Is Thailand pink friendly?

[webfact]

Is Thailand pink friendly?

BANGKOK: The country’s tourism authorities are trying to market Thailand as the region’s ‘pink’ destination, but local gay and transgender activists say the campaign disguises a darker reality – that beneath the nation’s veneer of public tolerance, conservatism and discrimination remain rife

"At home, I could easily lose my job just by acting out as a gay person,” says Richard, a 51-year-old gay man.

“I live and work in Singapore, but I can’t reveal my true sexual identity there.

“I earn good money and am working at an executive level. I always look professional in my suit and tie back at home, but here in Thailand I can wear a skin-tight shirt. I love it here since I’m allowed to be myself.”

Richard is on Silom Soi 4 in Bangkok, an area renowned for its gay nightlife, with his partner Li, 43, a bisexual man from Malaysia.

The pair travel to Thailand regularly and eventually plan to retire here.

“We usually come to see each other in Bangkok or sometimes Phuket,” Li says.” “We come here every other weekend. We plan to make Thailand our retirement home since people here are much friendlier than where I’m from.

“We feel welcome and blessed every time we are in Thailand. If I had a choice, I would prefer to be born here as a gay person.”

TICKLED PINK

The concept of the “pink tourism” dollar has reached Asia only recently, with the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender community now representing a new market niche in the region.

In December, 2011, San Francisco-based firm Community Marketing released its 16th Annual Gay and Lesbian Tourism Report, which analysed a poll of 6,648 people in the US who identify as lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender.

The report found an overall increase in pink travel after two years of recession-induced decline, with gay/bisexual men taking an average of 3.9 trips and lesbian/bisexual women taking an average of 3.3 trips in the previous 12 months.

The largest segment of respondents fell into the mid-range price point for travel, followed by budget and luxury.

Khun May, founder of gay travel website lovepattaya.com, says that no one in Thailand has ever conducted research on the domestic pink tourism industry. However, the popularity of the website has been measured by the number of unique visitors per day – 500 – and minimum page views of 1,000-2,000, all large numbers according to Khun May.

“Among our website’s members, most are spending money on travel and leisure and the rest spend the money on food and beverages.

“Most of our members choose to stay in the five-star hotels. That is why our sponsors are all five-star hotels,” Khun May says.

The term often used to describe why this group has such high purchasing power is the acronym Dink – dual income, no kids.

“Since this group of people has no kids, they can double their budget and spend more on themselves.

“This is why gay couples are usually bigger spenders than straight couples,” Khun May says.

Thailand has long been known as a desirable destination for gay and transgender travellers, even though pink tourism has never been officially promoted.

The Tourism Authority of Thailand (TAT), however, recently changed that, launching the “Go Thai Be Free” campaign with the aim of promoting pink tourism.

But while Thailand is viewed as a tourist haven for same-sex couples, the reality for locals is that the law, and often public sentiment, is not so liberal.

BETTER OR WORSE

After eight years of living with her partner, Bee, a 31-year-old lesbian, is ready to commit to a life-long relationship with her partner. While she admits the pair could live together without any problems, Bee thinks she deserves the same rights as any other Thai citizen.

“If we were a straight couple, we would be legally married by now,” she says. “My partner is a government official and I think I deserve the same government benefits that the married partner in a straight couple would receive. I’m working, so money is not an issue. However, I need security and stability in my life, just like everyone else.”

According to research on same-sex marriage conducted by the Foundation for Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity Rights and Justice on same-sex marriage, 73 per cent of gay or transgender couples in Thailand want legal recognition of their relationships.

Despite Thailand’s reputation as the most gay-friendly country in Southeast Asia, marriage or even civil union remains impossible for same-sex couples.

Earlier this year, local activists launched a campaign for the passage of a civil partnership law, saying it was a basic human right that everyone should have access to.

Natee Teerarojjanapong, president of the Gay Political Group of Thailand, says he was the first person to try to push for same-sex marriage in Thailand.

In August, 2011, Mr Natee attempted to register a marriage certificate with his male partner, whom he had lived with for 19 years in Chiang Mai’s Muang district. His request was rejected, but he didn’t mind – instead, all he asked for was that the official document from the district office specify the reason why they could not get married.

“According to the Article 30 of the constitution, discriminating against sexual identity is against the law,” Mr Natee says.

“I brought that document from the district office to the National Human Rights Commission of Thailand [NHRC] in Bangkok and gave it to NHRC commissioner Tairjing Siriphanich. My part was done. I am now waiting to hear back whether this [civil partnership] law will be passed.”

Anjana Suvarnananda, president of the Anjaree lesbian rights group, says that the proposed civil partnership law is essential to safeguarding sexual diversity in Thailand.

“When straight couples get married, there are many laws supporting their lives – distribution of inheritance, access to medical care for both parties, for example. But for people of the same gender living together, there is no law to support or protect them,” Ms Anjana says.

Jetsada “Note” Taesombat, coordinator of the Thai Transgender Alliance, believes it is crucial for transgender men and women to be legally recognised as part of society. At present, they are legally identified as their sex at birth.

“Transgender men and women also want the civil partnership law to pass, since gender recognition is the most important issue. To legalise same-sex civil partnerships would mean that we, as people with sexual diversity, can finally be recognised legally.

“The most important thing for me and for everyone is to be accepted as part of society,” Note says.

The Civil Partnership Act has been discussed and reviewed five times already, with public hearings have been held in all four regions of Thailand. The latest forum was held by the House Committee on Justice and Human Rights two months ago.

By law, 20 MPs must sign in support of a public bill before it can be presented to parliament for deliberation. This has already been achieved for the Civil Partnership Bill, but the proposal is yet to be added to the House agenda due to a shortage of public support.

By law, the bill must also garner 10,000 signatures from members of the public – the civil partnership bill has only about 4,000.

INVISIBLE VIOLENCE

In the eyes of the outsider, Thailand is a paradise of tolerance. But for gay and transgender people inside the country, the picture is less idyllic.

The Foundation for Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity Rights and Justice last year interviewed 868 people who identify as gay, lesbian or transgender in Chiang Mai, Nakhon Sawan, Bangkok, Pattaya, Surat Thani, Phuket and Nakhon Ratchasima.

It found that 15 per cent of respondents were not accepted among their own family members, while 8 per cent were only conditionally accepted as part of the family. For nearly 13 per cent of respondents, family members refused to let them live with a gay partner.
More than 14 per cent had been verbally assaulted by family members, 2.5 per cent were kicked out of the family home and 1.3 per cent were forced to undergo psychological treatment. About 2.5 per cent were forced to enter the monkhood, while 2.4 per cent were physically attacked by family members and 3.3 per cent were sexually assaulted by friends.

Naiyana Supapung, coordinator of the Teeranat Kanjanaauksorn Foundation, which works for gender and sexual justice, says that gay and transgender people in Thailand face silent abuse throughout their everyday lives.

She says Thai people have been conditioned to believe that society consists of only males and females. Therefore, the legal system cannot accommodate anyone outside those defined gender roles.

She says many people become frustrated when they see younger people acting in ways that were never seen in their time – boys acting like girls, girls dressing like boys, or sexual relationships between people of the same gender.

The main issues arising at the moment are because these ideas are all fairly new, Ms Naiyana says. People of previous generations had little or no knowledge of the existence of different gender groups, with the result that today such people are automatically judged as “freaks of nature’’.

‘’I have a son studying in high school,’’ Ms Naiyana says. “He showed me his health education text book and I was shocked by what I saw. One part of the book specifically warned against any contact with people who act like members of the opposite sex. It advised students to inform their teacher straight away so they can help adjust those kids’ behaviour.

“What makes this worse is the illustration in the lesson. The textbook shows images of what the author considers ‘abnormal’ kids.”

Ms Naiyana says she doesn’t necessarily blame teachers in this situation – she acknowledges that they are simply teaching their students what they themselves were taught many years ago. But this doesn't make it right, and she says there is an urgent need for a change in attitude.

“Invisible violence is more harmful than visible violence. At least there are ways to prevent and treat physical violence. But there is no way to prevent invisible violence. Once it wounds the heart, it is difficult to heal,’’ she says.

Ms Naiyana recalls a case several years ago in which a gay boy attempted to kill himself by drinking insecticide. The boy had been humiliated by a teacher who had ordered him to stop speaking and acting like a girl. The teacher threatened to lower the boy’s academic grades if he didn’t comply.

When he failed to follow her instruction, the boy was slapped in the face in front of the whole school during the morning flag ceremony.

When he returned home, he attempted suicide.

WHAT EQUALITY?

“I feel like the reason that gay, lesbian and transgender tourists feel more welcome here is because they are here as tourists and of course local people want their money. They are granted certain privileges, the same as when I travel to another country,’’ Transgender Alliance coordinator Note says.

She believes tourists feel more free to express their sexual identity in Thailand because it is not their home and they are offered a certain level of anonymity.

‘’If they actually live or work here and have a same-sex partner, they will begin to understand that there are many things they can’t do and may not have access to,’’ Note says.

“When they are here as tourists, they see a romantic side of our culture and tradition. But if they get to be part of a community for one year, they will feel different.’’

HEARTS AND MINDS

The first step towards ratifying a civil partnership law is to change the public attitude towards same-sex couples; changing the law won’t change popular sentiment, Ms
Anjana says.

“There is a quote from an expert saying that Thai society unofficially accepts, but officially rejects, gay and lesbian people,’’ she says.

“I think it’s true that Thai people can only accept gay and lesbian people in superficial ways, such as the way they act or dress. But when it comes to the meaningful circumstances, Thai people tend to be biased against them.’’

Note says society must recognise that there is more than just male and female – there are also lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender people living together.

“Apart from the legal issue, I think people’s attitudes are important. If people still have negative feelings toward gay and transgender people, the law will mean nothing to anyone.’’

Ms Naiyana agrees. ‘’It is time for us to reform our law, culture, and social values to be more open to sexual diversity. For me, civil partnership is the first step for gender recognition.

“If it is approved and enforced, it will be good. But I would still say we do not really understand what human right and gender equality are,’’ she says.

“If we can understand those rights, gay and transgender people should not need to have separate laws governing marriage.’’


-- Phuket News 2013-09-19

[Jingthing]

The issue isn't about nasal tones or other homophobic stereotypes of gay people. It's that people can be fired or worse in many parts of the world ONLY for their status as a gay individual. They could be total closet cases and likely are so in most anti-gay oppressive countries but that doesn't preclude their lives being ruined if their true nature is discovered. The ones who fit your silly stereotypes and ALL other ones as well are both living under such persecution in many countries.. Anyone can see clearly how your comment was homophobic -- pushing idiotic and offensive stereotypes. Some of your best friends are gay does NOT cut it, dude.

Edited September 19, 2013 by Jingthing

[Trentham]

Why Can't I Own a Canadian? October 2002

Dr. Laura Schlessinger is a radio personality who dispenses advice to people who call in to her radio show. Recently, she said that, as an observant Orthodox Jew, homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22 and cannot be condoned under any circumstance. The following is an open letter to Dr. Laura penned by a east coast resident, which was posted on the Internet. It's funny, as well as informative:

Dear Dr. Laura:

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the other specific laws and how to follow them:

When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15:19- 24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighbouring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your devoted fan,

Jim

[sustento]

I thought the gay forum was a place where we weren't required to justify our existence to passing bigots?

[Jingthing]

I thought the gay forum was a place where we weren't required to justify our existence to passing bigots?

I would have thought that too, but here we got a member who is openly gay give a like to a bigoted post, so I guess that might muddy the waters.

[Scott]

A series of off-topic, troll posts have been deleted. Suspensions will be issued.

This is the gay forum and anti-gay remarks are not tolerated.

7) Not to post slurs or degrading comments directed towards any group on the basis of race, nationality, religion, gender or sexual orientation.

Sorry, there isn't much left of the thread.

[ToddWeston]

There's a lot to digest in the article - I'm pleased Richard and his partner feel welcomed, I believe Thailand is extremely tolerant, marketing for pink dollars has been discussed in another thread and I'm sure 99.9 % of global gays realise Thailand warts and all is a pretty decent place to holiday.

The two lesbians wanting equal marriage rights, it's coming and it doesn't matter what it's called.

As for the statistics - 15% were not accepted by family I can only say from personal experience it takes time. When the inlaws realised I was violating their beloved son I was worse than a house ghost, soi dog, canal rat twenty odd years later I get a good night kiss. The rest of the statistics whilst painful to read I believe could be lower than in some smaller communities in the west (I wouldn't want to be gay in the Bible Belt in the USA - no flame intended)

I did find the rest of the article a bit of a rant - yes marriage/ civil unions are coming, Thais are generally law abiding and have respect for His Majesty, Lord Buddha and Country, when it becomes law I think they will be much more tolerant if they are not already.

NB : Next long article should have a warning to grab your reading glasses

[chickenslegs]

The topic is in the gay forum, but it has been posted on the Thaivisa.com News - attracting the interest of the general population.

There may have been a few numbskulls who posted bigoted remarks but, on the positive side, some people who would never have visited the gay forum may have read the whole article and learned something.

Personally, I think the whole idea of targeting the "pink" tourist dollar is cynical and dishonest. The main reason that gay tourists are welcome is that they (allegedly) have more money to spend.

[sustento]

The topic is in the gay forum, but it has been posted on the Thaivisa.com News - attracting the interest of the general population.

There may have been a few numbskulls who posted bigoted remarks but, on the positive side, some people who would never have visited the gay forum may have read the whole article and learned something.

Personally, I think the whole idea of targeting the "pink" tourist dollar is cynical and dishonest. The main reason that gay tourists are welcome is that they (allegedly) have more money to spend.

And that's a good a reason as any for a tourist authority to target them. The fact that Thailand is a better place to go on holiday if you're gay than many other countries is simply an added bonus.

[chickenslegs]

The topic is in the gay forum, but it has been posted on the Thaivisa.com News - attracting the interest of the general population.

There may have been a few numbskulls who posted bigoted remarks but, on the positive side, some people who would never have visited the gay forum may have read the whole article and learned something.

Personally, I think the whole idea of targeting the "pink" tourist dollar is cynical and dishonest. The main reason that gay tourists are welcome is that they (allegedly) have more money to spend.

And that's a good a reason as any for a tourist authority to target them. The fact that Thailand is a better place to go on holiday if you're gay than many other countries is simply an added bonus.

I am not gay, so I don't know whether Thailand is a better place to go on holiday if you're gay.

But it does seem dishonest to promote a place as being "gay friendly" when the local gay populace seems to think otherwise.

And that is the only point I was making.

[sustento]

I had this conversation a very long time ago on s.c.t with a Thai guy who was a professor at Chiang Mai University. He couldn't understand why we westerners thought that Thailand was so gay friendly. He said that if you were gay in Thailand people sometimes gossiped about you behind your back. I pointed out that if you were gay in the UK sometimes people kicked your head in which made him revise his opinion of the relative gay friendliness of Thailand.

[Tywais]

An inflammatory post and replies to it removed.

[ppmacready]

There's a lot to digest in the article - I'm pleased Richard and his partner feel welcomed, I believe Thailand is extremely tolerant, marketing for pink dollars has been discussed in another thread and I'm sure 99.9 % of global gays realise Thailand warts and all is a pretty decent place to holiday.

The two lesbians wanting equal marriage rights, it's coming and it doesn't matter what it's called.

As for the statistics - 15% were not accepted by family I can only say from personal experience it takes time. When the inlaws realised I was violating their beloved son I was worse than a house ghost, soi dog, canal rat twenty odd years later I get a good night kiss. The rest of the statistics whilst painful to read I believe could be lower than in some smaller communities in the west (I wouldn't want to be gay in the Bible Belt in the USA - no flame intended)

I did find the rest of the article a bit of a rant - yes marriage/ civil unions are coming, Thais are generally law abiding and have respect for His Majesty, Lord Buddha and Country, when it becomes law I think they will be much more tolerant if they are not already.

NB : Next long article should have a warning to grab your reading glasses

It is not necessary to be gay, to be treated worse than a soi dog by Thai in laws.

They have been educated to be racists.

[Benmart]

There's a lot to digest in the article - I'm pleased Richard and his partner feel welcomed, I believe Thailand is extremely tolerant, marketing for pink dollars has been discussed in another thread and I'm sure 99.9 % of global gays realise Thailand warts and all is a pretty decent place to holiday.

The two lesbians wanting equal marriage rights, it's coming and it doesn't matter what it's called.

As for the statistics - 15% were not accepted by family I can only say from personal experience it takes time. When the inlaws realised I was violating their beloved son I was worse than a house ghost, soi dog, canal rat twenty odd years later I get a good night kiss. The rest of the statistics whilst painful to read I believe could be lower than in some smaller communities in the west (I wouldn't want to be gay in the Bible Belt in the USA - no flame intended)

I did find the rest of the article a bit of a rant - yes marriage/ civil unions are coming, Thais are generally law abiding and have respect for His Majesty, Lord Buddha and Country, when it becomes law I think they will be much more tolerant if they are not already.

NB : Next long article should have a warning to grab your reading glasses

It is not necessary to be gay, to be treated worse than a soi dog by Thai in laws.

They have been educated to be racists.

I haven't met "They", so I have trouble understanding what group(s) you are referring too. The Soi dogs in my neighborhood are treated well by the people here. They have shelter, food and sleep a lot. Not a bad life.

[onthemoon]

The topic is in the gay forum, but it has been posted on the Thaivisa.com News - attracting the interest of the general population.

There may have been a few numbskulls who posted bigoted remarks but, on the positive side, some people who would never have visited the gay forum may have read the whole article and learned something.

Personally, I think the whole idea of targeting the "pink" tourist dollar is cynical and dishonest. The main reason that gay tourists are welcome is that they (allegedly) have more money to spend.

I don't think it's cynical. The "pink dollar" is a marketing term, and every marketing campaign targets certain groups. I find it quite good that the gay community has been identified as a target group rather than being ignored, or classified as undesirable, as in the past.

If you have ever worked in a restaurant, you know that gays are the best tippers. The reason may well be that they have more disposable income, as they don't have to feed a family and often enough are DINKs = Double Income, No Kids. Marketers understand the value of that.

[BusyBee123]

Utter nonsense from on the moon, best tippers are gay, dual income blah blah dream on sunshine and just for your blinkered mind many gays adopt ooh who would have thought it. As for marketing Thailand is only tolerant they still can't get over skin colour yet so join the queue for acceptance.

[sustento]

Utter nonsense from on the moon, best tippers are gay, dual income blah blah dream on sunshine and just for your blinkered mind many gays adopt ooh who would have thought it. As for marketing Thailand is only tolerant they still can't get over skin colour yet so join the queue for acceptance.

[onthemoon]

Utter nonsense from on the moon, best tippers are gay, dual income blah blah dream on sunshine and just for your blinkered mind many gays adopt ooh who would have thought it. As for marketing Thailand is only tolerant they still can't get over skin colour yet so join the queue for acceptance.

Wellwellwell. Good to hear your opinion.

[Scott]

Utter nonsense is a pretty big term. Of course, there are gays who are not big tippers, there are gays who have families and kids and there are gays who are poor. Of course, I doubt that these groups will be heading to Thailand in large numbers, though.