America /Thai citizen. Two passports. Came to Thailand with tourist visa.

[yougivemebaby]

My Thai friend came here from the states and used US passport to gain entry with a visa on arrival at the airport Has a Thai passport as was born here . Considering staying longer.

question is now that avisa on arrival has been used, what options are available to do an extention to stay for six months or more ?

thank you

[ubonjoe]

Whe didn't they use the Thai passport for entry?

The best thing to do would be leave by air an re-enter using their Thai passport.

There is a one year extension available for returning Thai nationals that can be applied for at immigration.

[ThaidDown]

Believe your friend could get a 1 year extension at Immigration showing that he/she was Thai, would be standard cost of 1900 baht.

Alternative would be to fly out on US passport and return on Thai passport.

Edit...Posted same time as Ubonjoe.

[yougivemebaby]

If she flys out and enters back with her Thai Passport . What about when they go back to the states and are leaving thailand ? Won't she need to use her Thai Passport ? does it matter what the last stamp says in Passport? or can it just be switched once back in the states ?

she is in Udon now can she go to immigration there ? that would be with her US passport she would get the visa extention and bring her Thai Passport as proof of Thai nationality ?

[ubonjoe]

She can get the extension in Udon. Her passport should be enough.

The US does not look for stamps showing entry or departure to another country. Many countries do not use stamps anymore. Thailand is the same for not looking for stamps normally. Lots of people use both passports when travelling.

Leave US showing both passports to airline to prove she can enter Thailand. Enter Thailand using Thai passport only. Depart Thailand showing both passports to airline. Show only Thai passport to Thai immigration. Enter US using only the US passport.

[yougivemebaby]

She can get the extension in Udon. Her passport should be enough.

The US does not look for stamps showing entry or departure to another country. Many countries do not use stamps anymore. Thailand is the same for not looking for stamps normally. Lots of people use both passports when travelling.

Leave US showing both passports to airline to prove she can enter Thailand. Enter Thailand using Thai passport only. Depart Thailand showing both passports to airline. Show only Thai passport to Thai immigration. Enter US using only the US passport.the

the trip for her is 2.5 hours she wants to make sure she has alldocumentation .. Does anyone have their phone number? for udon immigration

[ubonjoe]

This from police order 777/2551

2.23 In the case of a person who used to have Thai nationality or whose parent is or was of Thai nationality visiting relatives or returning to his or her original homeland: Each permission shall be granted
for no more than one year.http://udonthani.immigration.go.th/web/

(1) There must be evidence that the applicant used to have Thai nationality or that his/her parent is
or was of Thai nationality.

There have been reports of people having a Thai passport getting the extension.
Edit: Udon immigration website: http://udonthani.immigration.go.th/web/

Where is she located there might be an immigration office closer than Udon.

It might be easier to just go to the bridge in Nong Kai and try doing a passport swap by entering Laos with her Thai passport (free) and returning. Since she is Thai she might be able to do it.

[Pib]

If she flys out and enters back with her Thai Passport . What about when they go back to the states and are leaving thailand ? Won't she need to use her Thai Passport ? does it matter what the last stamp says in Passport? or can it just be switched once back in the states ?

she is in Udon now can she go to immigration there ? that would be with her US passport she would get the visa extention and bring her Thai Passport as proof of Thai nationality ?

My wife has Thai and American citizenship. Which passport to us is simple: When exiting or entering U.S. immigration use the U.S. passport; when exiting and entering Thai immigration use the Thai passport. Note I said "immigration"...it's OK to show the "airlines" check-in both passports if needed to prove to the airlines a visa is not needed to enter the country, no need for a return/round-trip ticket since she a Thai citizen, etc. Neither immigration, Thai or U.S., care about seeing where and when you departed from....many people have so many exit/entry stamps in their passports it almost impossible to read or figure them out by any immigration clerk.. they are just looking to confirm you can legally enter the country and this is based on the passport you present/hand them.

Summary; enter/exit Thailand--present Thai passport to immigration........enter/exit U.S.--present U.S. passport to immigration. OK to show airlines both passports if needed.

[paz]

This from police order 777/2551

2.23 In the case of a person who used to have Thai nationality or whose parent is or was of Thai nationality visiting relatives or returning to his or her original homeland: Each permission shall be granted

for no more than one year.http://udonthani.immigration.go.th/web/

(1) There must be evidence that the applicant used to have Thai nationality or that his/her parent is

or was of Thai nationality.

This order refers to people that "used to have, or whose parents, etc" Thai nationality. Not people that has current, established Thai nationality as proved by passport and/or Thai national ID card. So, my personal opinion, and I am speaking without experience, is the following:

- Thai nationals have a natural right, to re0enter and stay in their country under all and any situation. They are not subject to any immigration provision, because they are not foreigners. No fine can be levyed, and no procedure or extensions is necessary for them to do that.

- Exiting under a foreign passport that has been used for entry would be only done to avoid creating an "hole", or a "database-only overstay" under that passport. However, since said passport whould never have to be shown to Thai immigration, one may or may not care about that.

[ubonjoe]

This from police order 777/2551

2.23 In the case of a person who used to have Thai nationality or whose parent is or was of Thai nationality visiting relatives or returning to his or her original homeland: Each permission shall be granted

for no more than one year.http://udonthani.immigration.go.th/web/

(1) There must be evidence that the applicant used to have Thai nationality or that his/her parent is

or was of Thai nationality.

This order refers to people that "used to have, or whose parents, etc" Thai nationality. Not people that has current, established Thai nationality as proved by passport and/or Thai national ID card. So, my personal opinion, and I am speaking without experience, is the following:

- Thai nationals have a natural right, to re0enter and stay in their country under all and any situation. They are not subject to any immigration provision, because they are not foreigners. No fine can be levyed, and no procedure or extensions is necessary for them to do that.

- Exiting under a foreign passport that has been used for entry would be only done to avoid creating an "hole", or a "database-only overstay" under that passport. However, since said passport whould never have to be shown to Thai immigration, one may or may not care about that.

You are incorrect.

There have been some reports where a Thai holding a Thai passport has gotten the extension.

If a Thai citizen enters on a foreign passport they fall under the same rules as any foreigner.

They are subject to overstay, immigration fees and etc. They must depart on the passport they entered on.

This has been discussed in many topics before.

[paz]

This from police order 777/2551

2.23 In the case of a person who used to have Thai nationality or whose parent is or was of Thai nationality visiting relatives or returning to his or her original homeland: Each permission shall be granted

for no more than one year.http://udonthani.immigration.go.th/web/

(1) There must be evidence that the applicant used to have Thai nationality or that his/her parent is

or was of Thai nationality.

This order refers to people that "used to have, or whose parents, etc" Thai nationality. Not people that has current, established Thai nationality as proved by passport and/or Thai national ID card. So, my personal opinion, and I am speaking without experience, is the following:

- Thai nationals have a natural right, to re0enter and stay in their country under all and any situation. They are not subject to any immigration provision, because they are not foreigners. No fine can be levyed, and no procedure or extensions is necessary for them to do that.

- Exiting under a foreign passport that has been used for entry would be only done to avoid creating an "hole", or a "database-only overstay" under that passport. However, since said passport whould never have to be shown to Thai immigration, one may or may not care about that.

You are incorrect.

There have been some reports where a Thai holding a Thai passport has gotten the extension.

If a Thai citizen enters on a foreign passport they fall under the same rules as any foreigner.

They are subject to overstay, immigration fees and etc. They must depart on the passport they entered on.

This has been discussed in many topics before.

Ubonjoy, I know that it has been discussed before, and that there are reports like that, but I respectfully hold my opinion an I'm responding because having an intrest in Law, I find these cases interesting.

The mere fact of entering under a different passport cannot alienate any right, be a constitutional or natural one, because these rights are higher that the immigration act. And, the act does does explicitely says in any part anything like "or national Thai that has entered under a foreign passport". It has jurisdiction to Foreigners only, and a Thai national is never a foreigner, no matter what passport has used to enter the country: An administrative action like immigration database does not change nationality, I hope you will agree on that.

So, any immigration restriction, fee or fine imposed to a Thai national is, in my opinion, illegal and abusive, and I'm sure that it would not hold water if the case was be brought before a Judge.

Of course I also understand that most people will not want to suffer any hassle, will pay up and be subject to the same treatment as a foreigner, but that doesn't make so that it is right.

[paz]

Apologies for having mispelled the name ubonjoe and too many other mistakes.

[samran]

This from police order 777/2551

2.23 In the case of a person who used to have Thai nationality or whose parent is or was of Thai nationality visiting relatives or returning to his or her original homeland: Each permission shall be granted
for no more than one year.http://udonthani.immigration.go.th/web/
(1) There must be evidence that the applicant used to have Thai nationality or that his/her parent is
or was of Thai nationality.

This order refers to people that "used to have, or whose parents, etc" Thai nationality. Not people that has current, established Thai nationality as proved by passport and/or Thai national ID card. So, my personal opinion, and I am speaking without experience, is the following:

- Thai nationals have a natural right, to re0enter and stay in their country under all and any situation. They are not subject to any immigration provision, because they are not foreigners. No fine can be levyed, and no procedure or extensions is necessary for them to do that.

- Exiting under a foreign passport that has been used for entry would be only done to avoid creating an "hole", or a "database-only overstay" under that passport. However, since said passport whould never have to be shown to Thai immigration, one may or may not care about that.

You are incorrect.
There have been some reports where a Thai holding a Thai passport has gotten the extension.
If a Thai citizen enters on a foreign passport they fall under the same rules as any foreigner.
They are subject to overstay, immigration fees and etc. They must depart on the passport they entered on.
This has been discussed in many topics before.

Ubonjoy, I know that it has been discussed before, and that there are reports like that, but I respectfully hold my opinion an I'm responding because having an intrest in Law, I find these cases interesting.

The mere fact of entering under a different passport cannot alienate any right, be a constitutional or natural one, because these rights are higher that the immigration act. And, the act does does explicitely says in any part anything like "or national Thai that has entered under a foreign passport". It has jurisdiction to Foreigners only, and a Thai national is never a foreigner, no matter what passport has used to enter the country: An administrative action like immigration database does not change nationality, I hope you will agree on that.

So, any immigration restriction, fee or fine imposed to a Thai national is, in my opinion, illegal and abusive, and I'm sure that it would not hold water if the case was be brought before a Judge.
Of course I also understand that most people will not want to suffer any hassle, will pay up and be subject to the same treatment as a foreigner, but that doesn't make so that it is right.

You are correct of course though it is much easier doing an air Asia run to the nearest country and then flying back the same day on the Thai pp, which is what the OPs friend should do.

[Arkady]

Ubonjoy, I know that it has been discussed before, and that there are reports like that, but I respectfully hold my opinion an I'm responding because having an intrest in Law, I find these cases interesting.

The mere fact of entering under a different passport cannot alienate any right, be a constitutional or natural one, because these rights are higher that the immigration act. And, the act does does explicitely says in any part anything like "or national Thai that has entered under a foreign passport". It has jurisdiction to Foreigners only, and a Thai national is never a foreigner, no matter what passport has used to enter the country: An administrative action like immigration database does not change nationality, I hope you will agree on that.

So, any immigration restriction, fee or fine imposed to a Thai national is, in my opinion, illegal and abusive, and I'm sure that it would not hold water if the case was be brought before a Judge.

Of course I also understand that most people will not want to suffer any hassle, will pay up and be subject to the same treatment as a foreigner, but that doesn't make so that it is right.

I disagree with your analysis. If a Thai presents himself at Immigration as a foreigner with a foreign passport, Immigration is obliged to treat him the same as all other nationals of that country and I believe the Administrative Court would uphold that right, if anyone was ever stupid enough to take a case to the court. The law provides two ways for Thais to avoid being fined for overstaying: 1) enter on a Thai passport; 2) get 1 year extensions in the foreign passport based on being of Thai parentage. No. 2) is a lot more generous than countries like the US that prohibit its nationals from entering on foreign passports. There is no excuse for getting fined, apart from laziness, and I am sure the court would see it the same way. It would be logical to apply the Constitution to prevent a Thai from being deported but fines under Immigration Act should be upheld on the basis that the Thai chose to subject himself to the Act by presenting a foreign passport.

[samran]

Ubonjoy, I know that it has been discussed before, and that there are reports like that, but I respectfully hold my opinion an I'm responding because having an intrest in Law, I find these cases interesting.

The mere fact of entering under a different passport cannot alienate any right, be a constitutional or natural one, because these rights are higher that the immigration act. And, the act does does explicitely says in any part anything like "or national Thai that has entered under a foreign passport". It has jurisdiction to Foreigners only, and a Thai national is never a foreigner, no matter what passport has used to enter the country: An administrative action like immigration database does not change nationality, I hope you will agree on that.

So, any immigration restriction, fee or fine imposed to a Thai national is, in my opinion, illegal and abusive, and I'm sure that it would not hold water if the case was be brought before a Judge.

Of course I also understand that most people will not want to suffer any hassle, will pay up and be subject to the same treatment as a foreigner, but that doesn't make so that it is right.

I disagree with your analysis. If a Thai presents himself at Immigration as a foreigner with a foreign passport, Immigration is obliged to treat him the same as all other nationals of that country and I believe the Administrative Court would uphold that right, if anyone was ever stupid enough to take a case to the court. The law provides two ways for Thais to avoid being fined for overstaying: 1) enter on a Thai passport; 2) get 1 year extensions in the foreign passport based on being of Thai parentage. No. 2) is a lot more generous than countries like the US that prohibit its nationals from entering on foreign passports. There is no excuse for getting fined, apart from laziness, and I am sure the court would see it the same way. It would be logical to apply the Constitution to prevent a Thai from being deported but fines under Immigration Act should be upheld on the basis that the Thai chose to subject himself to the Act by presenting a foreign passport.

Whatever the interpretation I wouldn't want something this going to court potentially giving the judiciary a chance to opine on the merits of dual nationality.

[Arkady]

Ubonjoy, I know that it has been discussed before, and that there are reports like that, but I respectfully hold my opinion an I'm responding because having an intrest in Law, I find these cases interesting.

The mere fact of entering under a different passport cannot alienate any right, be a constitutional or natural one, because these rights are higher that the immigration act. And, the act does does explicitely says in any part anything like "or national Thai that has entered under a foreign passport". It has jurisdiction to Foreigners only, and a Thai national is never a foreigner, no matter what passport has used to enter the country: An administrative action like immigration database does not change nationality, I hope you will agree on that.

So, any immigration restriction, fee or fine imposed to a Thai national is, in my opinion, illegal and abusive, and I'm sure that it would not hold water if the case was be brought before a Judge.

Of course I also understand that most people will not want to suffer any hassle, will pay up and be subject to the same treatment as a foreigner, but that doesn't make so that it is right.

I disagree with your analysis. If a Thai presents himself at Immigration as a foreigner with a foreign passport, Immigration is obliged to treat him the same as all other nationals of that country and I believe the Administrative Court would uphold that right, if anyone was ever stupid enough to take a case to the court. The law provides two ways for Thais to avoid being fined for overstaying: 1) enter on a Thai passport; 2) get 1 year extensions in the foreign passport based on being of Thai parentage. No. 2) is a lot more generous than countries like the US that prohibit its nationals from entering on foreign passports. There is no excuse for getting fined, apart from laziness, and I am sure the court would see it the same way. It would be logical to apply the Constitution to prevent a Thai from being deported but fines under Immigration Act should be upheld on the basis that the Thai chose to subject himself to the Act by presenting a foreign passport.

Whatever the interpretation I wouldn't want something this going to court potentially giving the judiciary a chance to opine on the merits of dual nationality.

Yes, that would not be a clever thing for a dual national to do. Getting a one year extension on a foreign passport is clearly an unintended loophole anyway. It doesn't specify a Thai using a foreign passport. That section of the National Police Order is intended for former Thais who have renounced Thai nationality to obtain another one and people with Thai parents who live abroad and don't have Thai passports because they have never applied for them or let them lapse. So there is nothing specifically recognising dual nationality there or catering for Thais with two passports. Any case like this in the courts would definitely come to the attention of the Interior Ministry and provide ammo for another push to tighten up the law to the disadvantage of duals.

Any Thai with a Thai passport who comes to Thailand on a foreign passport for a long stay deserves to be fined for stupidity anyway and should just pay up without arguing.

[ubonjoe]

I would say more a lack of knowledge or misinformation than stupidity.

Many have entered on a foreign passport because their passport was expired or had less than 6 months validity not aware that they can enter on an expired passport. Their was a recent case of the Thai embassy in London informing a person that the passport had to be valid for entry.

Another is a case like the lady in the OP thinking or being informed that there would be a problem re-entering the US because there would be no stamps in their passport for another country.