When the Skytrain stopped, so did Bangkok

[MMarlow]

Fares increase 2 Baht but service still the same one of the most expensive light rail in Asia .

That is a real disaster, 2 baht.

[josephbloggs]

Fares increase 2 Baht but service still the same one of the most expensive light rail in Asia .

Yes it's the the same service: trains come along, people get on, it goes to other stations, people get off.

So how do you think they should have changed the service for that extra two baht? Cushioned seats? Buffet cars?

[MMarlow]

I have watched the BTS grow and indeed it is our main mechanism of transport around Bangkok. In the beginning there were just three carriages per train, now mostly 5 and still room to add more carriages to the trains, what is the maximum does anyone know?

The platforms were made long enough, unfortunately the trains are now running almost packed to capacity, and exiting the station, particularly if two trains arrive at once or worst still four trains arrive at once at the BTS interchange station Siam, is a bit of a nightmare.

It’s not just train lengths that need to be increased it’s also the frequency of trains (more trains themselves). The BTS is in some ways a victim of its success!

Yes, you're right, there is a huge delay between one train departing the station and the next one arriving, approximately every 4 minutes in rush hour. That really needs sorting out quickly. Disgusting.

And off-peak, when hardly anyone's using the system, sometimes I've had to wait almost 10 minutes (!) to get home in cool, clean comfort.

[Searat7]

The trains now all have 4 cars but they could clearly use 5 and I think the lead time to get cars from Germany is about 2 years for the 35 old trains- probably requires special setup to produce old train cars. Lead time on newer trains from China is probably less. Hope they have some on order.

[Lakegeneve]

I have watched the BTS grow and indeed it is our main mechanism of transport around Bangkok. In the beginning there were just three carriages per train, now mostly 5 and still room to add more carriages to the trains, what is the maximum does anyone know?

The platforms were made long enough, unfortunately the trains are now running almost packed to capacity, and exiting the station, particularly if two trains arrive at once or worst still four trains arrive at once at the BTS interchange station Siam, is a bit of a nightmare.

It’s not just train lengths that need to be increased it’s also the frequency of trains (more trains themselves). The BTS is in some ways a victim of its success!

Your counting ability leaves much to be desired. No 5 car operations ever as yet, all are currently 4 car.

There was a 6 car shuttle service between Feb and Oct between S8 & S10 before the Bang Wah ext opened on 5 Dec.

Platforms are designed for eventual 6 car trains.

The delay in adding extra carriages has been that the private operator BTSC has had insufficient funds to purchase new rolling stock. (Some rolling stock was also delivered late from the factory, mainly the first batch of CNR stock).

Currently, you have 35, 4 car Siemens trains and 12, 4 car CNR trains.

Extra stock will be needed once the Bearing to Samut Prakhan ext opens in 2016 should the BTSC win the right to operate it (obviously they most likely will).

[Lakegeneve]

Fares increase 2 Baht but service still the same one of the most expensive light rail in Asia .

It is heavy rail NOT light rail

[pkrv]

I have watched the BTS grow and indeed it is our main mechanism of transport around Bangkok. In the beginning there were just three carriages per train, now mostly 5 and still room to add more carriages to the trains, what is the maximum does anyone know?

The platforms were made long enough, unfortunately the trains are now running almost packed to capacity, and exiting the station, particularly if two trains arrive at once or worst still four trains arrive at once at the BTS interchange station Siam, is a bit of a nightmare.

It’s not just train lengths that need to be increased it’s also the frequency of trains (more trains themselves). The BTS is in some ways a victim of its success!

Your counting ability leaves much to be desired. No 5 car operations ever as yet, all are currently 4 car.

There was a 6 car shuttle service between Feb and Oct between S8 & S10 before the Bang Wah ext opened on 5 Dec.

Platforms are designed for eventual 6 car trains.

The delay in adding extra carriages has been that the private operator BTSC has had insufficient funds to purchase new rolling stock. (Some rolling stock was also delivered late from the factory, mainly the first batch of CNR stock).

Currently, you have 35, 4 car Siemens trains and 12, 4 car CNR trains.

Extra stock will be needed once the Bearing to Samut Prakhan ext opens in 2016 should the BTSC win the right to operate it (obviously they most likely will).

Sorry quite right 4 cars - adding the extra one made a big difference for a short time - Thanks for all the other information - obviously well informed - PKRV

Edited December 26, 2013 by pkrv

[bartender100]

The Sky train is a good legacy of Thaksin Shinawatra, with out him, probably never been built

Edited December 26, 2013 by bartender100

[hanno]

The Sky train is a good legacy of Thaksin Shinawatra, with out him, probably never been built

Thaksin became PM in 2001, the BTS started running in 1999....

[Thai at Heart]

Question is, have they fixed it.

Issues like this occur. Thing is, it's whether they happen regularly and to which scale the separates well run from 3rd world.

[hanno]

which was designed, built and taught how to be maintained largely by the Japanese, to be clear.

The trains are from Siemens - that is a german company.

And Siemens has a huge issue with German Rail as they cannot deliver the cars they promised due to technical problems......

So not exactly a Thai problem.

[Briggsy]

About 12 years ago, somebody gave me a map of Bangkok with about 8 diffierent mass transit lines extending in all directions. Not a lot has happened in the intervening period.

I left Bangkok in 2010 and am relieved to have escaped the congestion.

This should be top priority, build more mass transit.

[Lakegeneve]

About 12 years ago, somebody gave me a map of Bangkok with about 8 diffierent mass transit lines extending in all directions. Not a lot has happened in the intervening period.

I left Bangkok in 2010 and am relieved to have escaped the congestion.

This should be top priority, build more mass transit.

Indeed. BKK is about 15 years behind where it should be, that is the current network and the 4 lines under construction should be where BKK was even before the BTS opened in Dec 1999.

Metro expansion is like a drunk taking 1 step forward 3 steps back wards or sideways, it is dysfunctional and messy process but somehow eventually projects do belatedly get underway and built. Many lines have been delayed by 3 - 5 - 8 years from their original timeframes.

However, whilst there is much to critical about the expansion process it is incorrect to state, "not a lot has happened in the intervening period";

-3 new BTS has opened thanks to the BMA. (WWY ext, Bearing ext & in 2013 the Bang Wah ext)

-The ARL opened (3 yrs late),

-the Purple Line is under construction (opening 2 yrs late in 2016),

-the Blue Line extension is finally being built (some 5 yrs late, 2017),

-the SRT Light Red line is open for trail operations (though it is practically useless for now),

-and the Dark Red Line is under construction (3 yrs late, 2017).

-The BTS ext from Bearing to Samut Prakhan is also being built (2016).

Another 3-4 lines which were due to be tendered this year (and have been delayed - read the linked thread for the reasons) should be tendered in the next 12-18 months.

In 2015, you'll have 7-8 metro lines or exts all under various stages of construction at once!!! Then everyone will be complaining about metro construction causing more traffic jams!

All the info you need on what is being done and when, http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/406991-the-new-skytrain/page-11

[Lakegeneve]

To visually reinforce the point;

This is what existed 10 yrs ago prior to opening the MRT in 2004

This is the current situation (minus the two SRT suburan/comutter lines);

And this is what the Bangkok metro and suburban network is planned to look like by 2030 give or take 5 years (and assuming political instability doesn't derail the process - yes pun intended)

I suspect that you might agree that much has been done in the intervening period - albeit I'd agree with the proposition not enough and everything has been delayed.

[taony]

The platforms were built to handle six car trains. And at the beginning they ran 3 car trains promising to increase them to six cars soon after (six months if I remember correctly). Well 14 years later, we are only up to 4 car trains. Ticket machines / turnstiles? enough? Nope of course not. Even when a half empty train arrives, you need to wait in line to exit the damn thing. BTS = No reinvestment, just taking money out, paying dividends to "investors" etc.

The system is pretty much beyond capacity now because they have improved barely nothing over the years. Capacity can easily be expanded by running six car trains, using ticket machines that work and adding turnstiles. But that will never happen.

It was a struggle to convince BTS to build escalators / stairways / ramps to their service. The new lines , while good, are not where they are needed most, which is in the inner city. Just extending the lines is not real progress; tacking on a half dozen stations or so to the ends of the existing lines (with two ticketing systems!!!) is not progress. There is still boat loads of traffic everywhere and the trains are filled to capacity. Bangkok is screaming out for transportation improvements - but they will never come.

[mca]

14 years between system wide failures is a success in any engineering project.

Yep if I had a car that broke down or TV that needed repair once in 14 years I'd be singing it's praises to the high heavens.

But let's face it the knockers on TVF had their little dig when the system went down because 1) the BTS is Thai and 2) the owner's rich.

Edited December 26, 2013 by mca

[KOZMO]

I see no way that platform screen doors would cause a total shut down of the BTS, sounds like B/S to me!!

[whybother]

I see no way that platform screen doors would cause a total shut down of the BTS, sounds like B/S to me!!

It would if the train doors couldn't open because of the problem.

[celso]

 

The platforms were built to handle six car trains. And at the beginning they ran 3 car trains promising to increase them to six cars soon after (six months if I remember correctly). Well 14 years later, we are only up to 4 car trains. Ticket machines / turnstiles? enough? Nope of course not. Even when a half empty train arrives, you need to wait in line to exit the dam_n thing. BTS = No reinvestment, just taking money out, paying dividends to "investors" etc.

You are looking at it wrong. Why increase to six trains? What would be the benefit to the BTS right now?

It is simple economics. They are not operating at full capacity now - not LOSING customers because there is no space - so what is there to gain from buying dozens of new car trains? Trains less crowded yes, but that's not going to make BTS any more money. And you can bet it will make ticket prices go up.

Even at peak time, 6pm Siam Square, its a clusterf__k, but people still get in the station and join the queues, its tolerable. And by 7pm its approaching normality again. Definitely not over capacity... I suggest you visit Japan or London's subway to gain some perspective on what full capacity really means.

If you want a form of transport with no waiting in lines, seats, fast, with lots of central stops, in the middle of an international city: I suggest you start looking for a magic carpet.

Edited December 26, 2013 by celso

[taony]

Have you been drinking?

[Robby nz]

Just hope that none in either the center, south or north are thinking in their tiny little minds that this is a great way to bring the city to a standstill.

For sure we don't need a London underground type situation in this country.

[KOZMO]

What has this to do with the story of WI FI that was put out during and after the stoppage?

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[KOZMO]

If some signal jamming was the cause, i'm sure someone took note of it.

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[KOZMO]

I was refering to the platform screen doors.

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[whybother]

What has this to do with the story of WI FI that was put out during and after the stoppage? Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

The trains need communication with the platform's new automated door systems. The system upgrade would have to connect the train door opening systems with the platform door opening systems. It could be that the problem caused problems with the train doors. Not being able to open the doors would mean that they would need to shut down the system. There is no point running trains that can't open their doors.

[KOZMO]

Sounds reasonable!

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[tartempion]

Ah well, Bangkok has a Mass Transit System?

Compare this to NY, London, Paris, Singapore, Montreal, Brussels or even the Buenos Aires metro which startred operations 12 December 1913...

Bangkok is no match

[Bkungbank]

For those farang 2 Baht is noting but office workers living on min wages is huge burden, we don't ask for cushioned seats but at least vending machine that accept dollar bills liked MRT does easy for to buy ticket some busy station buying a ticket takes longer then the destination

Fares increase 2 Baht but service still the same one of the most expensive light rail in Asia .

Yes it's the the same service: trains come along, people get on, it goes to other stations, people get off.

So how do you think they should have changed the service for that extra two baht? Cushioned seats? Buffet cars?

[Lakegeneve]

For those farang 2 Baht is noting but office workers living on min wages is huge burden, we don't ask for cushioned seats but at least vending machine that accept dollar bills liked MRT does easy for to buy ticket some busy station buying a ticket takes longer then the destination

Fares increase 2 Baht but service still the same one of the most expensive light rail in Asia .

Yes it's the the same service: trains come along, people get on, it goes to other stations, people get off.

So how do you think they should have changed the service for that extra two baht? Cushioned seats? Buffet cars?

Office workers don't earn the minimum wage of 300 baht a day! That is why they are office workers!

2 baht is a "huge burden"?!? I do like your sarcastic sense of humour.

This was the first across the board rise in fares after 12 yrs of operations (the only fare rise was minimum fare form 10-15 baht back in 04/05). In actual fact as per the concessionaire agreement the max fare currently should be around the 60-65 baht mark. Fares increases have been held back by the govt.

Those people who are not office workers and are the actual minimum wage recipients take the bus either for a much smaller fare (free for some routes). I'm sure anyone struggling with a 2 baht rise would also similarly be doing so......

You'll probably be happy if the PT ever makes good on their 2011 election promise of a flat 20 baht metro fare and the greatly severe overcrowding which will result. That will make any current busy day on the BTS network seem like a breeze.

[hanno]

Ah well, Bangkok has a Mass Transit System?

Compare this to NY, London, Paris, Singapore, Montreal, Brussels or even the Buenos Aires metro which startred operations 12 December 1913...

Bangkok is no match

Compare it to places like HCMC, Ha Noi, Phnom Penh, KL, Vientiane that have no or almost no MTS...