Teaching

[jackien1966]

I am seeking to come to Thailand soon (within the next year) and am interested in learning about teaching positions for the future. However, being without a bachelor's degree, is it possible to find a good teaching position in Chiang Mai?

Thank you community for your help!

Jackie Nelson

[puukao]

I think it's possible to find a job teaching, but a "good" teaching position is another story. I've met about 10 teachers in Chiang Mai, and they all seemed to like their work. They all had a degree from school (so they told me), and were making about 200 baht an hour, or 250 for private lessons. All of them complained they were not making/saving enough. it also seemed like a terrible amount of preparation. I think a few had to get an Educational Visa instead of work visa because their school simply didn't want to help them, or didn't make enough money, or both. I forget. Anyhow, I would first try to get your TESL or ESL, or equivalent, and then simply apply and call a few places.

If you are trying to teach for a year, I think you might be better off trying places 25+ miles from Chiang Mai, and then coming into the city on your free time. I think there is more demand for those schools, and possible better luck getting a Work Visa.

I would also do a few youtube vidoes giving lessons, increasing your credibility and putting less emphasis on lack of degree. Create some lesson plans, and even teach some local kids (who know English) grammar, just to put on your resume.

hope this helps a little.

[jackien1966]

Thank you for the information. There are other avenues I can seek as well, but a friend who's been there suggested this route! Again, thank you for your input!

Jackie

[puukao]

no worries, all good. if you need any "advice" on where to stay, eat, or whatever based on your budget, don't hesitate to ask. we all have opinions, and i'm sure you can filter out which ones will work best for you.

things can get overwhelming quick; visa overnight bus ride to laos, string of bad meals, etc.... so feel free to lean on people here if you need something.

enjoy.

[jackien1966]

Thanks again! I was told I would find a LOT of support here and I'm seeing that this is true. I will continue research. Am looking to be out there at least by next October! Have to have that much time to save! LOL!

Namaste!

Jackie

[scotinsiam]

Thank you for the information. There are other avenues I can seek as well, but a friend who's been there suggested this route! Again, thank you for your input!

Jackie

Jackie,

I am not a teacher but know many use this site http://www.ajarn.com/ perhaps it may be of help.

[jackien1966]

Oh, thanks so much! VERY helpful!!

Jackie

[puukao]

http://www.chiangmainews.com/classifieds_job/

[Sparkles]

Thank you for the information. There are other avenues I can seek as well, but a friend who's been there suggested this route! Again, thank you for your input!

Jackie

Jackie,

I am not a teacher but know many use this site http://www.ajarn.com/ perhaps it may be of help.

There is a huge amount of info on this site. Also a forum within where you can ask questions and re live others experiences.Not all schools have the same requirements especially in relation to your own educational background.

[BlackArtemis]

As someone without a degree you will have a tough time finding a job that will give you a work permit. Without this you are working illegally. Now, many people manage this and never get caught, but I just want you to know the facts.

A government school with 40+ kids per classroom and little or no support is what to expect, with a salary in the low 20,000B/month is what to expect.

Many teachers with 4 year degrees but no degree in education can earn from 25-35k/month at private schools or schools with English Programs.

It will be easier to find a job working with Kindergarten more so than grade 1-6, known as Prathom or 7-12, known as Matayom.

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I don't believe you need a degree to teach Kindergarten, known as Anubaan, in Thailand. Any previous child care work is much more applicable to these jobs, making it easier to land them without prior experience.

Look at schools like "Little Stars".

The more desperate schools are going to be posting at the following places (some others posted these sites too):

http://bangkok.craigslist.co.th/edu/

http://ajarn.com/recruitment/browse_jobs/index.html

http://www.chiangmainews.com/classifieds_job/

Also as puukao stated, anything outside CM such as Lampang and Lamphun, will be in need more so than inside Chiang Mai itself.

You might also consider doing a TEFL cert if you are serious about this, they run about $1,500 USD

Good luck, I personally know some fantastic teachers who never took an education class, so if you are truly serious, you can learn.

[Sticky Rice Balls]

I indeed WAS, note past tense, in CM..i did in fact get my TEFL degree in 4 weeks but i did more of lang schools and private

as i didnt want to get stuck 50 deep with kids playing on thier FB mobiles.....most of the gigs seems with kids--more like

babysitting IMO.....they seem to prefer women, so you got that, but i wouldnt do it again...its a broken system....

Nothing seemed to work, the kids are terrified of A/C(summer heat!) and they are easily bored and seem to only respect

thai teachers, who can haul off and smack the kids, not that i would do so, but seemed its thai 4 thai...you're not thai.

Also the thai teachers seemed mad we made more than they did and they stuck us all in one room--we did not mix with thais

None of the copiers/comps/markers/etc seemed to work and its not a "free thinking" out of the box kind of enviro---i recall the

one teacher said "Just teach them English--Not your culture"....that stuck with me--as all they wanted was the "english" not me.

It seemed like a one sided system---do as i say mentality--do not question what i teach---that not the way to learn in my opinion

[Sparkles]

My daughter taught kindergarten in CM, without a degree, but after completion of a TEFL course here and she had a work permit which the school processed.There is an old thread you might find where people, who have no idea about what is required, made negative comments which I suggest you ignore .That's why I suggested the www.ajarn.com site. There you will find people who have actually been in the Thai education system

.

Her salary, 3 years ago, was 23,000 b per month. her classes were up to 40 children many with health issues ,deaf,autistic etc .She found it very difficult because the emphasis,from the supervisor, was on just doing the job and not being concerned about young children with difficulties and who without special attention will just get swept along with the others.Its a mostly rewarding occupation unless you try to "change" the Thai way of doing things. Her fellow Thai teachers resented the fact that native speakers aka foreigners were on a bigger salary and were quite unpleasant.

I taught in Bangkok for 8 years but at a private language school with mature age students 18-35.That's a different ball game and it was a mutually rewarding experience. Good luck with what ever direction you take.

[jamhar]

Thank you for the information. There are other avenues I can seek as well, but a friend who's been there suggested this route! Again, thank you for your input!

Jackie

Jackie,

I am not a teacher but know many use this site http://www.ajarn.com/ perhaps it may be of help.

Thats where i found my teaching job. I start within the month.

[jackien1966]

Thanks to everyone in this community for sharing. I have been told by a friend (who has extensively traveled throughout Thailand and the world) that people would be extremely helpful and indeed, you all have been. I have lots of time, to find out what fits, will be coming for a 2 week holiday first and will do some research while I am there! I will definitely let you all know when I'm coming!

Thank you again for your warmth & help!

Namaste

Jackie

[Baerboxer]

Thanks to everyone in this community for sharing. I have been told by a friend (who has extensively traveled throughout Thailand and the world) that people would be extremely helpful and indeed, you all have been. I have lots of time, to find out what fits, will be coming for a 2 week holiday first and will do some research while I am there! I will definitely let you all know when I'm coming!

Thank you again for your warmth & help!

Namaste

Jackie

Jackie - my wife is a teacher, qualified to Masters in Education. Many of our friends are teachers. Please, let me play devil's advocate and ask if you have taught before?

Not having a degree will be an issue. TEFL certificates (they are not degrees) will help for private language schools. Experience would also help. There is lots of good advice here, but again, do you have teaching experience. If not, then I would really advise you to seriously think again. Teaching is a profession, hard work and underpaid in most countries. I have lectured to adults in universities and delivered seminars in many countries up to PhD student level, but would not contemplate teaching children. I used to be part of a business in the community program in the UK that paired senior executives as mentors to head teachers, and I delivered seminars to groups of prospective head teachers. But, teaching a class of 40 plus children, who don't have English language skills.............

I do wish you well, but have seen many disappointed. Please feel free to PM if we can be of help, good luck and best wishes.

BB

[jackien1966]

No I haven't but was somewhat guided in that direction. However, it isn't my only train of thought, either. Just wanted to get some feedback and see what the reality is. I will certainly open myself to whatever opportunities may present themselves. What I don't want to do, however, is go from one boring office job here in Las Vegas, to another boring office job in Thailand, either! LOL! I'm sure my path will make itself known if and when I decide to settle in Thailand. First things first, however. Let me get my butt there for holiday and see how I like it, eh! I will be looking forward to meeting some of you soon, I hope! And thank you BB for your thoughts on this subject. It is food for thought and I will gladly take it all in.

Again, such a wonderful community spirit that is sooo lacking here in Vegas.

Jackie

[BB1955]

Dont quite think the job market here is as open as you would think . Understand that if you dont have a work permit you can face some serious punishment and fines if you are caught working without one . Its also my understanding that in order to get a work permit to teach you must have atleast a bachelors degree . Most office jobs are taken by Thai's at Thai wages . If you are not dependant on an income here by all means this is a great place to live ....

[jackien1966]

Well should I decide to move there, I would definitely do it the legal & correct way. I also wouldn't do it without having the means to support myself. Just putting out some feelers to see what the possibilities might be! Thank you!

[hellodolly]

Thank you for the information. There are other avenues I can seek as well, but a friend who's been there suggested this route! Again, thank you for your input!

Jackie

Yes there are people who come over here and live off of the wages a teacher makes. Most of the ones I have known lasted about three years. The pay was between 20,000 baht and 30,000 baht a month. Many of them took on students on the side to build up their income. I am not saying you can not live off that much just that you would have to cut back on the entertainment.

I knew one fellow who said it was like being a baby sitter. Most of the kids did not want to learn and acted accordingly.

I have a good friend who has a masters in English. She took the TESL course. It is a one month course. She told me it was one of the toughest things she had ever done. Knowing how to speak it properly is no help what so ever if you can't teach it. She loves the work because it lets her be her self, She is very creative and is constantly thinking up ways to keep the kids interested.

But as I said she had to learn to teach.

I hope you do come over and if it dosen't work out you will still be better off with the experience both teaching and another culture.

Good Luck

[onthedarkside]

unhelpful post removed

[femi fan]

If you like the idea of teaching, if you want to teach, if you're enthused about teaching here, then all will happen for you, you'll have a great time, you'll find life providing you lots of rewards, especially compared with an office job back home!

The way some people write it's like we ourselves have no control over what we do. The teacher is the leader in the classroom. The motivated teacher will find ways to motivate their students - kids or adults - and then the rewards from the teaching game kick in thick and fast. I personally think kids are harder, but other friends love teaching kids. I think you would want to at least identify in your heart if you wish to teach young kids, adolescents, or adults. My experience is that there's little difference needed in approach to teaching adolescents or adults.

Once you get to grips with the motivation issue, then teaching thais will be so much more peaceful and enjoyable than teaching the equivalent back home in a western nation, especially america or britain.

I think you're the kind of person who knows that what you put into something you will get back out. I was somewhat concerned about finding my first job over here and so on, but before my travels had finished i met a chap who told me that if i really wanted to teach then i'd get a job. It was the best advice i heard. That was a while back but i think it's just the same now here in thailand.

Plan what you can before you come here, but let a lot of it just happen as it happens! With the right attitude you will be happily accepted by nearly all thais. And as for your students, if you get them talking with a smile, if you get them talking about things they want to talk about, then welcome to the fantastic rewards of teaching english in thailand, kids or adults.

One last comment. In 2015 there's going to be a lot more demand for english learning because of the ASEAN evolution. It's an industry here that will always need teachers, now and in the future.

[jackien1966]

Thank you for your post. I was getting a bit nervous about stuff with the other posts but realistically, I have time to decide & plan. I am in the process of planning my first visit. I guess I should see if I even like it there (although everything I've heard says I'll probably not want to come back!) I will let the universe guide my decisions and who knows what lovely adventure there is for me ahead!??!!

Thank you again for taking the time to post.

Jackie

[habfan]

Wow everyone is on their best behavior so far on this thread. Good idea of your's Jackie to come for 2 weeks to get the lay of the land and explore your options, good luck.

[BlackArtemis]

I would also like to make a comment about the other comments here.

You will most likely end up teaching 40+ kids unless you are in a English Program, then only 25-35+

This can be difficult, the others are right about many kids only respecting the Thai teachers. However, if you are strict, firm, consistent, but kind, the kids for the most part will fall in line.

Some teachers may resent you for the pay, this is true, but not all. If you take the time to learn a bit of Thai and learn what being respectful means here, they can easily be won over to your side. Simply letting them know that you understand it is their classroom and you are there to support them can be a game changer. If the classroom teachers like you, they will back you up and this will be a big help in controlling 40 kids.

Also, I firmly believe that teaching 40kids in a hellish setting can be a great experience, you will learn classroom management skills extremely fast, and any mistakes you make will not really amount to anything. Also, if you find yourself actually enjoying this, you know you really could make this a career move, even going as far as getting a western certification, thus opening you up to much broader opportunities.

Some might chime in and say you shouldn't be so subservient to the Thai staff and what I am saying is BS, but in reality it will go a long loooong way in making your life better.

[Thighlander]

I bought and sold this LV condo in 2009. http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1909-Rio-Canyon-Ct-APT-208-Las-Vegas-NV-89128/6949807_zpid/ I couldn't wait to get away from Vegas. A bunch of Michigan failures, pretending to be upper class. CCSD is notoriously bad. Take a walk by Cimmaron Memorial ar 15:00 on a school day. Would you really want anything at all to do with those low-life, pregnant teenager, gang banging thugs? And they wouldn't even hire you if you did. That's actually one of the better schools, too. You won't find Thailand to be any better. The lower chance of taking a bullet, will be offset by the much higher risk of getting run over. And wait till you see how the idiot, selfish parents of these poorly behaved brats drive around the entrances to the schools. Would you really want to work for below minimum wage for people that look down at you, and laugh at you. Do you want to be a teacher? Or are you looking for a way to stay in Chiang Mai without any savings? For all too many; it is the second one. Chiang Mai has a reputation as being a cool hip place, and in fact it used to be that way. It is way oversaturated with TEFL certificate holders willing to be abused in the workplace. You could make more money and have a lower cost of living in Khon Kaen or Korat or elsewhere in Isaan, and all over the suburbs of BKK. It's supply and demand. I remember there being 1200 applicants for a school janitor position at Lake Tahoe. You could have probably been hired on the spot for the same position in most other places. If you do get hired, how are you going to feel about the people with fake degrees earning 50% more than you? They've kind of ruined it for everyone. And some of the schools will actually tell you to get one. Of course, they will be no where to be found, when you are sentenced.

http://expatrockstar.net/2012/07/english-teacher-jailed-in-thailand-for-fake-degree-offence/

Edited August 24, 2013 by Thighlander

[Sticky Rice Balls]

yep---good thread---truth and facts and no snarky comments----I REFUSE to bow to thais and came here in 2008 to seek the

truth----not sure that was a good idea---as none of the thais ive met seem to want the truth, let alone listen to anything i say..

as noted--years later it still rings in my head "teach them english NOT your culture" was told to me, never went back after...

every day im a "tourist" to thais, and only seen as here for "beer" and "boom boom" when the fact is its cheap, the food is

better, and im not afraid to get sick/doctor bills.....but since 2008 ive yet been able to explain that to them..mai ow beer!!!!

truly judged by my looks, not my content, and yep cos i have 2 small earrings i must like men and sideline as a ladyboy!!!--ugh

[femi fan]

Jackie, you just have to ignore the negative posts! They have only things to tell you about themselves and their own experiences based on their own attitudes towards life. And these they mistake for general truths and widespread ways of this nation.

Positive people with positive attitudes get very well rewarded here. And especially so english teachers.

When you get here you can go to the british council. You won't get work there, firstly you have to be british and secondly you must be qualified. But they will have a list of private language schools in chiang mai with addresses and phone numbers. When i first went looking (in bkk) for my first teaching job with no experience and no qualifications, it turned out simply to be a case of turning up at a school that needed a teacher at that time. So when you're looking bear in mind that often it's simply a case of whether there's a position that needs filling on the day that you appear. You can easily get one job to start with, and then see how it pans out and then go looking for another if you don't like the first. Once you're here you'll find it all works out nicely. That's the way it is in thailand, so long as you have the right attitude, which clearly you do, and equally clearly some will try to rob you of. Remain confident and excited at a new phase in your life and all will reveal itself.

The thing about private language schools is that you don't need a degree, and you are likely to get a mix of kids and adults. If you go for such a job you will not get 40 kids at all. You'll get classes of any size up to about 15.

I reckon you'll get what you want, just go for it!

[jackien1966]

Everyone has been so very helpful! It's good to hear the positive & the negative sides of perspectives so that I don't go in thinking this will be a picnic. Maybe it will, maybe it won't. I have time to prepare and maybe I'll meet some of you when I'm there!

Happy Saturday!

Jackie

[CMSteve]

A little more perspective for you...

I have a few teacher friends, a couple teach at "real" schools and a couple teach at local language schools. Two have degrees and two do not. They all have work permits! The lack of degree will not stop you from getting a legal work permit.

The two that work for "real" schools (Private schools) have monthly salaries in the 30,000B range. They both have larger classes with 20 or so students and work about 4hrs/day, but have to stay on campus for about 8hrs/day. They get many benefits, such as a small apt room, lunch, bonus at the end of the year, one even gets a yearly group vaca that is paid for by the school. The school also paid for them to take a trip to Vientiane to make their new visas for working. Also includes government insurance and automatic tax withholding.

The other two teachers work at language schools and pick up private classes on the side. They are on hourly wages ranging from 250 - 400B/hr depending on subject and class size. ie classes of 10 or more pay more. One is retired and is very picky about classes. I would guess he rarely breaks 20,000B/month. The other works full time (~40hrs/week) and makes ~45,000B/month.(he does not have a degree and is in his mid 20's) The school provides all the documents for his visa/permit, but he had to make the trip and pay for everything on his own. Insurance and taxes have to be paid/done on their own

Hope this helps a bit.

Edited August 25, 2013 by CMSteve

[CMSteve]

I don't think this is a Thai thing. Its pretty standard actually. In the west it usually come out more as "teach them the subject, not your politics". They are paying the school to learn english, the school is paying you to teach english, isn't it reasonable to assume that they want you to teach english?

yep---good thread---truth and facts and no snarky comments----I REFUSE to bow to thais and came here in 2008 to seek the

truth----not sure that was a good idea---as none of the thais ive met seem to want the truth, let alone listen to anything i say..

as noted--years later it still rings in my head "teach them english NOT your culture" was told to me, never went back after...

every day im a "tourist" to thais, and only seen as here for "beer" and "boom boom" when the fact is its cheap, the food is

better, and im not afraid to get sick/doctor bills.....but since 2008 ive yet been able to explain that to them..mai ow beer!!!!

truly judged by my looks, not my content, and yep cos i have 2 small earrings i must like men and sideline as a ladyboy!!!--ugh