Gem Scam

[alleykat]

I got a phone call from an old friend yesterday who has just recently arrived in Thailand from Australia. He told me he got scammed yesterday in Bangkok for $5000.00 in the age-old gem scam. I don't know the details yet. He says he has never seen or heard any warnings about this before.

Does anyone have any suggestions about what could possibly be done to retieve some of his money, apart from reporting it to the Tourist Police?

I do live here so I could follow it up a bit more than someone who's here on holiday.

[chuchok]

Embassy and Tourist police.

[Doza]

This is interesting - the scam is advertised in the LP, on its website, on some posters around, say Khao San road, and I guess maybe on embassy websites but there must be a better way of informing people.

How does your average tourist, maybe first time out of their country, who just goes down to the local flight centre and books a 2 week package to Thailand, really find out about these things? There should be a 'scam' guide given to all people who book a flight here!

I hate hearing about people getting scammed. You have got to admit though, to fall for this really is pretty stupid, but I still feel for the person - esp when its to the tune of $5000!

The guys who start the scam off, I see every day lurking around the corner of Suk 18 and 20. Well-dressed Thai guys who wait for tourists to come by and strike up conversations with them. They have tried it on me a few times and I get pretty aggressive with them but most people stop and chat, the map then comes out, and therin the scam starts...

[PREM-R]

Who in their right mind would part with $5,000 to purchase anything from "a guy you meet in the street", particularly something as 'dodgy' as gem stones. Even a first time package holiday maker to Bangkok would surely have more brain than to spend the whole of their holiday money on 'baubles' on the first day in town. By the way does your Aussie mate need a Rolex? "Only 600 dollars"

[lingling]

I got a phone call from an old friend yesterday who has just recently arrived in Thailand from Australia. He told me he got scammed yesterday in Bangkok for $5000.00 in the age-old gem scam. I don't know the details yet. He says he has never seen or heard any warnings about this before.

Does anyone have any suggestions about what could possibly be done to retieve some of his money, apart from reporting it to the Tourist Police?

I do live here so I could follow it up a bit more than someone who's here on holiday.

Hire a police officer (not from the district where the shop is located) with a bit of rank (captain or higher) to go with you to the shop and negotiate a deal. You can probably "sell back" the goods for 90% of the amount paid if done properly. I have a friend who was in the same situation a few years back and that's how it worked out for her.

Edited April 25, 2006 by lingling

[Kruang]

I got a phone call from an old friend yesterday who has just recently arrived in Thailand from Australia. He told me he got scammed yesterday in Bangkok for $5000.00 in the age-old gem scam. I don't know the details yet. He says he has never seen or heard any warnings about this before.

Does anyone have any suggestions about what could possibly be done to retieve some of his money, apart from reporting it to the Tourist Police?

I do live here so I could follow it up a bit more than someone who's here on holiday.

I think if you want to get some useful advice here, you need to get some details. Did he buy from a shop or from someone on the street? Did he hand over cash and then the seller didn't deliver? Or were the gems he bought inferior quality or fake? If the latter, how did your friend know that? Did he take them to a gemological lab and have them tested? Some people who say they've been scammed simply paid way too much for what they got ....

[Scott]

My first time in Thailand, I came with a friend from HK. He got scammed on the gem thing. He thought he knew gems. I was with him and there was some pretty in-depth discussions. I would have nothing to do with it. I said I couldn't tell a piece of chipped glass from a gem.

Apparently neither could my friend!!

I eventually returned to Thailand with his gem and took the tourist police to the shop and got a portion of the money back, but it wasn't easy. Police didn't want to go (I had a letter from my friend who was a Dr. in HK saying he would write to newspapers, contact the British Embassy, this was before 1997, etc. etc.).

Best of luck. They still do get some people, I guess.

[h90]

Who in their right mind would part with $5,000 to purchase anything from "a guy you meet in the street", particularly something as 'dodgy' as gem stones. Even a first time package holiday maker to Bangkok would surely have more brain than to spend the whole of their holiday money on 'baubles' on the first day in town. By the way does your Aussie mate need a Rolex? "Only 600 dollars"

600 dollar sounds good, can you personaly promise me that it is original?

(no need for certificates, I trust you)

[The Skipper]

Nothing you can do.

No crime commited.

You overpaid for some stones. Buyer beware.

Get them appraised back home for probably less than $500.

My nephews got taken for $5000 a few years ago, spent the vacation trying to get satisfaction.

Not only do the Tourist Authority not warn people but they actually encourage you to "buy gems" while on holiday in the Land of Smiles.

I've seen their promotional clip on inbound flights.

Would anyone be suprised to learn that someone at TAT is involved?

The scam artists have free reign at all the hot tourist places, telling tourists, the Temple is closed etc..

I was going for a riverboat ride and some guy told me the "river was closed".

Every Taxi parked outside every hotel is in on it and the Tuk-Tuk drivers are constantly trolling for another sucker. Not interested in giving transport, these guys are full time con artists.

Even at the Airport, behind secure areas the scammers ply their trade.

Who has'nt seen the "students" taking surveys wearing official looking Amazing Thailand shirts passing themselvs off as public officials.

... and do not smoke or some cop will follow you till you drop the butt and accost you for 2000bt.

Disgusting.

[PREM-R]

British Embassy Bangkok advises "You should be aware of being approached by strangers who offer to take you to gem shops. Once in the shop you may be asked to purchase gems on your credit card. The gems are sent to your home address in the UK. However, they are never worth the value you pay for them. It is very difficult to get your money returned as the shops shut down quickly and re-open somewhere else."

Australian Embassy Bangkok advises "In Thailand some travellers have become the victims of scams after they have accepted offers from people recommending or offering various goods or services, particularly with shopping for jewellery and gems. The Tourism Authority of Thailand (TAT) can provide official advice on purchasing jewellery and gems."

Caveat Emptor

[greg.d]

It's already been said but if you go to another country you really should do some research before you come, Especially on the well known scams.

'Caveat Emptor' indeed.

Don't people buy the LP (well at least look at it in a bookshop, no need to buy it!) really there is no excuse, how could someone be so stupid as to forkout $5000 for gems, for chr#st sake.

Even if you think you know you're stuff, best do a course in Bangkok or invest in a book by Richard Hughes (a specialist in gems) he has a great book costs about 97 pounds (cheap for the knowledge) or do a Google search.... richard hughes gems.

There is a sucker born every minute, sorry no sympathy from me.

LIVE AND LEARN

[MarkBKK]

... How does your average tourist, maybe first time out of their country, who just goes down to the local flight centre and books a 2 week package to Thailand, really find out about these things? ...

I can't recall seeing a guidebook that doesn't warn of this scam (it's in many phrase books too). And I'd guess most travel/holiday web sites mention it (apart from the ''book your hotel here'', ''welcome to wonderful Thailand'' type of sites).

I'm afraid going to a foreign country and finding out nothing at all about it before you go falls into the ''evolution in action'' category.

(Whoops, sorry, posted just after greg.d said the same thing.)

Edited April 25, 2006 by MarkBKK

[jdinasia]

amazing that people still don't get it ...

but your buddy is likely not to get a dime back since he is already back home.

but if he goes to the USA soon ... I have some land in Florida I could sell him at a great price!

[johna]

I met a Danish gem merchant on a buying trip to Thailand more than 10 years ago and he told me that 90% of tourists get ripped off. My wife upgrades her jewelry every so often but she will only do so with shops that she knows very well.

Stories you read periodically in the local press pretty much confirm that this guy has no chance of getting his money back.

[ThaiPauly]

My wife upgrades her jewelry every so often but she will only do so with shops that she knows very well.

Lucky Girl... when I buy my Wife jewlery.. she keeps it... no upgrades...maybee something new once in a while..thats it....Oh to be RICH

I have never heard of jewlery upgrades before.

Plus my 2 satangs worth is as previously stated 'Buyer Beware" if you get conned you get conned.

No sympathy from me I'm afraid

TP

[petedk]

Even professionals can get caught out.

I know a gem dealer with 30 years experince who bought a gemstone here in Bangkok and when he took it to be certified found out it was a fake. He told me that it is becoming increasingly difficult to spot the fakes just by looking. Being a professional and dealing with this supplier for many years he was able to get a full refund. He doesn't know if it was a deliberate scam or an honest mistake. Needless to say he now gets the gems from this dealer tested.

I'm not sure if tourists can get stones tested. I doubt very much if the shop would part with them for testing. The best advice for any tourist is don't buy if you don't know what you are doing.

[Kruang]

My wife upgrades her jewelry every so often but she will only do so with shops that she knows very well.

Lucky Girl... when I buy my Wife jewlery.. she keeps it... no upgrades...maybee something new once in a while..thats it....Oh to be RICH

I have never heard of jewlery upgrades before.

Plus my 2 satangs worth is as previously stated 'Buyer Beware" if you get conned you get conned.

No sympathy from me I'm afraid

TP

Men upgrade automobiles, electronic gear and wives/girlfriends. Women upgrade jewellery, wardrobes, hairstyles and body parts. Hope this helps .....

[Kruang]

Even professionals can get caught out.

I know a gem dealer with 30 years experince who bought a gemstone here in Bangkok and when he took it to be certified found out it was a fake. He told me that it is becoming increasingly difficult to spot the fakes just by looking. Being a professional and dealing with this supplier for many years he was able to get a full refund. He doesn't know if it was a deliberate scam or an honest mistake. Needless to say he now gets the gems from this dealer tested.

I'm not sure if tourists can get stones tested. I doubt very much if the shop would part with them for testing. The best advice for any tourist is don't buy if you don't know what you are doing.

Anyone who is willing to pay for testing at one of the gemological labs in Bangkok can get a lab report on a stone. Any shop that wouldn't let the customer pay for a lab test is just telling you to take your business elsewhere.

It's very true that most buyers don't know what they're doing. Unfortunately it's also true that many gems dealers don't know what they're doing either -- they got into the business before gemology became a scientific discipline, and they don't have the knowledge or the equipment to accurately appraise gemstones. With all the heat and chemical treatments available these days, appraising a stone "just by looking" has become increasingly difficult.

[Johpa]

I got a phone call from an old friend yesterday who has just recently arrived in Thailand from Australia. He told me he got scammed yesterday in Bangkok for $5000.00 in the age-old gem scam. I don't know the details yet. He says he has never seen or heard any warnings about this before.

Does anyone have any suggestions about what could possibly be done to retieve some of his money, apart from reporting it to the Tourist Police?

I do live here so I could follow it up a bit more than someone who's here on holiday.

Hire a police officer (not from the district where the shop is located) with a bit of rank (captain or higher) to go with you to the shop and negotiate a deal. You can probably "sell back" the goods for 90% of the amount paid if done properly. I have a friend who was in the same situation a few years back and that's how it worked out for her.

The above suggestion is an excellent example of using a phoo yai to mediate disputes in Thailand as discussed in a recent thread.

[jdinasia]

i remember a gem scams page on 2bangkok that has some useful info ...

[jb102670]

Hello everyone.

I didn't get scammed, but was offered a trade.

I was using a metal detector on Pataya beach, when a man approached me.

He wanted to trade me some gems for the detector.

He had in his hand what looked looked like the real thing.

I said no.

I also was apprached by a man with a map on Samson Road, about 5 blocks from Soi 6, in Bangkok.

jb

[Kruang]

Hello everyone.

I didn't get scammed, but was offered a trade.

I was using a metal detector on Pataya beach, when a man approached me.

He wanted to trade me some gems for the detector.

He had in his hand what looked looked like the real thing.

I said no.

I also was apprached by a man with a map on Samson Road, about 5 blocks from Soi 6, in Bangkok.

jb

You were smart not to trade the metal detector for the map.

[alleykat]

This is one story that has a happy ending. He went back to the shop yesterday with the Tourist Police and he got his money back. They were going to ship the jewelry to Australia.

Apparently he was taken to a jewelry store by a Tuk-tuk driver.

The jewels were poor quality he discovered later after talking to people that evening, and doing some research on the internet.

He knows he was an idiot!

[davidbkk]

yes that link for 2bangkok.com is gem scam

[PREM-R]

This is one story that has a happy ending. He went back to the shop yesterday with the Tourist Police and he got his money back. They were going to ship the jewelry to Australia.

Apparently he was taken to a jewelry store by a Tuk-tuk driver.

The jewels were poor quality he discovered later after talking to people that evening, and doing some research on the internet.

He knows he was an idiot!

Lucky Man

[ColPyat]

Anyone who is willing to pay for testing at one of the gemological labs in Bangkok can get a lab report on a stone. Any shop that wouldn't let the customer pay for a lab test is just telling you to take your business elsewhere.

The problem with this is that the costs of proper gem testing in a lab can easily exceed the value of the gem you plan to buy. Anyhow, the way how these scam jobs operate is not by selling fake gems, which would close them down, but by selling real gems for inflated prices.

Bangkok is one of the 5 major cities of the international gem trade, but the real deals are not made in nice shops, but back alley shops in the lower Silom area known to the people in the business. Even they get scammed often as they ways of faking or improving gems get more and more difficult to detect.