I Paid For Some Land Today

[Khun Jean]

The more often this topic is discussed the more incorrect it becomes.

To the OP, not others (most have no clue whatsoever and should refrain from posting)

The deed is done, land has been bought, money has been paid, land is registered on girlfriends name.

Use the search function and educate yourself.

In your situation go for the usufruct, it is cheap, no lawyers needed, and is valid for a lifetime.

In your situation forget about:

leases (have to pay tax and maximum 30 years, there are no guaranteed extensions!),

mortgages (too late, and what if she find a new boyfriend and pays for the land or just simply not pay, many years in court??,)

company to hold land (illegal))

[iancnx]

The more often this topic is discussed the more incorrect it becomes.

To the OP, not others (most have no clue whatsoever and should refrain from posting)

The deed is done, land has been bought, money has been paid, land is registered on girlfriends name.

Use the search function and educate yourself.

In your situation go for the usufruct, it is cheap, no lawyers needed, and is valid for a lifetime.

In your situation forget about:

leases (have to pay tax and maximum 30 years, there are no guaranteed extensions!),

mortgages (too late, and what if she find a new boyfriend and pays for the land or just simply not pay, many years in court??,)

company to hold land (illegal))

Good post by KJ and just to amplify on the 30 year lease with extension promises of another 30+30. Such extensions have not yet been tested in a court of law, and they could well be ruled illegal and therefore irrelevant when the time comes. 30 years is the law. So if you are under 70 think again!

[MMarlow]

Not true! Get your facts right before you post. Whether you trust your wife or not is irrelevant.

If you wife is killed in a motorcycle accident or falling down some stairs etc., etc., then the person who inherits the land has every right to turn up and throw you off the land immediately. The usufruct gives you the right to live on the land for 30 years, come what may, it is a better solution than a lease. A lease requires that you have to make payments to the landowner, as in the West.

Get your lawyer to draw it up in English and Thai, item by item. Make sure he retains a copy for security then at least one will be available in the event of a disaster. Make sure your name is entered on the back of the Chanote.

As you are not permitted to own land or pay for it, with exceptions, then presumably you made a 'loan' for the purchase?

"If you wife is killed ... then the person who inherits the land has every right to turn up and throw you off the land immediately."

Are you sure you have your facts right? Surely the person who inherits the land will be the husband (foreigner or otherwise) unless a will stated otherwise? If that person was a foreigner he would inherit and then have 12 months to dispose of that land. In that situation he could not be legally evicted?

[MMarlow]

Thanks Briggsy.... is that the usufruct option? can one of these be sorted out before the house is built?

i read that the cost is only 100B when we are married, so this sounds like a good option

You can not lease from you legally wedded partner. After a legal wedding (jot tabian somrot) you are entitled to half of the mutual possessions unless you write a prenuptial, but the land can't be on your side in the prenuptial.

You may be mistaken that the legal wedding will cost you a few 100 Baht in the tessbaan office.

That is interesting because I have friends who have leased land from the legally wedded wives. They made the lease prior to getting married.

If they leased the land before their marriage they didn't lease the land from their legal wives.

[lucjoker]

first you do everything wrong what you can possibly do wrong,then you make a proud announcement ?

Don't you have (smart ) friends here?

Or dumb friends who lost their land and house already?

Do you realize that when you give away something that it is 100% not yours anymore?

If a married couple separates ,each get 50% from the earnings during the marriage .Everything owned before

stays 100% from the owner.(so the land belongs now forever to her,unless she gives it back to you ,witch is impossible

unless you make a company)

Know that if you have a house in your name standing on someone else land ,they can forbid you to come on their land ,

so you can do nothing with the house ?

It looks as if you are now 100% dependable of your GF ,the moment you not behave and listen like a child ,she can kick you

out as a dog that became too big.

Now see if you can accept the truth,before you loose your last penny ?I doubt it .

Wish you all the luck !

[darren84310]

Get your girlfriend to make you a 30 year lease on the land and also make sure that you can prove that you paid for the house that will be built on it. You will legally own the house, so if there was ever a problem then she would have to buy the house from you or you could remove it. Therefore, you have double insurance, 30 year lease and house ownership.

BTW where is the land?... is it in her home town?

thanks darren mate - good advice. no land is in hua hin. she is from kalasin, issan.

I'm so glad you bought it away from her home town and in an area where you could sell it. Obviously if it was in her home town it would have made it virtually impossible for you to get near the house if ever there was a problem.

Anyway, I sincerely hope you won't have any problems and enjoy your life here.

Best wishes..

[GOLDBUGGY]

It is generally done all at once.

But, if the owner of the land, your fiance agrees, the 30-year lease remains a popular option.

Yes! I agree this is his best option. The Lease is also attached to the land as a Chattel. So she can't sell it until this lease expires, or you cancel it. Best you get a Lawyer to help you with this. Some money has to change hands to make this a legal contract.

[crazykopite]

You should have drawn up a 30 plus 30 year lease at the same time you purchased the property and had it registered at the land office would not even con tinplate building until ur gf agrees to giving you the lease good luck

[UKJASE]

If the OP had a Thai company and bought through that, would that protect him as the company would own the house land? I'm just digging as this is what I was thinking about the other day. I have a Thai company set up me having 49% the GF 49% and a friend 2%, preference shares to them (980 and 40 voting rights) and the normal shares to me (9800 voting rights). The lawyer set up this way to protect me and all businesses under that umbrella, so that even if they got together they can't vote me out and I still maintain full control of the company even though I have 49%. Also if the preference shares are sold, I have the right to them first and for most and I have to agree on where and who they are sold to.

Given this, If I bought land and/or a house through the company now, wouldn't I be protected this way? I'm only asking as this has been on my mind and it could be an option for the OP as well.

this is what we tried to do in the first place mate. we went to land office with lawyer, and was going to put the land under the existing company that we own our existing house. we had the company's capital increased, and thought this was enough. the land office then said they wanted to see both the shareholders' bank books with evidence of 1.5 m in my wifes, and 300,000B in the 2% shareholders. i put the money in and copied bank book showing the amount, and withdrew the cash. back at the land office they then wanted to see original bank books, plus all shareholders in attendance. the lawyer then said they were going to quiz my wife and the shareholder and ask where the money came from etc. everyone was saying "better put it in your fiance's name and write a contract saying she is just the "agent" to buy, and i am the "investor""

in the end, i am afraid to say, i had had enough, and just said "ok"

this was hua hin land office and apparently they dont look favourably on any companies that they feel may be nominee

hence i find myself in this situation now

thank god for thaivisa and all the invaluable advice that has been given by so many knowledgeable people

it goes without saying you are all invited to the house warming

here is a pic of the land

[UKJASE]

the scorch mark in the middle is where we burnt the lawyer's body

[RigPig]

I have found this discussion extremely interesting and informative.

I am interested in the mortgage strategy that has been mentioned previously. Now when using the term "mortgage", I am thinking more along the lines of the OP (prospective husband) being "the bank" (for want of a better description). I am not discussing an Ursfrut, Lease or Companies (although the mortgage principal could be applied to a company type set up) as I think that has already been covered. I do however think the OP may be able to instigate something along these lines..... as long as the Fiance is willing, if the papers have already been signed. It will I think give him an idea of her "true intentions" either way, should he decide to go down this path, if it is possible.

This is also designed to be a question, as well as another (possible) scenario around this persisting problem we farangs have here in Thailand. I am not looking at methods of breaking the law here, merely a method of "protecting" oneself or "insuring" oneself against the future. With some of the "investments" we make here, thinking about the long term, things can change as stated before. However we are all getting older and our ability to recover from a traumatic change of circumstances may be more difficult as time goes on.

I am fairly sure these scenarios would have to be instigated BEFORE a legal marriage is performed.

There are 2 possible ways of going around this I think, depending upon the relationship and the intentions of the OP (or farang in the relationship).

1/ If your intention is to protect your entire investment.

2/ If the intention is to protect your rights as a cohabitant and 50/50 partner (as in what I think would be construed as a "normal" marital relationship).

I make this distinction because some of us are "happier" to split the difference, but it is sometimes difficult to walk away from everything. If you are happy to walk away from everything then this is not an issue being discussed here. I am also assuming the ultimate objective is legal marriage.

With the first item, I am not sure this is possible after marriage, as I believe a document has to be signed stating basically "That ALL of the funds used to purchase the land belonged SOLELY to the wife at the time of purchase". This (is supposed to) negate ANY claim a husband may have upon the land in question. The husband may have some claim to 50% of the value of that property (I am not sure at all about this) however getting it will be (I would think) EXTREMELY difficult in a practical sense (assuming it has all gone sour by this stage).

However if this was instigated BEFORE a marriage, it would seem to me to be a legally binding "business" type venture between 2 parties. Things such as "interest", repayment terms and repayment times along with provisos for "liquidation" could all be "manipulated" to suit the circumstances and intentions at the time of the contract. The contract "terms" could even be changed at will I would think if both parties are in agreement.

With the second item, I think it could be set up (also before a marriage) with 50% (or whatever percentage is applicable) of the original purchase costs in the name of both parties (even if one half is supplied as a "gift" to the other party) It should have the same protection for the husband (to be) in as much as the property owned between both husband and wife (including land) would have to be sold (with suitable terms applied) and divided equally.

I also believe (correct me if I am wrong) that debts such as this are completely recoverable and are enabled to be passed on (to either side) in Thailand. This could possibly also add some "protection" to both parties if it was laid out in a manner that was suitable.

Comments please, especially from those with any experience with these matters.

Cheers

[CDNinKS]

I have found this discussion extremely interesting and informative.

I am interested in the mortgage strategy that has been mentioned previously. Now when using the term "mortgage", I am thinking more along the lines of the OP (prospective husband) being "the bank" (for want of a better description). I am not discussing an Ursfrut, Lease or Companies (although the mortgage principal could be applied to a company type set up) as I think that has already been covered. I do however think the OP may be able to instigate something along these lines..... as long as the Fiance is willing, if the papers have already been signed. It will I think give him an idea of her "true intentions" either way, should he decide to go down this path, if it is possible.

This is also designed to be a question, as well as another (possible) scenario around this persisting problem we farangs have here in Thailand. I am not looking at methods of breaking the law here, merely a method of "protecting" oneself or "insuring" oneself against the future. With some of the "investments" we make here, thinking about the long term, things can change as stated before. However we are all getting older and our ability to recover from a traumatic change of circumstances may be more difficult as time goes on.

I am fairly sure these scenarios would have to be instigated BEFORE a legal marriage is performed.

There are 2 possible ways of going around this I think, depending upon the relationship and the intentions of the OP (or farang in the relationship).

1/ If your intention is to protect your entire investment.

2/ If the intention is to protect your rights as a cohabitant and 50/50 partner (as in what I think would be construed as a "normal" marital relationship).

I make this distinction because some of us are "happier" to split the difference, but it is sometimes difficult to walk away from everything. If you are happy to walk away from everything then this is not an issue being discussed here. I am also assuming the ultimate objective is legal marriage.

With the first item, I am not sure this is possible after marriage, as I believe a document has to be signed stating basically "That ALL of the funds used to purchase the land belonged SOLELY to the wife at the time of purchase". This (is supposed to) negate ANY claim a husband may have upon the land in question. The husband may have some claim to 50% of the value of that property (I am not sure at all about this) however getting it will be (I would think) EXTREMELY difficult in a practical sense (assuming it has all gone sour by this stage).

However if this was instigated BEFORE a marriage, it would seem to me to be a legally binding "business" type venture between 2 parties. Things such as "interest", repayment terms and repayment times along with provisos for "liquidation" could all be "manipulated" to suit the circumstances and intentions at the time of the contract. The contract "terms" could even be changed at will I would think if both parties are in agreement.

With the second item, I think it could be set up (also before a marriage) with 50% (or whatever percentage is applicable) of the original purchase costs in the name of both parties (even if one half is supplied as a "gift" to the other party) It should have the same protection for the husband (to be) in as much as the property owned between both husband and wife (including land) would have to be sold (with suitable terms applied) and divided equally.

I also believe (correct me if I am wrong) that debts such as this are completely recoverable and are enabled to be passed on (to either side) in Thailand. This could possibly also add some "protection" to both parties if it was laid out in a manner that was suitable.

Comments please, especially from those with any experience with these matters.

Cheers

I can comment that the part about the document that needs to be signed is correct. I signed stating that the funds for the land were entirely my wife's (gf at the time) and I had no claim to the land. Everything I comment on is based on my experience at the Hua Hin land office........ as they say, your results may vary

[belg]

maybe all farangs should stop buying land & houses in GF & wifes names and asked those to go protest & block the streets in bangkok & elsewhere, till we, the sponsors of all this wealth, got some basic rights like owning a plot of land and putting a house on it , in our own name

and a company 100% owned and not some shady structure where you can cough up the money and never own more than 49% of what you paid 100% + taxes + social security + wages of your 2/4 obliged personell

[RigPig]

I have found this discussion extremely interesting and informative.

I am interested in the mortgage strategy that has been mentioned previously. Now when using the term "mortgage", I am thinking more along the lines of the OP (prospective husband) being "the bank" (for want of a better description). I am not discussing an Ursfrut, Lease or Companies (although the mortgage principal could be applied to a company type set up) as I think that has already been covered. I do however think the OP may be able to instigate something along these lines..... as long as the Fiance is willing, if the papers have already been signed. It will I think give him an idea of her "true intentions" either way, should he decide to go down this path, if it is possible.

This is also designed to be a question, as well as another (possible) scenario around this persisting problem we farangs have here in Thailand. I am not looking at methods of breaking the law here, merely a method of "protecting" oneself or "insuring" oneself against the future. With some of the "investments" we make here, thinking about the long term, things can change as stated before. However we are all getting older and our ability to recover from a traumatic change of circumstances may be more difficult as time goes on.

I am fairly sure these scenarios would have to be instigated BEFORE a legal marriage is performed.

There are 2 possible ways of going around this I think, depending upon the relationship and the intentions of the OP (or farang in the relationship).

1/ If your intention is to protect your entire investment.

2/ If the intention is to protect your rights as a cohabitant and 50/50 partner (as in what I think would be construed as a "normal" marital relationship).

I make this distinction because some of us are "happier" to split the difference, but it is sometimes difficult to walk away from everything. If you are happy to walk away from everything then this is not an issue being discussed here. I am also assuming the ultimate objective is legal marriage.

With the first item, I am not sure this is possible after marriage, as I believe a document has to be signed stating basically "That ALL of the funds used to purchase the land belonged SOLELY to the wife at the time of purchase". This (is supposed to) negate ANY claim a husband may have upon the land in question. The husband may have some claim to 50% of the value of that property (I am not sure at all about this) however getting it will be (I would think) EXTREMELY difficult in a practical sense (assuming it has all gone sour by this stage).

However if this was instigated BEFORE a marriage, it would seem to me to be a legally binding "business" type venture between 2 parties. Things such as "interest", repayment terms and repayment times along with provisos for "liquidation" could all be "manipulated" to suit the circumstances and intentions at the time of the contract. The contract "terms" could even be changed at will I would think if both parties are in agreement.

With the second item, I think it could be set up (also before a marriage) with 50% (or whatever percentage is applicable) of the original purchase costs in the name of both parties (even if one half is supplied as a "gift" to the other party) It should have the same protection for the husband (to be) in as much as the property owned between both husband and wife (including land) would have to be sold (with suitable terms applied) and divided equally.

I also believe (correct me if I am wrong) that debts such as this are completely recoverable and are enabled to be passed on (to either side) in Thailand. This could possibly also add some "protection" to both parties if it was laid out in a manner that was suitable.

Comments please, especially from those with any experience with these matters.

Cheers

I can comment that the part about the document that needs to be signed is correct. I signed stating that the funds for the land were entirely my wife's (gf at the time) and I had no claim to the land. Everything I comment on is based on my experience at the Hua Hin land office........ as they say, your results may vary

Ahhhh and you weren't married. If you had just given her the money (as you did anyway) and she just bought the land of her own volition, then you were not involved and would not have had to sign anything so my question is why did you? How did they know you were "involved" in any case (if you weren’t married)?

A mortgagee (the lender) doesn't own the land but has a lien on it until it is paid for in full, as a bank does. Same same............

[zaZa9]

Without wanting to seem overly negative , Ive read 5 pages on the legal aspects of this purchase and dealing with its risks , but only one post on the ownership in reality , ie what can happen if the girlfriend or wife REALLY wants you off "her" land ... and it isnt a pleasant thought ...

I for one would not want the risk of holding out in a house , no matter what the legal agreement , if a very angry and determined tg decides she will get you out.

The fact that Farang cannot own land in Thailand is pretty universal known , and get a few of her covetous brothers after a bottle or two of Lao Kaw and all the papers and lawyers in the world will never convince them that the farang should be left quietly and snuggly with his contracts in the nice house on THEIR sisters land.

The family can easily make life miserable if they are determined to, and for me anyway , any hassle at all is not what I retired here for.

Thus I see my only option as renting , not even a condo purchase after witnessing the abuse of sinking funds that goes on here in Phuket.

However , I perceive the OPs purchase , by being far away from his tgs hometown, as at least being a better prospect than him having bought any land nearby her villiage.

Unfortunately we all change , and I believe that if one party is offered a special extra ( like 100% ownership of a nicely acrueing block of land )they will be less willing to smooth things over in a relationship... they can only gain from its breakdown.

With most Thais , they will assume the house is part of the prize anyway ( informed or not ) and go after it and worry about the legalities later..

[RigPig]

Without wanting to seem overly negative , Ive read 5 pages on the legal aspects of this purchase and dealing with its risks , but only one post on the ownership in reality , ie what can happen if the girlfriend or wife REALLY wants you off "her" land ... and it isnt a pleasant thought ...

I for one would not want the risk of holding out in a house , no matter what the legal agreement , if a very angry and determined tg decides she will get you out.

The fact that Farang cannot own land in Thailand is pretty universal known , and get a few of her covetous brothers after a bottle or two of Lao Kaw and all the papers and lawyers in the world will never convince them that the farang should be left quietly and snuggly with his contracts in the nice house on THEIR sisters land.

The family can easily make life miserable if they are determined to, and for me anyway , any hassle at all is not what I retired here for.

Thus I see my only option as renting , not even a condo purchase after witnessing the abuse of sinking funds that goes on here in Phuket.

However , I perceive the OPs purchase , by being far away from his tgs hometown, as at least being a better prospect than him having bought any land nearby her villiage.

Unfortunately we all change , and I believe that if one party is offered a special extra ( like 100% ownership of a nicely acrueing block of land )they will be less willing to smooth things over in a relationship... they can only gain from its breakdown.

With most Thais , they will assume the house is part of the prize anyway ( informed or not ) and go after it and worry about the legalities later..

Yes unfortunately you are right.....

The Irish man who came back and found his children in a well is still chasing his investment! There was even a "stand off" between Chalong and Surin police at the time. Crooked police, lawyers and gf/housekeeper. A brave man to keep it going this long! He was told at the time( I believe) change SIM cards and where you stay every 2 days by the Surin police.

Mods, if these facts are not close to the truth by all means delete, if they are, it should not be presumed off topic but in the context it is meant. The OP has paid for the land and no matter what will NEVER own it !!!! That is illegal here.

It could be said "he made his bed......"

[bikerider21]

I have userfruct on my house and my hotel. It's registered at the land register office so anyone wanting to buy the land will know that even if he buys the land, then I have full use of it until I die.

I would suggest a lawyer to handle everything for you. A small price at around 10,000B.

As I know, the userfruct apply s to the land but that automatically means all the properties built on the land, like houses, hotels etc.

There is one thing. Because it's in your g/f's name, she's got to sign the userfruct papers. It's a good time to see now if she's agreeable.

[CDNinKS]

I have found this discussion extremely interesting and informative.

I am interested in the mortgage strategy that has been mentioned previously. Now when using the term "mortgage", I am thinking more along the lines of the OP (prospective husband) being "the bank" (for want of a better description). I am not discussing an Ursfrut, Lease or Companies (although the mortgage principal could be applied to a company type set up) as I think that has already been covered. I do however think the OP may be able to instigate something along these lines..... as long as the Fiance is willing, if the papers have already been signed. It will I think give him an idea of her "true intentions" either way, should he decide to go down this path, if it is possible.

This is also designed to be a question, as well as another (possible) scenario around this persisting problem we farangs have here in Thailand. I am not looking at methods of breaking the law here, merely a method of "protecting" oneself or "insuring" oneself against the future. With some of the "investments" we make here, thinking about the long term, things can change as stated before. However we are all getting older and our ability to recover from a traumatic change of circumstances may be more difficult as time goes on.

I am fairly sure these scenarios would have to be instigated BEFORE a legal marriage is performed.

There are 2 possible ways of going around this I think, depending upon the relationship and the intentions of the OP (or farang in the relationship).

1/ If your intention is to protect your entire investment.

2/ If the intention is to protect your rights as a cohabitant and 50/50 partner (as in what I think would be construed as a "normal" marital relationship).

I make this distinction because some of us are "happier" to split the difference, but it is sometimes difficult to walk away from everything. If you are happy to walk away from everything then this is not an issue being discussed here. I am also assuming the ultimate objective is legal marriage.

With the first item, I am not sure this is possible after marriage, as I believe a document has to be signed stating basically "That ALL of the funds used to purchase the land belonged SOLELY to the wife at the time of purchase". This (is supposed to) negate ANY claim a husband may have upon the land in question. The husband may have some claim to 50% of the value of that property (I am not sure at all about this) however getting it will be (I would think) EXTREMELY difficult in a practical sense (assuming it has all gone sour by this stage).

However if this was instigated BEFORE a marriage, it would seem to me to be a legally binding "business" type venture between 2 parties. Things such as "interest", repayment terms and repayment times along with provisos for "liquidation" could all be "manipulated" to suit the circumstances and intentions at the time of the contract. The contract "terms" could even be changed at will I would think if both parties are in agreement.

With the second item, I think it could be set up (also before a marriage) with 50% (or whatever percentage is applicable) of the original purchase costs in the name of both parties (even if one half is supplied as a "gift" to the other party) It should have the same protection for the husband (to be) in as much as the property owned between both husband and wife (including land) would have to be sold (with suitable terms applied) and divided equally.

I also believe (correct me if I am wrong) that debts such as this are completely recoverable and are enabled to be passed on (to either side) in Thailand. This could possibly also add some "protection" to both parties if it was laid out in a manner that was suitable.

Comments please, especially from those with any experience with these matters.

Cheers

I can comment that the part about the document that needs to be signed is correct. I signed stating that the funds for the land were entirely my wife's (gf at the time) and I had no claim to the land. Everything I comment on is based on my experience at the Hua Hin land office........ as they say, your results may vary

Ahhhh and you weren't married. If you had just given her the money (as you did anyway) and she just bought the land of her own volition, then you were not involved and would not have had to sign anything so my question is why did you? How did they know you were "involved" in any case (if you weren’t married)?

A mortgagee (the lender) doesn't own the land but has a lien on it until it is paid for in full, as a bank does. Same same............

Yes, you are right, but at the time she (we) bought the land I did not have the good sense to ask questions of TV members and was naive enough not to know that I should not have went to the land office with her

Further to the post I made about a Thai woman not being able to sell land without her husbands consent, my wife tells me that another woman she knows needed to transfer some land and her husband was away at work overseas. Apparently that was taken care of with the appropriate amount of tea money at the Hua Hin land office.

[CDNinKS]

Without wanting to seem overly negative , Ive read 5 pages on the legal aspects of this purchase and dealing with its risks , but only one post on the ownership in reality , ie what can happen if the girlfriend or wife REALLY wants you off "her" land ... and it isnt a pleasant thought ...

I for one would not want the risk of holding out in a house , no matter what the legal agreement , if a very angry and determined tg decides she will get you out.

The fact that Farang cannot own land in Thailand is pretty universal known , and get a few of her covetous brothers after a bottle or two of Lao Kaw and all the papers and lawyers in the world will never convince them that the farang should be left quietly and snuggly with his contracts in the nice house on THEIR sisters land.

The family can easily make life miserable if they are determined to, and for me anyway , any hassle at all is not what I retired here for.

Thus I see my only option as renting , not even a condo purchase after witnessing the abuse of sinking funds that goes on here in Phuket.

However , I perceive the OPs purchase , by being far away from his tgs hometown, as at least being a better prospect than him having bought any land nearby her villiage.

Unfortunately we all change , and I believe that if one party is offered a special extra ( like 100% ownership of a nicely acrueing block of land )they will be less willing to smooth things over in a relationship... they can only gain from its breakdown.

With most Thais , they will assume the house is part of the prize anyway ( informed or not ) and go after it and worry about the legalities later..

Yes unfortunately you are right.....

The Irish man who came back and found his children in a well is still chasing his investment! There was even a "stand off" between Chalong and Surin police at the time. Crooked police, lawyers and gf/housekeeper. A brave man to keep it going this long! He was told at the time( I believe) change SIM cards and where you stay every 2 days by the Surin police.

Mods, if these facts are not close to the truth by all means delete, if they are, it should not be presumed off topic but in the context it is meant. The OP has paid for the land and no matter what will NEVER own it !!!! That is illegal here.

It could be said "he made his bed......"

You are absolutely right he will never "own" the land. The OP never asked how he could own the land, he knows he can't do that. He asked how he can TRY and protect himself from losing the USE of the land in the future.

You are also right about being legally entitled to use it and actually being able to use it, this is Thailand after all. Check my signature at the bottom of my posts ;-)

[janpoo]

Hello: Also you marry with her land still can not be on your name. Please find out may be you can use your name to be the owner of the house but not land. May be you have to make contact to rent land from her for 30 year.

Edited January 26, 2014 by janpoo

[CDNinKS]

Hello: Also you marry with her land still can not be on your name. Please find out may be you can use your name to be the owner of the house but not land. May be you have to make contact to rent land from her for 30 year.

Married or not, the land will never be in your name, other than if it is willed to you and then only for a Maximum of 365 days.

Stgrhe has already posted how to have the house in your name.

[little mary sunshine]

Another dumb ass giving away 50% of what he owns already.....Will probably lose everything !!!

Or windup as a "suicide" down the road.........

[CDNinKS]

Another dumb ass giving away 50% of what he owns already.....Will probably lose everything !!!

Or windup as a "suicide" down the road.........

You do realize that statement applies to every married man on the planet, right?

[zaZa9]

Without wanting to seem overly negative , Ive read 5 pages on the legal aspects of this purchase and dealing with its risks , but only one post on the ownership in reality , ie what can happen if the girlfriend or wife REALLY wants you off "her" land ... and it isnt a pleasant thought ...

I for one would not want the risk of holding out in a house , no matter what the legal agreement , if a very angry and determined tg decides she will get you out.

The fact that Farang cannot own land in Thailand is pretty universal known , and get a few of her covetous brothers after a bottle or two of Lao Kaw and all the papers and lawyers in the world will never convince them that the farang should be left quietly and snuggly with his contracts in the nice house on THEIR sisters land.

The family can easily make life miserable if they are determined to, and for me anyway , any hassle at all is not what I retired here for.

Thus I see my only option as renting , not even a condo purchase after witnessing the abuse of sinking funds that goes on here in Phuket.

However , I perceive the OPs purchase , by being far away from his tgs hometown, as at least being a better prospect than him having bought any land nearby her villiage.

Unfortunately we all change , and I believe that if one party is offered a special extra ( like 100% ownership of a nicely acrueing block of land )they will be less willing to smooth things over in a relationship... they can only gain from its breakdown.

With most Thais , they will assume the house is part of the prize anyway ( informed or not ) and go after it and worry about the legalities later..

Yes unfortunately you are right.....

The Irish man who came back and found his children in a well is still chasing his investment! There was even a "stand off" between Chalong and Surin police at the time. Crooked police, lawyers and gf/housekeeper. A brave man to keep it going this long! He was told at the time( I believe) change SIM cards and where you stay every 2 days by the Surin police.

Mods, if these facts are not close to the truth by all means delete, if they are, it should not be presumed off topic but in the context it is meant. The OP has paid for the land and no matter what will NEVER own it !!!! That is illegal here.

It could be said "he made his bed......"

You are absolutely right he will never "own" the land. The OP never asked how he could own the land, he knows he can't do that. He asked how he can TRY and protect himself from losing the USE of the land in the future.

You are also right about being legally entitled to use it and actually being able to use it, this is Thailand after all. Check my signature at the bottom of my posts ;-)

I think we all already agree that you will never own land in Thailand.

Its a law pretty much every Thai knows and is proud of.

But my contention is that you will never really own the house either , because if your gf or wife becomes an "ex" and she decides she wants it , she can make it so that you or any potential tenant will never live in it again .

Maybe , just maybe , you could go down the slippery slope of having some powerful local police actually support your ownership over the tg and the family , but thats bound to cost you as well. They will not be administering the law in favour of the falang with all the "right" papers just because it is the law ...

[Thighlander]

In 2006, I lent a thai lawyer money to buy a house, she gave me a thirty year lease at the lowest possible price, and made a will that gave me the house if she died. We sold in 2008, and from what I gathered; she isn't doing it anymore after talk of crackdowns. Worked for me, but I wouldn't do it again.

[Phuketboy]

If the OP had a Thai company and bought through that, would that protect him as the company would own the house land? I'm just digging as this is what I was thinking about the other day. I have a Thai company set up me having 49% the GF 49% and a friend 2%, preference shares to them (980 and 40 voting rights) and the normal shares to me (9800 voting rights). The lawyer set up this way to protect me and all businesses under that umbrella, so that even if they got together they can't vote me out and I still maintain full control of the company even though I have 49%. Also if the preference shares are sold, I have the right to them first and for most and I have to agree on where and who they are sold to.

Given this, If I bought land and/or a house through the company now, wouldn't I be protected this way? I'm only asking as this has been on my mind and it could be an option for the OP as well.

this is what we tried to do in the first place mate. we went to land office with lawyer, and was going to put the land under the existing company that we own our existing house. we had the company's capital increased, and thought this was enough. the land office then said they wanted to see both the shareholders' bank books with evidence of 1.5 m in my wifes, and 300,000B in the 2% shareholders. i put the money in and copied bank book showing the amount, and withdrew the cash. back at the land office they then wanted to see original bank books, plus all shareholders in attendance. the lawyer then said they were going to quiz my wife and the shareholder and ask where the money came from etc. everyone was saying "better put it in your fiance's name and write a contract saying she is just the "agent" to buy, and i am the "investor""

in the end, i am afraid to say, i had had enough, and just said "ok"

this was hua hin land office and apparently they dont look favourably on any companies that they feel may be nominee

hence i find myself in this situation now

thank god for thaivisa and all the invaluable advice that has been given by so many knowledgeable people

it goes without saying you are all invited to the house warming

here is a pic of the land

Was just wondering as I am wanted to buy property very soon also. The company is set up properly, pays tax and amounts paid to shareholders etc. Nice looking block of land you have buy the way. Where is this?

[UKJASE]

If the OP had a Thai company and bought through that, would that protect him as the company would own the house land? I'm just digging as this is what I was thinking about the other day. I have a Thai company set up me having 49% the GF 49% and a friend 2%, preference shares to them (980 and 40 voting rights) and the normal shares to me (9800 voting rights). The lawyer set up this way to protect me and all businesses under that umbrella, so that even if they got together they can't vote me out and I still maintain full control of the company even though I have 49%. Also if the preference shares are sold, I have the right to them first and for most and I have to agree on where and who they are sold to.

Given this, If I bought land and/or a house through the company now, wouldn't I be protected this way? I'm only asking as this has been on my mind and it could be an option for the OP as well.

this is what we tried to do in the first place mate. we went to land office with lawyer, and was going to put the land under the existing company that we own our existing house. we had the company's capital increased, and thought this was enough. the land office then said they wanted to see both the shareholders' bank books with evidence of 1.5 m in my wifes, and 300,000B in the 2% shareholders. i put the money in and copied bank book showing the amount, and withdrew the cash. back at the land office they then wanted to see original bank books, plus all shareholders in attendance. the lawyer then said they were going to quiz my wife and the shareholder and ask where the money came from etc. everyone was saying "better put it in your fiance's name and write a contract saying she is just the "agent" to buy, and i am the "investor""

in the end, i am afraid to say, i had had enough, and just said "ok"

this was hua hin land office and apparently they dont look favourably on any companies that they feel may be nominee

hence i find myself in this situation now

thank god for thaivisa and all the invaluable advice that has been given by so many knowledgeable people

it goes without saying you are all invited to the house warming

here is a pic of the land

Was just wondering as I am wanted to buy property very soon also. The company is set up properly, pays tax and amounts paid to shareholders etc. Nice looking block of land you have buy the way. Where is this?

the land is in hua hin Warltier..... about 5km's along the Pala U road

good luck with your purchase too mate - i am sure using all the information that has been contributed to this thread, yours too will work out to be a very successful acquisition

[khunPer]

I have userfruct on my house and my hotel. It's registered at the land register office so anyone wanting to buy the land will know that even if he buys the land, then I have full use of it until I die.

I would suggest a lawyer to handle everything for you. A small price at around 10,000B.

As I know, the userfruct apply s to the land but that automatically means all the properties built on the land, like houses, hotels etc.

There is one thing. Because it's in your g/f's name, she's got to sign the userfruct papers. It's a good time to see now if she's agreeable.

Usufruct seems to be the easiest and cheapest way for a foreigner to get possession or right of use of some land here.

However, looked at in the extreme rare situations – the ones you read about in books and sometimes in the news section at Thai Visa – if everything works out the wrong way your life may be in danger, as the usufruct runs for lifetime. Maybe I’ve read too many Thai claimed-to-be-true horror stories? But it sticks in the back of my head that a farang shall always be worth more alive than dead.

Another downside I see with usufruct is, that it may be difficult to sell your investment and move on – you may have both paid for the land and the building(s) on it – as nothing belongs to you. A lease, even more expensive in long terms, gives more rights on the investment.

Anyway, I got nothing to fear; I’m lucky, because my lovely GF and her family are different…!

[Stuart21]

Reckon the marriage has better long term chances with a good 30 year (& renew) & or usufruct.

Heard of one guy - marriage did not survive the day chanote was put into her name.

[smotherb]

It is always better to ask for advice before you shoot yourself in the head.

interesting, falangs "buying": land in Thailand is quite like Russian roulette with more than one bullet in the cylinder

Edited January 26, 2014 by smotherb