Should Thailand tax junk food to help fight obesity?

[David48]

...

Note to self.

...

Perhaps keep your "notes to self" to yourself?

Dude, I do post a lot, but one thing I will NOT do is ever feel obligated to respond like a servant to each and every snarky demand from a member who is clearly more into playing personality games than the topic. Anyone can see the evidence of that and judge for themselves.

Cheers.

JT, tis not I who personalise things ... indeed, exactly the opposite.

I simply ask for referances for those this being offered up on the Forum as 'Facts'.

The only time I 'personalise things' is when I refer to you as either 'JT' or 'Jingthing' which, for me is a courtesy that maintains respect between fellow members.

To take that further, I have, do and in the future will ... as I've said countless times, publicly on this Forum and to you through a PM is that I will always endeavour to 'Play the Ball and not the Man'

On this subject, we disagree ... but that's life. On the next subject, who knows, we might agree ... we have in the past.

Now, mature members would now usually agree to disagree, move on, and move forward.

I hope you have the same conciliatory attitude.

.

[krisb]

Hi JT ... I just dropping by in-case you feel lonely.

Looks like it's just a conversation with yourself now, or, at best, the faithful few.

.

Please, Sir, I do not welcome such OT personal gossip messages of this kind. This is a serious topic. Thanks.

JT, what does 'OT' mean?

Thanks ...

Ot means overly tired. I've been reading this for a time now, and without untaxed junkfood I would not have made it.

Just sayn'

[Jingthing]

...

To take that further, I have, do and in the future will ... as I've said countless times, publicly on this Forum and to you through a PM is that I will always endeavour to 'Play the Ball and not the Man'

...

Saying and doing are separate things. (Like the Thai democrat party ...)

A friendly suggestion -- I'm just not that into you, or the tedious dodges you play; maybe seek another focus of your attention?

Edited January 9, 2014 by Jingthing

[Morakot]

I'm always stroppy when I don't get my sugar rush.

[Jingthing]

On the sugar thing, someone here mentioned that Thailand heavily subsidizes the sugar industry, correct?
In that case, wouldn't that make it even less likely that Thailand would even consider a widespread sugar tax?

A bit ironic because Thailand's government pays the cost of a lot of the health care problems from obesity.

Another complicating factor is that there is evidence, believe it or not, that SUGAR SUBSTITUTES contribute to obesity as well.

So many people think of products like Diet Coke as a health food, but they really aren't.

[brit1984]

On the sugar thing, someone here mentioned that Thailand heavily subsidizes the sugar industry, correct?

In that case, wouldn't that make it even less likely that Thailand would even consider a widespread sugar tax?

A bit ironic because Thailand's government pays the cost of a lot of the health care problems from obesity.

Another complicating factor is that there is evidence, believe it or not, that SUGAR SUBSTITUTES contribute to obesity as well.

So many people think of products like Diet Coke as a health food, but they really aren't.

are you serious?... i've been downing 10 liters of diet coke per day in my quest to have the perfect body

[Jingthing]

On the sugar thing, someone here mentioned that Thailand heavily subsidizes the sugar industry, correct?

In that case, wouldn't that make it even less likely that Thailand would even consider a widespread sugar tax?

A bit ironic because Thailand's government pays the cost of a lot of the health care problems from obesity.

Another complicating factor is that there is evidence, believe it or not, that SUGAR SUBSTITUTES contribute to obesity as well.

So many people think of products like Diet Coke as a health food, but they really aren't.

are you serious?... i've been downing 10 liters of diet coke per day in my quest to have the perfect body

Yes I'm serious.

You see, that's the problem with small scale anecdotal stories. Some chain smokers live to 100 but that doesn't prove smoking doesn't shorten life.

Get the concept?

You can find multiple links supporting this, here is one.

There are individuals and there is the PUBLIC.

Obviously people like me who are supportive of public policy measures to combat the globesity epidemic are looking at the bigger picture of societies as a whole. Such policies may not be great for all individuals but if effective, their overall impact on society has the potential to be positive.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/07/10/diet-soda-health-problems/2507219/

One large study found that people who drank artificially sweetened soda were more likely to experience weight gain than those who drank non-diet soda. Others found those who drank diet soda had twice the risk of developing metabolic syndrome, often a precursor to cardiovascular disease, than those who abstained.

Edited January 9, 2014 by Jingthing

[David48]

...

To take that further, I have, do and in the future will ... as I've said countless times, publicly on this Forum and to you through a PM is that I will always endeavour to 'Play the Ball and not the Man'

...

Saying and doing are separate things. (Like the Thai democrat party ...)

A friendly suggestion -- I'm just not that into you, or the tedious dodges you play; maybe seek another focus of your attention?

JT ... I'm not stalking ... no matter what you think.

But, if you keep flinging Mud ... I''l just keep removing it.

So, from your post ...

"Saying and doing are separate things" ... something you are guilty of ... saying something is a fact ... but not doing the reference to back it up.

Are you seriously comparing me to the Thai democrat party ...

"tedious dodges you play" ... please explain ... or is that just another tedious assumption that you represent as a fact.

"focus of your attention?" ... couldn't be further from the truth.

Actually, on a daily basis, I probably post more then you. For the moment ... in the future, that may revert back to you.

Any analysis from the moderation team will easily see that I almost rarely reply to your threads ... but please be free to call in that card if you are confident enough. Today is an exception ... but that's only because the mud is flowing thick and fast.

As I suggested above ... Now, mature members would now usually agree to disagree, move on, and move forward. I hope you have the same conciliatory attitude.

But, if you continue to throw mud, hoping that something will stick ... you are wrong, and I will continue to defend myself.

.

[brit1984]

^^ JT, calm down, i was taking the piss

nobody thinks diet coke is healthy

Edited January 9, 2014 by brit1984

[brit1984]

...

To take that further, I have, do and in the future will ... as I've said countless times, publicly on this Forum and to you through a PM is that I will always endeavour to 'Play the Ball and not the Man'

...

Saying and doing are separate things. (Like the Thai democrat party ...)

A friendly suggestion -- I'm just not that into you, or the tedious dodges you play; maybe seek another focus of your attention?

JT ... I'm not stalking ... no matter what you think.

But, if you keep flinging Mud ... I''l just keep removing it.

So, from your post ...

"Saying and doing are separate things" ... something you are guilty of ... saying something is a fact ... but not doing the reference to back it up.

Are you seriously comparing me to the Thai democrat party ...

"tedious dodges you play" ... please explain ... or is that just another tedious assumption that you represent as a fact.

"focus of your attention?" ... couldn't be further from the truth.

Actually, on a daily basis, I probably post more then you. For the moment ... in the future, that may revert back to you.

Any analysis from the moderation team will easily see that I almost rarely reply to your threads ... but please be free to call in that card if you are confident enough. Today is an exception ... but that's only because the mud is flowing thick and fast.

As I suggested above ... Now, mature members would now usually agree to disagree, move on, and move forward. I hope you have the same conciliatory attitude.

But, if you continue to throw mud, hoping that something will stick ... you are wrong, and I will continue to defend myself.

.

are you challenging JT to a naked mud wrestle?

[Morakot]

OK, everyone calm down. We have a dinner party first before any major moves will happen!

Edited January 9, 2014 by Morakot

[krisb]

I'm always stroppy when I don't get my sugar rush.

Yep. Human nature needs sugar without tax, which is also human nature.

Dagnammit'

[krisb]

OK, everyone calm down. We have a dinner party first before any major moves will happen!

Shimmy shimmy shake is my favourite move. Followed by the lawnmower.

Noooooo,pah-leeeeeze push the pineapple shake the tree

[Morakot]

Well on that note, we have a short clip for general entertainment before resuming the topic:

[Jingthing]

The topic has gone off the rails anyway ...

[BookMan]

OK, everyone calm down. We have a dinner party first before any major moves will happen!

Classic.

[krisb]

The topic has gone off the rails anyway ...

Now that's a job for Street Cowboy

[David48]

The topic has gone off the rails anyway ...

Now that's a job for Street Cowboy

+1

(Have run out of likes)

Hey, what happened to JT ... he was all over this before?

[Showbags]

The topic has gone off the rails anyway ...

All your threads seem to do that...you are good at

[Jingthing]

This is a controversial and politically loaded topic.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[MrGaoMungGawn]

The ONLY thing that certainly is NOT controversial, sir,

Is that we have our tastes set at a very early age.

If we are restricted from eating salt, fat, and sugar when we are less than One,

And continue with this restriction through the first few years,

And we substitute fruit, and healthier foods,

Then we will maintain these preferences into old age.

I recall that no one in Taiwan would drink COKE normally,

They said it was too sweet.

They hated candy, most,

But loved fruit, which they saw as being a treat when they were growing up.

Fatty meats however, were loved,

Because these were considered treats when meat was financially too rich for their diet, most days.

If parents in Thailand will restrict the junk foods, completely, when children are young, then they will have a fighting chance when the kids become teens, even troublesome teens.

Probably the same goes for alcohol, somewhat.

[StreetCowboy]

The topic has gone off the rails anyway ...

Now that's a job for Street Cowboy

Youngengineers.wmv

[mogandave]

The ONLY thing that certainly is NOT controversial, sir,

Is that we have our tastes set at a very early age.

If we are restricted from eating salt, fat, and sugar when we are less than One,

And continue with this restriction through the first few years,

And we substitute fruit, and healthier foods,

Then we will maintain these preferences into old age.

I recall that no one in Taiwan would drink COKE normally,

They said it was too sweet.

They hated candy, most,

But loved fruit, which they saw as being a treat when they were growing up.

Fatty meats however, were loved,

Because these were considered treats when meat was financially too rich for their diet, most days.

If parents in Thailand will restrict the junk foods, completely, when children are young, then they will have a fighting chance when the kids become teens, even troublesome teens.

Probably the same goes for alcohol, somewhat.

So kids that breast-feed like fatty meat?

[Showbags]

The ONLY thing that certainly is NOT controversial, sir,

Is that we have our tastes set at a very early age.

If we are restricted from eating salt, fat, and sugar when we are less than One,

And continue with this restriction through the first few years,

And we substitute fruit, and healthier foods,

Then we will maintain these preferences into old age.

I recall that no one in Taiwan would drink COKE normally,

They said it was too sweet.

They hated candy, most,

But loved fruit, which they saw as being a treat when they were growing up.

Fatty meats however, were loved,

Because these were considered treats when meat was financially too rich for their diet, most days.

If parents in Thailand will restrict the junk foods, completely, when children are young, then they will have a fighting chance when the kids become teens, even troublesome teens.

Probably the same goes for alcohol, somewhat.

So kids that breast-feed like fatty meat?

kids that breast feed have issues.

[Somsrisonphimai]

It doesn't really mean much tax or not tax. Unless the price is outraged, people will eat what they like to eat. You can tax white rice to death, I will still eat it because I cannot live without it. Alcohol and cigarette taxes did not stope people from drinking alcohol or smoking cigarette. To solve the issue, people need to change their eating habit and lifestyle. Eating healthy and exercise regularly are the key to a long and healthy life, so they say.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[soomak]

So what do you propose to do to stop the tidal wave of obesity in Thailand?

I propose that it is not your business. If you want to stay slim, then just do it and let other people do what they want.

Anyway, there isn't a tidal wave. If you are bored, read a book.

How long have you been coming to Thailand or living here? I've noticed a dramatic increase in Thai-besity since the late 1990s. I agree it's something for the Thais to ultimately decide but dude this is an expat forum and we are free to discuss Thailand related issues.

That's what I do: i freely discuss Thailand related issues and one issue is: the last thing we need here are neostalinist functionaries who dictate to other people how to live.

So let me propose another idea:

Everyone pays a health tax (as in most developed countries), but the tax gets higher as your BMI increases.

[soomak]

Yeah I'm sure many are hiding.

Seriously I doubt many people who live in Thailand have any problem in seeing overweight and obese Thais.

Yeah, in bkk there are many overweight people, not like the little hippos that wonder around in the US, but still clearly overweight.

and surely the percentage of overweight people is rising every year.

[soomak]

You might ask the question HOW do you preserve the culture and eating habits in Thailand in order to promote better health.

Well Italy has some interesting policies, one of which is that the lunch served to schools kids cannot be pre-processed (meaning that it has to be prepared at the school that same day), and its also mainly organic food.

The Naked Chef guy tried to start such a policy in the UK, not sure how successful he was.

[Jingthing]

So let me propose another idea:

Everyone pays a health tax (as in most developed countries), but the tax gets higher as your BMI increases.

Japan was requiring counseling to people whose waist size reached even mildly overweight (35.5 inches in men) but I don't have info whether this program is still in effect or whether it was judged to be effective. It seems to make sense to see the move towards obesity in a person as a red flag, the question is what outside actions help or don't help. I don't agree with your punishment BMI tax model because the causes of obesity are varied and complex and also some of the most obese people are also the most poor people. So for those people it's much more regressive than a substance tax because with a substance tax there is a choice to choose healthier options that are not subject to extra tax. Such as water for soda.

Edited January 10, 2014 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

It doesn't really mean much tax or not tax. Unless the price is outraged, people will eat what they like to eat. You can tax white rice to death, I will still eat it because I cannot live without it. Alcohol and cigarette taxes did not stope people from drinking alcohol or smoking cigarette. To solve the issue, people need to change their eating habit and lifestyle. Eating healthy and exercise regularly are the key to a long and healthy life, so they say. Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

You raise a very reasonable objection. Will such taxes work to help with the goal of preventing and reversing a significant amount of obesity in populations? Prevention is the easier goal as those who are already obese, especially if it starts in childhood, face very difficult odds of finding a long term solution for that (but losing even some weight and keeping it off is better than nothing). Anyway, don't fret, MEXICO, a very large and very obese nation will help the world get some good data on whether this kind of tax helps or not. Eventually.

The big question researchers have is whether such taxes will actually reduce consumption of these foods — which lead to hypertension, high triglycerides and insulin resistance, diabetes and have been shown to accelerate aging. Reducing their consumption would improve our country’s overall health. If they don’t then the taxes are merely another source of revenue for governments.

Now scientists will have a chance to test whether such a tax affects a large, and comparatively obese, marketplace.

http://blog.chron.com/sciguy/2014/01/mexico-dares-do-what-the-united-states-has-not-tax-sugar/comment-page-1/