assessing a condo's condition (structure, leakages,etc)

[mike111]

I'm seeking a professional in Jomtien area who can assess the condition of a condo it terms of structural issue, leakages, pests etc. I want to minimize the chances of unpleasant surprises down the road.

any recommendations?

TIA

[worgeordie]

I would just go with common sense, look around the condo building, cracks on outside

walls,what the condition is like in side,is it been maintained to a decent standard,talk

to other tenants.and what do your guts tell you about the place.buying any property

new or old has its risks,and you need to check out if any utility fees have been left unpaid

by the previous tenants.

regards Worgeordie

[givenall]

Why don't you talk to the committee member and also the building manager, and ask about any upcoming repairs, including paint and crack filling, etc.

do not ask the seller these because they will not tell the truth

[Cloggie]

Summary from previous postings:

===================================

- Check what the process is to buy supplies etc., for the building (should be by three quotations and need written approval from two members of the owners committee - in some condos the owners have installed rules that these signatures must rotate across the committee (i.e. cannot be the same two committee members each time and must change where there are regular purchases from the same suppliers (E.g. cleaning supplies), and check there is separation between approval to buy and who can sign cheques to pay for the supplies.

In my old condo (downtown Bkk) the same company had been engaged for about 8 years for servicing of the 3 lifts. One condo owner (same building) was the major shareholder in the lift company. Service was poor. At one meeting a new committee member asked whether there were three quotations for the annual renewal of the lift contract which was on the meeting agenda. Answer: no.

New committee member demanded that the contract renewal be postponed and three quotations gathered, each quotation gathered by different committee members. At next meeting each contender presented their credentials, references, capabilities, experience, etc. Contract was then given to a different supplier at a 50% cost saving.

- Check when the accounts for the whole building were last audited.The accountant for my old condo passed away and a new accountant was appointed, the new one a sister of a committee member. The new acct., presented the accounts, P&L etc., for the first time at the next AGM. Within a within a few minutes there were numerous queries from the floor of the meeting. Simple mistakes in arithmetic, important items just missing. Her response: 'ohh your too serious, it's just not important'. Next comment from the floor 'unacceptable and the accountant should not be paid any fees'. A vote was taken and almost every owner agreed. Sacked on the spot.

- Check if there is sufficient insurance coverage.

- Check if there is a sinking fund and how many Baht in the sinking fund and where are the funds lodged.

I forgot one important item - security.

- Take a good look at how the building security is set up / works:

- Is the main door left open all day with no security in terms of access to the upper residential floors?

- Is there a magnetic lock system on the main door to the main residential floors, but in reality the door is seldom closed.

- Is there any security on the car park floors - from the car park to the residential parts of the building, is it ignored by the owners (owners deliberately leave all the doors open)

- Is there any camera system around the building? Is yes, is it working, who is responsible to monitor the screens, and do they actually monitor the screens, etc., who is responsible to contact the police if needed etc?

- Can delivery men (Pizza Co., / KFC etc) just walk in and out and go to the residential floors without lodging an ID card with security? (Some condos have rules saying delivery men can go to your room without lodging ID card with security, some have no rules - just open access with no controls whatever, some condos have rules that owners / residents must go to the lobby to take delivery of food etc. And is there a security protocol for workmen coming into the building, e.g. plumber, renovations etc.

Years back in my building there was a break in and a wife and two young children beaten up. This was the catalyst for a long overdue review of security and (because of the incident) most other owners became much more serious about their own actions to close doors etc. It was also the catalyst for a review of the insurance on the building.

The insurance company did a comprehensive analysis of the building then refused to renew the insurance.

Why? The review revealed that the owners / occupiers of the penthouse (25th floor) were actually running a printing factors inside their very big unit, with very big stocks of flammable paper and very flammable inks, etc. , all brought in through the cargo lift that was out of sight of the main residents lobby area. The owners initially refused to remove the printing factory and the committee had to take legal action and get something like a court order to have it forceably shut down.

- Or is security well set up and security staff active to keep the building secure.

- And who does the outside security company who provide the security staff report to? When I bought my condo the outside security company reported to the 'Managing Director' (a self appointed title the admin./ building services supervisor had given herself - and in reality she had no authority to do anything - and was totally incapable).

The outside security company owner (an army general) just laughed at her when she tried to discuss security issues with him. The internal staff in the condo (small maintenance man / cleaners etc.,) also laughed at her.

After the incident I mentioned above this was changed and the chairperson of the owners committee was then responsible for security matters, and he did a good job and was unafraid of the army general and in fact sacked the security company (after a committee discussion) and found a replacement company owned by civilians. The internal supervisor mentioned was also sacked because of collusion with the company supplying the cleaning products to the building, let alone the fact that she paid no attention whatever to the items listed in the Job Description and was often quite rude when owners

attempted to speak with her.

[Head Snake]

Cloggie, That was a heckuva good post on the subject.

My wife and I are looking to buy either a house or a condo and your small report should help us.

[Head Snake]

Here are some items I will look for:

electricals : fuse box, condition of each outlet, grounding ( I don't even know if they do put grounding - does anybody know if grounding is better in condos vs. houses)

electrical, water, trash - all utility rates and costs

security

Does the water work? The drainage? master valves work properly for repairs.

For the drains, ,are they designed properly to keep smells out? I once spent a night in a new Marriott in Beijing and they had designed the drains wrong and it was disgusting unless you like the smell of urine and poo.

pets - do the neighbors have them? noise and flea potential

parking - ensure you know if you get one or 2 spaces and how to enforce keeping the spaces.

As I got kids, I'd check to ensure that any glass is tempered

Screens heavy duty. My wife rented one place where the screens are just falling apart - cheap stuff

air con insulation - my wife wonders why the electrical fees are so high. There is a general lack of concept for insulating unless the builder designed for it. If you tell her it would keep out the mosquitoes, maybe then she'd understand insulation.

[cheeryble]

Excellent information above to which I will addend:

1. The Law says a condominium must be surveyed every year. Ask to see the last one.

2. Be aware that galvanized steel water pipes can start leaking at the joints and get sclerotic after about 20 years. No problem if updated. In an older building check if

a) the common piping has been changed for plastic.

b ) the individual piping has been changed yet.

c) While you're at it check bathroom ceiling for leaks from above.

d) In any case turn on taps for rust and to check for adequate pressure.....especially on the hot water side.

3. Prefer an RCD or like electrical supply.

Turn on lights and aircon, and watch for a reduction in brightness when you run the hot water on max. If dims, wiring inadequate.

4. Have a good check around the more hidden public areas. If these are not well maintained and tidy, it raises a red flag about more important maintenance.

Some of the things above don't preclude a buy for everyone, but may do for you, and price will need adjusting.

Good luck

Edited July 21, 2013 by cheeryble

[Sophiaw32]

Before purchasing a condo, request a copy of the association's CC&Rs. You can make review and acceptance of the condo governing documents a condition of buying the unit, also known as a contingency. You or the seller usually must pay for a copy of the CC&Rs. Analyse the association's operating budget to ensure the condo is fiscally sound. If the condo is losing money due to current owners not keeping up with the dues, you may face special assessments as a future owner. Also, if you don't understand your responsibilities regarding the roof, or any other aspect of owning a particular condo, consult an attorney.

[Kf6vci]

Glad you are doing your due dilligence. But you also need cold hard facts regarding the management!

* we have had a string (!) of embezzlers as managers. Several times the money for utilities disappeared.

* then they have been unwilling to go after those (often richt) owners who owe ~ 500,000 B in HOA fees.

=> Some's got to pay.

* Not repairing an elevator for weeks? Yep.

* Not allowing an ATM on the premises.

* Crazy half-finished projects speak for themselves of terrible top management.

* Yapping dogs, open doors (cooking smells,noise), shoes in the hall way? I'd ask to stay one night on an air mattress before buying.

[Don Chance]

Most building in Thailand have mold problems, water leaks under the patio or any ledge exposed to the outdoors and water migrates under the subfloor creating mold under the tiles. Same problem in the shower, where water migrates under the tiles.

I always close all the windows and doors then come back in 10-20 minutes to check, open the door and take a big smell. Remember: if smells - it never sells!

I wouldn't buy any property in Thailand for this reason, maybe new it will be ok for 5-10 years. They just don't have big enough roofs or enough exterior water proofing. They are clueless.

 

[xylophone]

39 minutes ago, Don Chance said:

Most building in Thailand have mold problems, water leaks under the patio or any ledge exposed to the outdoors and water migrates under the subfloor creating mold under the tiles. Same problem in the shower, where water migrates under the tiles.

I always close all the windows and doors then come back in 10-20 minutes to check, open the door and take a big smell. Remember: if smells - it never sells!

I wouldn't buy any property in Thailand for this reason, maybe new it will be ok for 5-10 years. They just don't have big enough roofs or enough exterior water proofing. They are clueless.

 

Interesting that you should resurrect this old thread, as I have recently returned from a friends condominium which is in a pretty bad way with regards to leaks, and it is only about seven years old and expensive at that.

 

There was a major leak about three years ago which ruined the wooden floor in the place (two large bedrooms with two en suites, three toilets and kitchen and balcony and about 86 m²) and they had this fixed, but more leaks have appeared and it has had to be replaced with tiles.

 

The strange thing is that water comes in through the wall as well as around the window frames so a second phase of remedial work is going on, however as always, there are arguments as to whose responsibility this is and some problems with the "sinking fund" a lot of which appears to have "sunk".

 

Furthermore I have looked at this current remedial work and it is absolutely atrocious, with flaking paint left on the outside and just painted over, no proper sealant used around the window frames and no end of other poor quality workmanship.

 

They are also going to have to replace all of the "chrome" fittings in the second bathroom because the small window in this place has been open for some time and it would appear that sea air has attacked most of the fittings, some to a huge degree.

 

I had never heard of water penetrating from the outside, apart from the obvious cause which would be large cracks, however a friend who lives in Karon is going through a similar process with his large apartment, and as he spends time overseas, he's not very happy about being greeted by wet floors and walls, mould and damp etc, when he returns.......and the cause apparently is hairline cracks in the outside wall, and many of them.

 

Thinking about it it should be no surprise as I have observed the building of many apartment/condo blocks here and the workmanship is atrocious.
 

[Patong2]

I hesitate to put my spoke in here but here goes.

 

We own quite a few properties in our own country including the equivalent of several condos in various buildings.

in a country with strict building standards and force of rational law they are a pain in the butt and a constant concern.

 

We have looked at buying in Phuket for over 20 years. Never ever would we do it. Seen too many problems, too many shoddy buildings, heard of too many scams and dodgy lawyers. You have no way of understanding and working with the Thai legal system.

 

We happily rent, paying an exorbitant rent to live in the apartment we want, and are happy that we have no skin in the game when we see the shoddy painting, the ridiculous repairs and the rude and unhelpful staff.

 

As an experienced and successful property owner, Thailand property in any form would be a nightmare.

[cheeryble]

I hesitate to put my spoke in here but here goes.

 

We own quite a few properties in our own country including the equivalent of several condos in various buildings.

in a country with strict building standards and force of rational law they are a pain in the butt and a constant concern.

 

We have looked at buying in Phuket for over 20 years. Never ever would we do it. Seen too many problems, too many shoddy buildings, heard of too many scams and dodgy lawyers. You have no way of understanding and working with the Thai legal system.

 

We happily rent, paying an exorbitant rent to live in the apartment we want, and are happy that we have no skin in the game when we see the shoddy painting, the ridiculous repairs and the rude and unhelpful staff.

 

As an experienced and successful property owner, Thailand property in any form would be a nightmare.

 

I’ve never had a serious problem.......and never paid a lawyer to convey a condo, it’s easy.

One can't expect perfection when paying a relative pittance for property, but foresight and research usually avoids problems.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Patong2]

On 10/21/2018 at 7:30 AM, cheeryble said:

 

I’ve never had a serious problem.......and never paid a lawyer to convey a condo, it’s easy.

One can't expect perfection when paying a relative pittance for property, but foresight and research usually avoids problems.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

That's really great to hear and you are a 100% right, foresight and research are essential and sadly so few people make the effort. (True of any property in any country.

 

There are success stories I can tell too.

 

I have friends who have successfully built and developed 6 very nice gated properties complete with swimming pools in each and a very nice place for themselves that is huge (2 pools) and a designers dream and they have had no problems legally but nightmarish tales of maintenance and upkeep. They have been here about 15 years.

 

Being very conservative and disliking risk in investments, Phuket is way out of my comfort zone and I hate hearing about people who are not in a position to walk away and are having problems

 

 

[Ruffian Dick]

On 10/22/2018 at 11:06 PM, Patong2 said:

...

 

Being very conservative and disliking risk in investments, Phuket is way out of my comfort zone and I hate hearing about people who are not in a position to walk away and are having problems...

This forum covers more than just Phuket. ????Would you consider buying property elsewhere in Thailand?

[Patong2]

19 hours ago, Ruffian Dick said:

This forum covers more than just Phuket. ????Would you consider buying property elsewhere in Thailand?

No!

working in an environment where you are not familiar with the nuances of the legal system and having significant capital tied up is a recipe for sleepless nights and ulcers.

 

Even though your home country's economy may be in tatters at least you can navigate the problems with some knowledge.

 

All I have looked at in Thailand has ended with disaster or people stuck in a situation they have no power over.

[olfu]

Rent before you buy.

[wolf81]

Another option to consider is buying a condo from a big brand developer, ideally a developer that still manages / maintains the condo. I believe Sansiri does this at least for some of the condos they've build and you can find some info here.

 

I guess the maintenance fee would be higher when making use of such a service, but perhaps less worries is worth it.

 

Other big brand developers in Thailand are Asian Property Group (AP) and Land & Houses. 

[Heng]

By some chance does anyone on the board here own or has rented a unit at Q Asoke?   Currently in the market for a dorm for my oldest (time flies) and doing pre purchase research.   Pantip doesn't yield much in terms of complaints so I'd thought I check here, since we don't seem to have any issues with holding back about these kinds of things here.   

[beaufoy]

On 7/17/2013 at 3:53 PM, givenall said:

Why don't you talk to the committee member and also the building manager, and ask about any upcoming repairs, including paint and crack filling, etc.

do not ask the seller these because they will not tell the truth

I am thinking about buying a nordic condo in pattaya, but have seen a document with headline cracks in wall. I have asked for more details but have not received anything, the condo is one sep bedroom top floor 47 sq m for 1.8 m so the price is ok and looking at the pictures good tiles, good laminate good fixtures ...it does look well built

[beaufoy]

On 12/8/2014 at 12:29 PM, Sophiaw32 said:

Before purchasing a condo, request a copy of the association's CC&Rs. You can make review and acceptance of the condo governing documents a condition of buying the unit, also known as a contingency. You or the seller usually must pay for a copy of the CC&Rs. Analyse the association's operating budget to ensure the condo is fiscally sound. If the condo is losing money due to current owners not keeping up with the dues, you may face special assessments as a future owner. Also, if you don't understand your responsibilities regarding the roof, or any other aspect of owning a particular condo, consult an attorney.

Should be careful with terms of lease in England barratt had a system that the top floor paid for the roof repairs and ground floor paid for drain repairs which was good for the people not on the top or bottom floor. Of course people will say it is a lawyers job to find these bad terms, but lawyers are very bad readers...best read the lease yourself