A holiday in Pattaya...

[kiwicouple]

Kiwi thank you for sharing your Very accurate portrayal of Pattaya. You paid a premium price for quality and received poor sub standard quality. The true issue is these places the portray themselves on the internet with 5 star or 4 star and charge western prices and provide 2 or 3 star service in any western country. The cleanliness of food preparation is a major issue not to mention safety and sanitary issues throughout pattaya. You have people who will irrationally defend poor quality or try to tie it to pattaya "edge" as a justification. The air is polluted, the beaches dirty, the wAter is polluted, there are numerous safety issues everywhere and all of this should be overlooked because of the unique sex industry opportunity? The sex industry in pattaya has also changed folks wake up. If restaurants and hotels want to charge western prices then we have a right to demand the same level and quality of service. Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

You are welcome.

The points you make here are very valid indeed.

Seems there are many on here who cry and bawl when ‘outsiders’ have the audacity to tell it as it is.

Thing is though, an outsider that has been here for a three week holiday does not really know "as it is", many people have spent many years here without issue.

i have spent many years here but not many days without issue

Careful Blackman, ‘they’ will be running you out of town for such blasphemy…!

[kiwicouple]

I think the OP should visit Pattaya Sheep Farm, same language and he will feel loved!

Wow, actually I'm not a Kiwi, t'was just a nickname, but way to go... LOL.

[blackman]

You are welcome.

The points you make here are very valid indeed.

Seems there are many on here who cry and bawl when ‘outsiders’ have the audacity to tell it as it is.

Thing is though, an outsider that has been here for a three week holiday does not really know "as it is", many people have spent many years here without issue.

i have spent many years here but not many days without issue

Careful Blackman, ‘they’ will be running you out of town for such blasphemy…!

thanks for your concern but don't worry, most people think i am at best eccentric and at worst psychotic

consequently they give me a wide berth, even the few friends i have call first before visiting to check what kind of day i am having

my wife ties a pork chop around my neck so the dog is more inclined to play with me ...

[age4short]

If you've been too pattaya many times surely you would know what to expect, I I agree overall 5 star in pats & many other places in reality is 3 star, i live in NZ & been to pats many times (not as a sex tourist) & usually just go with the flow & enjoy the experience.

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[fredob43]

I lived in Patt's for several year's and it finally drove me out the OP is spot on in every respect. It's at best the pit's. Have just been there returned yesterday with some of my chums for one of our fishing trips, BKK where we normally go is at present a no go.

No bugger SMILES and the service in all the place's we went was non excitant, food very pore in both quality and quantity (how about 3 very small prawns in an Indian curry) I wont go down the price road, yes most thing's are available one of the main reasons for being there so the local expat's tell me. (Most have not been any ware else so don't know)

Sorry you had a bad time please come again to Thailand but what ever you do don't go to any of the tourist place's they have gotten worse as the year's progress. I have not been back to Patt's for over a year and it's gone down hill big time. Will I ever return like you NO.

I have read many post about the Russians being a problem met several this time and they all seemed very nice. I have no doubt that they like all nations have their bad one's. The worst behaved peep's I saw I hate to say this were my own country men English.

Edited January 19, 2014 by fredob43

[kiwicouple]

If you've been too pattaya many times surely you would know what to expect, I I agree overall 5 star in pats & many other places in reality is 3 star, i live in NZ & been to pats many times (not as a sex tourist) & usually just go with the flow & enjoy the experience. Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes, I guess if someones been anywhere many times, they would know what to expect... goes without saying really.

Edited January 19, 2014 by kiwicouple

[Fabulousheart]

The people who defend pattaya tend to be the cheap Charlie's or people with Thai spouses. They have very limited options.

I walked the beach yesterday and had a black sut covering my legs by the time I retuned. I am on my second respiratory issue in a little over 30 days. Most ac units do not have filters so there is no relief from the smog. Pray for winds and rain.

I hope that at some point the Thai people demand clean air, clean water and a proper infrastructure for there own quality of life.

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[simple1]

Age you are completely missing the point. Watch the tele and see all of the ads for luxury resorts, luxury spas , luxury hotels every day. We are barraged with the word luxury on billboards and all forms of media all over pattaya.you hit the nail on the head luxury truly does not exist in pattaya. You can have a fantastic villa or condo but then the safety standards, food standards and not to mention air quality, water quality etc have been well documented by the thai government itself as hazardous. We are barraged with the word luxury over and over again until the point we get suckered in to pay western prices for sub standard products. We are told to embrace the culture and embrace Mai pen rai. And yes I have come to Pattaya for many years and know many many people who live here. Also I know many of the business owners. I have been many times to all of the markets including open air. You take your life in your hands trying to cross the road. There are huge holes dug and left for months on walk ways outside these "luxury" condos. Pattaya at the core is driven by money. Once you understand that and accept money and power rules it can be manageable. I stand by my statement is the cheap Charlie's who irrationally defend things in Pattaya as they have limited options. Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes yes, and yes.

It doesn’t do the country or the ‘locals’ any good if the city is being sold as luxury this and that, but then is found to be somewhat of a cesspool of vice and filth.

..............

Also, I think it’s great that there are those who appreciate living in all of this for their own amusement, but there are plenty of folk living there from birth who would (and do) sell their soul to escape. So to those of you who bad mouth the likes of me for being a bit shocked, or for showing a little empathy for the real locals, try looking at it from their eyes. I’ve seen all sorts of nasty comments since writing my original post, all aimed at me and my wife it seems, but few have actually given thought to those people who would maybe like a better, cleaner, safer environment.

So yeah, knock yourselves out, enjoy the ‘rawness’, pat yourselves on the back for getting down and dirty, but once in a while, give thought to those who would maybe like things a little better but don’t really have a choice, unlike you.

Glad to see you have become an instant expert on the demographic of Pattaya. Local population born and raised in Pattaya is around 50,000 and the vast majority do not wish to "sell their souls to escape" as they wish to be close to their families and earn a living, albeit many only earn the minimum wage of 9k baht a month and struggle to support their families due to higher cost of living in Pattaya. The vast majority of local Pattaya people do not work in the sex industry. How do I know? My Thai extended family is comprised of about 200 locally born and raised Thais that I suggest are a reasonable sample.

You did not generally enjoy Pattaya, but please do not make statements based on assumptions or perhaps a few conversations, most likely with Thais from other Provinces.

Try reading again.... don't misquote,

From your post regarding Pattaya "there are plenty of folk living there from birth who would (and do) sell their soul to escape." I assume you are referencing the sex industry. So from your response this is not a specific reference to Pattaya, but a generalised comment regarding Thai sex workers? If so what qualifies you to make this observation after a week or two in Thailand. How many sex workers did you have a knowledgeable conversation to come to this conclusion? Guarantee you would be unable to separate fact from fiction as to emotional status/causes/motives.

BTW what's your definition of "real Thais" Are you saying Thai sex workers are excluded from 'real Thais'

[Fabulousheart]

What percentage of these luxury condos, hotels , spas, shopping and restaurants are actually enjoyed by Thais? If we eliminate spouses I suspect the actual % is single digits.

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[kiwicouple]

To Simple1

To answer you...

Yes of course I’m sure it could possibly apply to other parts of Thailand, but in this instance I am talking about Pattaya. And no, not just the sex industry as such, but what about the thousands of Thai girls who seek foreigners who are able to get them and their families out of their poverty trap? I'm sure they don't all do it because they think foriegners are sexy and exotic, unlike the guys who flock to them that is!

What qualifies me to make this observation after only a three week holiday?

Don’t be so naïve man, you don’t need to come to Thailand to know this happens all the time. You don’t need to spend three DAYS in Pattaya to see how sleazy it is, let alone three weeks.

I’m sure as you suggest, there are many motivations and causes that lead girls into the sex industry, but for the main, I would argue that money plays a lead part in the majority of cases, and I sure don’t need to sit down and interview them to work that one out.

None of this is what I wanted to say in my OP, but I am just answering your questions.

Oh, and moreover, when you think it doesn’t matter (to the welfare of the city and its people) what a tourist thinks after spending a mere three weeks in Pattaya, think again. Places like Pattaya run on the cash that “tourists” bring in.

If everyone was as self serving as some of the posters here, and would push away married couples, families, older tourists etc, then they are out to turn the place into a complete dump filled with yobs, pervs and idiots. Yes selfish beyond measure.

[RandomSand]

If everyone was as self serving as some of the posters here, and would push away married couples, families, older tourists etc, then they are out to turn the place into a complete dump filled with yobs, pervs and idiots. Yes selfish beyond measure.

Pattaya has been built on the money from, and exists to serve, these yobs, pervs and idiots that you mention.

It's just a not a place for married couples, families, older tourists etc.

I appreciate your very well written OP but it seems like you have a problem accepting what Pattaya really is.

[simple1]

To Simple1

To answer you...

Yes of course I’m sure it could possibly apply to other parts of Thailand, but in this instance I am talking about Pattaya. And no, not just the sex industry as such, but what about the thousands of Thai girls who seek foreigners who are able to get them and their families out of their poverty trap? I'm sure they don't all do it because they think foriegners are sexy and exotic, unlike the guys who flock to them that is!

What qualifies me to make this observation after only a three week holiday?

Don’t be so naïve man, you don’t need to come to Thailand to know this happens all the time. You don’t need to spend three DAYS in Pattaya to see how sleazy it is, let alone three weeks.

I’m sure as you suggest, there are many motivations and causes that lead girls into the sex industry, but for the main, I would argue that money plays a lead part in the majority of cases, and I sure don’t need to sit down and interview them to work that one out.

None of this is what I wanted to say in my OP, but I am just answering your questions.

Oh, and moreover, when you think it doesn’t matter (to the welfare of the city and its people) what a tourist thinks after spending a mere three weeks in Pattaya, think again. Places like Pattaya run on the cash that “tourists” bring in.

If everyone was as self serving as some of the posters here, and would push away married couples, families, older tourists etc, then they are out to turn the place into a complete dump filled with yobs, pervs and idiots. Yes selfish beyond measure.

Thanks for the reply. Pattaya has been on a J curve for tourists for years (as has the whole of Thailand) and I would say for those visiting Pattaya, other than those seeking out sex workers would usually stay for 2/3 days. This has changed with the massive influx of Russian speaking tourists travelling on cheap packages, mainly couples and families who stay for 2/3 weeks. The other primary group is East Asian staying for around a week.

Thailand is notorious for noise pollution, minimal law enforcement and other negatives, yet tourists arrivals are constantly increasing, this year now forecast to be 25 million plus. You & others have had some poor experiences, but at the end of the day will not impact by one iota overall tourist arrivals in Pattaya. On a more positive note why not consider Vietnam or Sri Lanka, both have some great beach locations, good hotels & food and not an 'in your face' sex industry.

Personally I am of the opinion that Thailand does not stand up as an outstanding country for beach and sea holidays, unless you wish to visit some of the islands, even then you need to be careful with your decision on venue/location

Edited January 19, 2014 by simple1

[kiwicouple]

If everyone was as self serving as some of the posters here, and would push away married couples, families, older tourists etc, then they are out to turn the place into a complete dump filled with yobs, pervs and idiots. Yes selfish beyond measure.

Pattaya has been built on the money from, and exists to serve, these yobs, pervs and idiots that you mention.

It's just a not a place for married couples, families, older tourists etc.

I appreciate your very well written OP but it seems like you have a problem accepting what Pattaya really is.

Thank you.

I don’t really have a problem accepting it, as it doesn’t matter much to me, I don’t live there and won’t ever have to put up with or accept any of it in that sense.

I guess there maybe some issue with the fact that there are plenty of businesses, hotels and the like, who advertise Pattaya to be a beachside resort suitable for pretty much every genre. This then puts it in a bad light when folk go home feeling like they wasted their time and money.

My OP was just about our experience, and written from the eyes of an ordinary married couple who didn’t quite expect what we found. Unfortunately, as does happen, there have been a few idiots on the forum who instantly took a dislike to what I said, and resorted to making up assumptions and name calling, as they don’t know how to have a real debate without throwing their toys around. All very silly really.

I have only responded to questions asked, pretty much, but which has led the OP off course.

No, no problem excepting that that’s the way it is. But on saying all of that, I can’t help feeling a little sorry for decent folk who live there, and who have to endure the problems that these kind of people bring with them. Does that really make me a bad person?

In my OP as well as talking about the bad side of our holiday, I did also say that I felt sad for seeing what harm has been bought to Pattaya, the people etc. In other words, I wasn’t just complaining in a self serving way (as really, it is just another holiday for me) but also for the people who really matter, those who live there.

As for the yobs and idiots mentioned... Like attracts like, and where you have bullish louts and idiots, who are happy to immerse themselves in muck, they are never alone for long.

[kiwicouple]

To Simple1

To answer you...

Yes of course I’m sure it could possibly apply to other parts of Thailand, but in this instance I am talking about Pattaya. And no, not just the sex industry as such, but what about the thousands of Thai girls who seek foreigners who are able to get them and their families out of their poverty trap? I'm sure they don't all do it because they think foriegners are sexy and exotic, unlike the guys who flock to them that is!

What qualifies me to make this observation after only a three week holiday?

Don’t be so naïve man, you don’t need to come to Thailand to know this happens all the time. You don’t need to spend three DAYS in Pattaya to see how sleazy it is, let alone three weeks.

I’m sure as you suggest, there are many motivations and causes that lead girls into the sex industry, but for the main, I would argue that money plays a lead part in the majority of cases, and I sure don’t need to sit down and interview them to work that one out.

None of this is what I wanted to say in my OP, but I am just answering your questions.

Oh, and moreover, when you think it doesn’t matter (to the welfare of the city and its people) what a tourist thinks after spending a mere three weeks in Pattaya, think again. Places like Pattaya run on the cash that “tourists” bring in.

If everyone was as self serving as some of the posters here, and would push away married couples, families, older tourists etc, then they are out to turn the place into a complete dump filled with yobs, pervs and idiots. Yes selfish beyond measure.

Thanks for the reply. Pattaya has been on a J curve for tourists for years (as has the whole of Thailand) and I would say for those visiting Pattaya, other than those seeking out sex workers would usually stay for 2/3 days. This has changed with the massive influx of Russian speaking tourists travelling on cheap packages, mainly couples and families who stay for 2/3 weeks. The other primary group is East Asian staying for around a week.

Thailand is notorious for noise pollution, minimal law enforcement and other negatives, yet tourists arrivals are constantly increasing, this year now forecast to be 25 million plus. You & others have had some poor experiences, but at the end of the day will not impact by one iota overall tourist arrivals in Pattaya. On a more positive note why not consider Vietnam or Sri Lanka, both have some great beach locations, good hotels & food and not an 'in your face' sex industry.

Personally I am of the opinion that Thailand does not stand up as an outstanding country for beach and sea holidays, unless you wish to visit some of the islands, even then you need to be careful with your decision on venue/location

Thank you.

I agree with all of that. Yes, I’ve been to Sri Lanka/Maldives. Sri Lanka is more like a cleaner version of Indian mainland (if you avoid the capital Colombo and head south west). Maldives, clean, almost clinically clean on some of the islands.

Yes Pattaya was a bad choice for us, which we ourselves made. No harm done.

[anon8]

Age you are completely missing the point. Watch the tele and see all of the ads for luxury resorts, luxury spas , luxury hotels every day. We are barraged with the word luxury on billboards and all forms of media all over pattaya.you hit the nail on the head luxury truly does not exist in pattaya. You can have a fantastic villa or condo but then the safety standards, food standards and not to mention air quality, water quality etc have been well documented by the thai government itself as hazardous. We are barraged with the word luxury over and over again until the point we get suckered in to pay western prices for sub standard products. We are told to embrace the culture and embrace Mai pen rai. And yes I have come to Pattaya for many years and know many many people who live here. Also I know many of the business owners. I have been many times to all of the markets including open air. You take your life in your hands trying to cross the road. There are huge holes dug and left for months on walk ways outside these "luxury" condos. Pattaya at the core is driven by money. Once you understand that and accept money and power rules it can be manageable. I stand by my statement is the cheap Charlie's who irrationally defend things in Pattaya as they have limited options. Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes yes, and yes.

It doesn’t do the country or the ‘locals’ any good if the city is being sold as luxury this and that, but then is found to be somewhat of a cesspool of vice and filth.

..............

Also, I think it’s great that there are those who appreciate living in all of this for their own amusement, but there are plenty of folk living there from birth who would (and do) sell their soul to escape. So to those of you who bad mouth the likes of me for being a bit shocked, or for showing a little empathy for the real locals, try looking at it from their eyes. I’ve seen all sorts of nasty comments since writing my original post, all aimed at me and my wife it seems, but few have actually given thought to those people who would maybe like a better, cleaner, safer environment.

So yeah, knock yourselves out, enjoy the ‘rawness’, pat yourselves on the back for getting down and dirty, but once in a while, give thought to those who would maybe like things a little better but don’t really have a choice, unlike you.

You were here for few days. You were freaked out by rats by Beach rd after dark. You have never been to SE Asia before, that much is clear. You call our town a cesspool. Who do you know here, how many Pattaya residents do you know, to call our place a cesspool?

Pattaya is not for you. Just like stones, sheep and green hills of NZ are not for most Pattaya residents.

Do you notice how non of replies here insult your home, NZ? Wanna know why? Cos its your home, residents of our 'cesspool' have enough tact not to offend you, and your home, cos its just not done. A polite guest never disrespects other peoples home.

How long are you gonna keep posting about people living in Pattaya having no options, and similar nonsense, over and over. You don't have a first clue about this place, and people who live here.

Dont tell me about my options, you dont know me, or anybody else in here!

You complain how there are nasty comments here directed at you.

Your whole thread is an insult after insult to every Pattaya resident. Curiously some of us, Pattaya residents keep giving your whining posts thumbs up. But only a few.

[anon8]

Oh and there it goes, i wondered when your rant about a little tummy upset and an iffy hotel would turn into a full blown Pattaya bash.

You were here for a 3 week holiday <deleted>, and know you think you know how/what the locals feel, you are priceless!!

That was clear from get go.

This guy visits Pattaya for few days, then comes to TV Pattaya forum, posts an endless, whining, boring page long post about how awful this place is. Calls Pattaya a cesspool, tells us we are too poor to live anywhere else, THEN complains how he is treated unfairly? LOL

[Fabulousheart]

Val get a life. You are either a cheap Charlie or married to a Thai with very limited options. Stop attacking kiwi for sharing his experience. Look at the tha governments own report advising all citizens to wear masks because the sir quality is hazaderous. Also look at the Thai government report on water with running sewers into most waterways along with oil and manufacturing waste. I can not walk the beach or roads of pattaya without having to shower as my legs have black sut on them.why is that? We are breathing that in val. Safety issues abound as mentioned over and over again. From 6 ft deep holes in toads and sidewalks to building issues to live electric wires hanging down. The most refi cultus thing I saw on tele last night pattaya wants to attract disabled tourist. I know people here in chairs and to say they are limited on what and where they go without significant help or dangerously having to wheel in the roads with motorbikes coming right on top of them.

If pattaya tourism is going to continue advertising luxury hotels, spas, restaurants and now handicapped friendly there will be an enormous back lash. They are charging western prices in many of these places cost more then the capitals of Europe. One place started at $450 a night and numerous places charging $250 plus a night.

There are lovely condos and hotels but once you step out the infrastructure is dangerous from any health and safety measure.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[HeavyDrinker]

The problem is that for Heart is that he seems stuck in a rut of thought. Either he is projecting his own life/experiences on to what he has seen in Pattaya but his reliance on soundbites like ''limited options'' and ''cheap charlies'' are utterly meaningless as he seems unable to elaborate any of his points.

I'd say that his invented list above could be applied to anywhere in Thailand, poor water management, poor infrastructure etc... including wherever he lives his own ''limited option cheap charlie'' life....

[blackman]

Age you are completely missing the point. Watch the tele and see all of the ads for luxury resorts, luxury spas , luxury hotels every day. We are barraged with the word luxury on billboards and all forms of media all over pattaya.you hit the nail on the head luxury truly does not exist in pattaya. You can have a fantastic villa or condo but then the safety standards, food standards and not to mention air quality, water quality etc have been well documented by the thai government itself as hazardous. We are barraged with the word luxury over and over again until the point we get suckered in to pay western prices for sub standard products. We are told to embrace the culture and embrace Mai pen rai. And yes I have come to Pattaya for many years and know many many people who live here. Also I know many of the business owners. I have been many times to all of the markets including open air. You take your life in your hands trying to cross the road. There are huge holes dug and left for months on walk ways outside these "luxury" condos. Pattaya at the core is driven by money. Once you understand that and accept money and power rules it can be manageable. I stand by my statement is the cheap Charlie's who irrationally defend things in Pattaya as they have limited options. Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes yes, and yes.

It doesn’t do the country or the ‘locals’ any good if the city is being sold as luxury this and that, but then is found to be somewhat of a cesspool of vice and filth.

..............

Also, I think it’s great that there are those who appreciate living in all of this for their own amusement, but there are plenty of folk living there from birth who would (and do) sell their soul to escape. So to those of you who bad mouth the likes of me for being a bit shocked, or for showing a little empathy for the real locals, try looking at it from their eyes. I’ve seen all sorts of nasty comments since writing my original post, all aimed at me and my wife it seems, but few have actually given thought to those people who would maybe like a better, cleaner, safer environment.

So yeah, knock yourselves out, enjoy the ‘rawness’, pat yourselves on the back for getting down and dirty, but once in a while, give thought to those who would maybe like things a little better but don’t really have a choice, unlike you.

You were here for few days. You were freaked out by rats by Beach rd after dark. You have never been to SE Asia before, that much is clear. You call our town a cesspool. Who do you know here, how many Pattaya residents do you know, to call our place a cesspool?

Pattaya is not for you. Just like stones, sheep and green hills of NZ are not for most Pattaya residents.

Do you notice how non of replies here insult your home, NZ? Wanna know why? Cos its your home, residents of our 'cesspool' have enough tact not to offend you, and your home, cos its just not done. A polite guest never disrespects other peoples home.

How long are you gonna keep posting about people living in Pattaya having no options, and similar nonsense, over and over. You don't have a first clue about this place, and people who live here.

Dont tell me about my options, you dont know me, or anybody else in here!

You complain how there are nasty comments here directed at you.

Your whole thread is an insult after insult to every Pattaya resident. Curiously some of us, Pattaya residents keep giving your whining posts thumbs up. But only a few.

apparently i am one of the few who gives thumbs up but does not use these

[anon8]

Val get a life. You are either a cheap Charlie or married to a Thai with very limited options. Stop attacking kiwi for sharing his experience. Look at the tha governments own report advising all citizens to wear masks because the sir quality is hazaderous. Also look at the Thai government report on water with running sewers into most waterways along with oil and manufacturing waste. I can not walk the beach or roads of pattaya without having to shower as my legs have black sut on them.why is that? We are breathing that in val. Safety issues abound as mentioned over and over again. From 6 ft deep holes in toads and sidewalks to building issues to live electric wires hanging down. The most refi cultus thing I saw on tele last night pattaya wants to attract disabled tourist. I know people here in chairs and to say they are limited on what and where they go without significant help or dangerously having to wheel in the roads with motorbikes coming right on top of them. If pattaya tourism is going to continue advertising luxury hotels, spas, restaurants and now handicapped friendly there will be an enormous back lash. They are charging western prices in many of these places cost more then the capitals of Europe. One place started at $450 a night and numerous places charging $250 plus a night. There are lovely condos and hotels but once you step out the infrastructure is dangerous from any health and safety measure.Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Fabulousheart, I have a life, very nice life.

You say I am attacking OP, pls point out a single attack!

I am not attacking OP, I am pointing out he has no clue what he is talking about, that is not attacking. He simply does not know anything about Pattaya after being here few days.

Please refrain from calling me names, I believe you have no business calling me anything, other than my TV nick, do not call me 'cheap charly', I think we have rules here.

In every post now you keep repeating people who live here have no options. Tell me please, how long have you lived in Pattaya! How many people you know, that makes you an authority?

Let me refresh your memory, Fabulousheart! Less than a week ago you started a topic 'Thappraya Road Near Jomtien', yes?

Here:

Posted 2014-01-16 13:58:04 by Fabulousheart:

Quote:

'I have been here over a month now and all of the bi holes that where dug on the side walks 3 months ago are still dangerously there. Why do they did many giant holes on both sides of the street and leave them open..'

End quote.

So over a month huh? You took pics of some road works, and you were genuinely puzzled as to why are the holes at sidewalk not covered. Well, a resident of Pattaya would not post such a question, maybe as an observation, but not to look for answers.

I understand your curiousity about local road works, but any Pattaya resident has long given up asking those kinds of questions.

You dont live here, do you?

Yet you keep criticising the town, and our residents, agreeing w OP, who was here few days, and you about1 month.

There! You dont know anything.

In every post you keep repeating about Pattaya residents having 'limited options'. How do you know what options we have? How can you be an expert, after 1 month here?

You telling me to get a life, while you take a camera, take photos of some unfinished roadwork, some holes on Trappya, and post it here, sincerely wondering how can this be! lol

You should have seen how Thrappya rd took nearly 3 years to pave and rebuild about 1 km of road. But you weren't here. Yet you seem know what Pattaya is all about, and who are people who live here.

Let me sum it up, just like OP, you don't know anything about Pattaya, and people who live here.

Edit, here is your thread from less than a week ago, first line is how you have now been here over 1 month:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/697109-thapraya-road-near-jomtien/

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Edited January 20, 2014 by valgehiir

[kiwicouple]

Age you are completely missing the point. Watch the tele and see all of the ads for luxury resorts, luxury spas , luxury hotels every day. We are barraged with the word luxury on billboards and all forms of media all over pattaya.you hit the nail on the head luxury truly does not exist in pattaya. You can have a fantastic villa or condo but then the safety standards, food standards and not to mention air quality, water quality etc have been well documented by the thai government itself as hazardous. We are barraged with the word luxury over and over again until the point we get suckered in to pay western prices for sub standard products. We are told to embrace the culture and embrace Mai pen rai. And yes I have come to Pattaya for many years and know many many people who live here. Also I know many of the business owners. I have been many times to all of the markets including open air. You take your life in your hands trying to cross the road. There are huge holes dug and left for months on walk ways outside these "luxury" condos. Pattaya at the core is driven by money. Once you understand that and accept money and power rules it can be manageable. I stand by my statement is the cheap Charlie's who irrationally defend things in Pattaya as they have limited options. Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes yes, and yes.

It doesn’t do the country or the ‘locals’ any good if the city is being sold as luxury this and that, but then is found to be somewhat of a cesspool of vice and filth.

..............

Also, I think it’s great that there are those who appreciate living in all of this for their own amusement, but there are plenty of folk living there from birth who would (and do) sell their soul to escape. So to those of you who bad mouth the likes of me for being a bit shocked, or for showing a little empathy for the real locals, try looking at it from their eyes. I’ve seen all sorts of nasty comments since writing my original post, all aimed at me and my wife it seems, but few have actually given thought to those people who would maybe like a better, cleaner, safer environment.

So yeah, knock yourselves out, enjoy the ‘rawness’, pat yourselves on the back for getting down and dirty, but once in a while, give thought to those who would maybe like things a little better but don’t really have a choice, unlike you.

You were here for few days. You were freaked out by rats by Beach rd after dark. You have never been to SE Asia before, that much is clear. You call our town a cesspool. Who do you know here, how many Pattaya residents do you know, to call our place a cesspool?

Pattaya is not for you. Just like stones, sheep and green hills of NZ are not for most Pattaya residents.

Do you notice how non of replies here insult your home, NZ? Wanna know why? Cos its your home, residents of our 'cesspool' have enough tact not to offend you, and your home, cos its just not done. A polite guest never disrespects other peoples home.

How long are you gonna keep posting about people living in Pattaya having no options, and similar nonsense, over and over. You don't have a first clue about this place, and people who live here.

Dont tell me about my options, you dont know me, or anybody else in here!

You complain how there are nasty comments here directed at you.

Your whole thread is an insult after insult to every Pattaya resident. Curiously some of us, Pattaya residents keep giving your whining posts thumbs up. But only a few.

Edited January 20, 2014 by kiwicouple

[kiwicouple]

Age you are completely missing the point. Watch the tele and see all of the ads for luxury resorts, luxury spas , luxury hotels every day. We are barraged with the word luxury on billboards and all forms of media all over pattaya.you hit the nail on the head luxury truly does not exist in pattaya. You can have a fantastic villa or condo but then the safety standards, food standards and not to mention air quality, water quality etc have been well documented by the thai government itself as hazardous. We are barraged with the word luxury over and over again until the point we get suckered in to pay western prices for sub standard products. We are told to embrace the culture and embrace Mai pen rai. And yes I have come to Pattaya for many years and know many many people who live here. Also I know many of the business owners. I have been many times to all of the markets including open air. You take your life in your hands trying to cross the road. There are huge holes dug and left for months on walk ways outside these "luxury" condos. Pattaya at the core is driven by money. Once you understand that and accept money and power rules it can be manageable. I stand by my statement is the cheap Charlie's who irrationally defend things in Pattaya as they have limited options. Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes yes, and yes.

It doesn’t do the country or the ‘locals’ any good if the city is being sold as luxury this and that, but then is found to be somewhat of a cesspool of vice and filth.

..............

Also, I think it’s great that there are those who appreciate living in all of this for their own amusement, but there are plenty of folk living there from birth who would (and do) sell their soul to escape. So to those of you who bad mouth the likes of me for being a bit shocked, or for showing a little empathy for the real locals, try looking at it from their eyes. I’ve seen all sorts of nasty comments since writing my original post, all aimed at me and my wife it seems, but few have actually given thought to those people who would maybe like a better, cleaner, safer environment.

So yeah, knock yourselves out, enjoy the ‘rawness’, pat yourselves on the back for getting down and dirty, but once in a while, give thought to those who would maybe like things a little better but don’t really have a choice, unlike you.

You were here for few days. You were freaked out by rats by Beach rd after dark. You have never been to SE Asia before, that much is clear. You call our town a cesspool. Who do you know here, how many Pattaya residents do you know, to call our place a cesspool?

Pattaya is not for you. Just like stones, sheep and green hills of NZ are not for most Pattaya residents.

Do you notice how non of replies here insult your home, NZ? Wanna know why? Cos its your home, residents of our 'cesspool' have enough tact not to offend you, and your home, cos its just not done. A polite guest never disrespects other peoples home.

How long are you gonna keep posting about people living in Pattaya having no options, and similar nonsense, over and over. You don't have a first clue about this place, and people who live here.

Dont tell me about my options, you dont know me, or anybody else in here!

You complain how there are nasty comments here directed at you.

Your whole thread is an insult after insult to every Pattaya resident. Curiously some of us, Pattaya residents keep giving your whining posts thumbs up. But only a few.

..

Edited January 20, 2014 by kiwicouple

[kiwicouple]

Age you are completely missing the point. Watch the tele and see all of the ads for luxury resorts, luxury spas , luxury hotels every day. We are barraged with the word luxury on billboards and all forms of media all over pattaya.you hit the nail on the head luxury truly does not exist in pattaya. You can have a fantastic villa or condo but then the safety standards, food standards and not to mention air quality, water quality etc have been well documented by the thai government itself as hazardous. We are barraged with the word luxury over and over again until the point we get suckered in to pay western prices for sub standard products. We are told to embrace the culture and embrace Mai pen rai. And yes I have come to Pattaya for many years and know many many people who live here. Also I know many of the business owners. I have been many times to all of the markets including open air. You take your life in your hands trying to cross the road. There are huge holes dug and left for months on walk ways outside these "luxury" condos. Pattaya at the core is driven by money. Once you understand that and accept money and power rules it can be manageable. I stand by my statement is the cheap Charlie's who irrationally defend things in Pattaya as they have limited options. Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes yes, and yes.

It doesn’t do the country or the ‘locals’ any good if the city is being sold as luxury this and that, but then is found to be somewhat of a cesspool of vice and filth.

..............

Also, I think it’s great that there are those who appreciate living in all of this for their own amusement, but there are plenty of folk living there from birth who would (and do) sell their soul to escape. So to those of you who bad mouth the likes of me for being a bit shocked, or for showing a little empathy for the real locals, try looking at it from their eyes. I’ve seen all sorts of nasty comments since writing my original post, all aimed at me and my wife it seems, but few have actually given thought to those people who would maybe like a better, cleaner, safer environment.

So yeah, knock yourselves out, enjoy the ‘rawness’, pat yourselves on the back for getting down and dirty, but once in a while, give thought to those who would maybe like things a little better but don’t really have a choice, unlike you.

You were here for few days. You were freaked out by rats by Beach rd after dark. You have never been to SE Asia before, that much is clear. You call our town a cesspool. Who do you know here, how many Pattaya residents do you know, to call our place a cesspool?

Pattaya is not for you. Just like stones, sheep and green hills of NZ are not for most Pattaya residents.

Do you notice how non of replies here insult your home, NZ? Wanna know why? Cos its your home, residents of our 'cesspool' have enough tact not to offend you, and your home, cos its just not done. A polite guest never disrespects other peoples home.

How long are you gonna keep posting about people living in Pattaya having no options, and similar nonsense, over and over. You don't have a first clue about this place, and people who live here.

Dont tell me about my options, you dont know me, or anybody else in here!

You complain how there are nasty comments here directed at you.

Your whole thread is an insult after insult to every Pattaya resident. Curiously some of us, Pattaya residents keep giving your whining posts thumbs up. But only a few.

Actually I borrowed the term “cesspool” from one of your neighbors. If you look at the early replies to my post, you will see that one of them contains this paragraph… “Maybe if your budget would have allowed you to stay in a higher end resort near Northpoint or south near Jomtien/Na Jomtien you might be writing a different story but planting yourself smack in the middle of a sesspool it's no wonder you are writing this.”

And that was from someone who lives in Pattaya, and who has posted many times on the forum. I naturally presumed he would be using a descriptive word that fit the bill (although slightly misspelt). So I borrowed it. Seemed very apt to me.

Its also very funny, the fact that although you quote me as having written an “endless, whining, boring page” etc… you just cant stop replying to the posts can you huh? If its so boring, and it upsets you so much, why do you get involved? Seems to me a hell of a lot of folk agree with what I said in my OP. Not as I'm bothered either way.

My OP was just pure and simple, a view from the eyes of a married couple of tourists. Not residents, not people looking to move in, but TOURISTS. What don’t you get?

Once again (yawn), there was no reference made to any individual, or establishment (which I could have done), but just an overview of our holiday.

All of the posts I have made since have been in response to other posts ie answers and replies etc. When you say “residents of our 'cesspool' have enough tact not to offend you, and your home…” are you serious? Have you not read some of the replies?

Mate, I have been called old, stuck-up, whining, chinless, middleclass, boring, a liar, etc… and much of this by you. It doesn’t bother me. It seems to bother you however, that some folk (including some of the hecklers) have agreed that Pattaya is, lets just say “not a des-res”, and you are in denial to the point where you are taking it as a personal insult . But thats fine, lets just agree to disagree.

However, we came out for a holiday, and we thought the place was a filthy dump. Is that clear enough for you?

Edited January 20, 2014 by kiwicouple

[Rimmer]

OK That's enough bickering, constructive comment time only please

[Fabulousheart]

Val again you admit and accept that the infrastructure in pattaya is dangerous , untimely and extremely hazardous. You say"You should have seen how Thrappya rd took nearly 3 years to pave and rebuild about 1 km of road. But you weren't here. Yet you seem know what Pattaya is all about, and who are people who live here."

Again val obviously you keep making wrong statements and are not reading. I have been coming to pattaya for 12 or 13 years. I have friends and family that live here.

Val you keep trying to justify thilthy streets, open storm drains, electricity wires hanging everywhere, the substandard building, poor air quality, poor water quality and dirty beaches. How can you defend that.mit is just what is so. Anyone who has the means to travel anywhere in the world and go by pattaya tourism of luxury resorts and luxury accommodations that charge high western prices for very low quality.

They keep building multi million b condos with dirty beaches, poor infrastructure, along with very poor environmental condition such as air and water quality.

I think thou protest to much as I said before either married to Thai or cheap Charlie with no other options.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[bmanly]

However, we came out for a holiday, and we thought the place was a filthy dump. Is that clear enough for you?

Hi mate, I have been coming to Pattaya for 20 years + and stay long time when I arrive. My mates are mostly Aussies and Kiwis. Most of the Kiwi guys have bought condos and settled in Pattaya permanently. Some of them are wealthy and others just get by. They choose to live in Pattaya more so than NZ. They love the place and wouldn't dream of leaving, they are good guys and have been mates of mine for many years. They would totally disagree with with what you have said in your opening post.

As for myself $12,000 NZ would last me 5 Months here, giving me 60K Thai Baht a Month. I think you overpaid for your holiday. I can rent a decent apartment for 8K a Month. As for food, well nearly all kitchens are open air, it's the Thai way of cooking. I also eat from the carts off the street and the Thai foodcourts. I eat what Thais eat and I almost never get sick from it.

In a nutshell I would rather have a 3 week holiday in Pattaya than a 3 week Holiday in New Zealand (yes I have been there) if both were offered for free. As they say in Thailand, if you not like up to you but many do like love Pattaya.

Edit: Note my long standing signature below.

Edited January 20, 2014 by bmanly

[kiwicouple]

However, we came out for a holiday, and we thought the place was a filthy dump. Is that clear enough for you?

Hi mate, I have been coming to Pattaya for 20 years + and stay long time when I arrive. My mates are mostly Aussies and Kiwis. Most of the Kiwi guys have bought condos and settled in Pattaya permanently. Some of them are wealthy and others just get by. They choose to live in Pattaya more so than NZ. They love the place and wouldn't dream of leaving, they are good guys and have been mates of mine for many years. They would totally disagree with with what you have said in your opening post.

As for myself $12,000 NZ would last me 5 Months here, giving me 60K Thai Baht a Month. I think you overpaid for your holiday. I can rent a decent apartment for 8K a Month. As for food, well nearly all kitchens are open air, it's the Thai way of cooking. I also eat from the carts off the street and the Thai foodcourts. I eat what Thais eat and I almost never get sick from it.

In a nutshell I would rather have a 3 week holiday in Pattaya than a 3 week Holiday in New Zealand (yes I have been there) if both were offered for free. As they say in Thailand, if you not like up to you but many do like love Pattaya.

Edit: Note my long standing signature below.

Hi.

All fair comments mate. No argument here. Horses for courses. The 12k though wasn’t the holiday, just the flights.

[ARGUSEYE]

Last week in a little "Resort" - type of place along the Kok river up from Chiang Rai I came across a middle aged German couple. In this place you could only hear the spashing of the river and the birds singing.

They came by car, so I asked if they worked in Thailand. "No, we are just tourists. All we did was to book the car online, it was there at the airport. 890 Baht a day."

.... And how did you find this lovely place? I asked. "Oh. no probem We just do some online research each evening in the hotel for the next day!!

I congratulated them. That's how ya do it!!

[robertthebruce]

Age you are completely missing the point. Watch the tele and see all of the ads for luxury resorts, luxury spas , luxury hotels every day. We are barraged with the word luxury on billboards and all forms of media all over pattaya.you hit the nail on the head luxury truly does not exist in pattaya. You can have a fantastic villa or condo but then the safety standards, food standards and not to mention air quality, water quality etc have been well documented by the thai government itself as hazardous. We are barraged with the word luxury over and over again until the point we get suckered in to pay western prices for sub standard products. We are told to embrace the culture and embrace Mai pen rai. And yes I have come to Pattaya for many years and know many many people who live here. Also I know many of the business owners. I have been many times to all of the markets including open air. You take your life in your hands trying to cross the road. There are huge holes dug and left for months on walk ways outside these "luxury" condos. Pattaya at the core is driven by money. Once you understand that and accept money and power rules it can be manageable. I stand by my statement is the cheap Charlie's who irrationally defend things in Pattaya as they have limited options. Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes yes, and yes.

It doesn’t do the country or the ‘locals’ any good if the city is being sold as luxury this and that, but then is found to be somewhat of a cesspool of vice and filth.

..............

Also, I think it’s great that there are those who appreciate living in all of this for their own amusement, but there are plenty of folk living there from birth who would (and do) sell their soul to escape. So to those of you who bad mouth the likes of me for being a bit shocked, or for showing a little empathy for the real locals, try looking at it from their eyes. I’ve seen all sorts of nasty comments since writing my original post, all aimed at me and my wife it seems, but few have actually given thought to those people who would maybe like a better, cleaner, safer environment.

So yeah, knock yourselves out, enjoy the ‘rawness’, pat yourselves on the back for getting down and dirty, but once in a while, give thought to those who would maybe like things a little better but don’t really have a choice, unlike you.

You were here for few days. You were freaked out by rats by Beach rd after dark. You have never been to SE Asia before, that much is clear. You call our town a cesspool. Who do you know here, how many Pattaya residents do you know, to call our place a cesspool?

Pattaya is not for you. Just like stones, sheep and green hills of NZ are not for most Pattaya residents.

Do you notice how non of replies here insult your home, NZ? Wanna know why? Cos its your home, residents of our 'cesspool' have enough tact not to offend you, and your home, cos its just not done. A polite guest never disrespects other peoples home.

How long are you gonna keep posting about people living in Pattaya having no options, and similar nonsense, over and over. You don't have a first clue about this place, and people who live here.

Dont tell me about my options, you dont know me, or anybody else in here!

You complain how there are nasty comments here directed at you.

Your whole thread is an insult after insult to every Pattaya resident. Curiously some of us, Pattaya residents keep giving your whining posts thumbs up. But only a few.

Actually I borrowed the term “cesspool” from one of your neighbors. If you look at the early replies to my post, you will see that one of them contains this paragraph… “Maybe if your budget would have allowed you to stay in a higher end resort near Northpoint or south near Jomtien/Na Jomtien you might be writing a different story but planting yourself smack in the middle of a sesspool it's no wonder you are writing this.”

And that was from someone who lives in Pattaya, and who has posted many times on the forum. I naturally presumed he would be using a descriptive word that fit the bill (although slightly misspelt). So I borrowed it. Seemed very apt to me.

Its also very funny, the fact that although you quote me as having written an “endless, whining, boring page” etc… you just cant stop replying to the posts can you huh? If its so boring, and it upsets you so much, why do you get involved? Seems to me a hell of a lot of folk agree with what I said in my OP. Not as I'm bothered either way.

My OP was just pure and simple, a view from the eyes of a married couple of tourists. Not residents, not people looking to move in, but TOURISTS. What don’t you get?

Once again (yawn), there was no reference made to any individual, or establishment (which I could have done), but just an overview of our holiday.

All of the posts I have made since have been in response to other posts ie answers and replies etc. When you say “residents of our 'cesspool' have enough tact not to offend you, and your home…” are you serious? Have you not read some of the replies?

Mate, I have been called old, stuck-up, whining, chinless, middleclass, boring, a liar, etc… and much of this by you. It doesn’t bother me. It seems to bother you however, that some folk (including some of the hecklers) have agreed that Pattaya is, lets just say “not a des-res”, and you are in denial to the point where you are taking it as a personal insult . But thats fine, lets just agree to disagree.

However, we came out for a holiday, and we thought the place was a filthy dump. Is that clear enough for you?

With you 100 percent on the ''Filthy Dump'', been once , and vowed never to return, its not for me, might suit some folks, and thats fine, if they like it , thats Great...

Different strokes for different folks...