Fbar? foreign bank account report.

[Jingthing]

July 1, 2013 is actually the first date where mailed in forms are no longer accepted. NOT July 2014.

Just the facts. No conspiracy theories. Just a poorly executed online filing program SO FAR.

Cheers.

Of course I do wonder if they are serious about the July 1, 2013 date.

For example if someone mailed a form today from Thailand, good chance it wouldn't make it before July. This form would of course be for the 2012 requirement. It would be late, yes, but would they REALLY not even accept that mailed form as filed (though late)?

Edited June 24, 2013 by Jingthing

[MrRealDeal]

July 1, 2013 is actually the first date where mailed in forms are no longer accepted. NOT July 2014.

Just the facts. No conspiracy theories. Just a poorly executed online filing program SO FAR.

Cheers.

Yeah worrying about massive government fines because the government filing system is impossible to use is not a conspiracy theory ....... Yeah ok

I would care about the date if I was dumb enough to want to fill out my form late this year But you already knew I knew the date anyhow but were just being you my mentioning it.

[Jingthing]

To be clear to the more serious posters who aren't here to play silly personality games: I NEVER asserted ever that the online filing system's deficiencies were part of any conspiracy theory. I do NOT believe in that. Not even a bit. Just the facts. Cheers.

The stated horrific fines for FBAR noncompliance are REAL. How often they actually impose those fines, I don't have a clue. Do you? In any case, they are a threat over our heads and in my view, not to be taken lightly.

That said, don't be naive. We who need to file FBARs are now required to file at a financial CRIMES website. If that isn't CREEPY, I don't know what is.

Edited June 24, 2013 by Jingthing

[MrRealDeal]

To be clear to the more serious posters who aren't here to play silly personality games: I NEVER asserted ever that the online filing system's deficiencies were part of any conspiracy theory. I do NOT believe in that. Not even a bit. Just the facts. Cheers.

The stated horrific fines for FBAR noncompliance are REAL. How often they actually impose those fines, I don't have a clue. Do you? In any case, they are a threat over our heads and in my view, not to be taken lightly.

That said, don't be naive. We who need to file FBARs are now required to file at a financial CRIMES website. If that isn't CREEPY, I don't know what is.

I asserted that your post about the "shockingly severe penalty's " and the pending near impossibility of being able to get it done is a conspiracy theory , I didn't accuse you of knowing it was one.

[Jingthing]

Once again, that is a completely false characterization of my intended meaning.

Those are two facts -- the penalties and the online filing difficulties. I was never talking about any conspiracy or suggesting there was any nefarious RELATION at all to those two facts.

Let's move on please.

Speaking of which, anyone who still needs to file for 2012 has about a week now so you'll probably be filing online. If that applies to anyone and you're having issues with the online filing, perhaps someone here can help you. If it relates to being offered multiple options for signing your online form, I can't help as I don't recall I was offered such an option.

Cheers.

Edited June 24, 2013 by Jingthing

[MrRealDeal]

Once again, that is an completely false characterization of my intended meaning.

Those are two facts -- the penalties and the online filing difficulties. I was never talking about any conspiracy or suggesting there was any RELATION at all to those two facts.

Let's move on please.

Post 55 shows how you related the penalties and filing difficulty's and related both of them to a "mountain" of a problem , if you would like to move on please don't force me to respond by posting things that any reasonable person would see as untrue and act like that's a reasonable way to end a discussion and I should just stop posting. Post 55 would lead any sensible person to see you did in fact "suggest a relation to those two facts". If you would like to move on or stop talking about it you are certainly free to do that. And if hearing from me is disturbing you feel free to stop posting to me and you won't hear from me again.

[Jingthing]

I simply meant if you don't comply with FBAR you are legally subject to horrific fines. That is a fact. I never said, thought, suggested, or posted that the government was deliberately making it hard to file to subject us to unfair fines. Which means for those who need to file FBARs in future, it is in our interest that the online filing systems gets technically better.

People are of course free to read any kind of fantastical silliness into anything anyone posts, but again, that was never what I posted and never a meaning I intended to convey (a conspiracy theory). I think I would know best what I think, yes?

Cheers.

Edited June 24, 2013 by Jingthing

[Cheapcharly]

I don't need to file now as I arrived in usa this year.

I would like to know if it s possible to start to file from July and send the form in January or February right after on file the 1040.

like this I can start to get all bank information and address from now.

it will help me to be consistent with the 1040.

possible?

[Jingthing]

I don't need to file now as I arrived in usa this year.

I would like to know if it s possible to start to file from July and send the form in January or February right after on file the 1040.

like this I can start to get all bank information and address from now.

it will help me to be consistent with the 1040.

possible?

I don't really fully understand you but I can say.

July is LATE for the 2012 filing.

I don't see why anyone would start filing for the 2013 FBAR until beginning January 2014.

Starting July (in about a week from now) you CANNOT send the FBAR form again ... EVER. (Unless they change the rules.)

Living in the USA is irrelevant. Having interest in FOREIGN ACCOUNTS is relevant. This is not for expats only. It is for any people with the foreign accounts over the required levels during the reporting year in question (the current reporting year in question is 2012).

FBAR and IRS are separate things with DIFFERENT filing deadlines, filing rules, etc.

Edited June 24, 2013 by Jingthing

[MrRealDeal]

I simply meant if you don't comply with FBAR you are legally subject to horrific fines. That is a fact. I never said, thought, suggested, or posted that the government was deliberately making it hard to file to subject us to unfair fines.

Well something we can agree on .... Although a completely new subject as no one until now has mentioned any deliberate government action.

If it makes you feel better about the fines their is a long list of mitigating factors that bring the fines down to 500 dollars on accounts below 50,000 for unintentional / unpuoposefull \ hummm I forget the exact word right now but the fine a person who made a reasonable mistake or failed to file would be 500 on an under 50,000 account , and the stated Goal of the IRS is compliance not punishment and they claim fines are only for your basic willful scoffing of the law types and others are given a warning.

So while I don't want to get into a new improved argument I would simply say you are seemingly unaware of the actual fine one would be subject to in each of the more than 200 different situations that the IRS outlines in the Penalty part of the Law and incorrectly assume that the 100,000 or 50 percent whichever is higher one might be applicable to every situation. Like I said it goes down to 500 Dollars and that would apply to most any reasonable person who was unable to file for some reason or another , the high penalty's are for people who deserve them for willful negligent misconduct basically telling the IRS to take hike and have a history as well.

So while I have not complained that you are making another untrue statement about the penalty being "horrific" you actually are doing that as well although I assume it's only because you are uninformed as to the long list of different types and category's of non filers and the penalty's they can receive. The one you know of is for a scoffing tax cheat with a Billion hidden away , The average Thai visa poster you are talking to would face a Max fine of 500 dollars if they blew off a warning.

Edited June 24, 2013 by MrRealDeal

[Cheapcharly]

well I will start to file tax for 2013, in 2014. before 2013 I was not a us citizen or a green card holder. before 2013 I had nothing to do with the usa. I was just an alien.

so people like me need to file in 2014 only as well as the fbar. correct?

they don't explain for us, immigrants got no explanation.

I m a new poor immigrant in the USA with more 10k$ on non usa accounts and I can not get access to all my account anyway, I need to wait end of 2013 to know how much money I have as interest are calculated at the end of they year.

I was thinking to enter address of bank already and estimate of what I have and when ready I will click the send button in 2014 when all numbers are correct.

[MrRealDeal]

I don't need to file now as I arrived in usa this year.

I would like to know if it s possible to start to file from July and send the form in January or February right after on file the 1040.

like this I can start to get all bank information and address from now.

it will help me to be consistent with the 1040.

possible?

I don't really fully understand you but I can say.

July is LATE for the 2012 filing.

I don't see why anyone would start filing for the 2013 FBAR until beginning January 2014.

Starting July (in about a week from now) you CANNOT send the FBAR form again ... EVER. (Unless they change the rules.)

Living in the USA is irrelevant. Having interest in FOREIGN ACCOUNTS is relevant. This is not for expats only. It is for any people with the foreign accounts over the required levels during the reporting year in question (the current reporting year in question is 2012).

FBAR and IRS are separate things with DIFFERENT filing deadlines, filing rules, etc.

I will tell you this you had better figure this out because you are coming pretty close to the willful misconduct zone which would put you in a higher fine category ..... Not taking reasonable steps to understand the FBAR rules is considered willfully not complying , and if you just went to the IRS or FBAR website you would understand it just fine , they also provide a phone number you can call and ask a real expert a question rendering the "I didn't understand excuse" not good enough.

[Cheapcharly]

do they have email address?

found one [email protected]

Edited June 24, 2013 by Cheapcharly

[MrRealDeal]

Google FBAR and go to the IRS website ..... Yes they have email .... under 10,000 you wont need to file in 2014 rendering all this unnecessary to discuss however you would need to file in your TAX form, interest over 5 Dollars on the account you said has less than 10,000.

[MrRealDeal]

Slight correction as I misspoke above the average person would GET a 500 dollar fine if they blew off a warning but repeat offenders or people with a history of Tax infractions in the same category could receive a Max of 5000

[Cheapcharly]

you say this is for 2012. I don't need to report anything as I spent less than 6 months in the USA as non resident...

[MrRealDeal]

Well I said you don't need to file because you said you were not a citizen or green card holder not because of the time you spent in the USA ..... but the not reporting part is correct , you would not need to file because you were not a citizen or a green card holder ...... and you also said you have less than 10,000 in your account which would mean you would not need to file in 2014 either ! ..... but at least you learned something about the FBAR rules for when you strike it rich in the USA and send some money back home someday ..... Welcome to America

[Jingthing]

Any taxation/FBAR advice on this site should be taken with some skepticism as the advisers are generally not professional tax experts and the stories given may or may not actually reflect all the relevant details of a person's situation.

Edited June 24, 2013 by Jingthing

[MrRealDeal]

I think post 70 will confirm post 78 is good advice.

[Cheapcharly]

no I have more than 10000... but filing time is next year for 2013 . as i m going to file for 2013, I must start to collect all info for 2014(and send this before June 2014).that s give me a break. because now I try to understand all this mess that USA put me in.

and I bet many guys will not file anything because they have no clue of these bfar rules.

will they shut down the fbar in July. and start a new one in January 2014?

then I will need to find a tax expert in bkk or pattaya because I will be on vacation in Thailand.

[Jingthing]

I believe the deadline for next year's FBARs will be June 30, 2014 (END of June). That's the FBAR to report accounts in 2013. Cheers. Yeah don't worry about filing that until next year.

[MrRealDeal]

As I have repeatedly tried to point out the form asks about 5 simple questions like your name, address, tax number, your banks address and amount in the bank ...... A 6 year old could fill it out without a problem you don't need any kind of expert ...

I will go out on a limb and tell you that the electronic posting will be easy enough for the average 10 year old by the time you fill it out which will no doubt be credited to some miraculous unexpected improvement !

[Cheapcharly]

Fbar is not hard.

what I will need is a guy to help me to file my tax. I have stock and bond plus gift I receive. I have no house.

Wednesday I go see my bank for my change of address to USA.

see if they do tax for me( which I doubt.)

they have to give me forms before the 15 February if I understand correctly. then I bring all my paper to a tax expert.

this will become a full time job . no need to work, I will be to busy with paperwork. I would save more money to take care of my money than getting a dumb job in the USA.

[Jingthing]

Yes this is an FBAR thread and filling out the form is indeed quite simple (as opposed to the online filing which has proved problematic for many), assuming you have access to the bank records needed.

[Cheapcharly]

As I have repeatedly tried to point out the form asks about 5 simple questions like your name, address, tax number,  your banks address and amount in the bank ......  A 6 year old could fill it out without a problem you don't need any kind of expert ... 

 

I will go out on a limb and tell you that the electronic posting will be easy enough for the average 10 year old by the time you fill it out which will no doubt be credited to some miraculous unexpected improvement !

my bank will shut my online access because they have no bank in usa.

so it makes things harder to know what you have.

in thailand, they don't want set my adress outside of Thailand. so I have to fly to Thailand or ask friends to send my mail.

[MrRealDeal]

You can just use the telephone to call the bank no need to fly back just to check your account. My Thai bank doesn't shut my access just because I live in America .... Kasicorn

You could also just ask your friend to open the mail and then call them on the phone

Edited June 25, 2013 by MrRealDeal

[Ticketmaster]

Dear Jingthing,

Well this thread has been going on for awhile. On June 19, I posted:

I just sent this e-mail to [email protected] with my name attached:

Dear BSAE,

Last year I was able to file my FBAR online, no problem. This year, I kept getting a message that said I needed the latest version of Adobe Reader, which I already had. After three hours of uninstalling, restarting, reinstalling and restarting, I finally gave up and mailed the paper version (three times to make sure you got it).

I further see instructions telling me I have to uninstall various other programs I might have on my computer.

I do all my financial transactions online and they are all secure. I have NEVER been told to uninstall programs or otherwise modify my computer.

But you folks tell me I Must MODIFY MY COMPUTER TO SUIT YOU??? <deleted>?

My understanding is that next year, online filing will be mandatory.

Be advised, I have no intention of making any modifications to my computer beyond having the latest version of Adobe Reader installed. I will NOT uninstall any programs. If I am unable to file online, I'll comply with the law by sending a paper report just as I did this year. And until you get your act together, that's how I'll file every year.

You folks need to get your act together. I would be interested in hearing from you on this, but I seriously doubt that I will. And if you do respond, please refrain from using any intimidating language. I am NOT intimidated and will NOT be intimidated. Capiche?

Perhaps everyone should send something similar.

Your response was a sarcastic: "Well, isn't that special!" and you professed that you would rather bend over than fight injustice. If people do not stand up and fight injustice the injustice persists and often increases. It's been over four months, but, out of the blue, BSAE responded:

J---,

Thanks for your feedback. Yes, we have received other complaints about the online process to file the FBAR and are in the process of redesigning the system to make it more streamlined and easier to file. Compatibility with existing Adobe readers will be tested to ensure you have no issues filing. The new process will be ready in January.

Thanks to me and the other people that were not afraid to take BSAE to task for their faulty software, they should have it fixed my January.

I hope I have helped some of the folks out there that have struggled with what has often been an onerous process of electronically filing the FBAR. It should be simple, and I suspect it will be simple with BSAE's software modifications and upgrades.

[Jingthing]

Great news, TM. Let's hope the fixes will be for real. I just wouldn't have used such strong language corresponding with the government, such as <deleted>, but good on you for pushing it.

[Pib]

Just hope the same folks who built the Obamacare website are not involved in the fix.

[Jingthing]

Just hope the same folks who built the Obamacare website are not involved in the fix.

A fair point!