Finding a High School - Tricky

[RoboLB]

Whilst I love Thailand, it can certainly be an 'Amazing' place at times........

The Back Story - Short Version

My wife (Thai) and I live mainly in Australia. Been married 10+ years. We thought we would 'help out' the family by bring our niece (also Thai) here to Australia for 3 years to attend a local High School. That's a story in itself. Very expensive, even at a Government School as she was an 'overseas' student. Was here on a student visa.

Anyway....our Niece has now just gone back to Thailand to complete her final 2 years of High School. Great experience for her and now a very confident/capable English speaker. Why going back? Because she wants to go to Uni in Thailand, not Australia. And we are advised that it is easier to get into Uni by following the final years of High School in the Thai 'system'. Makes sense. i.e. The right topics, taught in the right way, to pass entrance exams.

The Problem

It seems getting into a local Thai High School is not so easy. My wife is in Bangkok now trying to find one. They all want high grades on entrance tests, even the Government Schools. And of course whilst her English is great, the other subjects are not so strong. 1) she has been learning in a foreign language for three years and 2) Quite simply the High Schools here in Australia are a year or two behind Thailand academically.

So we are trying, some 'cheaper' private schools, but still she has to pass entrance tests. And also looking at some Government schools that have a strong focus on English (to maintain that skill). But things are not looking good, because of her grades.

I mentioned to my wife that if all else fails, at least she can just go to the local Government High School. On No she says, not that simple! Even the local High Schools can pick and choose students. So that if her grades are considered too low, she will end up at the bottom of the pile in a local High School where all the 'dregs' end up. Hardly seems fair.

I know I shouldn't compare. But here in Sydney the local High School is obliged to take kids from their 'catchment area'. And in fact the reverse applies. You need approval to go to a Government school in another 'catchment area'.

For those who have experienced this...............does this all sound correct ?

Robo

[Scott]

It sounds correct. I work with a bilingual school system and we have a lot of people who get their kids in early to assure that they will be likely to remain. In the upper Mathyom - grades 10-11-12 -- some still don't make the cut. The difference is, all they have to remain is get reasonable grades and behave themselves. They don't have to take an entrance exam.

Check with some of the private bilingual schools. She should be able to get in.

[culicine]

It's important to consider what you want her to do after school. Are you ok with her studying in english language in an International program in Thailand? If she is insisting she wants to study in Thai language in university I would suggest she studies in the Thai program of a private school. My school has both a Thai program (5/6 periods of english a week), but I work in the English Program, where most of their subjects are done in english. Despite this, many of my students went to study in Thai language programs in university (3 got into medicine, one in an international program). Either way you go, she might have to study in extra tutorial classes (which I detest), to help her get into a Thai language program. Students who study in Thai language at school generally struggle with learning in english at university. As for fees, my school charges about 120K a year for the EP and about 40K a year for the Thai program. This is a private school. Other schools may charge more or less. I'm sure your niece would be close to the top in my english class, but may be about a year behind in the other subjects. But because her english is good, I'm sure she can catch up, as long as she is competent in those subjects.

[RoboLB]

It sounds correct. I work with a bilingual school system and we have a lot of people who get their kids in early to assure that they will be likely to remain. In the upper Mathyom - grades 10-11-12 -- some still don't make the cut. The difference is, all they have to remain is get reasonable grades and behave themselves. They don't have to take an entrance exam.

Check with some of the private bilingual schools. She should be able to get in.

Thanks, but the private schools are saying her grades might be too low ...

[RoboLB]

It's important to consider what you want her to do after school. Are you ok with her studying in english language in an International program in Thailand? If she is insisting she wants to study in Thai language in university I would suggest she studies in the Thai program of a private school. My school has both a Thai program (5/6 periods of english a week), but I work in the English Program, where most of their subjects are done in english. Despite this, many of my students went to study in Thai language programs in university (3 got into medicine, one in an international program). Either way you go, she might have to study in extra tutorial classes (which I detest), to help her get into a Thai language program. Students who study in Thai language at school generally struggle with learning in english at university. As for fees, my school charges about 120K a year for the EP and about 40K a year for the Thai program. This is a private school. Other schools may charge more or less. I'm sure your niece would be close to the top in my english class, but may be about a year behind in the other subjects. But because her english is good, I'm sure she can catch up, as long as she is competent in those subjects.

Those fees sound similar to what we are hearing.

It makes sense to me, for her to study in Thai, but with plenty of English classes.

Maybe you could PM me the details of the school?

[culicine]

It's important to consider what you want her to do after school. Are you ok with her studying in english language in an International program in Thailand? If she is insisting she wants to study in Thai language in university I would suggest she studies in the Thai program of a private school. My school has both a Thai program (5/6 periods of english a week), but I work in the English Program, where most of their subjects are done in english. Despite this, many of my students went to study in Thai language programs in university (3 got into medicine, one in an international program). Either way you go, she might have to study in extra tutorial classes (which I detest), to help her get into a Thai language program. Students who study in Thai language at school generally struggle with learning in english at university. As for fees, my school charges about 120K a year for the EP and about 40K a year for the Thai program. This is a private school. Other schools may charge more or less. I'm sure your niece would be close to the top in my english class, but may be about a year behind in the other subjects. But because her english is good, I'm sure she can catch up, as long as she is competent in those subjects.

Those fees sound similar to what we are hearing.

It makes sense to me, for her to study in Thai, but with plenty of English classes.

Maybe you could PM me the details of the school?

Where do you live? It makes more sense to put her is a school close t where you live.

[FiftyTwo]

"Pass entrance exams" = ask how much the bribe is.

[Scott]

Actually, quite a few of the private schools don't take bribes. I know a few people have tried. The point is to find one that has openings and have her take the 'entrance' test. If she passes 1/2 of the exams at some schools, which are Math, Thai language, English and one other test (I believe), she is eligible for admission. The question then is do they have a space for her.

If she passes, but there are others with higher grades, they will get in first. So, it is a matter of passing the minimum number of tests and with a little bit of luck.

There are a lot of students who take multiple tests and then chose the best school, so if she passes and puts her money down, she should get in.

Best of luck and keep us posted.

[culicine]

"Pass entrance exams" = ask how much the bribe is.

Not my school and definitely not for entrance for M4. We had a M3 student leave in the middle of the year to go to an international school. Her and her parents were not happy with the quality of learning there. She tried to return but had to sit the entrance exam as she was coming back but as a new student. She failed all tests and was rejected. Only one new student was accepted for that batch and she is doing quite well. For the current students, they must also sit entrance exams. If they get less than 50% (combined scores over M3 results, entrance exams, and summer school exam), they must go to the language stream. The better students get a choice of stream. The school seems more lenient with entrance to M1 though- quite a number of the students fail multiple subjects. One was asked to repeat the year, so his parent pulled him out.

I think bribery will be more common in the 'famous' government schools, where they have limited places. Being benefactors of the school is not just limited to Thailand though. I'm personally not against it, as long as the money goes to improving teaching/resources of the school. Buy obviously this does not necessarily happen.

[CWMcMurray]

I trust she is in a tabien Baan some where, correct ?

If so, that means that there is 1 school that will be required to take her by law

But depending where that is, your wife is correct that it could be a very bad school.

Any other school would need to be tested into

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[CWMcMurray]

Also if local government school it is not just a matter of being accepted but also what class she is placed in

My wife's little brother is in M3 at government school here in BKK

There are 11 classes in his grade. Luckily he is in class number 2

The first 3 classes are math/science focused for college prep

Then the next 4 classes are less difficult with less math and science and extra language classes instead.

From what he has said... First 3 classes have the smartest kids and all are on track for going to university

For the next 4, it is a mix of those likely to go to university and some who likely won't ...

Then there are the last 4 classes... He says these are considered those with no chance of going to college... He said for this group, they pretty much don't do anything at school.... Teachers don't bother to teach and students couldn't care less ... Mostly they just play games on their phones and school counters all day...

So perp hasp your wife is worried that if going to school where guaranteed admission, they would just stick her in the bottom class, which would likely be very bad for her

Not just because she may end up not learning anything, but likely to be in classes with all of the worst of the worst that the school has to offer.... Who by default, she would end up making friends with (at least some of them) and things could go down hill from there

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[culicine]

Also if local government school it is not just a matter of being accepted but also what class she is placed in My wife's little brother is in M3 at government school here in BKK There are 11 classes in his grade. Luckily he is in class number 2 The first 3 classes are math/science focused for college prep Then the next 4 classes are less difficult with less math and science and extra language classes instead. From what he has said... First 3 classes have the smartest kids and all are on track for going to university For the next 4, it is a mix of those likely to go to university and some who likely won't ... Then there are the last 4 classes... He says these are considered those with no chance of going to college... He said for this group, they pretty much don't do anything at school.... Teachers don't bother to teach and students couldn't care less ... Mostly they just play games on their phones and school counters all day... So perp hasp your wife is worried that if going to school where guaranteed admission, they would just stick her in the bottom class, which would likely be very bad for her Not just because she may end up not learning anything, but likely to be in classes with all of the worst of the worst that the school has to offer.... Who by default, she would end up making friends with (at least some of them) and things could go down hill from there Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

Well after spending 3 years studying in Australia, a Thai government school is about the worst place she could go to. You are correct; she may do poorly in the entrance exam and end up in a low stream. Her English level will rapidly go down hill and will be totally bored with the english classes.

[RoboLB]

Thanks for all the tips. She lives in Bang Plad. We may have found a school not too far away.

[Ruin]

Robo, the better Thai Schools like Mater Dei are better than the cheap international schools. Getting into Thai college depends on her major. Science based majors have tougher competition, medicine and engineering in particular. Business (BBA) is not a problem. Most people can get into ABAC, it just means paying their fees.

Don't know if you could afford the top 4 international schools ISB, Ruamrudee, Patana, NIST. They would guarantee her college entrance, they are that good, but could cost 400k a year.

[lost_in_space]

It's important to consider what you want her to do after school. Are you ok with her studying in english language in an International program in Thailand? If she is insisting she wants to study in Thai language in university I would suggest she studies in the Thai program of a private school. My school has both a Thai program (5/6 periods of english a week), but I work in the English Program, where most of their subjects are done in english. Despite this, many of my students went to study in Thai language programs in university (3 got into medicine, one in an international program). Either way you go, she might have to study in extra tutorial classes (which I detest), to help her get into a Thai language program. Students who study in Thai language at school generally struggle with learning in english at university. As for fees, my school charges about 120K a year for the EP and about 40K a year for the Thai program. This is a private school. Other schools may charge more or less. I'm sure your niece would be close to the top in my english class, but may be about a year behind in the other subjects. But because her english is good, I'm sure she can catch up, as long as she is competent in those subjects.

Those fees sound similar to what we are hearing.

It makes sense to me, for her to study in Thai, but with plenty of English classes.

Maybe you could PM me the details of the school?

Where do you live? It makes more sense to put her is a school close t where you live.

I agree. I've seen school vans with kids go by my house before sunrise and after sunset, they must spend hours on them every day. I feel sorry for those kids. I chose my daughter's school because it's close to home and she can get enough sleep at night.

[culicine]

It's important to consider what you want her to do after school. Are you ok with her studying in english language in an International program in Thailand? If she is insisting she wants to study in Thai language in university I would suggest she studies in the Thai program of a private school. My school has both a Thai program (5/6 periods of english a week), but I work in the English Program, where most of their subjects are done in english. Despite this, many of my students went to study in Thai language programs in university (3 got into medicine, one in an international program). Either way you go, she might have to study in extra tutorial classes (which I detest), to help her get into a Thai language program. Students who study in Thai language at school generally struggle with learning in english at university. As for fees, my school charges about 120K a year for the EP and about 40K a year for the Thai program. This is a private school. Other schools may charge more or less. I'm sure your niece would be close to the top in my english class, but may be about a year behind in the other subjects. But because her english is good, I'm sure she can catch up, as long as she is competent in those subjects.

Those fees sound similar to what we are hearing.

It makes sense to me, for her to study in Thai, but with plenty of English classes.

Maybe you could PM me the details of the school?

Where do you live? It makes more sense to put her is a school close t where you live.

I agree. I've seen school vans with kids go by my house before sunrise and after sunset, they must spend hours on them every day. I feel sorry for those kids. I chose my daughter's school because it's close to home and she can get enough sleep at night.

I see some school vans in my village there, around 6am picking up kids. I leave about 6.15am with my son and go to school. I need to be there at 7.30am. The day is too long for kids here, and they are generally too exhausted to do homework.

[Mudcrab]

2) Quite simply the High Schools here in Australia are a year or two behind Thailand academically.

??????????????????????????? What school did you send her to in Australia?????

[wolfmanjack]

Actually, quite a few of the private schools don't take bribes. I know a few people have tried. The point is to find one that has openings and have her take the 'entrance' test. If she passes 1/2 of the exams at some schools, which are Math, Thai language, English and one other test (I believe), she is eligible for admission. The question then is do they have a space for her.

If she passes, but there are others with higher grades, they will get in first. So, it is a matter of passing the minimum number of tests and with a little bit of luck.

There are a lot of students who take multiple tests and then chose the best school, so if she passes and puts her money down, she should get in.

Best of luck and keep us posted.

How do they take multiple tests? I tried that with my son and all of the tests were on the same day so we had to choose a school and hope he passed.

One of the private schools did have it where if he did not pass their tests that they would find another school that would take him but some of the others schools did not have that option. They said if he did not pass he would most likely have to wait a year or wait to see if another school that did not get enough students had a second test.

[rotary]

This is not quite the same as the problem the OP has but:

Many many years ago I sent 2 kids to a what was at the time considered to be a very good multi-lingual school in a large up country town. The kids hated it pretty much, they were not learning English all that well and their Thai was marginal. After 3 years we sent them to normal Thai school, they liked it much better, learned Thai very well but lacked in English. In the end one of the kids caught up on English and while not totally fluent she is very close to it. She went to a university in Thailand with almost all subjects in English and will graduate very soon. She is planning on going to nursing school in the west and after speaking with her the entrance office says she gets extra points for entrance as she is fluent in 2 languages. I guess there are 2 lines of thought on the education process as to Thai education or outside Thailand. I believe either solution works with the right child under the right conditions.

[senor123]

2) Quite simply the High Schools here in Australia are a year or two behind Thailand academically.

??????????????????????????? What school did you send her to in Australia?????

Sounds about right to me.

I have spoken to a couple of Thai women living in Sydney who are not happy here but have children.

The only reason they are staying is so that their kids can get a good education.

I guess I am missing something.

[bangkapi]

No matter where she graduates from High School in the world, she can easily study university in Thailand.

Assumption University is easy for anyone to get into. It's known as ABAC.

If she prefers to study in a university with Thai instruction, I ask, "Why"?

[culicine]

2) Quite simply the High Schools here in Australia are a year or two behind Thailand academically.

??????????????????????????? What school did you send her to in Australia?????

I'm trained in the high school maths curriculum in NSW so I know the curriculum well. I would say in NSW, the kids would be about a year behind in maths until about Junior certificate. Fore example, quite a number of topics I teach to M3 would be taught at grade 10 in Australia. However, the senior high school maths curriculum, at extension level, is more rigorous and in-depth than the senior curriculum in Thailand. Arguably, the NSW curriculum is superior as it focuses on calculus and higher level topics. In Thailand, calculators are not allowed in Thai schools (mine use them as it's an EP), so students can't really go very deep into advanced topics. Imagine using log tables from 50 years ago, just to do logarithms lol

[culicine]

2) Quite simply the High Schools here in Australia are a year or two behind Thailand academically.

??????????????????????????? What school did you send her to in Australia?????

Sounds about right to me.

I have spoken to a couple of Thai women living in Sydney who are not happy here but have children.

The only reason they are staying is so that their kids can get a good education.

I guess I am missing something.

As I just posted, if they can finish high school with good grades in advanced subjects - math extension 1, 2, chem, physics, they will be much more advanced and well rounded than Thai graduates. And will certainly have a much better understanding of the topics.

[philliphn]

2) Quite simply the High Schools here in Australia are a year or two behind Thailand academically.

??????????????????????????? What school did you send her to in Australia?????

Everything that i ever heard. Said things were the other way around. Please, explain this?

[louse1953]

2) Quite simply the High Schools here in Australia are a year or two behind Thailand academically.

??????????????????????????? What school did you send her to in Australia?????

I'm trained in the high school maths curriculum in NSW so I know the curriculum well. I would say in NSW, the kids would be about a year behind in maths until about Junior certificate. Fore example, quite a number of topics I teach to M3 would be taught at grade 10 in Australia. However, the senior high school maths curriculum, at extension level, is more rigorous and in-depth than the senior curriculum in Thailand. Arguably, the NSW curriculum is superior as it focuses on calculus and higher level topics. In Thailand, calculators are not allowed in Thai schools (mine use them as it's an EP), so students can't really go very deep into advanced topics. Imagine using log tables from 50 years ago, just to do logarithms lol

Total use of calculators are a problem,when the kids come onto a building site,they can't do maths in their head,i had to do it for them.Frustrating for me,as they are better educated than me,but can't do the basics.

[belg]

so your great idea to bring her to australia backfired for the rest of her education... but seriously, how good/bad was she in that thai school before you brought her ?

not everybody is a bright light when it comes to learning, and the best way is to accept that is reality

[Chao Lao Beach]

"Pass entrance exams" = ask how much the bribe is.

This is 100% correct, many Gov schools require a six figure bribe.(Baht)

Many private ones, on the initial application there is a spot for you to enter a number of a promised donation upon acceptance that goes to the school, (but doesn't include to the "officer" who wants to meet with you first to "check" everything is right. Thai schools make the Royal Thai Police force look amateurish when it comes to bribes.

What part of Thailand you looking at ?

The child may desire Thailand for Uni as she is guaranteed of passing and it is easy compared to Oz, but, form what I have seen, she will have a much better employment prospect with a Oz degree in Thailand.

When you say that Oz Gov schools are expensive, how much you talking about ? (I presume that she was not processed as a Aust Perm Res)

[culicine]

2) Quite simply the High Schools here in Australia are a year or two behind Thailand academically.

??????????????????????????? What school did you send her to in Australia?????

I'm trained in the high school maths curriculum in NSW so I know the curriculum well. I would say in NSW, the kids would be about a year behind in maths until about Junior certificate. Fore example, quite a number of topics I teach to M3 would be taught at grade 10 in Australia. However, the senior high school maths curriculum, at extension level, is more rigorous and in-depth than the senior curriculum in Thailand. Arguably, the NSW curriculum is superior as it focuses on calculus and higher level topics. In Thailand, calculators are not allowed in Thai schools (mine use them as it's an EP), so students can't really go very deep into advanced topics. Imagine using log tables from 50 years ago, just to do logarithms lol

Total use of calculators are a problem,when the kids come onto a building site,they can't do maths in their head,i had to do it for them.Frustrating for me,as they are better educated than me,but can't do the basics.

Our students aren't allowed to use calculators until 8th grade. They should have developed basic mental arithmetic skills by then. Thai kids got by without them for 12 years in school, but many still seem to lack mental math skills. Just look at those working in shops - have to subtract 85 from 100 with a calculator.

Calculators can be used in primary to aid in understanding concepts - but not to replace mental skills.

[Scott]

It has not been very many years that a large % of the population only attend school to the 6th or 9th grade maximum. Many of the people you meet in daily life are not well educated.

After primary school, most students have to apply for lower high school -- Grades 7, 8 and 9. After Grade 9, they must reapply for upper level mathyom, Grades 10, 11 and 12.

A lot of students are weeded out and many of them end up in the notorious vocational schools.

Even within a particular school, a lot of students are weeded out. One of our G. 9 classes had 32 students in it but only 2 students were permitted to stay for G. 10. They were the worst class, but that's still a lot of students who couldn't continue their education.

The high schools, therefore, have relatively high standards and can be relatively selective who they accept. As the country moves toward universal education through G. 12, you will see a drop in the standards.

[salapau]

What are your neice's parents doing, it seems that you and your wife have taken over their duty as well as incurring costs ?