Election Day In Thailand

[ColPyat]

If he receives fewer votes than the No Vote option, would that not be considered "losing?"

That would be considered as Thaksin indeed having more than serious problems with his legitimacy, and would more than possibly mean that he would have to resign, and that new elections would have to be called for. It might even be a justified reason and crises enough to ask for a Royaly appointed interim government.

Lets wait and see. So far pure speculation, and no reason to reconsider my position. Which, if i may add, is not so entrenched that i don't disregard any possibility. I personally do base my position on facts and not on wishful thinking.

[yuyi]

But why do you say that Mr. Toxin is bad?

I have to insist that Mr. Toxin is the rightfully elected leader of this democratic country, and that all these negative happenings are nothing but desperate attempts by his enemies trying to use his honest mistakes to discredit him - nothing to worry about

Because, difficult as it may be to comprehend, and an entirely alien concept to you, there still are Thaksin opponents who do neither agree with the PAD and their demands, nor with the election boycott of the major opposition parties.

Now why would that be "difficult to comprehend", or even "an entirely alien concept"?

I notice quite often that there are more than 2 opinions as soon as more than 2 humans are involved

[sriracha john]

1. The use of rubber stamps. Why?

2. The rearranging of how the individual ballot is organized. Why?

3. The removal of privacy to those casting their vote. Why?

Any ideas?

You mean do I have any groundless assumptions? No that's your domain

For now your allegations of nation wide electoral fraud by the EC hold as much weight as your past predicitions that a military coup was imminent or that the monarchy was going to make Thaksin step down.

Rather than tell lies, can you point out these posts that you say I wrote regarding a personal prediction that a military coup was imminent of that the monarchy was going to make Thaksin step down?

I simply asked if you had any possible explanations as to why the EC made these changes, but I guess that's too much to ask. Oh well, I over-estimated your ability to answer a question as put forth. I won't make it again.

[Orion76]

Rather than tell lies, can you point out these posts that you say I wrote regarding a personal prediction that a military coup was imminent of that the monarchy was going to make Thaksin step down?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...st=195&p=690423

Do I really have to find the coup one too?

I simply asked if you had any possible explanations as to why the EC made these changes, but I guess that's too much to ask. Oh well, I over-estimated your ability to answer a question as put forth. I won't make it again.

I answered your question quite clearly... I'm leaving the groundless assumptions up to you, what part of that don't you understand?

[Rinrada]

Looks like the beers back on....

[konangrit]

"3. The removal of privacy to those casting their vote. Why?"

The EC's explanation:

"However, the secretary-general of the EC, Ekkachai Warunprapa, said the change came after the EC received some complaints that the old setup allowed people to carry out nefarious activities inside the booths.

"We received some complaints that people took pictures of their ballots to show to the people who were bribing them so they would get paid," he said."

[sting01]

My 2 cents :

I do precise I am not a Taksin fan, nor an oppnment. As foreigner I do not do politic in thailand. I also precise I consider thai people clevert enought to know what is best for them and their country.Whatever :

1) it's easy and good looking thing since one month to say Taksin is bad.

2) the guy indeed have made mistakes, errors and had some bad policies.

3) the same can be said about all and every political leaders existing or dead for each and every country

4) People are mostly confuse between ouste someone with a mob and the exercice of the democracy.

5) The main part of the anti taksin protester are from a social position that is well know : let say the bangkokian middle class. PLUS some intellectuals who raise since long time some morals advices, and some hight profile business or assimilate business person.

6) A lot of you read and speak fluently thai, so I do suppose they noticed what is written on the bilboards during the mobs? Mostly it's xenophobic or racist propaganda.

7) What Taksin did that made people so upset? No pay taxes? Sorry, but legally he do not have to do so, he was smart enought to use the legal holes existing. He is certainly not guilty if his economical oppnments are simply a bunch of morons not able to hire competent lawyers (Notice I do agree he used legal holes, or if it's not the english word let say he cheated the law, but it was not illegal).

8) Democracy is not a bunch of angry spoil and selfish people who are barely 20 % of the country who go rampage on the street and claim they are the heart of the country (both qualify the PAD and their opponments(the pro taksin)).

9) if you do not dare to go to poll because you know you will loose, so you are not worthy to simply imagine you will rule a country.

10) What taksin sold? A thai national company, or his familly business? Does taksin sold AIS or a nationalised company? I think he tried to do it with EGAT, and he was allowed to do so. But AIS is a private company, is not it? So what the fuss about private capital? The law say up to 49 % of foreign investment, what is the big problem?

11) After almost 5 years in thailand, for the first time I am scare. As I look stupid, as I have a mental problem that does not allow me to speak any foreign language but french only, thai (as english or US people) think I am not able to understand their own language. Well , even in Pantip shop keeper are less friendly right now. Well, farangs come in thailand not to give away money , but they want something for their money ... how dare they are! They should pay more. First time in 5 years I found shopp offering to sell mere CD copy for 250 bht (usual price is 100), and complaining me when I point the price in the next shop is 100.

12) People are complaining Taksin right now (thai people I mean) simply because he did what they dream to do but are not able to do because they do not have the balls for it. He got the big bucks. But he did not sold Thailand for that, he sold his own business.

13) Today, and it's what I am affriad, is the last day of the old thailand. Tomorrow it will be problem. If Taksin win, he will hit and hit hard. And the others will never accept to say he won. If he loose, and democratically resign and go with his money in bahamas or in france (we will be glad ot host him in Nice, Cannes or St tropez as long as he open a bank account there), what will come? The democrats? I do not think so. More likely it will be a leader of the PAD ... Religious extremist, or corrupt smiling oillyman, do your choice comrade.

14) what about the issan peasants who amongst the years have get gifts and money for taksin? What will they have now? Why do you think so many people upcountry used to vote for him? He give money ... I do agree it's vote buying, but when you merely earn 2000 bht a month you do not know (you do NOT WANT to know) wht is vote bying, but you know what your kids needs baddly.

As usual this post will certainly infuriate the most part of those who will read it, who cares in fact. Just read it, and think out the box about what I say. DO NOT FORGET we are not in USA, FRANCE or UK, but that is thailand, a country where powerty is usual upcountry, and where democracy exist since .... mmmm.... since Taksin was elected in fact, or some month before.

So , to take an exemple, Von Papen and the barons governement + the kamarilla was a a very bad thing in germany in 1932, but does the democratically and fairly elected man who went after von Papen was really the best choice???? I do not think, do you?

N.B I do not compare Taksin with Von Papen or anyone else, I justchoose an hystorical exemple.

P.S. Edited 2 times because certainly too sharp, maybe offensive, and also by auto protection

Edited April 2, 2006 by sting01

[Orion76]

"3. The removal of privacy to those casting their vote. Why?"

The EC's explanation:

"However, the secretary-general of the EC, Ekkachai Warunprapa, said the change came after the EC received some complaints that the old setup allowed people to carry out nefarious activities inside the booths.

"We received some complaints that people took pictures of their ballots to show to the people who were bribing them so they would get paid," he said."

Now there is some info one could base an opinion on, either saying that's a good reason or dismissing it as BS

As for the accusation that they did it so you could look over one's shoulder.... the partition around the booth is so low you can look over it from any side, the partition is actually lower than one's shoulders so looking at the ballot over one's shoulder is actually the most difficult way to see it

[sriracha john]

Rather than tell lies, can you point out these posts that you say I wrote regarding a personal prediction that a military coup was imminent of that the monarchy was going to make Thaksin step down?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...st=195&p=690423

Do I really have to find the coup one too?

I simply asked if you had any possible explanations as to why the EC made these changes, but I guess that's too much to ask. Oh well, I over-estimated your ability to answer a question as put forth. I won't make it again.

I answered your question quite clearly... I'm leaving the groundless assumptions up to you, what part of that don't you understand?

clicking on your link brought me to top of a page of posts.... the ones I looked at on that page that were written by me were news posts supplied by the Bangkok Post; they weren't predictions of mine. So again, rather then tell lies, do you have posts of my personal predictions??

You didn't answer any of the 3 questions I asked... but like I said, that's ok. You're incapable of doing so, so I won't ask about that part again.

[jdinasia]

[Orion76]

George, see any good lottery numbers in your crystal ball?

[ColPyat]

Finally we have a rather clear position of the privy council regarding the demands of having a Royaly appointed interim Prime Minister. Which should be seen especially in light of Chamlong's statement today, in which he announced that the PAD ignores the election result and will protest until a Royaly appointed interim Prime Minister is installed.

Now, i would be very interested what you PAD partisans have to say about this.

Here it goes, from the nation website, breaking news:

Surayud calls for halt to attempts to involve monarchy in politics

Privy Councillor General Surayud Chulanont Sunday called for a halt to any attempts to sway the monarchy for political gain.

"The Constitution clearly spells out the role of the monarchy and it is everyone's duty to study and understand this," he said.

The monarchy is a revered institution that Thai citizens can depend on, remaining above and beyond politics, he said.

Because of the deep bond between the monarch and the people, it comes as no surprise that relevant parties often portray themselves as loyal to the monarchy but it is deemed inappropriate if they try to involve the King in politicking, he said.

In regard to controversial comments made by anti-Thaksin campaigner Sondhi Limthongkul, he said the legal proceedings relating to the matter will result in justice.

Edited April 2, 2006 by ColPyat

[samran]

Went out and voted today. Waayyy out in the burbs, near fashion island.

The polling station was on the side of a street under an open air tent, the type that you see at a market.

A policeman was there dozing away, keeping 'guard'. The election officals went through the motions with me checking my ID. Seemed to be free and fair and above board as far as these things go. Having voted in Australian (state and Federal) elections, as well as UK ones, the process was remarkably similar.

My uncle walking into the booth with the wearing oppositions yellow singlet with 'we love the king' written in Thai on it. He voted for no-one. His wife, from Korat (bless), voted for the TRT party list.

And moi, I voted for...........

[Plus]

EC will be sued for their booth arrangements by PAD and separately P-Net first thing tomorrow morning.

EC's explanations don't mean much - they've already lost all credibility.

Anand was the first one to speak on the booth arrangements, btw.

[Heng]

Nothing out of the ordinary at Ruamrudee International School (my designated voting place), no one looking over anyone's shoulder either. Just a long line of voters processed in about 10 minutes.

[sriracha john]

"3. The removal of privacy to those casting their vote. Why?"

The EC's explanation:

"However, the secretary-general of the EC, Ekkachai Warunprapa, said the change came after the EC received some complaints that the old setup allowed people to carry out nefarious activities inside the booths.

"We received some complaints that people took pictures of their ballots to show to the people who were bribing them so they would get paid," he said."

Now there is some info one could base an opinion on, either saying that's a good reason or dismissing it as BS

As for the accusation that they did it so you could look over one's shoulder.... the partition around the booth is so low you can look over it from any side, the partition is actually lower than one's shoulders so looking at the ballot over one's shoulder is actually the most difficult way to see it

You are misunderstanding the positioning of the booths. The booths have partitions on three sides. Previously, the booths were placed with the back partition blocking the view of election officials seated before them. Now, with the booths being turned around, the officials have an unobscured view of the side of the booth without any partitions.

As for the EC's explanation, it does seem rather weak and not so widespread ("some reports.."). It would also seem alternative methods could have been used, such as restricting cameras or phones from being taken into the booth. On the whole, it would hardly seem adequate justification to qualify as a reason to over-rule Section 156 of the Constitution:

The casting of votes to elect or give approval to a person for holding office shall be secret.

[Orion76]

I have seen the booths with my own eyes today. If an official would want to stand next to a voter and intimidate him to tick a certain box then it really doesn't matter what direction it faces.

[yuyi]

I have seen the booths with my own eyes today. If an official would want to stand next to a voter and intimidate him to tick a certain box then it really doesn't matter what direction it faces.

All of them? 50 %? 10%? 1%? 0.01 % ?

[Insight]

Looks like the beers back on....

Where? I just checked at the 7-11 and the local Mum & Pop shop - got knocked back in both places.

[Plus]

Since people can't use phone cameras anymore - to prove they voted as they were paid, EC had to provide another way to monitor their ballot marking.

[Orion76]

I have seen the booths with my own eyes today. If an official would want to stand next to a voter and intimidate him to tick a certain box then it really doesn't matter what direction it faces.

All of them? 50 %? 10%? 1%? 0.01 % ?

My point is the partition of the voting booth is so low that the ballot is visible from all sides of the booth if you are standing close enough to be able to see the ballot, so in polling stations where there would be intimidation the orientation of the booth doesn't really matter.

What's your point?

[LaoPo]

Are there any 'Forecast' Polls???

LaoPo

[sriracha john]

I have seen the booths with my own eyes today. If an official would want to stand next to a voter and intimidate him to tick a certain box then it really doesn't matter what direction it faces.

Intimidation, while certainly a concern, is not the paramount one. Secrecy and it's resultant privacy are. They are crucial to any free and fair election and likely why they are specifically addressed in the Constitution.

Quote:

Ex-prime minister Anand PanyarachunAnand, who voted in Watthana district, said the new setting of the booths could allow ill-intentioned people to peek into the booths and know which candidates and party the voters voted for.

"I hope the Election Commission will look into the matter," Anand said.

- TN

Speaking of quotes, any progress made in finding those that you said I wrote?

Or is it safe now for everyone to sort out that your accusations were lies?

or at least, an error on your part.

[sriracha john]

First election results on television news:

not final count.... but so far:

Petchaburi province

TRT: 4,568 votes

No Vote: 10,253 votes

[Khutan]

<snip>My wife is in the North and was absolutely undisturbed by anyone, and made her "No" vote. Which says as little as your post about the whole country.

Well no one called me to pay for the fuel to drive my wife 450km to vote, so she stayed at home.

Lucky for me I learnt from the last election and I got some beer to drink a few days ago so the weekend would be tolerable.

[ColPyat]

First election results on television news:

not final count.... but so far:

Petchaburi province

TRT: 4,568 votes

No Vote: 10,253 votes

Being in the South, it was to be expected. Being more than 20% - minimum requirement fulfilled, TRT candidate in.

Lets wait and see.

The crucial districts are in Central Thailand, but especially in the North and Isaarn.

[samran]

At my polling place, you had a line of desks to check ID's. Continuing that line, were the line polling booths. At the end of that line, were the snoozing coppers.

Thus, once you had gotten your ballot papers, the EC officials couldn't see who you had voted for (the booths are too small for someone to peek anyway). There was more privacy here that at your average ATM when you enter your PIN, and about the same as I have expereinced in Australia and the UK.

[sriracha john]

First election results on television news:

not final count.... but so far:

Petchaburi province

TRT: 4,568 votes

No Vote: 10,253 votes

Being in the South, it was to be expected.

Have they moved Petchaburi??....

or just the marker as to what is considered the "South"?

eg. "anything" south of Bangkok is the South.

Edited April 2, 2006 by sriracha john

[hammered]

First election results on television news:

not final count.... but so far:

Petchaburi province

TRT: 4,568 votes

No Vote: 10,253 votes

Being in the South, it was to be expected. Being more than 20% - minimum requirement fulfilled, TRT candidate in.

Lets wait and see.

The crucial districts are in Central Thailand, but especially in the North and Isaarn.

]

Petchaburi is a central Thai province. The south starts at Chumphon. Just a minor point of clarification.

[Plus]

Since you were not paid to vote a certain way, there's no point in monitoring you.

About an hour ago there were some results from Lak Si -

50/50. I have Cinemax on now.

Phetchaburi is not south enough to be called South.