Thailand lagging behind in English

[lostmebike]

But they're not lagging behind in sanuk are they? Would you rather be fluent in a foreign language or be happy?

I think it is spelled 'sanook' .....

The Royal Thai General System which is the official method of rendering Thai language words in the Latin alphabet thinks it's spelled 'sanuk'

http://www.thai-language.com/id/131195

His argument does seem a little pedantic don't you think?

[Mister Fixit]

It is interesting to mote that in England some schools are now banning local dialect, not only for teaching but also for conversations between students

If yo cor spayke proppa yo cor tek the exam

Sownds loike yow cum frum the Black Countray! Am yow a yam-yam?

[MaxLee]

We will see the same headline next week again,

... just an act for receiving international pity,

[sustento]

I've got a Thai friend who's only had 6 years of schooling. You can give him any English newspaper and he'll read it to you word perfect. He has no idea what the words actually mean.

[Mister Fixit]

But they're not lagging behind in sanuk are they? Would you rather be fluent in a foreign language or be happy?

I think it is spelled 'sanook' .....

The Royal Thai General System which is the official method of rendering Thai language words in the Latin alphabet thinks it's spelled 'sanuk'

http://www.thai-language.com/id/131195

There are a number of transliteration systems - they are all crap. For example, the way they use a 'u; and not an 'a' 'My name Nut' but they spell it 'Nat'

WRONG!!

A flat 'a' is way different from a flat 'u'

[Scott]

Some years ago, where I work, the native English speakers were given a fair amount of leeway in teaching English. The students were encouraged to speak, read and write English. Students had to keep a written journal each day, which was grammatically a nightmare, but at least the students started learning to write. In English tests, our school routinely came out very well, ranking in the top 100 schools in Thailand.

Most of our students by the time they were in high school could communicate very well in English. On more than one occasion, a student had to be called in to translate for a Thai teacher.

In the past couple of years, the Thai Admin has decided they know best how English should be taught. There is no more journal -- they write, but any writing is copied and it is the neatness of the handwriting which determines good writing. Students no longer read, except for vocabulary words, which they must be able to recite, spell and translate into Thai.

I cannot begin to tell you how the level of English has dropped.

[khrab]

Not sure about the Chinese, but for the Vietnamese that I have experience with, they generally learn English very quickly if they need to. I also find that on the whole their critical thinking skills, independent learning and study skills, and overall drive for learning itself to be higher. I won't say that they have a higher IQ, but I do find they have a higher intellectual drive.

Vietnam has the slight advantage using the Roman letters.

[Jackson86]

Agree that Thais should learn English from young as well, otherwise very uncompetitive. English as a international language is too important.

[Shancloudy]

They learn English at school but they didn't practice it. Lack of self confidence that they can speak English as well. They are afraid to criticize by other people they think that they will pronounce it wrong.

[mojorison]

English is easy... that's part of the reason it has been adopted as the "international" language... like it or not. It has no genders, and is easy to read. The Thais are crap at it partly because of school funding, and also because of the monstrous Thai ego, telling them that they don't need to lower themselves. People working in tourism all speak adequate English, rice farmers probably don't speak much (school funding and necessity), and the <insert cliched name for urban elite/> think they are above it. IMHO.

[sustento]

English is easy... that's part of the reason it has been adopted as the "international" language... like it or not. It has no genders, and is easy to read.

Of course it is

http://www.thepoke.co.uk/2011/12/23/english-pronunciation/

[rumbo1]

There are very many very intelligent Thais , I think the problem is they don't want the majority to be well educated so the elite upper class can continue to be corrupt and control thus protecting their own wealth, you only have to look at some of the comments made about issan people during recent protests. I have a friend teaching English in a public school out here and the average class size is about 60 pupils , compare that to a private school class size.

you and your "its the elites fault" group are really pushing shit up hill with this crap. The ones that want the north kept uneducated are thaksin and his cronies so that they can control them, if they get eduction then they will realize they are being lied to and will no longer back the ptp/thaksin. The only way you can keep corruption going is by keeping the people dumb and that is exactly what the ptp are now doing. The elites have nothing to do with it, they are not in govt, the ptp/thaksin are, they are the ones that need to be ridiculed over this, using this for your personal bias and putting it before whats best for the people of Thailand is pretty pathetic really but typical of a thaksin lover.

Seajae

I think you obviously have very strong political views unlike myself. To be totally honest with you I have no political interest in any Thai party or in my home country as I believe that nearly all politicians are corrupt which ever country they serve in.

On that note I would like to end this discussion with you as you've obviously got an attitude problem

[terryw]

I am not an expert on the International level of English in Thailand, but I have worked as a Cambridge English Examiner in both Bangkok and Hanoi. The standard of English is similar in the two cities. The standard of English in smaller cities and rural areas is definitely better in Thailand.

Using a football comparison, Malaysia and Singapore are in the Premier Division with Thailand and Vietnam in Divisions 3 and 4.

[DrTuner]

If you are having a "normal" job, where everything is so protected and no farang may ever enter and you may never speak English...what use does it have!

The bar- girls, who learned this, because it is -more or less- essential to talk with your "customers" will be the winner of the ASEAN in Thailand!

...and good for them!

This seems to be backfiring already. How many times have you read here on TV that the "good girls" have nothing to do with tourism and hence can barely speak English ? Doesn't take much of a leap to make the assumption good English->Bargirl, does it. When Thais get that attitude they'll straight out refuse to speak any English.

[tomyummer]

'Smart Lady Thailand' just about sums it up here.

[PaullyW]

I am not an expert on the International level of English in Thailand, but I have worked as a Cambridge English Examiner in both Bangkok and Hanoi. The standard of English is similar in the two cities. The standard of English in smaller cities and rural areas is definitely better in Thailand.

Using a football comparison, Malaysia and Singapore are in the Premier Division with Thailand and Vietnam in Divisions 3 and 4.

But of Hanoi and Bangkok only one of them has been at the English bit for more than 3 decades and having made no discernible improvement.

[seajae]

There are very many very intelligent Thais , I think the problem is they don't want the majority to be well educated so the elite upper class can continue to be corrupt and control thus protecting their own wealth, you only have to look at some of the comments made about issan people during recent protests. I have a friend teaching English in a public school out here and the average class size is about 60 pupils , compare that to a private school class size.

you and your "its the elites fault" group are really pushing shit up hill with this crap. The ones that want the north kept uneducated are thaksin and his cronies so that they can control them, if they get eduction then they will realize they are being lied to and will no longer back the ptp/thaksin. The only way you can keep corruption going is by keeping the people dumb and that is exactly what the ptp are now doing. The elites have nothing to do with it, they are not in govt, the ptp/thaksin are, they are the ones that need to be ridiculed over this, using this for your personal bias and putting it before whats best for the people of Thailand is pretty pathetic really but typical of a thaksin lover.

Seajae

I think you obviously have very strong political views unlike myself. To be totally honest with you I have no political interest in any Thai party or in my home country as I believe that nearly all politicians are corrupt which ever country they serve in.

On that note I would like to end this discussion with you as you've obviously got an attitude problem

hahahahaha, sorry rumbo but for someone that has no "strong " political views you certainly say differently. You are the one that is trying to blame this on the "elites" and you are the one that dragged the protests into it so you naturally get kick back. Repeating from thaksins and the reds propaganda sheets dont help your cause either

[SaamBaht]

You read so many stories about this over the years.

[ratcatcher]

If you are having a "normal" job, where everything is so protected and no farang may ever enter and you may never speak English...what use does it have!

The bar- girls, who learned this, because it is -more or less- essential to talk with your "customers" will be the winner of the ASEAN in Thailand!

...and good for them!

This seems to be backfiring already. How many times have you read here on TV that the "good girls" have nothing to do with tourism and hence can barely speak English ? Doesn't take much of a leap to make the assumption good English->Bargirl, does it. When Thais get that attitude they'll straight out refuse to speak any English.

The P.M., being a "good girl", speaks "passable" English, do you think she is concerned whether people wonder about her job history??

Her English is actually not that good for a person with a Master's degree from an American university, but I give her credit for attempting to use it even if she is derided by some for so doing.

[NeverSure]

When will the Thai Government learn and appreciate that being able to say.... "Welcome handsome man", "Me love you long time", "I want go with you." and other such phrases is not a commendable standard of English nor is it useful outside of any bar.

Seriously they need to put off joining AEC for at least the next 100 years as they'll never be able to complete when most other AEC member countries have such an adequate command of the English language.

The irony is that far more ladies called to the bar are capable of carrying on a simple friendly conversation with a foreigner than most of those who have knelt before a member of the special family to receive a piece of paper. That's why hotel, restaurant and bar workers usually have better English skills because they get to hear and speak the language

Half the problem with Thai students and graduates is they never get a chance to sit down with an English speaking foreigner and just exchange a few pleasantries which helps to break the ice.

Most Thais who have learned some English are terrified of speaking English because they are afraid of making a grammatical or pronunciation error and being laughed at.

Most English speakers trying to converse with a Thai aren't really interested if what they say is grammatically correct or not, as long as it makes some sense and they understand it.

Rather sad really.

...and because there is an incentive fore them, to learn it!

If you are having a "normal" job, where everything is so protected and no farang may ever enter and you may never speak English...what use does it have!

The bar- girls, who learned this, because it is -more or less- essential to talk with your "customers" will be the winner of the ASEAN in Thailand!

...and good for them!

And, who is teaching them English? A short time customer with a wife beater, tattoos and a PHD in English education?

We learned the language by total immersion from our mothers, siblings, friends and neighbors. We learned to speak to survive. We learned to speak long before we learned how to diagram a sentence.

Thailand has it bass ackwards. They focus on vocabulary, grammar, reading and writing, when they should first teach speaking and understanding, so that the grammar writing would mean something to them. This is why it is so painful to me to see Filipinas and Thais teaching English. I would rather see an NES with a TEFL in that classroom than a Thai with a stack of college degrees a foot high.

[pramaprow]

"It's the Thai way or the highway"...Thailand will balk at the Asean rules...

+1

[englishoak]

Hub of Tinglish.

[DocN]

When will the Thai Government learn and appreciate that being able to say.... "Welcome handsome man", "Me love you long time", "I want go with you." and other such phrases is not a commendable standard of English nor is it useful outside of any bar.

Seriously they need to put off joining AEC for at least the next 100 years as they'll never be able to complete when most other AEC member countries have such an adequate command of the English language.

The irony is that far more ladies called to the bar are capable of carrying on a simple friendly conversation with a foreigner than most of those who have knelt before a member of the special family to receive a piece of paper. That's why hotel, restaurant and bar workers usually have better English skills because they get to hear and speak the language

Half the problem with Thai students and graduates is they never get a chance to sit down with an English speaking foreigner and just exchange a few pleasantries which helps to break the ice.

Most Thais who have learned some English are terrified of speaking English because they are afraid of making a grammatical or pronunciation error and being laughed at.

Most English speakers trying to converse with a Thai aren't really interested if what they say is grammatically correct or not, as long as it makes some sense and they understand it.

Rather sad really.

...and because there is an incentive fore them, to learn it!

If you are having a "normal" job, where everything is so protected and no farang may ever enter and you may never speak English...what use does it have!

The bar- girls, who learned this, because it is -more or less- essential to talk with your "customers" will be the winner of the ASEAN in Thailand!

...and good for them!

And, who is teaching them English? A short time customer with a wife beater, tattoos and a PHD in English education?

We learned the language by total immersion from our mothers, siblings, friends and neighbors. We learned to speak to survive. We learned to speak long before we learned how to diagram a sentence.

Thailand has it bass ackwards. They focus on vocabulary, grammar, reading and writing, when they should first teach speaking and understanding, so that the grammar writing would mean something to them. This is why it is so painful to me to see Filipinas and Thais teaching English. I would rather see an NES with a TEFL in that classroom than a Thai with a stack of college degrees a foot high.

So what?

Who cares where are they getting their English from?

There is an incentive for them to learn and learn they do!

I am working in tourism and I had many talks with hotel- sales people, that led absolutely nowhere, unless a Thai was present, so they could chit chat away in their language.

And most of these guys have "A- grades" in English!

Their industry is one of the protected ones, where farang can only work in the higher management, so they mostly speak with Thais = no incentive to learn!

I know several bargirls, who can have a decent conversation in English, mind you.

"You hansum man" is just a start...

[bangon04]

Agree that Thais should learn English from young as well, otherwise very uncompetitive. English as a international language is too important.

Interestingly, Japan was the second most prosperous economy in the world for many years, enjoying great wealth and international esteem.

The education system in Japan has a similarly dismal approach to English language teaching and learning, and there are many points of similarity in achievement. Of course the Japanese have a completely different level of discipline and commitment in other aspects of life, economics and technical expertise, which explain the prosperity, but English speaking language skills are not a priority there.

Yingluck has been lampooned on this website for her lack of English speaking skills on the world stage. But when did you ever hear Shinzo Abe or any of his predecessors utter one word of English in public speaking? He always uses an official interpreter, and always delivers speeches in any country in Japanese. Obama is happy to use the earphones for his convenience.

[mojorison]

English is easy... that's part of the reason it has been adopted as the "international" language... like it or not. It has no genders, and is easy to read.

Of course it is

http://www.thepoke.co.uk/2011/12/23/english-pronunciation/

Thank you for the homework, this article strengthens my point.

[lungmi]

9 Years BBC (Queen's) English in a German grammar school. Professional teacher for German and Roman languages.
"emergency" teacher in Thai highschools I met one Burmese refugee teacher whose English I understood easy.

Expats from NZ, no problem, some UK and US too.

I'm volunteer in a Hilltribe school, my students have a good pronunciation. English is their 3rd language.

They are not Thai (Hmong, Karen, Lisu). My assistant teacher (Karen and Teacher for Burmese)

and me are proud for their good English pronunciation.

[PaullyW]

Agree that Thais should learn English from young as well, otherwise very uncompetitive. English as a international language is too important.

Interestingly, Japan was the second most prosperous economy in the world for many years, enjoying great wealth and international esteem.

The education system in Japan has a similarly dismal approach to English language teaching and learning, and there are many points of similarity in achievement. Of course the Japanese have a completely different level of discipline and commitment in other aspects of life, economics and technical expertise, which explain the prosperity, but English speaking language skills are not a priority there.

Yingluck has been lampooned on this website for her lack of English speaking skills on the world stage. But when did you ever hear Shinzo Abe or any of his predecessors utter one word of English in public speaking? He always uses an official interpreter, and always delivers speeches in any country in Japanese. Obama is happy to use the earphones for his convenience.

The marked difference is that Yingluck does not seem to smart in any language. In addition, she has a terrible command of English. But, as with most Thais, her nature is to prioritize style over substance. Speaking English and making no sense rather than speaking Thai and making maybe a little sense.

As for your comparison to Japan, you are correct that it's not very relevant. For one, Japan began its prospering several decades ago when the world was certainly not as linked as it is now. That was before the Internet and 'globalization'. You mentioned the Japanese discipline which is accurate. Japan has a literary history, cultural codes of honor that most seem to strive for, history of pushing themselves to be better even long before their first interactions with foreigners in modern history. Japan is really nothing like Thailand, at all. There is no such thing as 'maibenrai' in Japanese. Thais base the foundations of their entire culture on 'maipenrai' and the fact that it's OK to be lazy and a low achiever.

Also, Japan didn't build it's economy on the back of mostly western sex and other tourism... However Thailand did, so for that reason and many others, it would probably benefit Thais immensely to be able to understand and speak English. Thais need all the help they can get to compete.

[mojorison]

Agree that Thais should learn English from young as well, otherwise very uncompetitive. English as a international language is too important.

Interestingly, Japan was the second most prosperous economy in the world for many years, enjoying great wealth and international esteem.

The education system in Japan has a similarly dismal approach to English language teaching and learning, and there are many points of similarity in achievement. Of course the Japanese have a completely different level of discipline and commitment in other aspects of life, economics and technical expertise, which explain the prosperity, but English speaking language skills are not a priority there.

Yingluck has been lampooned on this website for her lack of English speaking skills on the world stage. But when did you ever hear Shinzo Abe or any of his predecessors utter one word of English in public speaking? He always uses an official interpreter, and always delivers speeches in any country in Japanese. Obama is happy to use the earphones for his convenience.

The marked difference is that Yingluck does not seem to smart in any language. In addition, she has a terrible command of English. But, as with most Thais, her nature is to prioritize style over substance. Speaking English and making no sense rather than speaking Thai and making maybe a little sense.

As for your comparison to Japan, you are correct that it's not very relevant. For one, Japan began its prospering several decades ago when the world was certainly not as linked as it is now. That was before the Internet and 'globalization'. You mentioned the Japanese discipline which is accurate. Japan has a literary history, cultural codes of honor that most seem to strive for, history of pushing themselves to be better even long before their first interactions with foreigners in modern history. Japan is really nothing like Thailand, at all. There is no such thing as 'maibenrai' in Japanese. Thais base the foundations of their entire culture on 'maipenrai' and the fact that it's OK to be lazy and a low achiever.

Also, Japan didn't build it's economy on the back of mostly western sex and other tourism... However Thailand did, so for that reason and many others, it would probably benefit Thais immensely to be able to understand and speak English. Thais need all the help they can get to compete.

Your reference to building the economy on the back of the sex trade is pathetic, insulting and patently incorrect. It reveals a little something about yourself however. Firstly you are probably a whore hound, and secondly, you have nurtured a distorted view of Thailand by living in your microcosm of paid sex and depravity, No offence.

[ratcatcher]

Agree that Thais should learn English from young as well, otherwise very uncompetitive. English as a international language is too important.

Interestingly, Japan was the second most prosperous economy in the world for many years, enjoying great wealth and international esteem.

The education system in Japan has a similarly dismal approach to English language teaching and learning, and there are many points of similarity in achievement. Of course the Japanese have a completely different level of discipline and commitment in other aspects of life, economics and technical expertise, which explain the prosperity, but English speaking language skills are not a priority there.

Yingluck has been lampooned on this website for her lack of English speaking skills on the world stage. But when did you ever hear Shinzo Abe or any of his predecessors utter one word of English in public speaking? He always uses an official interpreter, and always delivers speeches in any country in Japanese. Obama is happy to use the earphones for his convenience.

The marked difference is that Yingluck does not seem to smart in any language. In addition, she has a terrible command of English. But, as with most Thais, her nature is to prioritize style over substance. Speaking English and making no sense rather than speaking Thai and making maybe a little sense.

As for your comparison to Japan, you are correct that it's not very relevant. For one, Japan began its prospering several decades ago when the world was certainly not as linked as it is now. That was before the Internet and 'globalization'. You mentioned the Japanese discipline which is accurate. Japan has a literary history, cultural codes of honor that most seem to strive for, history of pushing themselves to be better even long before their first interactions with foreigners in modern history. Japan is really nothing like Thailand, at all. There is no such thing as 'maibenrai' in Japanese. Thais base the foundations of their entire culture on 'maipenrai' and the fact that it's OK to be lazy and a low achiever.

Also, Japan didn't build it's economy on the back of mostly western sex and other tourism... However Thailand did, so for that reason and many others, it would probably benefit Thais immensely to be able to understand and speak English. Thais need all the help they can get to compete.

Your reference to building the economy on the back of the sex trade is pathetic, insulting and patently incorrect. It reveals a little something about yourself however. Firstly you are probably a whore hound, and secondly, you have nurtured a distorted view of Thailand by living in your microcosm of paid sex and depravity, No offence.

No offence.

[bangon04]

Agree that Thais should learn English from young as well, otherwise very uncompetitive. English as a international language is too important.

Interestingly, Japan was the second most prosperous economy in the world for many years, enjoying great wealth and international esteem.

The education system in Japan has a similarly dismal approach to English language teaching and learning, and there are many points of similarity in achievement. Of course the Japanese have a completely different level of discipline and commitment in other aspects of life, economics and technical expertise, which explain the prosperity, but English speaking language skills are not a priority there.

Yingluck has been lampooned on this website for her lack of English speaking skills on the world stage. But when did you ever hear Shinzo Abe or any of his predecessors utter one word of English in public speaking? He always uses an official interpreter, and always delivers speeches in any country in Japanese. Obama is happy to use the earphones for his convenience.

The marked difference is that Yingluck does not seem to smart in any language. In addition, she has a terrible command of English. But, as with most Thais, her nature is to prioritize style over substance. Speaking English and making no sense rather than speaking Thai and making maybe a little sense.

As for your comparison to Japan, you are correct that it's not very relevant. For one, Japan began its prospering several decades ago when the world was certainly not as linked as it is now. That was before the Internet and 'globalization'. You mentioned the Japanese discipline which is accurate. Japan has a literary history, cultural codes of honor that most seem to strive for, history of pushing themselves to be better even long before their first interactions with foreigners in modern history. Japan is really nothing like Thailand, at all. There is no such thing as 'maibenrai' in Japanese. Thais base the foundations of their entire culture on 'maipenrai' and the fact that it's OK to be lazy and a low achiever.

Also, Japan didn't build it's economy on the back of mostly western sex and other tourism... However Thailand did, so for that reason and many others, it would probably benefit Thais immensely to be able to understand and speak English. Thais need all the help they can get to compete.

I think the point I wanted to make was that Japan is/was hugely successful despite the dismal failures learning fluent English.

Japan probably had more US bases over the years, and more than enough contact with visiting US soldiers on R+R. More contact through business with English speaking countries over the years, much more overseas travel by Japanese citizens over the years , than a blinkered Thailand.

However you are quite right that the dreaded "Globalisation" has now really taken hold, and the future for Thailand must include English language skills (unless Thais opt to become Sinophiles instead.)