The Thai Mirage - I Met A Thai Girl That Was Working In Ferangland.

[slothful1]

I won't introduce myself, theres no need. you will probably know me, not personally but you will know me.

I thought I would offer my perspective on Thailand.. It's probably more of a rant as I sit here in bangkok reflecting on my experiences of my past in thailand.

Anyways, I met a girl in ferangland, I'm 33, she is 31.. We are getting married in bangkok next week, I'm here now and we are organizing the wedding. And no, they will not be getting sin sod. Sinsod will only be for show, so people can see I can look after her.

I have spent quite some time in thailand before I met her, when I was about 25 I stayed in thailand for nearly a year. And I've spent quite a lot of time with girls I have met in thailand, 1 girl I lived with for 6 months or so.

These girls weren't exactly lawyers or doctors either. The relationships were different but I couldn't quite put my finger on it. Something didn't feel right.

Being in thailand now after being with her for so long, I'm looking at this country with a new set of eyes. I'm staying in a bangkok suburb, north west about 40 mins from central bangkok with her family. They all work fairly normal jobs, They have a normal house by ferang standards. If they worked these jobs in ferangland, they would be middle class just as they are here, more or less.

Ok, this is where I get a bit philosophical, don't be offended this is only my point of view.

My memories of thailand from before was all parties, debauchery, and generally fooling myself into thinking I was some kind of playa. It was fun for a while, but I grew disillusioned and left.

5 years of visiting thailand it's taken to be really seen as an equal and respected here among her family and friends, It's taken that long for them to decide that I'm going to stick around I guess.

Now I'm here with my girlfriend and her friends from uni doing normal things, eating shopping and so forth. So far it's all pretty vanilla experience, nothing amazing. In fact, I don't feel like it's much different at all to back home.

It isn't until now that I have realised the extent to which I was disillusioned. When I look back at the thai bar scene I feel like it's somewhat of a mirage in this country. It's just not real, Thai girls I mean, they aren't like that at all. I spoke to her friends when I first met her in ferangland. I spoke to them like would speak to a bargirl, This had bad consequences. after this encounter the mirage receded a little, and I could see more.

Hanging around with her university friends, friends from her previous Bangkok jobs who work for insurance companies and they aren't any different from people back in ferangland, they speak a different language and they eat different food. I'm not saying there isn't differences, I'm just saying they aren't that different.

I think the only thing that is different is our perspective upon entering the mirage, when we look out from the mirage everything is skewed and thats when people get into trouble.

I guess this hit home pretty hard when I hang around with my girlfriends friends, I certainly don't get any special treatment and If I want to socialize with them it's a real effort and I have to think hard to conversate, the last thing they want to do is speak english in thailand. I believe most thais will only speak english given proper motivation, they just don't if they didn't have to. Some of her uni friends speak almost fluent educated english and still they won't speak english with me.

Going to the places that many middle class thais go, I now realize that the places most foreigners visit are such an extremely small part of thailand. We drive all around bangkok suburbs going to different places at night and I haven't seen any bargirls or scrupulous looking massage parlours anywhere.

I think when some people (men) speak of thailand, they aren't speaking of thailand, they are speaking of the mirage, a money sucking illusion created for us in a land with that will allow that illusion to be built. Not a bad thing at all, but it needs to be identified as such for one to stay level headed and keep his finances in check.

I think people (men) need to know there really are two completely seperate worlds in thailand. The mirage and the real thailand. Some are still in the mirage, the thais aren't, the rest of us are somewhere in between.

The question is, where are you?

Our knowledge is a receding mirage in an expanding desert of ignorance

- will durant

[Banzai99]

Glad you got Thailand all worked out, I am still learning after 22 years here full time.

[farang000999]

Don't sign your name to anything on the internet, chances are you will come to regret it at some point for a variety of reasons. Especially a bunch of sophomoric comments about debauchery in the third world. You'd be amazed how things can show up in google search.

Edited May 4, 2013 by farang000999

[slothful1]

I didn't, That is a quote by will durant. I thought it might come across like that, oops! Banzai, I haven't worked it out, I have very 2 very different perspectives on it, theres a million other perspectives nothing like mine, but this one is mine.

[USNret]

I think what you mention is one of the big reasons for so much discord on TV. Some people are here for the bar scene. That's where they go & what they do; everyone they meet is from that world. They form an opinion of Thailand on that basis.

Others might have started there & moved on to a more "wholesome" lifestyle, like yourself.

Others (like me) never went through the bar-hopping mode. We've spent our time with "normal" Thai people & families, with normal jobs, having very little interaction with farangs at any level. And form an opinion of Thailand on that basis.

So we all come up with vastly different views of what Thailand really is.

Most of the Thai people I know are college educated, been working in a professional field for many years, are not too interested in/concerned about my perceived wealth, they are capable of reading maps & giving directions, they read books (some avidly), are not wealthy, have no interest in meeting farang, have traveled moderately internationally, mostly with their Thai friends. From so many discussions on this forum, you would think that Thai people like this simply don't exist. They do!

Edited May 4, 2013 by USNret

[muythai2013]

There is no real Thailand or unreal Thailand.

It's all Thailand If it's in Thailand,What you see however depends on the path you travel here.

You were walking a different path before but it was still on the same mountain as the path your on now however you wisely moved off the beaten track and got onto a more glamorous track.

[breadbin]

Middle class? What jobs would they be then?

I think the majority if people in the UK are working class aren't they?

Working in an office or being a civil servant doesn't make you middle class.

I think people's perception if what middle class is not correct.

I am a plumber, working class but live in a house worth half a million Gbp.

A bank manager who works and lives in a flat is also working class,

[Stradavarius37]

You could have written that topic in 2-3 paragraphs - time to put the bong down.

[megaworldasia]

Yes, you're right it is a mirage. But there's also another mirage; the mirage where style and status are more important than intellectual substance and accountability. Hence the need for "Sinsod will only be for show, so people can see I can look after her." If you're happy to go along with such a shallow cultural concept, then so be it but, as you've already noted, there's going to be a lot of compromising going on from you and probably not that much from the other side:"the last thing they want to do is speak english in thailand. I believe most thais will only speak english given proper motivation, they just don't if they didn't have to. Some of her uni friends speak almost fluent educated english and still they won't speak english with me." Xenophobia at the extreme and shows how insular they can be compared to citizens of other S.E.Asian nations ie; Vietnam where the local go out of their way to try and speak English simply because they understand the importance of the language in the big picture. The bottom line for me is what, exactly, would a Thai woman, even an educated type, bring to the table to improve my life on the planet. After 20 years of living in the country I can state, quite confidently, that it's not very much. It's not like you can give them 2 million baht and expect them to double it for you through shrewd investments or business acumen. Sorry to say but even your middle class, educated types are myopic; with eating, shopping, iphone, thai TV and idle gossip filling the majority of their waking hours. No doubt the defenders of the realm, and the apologists, will get stuck into me but I don't give a shit; I've seen, and heard, it all before. The mirage that you talk about is but one of the many mirages in this country and the most important mirage that you need to get to grips with is the one where you might think you are the most important person in your Thai woman's life. You keep your mirage and I'll have mine; the one where I remain single, make use of P4P mirage on Saturday nights and not have to be concerned about showing a bunch of people, who aren't really interested in me, that I'm wealthy enough to take care of their daughter.<br /><br /><br />

[JLCrab]

from Post #1: The question is, where are you?

I'm with the doctors and lawyers.

[Kilgore Trout]

I won't introduce myself, theres no need. you will probably know me, not personally but you will know me.

I thought I would offer my perspective on Thailand.. It's probably more of a rant as I sit here in bangkok reflecting on my experiences of my past in thailand.

Anyways, I met a girl in ferangland, I'm 33, she is 31.. We are getting married in bangkok next week, I'm here now and we are organizing the wedding. And no, they will not be getting sin sod. Sinsod will only be for show, so people can see I can look after her.

I have spent quite some time in thailand before I met her, when I was about 25 I stayed in thailand for nearly a year. And I've spent quite a lot of time with girls I have met in thailand, 1 girl I lived with for 6 months or so.

These girls weren't exactly lawyers or doctors either. The relationships were different but I couldn't quite put my finger on it. Something didn't feel right.

Being in thailand now after being with her for so long, I'm looking at this country with a new set of eyes. I'm staying in a bangkok suburb, north west about 40 mins from central bangkok with her family. They all work fairly normal jobs, They have a normal house by ferang standards. If they worked these jobs in ferangland, they would be middle class just as they are here, more or less.

Ok, this is where I get a bit philosophical, don't be offended this is only my point of view.

My memories of thailand from before was all parties, debauchery, and generally fooling myself into thinking I was some kind of playa. It was fun for a while, but I grew disillusioned and left.

5 years of visiting thailand it's taken to be really seen as an equal and respected here among her family and friends, It's taken that long for them to decide that I'm going to stick around I guess.

Now I'm here with my girlfriend and her friends from uni doing normal things, eating shopping and so forth. So far it's all pretty vanilla experience, nothing amazing. In fact, I don't feel like it's much different at all to back home.

It isn't until now that I have realised the extent to which I was disillusioned. When I look back at the thai bar scene I feel like it's somewhat of a mirage in this country. It's just not real, Thai girls I mean, they aren't like that at all. I spoke to her friends when I first met her in ferangland. I spoke to them like would speak to a bargirl, This had bad consequences. after this encounter the mirage receded a little, and I could see more.

Hanging around with her university friends, friends from her previous Bangkok jobs who work for insurance companies and they aren't any different from people back in ferangland, they speak a different language and they eat different food. I'm not saying there isn't differences, I'm just saying they aren't that different.

I think the only thing that is different is our perspective upon entering the mirage, when we look out from the mirage everything is skewed and thats when people get into trouble.

I guess this hit home pretty hard when I hang around with my girlfriends friends, I certainly don't get any special treatment and If I want to socialize with them it's a real effort and I have to think hard to conversate, the last thing they want to do is speak english in thailand. I believe most thais will only speak english given proper motivation, they just don't if they didn't have to. Some of her uni friends speak almost fluent educated english and still they won't speak english with me.

Going to the places that many middle class thais go, I now realize that the places most foreigners visit are such an extremely small part of thailand. We drive all around bangkok suburbs going to different places at night and I haven't seen any bargirls or scrupulous looking massage parlours anywhere.

I think when some people (men) speak of thailand, they aren't speaking of thailand, they are speaking of the mirage, a money sucking illusion created for us in a land with that will allow that illusion to be built. Not a bad thing at all, but it needs to be identified as such for one to stay level headed and keep his finances in check.

I think people (men) need to know there really are two completely seperate worlds in thailand. The mirage and the real thailand. Some are still in the mirage, the thais aren't, the rest of us are somewhere in between.

The question is, where are you?

Our knowledge is a receding mirage in an expanding desert of ignorance

- will durant

Where is this "ferangland?"

The other side of yellowmanland?

Around the corner from negroland?

Have some pride in where you come from, the Thais do....

[HardenedSoul]

The bottom line for me is what, exactly, would a Thai woman, even an educated type, bring to the table to improve my life on the planet. After 20 years of living in the country I can state, quite confidently, that it's not very much. It's not like you can give them 2 million baht and expect them to double it for you through shrewd investments or business acumen. Sorry to say but even your middle class, educated types are myopic; with eating, shopping, iphone, thai TV and idle gossip filling the majority of their waking hours.

No doubt the defenders of the realm, and the apologists, will get stuck into me but I don't give a shit; I've seen, and heard, it all before. The mirage that you talk about is but one of the many mirages in this country and the most important mirage that you need to get to grips with is the one where you might think you are the most important person in your Thai woman's life. You keep your mirage and I'll have mine; the one where I remain single, make use of P4P mirage on Saturday nights and not have to be concerned about showing a bunch of people, who aren't really interested in me, that I'm wealthy enough to take care of their daughter.<br /><br /><br />

Well, to be fair, there aren't many people here or elsewhere you could give 2 million baht to and expect them to double it through shrewd investments, is there?

I do tend to agree with your assessment of the mindset of "middle class" Thais but I don't think they're really that much different from their counterparts in the West.

Aren't the middle-classes in the UK, Europe and the US part of societies that:-

1. Spend an inordinate amount of time glued to mind-numbing TV soap operas?

2. Elevate unremarkable dimwits possessed of distinctly minor talent to celebrity status?

3. Move heaven and earth to be able to afford tat like iPhones, fashion-statement cars and expensive clothes?

Yes, for sure, there is interest in arguably more "worthy" matters like business, politics, current affairs and the arts etc in our homelands but that's the case here too. If it wasn't, why would there be TV channels devoted to those topics on Thai TV? Ok, perhaps the quality isn't up to Western standards but don't we all cringe with embarrassment and shake our heads at the glaring inaccuracies when reading or watching Western-produced articles and documentaries about Thailand?

I'm certainly not an apologist or a defender of the realm but, frankly, I think one of the most prevalent mirages is that which sees some develop the sense that Western societies are innately superior to Thailand's when, if you look closely, there are so many similarities.

[Soutpeel]

We drive all around bangkok suburbs going to different places at night and I haven't seen any bargirls or scrupulous looking massage parlours anywhere.

So you are suggesting the "entertainment industry" has only been put in place in Thailand to cater to farangs/tourists only and it doesnt exist outside this areas ?...my my...one could suggest the "Local entertainment" industry catering to Thai's is far bigger...one has to only drive down a certain road in BKK and see the numerous up market "entertainment establishments"..some of which were/are owned by Thai politians..these places most certainly were not established for the tourist market...

I believe most thais will only speak english given proper motivation, they just don't if they didn't have to. Some of her uni friends speak almost fluent educated english and still they won't speak english with me.

I believe most Thai's cant speak English, so no amount of proper motivation will get them to.....as to your last statement..how do you know they speak almost fluent English if they will not speak to you in English ?...

they reason they are not even trying to speak English in the conversation is that they assume you speak no Thai ?...and they dont want you to know what they are talking about...or they are just out and out rude..

Having been working here almost 12 years with an MNC, I have yet to meet a Thai who speaks "almost fluent educated English", very good English most certainly, lots of them but almost "fluent educated English"..no, of course we may define differently what constitutes "educated fluent English"

Me thinks its you seeing a mirage..

[aTomsLife]

So you were actually naive enough to think it appropriate to speak to average Thai women as if they were prostitutes, and now want to share your new found enlightenment with the the rest of us, eh?

Well, just so you know, some of us had common sense even before arriving here. Imagine that.

[Payboy]

I won't introduce myself, theres no need. you will probably know me, not personally but you will know me.

So you're that guy from Hangover II.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Yes, for sure, there is interest in arguably more "worthy" matters like business, politics, current affairs and the arts etc in our homelands but that's the case here too. If it wasn't, why would there be TV channels devoted to those topics on Thai TV? Ok, perhaps the quality isn't up to Western standards but don't we all cringe with embarrassment and shake our heads at the glaring inaccuracies when reading or watching Western-produced articles and documentaries about Thailand?

I'm certainly not an apologist or a defender of the realm but, frankly, I think one of the most prevalent mirages is that which sees some develop the sense that Western societies are innately superior to Thailand's when, if you look closely, there are so many similarities.

I think most western articles are extremely kind to Thailand.

It is actually far worse then most stories portray.

Which of us doesn't know of a mysterious balcony fall, or a hit-and-run, or a hotel death that happened to a foreigner.

Yet back in your home countries, not so much I think.

Not to mention prostitution on almost every road or government corruption 'in-your-face' at every level.

But back to the OP with all his respectable uni-female friends, hasn't he noticed about 20% of uni girls appear to have a 'side-line'?

I wish I could meet other Thais that speak fluent English, I've only found two so far, and one really couldn't be classed fluent.

Edited May 4, 2013 by AnotherOneAmerican

[Travel2003]

I won't introduce myself, theres no need. you will probably know me, not personally but you will know me.

So you're that guy from Hangover II.

So the girl he talks about is either his wife, or the chick with the dick?

[Hedghog]

Newbie.

Trying to educate TVers about Thailand.

Change the record pal,we are living here.

Not dreaming about it.

[saakura]

Troll. Hope you paid the back rent owed to your land lady.

[HardenedSoul]

I think most western articles are extremely kind to Thailand.

It is actually far worse then most stories portray.

Which of us doesn't know of a mysterious balcony fall, or a hit-and-run, or a hotel death that happened to a foreigner.

Yet back in your home countries, not so much I think.

Not to mention prostitution on almost every road or government corruption 'in-your-face' at every level.

But back to the OP with all his respectable uni-female friends, hasn't he noticed about 20% of uni girls appear to have a 'side-line'?

I wish I could meet other Thais that speak fluent English, I've only found two so far, and one really couldn't be classed fluent.

Regardless - whether you believe these articles are kind or unkind - the point about inaccuracies remains valid?

Can't agree with you that the examples of foul play you allude to aren't farily commonplace in the West. Foreign students being mugged, stabbed and even killed are a rare occurence in the West but not unheard of.

Many foreigners who meet with their end in Thailand often have themselves, excessive drinking and poor life choices to blame for what befalls them and to think otherwise is foolish.

Prostitution on almost every road?? Do you even live in Thailand?

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Prostitution on almost every road?? Do you even live in Thailand?

You have already posted where you live, so hard for you to claim it isn't happening on your road, and on a massive scale.

I live in a quiet Thai only moobaan, house next door but one, owned by a karaoke manageress, and all her girls seem to sleep there (off and on).

Small sample, but I'm sure everyone that can understand Thai will know of a few workers in their road.

Prostitution is a massive problem in Thailand, but everyone chooses to sweep it under the carpet.

Edited May 4, 2013 by AnotherOneAmerican

[megaworldasia]

The bottom line for me is what, exactly, would a Thai woman, even an educated type, bring to the table to improve my life on the planet. After 20 years of living in the country I can state, quite confidently, that it's not very much. It's not like you can give them 2 million baht and expect them to double it for you through shrewd investments or business acumen. Sorry to say but even your middle class, educated types are myopic; with eating, shopping, iphone, thai TV and idle gossip filling the majority of their waking hours.

No doubt the defenders of the realm, and the apologists, will get stuck into me but I don't give a shit; I've seen, and heard, it all before. The mirage that you talk about is but one of the many mirages in this country and the most important mirage that you need to get to grips with is the one where you might think you are the most important person in your Thai woman's life. You keep your mirage and I'll have mine; the one where I remain single, make use of P4P mirage on Saturday nights and not have to be concerned about showing a bunch of people, who aren't really interested in me, that I'm wealthy enough to take care of their daughter.<br /><br /><br />

Well, to be fair, there aren't many people here or elsewhere you could give 2 million baht to and expect them to double it through shrewd investments, is there?

I do tend to agree with your assessment of the mindset of "middle class" Thais but I don't think they're really that much different from their counterparts in the West.

Aren't the middle-classes in the UK, Europe and the US part of societies that:-

1. Spend an inordinate amount of time glued to mind-numbing TV soap operas?

2. Elevate unremarkable dimwits possessed of distinctly minor talent to celebrity status?

3. Move heaven and earth to be able to afford tat like iPhones, fashion-statement cars and expensive clothes?

Yes, for sure, there is interest in arguably more "worthy" matters like business, politics, current affairs and the arts etc in our homelands but that's the case here too. If it wasn't, why would there be TV channels devoted to those topics on Thai TV? Ok, perhaps the quality isn't up to Western standards but don't we all cringe with embarrassment and shake our heads at the glaring inaccuracies when reading or watching Western-produced articles and documentaries about Thailand?

I'm certainly not an apologist or a defender of the realm but, frankly, I think one of the most prevalent mirages is that which sees some develop the sense that Western societies are innately superior to Thailand's when, if you look closely, there are so many similarities.

I think it's safe to say that many foreigners, who've decided to call this place their home, have done so because they - myself included - have decided to opt out of the PC nonsense and controlling suffocation (taxation) of their western homelands. I'm well aware of the limitations of the way of life here, and some of the oddities of the locals, but the fact is I've come to prefer the mirages of Thailand to that of western societies.

[SteeleJoe]

There is no real Thailand or unreal Thailand.

Nice one. I get so tired of people claiming Pattaya, Phuket or Sukhumvit or where is not "real Thailand"; for better or worse they are all Thailand just as the other 90% of Thailand that is quite different is also real Thailand.

And you are also correct that it comes down to one's lifestyle choices: I remember that this first became so apparent to me about 20 years ago when I was still living in Pattaya years ago but I all but completely gave up the partying lifestyle and lived in my quiet suburban home with ordinary middle class Thai neighbors - nothing tawdry or unThai about it...

[SteeleJoe]

You could have written that topic in 2-3 paragraphs - time to put the bong down.

I confess my eyes glazed over pretty quickly and I only managed to skim over it...

[HardenedSoul]

Prostitution on almost every road?? Do you even live in Thailand?

You have already posted where you live, so hard for you to claim it isn't happening on your road, and on a massive scale.

I live in a quiet Thai only moobaan, house next door but one, owned by a karaoke manageress, and all her girls seem to sleep there (off and on).

Small sample, but I'm sure everyone that can understand Thai will know of a few workers in their road.

Prostitution is a massive problem in Thailand, but everyone chooses to sweep it under the carpet.

Yes I have posted where I live and, yes, it's hardly difficult to find around here but I'm open-minded enough to know that prostitution is not available on almost every road in Thailand.

[SteeleJoe]

So you are suggesting the "entertainment industry" has only been put in place in Thailand to cater to farangs/tourists only and it doesnt exist outside this areas ?...my my...one could suggest the "Local entertainment" industry catering to Thai's is far bigger...one has to only drive down a certain road in BKK and see the numerous up market "entertainment establishments"..some of which were/are owned by Thai politians..these places most certainly were not established for the tourist market...

I believe most Thai's cant speak English, so no amount of proper motivation will get them to.....as to your last statement..how do you know they speak almost fluent English if they will not speak to you in English ?...

they reason they are not even trying to speak English in the conversation is that they assume you speak no Thai ?...and they dont want you to know what they are talking about...or they are just out and out rude..

Having been working here almost 12 years with an MNC, I have yet to meet a Thai who speaks "almost fluent educated English", very good English most certainly, lots of them but almost "fluent educated English"..no, of course we may define differently what constitutes "educated fluent English"

Me thinks its you seeing a mirage..

* One could suggest it and one be entirely correct. It is a simple fact - not a criticism in my mind - that probably about 90% of the sex industry caters to Thais and a large portion of that is upmarket. If you add drinking establishments and such that have virtually zero Farang customers and never will? A massive number, far greater than any than are patronized exclusively by Farangs.

* I've been here for decades and have or have had as Thai friends, colleagues, neighbors, and romantic partners people from "all walks of life" and all socio-economic backgrounds but mostly university educated and many post graduate. From that, and the countless encounters I've had in any number of working situations or as a customer or guest in various businesses, I am convinced that it is in fact very few Thais who are "near fluent in English" and relatively few that speak English very well. Again, this is not a criticism - I know why this is the case and I am not implying anything about Thais by saying it - it is just a fact.

Your post pretty much nailed it.

[SteeleJoe]

Prostitution on almost every road?? Do you even live in Thailand?

You have already posted where you live, so hard for you to claim it isn't happening on your road, and on a massive scale.

I live in a quiet Thai only moobaan, house next door but one, owned by a karaoke manageress, and all her girls seem to sleep there (off and on).

Small sample, but I'm sure everyone that can understand Thai will know of a few workers in their road.

Prostitution is a massive problem in Thailand, but everyone chooses to sweep it under the carpet.

Yes I have posted where I live and, yes, it's hardly difficult to find around here but I'm open-minded enough to know that prostitution is not available on almost every road in Thailand.

As recognized by people who studied the sex industry in Thailand (as I used to be) including many Thai scholars, research has shown what is in fact apparent to any one observant enough and who knows Thai society well enough - that prostitution comes Ina wide variety of forms and is available at wide variety of venues. Karaoke longer, barber shops, restaurants, tea shops, and more are all examples of places other than the many brothels, massage parlors or bars that offer commercial sex.

Chula did a great study many years ago - I have it on paper in a box somewhere, I've tried to find it online before but couldn't - that indicated that in any given place in Bangkok, commercial sex was available within a kilometer and that upcountry it wasn't much different (obviously distances could be greater for someone living in very remote spots).

Almost every road? IF that's an exaggeration, it's not by all that much.

And as in my previous post I will add - this is not intended as a criticism, just a statement of facts as I know them. (I personally don't see prostitution as necessarily problem per se; I won't take time qualify that as it would be way off topic - and take too much work).

[balloon chaser]

Yes, normal women stay with men for money. It's not just bargirls. Trust me. Just because they don't work in a bar doesn't mean it's free. You'll learn that soon enough.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

@SJ and HS

I also read a survey done by CM university, it's online somewhere, and they concluded.

50% of 15 year old boys in CM province had used the services of a prostitute and 90% of male university students in CM had used the services of a brothel.

[arminbkk]

My impression, from 'hanging' with Thais, is that often they themselves step out into that mirage temporarily.

And a lot of the Thais that provide that mirage you used to live in, leave those normal suburbs when they go to work to do just that.

But of course, in a land of 60+ million, they are not all in the same service industry.

Of all the thai guys i have met in 10 years or so, maybe one out of 10 was not into such mirage.

But yes, take that away and it is very similar to normal everyday farang live (just to abbreviate).

Which is boring, hence what a lot of foreigners come for/do here, which I don't consider bad.

By the way, I don't indulge in that, which is why I find life in Thailand almost as dull and boring as where I come from (but I stay here for work and future career opps).