EC member brushes aside govt-initiated forum on election

[LevelHead]

It is very simple in my opinion and my opinion is below :

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. It has to be carried out before February the 6th or the caretaker government will be in breach of the constitution and the PDRC will pretty surely in my opinion on Feb 7th be straight along to file a complain with the Constitution Court to get a new PM appointed.

The Constitution of Thailand says that an election is to be held within a fixed timescale (presently Feb 6th is the deadline), and if the seats are not filled then by-elections are to be held until the seats are filled.

Until 95% of the seats are filled by way of election, or series of by-elections after the initial election, the caretaker government stays in power.

When by-elections have been held, over and over again if necessary, and 95% of the seats are filled then the new parliament is in effect.

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. The only way it can be delayed is if the Constitution Court rules in advance that it can be delayed. If there is no Constitution Court ruling in advance that it may be delayed then any delay will breach the Constitution and the Constitution Court will find the caretaker PM and the caretaker government in breach.

[LevelHead]

As the world turns and ponders on the age-old fundamental questions - can Pheu Thai think ? - and if so, will they make the obvious decision and acquiesce to the EC's suggestion and delay the election ? Or will they barrel ahead, full cylinders thrusting - gleefully towards an election that will result in a parliament that cannot be opened ? We have to give Pheu Thai a lot of time for this decision. It's really tough.

On the other hand, stop thinking. Just do it.

You mean the constitutionally mandated schedule for elections ??

That constitution that the democrats are so adamant to defend ??

The constitution does not mandate Feb. 2 for elections. The constitution allows 180 days which means before May 9. May 4 has been proposed by the EC but Thaksin knows the dormant Amnesty Bill will expire before then so he and his propagandists are hysterical that the election take place Feb. 2. Why are you so strongly in favor of elections on Feb. 2 when it is clear they will be for naught? Are you a Thaksin propagandist? What are your motives for wanting the election on Feb. 2? Instead of putting the idea of waiting down, give us one good reason, besides the fact that they are already scheduled, why they need to be in such a hurry to hold elections.

Please read - http://www.senate.go...itution2007.pdf to enlighten you.

It states on dissolving the house, the election must be held not less than 45 days and not more than 60 days after.

The 180 days is when an election has *already* been held with no result. Then the caretaker government and the EC must schedule new elections within 180 days.

Well said ! My opinion is below :

The caretaker PM and caretaker government are well aware , however the media in Thailand appears to be trying to portray them as bad for not delaying, knowing full well this is baiting them into a trap.

If there is no election attempted by Feb 6th, whether successful or not, then the caretaker PM and caretaker government will breach the Constitution and its game over.

So the election has to go ahead.

[seajae]

Mr Somchai has made his views clear. Perhaps it's time for him to step aside in favour of someone with a more pragmatic approach.

you mean someone that will do what the ptp, thaksin and the reds tell him to. This is about everyone, not just the lapdogs of the ptp but with your bias you simply cannot see it just as you cannot see that it is people from all walks of life protesting, not just yellows.

[icommunity]

It is very simple in my opinion and my opinion is below :

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. It has to be carried out before February the 6th or the caretaker government will be in breach of the constitution and the PDRC will pretty surely in my opinion on Feb 7th be straight along to file a complain with the Constitution Court to get a new PM appointed.

The Constitution of Thailand says that an election is to be held within a fixed timescale (presently Feb 6th is the deadline), and if the seats are not filled then by-elections are to be held until the seats are filled.

Until 95% of the seats are filled by way of election, or series of by-elections after the initial election, the caretaker government stays in power.

When by-elections have been held, over and over again if necessary, and 95% of the seats are filled then the new parliament is in effect.

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. The only way it can be delayed is if the Constitution Court rules in advance that it can be delayed. If there is no Constitution Court ruling in advance that it may be delayed then any delay will breach the Constitution and the Constitution Court will find the caretaker PM and the caretaker government in breach.

I agreed with you. Only that the Constitution Court cannot rules in advance that it can be delayed. It will be unconstitutional if the section concerned is not amended. The CC is to follow the law passed by parliament. They have no power to make law and ruling must follow the principle of justice and evidence, not personal opinions.

[LevelHead]

It is very simple in my opinion and my opinion is below :

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. It has to be carried out before February the 6th or the caretaker government will be in breach of the constitution and the PDRC will pretty surely in my opinion on Feb 7th be straight along to file a complain with the Constitution Court to get a new PM appointed.

The Constitution of Thailand says that an election is to be held within a fixed timescale (presently Feb 6th is the deadline), and if the seats are not filled then by-elections are to be held until the seats are filled.

Until 95% of the seats are filled by way of election, or series of by-elections after the initial election, the caretaker government stays in power.

When by-elections have been held, over and over again if necessary, and 95% of the seats are filled then the new parliament is in effect.

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. The only way it can be delayed is if the Constitution Court rules in advance that it can be delayed. If there is no Constitution Court ruling in advance that it may be delayed then any delay will breach the Constitution and the Constitution Court will find the caretaker PM and the caretaker government in breach.

I agreed with you. Only that the Constitution Court cannot rules in advance that it can be delayed. It will be unconstitutional if the section concerned is not amended. The CC is to follow the law passed by parliament. They have no power to make law and ruling must follow the principle of justice and evidence, not personal opinions.

Thanks, so its all very clear then.

The law of the land says an election has to be held by Feb 6th.

It can only be delayed in the event of a national emergency, like countrywide flooding or earthquake or something.

In the absence of national emergency the election has to go ahead, whether it is successful or not. If not successful then by-elections can be held in individual constituencies or if a total failure a new election can be called within 180 days of the failed one.

Caretaker PM and cabinet stay in power until a successful election is held.

A caretaker prime minister and their caretaker cabinet would be in breach of the constitution and in serious trouble if they delayed an election for any other reason other than that of a national emergency.

I think my opinion above just about covers it then now.

[LevelHead]

I therefore do not see what the problem is.

Have an election.

EC declares the election void.

Constitution states that another election must be held in 180 days.

180 days allows for reforms to be made under the present caretaker government in line with the Constitution.

Democrats can enter the next election. All very simple and the Constitution of Thailand is correctly adhered to by all parties.

If everyone holds the Constitution as the law, then it must be adhered to, which means the 2nd Feb election cannot be delayed.

[jonclark]

It is very simple in my opinion and my opinion is below :

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. It has to be carried out before February the 6th or the caretaker government will be in breach of the constitution and the PDRC will pretty surely in my opinion on Feb 7th be straight along to file a complain with the Constitution Court to get a new PM appointed.

The Constitution of Thailand says that an election is to be held within a fixed timescale (presently Feb 6th is the deadline), and if the seats are not filled then by-elections are to be held until the seats are filled.

Until 95% of the seats are filled by way of election, or series of by-elections after the initial election, the caretaker government stays in power.

When by-elections have been held, over and over again if necessary, and 95% of the seats are filled then the new parliament is in effect.

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. The only way it can be delayed is if the Constitution Court rules in advance that it can be delayed. If there is no Constitution Court ruling in advance that it may be delayed then any delay will breach the Constitution and the Constitution Court will find the caretaker PM and the caretaker government in breach.

I agreed with you. Only that the Constitution Court cannot rules in advance that it can be delayed. It will be unconstitutional if the section concerned is not amended. The CC is to follow the law passed by parliament. They have no power to make law and ruling must follow the principle of justice and evidence, not personal opinions.

Thanks, so its all very clear then.

The law of the land says an election has to be held by Feb 6th.

It can only be delayed in the event of a national emergency, like countrywide flooding or earthquake or something.

In the absence of national emergency the election has to go ahead, whether it is successful or not. If not successful then by-elections can be held in individual constituencies or if a total failure a new election can be called within 180 days of the failed one.

Caretaker PM and cabinet stay in power until a successful election is held.

A caretaker prime minister and their caretaker cabinet would be in breach of the constitution and in serious trouble if they delayed an election for any other reason other than that of a national emergency.

I think my opinion above just about covers it then now.

The only problem is that the questions being asked cannot be answered by an election. Large sections of society support PTP and large sections of society do not. We have a society of polar opposites and supporters who are vocal and vociferous in their near hatred of each other.

Returning PTP to power will not pacify those who are opposed to PTP and all it stands for. The idea that keeps being bleated "democracy and we have the majority" is of little concern to those who oppose the, at times shambolic mis-administration of the country. Returning PTP will not change their views of opposition. The protests will not go away, Thailand will remain bogged down in a stalemate

The simplest analogy i can give to this election as a panacea to Thailand's problems is this - Imagine going to a doctor complaining of a broken arm (protestors complaints) and he amputated your leg (election results)- Oversimplistic - perhaps but it gets the point across that the symptom has not been addressed and still persists and the medication has only made matters worse

Edited January 14, 2014 by jonclark

[LevelHead]

It is very simple in my opinion and my opinion is below :

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. It has to be carried out before February the 6th or the caretaker government will be in breach of the constitution and the PDRC will pretty surely in my opinion on Feb 7th be straight along to file a complain with the Constitution Court to get a new PM appointed.

The Constitution of Thailand says that an election is to be held within a fixed timescale (presently Feb 6th is the deadline), and if the seats are not filled then by-elections are to be held until the seats are filled.

Until 95% of the seats are filled by way of election, or series of by-elections after the initial election, the caretaker government stays in power.

When by-elections have been held, over and over again if necessary, and 95% of the seats are filled then the new parliament is in effect.

The caretaker government cannot delay the election. The only way it can be delayed is if the Constitution Court rules in advance that it can be delayed. If there is no Constitution Court ruling in advance that it may be delayed then any delay will breach the Constitution and the Constitution Court will find the caretaker PM and the caretaker government in breach.

I agreed with you. Only that the Constitution Court cannot rules in advance that it can be delayed. It will be unconstitutional if the section concerned is not amended. The CC is to follow the law passed by parliament. They have no power to make law and ruling must follow the principle of justice and evidence, not personal opinions.

Thanks, so its all very clear then.

The law of the land says an election has to be held by Feb 6th.

It can only be delayed in the event of a national emergency, like countrywide flooding or earthquake or something.

In the absence of national emergency the election has to go ahead, whether it is successful or not. If not successful then by-elections can be held in individual constituencies or if a total failure a new election can be called within 180 days of the failed one.

Caretaker PM and cabinet stay in power until a successful election is held.

A caretaker prime minister and their caretaker cabinet would be in breach of the constitution and in serious trouble if they delayed an election for any other reason other than that of a national emergency.

I think my opinion above just about covers it then now.

The only problem is that the questions being asked cannot be answered by an election. Large sections of society support PTP and large sections of society do not. We have a society of polar opposites and supporters who are vocal and vociferous in their near hatred of each other.

Returning PTP to power will not pacify those who are opposed to PTP and all it stands for. The idea that keeps being bleated "democracy and we have the majority" is of little concern to those who oppose the, at times shambolic mis-administration of the country. Returning PTP will not change their views of opposition. The protests will not go away, Thailand will remain bogged down in a stalemate

The simplest analogy i can give to this election as a panacea to Thailand's problems is this - Imagine going to a doctor complaining of a broken arm (protestors complaints) and he amputated your leg (election results)- Oversimplistic - perhaps but it gets the point across that the symptom has not been addressed and still persists and the medication has only made matters worse

That a small section of the country is not happy with PTP is not a real valid concern.

No government will ever have total support, there will always be those who complain. The protests so far have at most only got around 200,000 people, which is less than 0.5% of the Thai population. You cannot hold 99.5% hostage for the whims of the 0.5%.

Majority rule from elections is the fundamental point of all democratic countries.

The rules do not need changing, PTP do not need to be decimated.

It needs a new alternate and real opposition party to come up that will take away the PTP vote.

Most people in Thailand see Suthep and Abhisit and the Democrats as more corrupt than Thaksin, people who have sold their souls time and time again for money and power and land and favour. Now, people can have that opinion, that is their human right and its that opinion which makes the Democrats unelectable. Vote buying is an excuse, a very poor excuse for the simple fact that the Dems are, in my opinion, despised by a large swath of the population.

So the only reform needed is to the opposition, they need to start thinking about the whole country, the whole population, the need to get rid of their perceived corrupt leaders and sponsors and make themselves electable, that is my opinion.

An election with a good opposition is the way to defeat PTP and until the new party comes up, or the Democrats reform themselves and their backers massively.

[Mister Fixit]

As the world turns and ponders on the age-old fundamental questions - can Pheu Thai think ? - and if so, will they make the obvious decision and acquiesce to the EC's suggestion and delay the election ? Or will they barrel ahead, full cylinders thrusting - gleefully towards an election that will result in a parliament that cannot be opened ? We have to give Pheu Thai a lot of time for this decision. It's really tough.

On the other hand, stop thinking. Just do it.

Too difficult for them. It requires a brain.

[NCFC]

Mr Somchai has made his views clear. Perhaps it's time for him to step aside in favour of someone with a more pragmatic approach.

you mean someone that will do what the ptp, thaksin and the reds tell him to. This is about everyone, not just the lapdogs of the ptp but with your bias you simply cannot see it just as you cannot see that it is people from all walks of life protesting, not just yellows.

No it's about following what the constitution says. After the house is dissolved the election must be held between 45 and 60 days.

[Baerboxer]

That a small section of the country is not happy with PTP is not a real valid concern.

No government will ever have total support, there will always be those who complain. The protests so far have at most only got around 200,000 people, which is less than 0.5% of the Thai population. You cannot hold 99.5% hostage for the whims of the 0.5%.

Majority rule from elections is the fundamental point of all democratic countries.

The rules do not need changing, PTP do not need to be decimated.

It needs a new alternate and real opposition party to come up that will take away the PTP vote.

Most people in Thailand see Suthep and Abhisit and the Democrats as more corrupt than Thaksin, people who have sold their souls time and time again for money and power and land and favour. Now, people can have that opinion, that is their human right and its that opinion which makes the Democrats unelectable. Vote buying is an excuse, a very poor excuse for the simple fact that the Dems are, in my opinion, despised by a large swath of the population.

So the only reform needed is to the opposition, they need to start thinking about the whole country, the whole population, the need to get rid of their perceived corrupt leaders and sponsors and make themselves electable, that is my opinion.

An election with a good opposition is the way to defeat PTP and until the new party comes up, or the Democrats reform themselves and their backers massively.

Do you have anything to substantiate this claim or is it simply your opinion/guess ?

I guess your opting for one of the lower protest attendance numbers being banded around indicates where your sympathies lie. But I really don't know any one, and I know a lot of people here, who would say Suthep and Abhsit are more corrupt than Thaksin. His record speaks for itself.