Fortuner versus Camry Hybrid

[corkman]

I've got a 3D fortuner. 2WD. Thinking of trading it for a range topping 2.5 Hybrid Camry.

I'm not so concerned with the "toys". One quickly tires of them. I am more concerned with.

- ride comfort, comfort in general

- safety, both passive and active (that includes road holding etc).

- performance (I love the "grunt" the fortuner has, when you punch it it moves!)

- fuel economy (petrol versus diesel)

- practicality (family of 4).

Anyone care to offer an opinion?

Thanks

[BSJ]

Given the limited range of affordable reasonably optioned diesel cars here I suppose a comparison between a truck like SUV and a bland quasi econo car isn't such a big stretch.

[JoeW]

My boss has a Camry hybrid (2013) and I am actually not really impressed with the ride quality. The suspension feels a bit hard and imo is less comfortable than previous camrys.

I think the Nissan Teana offers a better ride. I haven't driven the new accord yet.

[mogandave]

Around town I would prefer the car. Country, highway and road-trips I would prefer the SUV.

[guzzi850m2]

I read somewhere here on the forum that the Teana is the best ride of the 3 "top sedan" cars made here followed by the Accord and Camry last.

Try search in the English newspaper from BKK we are not allowed to mention the name of and I think there is a test there as well with same result.

A Camry Hybrid with about 300 kg?? of batteries must be a bit slow, it's like 3 heavy adults extra weight before you load it up.

Well okay I haven't tried one so I can't really comment.

[IMHO]

It's a bit of a chalk and cheese mix.

The Camry is newer, quieter, more compliant, and cheaper to run in traffic.

The 'tuna is older, noiser, rougher, more practical, cheaper to run on the highway, and better at taking a hit on bad quality roads.

The Teana is a better drive, and has a new model releasing very soon that promises more of the same class leading manners. The latest Accord is much better than previous generations, but still has the signature Honda road noise.

If you're feeling a little adventurous, the Volvo S60 Driv-e 1.6 Turbo is only a few Baht more than the top model Camry Hybrid, and feels more planted on the road, peppier under acceleration and just more solid, but comes with a resale disadvantage and an anaemic dealer network.

If you're feeling really brave, the Skoda Superb does indeed live up to it's name, but you're not getting service outside of BKK, and the only way to move on and get decent value would be to keep it in the family as a hand-me-down.

Edited August 27, 2013 by IMHO

[corkman]

Guess its thumbs down for the Camry then.

Truthfully I was in the market for a 3 series, but then I woke up and smelled the cofee and realised that 3MB for a 3 series is nuts (the price of a 5 in the real world). So with the saloon bug biting hard the Camry spec looks nice.... But clearly the opinion and experience of all here is that it's just a cheap and nasty, unrefined machine - so better stick with the fortuner which is at least big and somewhat comfy, practical, safe, and has good residuals.

Nissan - sorry, I think they're ugly.

Volvo I like, nice car. Residuals - well thats a controversial point...... I would be more concerned with build quality, reliability, after sales service, etc.? I would certainly consider it, if its a robust option?

[IMHO]

Guess its thumbs down for the Camry then.

Truthfully I was in the market for a 3 series, but then I woke up and smelled the cofee and realised that 3MB for a 3 series is nuts (the price of a 5 in the real world). So with the saloon bug biting hard the Camry spec looks nice.... But clearly the opinion and experience of all here is that it's just a cheap and nasty, unrefined machine - so better stick with the fortuner which is at least big and somewhat comfy, practical, safe, and has good residuals.

Nissan - sorry, I think they're ugly.

Volvo I like, nice car. Residuals - well thats a controversial point...... I would be more concerned with build quality, reliability, after sales service, etc.? I would certainly consider it, if its a robust option?

The issues with the Volvo are not around it's build quality, design or driving manners - they are all top class.

Problems that plague Volvo's in TH are a small servicing dealer network, expensive out-of-warranty parts, and long waits for some parts - all of which contribute to their lower than average resale value. If intending to sell it again within 2-3 years, and willing to take 10-15% more resale loss over a Toyota/Honda in that time, it's a solid option though. Depends if you're just pinching pennies, or want a better car to drive, and can live with the downsides of ownership.

The New Teana looks better than the outgoing model (search for 2013 Altima to get an idea of what it will look like) and seeing how much better the current old one is even when compared to new Camry/Accord designs, I'd say you'd be doing yourself a disservice by dismissing it off the cuff... The reason so many of them still sell even in the face of newer and better looking competition is because of all the buyers that test-drove first

I never gave a thumbs down to the Camry, it does what it does very competently, will enjoy fantastic resale and a huge dealer network. It's just not best of class, and it's never been a beauty to look at... I'd still rate it well above the Accord, mainly due to the latter's eco-car like noise suppression levels.

[StefanBBK]

I am happy with the same Tuna you have. My SIL used to have the Camry and I was never impressed. My points for the tuna are:

1 space. Family of 4, at times we have 6 people in the car, no Problem.

2 economy. My consumption is 9.4 lt diesel on 100km. That is less than 3 baht / km.

3 safety. Its seize and rugged construction makes it feel save. Plus sitting a bit higher over traffic is an advantage. It feels good to drive small roads, unpaved areas as well as in BKK city traffic

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Ace of Pop]

Guess its thumbs down for the Camry then.

Truthfully I was in the market for a 3 series, but then I woke up and smelled the cofee and realised that 3MB for a 3 series is nuts (the price of a 5 in the real world). So with the saloon bug biting hard the Camry spec looks nice.... But clearly the opinion and experience of all here is that it's just a cheap and nasty, unrefined machine - so better stick with the fortuner which is at least big and somewhat comfy, practical, safe, and has good residuals.

Nissan - sorry, I think they're ugly.

Volvo I like, nice car. Residuals - well thats a controversial point...... I would be more concerned with build quality, reliability, after sales service, etc.? I would certainly consider it, if its a robust option?

The issues with the Volvo are not around it's build quality, design or driving manners - they are all top class.

Problems that plague Volvo's in TH are a small servicing dealer network, expensive out-of-warranty parts, and long waits for some parts - all of which contribute to their lower than average resale value. If intending to sell it again within 2-3 years, and willing to take 10-15% more resale loss over a Toyota/Honda in that time, it's a solid option though. Depends if you're just pinching pennies, or want a better car to drive, and can live with the downsides of ownership.

The New Teana looks better than the outgoing model (search for 2013 Altima to get an idea of what it will look like) and seeing how much better the current old one is even when compared to new Camry/Accord designs, I'd say you'd be doing yourself a disservice by dismissing it off the cuff... The reason so many of them still sell even in the face of newer and better looking competition is because of all the buyers that test-drove first

I never gave a thumbs down to the Camry, it does what it does very competently, will enjoy fantastic resale and a huge dealer network. It's just not best of class, and it's never been a beauty to look at... I'd still rate it well above the Accord, mainly due to the latter's eco-car like noise suppression levels.

To buy a Camry in our area is not wise,same for Mitsu.Both sell Trucks,and when they get the odd Benzine Engine in Car Form,they think its come from the Moon. Honda only have Petroll engines,and are by far the best Car/SUV sevice nearby.As for noise suppression Honda need ther arse kicked,or at least fit Mich Pilot as O.E..on the Civic and Accord,not Dunlop and Bad Year.We had them both changed before delivery,about 10% better,but not much more.

[mogandave]

But clearly the opinion and experience of all here is that it's just a cheap and nasty, unrefined machine

Clear to you perhaps.

If you’re going to twist what people say in such a way as that, I think the next time you solicit advice on the board, people here would be well advised to not offer any up.

[VocalNeal]

Camry must be OK as there are thousands of them. Hybrid has harsher/stiifer suspension because it is loaded up with batteries. Teana is OK but has lower ground clearance than Camry, important if venturing into pineapple fields!

If road holding was a yardstick I don't think Camry would fair any better than Fortuner at "normal" road speeds. If one is a spirited driver I don't think Camry excels in cornering, although they do screech around the corners routinely being tested on the road between the 331 and Hwy7.

Maybe get a Honda CRV? halfway between the OP choices.

Edited August 28, 2013 by VocalNeal

[Retro Reactive]

- safety, both passive and active (that includes road holding etc).

I'd still rate it well above the Accord, mainly due to the latter's eco-car like noise suppression levels.

While I love my 370z the teana is a remarkably unattractive sedan inside and out,

The G8 accord was bloated and noisy. also didnt care for the dash although cleans up well enough with a 2din on the Non Nav model. The new camry has a great interior especially the dash, the exterior is also easier on the eyes but the ommision of lifesaving curtain airbags which are standard on all 2.4 accords leaves the Thai camry a disapointment. That coupled with iihs small offset crash test scores for the camry a complete nonstarter if you are concerned about passive safety.

2012 IIHS crash test results for midsize family cars

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwARvZVoXho

[sjonburi]

IIHS Accord, nice in theory when crashing similar sized cars but would like to see what happens if a Fortuner hits it at full force sideways.. One of the 'safety' features which I started to appreciate when moving from an Altis to a Prerunner is the fact that you can see much better what is happening in front of the car in front of you and take action before something nasty is going happen.. when you're driving a sedan, you can have all the airbags you want but between all those trucks and SUV's on the road I felt kinda trapped in my sedan.. don't rule out the mass of a Fortuner which is nearly 2000 kg compared to the 1500-1600 kg of the mid-size sedans..

my 2 c

- safety, both passive and active (that includes road holding etc).

I'd still rate it well above the Accord, mainly due to the latter's eco-car like noise suppression levels.

While I love my 370z the teana is a remarkably unattractive sedan inside and out,

The G8 accord was bloated and noisy. also didnt care for the dash although cleans up well enough with a 2din on the Non Nav model. The new camry has a great interior especially the dash, the exterior is also easier on the eyes but the ommision of lifesaving curtain airbags which are standard on all 2.4 accords leaves the Thai camry a disapointment. That coupled with iihs small offset crash test scores for the camry a complete nonstarter if you are concerned about passive safety.

2012 IIHS crash test results for midsize family cars

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwARvZVoXho

[sjonburi]

MRO IMHO,

Heard from a Thai friend that the current Teana's CVT is plagued with overheating / whining and all sorts of problems.. he is on his 3rd CVT now.. Have you read something about this on the Thai forums?

Guess its thumbs down for the Camry then.

Truthfully I was in the market for a 3 series, but then I woke up and smelled the cofee and realised that 3MB for a 3 series is nuts (the price of a 5 in the real world). So with the saloon bug biting hard the Camry spec looks nice.... But clearly the opinion and experience of all here is that it's just a cheap and nasty, unrefined machine - so better stick with the fortuner which is at least big and somewhat comfy, practical, safe, and has good residuals.

Nissan - sorry, I think they're ugly.

Volvo I like, nice car. Residuals - well thats a controversial point...... I would be more concerned with build quality, reliability, after sales service, etc.? I would certainly consider it, if its a robust option?

The issues with the Volvo are not around it's build quality, design or driving manners - they are all top class.

Problems that plague Volvo's in TH are a small servicing dealer network, expensive out-of-warranty parts, and long waits for some parts - all of which contribute to their lower than average resale value. If intending to sell it again within 2-3 years, and willing to take 10-15% more resale loss over a Toyota/Honda in that time, it's a solid option though. Depends if you're just pinching pennies, or want a better car to drive, and can live with the downsides of ownership.

The New Teana looks better than the outgoing model (search for 2013 Altima to get an idea of what it will look like) and seeing how much better the current old one is even when compared to new Camry/Accord designs, I'd say you'd be doing yourself a disservice by dismissing it off the cuff... The reason so many of them still sell even in the face of newer and better looking competition is because of all the buyers that test-drove first

I never gave a thumbs down to the Camry, it does what it does very competently, will enjoy fantastic resale and a huge dealer network. It's just not best of class, and it's never been a beauty to look at... I'd still rate it well above the Accord, mainly due to the latter's eco-car like noise suppression levels.

[Ace of Pop]

All this Crash stuff is nonesence theres allways something bigger thanYou.If i had a HumVee a Road Train would get Me. Dont let Thai SUVs here fool you they aint Range Rover /Benz tough, they are Hilux /Camry quality stuck up in the Air . Bit like the Drivers.

[phutoie2]

All this tech stuff, how many cup holders?.

Sent from my i-mobile IQ 2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[sjonburi]

Om nom nom Civic

All this Crash stuff is nonesence theres allways something bigger thanYou.If i had a HumVee a Road Train would get Me. Dont let Thai SUVs here fool you they aint Range Rover /Benz tough, they are Hilux /Camry quality stuck up in the Air . Bit like the Drivers.

[BSJ]

I once saw a Land Cruiser 100 series and a MX5 collide. The MX5 bounced of the Land Cruiser into an immovable wreck....to be towed away. The Land Cruiser driver after the paper work was done got in and drove it away with nary a scratch!

[Ace of Pop]

I saw a MX 5 Hit a Moped once ,and the driver carried on. . When Yer Lucks Out,its Goodnight.

[Retro Reactive]

Agree with ace of pop, SUV and Ute will always have right of way to the lowly sedan, but then there are cement and container trucks, buses etc......its your time its your time.

IIHS Accord, nice in theory when crashing similar sized cars but would like to see what happens if a Fortuner hits it at full force sideways.. One of the 'safety' features which I started to appreciate when moving from an Altis to a Prerunner is the fact that you can see much better what is happening in front of the car in front of you and take action before something nasty is going happen.. when you're driving a sedan, you can have all the airbags you want but between all those trucks and SUV's on the road I felt kinda trapped in my sedan.. don't rule out the mass of a Fortuner which is nearly 2000 kg compared to the 1500-1600 kg of the mid-size sedans..

my 2 c

Cannot repeal the laws of physics when it comes to ride height and weight, there will be some accidents where a fortuner would come off better such as T Bone scenario described and others where it would not. I had a Triton 4dr GLS limited with a turbo back exhaust, race chip and a set of dubs. didnt ride nearly as well as the PJS on account of the rear leafs and wallowing ride in corners but looked the part and being a diesel didnt cost much to run and waded the flooded and potholed roads.

I think the real safety advantage of a ute and suv is the commanding view and its size definately reduces the risk of oncomming traffic veering into your lane to pass and tailgating from behind. Thus avoiding the accident in the first place However, in the event of an accident in LOS, where for example the PJS lacks VSA, torso and curtain airbags which are included in the aussie PJS "Challenger", id much rather be in a vehicle which has not been stripped of important safety features and less effective crumple zones of a BOF.

Ultimately its not my reliance on safety features but my judgement which has kept me safe for over 12 yrs on LOS roads. Relying on safety features or a large car is the wrong mentality. Seen and photographed enough totalled utes in thailand to sober me from any false sense of security. the fortuner and other ppvs are a poor alternative to the prado and other suvs. That being said they have come a long way from the previous generation gwagon, sportrider, etc and Iook foward to see how far the new gen of ppv brings the level of refinement, safety and style.

Edited August 28, 2013 by Retro Reactive

[Ace of Pop]

You can goad Fortuna Drivers on fast bendy Mountain Roads where i live . Let em Tailgate you, then hit the gas, they follow, then slam the gas into the worst wet bend you know without touching your brakes.They Wiggle en Squigle all over the Road.All Dem Traction Gizzmoes dont help a Clown. My Wife has BANNED Me From Goading Thai Tuna Drivers. Mitsu PJS seem rather good on wet bends ive noted.

[pokerspiv]

Dont let Thai SUVs here fool you they aint Range Rover /Benz tough, they are Hilux /Camry quality stuck up in the Air . Bit like the Drivers.

Toyota Hiluxes are the toughest SUVs that have ever been built in the history of engineering.

After it had been submerged in sea water, hit with a wrecking ball and set on fire, Top Gear put one on top of a block of flats, blew up the block of flats, let the Hilux land, and it still started.

So calling something Hilux quality is high praise indeed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnWKz7Cthkk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTPnIpjodA8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFnVZXQD5_k

Edited August 28, 2013 by pokerspiv

[Jerry Cornelius]

Dont let Thai SUVs here fool you they aint Range Rover /Benz tough, they are Hilux /Camry quality stuck up in the Air . Bit like the Drivers.

Toyota Hiluxes are the toughest SUVs that have ever been built in the history of engineering.

Top Gear put one on top of a skyscraper, blew up the skyscraper, let the Hilux land, and it still started.

So calling something Hilux quality is high praise indeed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnWKz7Cthkk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFnVZXQD5_k

Perhaps as well considering the way some of their owners drive.

Jerry

Edited August 28, 2013 by Jerry Cornelius

[Jerry Cornelius]

You can goad Fortuna Drivers on fast bendy Mountain Roads where i live . Let em Tailgate you, then hit the gas, they follow, then slam the gas into the worst wet bend you know without touching your brakes.They Wiggle en Squigle all over the Road.All Dem Traction Gizzmoes dont help a Clown. My Wife has BANNED Me From Goading Thai Tuna Drivers. Mitsu PJS seem rather good on wet bends ive noted.

It seems that we share a pastime.

Jerry

Edited August 28, 2013 by Jerry Cornelius

[Ace of Pop]

Toyotas are no tougher than a Nissan.I bought my first truck many years ago. Nissans were imported from Japan back then. A Big M single cab weighing in at over1000Kilos. No Aircon,you had it fitted by Nops Shed Aircon Company, and it never went wrong.Think it was about 250K Bht,but not sure,now one sees basicaly the same thing for a Million.Those 2 Extra Chairs,Doors and a Tin Roof aint arf pricey.Id buy a Honda CRV ,at least it isnt a Blinged Truck,and doesnt hop all over the place,like the Kids Trailbouncer..

[mogandave]

You can goad Fortuna Drivers on fast bendy Mountain Roads where i live . Let em Tailgate you, then hit the gas, they follow, then slam the gas into the worst wet bend you know without touching your brakes.They Wiggle en Squigle all over the Road.All Dem Traction Gizzmoes dont help a Clown. My Wife has BANNED Me From Goading Thai Tuna Drivers. Mitsu PJS seem rather good on wet bends ive noted.

It seems that we share a pastime.

Jerry

My favorite, is driving in traffic, and a string of cars on the opposite side of the road is patiently waiting to make a right turn in traffic, when a ‘tuna comes around them and attempts to jump line. I like nothing better than being able to block the ‘tuna, while letting the whole line that been waiting go.

You get bonus points if you can creep ahead and get the car behind you to cooperate and get traffic going again without the Fortuner ever getting to go.

[sjonburi]

LOL! You mean when they're basically pushing you up the mountain roads due to the lack of torque in any petrol honda engine and keep waiting until the VTEC kicks in @ 6000 RPM, oh wait..

You can goad Fortuna Drivers on fast bendy Mountain Roads where i live . Let em Tailgate you, then hit the gas, they follow, then slam the gas into the worst wet bend you know without touching your brakes.They Wiggle en Squigle all over the Road.All Dem Traction Gizzmoes dont help a Clown. My Wife has BANNED Me From Goading Thai Tuna Drivers. Mitsu PJS seem rather good on wet bends ive noted.

[Ace of Pop]

LOL! You mean when they're basically pushing you up the mountain roads due to the lack of torque in any petrol honda engine and keep waiting until the VTEC kicks in @ 6000 RPM, oh wait..

You can goad Fortuna Drivers on fast bendy Mountain Roads where i live . Let em Tailgate you, then hit the gas, they follow, then slam the gas into the worst wet bend you know without touching your brakes.They Wiggle en Squigle all over the Road.All Dem Traction Gizzmoes dont help a Clown. My Wife has BANNED Me From Goading Thai Tuna Drivers. Mitsu PJS seem rather good on wet bends ive noted.

Look up the meaning BHP per Ton,thats why you cant fend off a Manual Honda City with a Tuna...... 120 BHP in a Tin Can.

[sjonburi]

LOL! You're even funnier than I thought

Let me update you in that case with a famous quote from a guy who knew 'a thing or two' about cars.

"HP sells cars, Torque wins races"

Now please do the match again of available torque per tonne

Good luck with 145 nm's up that mountain ;-)

LOL! You mean when they're basically pushing you up the mountain roads due to the lack of torque in any petrol honda engine and keep waiting until the VTEC kicks in @ 6000 RPM, oh wait..

You can goad Fortuna Drivers on fast bendy Mountain Roads where i live . Let em Tailgate you, then hit the gas, they follow, then slam the gas into the worst wet bend you know without touching your brakes.They Wiggle en Squigle all over the Road.All Dem Traction Gizzmoes dont help a Clown. My Wife has BANNED Me From Goading Thai Tuna Drivers. Mitsu PJS seem rather good on wet bends ive noted.

Look up the meaning BHP per Ton,thats why you cant fend off a Manual Honda City with a Tuna...... 120 BHP in a Tin Can.