What do you think?

[Docno]

Geez, when I saw the subject I line, I thought the child had been caned or something. Turns out to be a lousy haircut, and yet people are advocating going to the police, making a human rights complaint, assaulting the teacher/director, etc etc. When I was a kid/teen, we used to get the 'cuts' from our teachers, i.e., a caning of up to six strokes on the hand. Parents never thought twice about it. Neither did we. We knew it was the price you paid if you broke the rules (and got caught). I certainly wasn't 'damaged' by the experience, and my friends and I turned out just fine.

Now it's a haircut instead of the cuts, and people are screaming for blood. It's a different world...

I think the only way you got "damaged", was by not realizing that times and rules have actually changed, since you were young...

Apparently so, because now it seems to be ok to physically assault someone as a response to situations like this. Better world is it?

[rwdrwdrwd]

Just had my Thai-girlfriend see the pictures... She would do that following if it was her son:

- Go to the director and require him to pay a min. of THB 50.000 in compensation, if he as the Director and the school wanted to avoid more trouble. As she clearly said "The schools can not do this anymore".

If he did not pay up and apologies, then she would go to the media with the pictures and do everything for the Director and School to lose face.

Well, that was the Thai point of view...

(Personally, I would not do that black-mailing thing, but obviously a Thai person would and on the other hand, it would hurt the director having to pay up) If I was you, I would do it Thai-style, because the Director is at fault and can get in trouble for this, if you follow up on it)

I hope this is true and I hope the OP does it, if nothing else it might make the director think twice in regard to their boy in the future. I'm not sure how I would react were it my son to be honest.. but I wouldn't ignore it that's for sure, and the first person I'd be going to see is the culprit face to face without appointment.

[khunpa]

Geez, when I saw the subject I line, I thought the child had been caned or something. Turns out to be a lousy haircut, and yet people are advocating going to the police, making a human rights complaint, assaulting the teacher/director, etc etc. When I was a kid/teen, we used to get the 'cuts' from our teachers, i.e., a caning of up to six strokes on the hand. Parents never thought twice about it. Neither did we. We knew it was the price you paid if you broke the rules (and got caught). I certainly wasn't 'damaged' by the experience, and my friends and I turned out just fine.

Now it's a haircut instead of the cuts, and people are screaming for blood. It's a different world...

I think the only way you got "damaged", was by not realizing that times and rules have actually changed, since you were young...

Apparently so, because now it seems to be ok to physically assault someone as a response to situations like this. Better world is it?

Both things are no longer allowed in Thai Schools. Therefore the OP should also react on this, since what the Director has done is wrong and against the law here.

I was also physically punished, when I went to school and also by my dad. However, I can not recall learning anything from that... besides hating school and my dad.

[StreetCowboy]

I think the OP needs to consider if he is moving his child to a different school or not, because the Principal probabaly is not moving. If he's going to move, then he can more or less do what he wants, with no real benefit. If he is planning on keeping his child at that school, then he really has to decide whether he can force the principal out quickly or not, because it doesn't seem fair to subject the child to being a footsoldier in a long-running trenchwar between the parent and the principal.

SC

[khunpa]

I think the OP needs to consider if he is moving his child to a different school or not, because the Principal probabaly is not moving. If he's going to move, then he can more or less do what he wants, with no real benefit. If he is planning on keeping his child at that school, then he really has to decide whether he can force the principal out quickly or not, because it doesn't seem fair to subject the child to being a footsoldier in a long-running trenchwar between the parent and the principal.

SC

Agree, moving school should be considered. But for sure the Director of the school, should be held responsible also and should "pay" for doing this.

I however doubt very much that the Director will do anything to the child, if the father reacts properly on this.

Both the Director and school will lose face big time, if this gets media attention.

[khunpa]

Just had my Thai-girlfriend see the pictures... She would do that following if it was her son:

- Go to the director and require him to pay a min. of THB 50.000 in compensation, if he as the Director and the school wanted to avoid more trouble. As she clearly said "The schools can not do this anymore".

If he did not pay up and apologies, then she would go to the media with the pictures and do everything for the Director and School to lose face.

Well, that was the Thai point of view...

(Personally, I would not do that black-mailing thing, but obviously a Thai person would and on the other hand, it would hurt the director having to pay up) If I was you, I would do it Thai-style, because the Director is at fault and can get in trouble for this, if you follow up on it)

I hope this is true and I hope the OP does it, if nothing else it might make the director think twice in regard to their boy in the future. I'm not sure how I would react were it my son to be honest.. but I wouldn't ignore it that's for sure, and the first person I'd be going to see is the culprit face to face without appointment.

I agree, that hair cut is WAY over the limit and looking at the pictures, it also seems the boy is quite young, which makes even a better case and media story.

The fact that it is the school director and not a normal teacher, even benefits OPs case further.

[StreetCowboy]

I think the OP needs to consider if he is moving his child to a different school or not, because the Principal probabaly is not moving. If he's going to move, then he can more or less do what he wants, with no real benefit. If he is planning on keeping his child at that school, then he really has to decide whether he can force the principal out quickly or not, because it doesn't seem fair to subject the child to being a footsoldier in a long-running trenchwar between the parent and the principal.

SC

Agree, moving school should be considered. But for sure the Director of the school, should be held responsible also and should "pay" for doing this.

I however doubt very much that the Director will do anything to the child, if the father reacts properly on this.

Both the Director and school will lose face big time, if this gets media attention.

We can all say 'should' but I think the parent should only take this forward if he is willing to fight to the death over a hair cut. Or does he want his child to be called "haircut" for the rest of his school career? The haircut will grow out quickly. The fight will not. If the parent is petty and vindictive, then better to batter the principal years later, when his son has graduated.

SC

[DGIE]

Your son might have been told to have his hair cut many times before but he forgot to tell you.

What case are you going to file for the teacher who did it if you complain?

Bring your son out from the school. Maybe teachers in another school allow long hair.

[DGIE]

me for sure feel bad too when somebody did that to my son

[rwdrwdrwd]

I mentioned this to my wife earlier (in a sentence where I reiterated that our son is NOT going to a Thai school) and her reaction to the hair cutting was 'yeah. that does happen..' but her reaction on seeing the photo was very much that this is much, much worse than is 'normally' done and appears vindictive.

[brit1984]

http://wigthailand.com/

[khunpa]

I mentioned this to my wife earlier (in a sentence where I reiterated that our son is NOT going to a Thai school) and her reaction to the hair cutting was 'yeah. that does happen..' but her reaction on seeing the photo was very much that this is much, much worse than is 'normally' done and appears vindictive.

Exactly the same reaction from my GF. This hair cut is way over the limit and what is normal. I bet you, that any normal Thai would agree on that.

I have seem my stepson (and his friends) been cut by teachers before, but nothing even close to the pictures posted here. That is also my the OP in my opinion (and my GFs) has a VERY good case against the school and the director. This in not a "normal" school hair cut!

[StreetCowboy]

My neds are bigger than your neds

[Skint]

OP the school director has made an arse of your boy, the shame your boy must have felt after it was done must have been awful. Cutting your child's hair is your responsibility not this directors I'd be making that clear to him weather that's by proper channels whatever that may be or by having a word in his ear.

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[yourauntbob]

Sorry, I dont find this to be the tragedy its being made out to be here. Some schools have strict rules on the way the students need to cut their hair, if you dont like it then move your student out of this school.

Many people here are acting as if this is assault. What???? its a bad hair cut. is it really something to press charges against? this type of thinking is why i moved away from the west. everybody is so easily offended, everything is a crime, everyone needs to be politically correct. i read these types of posts and i truly fear for mankind. is this really what we have fallen to? one bad hair cut and we need an army of lawyers to get someone fired? do we not have better things to put our scarce resources to?

i, as all of us, dont know the full story. maybe the kid had been warned a few times (most likely). not a bid deal, cut his hair short and the whole "ordeal" will be over. kids today are to sheltered. the same people making these posts probably wonder why they cant get their kids to behave. i am at a loss for words, lord help us all.

[khunpa]

Sorry, I dont find this to be the tragedy its being made out to be here. Some schools have strict rules on the way the students need to cut their hair, if you dont like it then move your student out of this school.

Many people here are acting as if this is assault. What???? its a bad hair cut. is it really something to press charges against? this type of thinking is why i moved away from the west. everybody is so easily offended, everything is a crime, everyone needs to be politically correct. i read these types of posts and i truly fear for mankind. is this really what we have fallen to? one bad hair cut and we need an army of lawyers to get someone fired? do we not have better things to put our scarce resources to?

i, as all of us, dont know the full story. maybe the kid had been warned a few times (most likely). not a bid deal, cut his hair short and the whole "ordeal" will be over. kids today are to sheltered. the same people making these posts probably wonder why they cant get their kids to behave. i am at a loss for words, lord help us all.

1. It is officially NOT anymore allowed in ANY Thai schools to do this. This has nothing to do with school rules at all. IT IS NOT ALLOWED ANYMORE AT ANY SCHOOLS! and Could there maybe be a valid reason for why it is no longer allowed?

2. That hair cut is WAY beyond any normal school hair cut.

3. Why don't you come by my house and I will be happy to cut your hair the same way as the kid - free of charge. Then lets see how you feel about that.

May the lord help you, for not being able to understand how this kid and his father feels... But again. Come by and I will hold you down and give you the same hair cut. (if you have any hair left)

[mgjackson69]

So much hand-wringing about 'feelings' ... yet still no word from the OP on how traumatized the boy actually is by this.

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[Skint]

So much hand-wringing about 'feelings' ... yet still no word from the OP on how traumatized the boy actually is by this.

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I think it's pretty obvious, being made a <deleted> of at any age is not good.

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[khunpa]

So much hand-wringing about 'feelings' ... yet still no word from the OP on how traumatized the boy actually is by this.

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Well, have a wild guess...

How would you like to have your haircut like that and how do you think the boy felt after? I doubt any normal kid, would enjoy walking around with such a haircut. And do you think the OP would be so angry and upset, if his son was one big smile, when he came home from school?

That haircut is too much... even for Thai standard. The OP should post it on Thai forums. I am sure, you would see that normal Thai-people, also find this way over the limit. A normal Thai school haircut is one thing, but this is beyond what is normal!

[Kangawallafox]

In bkk if a girl has a skirt to short she is made to wear those isaan sarongs all day,even if she is not from isaan.

Regardless of wrong or right your complaint will fall on deaf ears,you will be fed defensive bs in response to your every word and complaint,and nothing will happen,it may paint a target on your child's back in the future as the teacher may lose face and remember he handles the grades and will have the last laugh if you rattle the cage.

You can't tell me it just happened,there must have been warnings first,several.

Perhaps we can adopt the western behavior in schools,everyone can run riot telling teachers to get f&@$d and hit the teachers,or we can accept a little discipline that keeps them in line,respecting teachers and elders as thai's do.

The hair cut is bound to make you angry,but it could of been avoided either by sticking to the regulation haircuts,or not pissing of the teacher if his hair was kosher in the first place.

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[khunpa]

In bkk if a girl has a skirt to short she is made to wear those isaan sarongs all day,even if she is not from isaan.

Regardless of wrong or right your complaint will fall on deaf ears,you will be fed defensive bs in response to your every word and complaint,and nothing will happen,it may paint a target on your child's back in the future as the teacher may lose face and remember he handles the grades and will have the last laugh if you rattle the cage.

You can't tell me it just happened,there must have been warnings first,several.

Perhaps we can adopt the western behavior in schools,everyone can run riot telling teachers to get f&@$d and hit the teachers,or we can accept a little discipline that keeps them in line,respecting teachers and elders as thai's do.

The hair cut is bound to make you angry,but it could of been avoided either by sticking to the regulation haircuts,or not pissing of the teacher if his hair was kosher in the first place.

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I am sorry, but I have now shown the pictures to two Thai people and they both say that haircut is too much and WAY out of line.

Both would react on this and request financial compensation and an apology from the director. If not received, they would go to both the police, the ministry and the media.

Your response is simply not what a Thai person would do in this case and it is not true that there will not be consequences for the director and school, if the father reacts on this. (which I really hope he does, for not only his kid but also the other kids at that school)

[CWMcMurray]

To the OP... It seems a few who have been in your shoes have been successful by complaining to Ministry if Ed and then going to school for apology

If in your shoes, would follow their advise and do the same

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[David48]

In bkk if a girl has a skirt to short she is made to wear those isaan sarongs all day,even if she is not from isaan.

Regardless of wrong or right your complaint will fall on deaf ears,you will be fed defensive bs in response to your every word and complaint,and nothing will happen,it may paint a target on your child's back in the future as the teacher may lose face and remember he handles the grades and will have the last laugh if you rattle the cage.

You can't tell me it just happened,there must have been warnings first,several.

Perhaps we can adopt the western behavior in schools,everyone can run riot telling teachers to get f&@$d and hit the teachers,or we can accept a little discipline that keeps them in line,respecting teachers and elders as thai's do.

The hair cut is bound to make you angry,but it could of been avoided either by sticking to the regulation haircuts,or not pissing of the teacher if his hair was kosher in the first place.

I am sorry, but I have now shown the pictures to two Thai people and they both say that haircut is too much and WAY out of line.

Both would react on this and request financial compensation and an apology from the director. If not received, they would go to both the police, the ministry and the media.

Your response is simply not what a Thai person would do in this case and it is not true that there will not be consequences for the director and school, if the father reacts on this. (which I really hope he does, for not only his kid but also the other kids at that school)

khunpa ... I presume that you told your 2 Thai friends the story of what happened and that you didn't like it.

Did you factor in the fact that their response is to make you feel happy and that they 'agree with you', but privately think something different.

They just tell you what they think you want to hear ... such is the 'face thing'.

BTW ... on what ground would they seek 'financial compensation' ...

[khunpa]

In bkk if a girl has a skirt to short she is made to wear those isaan sarongs all day,even if she is not from isaan.

Regardless of wrong or right your complaint will fall on deaf ears,you will be fed defensive bs in response to your every word and complaint,and nothing will happen,it may paint a target on your child's back in the future as the teacher may lose face and remember he handles the grades and will have the last laugh if you rattle the cage.

You can't tell me it just happened,there must have been warnings first,several.

Perhaps we can adopt the western behavior in schools,everyone can run riot telling teachers to get f&@$d and hit the teachers,or we can accept a little discipline that keeps them in line,respecting teachers and elders as thai's do.

The hair cut is bound to make you angry,but it could of been avoided either by sticking to the regulation haircuts,or not pissing of the teacher if his hair was kosher in the first place.

I am sorry, but I have now shown the pictures to two Thai people and they both say that haircut is too much and WAY out of line.

Both would react on this and request financial compensation and an apology from the director. If not received, they would go to both the police, the ministry and the media.

Your response is simply not what a Thai person would do in this case and it is not true that there will not be consequences for the director and school, if the father reacts on this. (which I really hope he does, for not only his kid but also the other kids at that school)

khunpa ... I presume that you told your 2 Thai friends the story of what happened and that you didn't like it.

Did you factor in the fact that their response is to make you feel happy and that they 'agree with you', but privately think something different.

They just tell you what they think you want to hear ... such is the 'face thing'.

BTW ... on what ground would they seek 'financial compensation' ...

Yes, I showed two uneducated bargirls the images and told them I would buy them lady drinks if they agreed with me.... I do not surround my self with Thai people that are educated, can think and speak for themselves...

Check a previous post about a person who actually complained and got a reduction in the school fees as compensation. I do not know if you noticed, but Thais tend to focus a bit on money, when something is done wrong to them...

[rwdrwdrwd]

khunpa ... I presume that you told your 2 Thai friends the story of what happened and that you didn't like it.

Did you factor in the fact that their response is to make you feel happy and that they 'agree with you', but privately think something different.

They just tell you what they think you want to hear ... such is the 'face thing'.

I mentioned this topic to my wife and she brushed it off as quite common, and a cultural difference - conversation soon moved on. When she happened to notice the photos an hour or two later over my shoulder her unprompted reaction was completely different - what this individual has done is simply not common, normal or acceptable.

[NeverSure]

an apology in front of the whole school at assembly is what i would be more happy with however there would then be embarrassment to my son who probably is hoping it would all go away.

so private apology, a dressing down from the ministry , a police caution, short suspension of employment or anything causing a bit of face loss would do.

i'd still create webpage/facebook page just for this tho (without childs name) , naming and shaming the school

"...anything causing a bit of face loss would do."

I just love that term. With my great big European heritage hands, It just brings a picture to mind of one quick grab and pull.

[NeverSure]

Geez, when I saw the subject I line, I thought the child had been caned or something. Turns out to be a lousy haircut, and yet people are advocating going to the police, making a human rights complaint, assaulting the teacher/director, etc etc. When I was a kid/teen, we used to get the 'cuts' from our teachers, i.e., a caning of up to six strokes on the hand. Parents never thought twice about it. Neither did we. We knew it was the price you paid if you broke the rules (and got caught). I certainly wasn't 'damaged' by the experience, and my friends and I turned out just fine.

Now it's a haircut instead of the cuts, and people are screaming for blood. It's a different world...

Yes you were damaged and it shows in your post. It is now ingrained into you that it is OK to abuse children.

If not stopped it goes on generation after generation, just like inside you.

[David48]

I am sorry, but I have now shown the pictures to two Thai people and they both say that haircut is too much and WAY out of line.

Both would react on this and request financial compensation and an apology from the director. If not received, they would go to both the police, the ministry and the media.

Your response is simply not what a Thai person would do in this case and it is not true that there will not be consequences for the director and school, if the father reacts on this. (which I really hope he does, for not only his kid but also the other kids at that school)

khunpa ... I presume that you told your 2 Thai friends the story of what happened and that you didn't like it.

Did you factor in the fact that their response is to make you feel happy and that they 'agree with you', but privately think something different.

They just tell you what they think you want to hear ... such is the 'face thing'.

BTW ... on what ground would they seek 'financial compensation' ...

Yes, I showed two uneducated bargirls the images and told them I would buy them lady drinks if they agreed with me.... I do not surround my self with Thai people that are educated, can think and speak for themselves...

Check a previous post about a person who actually complained and got a reduction in the school fees as compensation. I do not know if you noticed, but Thais tend to focus a bit on money, when something is done wrong to them...

khunpa ... sarcasm isn't your forte ... is it.

If, in all your months/years in Thailand you haven't discovered that Thais will tell you what they think you want to hear, but privately think something completely different, then ...

So, have a real good think through the issue.

On what basis is there monetary compensation due? Who is the aggrieved party?

It was the child's hair who cut, the old man just pissed with this. So the aggrieved party is the child.

On what basis is the child due compensation?

Was there a loss of face? ... sure.

But who loss of Face is larger? In a pissing contest between the loss of Face of a

Farang,

a Child and

a Senior School Administrator (in that order)

... who do you think would win? That will determine any apology.

I'm not saying for a second what happened to the child is right, correct or, as we don't know the background to the event ... even balanced.

But I'm a pragmatist ... I don't get on a high horse when things don't go my way ... I look for solutions ... not revenge.

Just my take on the issue ... you are free to disagree.

.

[StreetCowboy]

Probably the best thing would be to miss out all the hassle, go straight to the end game and have the Principal killed. If he's not willing to do that, then let it go.

[Straight8]

I am sorry, but I have now shown the pictures to two Thai people and they both say that haircut is too much and WAY out of line.

Both would react on this and request financial compensation and an apology from the director. If not received, they would go to both the police, the ministry and the media.

Your response is simply not what a Thai person would do in this case and it is not true that there will not be consequences for the director and school, if the father reacts on this. (which I really hope he does, for not only his kid but also the other kids at that school)

khunpa ... I presume that you told your 2 Thai friends the story of what happened and that you didn't like it.

Did you factor in the fact that their response is to make you feel happy and that they 'agree with you', but privately think something different.

They just tell you what they think you want to hear ... such is the 'face thing'.

BTW ... on what ground would they seek 'financial compensation' ...

Yes, I showed two uneducated bargirls the images and told them I would buy them lady drinks if they agreed with me.... I do not surround my self with Thai people that are educated, can think and speak for themselves...

Check a previous post about a person who actually complained and got a reduction in the school fees as compensation. I do not know if you noticed, but Thais tend to focus a bit on money, when something is done wrong to them...

khunpa ... sarcasm isn't your forte ... is it.

If, in all your months/years in Thailand you haven't discovered that Thais will tell you what they think you want to hear, but privately think something completely different, then ...

So, have a real good think through the issue.

On what basis is there monetary compensation due? Who is the aggrieved party?

It was the child's hair who cut, the old man just pissed with this. So the aggrieved party is the child.

On what basis is the child due compensation?

Was there a loss of face? ... sure.

But who loss of Face is larger? In a pissing contest between the loss of Face of a

Farang,

a Child and

a Senior School Administrator (in that order)

... who do you think would win? That will determine any apology.

I'm not saying for a second what happened to the child is right, correct or, as we don't know the background to the event ... even balanced.

But I'm a pragmatist ... I don't get on a high horse when things don't go my way ... I look for solutions ... not revenge.

Just my take on the issue ... you are free to disagree.

.

Guess in your eyes nothing that happens is Thainess is wrong. The farang should just learn to bend over any and every which way and accept it.

Go back to what you do best!!