Thailand: Groups back moves to block smoking

[hanno]

Here for example:

Spanish doctors say e-cigarettes no safer than the real thing

LIKE THIS ARTICLE13

By Anne Sewell

Oct 1, 2013 - 9 hours ago in Health

5 236 27 1 Google +3

+

Madrid - Spain's Association of Pneumology and Thoracic Surgery, a top Spanish medical association, is warning that the vapor of e-cigarettes has pretty much the same bad effects as regular cigarettes.

Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/359421#ixzz2gXavKxcO

This doctor is an idiot. In the future she will be compared to the Doctors from decades ago who said smoking regular cigarettes is good for your health.

Right, ****Flame removed****:

Electronic cigarettes harm the lung

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/249784.php

Electronic cigarettes contain chemical that make some "as harmful as real cigarettes:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2402108/E-cigarettes-harmful-cigarettes-cause-cancer-claims-study.html

France, FDA wanrs of health risks

http://www.examiner.com/article/e-cigarettes-health-france-fda-warns-of-health-risks-posed-by-e-cigarettes

Edited October 2, 2013 by metisdead

[Thai at Heart]

First a disclosure - I smoke.

The various rants about smoking in bars & restaurants here in Thailand are pointed in the wrong direction. It is against the law & if the owner/manager is allowing it inside, the police are the ones to (supposedly) apply the law.

Adding to the 'scary' pictures on fag packets is nothing but a facade to get at the manufacturers & will have little or no effect on smokers, except to make it more difficult to identify a preferred brand. The anti-smoking crowd like to get publicity for their efforts but don't tackle the real problems.

First, in order to prevent under-aged youths from starting or persisting, the direct selling to them needs to be stopped. Further, the selling of plastic bags of 3 cigs is probably the worst possible contribution to starters. Both are illegal but need a police force that enforces the law, something sadly lacking here.

The second way is to increase the price as locally made cigarettes are cheap here. Don't overdo it or smuggling will mushroom from a relatively minor activity (with cigs) now.

It is the brand recognition that these warnings cause damage to. People recognise brands, and if they can't find them on the shelf, they will buy something else. The manufacturers know, that once a smoker buys a certain amount of packets of a competing brand they have a given chance that they will switch. This is one of the few ways to grow your brand. The warnings on the pack dissuade virtually NO ONE from taking up or continuing to smoke.

So in essence, by covering up the pack and removing the branding, it can have the odd effect of, the consumer saying "I don't care what I smoke, just give me the cheapest one'.

Oddly, there are good quality and bad quality cigarettes and this is basically reflected in the sale price. It could be that the effect of these massive warnings that a smoker is being pushed into smoking marginally more damaging cigarettes.

Edited October 2, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[ukrules]

Here for example:

Spanish doctors say e-cigarettes no safer than the real thing

LIKE THIS ARTICLE13

By Anne Sewell

Oct 1, 2013 - 9 hours ago in Health

5 236 27 1 Google +3

+

Madrid - Spain's Association of Pneumology and Thoracic Surgery, a top Spanish medical association, is warning that the vapor of e-cigarettes has pretty much the same bad effects as regular cigarettes.

Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/359421#ixzz2gXavKxcO

This doctor is an idiot. In the future she will be compared to the Doctors from decades ago who said smoking regular cigarettes is good for your health.

Right, ****Flame removed****:

Electronic cigarettes harm the lung

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/249784.php

Electronic cigarettes contain chemical that make some "as harmful as real cigarettes:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2402108/E-cigarettes-harmful-cigarettes-cause-cancer-claims-study.html

France, FDA wanrs of health risks

http://www.examiner.com/article/e-cigarettes-health-france-fda-warns-of-health-risks-posed-by-e-cigarettes

There are trace amounts of carcinogens in many e-cigarettes but compared to smoking normal cigarettes the levels are much lower.

There's also trace amounts of carcinogens on lots of cooked food as they form during cooking.

The research paper is here, it's not free for the full paper but there is a summary and the second link is an article based on the research in the first link :

http://tobaccocontrol.bmj.com/content/early/2013/03/05/tobaccocontrol-2012-050859.abstract

http://acsh.org/2013/03/new-data-on-safety-of-e-cigarettes/

There's between 9 and 450 times LESS carcinogenic content in e-cigarettes than in regular cigarettes.

Further analysis here :

http://tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/new-study-of-electronic-cigarette-vapor.html

The issue facing the e-cigarette industry is that the juice ingredients must be regulated and listed. I'm sure some of the cheaper nicotine juices contain more contaminents than others. I'm referring to some of the cheap Chinese brands which do have some dubious and seemingly unnecessary ingredients in them.

One interesting thing about the 'juices' used in modern e-cigarettes is that different strengths based on nicotine content can be purchased in order to allow people to 'taper off' their nicotine dependency should they wish to.

[bigbamboo]

I quit smoking last week by reading a book.

I know that it sounds crazy but it is the truth.

I am on my 5th day and nicotine free.

Didn't use patches or e-cigarettes or gums. nothing at all.

After 30+ years of addiction I quit cold turkey.

I am so very grateful to Allen Carr , whose method to stop smoking

has helped millions of smokers quit smoking and find freedom from cigarettes.

His book changed my life 'cause I just KNOW that I won't smoke a fag ever again

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWnuTnIxfi0

If you wish to quit please read this book, it is free to download and in pdf format:

EASY WAY TO STOP SMOKING by Allen Carr

http://media.wix.com/ugd/74fa87_2010cc5496521431188f905b7234a829.pdf

Nicotine addiction is a terrible, terrible thing.

After you quit please share this link, many people out there need help.

Thanks!

Sounds amazing but sadly it would never work here.

Thais.... read a book?

[Thai at Heart]

I quit smoking last week by reading a book.

I know that it sounds crazy but it is the truth.

I am on my 5th day and nicotine free.

Didn't use patches or e-cigarettes or gums. nothing at all.

After 30+ years of addiction I quit cold turkey.

I am so very grateful to Allen Carr , whose method to stop smoking

has helped millions of smokers quit smoking and find freedom from cigarettes.

His book changed my life 'cause I just KNOW that I won't smoke a fag ever again

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWnuTnIxfi0

If you wish to quit please read this book, it is free to download and in pdf format:

EASY WAY TO STOP SMOKING by Allen Carr

http://media.wix.com/ugd/74fa87_2010cc5496521431188f905b7234a829.pdf

Nicotine addiction is a terrible, terrible thing.

After you quit please share this link, many people out there need help.

Thanks!

Sounds amazing but sadly it would never work here.

Thais.... read a book?

I would hazard it wouldn't translate into Thai very well either.

[HerbalEd]

I don't know about Europe or Thailand, but in USA the tobacco companies are exempt from having to list the ingredients on cigarette packages. The cigarettes contain many more ingredients besides tobacco, but you are not allowed to know what they are. But, maybe you who smoke trust the tobacco companies to do the right thing.

Neither the USDA or FDA regulate tobacco products in USA. That's done by ATF (Burea of Alcohol, Tobacco & Firearms) and they do little to nothing regarding safety of tobacco products. And how did the tobacco companies get this sweet, minimal-regulation deal? By what I call legal corruption: lobbying and campaign finance.

If you need any more reason to quit smoking beyond the sake of your health, try no longer being the manipulated fool of the tobacco industry.

Edited October 2, 2013 by HerbalEd

[transam]

I like a ciggy, my three Thai chums, two are physical education teachers, and one is a Health teacher all like a ciggy.

We do what we want until our time is up.

[nisakiman]

So many of the posts here refer to smokers "subjecting me to your toxic fumes..." etc etc.

Sorry guys, but you've been duped, gulled and indoctrinated with a large pile of steaming bullshit.

There is no toxicity to SHS in the quantities you are ever likely to encounter, even in a really smokey bar (first rule of toxicology - 'the dose makes the poison'). The only reason you believe it is harmful is because a hardcore group of fanatical zealots who are awash with countless millions of funding have been on a propaganda spree for the last three decades. They have been relentlessly broadcasting lies, misinformation and exaggeration through every media channel available. They cherry-pick the stats they want (and usually twist those), and ignore the facts which don't fit their agenda. They care not one iota for the damage they cause, nor for truth: "The end justifies the means" is their ethos; "Think of the children" is their guilt-tripping rallying cry.

However, if you look at the actual results of all the research that has been done on ETS (Environmental Tobacco Smoke), you will see that the RR value (Relative Risk) is insignificant.

http://www.nycclash.com/Philly.html#ETSTable

"It should be noted that of these 25 studies NONE reach the RR 3.0 level where inferences could possibly be drawn regarding increased risk. Only ONE shows a statistically significant risk (RR 2.29) while ONE shows a statistically significant REDUCED risk (RR 0.78) (Suggesting a beneficial effect.) The remainder are NOT statistically significant, suggesting neither risk nor benefit. NINE of these lean toward weak increased risk and THIRTEEN suggest a weak beneficial effect. The overall picture suggests, if anything, that ETS is beneficial to childrens health, but as with all epidemiological study It is suggested by many that only statistical correlation's can be shown and ‘correlation’ does NOT equal ‘causation’.

The overall ‘scientific consensus’ on ETS ‘harm’ suggested by the anti-smoker industry, depending upon which studies are included/ excluded from analysis, concludes that ETS raises risk of ill health. There are various ‘consensus’ figures suggested, eg RR’s of 1.16, 1.21, 1.33, equating to between 16% and 33% increased risk (there may be others). To the layman, this may look like damning evidence, but it indicates ‘increased risk’ NOT ‘actual risk’ and many do not understand the difference. A simple analogy explains the principle; If you buy one lottery ticket, your chance (risk) of winning the jackpot is ‘X’, if you then buy another you increase your chances (raised risk) of winning by 100%. The chance (‘actual risk’) of winning is somewhat different. Even If we accept these anti-smoker figures as definitive, the actual risk is minute.

For perspective It is worthwhile to make comparisons with other ‘health risks’ ;
Butter: RR 1.44 (CI 1.16, 1.80) - 44% increased risk
Eggs: RR 1.53 (CI 1.02, 2.31) - 53% increased risk
Liver: RR 1.68 (CI 1.29, 2.19) - 68% increased risk
Whole Milk: significant increase in risk up to RR 2.64 - 164% increased risk"

http://kin-free.blogspot.co.uk/

Non-smokers may not much like the smell of tobacco (although that too is a recent phenomenon born of the "smokers stink" propaganda - thirty years ago, nobody minded, or indeed noticed smoke), but it certainly isn't 'poisoning' you.

There will come a point in the future when the whole SHS scam will fall apart, just as the AGW scam is falling apart now. You can fool some of the people all of the time, and you can fool all of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all the people all the time.

The smoking bans have been socially divisive and economically disastrous, particularly in the colder countries. Businesses have been destroyed; in the UK alone over 13,000 pubs have closed since the ban (the rate of closures quadrupled immediately in the wake of the ban) and something in the region of 150,000 - 200,000 jobs have been lost; homes have been repossessed; families and friends have been set against each other and 25% of the population have been set up as legitimate targets for bigotry and discrimination. All so some misguided zealots can pursue their warped ideology of an unattainable 'smoke-free society'.

The sooner common sense prevails on this subject, the better the world will be.

[marcusd]

Just ban the product.

banning causes black market operations. Look at bootlegging. In the USA in the 30's

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

[ukrules]

Just ban the product.

banning causes black market operations. Look at bootlegging. In the USA in the 30's

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

It's also too lucrative to ban.

For example in the UK where the excuse of 'smokers being a drain on the NHS' is often used people don't consider that the Duty and VAT received by the Treasury is much more each year than the entire cost to the government of running the NHS, all of it.

I did some basic research on this a few years back and the shortfall would be enormous if cigarettes were simply made illegal. With e-cigarettes gaining usage the nightmare scenario for the government is becoming a reality. They are going to lose their massive duty/tax windfalls from cigarette sales and there's not a lot they can do to prevent it from happening.

[Thai at Heart]

Just ban the product.

banning causes black market operations. Look at bootlegging. In the USA in the 30's

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

It's also too lucrative to ban.

For example in the UK where the excuse of 'smokers being a drain on the NHS' is often used people don't consider that the Duty and VAT received by the Treasury is much more each year than the entire cost to the government of running the NHS, all of it.

I did some basic research on this a few years back and the shortfall would be enormous if cigarettes were simply made illegal. With e-cigarettes gaining usage the nightmare scenario for the government is becoming a reality. They are going to lose their massive duty/tax windfalls from cigarette sales and there's not a lot they can do to prevent it from happening.

And that is going to be a massive problem. The major cigarette manufacturers are already getting into the market. Just imagine, a bar or pub where everyone can smoke e-cigs. The brewers will love it, the bars will love it, the fag manufacturers will love it. The government will HATE it.

[user82374298374]

>>See my post above. Seems like the smokers of electronic cigarette smokers do not get a "get out of jail free" card after all......

What they're saying is completely untrue. As someone who smoked cigarettes for 25 years and who then moved to e-cigarettes, I can tell you that my lung function has improved dramatically. I have more energy, no hacking cough, etc.

There are some 'doctor's groups' in some countries like Spain and India (and Thailand, I'm sure) who will make these bogus claims either because they frown upon all types of inhalation, or because they're being paid by the local tobacco monopolies/regulators who collect taxes from the local tobacco monopolies, or both.

But my personal experience is that e-cigarettes aren't nearly as harmful as smoking tobacco cigarettes. And nicotine in the minute quantities that are present in the liquid used in e-cigarettes is not carcinogenic, whilst all the cancer-causing chemicals tobacco cigarettes are laced with simply aren't present.

[Faranguy]

Smoking needs to be banned from movies. this is the main method of advertising and the movie companies get paid handsomely for it

[nisakiman]

This was posted today on a blog I read.

That Irish plain packs study

Last week I wrote about the latest plain packs study which is the same as all the other plain pack studies, ie. it's a survey that asks teenagers whether they think ugly packs look ugly.

I'm very grateful to a reader who has managed to prise this unpublished effort from the hands of the state-funded charities that commissioned it. I won't say it makes for fascinating reading, but there are some telling moments which undermine the already-weak claims made on its behalf.

http://velvetgloveironfist.blogspot.com/2013/10/that-irish-plain-packs-study.html

Edited October 2, 2013 by metisdead
Edited as per fair use policy.

[culicine]

Of course electronic cigarettes are just as bad as the real thing......

Raise the price to USD 25.00 like in Oz and a lot less people will smoke.

Yep, my mum gave up recently...just couldn't afford it as a pensioner in OZ. Tax the guts out of them....it's really the only way to reduce smoking.....when the only choice is putting food on the table for their kids or smoking, people will need to choose.

[ableguy]

at

Electronic cigarettes are the future. If the governmet unban the sale of liquid nicotine in Thailand it will really take off and potentially replace the cigarette industry.

It's already happening elsewhere. Only recently (last day or two) a huge American tobacco company Lorillard purchased a British e-cigarette company for $49 Million with further large cash payments in a few years time should certain sales targets be met. They are not the first traditional tobacco company to buy up smaller but rapidly growing electronic cigarette manufacturers.

Why ? They know the writing is on the wall and an unstoppable disruption is in motion. It won't be long before we see the first country completely ban cigarettes in favour of e-cigarettes. That first country could well be Australia but only time will tell.

The reason : cigarettes are dying out due to new technology which is of course banned on Thailand.

My prediction is that within the next 5 years or so nearly every smoker will be using electronic cigarettes. People are changing over at an exopnential rate.

I hope in the next five years people just wise up and toss this shi t in the bin . tobbaco that is along with electronic cigs imagine seeing a cat or dog puffing on this shit ? what would you think ?

[Thai at Heart]

>>See my post above. Seems like the smokers of electronic cigarette smokers do not get a "get out of jail free" card after all......

What they're saying is completely untrue. As someone who smoked cigarettes for 25 years and who then moved to e-cigarettes, I can tell you that my lung function has improved dramatically. I have more energy, no hacking cough, etc.

There are some 'doctor's groups' in some countries like Spain and India (and Thailand, I'm sure) who will make these bogus claims either because they frown upon all types of inhalation, or because they're being paid by the local tobacco monopolies/regulators who collect taxes from the local tobacco monopolies, or both.

But my personal experience is that e-cigarettes aren't nearly as harmful as smoking tobacco cigarettes. And nicotine in the minute quantities that are present in the liquid used in e-cigarettes is not carcinogenic, whilst all the cancer-causing chemicals tobacco cigarettes are laced with simply aren't present.

That is as maybe. Until it's proven and approved, anecdotal evidence doesn't make much difference.

I recon it may be safer too, but they said that about light cigarettes which was twaddle for example.

[ableguy]

I quit smoking last week by reading a book.

I know that it sounds crazy but it is the truth.

I am on my 5th day and nicotine free.

Didn't use patches or e-cigarettes or gums. nothing at all.

After 30+ years of addiction I quit cold turkey.

I am so very grateful to Allen Carr , whose method to stop smoking

has helped millions of smokers quit smoking and find freedom from cigarettes.

His book changed my life 'cause I just KNOW that I won't smoke a fag ever again

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWnuTnIxfi0

If you wish to quit please read this book, it is free to download and in pdf format:

EASY WAY TO STOP SMOKING by Allen Carr[/size]

http://media.wix.com/ugd/74fa87_2010cc5496521431188f905b7234a829.pdf

Nicotine addiction is a terrible, terrible thing.

After you quit please share this link, many people out there need help.

Thanks!

Hope you stay clean, I myself have been for five years cold turkey but the benefits are unreal the strange thing is I cannot now understand why I ever smoked in the first place,

[MAJIC]

Smoking and Tobacco Products are a large part of most countries economy, it's wishful thinking to hope smoking will be banned everywhere, we are talking losing colossal taxes here,until the big tax hole get's filled,forget it!,and also not to mention the job losses within the Industry,and yet more tax losses.

[nisakiman]

Of course electronic cigarettes are just as bad as the real thing......

Raise the price to USD 25.00 like in Oz and a lot less people will smoke.

Yep, my mum gave up recently...just couldn't afford it as a pensioner in OZ. Tax the guts out of them....it's really the only way to reduce smoking.....when the only choice is putting food on the table for their kids or smoking, people will need to choose.

And why the hell should anybody be forced to choose? Unless you are from an Amazonian tribe that has no contact with the outside world, you can't help but be aware of the alleged dangers of smoking. Just as mountaineers are aware of the dangers of climbing, and footballers (particularly professionals) are aware of the risks of serious injury. It's your life, and how you choose to live it is nobody's business but your own. Who the hell do you think you are to seek to impose your own personal morality on everyone else through the blunt instrument of legislation and taxation? If I enjoy smoking, that's my choice. It's none of your damn business.

[kuiburi]

I remember the joy I felt when I went to a huge club/bar in Chicago after they banned smoking everywhere. It was easy to breathe. I had a much better time and I didn't smell like a$$tray after I left. Occasionally I would partake of the evil cigarette when I would drink. Making the other 95% that don't smoke inhale it is just silly. Go outside <deleted>. I would like to see this happen in Thailand. Smoking is not cool anymore. It's is so 2490's (1950's)

Last time i went to a pub in Amsterdam , the bar was almost empty , no smoking allowed , then i discovered the smoking room all in the back . In there it was partytime it was packed with smokers and non smokers because it had the great old fashion atmospfere .

So if u go to Amsterdam enjoy a boring time at the smokefree bar .

since mankind discovered fire they smoke . Before that , they had the papyrusplant and Tobacco , but no fire yet , that must have been a hell of a time .

That is because in Amsterdam the go to the back bar to smoke Ganja!

Not allowed to smoke ganja in normal pubs or clubs , there are special coffeshops for .

[Thai at Heart]

Of course electronic cigarettes are just as bad as the real thing......

Raise the price to USD 25.00 like in Oz and a lot less people will smoke.

Yep, my mum gave up recently...just couldn't afford it as a pensioner in OZ. Tax the guts out of them....it's really the only way to reduce smoking.....when the only choice is putting food on the table for their kids or smoking, people will need to choose.

And why the hell should anybody be forced to choose? Unless you are from an Amazonian tribe that has no contact with the outside world, you can't help but be aware of the alleged dangers of smoking. Just as mountaineers are aware of the dangers of climbing, and footballers (particularly professionals) are aware of the risks of serious injury. It's your life, and how you choose to live it is nobody's business but your own. Who the hell do you think you are to seek to impose your own personal morality on everyone else through the blunt instrument of legislation and taxation? If I enjoy smoking, that's my choice. It's none of your dam_n business.

Everyone is completely aware of the dangers.

It's a legal addiction. Plain and simple. It's not particularly pleasurable and deep down 95% would like to quit. It is extremely addictive so a bit of sympathy to help people who want to quit goes a long way.

And I went cold 3 weeks ago, after working for the industry for a long time. It really makes no sense at all but, people will say they enjoy it, but it is a stretch to say enjoy....

Edited October 2, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[nisakiman]

Of course electronic cigarettes are just as bad as the real thing......

Raise the price to USD 25.00 like in Oz and a lot less people will smoke.

Yep, my mum gave up recently...just couldn't afford it as a pensioner in OZ. Tax the guts out of them....it's really the only way to reduce smoking.....when the only choice is putting food on the table for their kids or smoking, people will need to choose.

And why the hell should anybody be forced to choose? Unless you are from an Amazonian tribe that has no contact with the outside world, you can't help but be aware of the alleged dangers of smoking. Just as mountaineers are aware of the dangers of climbing, and footballers (particularly professionals) are aware of the risks of serious injury. It's your life, and how you choose to live it is nobody's business but your own. Who the hell do you think you are to seek to impose your own personal morality on everyone else through the blunt instrument of legislation and taxation? If I enjoy smoking, that's my choice. It's none of your dam_n business.

Everyone is completely aware of the dangers.

It's a legal addiction. Plain and simple. It's not particularly pleasurable and deep down 95% would like to quit. It is extremely addictive so a bit of sympathy to help people who want to quit goes a long way.

And I went cold 3 weeks ago, after working for the industry for a long time. It really makes no sense at all but, people will say they enjoy it, but it is a stretch to say enjoy....

I have to disagree with you there, TaH. I smoke because I really do enjoy it. And so do most smokers who have ignored the siren calls of the righteous moralisers who want all smokers to feel guilty about it.

It's not a slavish addiction. People give up smoking all the time with very little effort. I have had a couple of periods in my life when I've gone for a year or more without smoking, simply because I became bored with it at that time. No drama, I just stopped.

But those who give up smoking fall into two groups. There are those who give up for reasons of their own, and because they really don't want to smoke anymore. Those people generally have no problem with giving up, and they also have no problem with people who continue to smoke.

The other group are those who have succumbed to the pressures of the Tobacco Control Industry; who have been hectored and harassed and pressured into thinking that they have no choice but to give up, that as smokers they are somehow sub-human. They believe the propaganda. They want to be part of the mainstream orthodoxy again, to be accepted back into the majority. This group finds it a real struggle to quit, and if and when they finally do stop, they are the group that become the most intolerant haters of all things smoking related. It is this group that post comments about smokers 'stinking', and how they should be forced by law and taxation into quitting. And even that they should be shot (yes, I've seen many comments along those lines, even here on TV). The psychopathic hatred of smokers comes from the fact that they didn't really want to quit - they were forced to by the pressures of the hate propaganda they'd been brainwashed with, so they in turn project that hatred onto others who continue to smoke, those who haven't succumbed to that same propaganda.

And that is the reason for my antagonism towards the Tobacco Control Industry. They manipulate people through lies and deception. They shamelessly use "the cheeldren" to try to instill guilt. They are totally amoral.

I'm not actually a militant pro-smoker, but I am a militant supporter of freedom of choice. And our freedoms are being eroded by these self-appointed guardians of our morals, using a salami-slice approach. Whenever they gain ground, they want more. They will never be satiated, And I detest being lied to, particularly by people who should know better and are in a position of responsibility.

[HerbalEd]

Of course electronic cigarettes are just as bad as the real thing......

Raise the price to USD 25.00 like in Oz and a lot less people will smoke.

Yep, my mum gave up recently...just couldn't afford it as a pensioner in OZ. Tax the guts out of them....it's really the only way to reduce smoking.....when the only choice is putting food on the table for their kids or smoking, people will need to choose.

And why the hell should anybody be forced to choose? Unless you are from an Amazonian tribe that has no contact with the outside world, you can't help but be aware of the alleged dangers of smoking. Just as mountaineers are aware of the dangers of climbing, and footballers (particularly professionals) are aware of the risks of serious injury. It's your life, and how you choose to live it is nobody's business but your own. Who the hell do you think you are to seek to impose your own personal morality on everyone else through the blunt instrument of legislation and taxation? If I enjoy smoking, that's my choice. It's none of your dam_n business.

I fully agree, but when someone's smoke invades my personal space when I'm in a public place then it becomes my business. I'm sick and tired of having my dinner spoiled ... or having to move ... because a selfish twit lights up at the table next to me.

If smokers would practice common courtesy and respect for others then they would not be so demonized by non smokers. Unfortunately very few seem to get it ... or they just don't care. But I say bravo and thanks to the ones that do.

[hanno]

Smoking and Tobacco Products are a large part of most countries economy, it's wishful thinking to hope smoking will be banned everywhere, we are talking losing colossal taxes here,until the big tax hole get's filled,forget it!,and also not to mention the job losses within the Industry,and yet more tax losses.

I just do not think that this is true, much repeated as it is. I believe the bill that governments pay in health care and dealing with smoking-related diseases offsets any taxes earned. Same is true for alcohol; I figure it is more big business doing very effective lobbying work.

[singa-traz]

.... Yep, my mum gave up recently...just couldn't afford it as a pensioner in OZ. Tax the guts out of them....it's really the only way to reduce smoking.....when the only choice is putting food on the table for their kids or smoking, people will need to choose.

And why the hell should anybody be forced to choose? Unless you are from an Amazonian tribe that has no contact with the outside world, you can't help but be aware of the alleged dangers of smoking. Just as mountaineers are aware of the dangers of climbing, and footballers (particularly professionals) are aware of the risks of serious injury. It's your life, and how you choose to live it is nobody's business but your own. Who the hell do you think you are to seek to impose your own personal morality on everyone else through the blunt instrument of legislation and taxation? If I enjoy smoking, that's my choice. It's none of your dam_n business.

At your first chemotherapy session, you might change your opinion, but in the meantime, enjoy smoking.

For some people, it takes the loss of a loved one, to quit smoking.

[doremifasol]

I quit smoking last week by reading a book.

I know that it sounds crazy but it is the truth.

I am on my 5th day and nicotine free. alt=biggrin.png width=20 height=20>

Didn't use patches or e-cigarettes or gums. nothing at all.

After 30+ years of addiction I quit cold turkey.

I am so very grateful to Allen Carr alt=wai2.gif> , whose method to stop smoking

has helped millions of smokers quit smoking and find freedom from cigarettes.

His book changed my life 'cause I just KNOW that I won't smoke a fag ever again alt=clap2.gif width=31 height=25>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWnuTnIxfi0

If you wish to quit please read this book, it is free to download and in pdf format:

EASY WAY TO STOP SMOKING by Allen Carr

http://media.wix.com/ugd/74fa87_2010cc5496521431188f905b7234a829.pdf

Nicotine addiction is a terrible, terrible thing.

After you quit please share this link, many people out there need help.

Thanks!

Sounds amazing but sadly it would never work here.

Thais.... read a book?

No problem about that, they can quit smoking by watching the webcast :

http://www.theeasywaytostopsmoking.com/Webcast.aspx

It comes with a price but it is worth every penny.

Edited October 3, 2013 by doremifasol

[doremifasol]

I quit smoking last week by reading a book.

I know that it sounds crazy but it is the truth.

I am on my 5th day and nicotine free. src="http://static.thaivisa.com/forum//public/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.png" alt=biggrin.png>

Didn't use patches or e-cigarettes or gums. nothing at all.

After 30+ years of addiction I quit cold turkey.

I am so very grateful to Allen Carr src="http://3-ps.googleusercontent.com/x/www.thaivisa.com/static.thaivisa.com/forum//public/style_emoticons/default/wai2.gif.pagespeed.ce.goigDuXn4X.gif" alt=wai2.gif width=20 height=20> , whose method to stop smoking

has helped millions of smokers quit smoking and find freedom from cigarettes.

His book changed my life 'cause I just KNOW that I won't smoke a fag ever again src="http://3-ps.googleusercontent.com/x/www.thaivisa.com/static.thaivisa.com/forum//public/style_emoticons/default/clap2.gif.pagespeed.ce.z5euFoXm0J.gif" alt=clap2.gif width=31 height=25>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWnuTnIxfi0

If you wish to quit please read this book, it is free to download and in pdf format:

EASY WAY TO STOP SMOKING by Allen Carr[/size]

http://media.wix.com/ugd/74fa87_2010cc5496521431188f905b7234a829.pdf

Nicotine addiction is a terrible, terrible thing.

After you quit please share this link, many people out there need help.

Thanks!

Hope you stay clean, I myself have been for five years cold turkey but the benefits are unreal the strange thing is I cannot now understand why I ever smoked in the first place,

Thank you, I stay clean.

I cannot now understand why I ever smoked in the first place

I like that, well done!!

[MAJIC]

Smoking and Tobacco Products are a large part of most countries economy, it's wishful thinking to hope smoking will be banned everywhere, we are talking losing colossal taxes here,until the big tax hole get's filled,forget it!,and also not to mention the job losses within the Industry,and yet more tax losses.

I just do not think that this is true, much repeated as it is. I believe the bill that governments pay in health care and dealing with smoking-related diseases offsets any taxes earned. Same is true for alcohol; I figure it is more big business doing very effective lobbying work.

According to this article from the BBC,which does not back up your argument, in fact the Tax Revenue vs the NHS Burdon is as follows: Tax Revenue = 9.3 Billion

Burdon of treatment cost to the UK NHS =1.5 Billion. Clearly Smokers are paying for their own treatment indirectly, and also are an asset to the Tax Payer who does not need to pay the differential in Taxes of: 7.8 Billion annually!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3292979.stm

Edited October 3, 2013 by MAJIC