Why is it so hard to find a good nanny?

[kurnell]

Since my 1st child was born in 2006 we have gone through 20+ nannies and to be honest, only one of them (the first) has been any good. To begin with, not one of them could cook and they had to be trained. We have also paid them anything from 8-15k (the 15k nanny was the worst) and have tried Thai, Cambodia, Burmese an Laos. Occasionally we have had a nanny that was promising but they would leave after 6 months, often in the middle of the night.

When I read on websites like BAMBI I hear glowing reports of nannies that "became part of the family" etc and "my kids loved them" or "couldn't live without them". So where are these nannies?

Perhaps I am expecting too much, as we ask our nanny to prepare our 2 little kids for school then handle household chores while they are school, before getting them ready for bed at night. We also do not live on Sukhumvit which seems to be a turn off for a lot of nannies.

[Donnie Brasco]

Some kind of job description scedule appears in order here.

A domestic servant is not an appliance that comes with a set of functionalities. She has specific duties. The employer has specific responsibilities.

A nanny is a woman who lives in and who's primary duties are to take care of the children, to dress them, wash them, play with them, take them to school etc. and does a little tidying up.

A baby sitter lives out, comes to your house and does pretty much the same stuff.

A cleaning lady is like a maid except that she lives out and shows up a couple of times a week to clean your house.

None of these people are drivers or will wash your car. If any of these people sense "scope creep" they will begin looking for other work through the bamboo Internet.

A maid lives in. She has her own room and her job may consist of all or some of the above duties and she may or may not cook. This should be stated clearly when she's hired.

She does the laundry. Other tasks are negotiated before she starts.

A cook knows how to prepare several (ten to fifteen) local dishes and knows or is willing to learn how to make some Western ones.

Most foreigners in Thailand have never had domestic help.

They have no idea how to engage them, how to train them and how to pay them.

They are free to leave whenever they find a better deal.

Any and all of the above may jump ship whenever they wish.

Hiring a woman, calling here your maid and then piling on ALL of the above duties onto the poor woman is no solution to anybody's problems; the householder's or the maid's. Thais hire these people as wage slaves and the additional responsibilities brought into the house by a foreign husband who has no idea of a) what a maid's duties should be and

what the employer's expectations are

Lastly, overcoming "help" issues must never be resolved as young Thai couples occasionally do; by kidnapping a pre-adolescent and enslaving her into performing all the household chores.

Remember "dii-dii"; there are plenty of sharp knives in the Kitchen.

They can leave whenever they want.

I know all this stuff because I was once a butler/valet to Ellen Degeneres.

Hope this helps.

[kurnell]

Some kind of job description scedule appears in order here.

A domestic servant is not an appliance that comes with a set of functionalities. She has specific duties. The employer has specific responsibilities.

A nanny is a woman who lives in and who's primary duties are to take care of the children, to dress them, wash them, play with them, take them to school etc. and does a little tidying up.

A baby sitter lives out, comes to your house and does pretty much the same stuff.

A cleaning lady is like a maid except that she lives out and shows up a couple of times a week to clean your house.

None of these people are drivers or will wash your car. If any of these people sense "scope creep" they will begin looking for other work through the bamboo Internet.

A maid lives in. She has her own room and her job may consist of all or some of the above duties and she may or may not cook. This should be stated clearly when she's hired.

She does the laundry. Other tasks are negotiated before she starts.

A cook knows how to prepare several (ten to fifteen) local dishes and knows or is willing to learn how to make some Western ones.

Most foreigners in Thailand have never had domestic help.

They have no idea how to engage them, how to train them and how to pay them.

They are free to leave whenever they find a better deal.

Any and all of the above may jump ship whenever they wish.

Hiring a woman, calling here your maid and then piling on ALL of the above duties onto the poor woman is no solution to anybody's problems; the householder's or the maid's. Thais hire these people as wage slaves and the additional responsibilities brought into the house by a foreign husband who has no idea of a) what a maid's duties should be and

what the employer's expectations are

Lastly, overcoming "help" issues must never be resolved as young Thai couples occasionally do; by kidnapping a pre-adolescent and enslaving her into performing all the household chores.

Remember "dii-dii"; there are plenty of sharp knives in the Kitchen.

They can leave whenever they want.

I know all this stuff because I was once a butler/valet to Ellen Degeneres.

Hope this helps.

Not really. They have a job description before they start. It ain't rocket science.

[robblok]

Some kind of job description scedule appears in order here.

A domestic servant is not an appliance that comes with a set of functionalities. She has specific duties. The employer has specific responsibilities.

A nanny is a woman who lives in and who's primary duties are to take care of the children, to dress them, wash them, play with them, take them to school etc. and does a little tidying up.

A baby sitter lives out, comes to your house and does pretty much the same stuff.

A cleaning lady is like a maid except that she lives out and shows up a couple of times a week to clean your house.

None of these people are drivers or will wash your car. If any of these people sense "scope creep" they will begin looking for other work through the bamboo Internet.

A maid lives in. She has her own room and her job may consist of all or some of the above duties and she may or may not cook. This should be stated clearly when she's hired.

She does the laundry. Other tasks are negotiated before she starts.

A cook knows how to prepare several (ten to fifteen) local dishes and knows or is willing to learn how to make some Western ones.

Most foreigners in Thailand have never had domestic help.

They have no idea how to engage them, how to train them and how to pay them.

They are free to leave whenever they find a better deal.

Any and all of the above may jump ship whenever they wish.

Hiring a woman, calling here your maid and then piling on ALL of the above duties onto the poor woman is no solution to anybody's problems; the householder's or the maid's. Thais hire these people as wage slaves and the additional responsibilities brought into the house by a foreign husband who has no idea of a) what a maid's duties should be and

what the employer's expectations are

Lastly, overcoming "help" issues must never be resolved as young Thai couples occasionally do; by kidnapping a pre-adolescent and enslaving her into performing all the household chores.

Remember "dii-dii"; there are plenty of sharp knives in the Kitchen.

They can leave whenever they want.

I know all this stuff because I was once a butler/valet to Ellen Degeneres.

Hope this helps.

Not really. They have a job description before they start. It ain't rocket science.

Still he makes valid points a nanny is not a maid and does not cook nor does she clean. You want too much for your money.

[joeaverage]

i have been remarkably lucky in that respect.

After a one week stint with a woman who turned out to be pure evil, we recruited a distant cousin who was sick of factory work. 6 years later she is still with me, even though the child's mother is not.

she makes 10k per month and is more family than retainer and is entirely responsible for my household.

while she may be a tad lazy, she is fiercely loyal to me and loves my child and is infinitely trustworthy and honest.

i just wish she could cook.

[Boo]

Agreed, a nanny is not a cleaner. She may be asked to perform duties in relation to the children, doing their laundry & ironing, changing their beds, tidying their toys but you seem to want a cleaner who also does some childcare duties. Her day presumably starts early morning & unless your kids go to bed at 5pm, she is expected to work until around 8pm. That is a very long day, esp if she is expected to clean house in between.

I would suggest lowering the salary for the nanny & use the remainder to employ a day cleaner to come in a couple of hours a day.

[Donnie Brasco]

Ah, I see.

Their job description is that they do whatever you say.

Ok,how's that be. working out for you so far, Sahib ;-?

[Donnie Brasco]

Yeah ok kurnall.

As you say in your sneak-shot at ME and your slight to all in service after all the trouble I have taken to educate you on the subject of domestic help;indeed it's not rocket science.

But you still haven't been able to get it right, have you ?

Life in the raj can be a tough row to hoe.

[Skytrain2hell]

I found a nice nanny/babysitter on here actually. We don't have her over often as we have a decent amount of free time. She doesn't do much maid work, but we hire her as a caretaker and not a maid.

[joeaverage]

Yeah ok kurnall.

As you say in your sneak-shot at ME and your slight to all in service after all the trouble I have taken to educate you on the subject of domestic help;indeed it's not rocket science.

But you still haven't been able to get it right, have you ?

Life in the raj can be a tough row to hoe.

a slight to all in service.

get over yourself.

or get yourself back to downton abbey

Edited June 22, 2013 by joeaverage

[davejones]

I think you don't know the difference between a nanny and a cook. They are two different occupations. If you want a cook, then hire a cook, not a nanny.

And if you pay 8K, what do you expect. Not trying to be harsh here, but it seems you want someone who is a nanny, cook, cleaner all rolled into one, who will work dawn to dusk for little pay. I'm not surprised that they all left. I wouldn't even start.

If you want a nanny, then hire one and only give them nanny duties. I don't know what nannies in Thailand are like, but in the UK, a good nanny would be properly trained. They wouldn't expect to be cleaning and cooking.

[gosompoi]

6 years with our nanny, wonderful with the children, better than we are! But she doesn't do anything but take care of the children between 7am until 6pm. No cleaning or other duties.

[kurnell]

Some kind of job description scedule appears in order here.

A domestic servant is not an appliance that comes with a set of functionalities. She has specific duties. The employer has specific responsibilities.

A nanny is a woman who lives in and who's primary duties are to take care of the children, to dress them, wash them, play with them, take them to school etc. and does a little tidying up.

A baby sitter lives out, comes to your house and does pretty much the same stuff.

A cleaning lady is like a maid except that she lives out and shows up a couple of times a week to clean your house.

None of these people are drivers or will wash your car. If any of these people sense "scope creep" they will begin looking for other work through the bamboo Internet.

A maid lives in. She has her own room and her job may consist of all or some of the above duties and she may or may not cook. This should be stated clearly when she's hired.

She does the laundry. Other tasks are negotiated before she starts.

A cook knows how to prepare several (ten to fifteen) local dishes and knows or is willing to learn how to make some Western ones.

Most foreigners in Thailand have never had domestic help.

They have no idea how to engage them, how to train them and how to pay them.

They are free to leave whenever they find a better deal.

Any and all of the above may jump ship whenever they wish.

Hiring a woman, calling here your maid and then piling on ALL of the above duties onto the poor woman is no solution to anybody's problems; the householder's or the maid's. Thais hire these people as wage slaves and the additional responsibilities brought into the house by a foreign husband who has no idea of a) what a maid's duties should be and

what the employer's expectations are

Lastly, overcoming "help" issues must never be resolved as young Thai couples occasionally do; by kidnapping a pre-adolescent and enslaving her into performing all the household chores.

Remember "dii-dii"; there are plenty of sharp knives in the Kitchen.

They can leave whenever they want.

I know all this stuff because I was once a butler/valet to Ellen Degeneres.

Hope this helps.

Not really. They have a job description before they start. It ain't rocket science.

Still he makes valid points a nanny is not a maid and does not cook nor does she clean. You want too much for your money.

Nonsense. The nanny has nothing to do between 7am and 4pm so what is she supposed to do? Watch TV? In fact it is a far more cruisey job than a full time nanny for a baby.

[kurnell]

Yeah ok kurnall.

As you say in your sneak-shot at ME and your slight to all in service after all the trouble I have taken to educate you on the subject of domestic help;indeed it's not rocket science.

But you still haven't been able to get it right, have you ?

Life in the raj can be a tough row to hoe.

Are you on medication? Or do you always argue with yourself?

[kurnell]

I think you don't know the difference between a nanny and a cook. They are two different occupations. If you want a cook, then hire a cook, not a nanny.

And if you pay 8K, what do you expect. Not trying to be harsh here, but it seems you want someone who is a nanny, cook, cleaner all rolled into one, who will work dawn to dusk for little pay. I'm not surprised that they all left. I wouldn't even start.

If you want a nanny, then hire one and only give them nanny duties. I don't know what nannies in Thailand are like, but in the UK, a good nanny would be properly trained. They wouldn't expect to be cleaning and cooking.

Where do I say I pay 8k? Mate you are commenting on something you do not have a clue about.

[lee b]

money, you get what you pay for !

[MacChine]

...because other people's kids are usually intolerable brats. With overpopulation concerns today, children be restricted under a lottery system. Some of the sex pats in Thailand working on their third families,9 -10 kids some of them... sickening.

Edited June 22, 2013 by MacChine

[Gsxrnz]

After reading these comments I've concluded that we have the greatest live-in maid/nanny/cook/car cleaner/gardener in the whole of Thailand by the sound of it. I will be giving her a pay rise

[kurnell]

...because other people's kids are usually intolerable brats. With overpopulation concerns today, children be restricted under a lottery system. Some of the sex pats in Thailand working on their third families,9 -10 kids some of them... sickening.

Spreading the love. Have you tired anti-depressants?

[khunPer]

Nanny or maid is a low status job, many – especially young girls – wish to move further up from.

We have had a number of youg girls as combined maid/nanny since 2006 – five all together, three Thais, one Cambodian and one Lao. Never too hard work and always considered as being a member of the family, much more like the original Europen au-pair idea – I think that is quite important, as it move the maid up in status. A couple of years we had two maids, as there were more work. We never had any problems, but most (four) wished to move further on for various reasons (education, high school, finding boyfriend).

Their job has primary been to take care of our one child, secondary some housework like cleaning, laundry (machine) and ironing, sometimes cooking. If there has been extra work for the in-house maid, she always got extra – then the maid look forward to guests coming or something else needing her to work more.

The last one, we have had for four years now, is outstanding good and always says, she plan to stay with us for two more years – now in her third two-year term.

Yes, I believe the good maids/nannies are out there; but I also believe that it is not only a question of money.

[Donnie Brasco]

@ kernel

S-s-s-s okay, there sahib kernell, sir.

At this point no one on this thread is left wondering what kind of a person you'd be to work for :-)

Good luck in your search.

[Donnie Brasco]

Yeah ok kurnall.

As you say in your sneak-shot at ME and your slight to all in service after all the trouble I have taken to educate you on the subject of domestic help;indeed it's not rocket science.

But you still haven't been able to get it right, have you ?

Life in the raj can be a tough row to hoe.

a slight to all in service.

get over yourself.

or get yourself back to downton abbey

I met an English couple on holiday at Spa Samui. She (yep, she) was a butler and valet and he was the duty chef and driver for a very wealthy older man in the UK. She was a rockin' hot lass with a good head on her shoulders and he was a very knowledgeable cook and mechanic.

When I asked them what they did she said they were "in service" and then proceeded to tell me what that meant. They had good salaries and benefits and seemed very happy with their jobs. They said "service" worked well for them since they had decided that they preferred it to family life.

There was a yacht chef there as well. He'd just got off in Langkawi because he decided he'd had enough.

Met a valet to the Royals on a beach in Paros ages ago. He also described his situation as having been "in service"

It seemed (as I vaguely remember) preferable to these people to describe themselves as being "in service" rather than saying "I am a servant" or "I am a valet". These people were all British and it seemed acceptable to them to describe themselves as being "in service".

Sorry to have appeared odd in my choice of words.

I do get the impression though that because we are in Thailand that you want to ratchet down the whole "servant concept" .

Since most of us have egalitarian roots and memes a lot of North Americans are embarrassed by it. So, this is quite understandable, I guess.

I assure you the three servants I mentioned and others I have encountered on several continents seemed content enough.

Sorry if this all sounds pretentious to you.

I don't intend it to be.

[PattayaPhom]

Try a Filipino. Must ask, if you expect the nanny to do everything, what child/household duties do you and the mother petform?

[jacko45k]

After reading these comments I've concluded that we have the greatest live-in maid/nanny/cook/car cleaner/gardener in the whole of Thailand by the sound of it. I will be giving her a pay rise

Yes, my missus might get one too next birthday!!!

[mikeinbangkok]

Majority of the foreigners who come to Asia, to Thailand to the Philippines or whatever, have never had the experience or the privilege of having Maids, Nannies, Cooks or drivers. Then suddenly they land here as Expatriates and become so choosy and classy that no local is good enough. They expect the 10,000 baht salary gives them the licence to demand anything and everything. Back in their home countries, I would not want to imagine what they would be told to do with that 10,000 baht...

[SOTIRIOS]

.....if you haven't noticed in the scam haven, land of ill-repute....

(,,,,,so much industry states that there is an inadequate workforce,,,,,,because nobody wants to work for an honest day's wages.....)

.....so easy to marry or scam one's way into a small fortune.....

[belg]

let's be honest, most of us expats could not afford a nanny in the west, here it is dirt cheap ...

so even you could do all chores yourself, or your wife, why would you ? for just a few thousands of baht, you can have your nanny/maid/cook

right ?

ours is not a live in, she comes for a few hours in the afternoon, cleans, prepare the dinner and after doing the dishes, she is on her way

she has another job that pays less in the morning, more hours and less pay

so ... yes we could eventually do everything ourselves, but now we are providing a hard (sometimes sleeping in the afternoon) working woman an extra income for herself , children, family...

[joeaverage]

Yeah ok kurnall.

As you say in your sneak-shot at ME and your slight to all in service after all the trouble I have taken to educate you on the subject of domestic help;indeed it's not rocket science.

But you still haven't been able to get it right, have you ?

Life in the raj can be a tough row to hoe.

a slight to all in service.

get over yourself.

or get yourself back to downton abbey

I met an English couple on holiday at Spa Samui. She (yep, she) was a butler and valet and he was the duty chef and driver for a very wealthy older man in the UK. She was a rockin' hot lass with a good head on her shoulders and he was a very knowledgeable cook and mechanic.

When I asked them what they did she said they were "in service" and then proceeded to tell me what that meant. They had good salaries and benefits and seemed very happy with their jobs. They said "service" worked well for them since they had decided that they preferred it to family life.

There was a yacht chef there as well. He'd just got off in Langkawi because he decided he'd had enough.

Met a valet to the Royals on a beach in Paros ages ago. He also described his situation as having been "in service"

It seemed (as I vaguely remember) preferable to these people to describe themselves as being "in service" rather than saying "I am a servant" or "I am a valet". These people were all British and it seemed acceptable to them to describe themselves as being "in service".

Sorry to have appeared odd in my choice of words.

I do get the impression though that because we are in Thailand that you want to ratchet down the whole "servant concept" .

Since most of us have egalitarian roots and memes a lot of North Americans are embarrassed by it. So, this is quite understandable, I guess.

I assure you the three servants I mentioned and others I have encountered on several continents seemed content enough.

Sorry if this all sounds pretentious to you.

I don't intend it to be.

i just don't see how these people and their career in service bear any relation to hiring and maintaining domestic help in Thailand.

the two just don't compare. they are rooted in different cultures and pertain to people with entirely different opportunities and expectations in life.

[SaamBaht]

We've had one good nanny in the past two years. She was a five day a week 9 to 5 woman who cared for my son and when he was napping did laundry and light cleaning. When he didn't nap, she didn't do the extra work. She left abruptly as pretty much all domestic help does. She lasted eighteen months.

During that time my wife has had a second child and we've tried to use Vietnamese women. They are better workers but don't do as well as the Thais with caring for children. They talk on the phone constantly and leave the moment a better job appears.

We would love to try Burmese, Khmers, hell ANYONE! We are desperate like the OP. We up in Isaan if anyone knows of anyone.

For what it's worth, I did post an ad on Thai Visa and did get one call from a woman in Bangkok who wanted a Bangkok area job.

I think part of the problem is a general labor shortage and wage inflation. Thais have options and many pass on a crying baby with dirty diapers.

Edited June 23, 2013 by SaamBaht

[RBOP]

I've been here in Thailand 18 years. Every maid I have had I had to fire for stealing and/or sloppy work. Wasn't until I got married that my wife took over that aspect of the house hold and then she would only hire relatives (cousins/nieces).

In your case, sounds like you need a Nanny and a Maid. Its interesting how spoiled we Westerners are here. My Mom as a single parent, raised 2 boys, worked a full time job, cooked and cleaned and we still went to the cottage every weekend in the summer. In the West, hiring a Nanny or Maid is only for the rich. My Uncle had a Nanny but it broke up his marriage when they slept together.