Ex-wife has hidden existence of a child

[ianfowler]

Just found out last month via facebook my ex-wife has a son. We had remained on friendly terms and in phone contact. Last month i spotted her on facebook so added her as a friend so no guessing required as to where i spotted the photos.

Looking at the photos of said child he is not the age she claims.

I have asked her on numerous occassions over the phone how old he is and his date of birth. The concocted replies of age i've had from her make him the biggest 10 month old in one of the photos i've ever seen ie he look at least 2.5yrs old. She refuses to give me a DOB. When i challenged her over her timeline of events (carefully typed in Thai) i was abruptly removed from her facebook friends and within less than a minute the account had been deactivated.

Any ideas where i stand legally as again by the looks of the photos she had the kid whilst we were still married and i was back in England (there was 11 months between the last two visits) sending her money for hospital bills etc including over 70k baht in Feb 2011.

We divorced in late March 2011, the then wife asking me out of the blue on my 2nd day of being back in Thailand and the first day up in Khorat.

It was an uncontested divorce and we were asked those questions of adultery, kids, houses etc at the divorce in the local amphur office. We both replied no.

[Mario2008]

Any child born during the marriage, or 310 days after termintion of te marriage (besdies special circumstances) is considered to be the legal child of the (ex)husband. As far as the law is concenred you are the father, with all duties and rights attached to that.

If you want to contest that, you have 1 year after date of birth to repudiate the child. In essence you petiton the court to to declare that the child is not yours and you are not the legal father of the child. I believe that the 1 year also starts from the day you have knowledge of the child, so you should be safe. But you will need a lawyer.

[ianfowler]

Thanks. The real kicker is she says i'm not the dad. So yep a lawyer is definetely in order. Just also wondered how said child affects the divorce still standing as she possibly withheld that. As I said, she won't give me a date of birth so there must be something she's hiding. Will have to go through a lawyer or investigator to get DOB.

[Mike45]

I suppose it's possible that she is telling the truth about it not being your child. Being unfaithful to you and having the child could also be the reason she requested a divorce and didn't tell you about the child or ask you to pay for anything for the child. I'm sure you want to know the truth but I also believe she has a right to some privacy.

[ianfowler]

@Mike, I understand where you are coming from. But if she did hide the child etc it wasn't because she didn't want me to pay anything it is definetely the other way around.

As Mario2008 has said i do need a lawyer because

a) she lied (possibly) at the divorce which might legally complicate things

because i wouldn't have had an uncontested divorce, far from it - which she knows full well.

c) who knows if she is telling the truth or not about anything.

d) i need to have peace of mind

The last kicker is i am friends on FB with some of her family. Not a single one has a picture of her or her kid on there. All the other family members appear, so I guess she is tolerated but has lost face to the all.

[paz]

Can't you tell from the pictures, if at least he/she is full or half Thai blood ?

Also, normally a Thai lady would not wait before asking support money for your child. Is not like she can have more later by hiding the fact to you. And unless she is really out of this world, she would not play that card unless she can prove it's yours.

Yes an unpleasant situation but I think you should start from the position that the baby (it it exists at all, something women do strange things) is not your, but if it is, the burden to prove that is not your either.

Edited October 2, 2013 by paz

[Dr Robert]

The truth has never been of value to human beings-it is a symbol for mathematicians and philosphers to pursue. In human relationships, kindness and ties are worth a thousand truths.

(adapted from Graham Greene, "The Heart of the Matter", 1948)

[benalibina]

Are you living in Thailand now ?

[Mario2008]

At the amphur it should be possible to check if the child is legally of the OP. They should have a register about the parents of the child.

If the child was indeed born during the marriage, he will be named as the father in the records. The mother will need to rectify things, as now she can for example not apply for a passport for the child without the help of the OP, as he is legally the father.

[benalibina]

At the amphur it should be possible to check if the child is legally of the OP. They should have a register about the parents of the child.

If the child was indeed born during the marriage, he will be named as the father in the records. The mother will need to rectify things, as now she can for example not apply for a passport for the child without the help of the OP, as he is legally the father.

What if she just states that mr X Is the father, can she do that or must the natural father register the birth and baby gets his last name ?

[givenall]

How would you know is your chil even if he was born while you were married. A dna would be advisable

[ianfowler]

Having looked at the photo's many times he does not look half Thai have western. Though his complexion is quite fair compared to his mums. It's his age that concerns me and any legal implications possibly involved. The ex has definetely been hiding something in regards to that and has basically cut off all contact from me as soon as I told her he was never the age she had implied. I think she may be worried about legal proceedings, money etc.

I am seeking legal advice and have made initial contact with a law firm Siam Legal, as they have a free initial advice service so may be able to put my mind at rest.

I know that in some countries uncontested divorce is not recognised and i have heard that there can be problems with some here in England.

@ paz @ doctor robert - her son is the innocent party here. i have no wish to cause him any duress. He is a lovely looking kid. But sadly i know the ex wife and what she is like.

@benalibina - no i'm in England.

@Mario2008 - i'm not sure how much i would relish a trip to her local amphur. I have a funny feeling that i would not be shall we say greeted to well by some of her friends if i turned up in Chok Chai and they found out.

[FiftyTwo]

Thanks. The real kicker is she says i'm not the dad. So yep a lawyer is definetely in order. Just also wondered how said child affects the divorce still standing as she possibly withheld that. As I said, she won't give me a date of birth so there must be something she's hiding. Will have to go through a lawyer or investigator to get DOB.

Just go to any Amphur office with your divorce certificate, and ask if she had a child when you were married or within 9 months after the divorce. If she did, they will give you a copy of the child's birth certificate, and you will legally be the father. Doesn't matter if she denies it or not. Doesn't matter if DNA matches or not. You will still be the legal father.

[danbradster]

I suspect the account was not deactivated, but privacy setting stop you (a blocked person) from seeing it or searching for it.

If you want to check my theory, just create a second account and search for her account name and the account should still show up in the search results. Not that it matters much whether the account still exists.

[ianfowler]

@ fifty two, got the certificate. will it matter that she has also changed her first name? I still know her thai id number. I didn't know i could do that. Do you think i can do that at the Thai embassy in London?

@danbrabster - she has reactivated her account, i'm the only friend missing.

[Mario2008]

At the amphur it should be possible to check if the child is legally of the OP. They should have a register about the parents of the child.

If the child was indeed born during the marriage, he will be named as the father in the records. The mother will need to rectify things, as now she can for example not apply for a passport for the child without the help of the OP, as he is legally the father.

What if she just states that mr X Is the father, can she do that or must the natural father register the birth and baby gets his last name ?

Under the law the OP is the legal father by default. Only an action to repudiate the child will make that different.

[Mario2008]

Having looked at the photo's many times he does not look half Thai have western. Though his complexion is quite fair compared to his mums. It's his age that concerns me and any legal implications possibly involved. The ex has definetely been hiding something in regards to that and has basically cut off all contact from me as soon as I told her he was never the age she had implied. I think she may be worried about legal proceedings, money etc.

I am seeking legal advice and have made initial contact with a law firm Siam Legal, as they have a free initial advice service so may be able to put my mind at rest.

I know that in some countries uncontested divorce is not recognised and i have heard that there can be problems with some here in England.

@ paz @ doctor robert - her son is the innocent party here. i have no wish to cause him any duress. He is a lovely looking kid. But sadly i know the ex wife and what she is like.

@benalibina - no i'm in England.

@Mario2008 - i'm not sure how much i would relish a trip to her local amphur. I have a funny feeling that i would not be shall we say greeted to well by some of her friends if i turned up in Chok Chai and they found out.

No need to go there yourself. If you can not get it from another amphur, you can give someone a power of attorney to get the document for you.

[ianfowler]

Well i've had to go through a lawyer and investigator. The lawyer needs her sons full thai name and id to be able to check DOB but they cannot get that through ex-wifes id. They have suggested i hire an investigator to get it as there is no way the ex-wife will tell me. The lawyer can then carry out checks to see if my concerns are correct and advise me accordingly. Never thought it would be this long winded just to get a D.O.B confirmed.

[FiftyTwo]

Well i've had to go through a lawyer and investigator. The lawyer needs her sons full thai name and id to be able to check DOB but they cannot get that through ex-wifes id. They have suggested i hire an investigator to get it as there is no way the ex-wife will tell me. The lawyer can then carry out checks to see if my concerns are correct and advise me accordingly. Never thought it would be this long winded just to get a D.O.B confirmed.

They are not telling you the truth (to get more money?), or are totally incompetent.

All you need is your marriage or divorce certificate, all details of birht/marriage/death in Thailand are held on the government computer database that is shared with all Amphur offices. The birth will be linked to the marriage no matter what her name changes, her ID number never changes.

[ianfowler]

@ Fiftytwo - I went to Siam Legal which seemed to be a big law firm. So are you saying that with my divorce cert and her id number they can check for childs DOB? They told me that without the ex's permission they could not get a birth cert etc. They said once they had the childs id and full thai name they could "verbally" confirm DOB.

The investigator has said there was a central database which was where they would do the check via house registration address etc.

[FiftyTwo]

The central database can be accessed from any Amphur office, by any Amphur employee.

If the child was born when you were married or within 9 months of divorce, then the child is legally yours and any Amphur office will give you the information you are legally entitled to have.

Most legal firms have a 'friend' in an Amphur office, 500-1000bht and the 'friend' will give them the information, entitled or not. They would only need the mother's ID number (on your marriage/divorce cert.)

They appear to be giving you some sort of 'runaround' for information that is cheap and easy for almost anyone to access.

Edited October 13, 2013 by FiftyTwo

[NanLaew]

@ Fiftytwo - I went to Siam Legal which seemed to be a big law firm. So are you saying that with my divorce cert and her id number they can check for childs DOB? They told me that without the ex's permission they could not get a birth cert etc. They said once they had the childs id and full thai name they could "verbally" confirm DOB.

The investigator has said there was a central database which was where they would do the check via house registration address etc.

Tell whatever paper shuffler you are dealing with at Siam Legal to try harder. Infants and children won't have any ID until they are (I think) 7 years old. What use would any 'verbal' confirmation of DOB have if you are seeking further legal redress?

Try another lawyer?

Good luck.

[FiftyTwo]

@ Fiftytwo - I went to Siam Legal which seemed to be a big law firm. So are you saying that with my divorce cert and her id number they can check for childs DOB? They told me that without the ex's permission they could not get a birth cert etc. They said once they had the childs id and full thai name they could "verbally" confirm DOB.

The investigator has said there was a central database which was where they would do the check via house registration address etc.

Tell whatever paper shuffler you are dealing with at Siam Legal to try harder. Infants and children won't have any ID until they are (I think) 7 years old. What use would any 'verbal' confirmation of DOB have if you are seeking further legal redress?

Try another lawyer?

Good luck.

Children's ID numbers are issued at birth and printed on their Thai birth certificate, and their Tabian Baan house book.