Why Do Native English Speakers Feel Threatened By Non Native Speakers

[theblether]

The Blether.

Are you suggesting the Scots are native English speakers.God forbid.

I had the pleasure of staying in Scotland,for a few years,Luechars and Forres near Elgin.

I found learning the local dialect harder than Thai.

Apologies,if spelling is off.

I do have sympathy with that point..............

[pattayadingo]

I certainly never feel threatened by any non English speaking people. The world is full of different cultures and languages. Yet, I have travelled a lot and had interaction with different cultures, maybe that is why. Yes, I have a biased point of view regarding some nationalities, but that is my own perception of those.

Maybe some who feel inferior feel threatened? There are certainly many who have not travelled abroad extensively and that can add to their feelings of inferiority.

On the other hand you have those superior people who think they are superior to the rest and they will use that felling of superiority. Like the grammar brigade. I feel they are typical of those who like to feel superior because they can correct one simple spelling mistake. Yet ask them to converse in French, Dutch, German etc and they would have no idea where to start.

Then again, the British did rule over most of the world with the Commonwealth, bringing our language with us. Add to that the Americans, Australians, Canadians and of course the British - amongst others - do speak one form of English or another. Surely that makes English an international language. It is also the dominant language used in the world of computers and the internet. Maybe people these days think that is also part of the reason to feel everyone should speak English.

There are also certain nationalities who look down upon English as a spoken language, but I'll not name the main one I feel that about.

Overall, I feel it would be better if people learned a certain amount of English to get by in the world, but stuff those with their superiority complexes, be they English speaking or not

[Rimmer]

A post discussing moderation has been removed

[mauGR1]

...Good, anyway, i don't see how the average English native speaker would feel threatened by non-native speakers..who cares about grammar nazis..

Eventually, when travelling around the world, they just learn to mellow their heavy accent, and speak slowly.

( specially true in the case of them being Scottish )

[pattayadingo]

...Good, anyway, i don't see how the average English native speaker would feel threatened by non-native speakers..who cares about grammar nazis..

Eventually, when travelling around the world, they just learn to mellow their heavy accent, and speak slowly.

( specially true in the case of them being Scottish )

Or with a broad Yorkshire accent.

Thai women speaking English with a Yorkshire, Geordie or Scots accent............. sexy

[Eesat]

I'm not joking.

By the way, I was in Dutch owned bar the other day and watched the abdication / coronation........it was full of Dutch people getting right into it and it was thoroughly enjoyable.

Got to be honest though, we Brits are far better at ceremonial stuff.

I didn't see Queen Beatrix but Maggie Thatcher's funeral was just spellbinding.I have a lot to thank The Iron Lady for,I left the UK when she was in power as it was a mess!

[vlietje]

I'm not joking.

By the way, I was in Dutch owned bar the other day and watched the abdication / coronation........it was full of Dutch people getting right into it and it was thoroughly enjoyable.

Got to be honest though, we Brits are far better at ceremonial stuff.

At least we don't let our wanna be king not wait for 80 years and counting

[Eesat]

I think there's a bit of reverse psychology going on here,I'm always surprised at the positive reaction in Asia when I tell people I'm British.We all know in Europe it's very different and I believe harks back to the good old British Empire,as mentioned before!

The other Europeans hate the fact that we ruled the waves and most of the planet for many,many years.In fact the biggest empire the planet has ever seen,plus we held out against the Germans in the war as they cut through Central Europe like a knife through butter!

Do we get any thanks for our efforts though?

[marstons]

It is probably a feeling of Entitlement that Native English Speakers have. Having been in the limelight for a number of decades they find themselves in a time of transition or fading influence in SEAsia. It must be difficult to adapt.

So why are most South Eastern Asian counties so keen to learn Englsih? why so much fuss right now bout TOEFL

I find all Nationalities to be quite annoying, including my own..

The latest annoyance is the Russians talking Russian to 7/11 staff and expect them to understand..

..English is the international language, period..

Thai should be spoken in Thailand period, you cant expect low paid low schooled Thais to understand English. Your in Thailand.. adapt. But im pretty sure you do, but i find it unreasonable to expect Thais in their own country to speak English especially low paid ones.

well if they don't learn they will remain low paid and poorly educated. I have visited over 40 countries its a tough call learning all those languages when English has got me by all over the world. Is the International language, but of course this being Thailand tourist and the rest of the world should be learning Thai. Lets face it if tourist want the honor of visiting here to spend money the least they can do is learn to speak Thai to accommodate the locals

[Eesat]

"Add to that the Americans, Australians, Canadians and of course the British - amongst others - do speak one form of English or another."

Don't forget the world's largest democracy,one billion Indians use it as their national business language as they have hundreds of different dialects.In fact if someone in Kerala were to speak to someone in say,Kashmir,in their respective dialects they wouldn't understand a single word!

[jocko]

Got to be honest though, we Brits are far better at ceremonial stuff.

We have had a lot of practice, and we love a good parade.

And it's bloody good for tourism.

If the UK has a parade the whole world watches .

Thank god we are good at something .

Rule Britannia.

And some nearly spoke englsh.

[jocko]

native english speakers are superior human beings- simple concept...

except those who can't speak English but try to communicate using various obscure dialects.

Ahem.....what are you trying to say naam.

Allo Allo?

[bangkokburning]

I am very happy and thankful when I can converse outside the US in English.

I sometimes even thank people for speaking English with me.

When I am going to ask someone something, I always ask first IN THAI do you speak English?

Im grateful my wife chose to pick up my slack and learn English. Its opened lots of doors for her but its the common language of our marriage. I know though, someday abd some way it will be a big bonus for her.

English is the lingua franca of the world - but it doesnt mean everyone or anyone should speak it.

My language skills really need an upgrade and overhaul. Sometimes, Im embarassed with my wife outside honestly. But you just never know when you are going to be done with Thailand. All that time and potentially money wasted. Have a friend fluent in Chinese. 12 yrs in China, heading back to Canada. Done.

[robblok]

It is probably a feeling of Entitlement that Native English Speakers have. Having been in the limelight for a number of decades they find themselves in a time of transition or fading influence in SEAsia. It must be difficult to adapt.

So why are most South Eastern Asian counties so keen to learn Englsih? why so much fuss right now bout TOEFL

>

I find all Nationalities to be quite annoying, including my own..

The latest annoyance is the Russians talking Russian to 7/11 staff and expect them to understand..

..English is the international language, period..

Thai should be spoken in Thailand period, you cant expect low paid low schooled Thais to understand English. Your in Thailand.. adapt. But im pretty sure you do, but i find it unreasonable to expect Thais in their own country to speak English especially low paid ones.

well if they don't learn they will remain low paid and poorly educated. I have visited over 40 countries its a tough call learning all those languages when English has got me by all over the world. Is the International language, but of course this being Thailand tourist and the rest of the world should be learning Thai. Lets face it if tourist want the honor of visiting here to spend money the least they can do is learn to speak Thai to accommodate the locals

Its an expat forum here, if your a tourist English is fine if your an expat its an embarasment if you don't speak a little bit of the language. I am far from perfect and others speak this language much better but people should at least be able to hold a simple conversation in Thai. Expat who chose to live here not a tourist.

[geriatrickid]

I don't know if threatened is quite right, probably more of a fear of the unknown.

Then that makes for a romantic moment. Think of the challenge of charming a woman with seductive Spanish poetry, or an Italian sonnet, or perhaps a few words of French.

I thought I'd have fun with a bar girl one night and spoke to her in French and she came back at me in German.

[geriatrickid]

"Add to that the Americans, Australians, Canadians and of course the British - amongst others - do speak one form of English or another."

Don't forget the world's largest democracy,one billion Indians use it as their national business language as they have hundreds of different dialects.In fact if someone in Kerala were to speak to someone in say,Kashmir,in their respective dialects they wouldn't understand a single word!

Good gracious. The English used in India is to the English language what Haitian Creole is to French. I can assure you that 1 billion Indians do not speak English and that outside of the big cities, the local Indian dialects rule. And even when they do speak English the accent is so heavy as to often be incomprehensible. One of the advantages of Thailand is that even though the regions have their own dialects or variations, such as Issan, people still are able to converse in a quasi central Thai dialect.

[candypants]

There's a bit of Xenophobia at play here, you need to understand that most of us grew up fearing a nuclear war with the Russians, now seeing a quite aggressive Slav tribe taking over previously Anglo-Saxon holiday spots is going to knock a few people out of their comfort zones.

[cut]

Just sayin'.

xenophobia it may be, but i most certainly did not grow up fearing nuclear war

[candypants]

I am very happy and thankful when I can converse outside the US in English.

I sometimes even thank people for speaking English with me.

When I am going to ask someone something, I always ask first IN THAI do you speak English?

Im grateful my wife chose to pick up my slack and learn English. Its opened lots of doors for her but its the common language of our marriage. I know though, someday abd some way it will be a big bonus for her.

English is the lingua franca of the world - but it doesnt mean everyone or anyone should speak it.

My language skills really need an upgrade and overhaul. Sometimes, Im embarassed with my wife outside honestly. But you just never know when you are going to be done with Thailand. All that time and potentially money wasted. Have a friend fluent in Chinese. 12 yrs in China, heading back to Canada. Done.

that will certainly be useful in vancouver

Edited May 3, 2013 by candypants

[Scully]

I have no problem with any nationality coming to Thailand we are all in the boat, but I do read complaints about a large proportion of nationalities having rather unpleasant traits.

For instance the last hotel I stayed in had a large population of Germans, imagine having to set my alarm for 4.30am just to get my towel glued to a sunbed

[Thakkar]

Once, in the middle of a conversation with a guy sat next to me on a plane, he stopped suddenly and said, "you know, your English is pretty good."

"So is yours," I replied, "you know, for an American."

Bad start, but I recovered and made friends with him, as is my wont. When I visited Honolulu, I gave him a call and he spent two days showing me around the beautiful island.

Point being, people who seem insular, can be very nice. And people who think themselves sophisticated (like me, above) can be cocky.

T

I have no problem with native English speakers, got more friends here among them then Dutch (we are a minority) so i know they can be nice but so can any other group. Just like there are idiots among them too, i know for a fact there are plenty of idiot Dutch too.

I just noticed all those topics popping up and wondered why, I don't have much problems with Russian signs just like Thai ones I cant read them. Ok i can read a bit of Thai more as Russian but stuff like that does not bother me one bit.

I thought ok.. lots or Russian bashing.. then noticed it ont he Germans and then on the French (cant really blame them there just joking)

I agree. Xenophobia, when one is living in a foreign country is hard to understand. I am as baffled as you are. This is especially so when the complainers have chosen to live in a bustling tourist town like Pattaya.

A few years ago there was much Indian-bashing in the TV Pattaya forum, which I rarely visit. I was alerted to it by my daughter, who, because we were planning a holiday there, was researching Pattaya restaurants to try. She was appalled at the almost overt racism and was put off ever visiting any Thaivisa forum, though I've told her there are many decent forums, and posters who give helpful advice and have thoughtful discussions. Imagine how much more put-off she'd have been if the forum wasn't moderated.

I guess the forums are a reflection of the sort of people that are out there. I try not to let it bother me. The good news is that, by all accounts, the younger generation everywhere are far more tolerant. For example, same-sex marriage is now supported by a large majority of those below 30 in many developed countries. My own teenagers don't even get what all the fuss is about.

T

[MAJIC]

I don't feel at all threatened until I find myself talking Pidgen English to the Non Native English Speaker,just to please them.

[Thakkar]

Eesat, on 03 May 2013 - 00:27, said:

"Add to that the Americans, Australians, Canadians and of course the British - amongst others - do speak one form of English or another."

Don't forget the world's largest democracy,one billion Indians use it as their national business language as they have hundreds of different dialects.In fact if someone in Kerala were to speak to someone in say,Kashmir,in their respective dialects they wouldn't understand a single word!

An educated Indian from one part of India meeting another educated Indian from a different part of India is just as likely to speak with them in English as they are to do so in Hindi (the main national language). This sort of thing exasperates the ultra nationalist Indians so much that, they pen angry Letters to the Editor of their newspaper—in English!

T

[lvdkeyes]

I find all Nationalities to be quite annoying, including my own..

The latest annoyance is the Russians talking Russian to 7/11 staff and expect them to understand..

..English is the international language, period..

Thai should be spoken in Thailand period, you cant expect low paid low schooled Thais to understand English. Your in Thailand.. adapt. But im pretty sure you do, but i find it unreasonable to expect Thais in their own country to speak English especially low paid ones.

"Your in Thailand"? I hope your Thai is better than your English.

[Konini]

"Add to that the Americans, Australians, Canadians and of course the British - amongst others - do speak one form of English or another."

Don't forget the world's largest democracy,one billion Indians use it as their national business language as they have hundreds of different dialects.In fact if someone in Kerala were to speak to someone in say,Kashmir,in their respective dialects they wouldn't understand a single word!

A person speaking Wurzel from Cornwall would not understand a word my family (Geordies) would say and vice versa - but they both tune into the BBC news at 6 o'clock. That has always intrigued me, from being a small child taken out of the colliery's in Durham and placed into South Yorkshire with most of our neighbours from the village and a few random Scottish people who spoke completely differently to us. As children we learned their words (I'll never forget Tracy Hall saying 'I want a jobie' and asking her what it meant), and they learned our words. Then we all went to school with a few Doncaster kids who understood none of us. Then we went to High School, where we were in the minority and had to learn Yorkshire instead of our pigeon Geordie-Scottish language to be understood and to fit in.

We lived in Australia for 20 years, so our accents have been heavily diluted, but when we go back home, within hours we drop back into dialect. I've taken note of this over the years as the subject fascinates me. Upon going back to Australia, for a week or so we were still talking at least partially in dialect and co-workers couldn't understand half of what we were saying.

The different ways English is spoken is a subject that will never bore me, and in the UK, accents seem to be getting stronger. My sister seems to speak Yorkie a lot heavier than she used to. My cousins seem to speak Geordie a lot heavier than they used to - my husband from Middlesboro can barely understand some of my relatives, even though he is from 10 miles south of them. I once laughed that a Scotchie was given sub-titles on TV, but now I hear some and can't understand them at all, just an occasional word. Regional accents in the UK, or at least in the north east, seem to be getting stronger and stronger. No scientific proof of this, just me listening to others speaking.

[robblok]

I find all Nationalities to be quite annoying, including my own..

The latest annoyance is the Russians talking Russian to 7/11 staff and expect them to understand..

..English is the international language, period..

Thai should be spoken in Thailand period, you cant expect low paid low schooled Thais to understand English. Your in Thailand.. adapt. But im pretty sure you do, but i find it unreasonable to expect Thais in their own country to speak English especially low paid ones.

"Your in Thailand"? I hope your Thai is better than your English.

Small mistake made by typing a lot, i don't go over my posts i just type. I cant be bothered to check it all. I wonder how your other languages are. I speak 4 and you ?

Next time ill write you are in or you are living in to please the language police.

[maxme]

I find all Nationalities to be quite annoying, including my own..

The latest annoyance is the Russians talking Russian to 7/11 staff and expect them to understand..

..English is the international language, period..

Thai should be spoken in Thailand period, you cant expect low paid low schooled Thais to understand English. Your in Thailand.. adapt. But im pretty sure you do, but i find it unreasonable to expect Thais in their own country to speak English especially low paid ones.

"Your in Thailand"? I hope your Thai is better than your English.

Small mistake made by typing a lot, i don't go over my posts i just type. I cant be bothered to check it all. I wonder how your other languages are. I speak 4 and you ?

Next time ill write you are in or you are living in to please the language police.

So the tourists have to learn Thai then, good luck with that...

[robblok]

I find all Nationalities to be quite annoying, including my own..

The latest annoyance is the Russians talking Russian to 7/11 staff and expect them to understand..

..English is the international language, period..

Thai should be spoken in Thailand period, you cant expect low paid low schooled Thais to understand English. Your in Thailand.. adapt. But im pretty sure you do, but i find it unreasonable to expect Thais in their own country to speak English especially low paid ones.

"Your in Thailand"? I hope your Thai is better than your English.

Small mistake made by typing a lot, i don't go over my posts i just type. I cant be bothered to check it all. I wonder how your other languages are. I speak 4 and you ?

Next time ill write you are in or you are living in to please the language police.

So the tourists have to learn Thai then, good luck with that...

Its an expat forum.. and tourist should not learn Thai.

[maxme]

I find all Nationalities to be quite annoying, including my own..
The latest annoyance is the Russians talking Russian to 7/11 staff and expect them to understand..
..English is the international language, period..//

Thai should be spoken in Thailand period, you cant expect low paid low schooled Thais to understand English//

- It was meant for the response you gave to ivdkeyes and not all that have low paid jobs are that bad, some actually try.

But if I were to respond to the matter at hand... If a foreign couple decides to stay here, how likely is it that they can become citizens, getting a bank account and so on?

If the chances are slim, how likely is it that they can or will learn Thai?

[robblok]

I find all Nationalities to be quite annoying, including my own..

The latest annoyance is the Russians talking Russian to 7/11 staff and expect them to understand..

..English is the international language, period..//

Thai should be spoken in Thailand period, you cant expect low paid low schooled Thais to understand English//

- It was meant for the response you gave to ivdkeyes and not all that have low paid jobs are that bad, some actually try.

But if I were to respond to the matter at hand... If a foreign couple decides to stay here, how likely is it that they can become citizens, getting a bank account and so on?

If the chances are slim, how likely is it that they can or will learn Thai?

This was in response to an expat, they should be able to speak Thai or try to. If you plan on staying here longer for sure you have to learn the language its normal. Seems many English speakers fail to gasp that, if you are residing in a country try to learn a bit of its language. Depends of course on the time you will stay here. Id say if over a year or 2 years learn the language.

And I am the first to admit my Thai is far from perfect but at least i tried and am still trying to. Its just normal and common cutesy if you live in a foreign country.

Tourists are a whole other thing they should just speak English, but even so you can't expect everyone to speak it well especially here.

[maxme]

I find all Nationalities to be quite annoying, including my own..

The latest annoyance is the Russians talking Russian to 7/11 staff and expect them to understand..

..English is the international language, period..//

Thai should be spoken in Thailand period, you cant expect low paid low schooled Thais to understand English//

- It was meant for the response you gave to ivdkeyes and not all that have low paid jobs are that bad, some actually try.

But if I were to respond to the matter at hand... If a foreign couple decides to stay here, how likely is it that they can become citizens, getting a bank account and so on?

If the chances are slim, how likely is it that they can or will learn Thai?

This was in response to an expat, they should be able to speak Thai or try to. If you plan on staying here longer for sure you have to learn the language its normal. Seems many English speakers fail to gasp that, if you are residing in a country try to learn a bit of its language. Depends of course on the time you will stay here. Id say if over a year or 2 years learn the language.

And I am the first to admit my Thai is far from perfect but at least i tried and am still trying to. Its just normal and common cutesy if you live in a foreign country.

Tourists are a whole other thing they should just speak English, but even so you can't expect everyone to speak it well especially here.

I would agree with you but that´s up to everyone to decide. It wouldn´t be if the Thais actually made it easier for foreigners to actually become citizens and thereby be integrating, because then you could make it mandatory. Yet it's not, so telling others what they should do is simply wrong.

I learn Thai but not because I honor the country, but because by doing it, I honor my family and relatives here.

Many of the Thais cannot speak English because of a less than adequate educational system here but that doesn´t mean they don´t want to, they just didn´t have the chance.

When we ask newly becomed citizens in our country to learn our language, it´s because they can benefit from the same welfare system, the same jobs and other things like the natives do.

In Thailand it doesn´t work that way, not because the Thais say so, but because those in power say so. It´s not for the benefit of the country, it´s for them not lose their influential over the people, because what can be better than foreigners with cash coming in here to settle. Surely when they buy a house, a car or build up companies which will provide jobs for the locals are something that benefit the Thai society.

I will learn as much I think I have to learn so it will benefit myself and my family. Once the country, or those in power, accept me as one of their own, then I will make learning Thai... a real goal as this is expected of me if I´m to become one of them.

Edited May 4, 2013 by maxme