Liverpool F.c.

[carmine]

Carrol really is not a very good player. He's a donkey, ( with striking similarities to Duncan Ferguson) but maybe theres still a fitness problem. More alarmingly though, for a 35m investment, i've seen players with a lot more natural instinct in the lower leagues.

The gulf in class between him and Suarez is huge and will become very frustrating. I don't think AC could read the matchday programme let alone a through ball

Edited August 21, 2011 by carmine

[rixalex]

Carrol really is not a very good player. He's a donkey, ( with striking similarities to Duncan Ferguson) but maybe theres still a fitness problem. More alarmingly though, for a 35m investment, i've seen players with a lot more natural instinct in the lower leagues.

The gulf in class between him and Suarez is huge and will become very frustrating. I don't think AC could read the matchday programme let alone a through ball

Nevermind about whether he is a decent footballer or not, i'm more worried about when he's going to lose that poncey pony-tail. Them and those hair bands should be illegal.

[MrRed]

Carrol really is not a very good player. He's a donkey, ( with striking similarities to Duncan Ferguson) but maybe theres still a fitness problem. More alarmingly though, for a 35m investment, i've seen players with a lot more natural instinct in the lower leagues.

The gulf in class between him and Suarez is huge and will become very frustrating. I don't think AC could read the matchday programme let alone a through ball

I also think he is average at best but give Liverpool credit yesterday they packed the midfield and played him alone as a target man,Adams or Downing where not supplying him with the high balls he needs to shine,but play Kuyt and Downing together and i think when Gerrard comes back they have the look of a decent attacking midfield(with cover)and can play Suarez off Carroll.

Time will tell for Carroll but he could be the weak link in a good attacking side,sorry to say as a United supporter that KK has started well and when they have a full strength team....ie Skirtel,Johnson, Gerrard back +another buy they will now be title contenders after a long time out of it.

Just my early season opinion,impressed with both full backs yesterday and Kuyt again.

[carmine]

Carrol really is not a very good player. He's a donkey, ( with striking similarities to Duncan Ferguson) but maybe theres still a fitness problem. More alarmingly though, for a 35m investment, i've seen players with a lot more natural instinct in the lower leagues.

The gulf in class between him and Suarez is huge and will become very frustrating. I don't think AC could read the matchday programme let alone a through ball

I also think he is average at best but give Liverpool credit yesterday they packed the midfield and played him alone as a target man,Adams or Downing where not supplying him with the high balls he needs to shine,but play Kuyt and Downing together and i think when Gerrard comes back they have the look of a decent attacking midfield(with cover)and can play Suarez off Carroll.

Time will tell for Carroll but he could be the weak link in a good attacking side,sorry to say as a United supporter that KK has started well and when they have a full strength team....ie Skirtel,Johnson, Gerrard back +another buy they will now be title contenders after a long time out of it.

Just my early season opinion,impressed with both full backs yesterday and Kuyt again.

Its the first time i can remember when Arsenal started a home game playing for a point.

I doubt Dalglish would have been very happy after that, apart from the three points. At the end of the day, how many saves did the keepers have to make. I would also have expected Liverpool to have been much better with their set pieces. Very average football, and one that gives me some hope although ofcourse its early days. Its early days but it won't take long before Utd and City stride away methinks.

[MrRed]

Your last sentence after what i have seen so far could happen,but i also have a feeling that Liverpool will be on the tails of both and not the rent boys or the Arse.

Arsenal where poor yesterday but do have a lot of injures and want away players,the truth is in Wengers whole persona....a right miserable <deleted> and not good for the players same as that Avram Grant fuc_kin depressing to play for and try and gain inspiration from.

He wants to cheer up a bit!

[Devil]

Kenny's record against the top 4. Is 4 Wins (Chelsea,Utd,City,Arsenal) and 1 Draw (Arsenal)

We won the midfield with a clear plan and had more possession.

The energy of Suraez coming on took advantage of a tired back 4 that was wore down by Carroll who chased and harassed all game.

Lucas again showing why his a must starter - he hit double figures for tackles made 16 and won 10 and completed 45 of his 52 passes today - 87% completion.

3 points !

[carmine]

Kenny's record against the top 4. Is 4 Wins (Chelsea,Utd,City,Arsenal) and 1 Draw (Arsenal)

We won the midfield with a clear plan and had more possession.

The energy of Suraez coming on took advantage of a tired back 4 that was wore down by Carroll who chased and harassed all game.

Lucas again showing why his a must starter - he hit double figures for tackles made 16 and won 10 and completed 45 of his 52 passes today - 87% completion.

3 points !

If you're happy i'm happy!! if there was a clear plan and with all that possession why did'nt you create any chances? Completed passes don't win games. Penetrating passes do and there were very few. It took a ridiculous fluke to open them up otherwise it did'nt look like happening. But, as you very rightly say, three points. Always a good result away to Arsenal regardless of how poor they are.

Thats an honest appraisal mate but kid yourself if you want.

[Devil]

Kenny's record against the top 4. Is 4 Wins (Chelsea,Utd,City,Arsenal) and 1 Draw (Arsenal)

We won the midfield with a clear plan and had more possession.

The energy of Suraez coming on took advantage of a tired back 4 that was wore down by Carroll who chased and harassed all game.

Lucas again showing why his a must starter - he hit double figures for tackles made 16 and won 10 and completed 45 of his 52 passes today - 87% completion.

3 points !

If you're happy i'm happy!! if there was a clear plan and with all that possession why did'nt you create any chances? Completed passes don't win games. Penetrating passes do and there were very few. It took a ridiculous fluke to open them up otherwise it did'nt look like happening. But, as you very rightly say, three points. Always a good result away to Arsenal regardless of how poor they are.

Thats an honest appraisal mate but kid yourself if you want.

Clear plan - in that we wanted to win midfield, both Kuyt and Lucas had said that in a number of interviews prior to the game we have to stop Arsenal keeping the ball. Sounds simple but not many teams can do that there.

It was just a case of executing it and we did - so please explain as I thought high completed passes in midfield gives you possession, No? And I was pointing out yet again why Lucas is a must start for these types of games.

Although Adam was wasteful at time and looked of the pace.

Now your saying we didn't create many chances behave Carmine...we haven't won Arsenal away in 11 years.

Both fullback were excellent Enrique and Kelly. Midfield and defense were solid, and we had quality coming of the bench in Suarz and Meirelss who both changed the game - so whats not to like???

YNWA

Edited August 21, 2011 by Devil

[carmine]

Dev, lets agree on two points first shall we...

First of all your goal this season is a top four finish. Secondly its early doors and theres room for improvements all round.

However, why can't you see that last nights game was a simple case of both sides being frankly rather poor. thats it. You are not crap, just average at the moment but if you can take three points off the back of creating so few goal scoring oppotunities then great but it won't be repeated very often, thats all i'm saying. i'm not having at go at Liverpool, i'd say the same if it were Spurs but i see you're still wearing those specs!

[smokie36]

Dev, lets agree on two points first shall we...

First of all your goal this season is a top four finish. Secondly its early doors and theres room for improvements all round.

However, why can't you see that last nights game was a simple case of both sides being frankly rather poor. thats it. You are not crap, just average at the moment but if you can take three points off the back of creating so few goal scoring oppotunities then great but it won't be repeated very often, thats all i'm saying. i'm not having at go at Liverpool, i'd say the same if it were Spurs but i see you're still wearing those specs!

I agree. Liverpool failed to finish off a dog average second string side yesterday. Cause for concern I'd say. Good three points though nonetheless.

[Devil]

Kenny's record against the top 4. Is 4 Wins (Chelsea,Utd,City,Arsenal) and 1 Draw (Arsenal)

We won the midfield with a clear plan and had more possession.

The energy of Suraez coming on took advantage of a tired back 4 that was wore down by Carroll who chased and harassed all game.

Lucas again showing why his a must starter - he hit double figures for tackles made 16 and won 10 and completed 45 of his 52 passes today - 87% completion.

3 points !

If you're happy i'm happy!! if there was a clear plan and with all that possession why did'nt you create any chances? Completed passes don't win games. Penetrating passes do and there were very few. It took a ridiculous fluke to open them up otherwise it did'nt look like happening. But, as you very rightly say, three points. Always a good result away to Arsenal regardless of how poor they are.

Thats an honest appraisal mate but kid yourself if you want.

Clear plan - in that we wanted to win midfield, both Kuyt and Lucas had said that in a number of interviews prior to the game we have to stop Arsenal keeping the ball. Sounds simple but not many teams can do that there.

It was just a case of executing it and we did - so please explain as I thought high completed passes in midfield gives you possession, No? And I was pointing out yet again why Lucas is a must start for these types of games.

Although Adam was wasteful at time and looked of the pace.

Now your saying we didn't create many chances behave Carmine...we haven't won Arsenal away in 11 years.

Both fullback were excellent Enrique and Kelly. Midfield and defense were solid, and we had quality coming of the bench in Suarz and Meirelss who both changed the game - so whats not to like???

YNWA

Dev, lets agree on two points first shall we...

.First of all your goal this season is a top four finish. Secondly its early doors and theres room for improvements all round.

^ Yes Carmine I think that's stating the obvious

Why was there any indication I would think otherwise or have said otherwise? I still didnt get your point or specific replies of my first post and that's why I am still replying.

Did I give the impression I was happy - well good because I am .But where did I start saying we were amazing for you to turn into Dev's wearing Red Tinted Specs again ...uncalled for Carmine and boring to say the least.

I said we won midfield which another poster also commented on prior and I then pointed out Lucas tackles and pass completion which was a reflection of the midfield - nothing more !

Possession 53%- 43% to Liverpool

Shots on Target - 8-6 to Liverpool

Attempts of target 5-4 to Liverpool

Edited August 21, 2011 by Devil

[adder]

2 clearly offside goals . I hope that this isn't going to be the norm again , where refs & linesmen decide the outcome of games . This one should of been a draw

[MrRed]

Dev, lets agree on two points first shall we...

First of all your goal this season is a top four finish. Secondly its early doors and theres room for improvements all round.

However, why can't you see that last nights game was a simple case of both sides being frankly rather poor. thats it. You are not crap, just average at the moment but if you can take three points off the back of creating so few goal scoring oppotunities then great but it won't be repeated very often, thats all i'm saying. i'm not having at go at Liverpool, i'd say the same if it were Spurs but i see you're still wearing those specs!

I agree. Liverpool failed to finish off a dog average second string side yesterday. Cause for concern I'd say. Good three points though nonetheless.

They won 2-0 Smokes .....that is finished off enough isn't it!

[smokie36]

Dev, lets agree on two points first shall we...

First of all your goal this season is a top four finish. Secondly its early doors and theres room for improvements all round.

However, why can't you see that last nights game was a simple case of both sides being frankly rather poor. thats it. You are not crap, just average at the moment but if you can take three points off the back of creating so few goal scoring oppotunities then great but it won't be repeated very often, thats all i'm saying. i'm not having at go at Liverpool, i'd say the same if it were Spurs but i see you're still wearing those specs!

I agree. Liverpool failed to finish off a dog average second string side yesterday. Cause for concern I'd say. Good three points though nonetheless.

They won 2-0 Smokes .....that is finished off enough isn't it!

Not for me. 6-0 would have been more satisfying!

[Devil]

2 clearly offside goals . I hope that this isn't going to be the norm again , where refs & linesmen decide the outcome of games . This one should of been a draw

[HeavyDrinker]

So far this season United, Liverpool, Arse, and Chelsea have looked pretty plain.

The game yesterday was bereft of any quality from either side. Even when Suarez came on he couldn't stay onside and appeared to be running around in circles all the time.

Shame for Arsenal the linesman couldn't see that.

OK we're only one or two games in but this really could be a chance for a "Dark Horse" to come up the rails.

[alfieconn]

It seems the 1-1 draw at home to Sunderland has been forgotten already

[smokie36]

It seems the 1-1 draw at home to Sunderland has been forgotten already

Is that the same Sunderland who looked very ordinary being beaten by Newcastle yesterday?

[bkkjames]

Arsenal looked lost_smokes you may have a chance to pip them for 4th.

[smokie36]

Arsenal looked lost_smokes you may have a chance to pip them for 4th.

If we can score goals we should. Jury's out on that one tho....

[mrbojangles]

Dev, lets agree on two points first shall we...

First of all your goal this season is a top four finish. Secondly its early doors and theres room for improvements all round.

However, why can't you see that last nights game was a simple case of both sides being frankly rather poor. thats it. You are not crap, just average at the moment but if you can take three points off the back of creating so few goal scoring oppotunities then great but it won't be repeated very often, thats all i'm saying. i'm not having at go at Liverpool, i'd say the same if it were Spurs but i see you're still wearing those specs!

I agree. Liverpool failed to finish off a dog average second string side yesterday. Cause for concern I'd say. Good three points though nonetheless.

And a second string side who were also down to 10 men. But 3 points is 3 points.

[Abrak]

I can see why Carmine enjoyed the game most because it must give some hope that Spurs could finish fourth.

However what I liked about the match is that we now have enough depth in the squad that we won the game with players coming off the bench. If you can imagine last year that would have been Ngog and Poulsen coming on and not Raul and Suarez.

Talking of Suarez, Uruguay are 50:1 to win the World Cup in Brazil which must be pretty good odds.

[adder]

I can see why Carmine enjoyed the game most because it must give some hope that Spurs could finish fourth.

However what I liked about the match is that we now have enough depth in the squad that we won the game with players coming off the bench. If you can imagine last year that would have been Ngog and Poulsen coming on and not Raul and Suarez.

Talking of Suarez, Uruguay are 50:1 to win the World Cup in Brazil which must be pretty good odds.

The game was won by a bad Linesman . I think he was on all the match but maybe he did come off the Liverpool bench with the waay he played

[carmine]

I can see why Carmine enjoyed the game most because it must give some hope that Spurs could finish fourth.

However what I liked about the match is that we now have enough depth in the squad that we won the game with players coming off the bench. If you can imagine last year that would have been Ngog and Poulsen coming on and not Raul and Suarez.

Talking of Suarez, Uruguay are 50:1 to win the World Cup in Brazil which must be pretty good odds.

Don't forget, i had the pleasure of watching Chelsea aswell. As far as i'm concerned theres third place up for grabs if they dont get Modric (and they won't because he's not for sale) Considering we did'nt get any points a bloody good weekend although in a perfect world i'd have preferred a draw at the Library. I've got a good feeling about monday nights game too.

I'll take Uruguay at fifties without a doubt.

[Abrak]

Don't forget, i had the pleasure of watching Chelsea aswell. As far as i'm concerned theres third place up for grabs if they dont get Modric (and they won't because he's not for sale) Considering we did'nt get any points a bloody good weekend although in a perfect world i'd have preferred a draw at the Library. I've got a good feeling about monday nights game too.

I'll take Uruguay at fifties without a doubt.

Glad you are optimistic. However I cant help but remember how totally piss poor you guys were for the last 3 months of last season so we will just have to see.

Still if you go back and include the end of last season, then Arsenal do really look a mess. They have won only 2 of their last 19 premiership matches.

I do sort of agree with you about Carroll. We are beginning to run out of excuses for him. I mean a lot of Liverpool fans say that he does a lot more than you can see and he has obviously been injured a lot of the time but he cant be injured forever. And I am not questioning whether we paid too much for him because that it is actually irrelevant given that it is in the past. The question I wonder is whether he should be in the starting line up every week because to me Liverpool tend to look a better team when he is off the pitch than when he is on.

And actually what I worry about Carroll is that football loves to get into pissing matches about the price of individual players in what is inherently a team sport. So Liverpool sort of wants to prove he is a brilliant player because they paid 35m for him and their opponents want to say he is crap and Liverpool are stupid. But it is the pissing match that is stupid not the price by that I mean if you end up trying to prove that a player is brilliant when he isnt then that is stupid. As far as the price well we bought Suarez for 23m and he is worth 50m. And we spent 50m on players in the transfer window and we now have a much better side. If we overpaid for them by 10m quid in some peoples eyes it is totally meaningless in 500m quid business.

And is Arsene Wenger really going to throw away his career with his obsession over value and refusal to buy in the transfer market because players are 'too expensive' or whatever. Because it really would be incredibly stupid of him. Because he will simply be a victim of the 'fallacy of composition'. Which in normal english states that if you dont buy players because you think they are overvalued, then you dont have a team in which case your team is worthless.

[alfieconn]

Don't forget, i had the pleasure of watching Chelsea aswell. As far as i'm concerned theres third place up for grabs if they dont get Modric (and they won't because he's not for sale) Considering we did'nt get any points a bloody good weekend although in a perfect world i'd have preferred a draw at the Library. I've got a good feeling about monday nights game too.

I'll take Uruguay at fifties without a doubt.

I do sort of agree with you about Carroll. We are beginning to run out of excuses for him. I mean a lot of Liverpool fans say that he does a lot more than you can see and he has obviously been injured a lot of the time but he cant be injured forever. And I am not questioning whether we paid too much for him because that it is actually irrelevant given that it is in the past.

So is it only relevent if it is in the future

[JacknDanny]

Don't forget, i had the pleasure of watching Chelsea aswell. As far as i'm concerned theres third place up for grabs if they dont get Modric (and they won't because he's not for sale) Considering we did'nt get any points a bloody good weekend although in a perfect world i'd have preferred a draw at the Library. I've got a good feeling about monday nights game too.

I'll take Uruguay at fifties without a doubt.

I do sort of agree with you about Carroll. We are beginning to run out of excuses for him. I mean a lot of Liverpool fans say that he does a lot more than you can see and he has obviously been injured a lot of the time but he cant be injured forever. And I am not questioning whether we paid too much for him because that it is actually irrelevant given that it is in the past.

So is it only relevent if it is in the future

Fact is, a very average side beat a very poor Arsenal side. Didnt see the Chelsea game but doesnt appear they were lights out !!

i think Arsenal will be lucky to finish top 6, spurs have got a below average squad with ( if we are to believe everything on here) a shit manager . City and Utd to battle out first and second. Would not surprise me if someone like West Brom finished above Arsenal!! Seriously!! Unlucky first 2 games.

[MrRed]

Don't forget, i had the pleasure of watching Chelsea aswell. As far as i'm concerned theres third place up for grabs if they dont get Modric (and they won't because he's not for sale) Considering we did'nt get any points a bloody good weekend although in a perfect world i'd have preferred a draw at the Library. I've got a good feeling about monday nights game too.

I'll take Uruguay at fifties without a doubt.

I do sort of agree with you about Carroll. We are beginning to run out of excuses for him. I mean a lot of Liverpool fans say that he does a lot more than you can see and he has obviously been injured a lot of the time but he cant be injured forever. And I am not questioning whether we paid too much for him because that it is actually irrelevant given that it is in the past.

So is it only relevent if it is in the future

Fact is, a very average side beat a very poor Arsenal side. Didnt see the Chelsea game but doesnt appear they were lights out !!

i think Arsenal will be lucky to finish top 6, spurs have got a below average squad with ( if we are to believe everything on here) a shit manager . City and Utd to battle out first and second. Would not surprise me if someone like West Brom finished above Arsenal!! Seriously!! Unlucky first 2 games.

spot on

[Devil]

Don't forget, i had the pleasure of watching Chelsea aswell. As far as i'm concerned theres third place up for grabs if they dont get Modric (and they won't because he's not for sale) Considering we did'nt get any points a bloody good weekend although in a perfect world i'd have preferred a draw at the Library. I've got a good feeling about monday nights game too.

I'll take Uruguay at fifties without a doubt.

Glad you are optimistic. However I cant help but remember how totally piss poor you guys were for the last 3 months of last season so we will just have to see.

Still if you go back and include the end of last season, then Arsenal do really look a mess. They have won only 2 of their last 19 premiership matches.

I do sort of agree with you about Carroll. We are beginning to run out of excuses for him. I mean a lot of Liverpool fans say that he does a lot more than you can see and he has obviously been injured a lot of the time but he cant be injured forever. And I am not questioning whether we paid too much for him because that it is actually irrelevant given that it is in the past. The question I wonder is whether he should be in the starting line up every week because to me Liverpool tend to look a better team when he is off the pitch than when he is on.

And actually what I worry about Carroll is that football loves to get into pissing matches about the price of individual players in what is inherently a team sport. So Liverpool sort of wants to prove he is a brilliant player because they paid 35m for him and their opponents want to say he is crap and Liverpool are stupid. But it is the pissing match that is stupid not the price by that I mean if you end up trying to prove that a player is brilliant when he isnt then that is stupid. As far as the price well we bought Suarez for 23m and he is worth 50m. And we spent 50m on players in the transfer window and we now have a much better side. If we overpaid for them by 10m quid in some peoples eyes it is totally meaningless in 500m quid business.

And is Arsene Wenger really going to throw away his career with his obsession over value and refusal to buy in the transfer market because players are 'too expensive' or whatever. Because it really would be incredibly stupid of him. Because he will simply be a victim of the 'fallacy of composition'. Which in normal english states that if you dont buy players because you think they are overvalued, then you dont have a team in which case your team is worthless.

You seem to like stats Abrak - these might give you cause for optimism.

Paul Tomkins: Yesterday, Carroll and Henderson (whose job it was to support the no.9) made 86 passes, 73 of which were successful. Against City 12 months ago, Torres and Ngog made just 39 passes, only 26 of which were successful.

http://tomkinstimes.com/2011/08/pass-move-goal-%E2%80%93-victory-over-arsenal/

[JacknDanny]

Don't forget, i had the pleasure of watching Chelsea aswell. As far as i'm concerned theres third place up for grabs if they dont get Modric (and they won't because he's not for sale) Considering we did'nt get any points a bloody good weekend although in a perfect world i'd have preferred a draw at the Library. I've got a good feeling about monday nights game too.

I'll take Uruguay at fifties without a doubt.

Glad you are optimistic. However I cant help but remember how totally piss poor you guys were for the last 3 months of last season so we will just have to see.

Still if you go back and include the end of last season, then Arsenal do really look a mess. They have won only 2 of their last 19 premiership matches.

I do sort of agree with you about Carroll. We are beginning to run out of excuses for him. I mean a lot of Liverpool fans say that he does a lot more than you can see and he has obviously been injured a lot of the time but he cant be injured forever. And I am not questioning whether we paid too much for him because that it is actually irrelevant given that it is in the past. The question I wonder is whether he should be in the starting line up every week because to me Liverpool tend to look a better team when he is off the pitch than when he is on.

And actually what I worry about Carroll is that football loves to get into pissing matches about the price of individual players in what is inherently a team sport. So Liverpool sort of wants to prove he is a brilliant player because they paid 35m for him and their opponents want to say he is crap and Liverpool are stupid. But it is the pissing match that is stupid not the price by that I mean if you end up trying to prove that a player is brilliant when he isnt then that is stupid. As far as the price well we bought Suarez for 23m and he is worth 50m. And we spent 50m on players in the transfer window and we now have a much better side. If we overpaid for them by 10m quid in some peoples eyes it is totally meaningless in 500m quid business.

And is Arsene Wenger really going to throw away his career with his obsession over value and refusal to buy in the transfer market because players are 'too expensive' or whatever. Because it really would be incredibly stupid of him. Because he will simply be a victim of the 'fallacy of composition'. Which in normal english states that if you dont buy players because you think they are overvalued, then you dont have a team in which case your team is worthless.

You seem to like stats Abrak - these might give you cause for optimism.

Paul Tomkins: Yesterday, Carroll and Henderson (whose job it was to support the no.9) made 86 passes, 73 of which were successful. Against City 12 months ago, Torres and Ngog made just 39 passes, only 26 of which were successful.

http://tomkinstimes.com/2011/08/pass-move-goal-%E2%80%93-victory-over-arsenal/

You really are grasping at straws here!!! Ngog, a fringe player at best!!!! And Torres who was not really at his peak!! Come on, stop encouraging your stats man Abrak . I dont have anything against Liverpool, but I did not see anything that feared me yesterday, short of Suarez being a world class player in an average team and you having a good young fullback