Bangkok: Chula students celebrate graduation with Hitler

[DocN]

Stop bringing your western values to Thailand... they don't work here.

Hitler is just a historical figure, no worse than Chairman Mao.. so get over it.

Nothing to do with values; all to do with ignorance and hubris

And trust me....when western universities with links to chula put up a stink western values and western money WILL work here

Note to Thailand Tourism: send out a directive telling all Thai students and teachers that they are causing loss of face to Thailand which, from other reading can cause them to be taken to court. Additionally, they cause loss of Thailand earning income from tourists who are aware of the negative history of Hitler, the Nazi movement and the genocide.

Again, why is what Hitler did more important than what dozens of other genocidal dictators did?

Hitler did what all leaders do, kill innocent nobodies instead of the enemy's leaders. Hitler saw Germany's enemy the international bankers that were crippling Germany with repayments after WW1. Unfortunately most of the bankers were Jewish.

Because a) Hitler was the FIRST, if not the ONLY dictator, who planed and executed the (almost) industrial killings of a racial/ religious fraction of "his own" populace from gays to jews and b ) on the side, started a World War! You comprehend the implication of the word "World" in "World War", don't you?!

Edited July 14, 2013 by DocN

[GreenSnapper]

Hitler was not a socialist. He was a fascist.

National Socialism, Fascism, Socialism, Communism is basically the same thing of a totalitarian ideology to restructure society and eredicate all those who oppose.

At present time, the country which is almost a 100% copy of German National Socialism, is Socialist Korea (North Korea). The uniforms, the personality cult, the propaganda, the concentration camps could be from a text book from 1940.

Pol Pot learned his profession when he studied in France and got in contact with the Socialist student movement. Everything he realized later is originated from his French time. His comrades then would be called "activists" nowadays.

And now back to Thailand.

What is more dangerous?

Thai students who have no clues in history and have "sanook" when doing a cartoon of Hitler?

Or Western student activists, who know their history and still fight for the same "ideals" as their comrades 40 years ago?

Of these two groups, who do you believe could cause another genocide in the future?

I know, what about I would worry more.

[Bluespunk]

Hitler was not a socialist. He was a fascist.

National Socialism, Fascism, Socialism, Communism is basically the same thing of a totalitarian ideology to restructure society and eredicate all those who oppose.

At present time, the country which is almost a 100% copy of German National Socialism, is Socialist Korea (North Korea). The uniforms, the personality cult, the propaganda, the concentration camps could be from a text book from 1940.

Pol Pot learned his profession when he studied in France and got in contact with the Socialist student movement. Everything he realized later is originated from his French time. His comrades then would be called "activists" nowadays.

And now back to Thailand.

What is more dangerous?

Thai students who have no clues in history and have "sanook" when doing a cartoon of Hitler?

Or Western student activists, who know their history and still fight for the same "ideals" as their comrades 40 years ago?

Of these two groups, who do you believe could cause another genocide in the future?

I know, what about I would worry more.

You are wrong on so many levels.

[Thai at Heart]

Stop bringing your western values to Thailand... they don't work here.

Hitler is just a historical figure, no worse than Chairman Mao.. so get over it.

Nothing to do with values; all to do with ignorance and hubris

And trust me....when western universities with links to chula put up a stink western values and western money WILL work here

Note to Thailand Tourism: send out a directive telling all Thai students and teachers that they are causing loss of face to Thailand which, from other reading can cause them to be taken to court. Additionally, they cause loss of Thailand earning income from tourists who are aware of the negative history of Hitler, the Nazi movement and the genocide.

Again, why is what Hitler did more important than what dozens of other genocidal dictators did?

Hitler did what all leaders do, kill innocent nobodies instead of the enemy's leaders. Hitler saw Germany's enemy the international bankers that were crippling Germany with repayments after WW1. Unfortunately most of the bankers were Jewish.

Because he was able to convey his power across borders. The other nut jobs in the list were largely confined to their home countries, but he managed to manipulate his power across a whole continent.

[Dr Strange]

. I raised my right arm aloft and in front of me and placed my left index finger under my nose and parallel to my lips. Then I goosestepped about 10 yards, just as we kids did so long ago. He burst into laughter. He, in my view, knew who Hitler was,

Just as likely, he knew who Basil Fawlty was...

Indeed. But then he might consider who Basil was impersonating.

Or not. My point was that given the lack of knowledge of WWII in Europe, and the events around Hitler, it is very possible that the driver recognised a 'funny man' he once saw on TV withouth any consideration that he was impersonating someone.

[ajarnpot]

the answer to this is easy. Germans have been in Thaialand a long time. they have been slowly inserting a German history into Thailand, it has been absorbed into the curiculum over the years when Thailand wanted to know what to teach students. Now indeed Hitler is held up next to cpt america.

[SteeleJoe]

the answer to this is easy. Germans have been in Thaialand a long time. they have been slowly inserting a German history into Thailand, it has been absorbed into the curiculum over the years when Thailand wanted to know what to teach students. Now indeed Hitler is held up next to cpt america.

Nice one!

Wait...you ARE joking, right?

[kruangfaifar]

This is going to be hard for the "Swastikas are Buddhist meme" apologists as there is NO swastika in this one.

Also, this Hitler doesn't look at all like Charlie Chaplin, so forget that excuse too.

I think this is actually a seriously offensive thing, coming from a so called elite educational institution in Thailand.

Would it be so hard to teach about Hitler and Nazism?

Would it be so hard to teach that Neo-Nazis today in Russia are targeting Asian people racially for violence and killings?

To those who say we're meddling westerners, I say, Thailand wake up to reality, it could use some meddling with its continuing shameful flirting with Hitler. Nazis and Hitler aren't heroes. Neo Nazi movements still exist today and they are something to be fought against, not propped up as something cool or a fashion statement.

Don't read too much into it. They probably got the idea from TV shows like Family Guy, The Simpsons and others which are aired in Thailand and show Hitler images

[Ned]

Hitler had REAL POWER!! That's a very attractive trait here. The man was undisputably top dog.

[wilcopops]

I think many Americans underestimate how much they are disliked by many foreigners, in particular amongst the young and at Universities. THey are seen as culturally intrusive if not imperialistic and so many iconic images of America are linked with images and icons that Americans see as distasteful themselves.

Thailand is an exception in S.E. asia in that it didn't loose a lot of people as a result of WW2 - however all the surrounding nations suffered greater losses in WW2 more than America, yet they too have a strong tradition of anti-Americanism that they may well see as similar to Nazi Germany.

So perhaps rather than look at Hitler as the only "devilish" icon in that backdrop, we could look at it terms of a collection of NEGATIVE images or a parody. Rather than real people they are images that represent something to those who designed and produced the backdrop. - in other words a meme in the Dawkins sense of the word.

Edited July 15, 2013 by wilcopops

[bangkaew]

Again, why is what Hitler did more important than what dozens of other genocidal dictators did?

Hitler did what all leaders do, kill innocent nobodies instead of the enemy's leaders. Hitler saw Germany's enemy the international bankers that were crippling Germany with repayments after WW1. Unfortunately most of the bankers were Jewish.

Bankers, was it?

Do you see a lot of bankers in this crowd?

that was exactly my point. The people killed, the people always killed have done nothing to deserve it. Hitler was evil in blaming ordinary jews for the actions of the international bankers, who happened to be Jewish. It is similar today with Islamaphobia with ordinary Muslims blamed for al qaeda.

[bangkaew]

Again, why is what Hitler did more important than what dozens of other genocidal dictators did?

Hitler did what all leaders do, kill innocent nobodies instead of the enemy's leaders. Hitler saw Germany's enemy the international bankers that were crippling Germany with repayments after WW1. Unfortunately most of the bankers were Jewish.

France was the main force behind the reparations payments being enforced. Nothing to do with religion or banks. It was revenge and a desire to keep Germany weak that drove this aspect of the Versailles treaty, not banking, not religion.

beg to differ. Central banks were still private then. So it was private banks that Germany owed.

[bangkaew]

Again, why is what Hitler did more important than what dozens of other genocidal dictators did?

Hitler did what all leaders do, kill innocent nobodies instead of the enemy's leaders. Hitler saw Germany's enemy the international bankers that were crippling Germany with repayments after WW1. Unfortunately most of the bankers were Jewish.

Because a) Hitler was the FIRST, if not the ONLY dictator, who planed and executed the (almost) industrial killings of a racial/ religious fraction of "his own" populace from gays to jews and b ) on the side, started a World War! You comprehend the implication of the word "World" in "World War", don't you?!

Certainly not the first nor last. happened in Africa recently.

[Jingthing]

Again, why is what Hitler did more important than what dozens of other genocidal dictators did?

Hitler did what all leaders do, kill innocent nobodies instead of the enemy's leaders. Hitler saw Germany's enemy the international bankers that were crippling Germany with repayments after WW1. Unfortunately most of the bankers were Jewish.

Because a) Hitler was the FIRST, if not the ONLY dictator, who planed and executed the (almost) industrial killings of a racial/ religious fraction of "his own" populace from gays to jews and b ) on the side, started a World War! You comprehend the implication of the word "World" in "World War", don't you?!

Certainly not the first nor last. happened in Africa recently.

No, regarding the holocaust, it was indeed the FIRST INDUSTRIALIZED genocide in an advanced country. What we would call today a first world country. Yes genocides are not that unusual in human history, before and after the holocaust.

[Thai at Heart]

Hopefully this isn't the type of "Thainess" that Yingluck wants portrayed overseas.

[Dr Strange]

Again, why is what Hitler did more important than what dozens of other genocidal dictators did?

Hitler did what all leaders do, kill innocent nobodies instead of the enemy's leaders. Hitler saw Germany's enemy the international bankers that were crippling Germany with repayments after WW1. Unfortunately most of the bankers were Jewish.

France was the main force behind the reparations payments being enforced. Nothing to do with religion or banks. It was revenge and a desire to keep Germany weak that drove this aspect of the Versailles treaty, not banking, not religion.

beg to differ. Central banks were still private then. So it was private banks that Germany owed.

Beg to differ again. It was the states that Germany had to pay. And a lot of the repayments were made in goods rather than cash (ironically, a lot of the cash payments were made by way of loans from New York banks). The whole argument that the reparations lay at the root of WWII have long been debunked my most historians. Interestingly, the last payment was made only 3 years ago.

[bangkaew]

beg to differ. Central banks were still private then. So it was private banks that Germany owed.

Beg to differ again. It was the states that Germany had to pay. And a lot of the repayments were made in goods rather than cash (ironically, a lot of the cash payments were made by way of loans from New York banks). The whole argument that the reparations lay at the root of WWII have long been debunked my most historians. Interestingly, the last payment was made only 3 years ago.

Well the states still has a private central bank. I have no idea whether the NY banks were Jewish owned but the point is that Hitler thought so and wrongfully blamed the every day jews of Germany. I don't believe that the reparations were not a factor.

[Jingthing]

There was NO RATIONALITY to Hitler's racist obsession about the Jews.

However, his extreme anti-semitism was a very useful POLITICAL tool for him.

Having a SCAPEGOAT is a classic tactic.

He could tell the "racially pure" German majority they were the master race and so special so he needed a minority group to CONTRAST with. This minority group was not only the Jews but the Jews were clearly the primary focus of his obsession and the Nazi propaganda (and holocaust). The non-minority majority LOVED to have their egos stoked that way.

Edited July 15, 2013 by Jingthing

[Dr Strange]

beg to differ. Central banks were still private then. So it was private banks that Germany owed.

Beg to differ again. It was the states that Germany had to pay. And a lot of the repayments were made in goods rather than cash (ironically, a lot of the cash payments were made by way of loans from New York banks). The whole argument that the reparations lay at the root of WWII have long been debunked my most historians. Interestingly, the last payment was made only 3 years ago.

Well the states still has a private central bank. I have no idea whether the NY banks were Jewish owned but the point is that Hitler thought so and wrongfully blamed the every day jews of Germany. I don't believe that the reparations were not a factor.

They still had private banks, yes, but it was not them who were owed. There is a big (and again ironic) possibility that those NY banks were, at least in part, Jewish owned, but there was not the same anti semitism in WWI as in WWII. The reparations are a bit of a red herring as far as causes of WWII go. As I say, the majority of historians (who know more of this than you or I) certainly do not see it as quite as big a factor as most believe.

In 1987, the German historian Detley Peukert wrote about reparations:

"Opinions range from the traditional verdict that the national budget and economy were intolerably squeezed to the opposite view that the burden was scarcely larger than present-day aid to developing countries. For once, the truth really seems to lie somewhere between these positions. It is certainly true that the flexibility of the German economy, already constrained by the low post-war level of economic activity in any case, was further restricted by the need to pay reparations. On the other hand, the actual payments that had to made were perfectly manageable. Reparations were not, therefore, an utterly intolerable burden, especially since any clear-sighted politician could reckon that after a few years of uninterrupted payment and reduced international tension there was a reasonable chance that the overrall size of the debt would be cut down."

[bangkaew]

currency war, trade war and then military war. That is the pattern. War is usually about money whether it be empire building or securing resources. So poverty was the catalyst Hitler needed. Jews are very competent people in general so they were an easy target.

[Jingthing]

...

Jews are very competent people in general so they were an easy target.

You haven't met my cousin, Moishe!

[orosee]

Stop bringing your western values to Thailand... they don't work here.

Hitler is just a historical figure, no worse than Chairman Mao.. so get over it.

Nothing to do with values; all to do with ignorance and hubris

And trust me....when western universities with links to chula put up a stink western values and western money WILL work here

Note to Thailand Tourism: send out a directive telling all Thai students and teachers that they are causing loss of face to Thailand which, from other reading can cause them to be taken to court. Additionally, they cause loss of Thailand earning income from tourists who are aware of the negative history of Hitler, the Nazi movement and the genocide.

Again, why is what Hitler did more important than what dozens of other genocidal dictators did?

Hitler did what all leaders do, kill innocent nobodies instead of the enemy's leaders. Hitler saw Germany's enemy the international bankers that were crippling Germany with repayments after WW1. Unfortunately most of the bankers were Jewish.

Because he was able to convey his power across borders. The other nut jobs in the list were largely confined to their home countries, but he managed to manipulate his power across a whole continent.

Unfortunately this is still true today. Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot killed their people at times when doing this was either politically useful (Cold War) or considered the lesser evil (keeping the Vietnamese in check). Bosnia, Rwanda, Iraqi Kurds were ignored either until it was politically useful to intervene, or until domestic pressure made intervention necessary. In all fairness, most western nations do not go to war lightly these days or have huge standing armies. WW2 wasn't fought in the West to prevent evil, it was really to secure a balance of power between the white nations. One must not forget that England, France, Belgium and the Netherlands all ruled over non-white colonies of hundreds of millions of people without a worry about legitimacy or morality of doing so. No wonder that the thought of becoming a colony of Germany themselves was such a horrendous prospect for them.

Sadly, most colonies had to fight for their freedom after 1945. Western powers did not see the humanitarian need to release them on their own. But they were militarily and spiritually weakened after the losses of WW2. Losses inflicted to them by Hitler's armies. For the colonized peoples of the East, could that make Hitler an agent of their own liberation? I've run too often into strangers who gave me the "Hitler good!" thumbs up. I really wish that evil were not a matter of perspective, but I think it is. Edited July 16, 2013 by angiud
fixed quotes

[JeffreyWitty]

This is unbelievable, they spelt congratulation right

They made up for it with terrible artwork.

(all of it, not just the Hitler)

[bangkaew]

Hitler was indeed afraid of the march of Bolshevism and unfortunately, apart from Lenin, the Bolshevik leaders were Jewish.

[jamhar]

Uh oh,The story is being carried by the AP and its hit a major US Newspaper.

This is cannot be too good for the Thai Tourism industry going forward.

Thailand Hitler banner: School sorry for Hitler in superhero banner

BANGKOK, Thailand — Thailand's premier university has apologized for displaying Adolf Hitler on a banner alongside Superman and other superheroes, saying it was painted by ignorant students who didn't realize Hitler's image would offend anyone.

The huge banner was placed outside the art school at Chulalongkorn University as part of a tribute to this year's graduating class.

It said “Congratulations” in bold white letters and showed Hitler with his arm raised in a Nazi salute next to Batman, Captain America, the Incredible Hulk and Iron Man.

“[We] would like to formally express our sincere apology for our students' 'Superhero' mural,” art school dean Suppakorn Disatapundhu said in a statement Monday. “I can assure you we are taking this matter very seriously.”

The banner was up for two days before being removed Saturday in response to criticism. Photos posted online showed graduating students in their robes, mimicking Hitler's salute.

Link - thailand-hitler-banner

The article was accompanied by a photo of a someone getting her picture in front of the banner doing the hitler salute

OUCH!

Edited July 16, 2013 by jamhar

[steffi]

This sort of thing happens in USA then it's the Dean who resigns in shame not just some department head.

[steffi]

And these are the smart ones. These are the ones who passed their admission tests and graduated.

[runningfree73]

Stop bringing your western values to Thailand... they don't work here.

Hitler is just a historical figure, no worse than Chairman Mao.. so get over it.

Are you serious? What has Western values got to do with it? Are you're saying that mass murder is acceptable in Thai culture? So I guess you would say the murder of six million Jews is just a "historical fact"?

[transam]

The photo of a student on stage actually doing the Nazi salute in front of her ''super hero'' is rather disturbing I think.

[internationallawreview]

A Brief History of Hitler in Thailand 2013 (online reactions):

For:

1. Thais are ignorant/ youth are ignorant – Thus it is excusable that they use Hitler’s/Nazi images as they please even though they were able to find his image/symbols by text/ internet (yet somehow could not find time to read the boring captions…
2. Thai students are masters of artistic expression, dualism, philosophy - Thus we should get it that those “heiling” students are seeking to inspire us and not just being sadly ignorant and intellectually lazy and blasphemous to the memory of millions who died during Hitler’s time
3. Thais are not from “western culture” and are aware of only Thai history – Thus they need not know what they do in the context of “our history” because the WORLD War did not touch them when they allied with the Japanese – Hitler’s allies.
4. Thai school administrators both in the CM school which had kids marching in Nazi regalia and Chula celebrating graduation “Hitler style) are aghast and thoroughly apologetic – Although Thai students are generally not allowed to do anything without approval, which in this case means the school administrators and teachers did not approve of the students making them lose face.

Against:

5. Thais know exactly who is Hitler - They take some pleasure in finally finding a “button” they can push that agitates

Farangs and choose to exercise this “power” irregardless of connotations – More to come as more Thai elitist/xenophobic

youth catch on.

6. Thais (and Asians) in general do not acknowledge the gravity of WW2 and that had Hitler not been defeated, or had it

taken much longer they would have suffered much more or possibly would have been annihilated and that it was the

sacrifice of “farang” soldiers (and Allied Nation’s families) that spared the Asians this worse fate. (many believe Hitler

would have killed/enslaved Thais both for being Asian and gay…).

7. Thais do know at least basic WW2 history including the fact that the Thai government had made agreements with the

Japanese – Thus they use passive/aggressive tactics to disarm important symbols (of war/evil) to the Allies, and/or the

Thais are trying to make an ambiguous soup of the clear right & wrong sides of the war to release their own sense of

embarrassment / self loathing

Irrelevant – Yet of Interest to many posters:

1. Some “western” people are ignorant - Thus we are NOT to talk about the ignorance of Thais until everyone in our countries is … completely enlightened? (also refer to #’s 1 and 3 above and try to create an infinite loop from reason here).
2. Thais are not Jews – Thus they can “Heil” all they want because only Jews care about Hitler and there are no Jews of note in Thailand…(irregardless that the greater number of civilian and soldier casualties were Christian along with some Muslims (north Africa), many Buddhists (China) and members of nearly all other races/religions)
3. Hitler was not the only mass murderer or evil person in history (ref. Mao, Khan, Stalin, Guevera, Hirahito, Bonaparte, Henri VIII, Colombus, all Americans , possibly Australians and Milli Vanilli), thus we are not allowed to discuss the Thais use of Hitler’s image without fully addressing all other “killers” in our own cultures in every reference here. This of course is PC and creates “fairness” to the Thais.
4. Thais are great in marketing & propaganda – They are cleverly bringing attention to their “causes” and subtly inviting in Neo-Nazi/ White Supremist to join their club.
5. Henry Ford talked with Nazis and there are conflicting accounts of the number of victims of the Holocaust/ War ranging from 6 million to 12 million and 40 to 100 million respectively – and we cannot discuss the topic of “Why Thais use Hitler/Nazi imagery and what are the ramifications of this” until we clear up all topics that pop into people’s heads.
6. a. Some Jews are white and not Thai (see #8), b. Some Thais are elitist and trying to becoming “white”, but not Jewish… to avoid Nazi extermination (see #5)
7. Thais are hypocrites because they expect foreigners to respect their culture and icons, yet they do not reciprocate.
8. Some swastikas go left, some go right. Many people beside Nazis use swastikas – we must list them all here before we go forward.
9. Thais took over Laos and lost it because of the French (but kept Isaan) and hoped allying with Japan would help them obtain Burma…Thus, as Imperialist, they identify with Hitler.
10. Thais have contributed nothing to world history - the arts, sciences, technology, major events, except a show with Yul Brenner, but they can sure start a heck of a topic. J

Edited July 17, 2013 by internationallawreview