Anti-Election Protesters Intercept Ballots At Laksi

[ggold]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

More crap! how do you expect a government that has proven track record of corruption and incompetence form a forum for the changes to the constitution that are needed, and expect that to be unbiased?

The forum was so successful it isn't even sitting now to discuss the changes, Which show just how sincere PTP were with that forum!

Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament.

If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

the fact that as you say "I don't know what you are talking about on:" shows you how ignorant your comments are! My fact are correct, if you don't know then what are you doing posting on subjects you know nothing of?

[blaze]

And where were the Royal Thai Police while this was going on.

. Farcical

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Last Sunday, when the protesters blocked the pre-election the police made a big raid at Soi Nana to check if some bar there sells Alcohol to tourists which is forbidden on election days.

And of course collect tea money.

Let that sink in and after a while you'll understand why so many people support Suthep and why he is so successful.....

The system is complete rotten down with corruption....now it is so rotten down that it can not even protect itself anymore.

Yes I understand- you are commenting (rightly) on the corrupt nature that appears to be part of the Thai mentality. (and of course not just Thai- )

Do you think that the willingness of these girls to obey the law will miraculously improve after 'reforms' have been put in place?

Will the tax dodging small business owners, quit fudging their books?

The girls selling beer were breaking the law-

The cops receiving bribes were breaking the law.

The problem is how to shift Thais from people who conform to tradition (gifting those in authority) to conforming to law.

And that requires a total cultural shake-up. It's not going to happen as Suthep promises - over night.

but of course, Suthep is not anti-corruption at all.

He is anti Thaksin.

And after he wins- (he will win) nothing will have changed.

When the Thais take to the streets as they did in Venezuela a few years ago, to demand an end to police corruption- when they name shame and boycott schools that hint at tea money- when they pay their taxes as required- ..ah well- I'm dreaming.

This has nothing to do with corruption- it is about keepinig the old system alive in the face of the threat of the modern.

Remember that Thaksin prospered in a system that hadn't changed in centuries- a system of patronage- of playing loose with law-

And that is the same system that is under threat- and which Suthep seeks to breathe new life into.

the ONLY reform he wants is that the influence of Thaksin and his populist/popular programs be erased so we can get back to the old way of doing things.

Edited January 31, 2014 by blaze

[icommunity]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

More crap! how do you expect a government that has proven track record of corruption and incompetence form a forum for the changes to the constitution that are needed, and expect that to be unbiased?

The forum was so successful it isn't even sitting now to discuss the changes, Which show just how sincere PTP were with that forum!

Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament.

If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

the fact that as you say "I don't know what you are talking about on:" shows you how ignorant your comments are! My fact are correct, if you don't know then what are you doing posting on subjects you know nothing of?

WOW, cannot clarify! Let me tell you this - Half truth, distortion are worse than lies.

[crazykopite]

And where were the Royal Thai Police while this was going on.

. Farcical

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Last Sunday, when the protesters blocked the pre-election the police made a big raid at Soi Nana to check if some bar there sells Alcohol to tourists which is forbidden on election days.

And of course collect tea money.

Let that sink in and after a while you'll understand why so many people support Suthep and why he is so successful.....

The system is complete rotten down with corruption....now it is so rotten down that it can not even protect itself anymore.

Am I to understand that under a Suthep regime things will be any different if you really believe that then I am afraid you are living in cloud cuckoo land

[samba2014]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

You can't really demand "Reform before election" when there is no election planned.

PCAD actually demanded that Yingluck step down (as in RESIGN) and a "people's council" be appointed. They didn't want parliament dissolved for an immediate election. They wanted reform and then an election in 12 months.

Obviously the PCAD has not successfully met any of their demands.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[thesetat2013]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

Im not condoning Sutheps actions after they started rioting blocking voters rights. But you should look at the other side of the fence sometimes. Maybe they didnt want a reform committee because it would be led by YL and the PTP. From everything said by Suthep the 1st on his agenda is getting her out of office. Do you really think as head of a reform comittee that her first order of business would be to find a way to remove herself? So of course he would boycott it.. . As for the rest of your comment it seems like you have some personal issues becaus it is just ranting

Sent from my GT-S5310 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[MaxLee]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

No the demand was to get rid of the Shinawatra clan controlling Thailand!

And the election was their trick to continue.....(ala Thaksin 2006)

Election = trick = Wow!

My 8 year old wouldn't believe that!

Well then I will add my 8 cents:

Politicians in Thailand, makes promises to improve the quality of life or whatever = backstabbingTrick

Edited January 31, 2014 by MaxLee

[casualbiker]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

More crap! how do you expect a government that has proven track record of corruption and incompetence form a forum for the changes to the constitution that are needed, and expect that to be unbiased?

The forum was so successful it isn't even sitting now to discuss the changes, Which show just how sincere PTP were with that forum!

Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament.

If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

1) the rice pledging (over budget, missing funds and stock), the tablet purchase (dubious bidding, quality, actual units delivered, last minute "delivery" charge on contract , the new car buyers (numerous problems in implementation) , the new house buyers ( same as the NCB ) etc

2) the reform council was Barnharn's idea (as a coalition member) Yingluck just said ok

3) you right . you don't know ... much at all.

It is correct that the Democrats resigned from parliament BEFORE Yingluck dissolved parliament. It is correct that the governments reform forum meeting was last month (not Barnharns)

4) Do you feel intimidated ... WHY?

[icommunity]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

Im not condoning Sutheps actions after they started rioting blocking voters rights. But you should look at the other side of the fence sometimes. Maybe they didnt want a reform committee because it would be led by YL and the PTP. From everything said by Suthep the 1st on his agenda is getting her out of office. Do you really think as head of a reform comittee that her first order of business would be to find a way to remove herself? So of course he would boycott it.. . As for the rest of your comment it seems like you have some personal issues becaus it is just ranting

Sent from my GT-S5310 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Which reform committee/forum you were talking about? Both before and after the house dissolution. None is headed by PM YS and the PTP.

[Cricketnut]

Do these people have a single clue as to what they could possibly be involved in? They say they are not against elections, but want reform first. On the surface, that sounds fine, and I even support that aspect, but like an iceberg, the tip doesn't show the whole picture, or the dangers lurking below the surface.

The danger here is the unseen, unexplained, undefined "People's Council" as stated by Suthep. He claims it will be formed with 300 "good people", but what is his definition of "good people"? And another 100 personally handpicked by him to be appointed. Talk about "stacking the deck". He has yet to define, clearly, where these "chosen few" will come from, other than "from the people". Not a single name has been mentioned.

He claims he will not be a part of it. Is that to be taken with the same belief as "this will be our day of victory. If we don't win today, I will turn myself into the authorities" that he's uttered 3-4 times now after his "victory day" didn't happen? Or his flip-flopping on "we won't interfere with the elections" - "Were going to do everything possible to stop the elections"?

This un-elected "People's Council" would be the ruling authority of the country, with zero checks and balances, and could quite easily stay in power as long as they want, and never mind the "6 - 18 months" Suthep has quoted before elections again. There's no guarantee that elections would be held in the next 3-5 years with this bunch.

Be careful what you wish for.

A Dictatorship is what they are wishing for! Doesn't take a genius to work that out and I think even TV members themselves would admit that yes reform would be good.. But this is way too spurious for Thai people that I have talked with at work and even they are afraid of the consequences. They did admire Suthep in the beginning, but now seem really depressed, angry, and fearful about the current situation. I asked why they felt anger and surprisingly 3 admitted to me that they were angry and grieved that the Democrat Party had boycotted the elections. They felt that this time round they would have had a much better chance of winning. With the state of affairs being as they are at present maybe, just maybe that could have been a possibility... You have a lot to ANSWER for DEMOCRATS and now you have alienated and further spurned the people of Thailand. PDRC the same. Perpetrators of violence the same (I havent mentioned red shirts as none have been charged or convicted). THis is not really me speaking but the ordinary people I work with. What a bloody shame and disgrace... Oh please dont shoot the messenger

[seminomadic]

PCAD need to be honest and suggest abolishing elections and democratic politics permanently. They want a paternal system in a one-party state. Perhaps something like China, Laos or Vietnam. If that is what the people here are happy with, for the sake of stability, then let them have it. The world's first constitutional communist monarchy state!

I suspect, however, it is not what the majority want. The genie is already out of the bottle.

Thread winner. Thailand wants to have its cake and eat it too.

I've said for years Thailand should actually be communist (assuming a purer form than Stalinist or Maoist versions).

If the workers had more of a piece of the concern they work for, maybe 4 out of the 5 girls behind one counter at Central wouldn't stand around texting and picking their noses

Edited January 31, 2014 by seminomadic

[bobdown1]

And where were the Royal Thai Police while this was going on.

. Farcical

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Last Sunday, when the protesters blocked the pre-election the police made a big raid at Soi Nana to check if some bar there sells Alcohol to tourists which is forbidden on election days.

And of course collect tea money.

Let that sink in and after a while you'll understand why so many people support Suthep and why he is so successful.....

The system is complete rotten down with corruption....now it is so rotten down that it can not even protect itself anymore.

Suthep is so succesful

[icommunity]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

More crap! how do you expect a government that has proven track record of corruption and incompetence form a forum for the changes to the constitution that are needed, and expect that to be unbiased?

The forum was so successful it isn't even sitting now to discuss the changes, Which show just how sincere PTP were with that forum!

Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament.

If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

1) the rice pledging (over budget, missing funds and stock), the tablet purchase (dubious bidding, quality, actual units delivered, last minute "delivery" charge on contract , the new car buyers (numerous problems in implementation) , the new house buyers ( same as the NCB ) etc

2) the reform council was Barnharn's idea (as a coalition member) Yingluck just said ok

3) you right . you don't know ... much at all.

It is correct that the Democrats resigned from parliament BEFORE Yingluck dissolved parliament. It is correct that the governments reform forum meeting was last month (not Barnharns)

4) Do you feel intimidated ... WHY?

If you expect running for the benefit of a country is without problems and challenges, than to form a government is not for you. It is easy to make baseless and substantiate accusation.

The Reform Council was PM YS's initiative.

Yes, The DEM MPs resigned en masse but they were not in the government.

Both reform initiative had their meetings.

It is intimidating

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

You should read my reply to him and comment from there.

[casualbiker]

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

1) the rice pledging (over budget, missing funds and stock), the tablet purchase (dubious bidding, quality, actual units delivered, last minute "delivery" charge on contract , the new car buyers (numerous problems in implementation) , the new house buyers ( same as the NCB ) etc

2) the reform council was Barnharn's idea (as a coalition member) Yingluck just said ok

3) you right . you don't know ... much at all.

It is correct that the Democrats resigned from parliament BEFORE Yingluck dissolved parliament. It is correct that the governments reform forum meeting was last month (not Barnharns)

4) Do you feel intimidated ... WHY?

If you expect running for the benefit of a country is without problems and challenges, than to form a government is not for you. It is easy to make baseless and substantiate accusation.

The Reform Council was PM YS's initiative.

Yes, The DEM MPs resigned en masse but they were not in the government.

Both reform initiative had their meetings.

It is intimidating

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

You should read my reply to him and comment from there.

As the main elected opposition party THE DEMOCRATS could very well be deemed in government for a parliamentary system AND IN THE CONTEXT OF THE REMARK.

Your answer to 1) is just ridiculous. You asked for a track record "corruption and incompetence"

but on further looking you were right that Yingluck asking Banharn.. i thought it was Banharns idea..BUT can you tell me how thats going... stalled didn't it ?

replaced with this:

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/pm-yingluck-proposes-499-member-thailand-reform-council/

and how is that one going.. is it formed yet?

[Publicus]

Do these people have a single clue as to what they could possibly be involved in? They say they are not against elections, but want reform first. On the surface, that sounds fine, and I even support that aspect, but like an iceberg, the tip doesn't show the whole picture, or the dangers lurking below the surface.

The danger here is the unseen, unexplained, undefined "People's Council" as stated by Suthep. He claims it will be formed with 300 "good people", but what is his definition of "good people"? And another 100 personally handpicked by him to be appointed. Talk about "stacking the deck". He has yet to define, clearly, where these "chosen few" will come from, other than "from the people". Not a single name has been mentioned.

He claims he will not be a part of it. Is that to be taken with the same belief as "this will be our day of victory. If we don't win today, I will turn myself into the authorities" that he's uttered 3-4 times now after his "victory day" didn't happen? Or his flip-flopping on "we won't interfere with the elections" - "Were going to do everything possible to stop the elections"?

This un-elected "People's Council" would be the ruling authority of the country, with zero checks and balances, and could quite easily stay in power as long as they want, and never mind the "6 - 18 months" Suthep has quoted before elections again. There's no guarantee that elections would be held in the next 3-5 years with this bunch.

Be careful what you wish for.

This is an excellent post.

[Cricketnut]

And where were the Royal Thai Police while this was going on.

. Farcical

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Last Sunday, when the protesters blocked the pre-election the police made a big raid at Soi Nana to check if some bar there sells Alcohol to tourists which is forbidden on election days.

And of course collect tea money.

Let that sink in and after a while you'll understand why so many people support Suthep and why he is so successful.....

The system is complete rotten down with corruption....now it is so rotten down that it can not even protect itself anymore.

Am I to understand that under a Suthep regime things will be any different if you really believe that then I am afraid you are living in cloud cuckoo land

The vast majority of Thais think that a little graft is OK if it benefits them. So a real question could be thus, if 300 hundred normal Thais run the country for 12-18 months will graft still be accepted? Why of course. And the average Thai will be no better off! Oh I forgot Suthep will be and his merry men. What a joke....

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[gabruce]

And where were the Royal Thai Police while this was going on.

. Farcical

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

C'mon, no helmet fines= karaoke, booze brothels: priorities.

Still working hard in Chiang Mai collecting helmet fines today.

[gabruce]

Do these people have a single clue as to what they could possibly be involved in? They say they are not against elections, but want reform first. On the surface, that sounds fine, and I even support that aspect, but like an iceberg, the tip doesn't show the whole picture, or the dangers lurking below the surface.

The danger here is the unseen, unexplained, undefined "People's Council" as stated by Suthep. He claims it will be formed with 300 "good people", but what is his definition of "good people"? And another 100 personally handpicked by him to be appointed. Talk about "stacking the deck". He has yet to define, clearly, where these "chosen few" will come from, other than "from the people". Not a single name has been mentioned.

He claims he will not be a part of it. Is that to be taken with the same belief as "this will be our day of victory. If we don't win today, I will turn myself into the authorities" that he's uttered 3-4 times now after his "victory day" didn't happen? Or his flip-flopping on "we won't interfere with the elections" - "Were going to do everything possible to stop the elections"?

This un-elected "People's Council" would be the ruling authority of the country, with zero checks and balances, and could quite easily stay in power as long as they want, and never mind the "6 - 18 months" Suthep has quoted before elections again. There's no guarantee that elections would be held in the next 3-5 years with this bunch.

Be careful what you wish for.

This is an excellent post.

I agree. Excellent point. He would have more credibility if they at least proposed 300 names. How would they ensure that reform would ever end? I suppose a contract might be useful and viable. Of course I think I would trust a reform council picked by Pheu Thai less. But then I am a cynical old man. It's politics. Details probably mean the death of every politicians dream, including Pheu Thai and the Democrats. However this does seem to be a failing in all democracies. Spout platitudes but never reveal the details.

[Muhendis]

And where were the Royal Thai Police while this was going on.

. Farcical

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I'm assuming they are keeping away so the red shirt assassins can make their move without police presence. That is how it usually works anyway. The police will arrive after the violence to plant evidence....... again.

Don't forget there was an incident where a policeman was shot by a black shirt sniper. Small wonder the police don't wish to be high profile.

[tingtongteesood]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

More crap! how do you expect a government that has proven track record of corruption and incompetence form a forum for the changes to the constitution that are needed, and expect that to be unbiased?

The forum was so successful it isn't even sitting now to discuss the changes, Which show just how sincere PTP were with that forum!

Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament.

If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

Are you blind ? Or just don't have the mental capacity to process the bleeding obvious right in front of your face ? Either way, try and educate yourself before embarrassing yourself again with the usual utter crap you spew here and leave the conversation to the adults.....

[tingtongteesood]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

More crap! how do you expect a government that has proven track record of corruption and incompetence form a forum for the changes to the constitution that are needed, and expect that to be unbiased?

The forum was so successful it isn't even sitting now to discuss the changes, Which show just how sincere PTP were with that forum!

Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament.

If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

Are you blind ? Or just don't have the mental capacity to process the bleeding obvious right in front of your face ? Either way, try and educate yourself before embarrassing yourself again with the usual utter crap you spew here and leave the conversation to the adults.....

[h90]

And where were the Royal Thai Police while this was going on.

. Farcical

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Last Sunday, when the protesters blocked the pre-election the police made a big raid at Soi Nana to check if some bar there sells Alcohol to tourists which is forbidden on election days.

And of course collect tea money.

Let that sink in and after a while you'll understand why so many people support Suthep and why he is so successful.....

The system is complete rotten down with corruption....now it is so rotten down that it can not even protect itself anymore.

Yes I understand- you are commenting (rightly) on the corrupt nature that appears to be part of the Thai mentality. (and of course not just Thai- )

Do you think that the willingness of these girls to obey the law will miraculously improve after 'reforms' have been put in place?

Will the tax dodging small business owners, quit fudging their books?

The girls selling beer were breaking the law-

The cops receiving bribes were breaking the law.

The problem is how to shift Thais from people who conform to tradition (gifting those in authority) to conforming to law.

And that requires a total cultural shake-up. It's not going to happen as Suthep promises - over night.

but of course, Suthep is not anti-corruption at all.

He is anti Thaksin.

And after he wins- (he will win) nothing will have changed.

When the Thais take to the streets as they did in Venezuela a few years ago, to demand an end to police corruption- when they name shame and boycott schools that hint at tea money- when they pay their taxes as required- ..ah well- I'm dreaming.

This has nothing to do with corruption- it is about keepinig the old system alive in the face of the threat of the modern.

Remember that Thaksin prospered in a system that hadn't changed in centuries- a system of patronage- of playing loose with law-

And that is the same system that is under threat- and which Suthep seeks to breathe new life into.

the ONLY reform he wants is that the influence of Thaksin and his populist/popular programs be erased so we can get back to the old way of doing things.

No you are only partially right...there was always the system of ignoring the law, taking 5-10 % etc. But under Thaksin it got complete out of order, total extreme.

Suthep and/or the people who demonstrate are anti-corruption...corruption (and abuse of power for profit) is the dominating topic at all the speeches.

No, even with a big win, it won't happen that Thailand is over night corruption free.

But with strong laws and on the other side canceling the jungle of useless laws that block the courts from meaningful work it will improve.

If the policeman earns the double, but in case of slightest corruption is out and without pension and his money sized than the visible corruption will fade away fast and the system will improve over a few years.

If vote buying results of a lifetime ban for both buyer and seller + a hefty fee for both and the middlemen the system will improve.

And if it needs longer it is even more a reason to start early. It worked in Croatia, it worked in South Korea.

My father (73) told when he started to sell things it was common in Europe that the purchase get something, while now it is not existent anymore and that in "just" 40 years.

There is no genetic reason why Thais are more corrupt than Germans, so "we" (we not corrupt) just need the right legal framework and education.

[tingtongteesood]

Do these people have a single clue as to what they could possibly be involved in? They say they are not against elections, but want reform first. On the surface, that sounds fine, and I even support that aspect, but like an iceberg, the tip doesn't show the whole picture, or the dangers lurking below the surface.

The danger here is the unseen, unexplained, undefined "People's Council" as stated by Suthep. He claims it will be formed with 300 "good people", but what is his definition of "good people"? And another 100 personally handpicked by him to be appointed. Talk about "stacking the deck". He has yet to define, clearly, where these "chosen few" will come from, other than "from the people". Not a single name has been mentioned.

He claims he will not be a part of it. Is that to be taken with the same belief as "this will be our day of victory. If we don't win today, I will turn myself into the authorities" that he's uttered 3-4 times now after his "victory day" didn't happen? Or his flip-flopping on "we won't interfere with the elections" - "Were going to do everything possible to stop the elections"?

This un-elected "People's Council" would be the ruling authority of the country, with zero checks and balances, and could quite easily stay in power as long as they want, and never mind the "6 - 18 months" Suthep has quoted before elections again. There's no guarantee that elections would be held in the next 3-5 years with this bunch.

Be careful what you wish for.

A Dictatorship is what they are wishing for! Doesn't take a genius to work that out and I think even TV members themselves would admit that yes reform would be good.. But this is way too spurious for Thai people that I have talked with at work and even they are afraid of the consequences. They did admire Suthep in the beginning, but now seem really depressed, angry, and fearful about the current situation. I asked why they felt anger and surprisingly 3 admitted to me that they were angry and grieved that the Democrat Party had boycotted the elections. They felt that this time round they would have had a much better chance of winning. With the state of affairs being as they are at present maybe, just maybe that could have been a possibility... You have a lot to ANSWER for DEMOCRATS and now you have alienated and further spurned the people of Thailand. PDRC the same. Perpetrators of violence the same (I havent mentioned red shirts as none have been charged or convicted). THis is not really me speaking but the ordinary people I work with. What a bloody shame and disgrace... Oh please dont shoot the messenger

Your stubborn blindness to accept the truth is quite frustrating. You are spewing complete bs same as usual. TAKSIN was trying for a dictatorship and the protests stopped his plans. Why do you say the Suteb wants to be a dictator ? There is no evidence to support spurious crazy theory so stop spreading your personal manure please. It is a lie. We could have had 3 months of reforms by now and been well on the way to something changing if the caretakers didn't keep obfuscating and wasting time with all this other crap. The election is completely pointless. I feel the Dems boycotted the electtion and really don't want to win right now as someone has to clean up the hell of a mess PT have created and whatever they do it will be wrong, they would rather watch PT be forced to clean it up and laugh at the bigger mess they create in the process ( ie the bank loans fiasco today haahahahaha ). The spotlight will be on them now and they won't be able to get away with anything like they did before the protests started. GOOD !

[icommunity]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

More crap! how do you expect a government that has proven track record of corruption and incompetence form a forum for the changes to the constitution that are needed, and expect that to be unbiased?

The forum was so successful it isn't even sitting now to discuss the changes, Which show just how sincere PTP were with that forum!

Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament.

If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

Are you blind ? Or just don't have the mental capacity to process the bleeding obvious right in front of your face ? Either way, try and educate yourself before embarrassing yourself again with the usual utter crap you spew here and leave the conversation to the adults.....

Wow, sound very dictatorial. You probably is blinded by the pay you will get to buy your lolipop or may be a bluesky branded whistle shape pacifier that can also be used as a whistle to intimidate and violate the rights of others.

[gabruce]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

More crap! how do you expect a government that has proven track record of corruption and incompetence form a forum for the changes to the constitution that are needed, and expect that to be unbiased?

The forum was so successful it isn't even sitting now to discuss the changes, Which show just how sincere PTP were with that forum!

Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament.

If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

Are you blind ? Or just don't have the mental capacity to process the bleeding obvious right in front of your face ? Either way, try and educate yourself before embarrassing yourself again with the usual utter crap you spew here and leave the conversation to the adults.....

If you look past the rhetoric he's just saying get your facts straight before posting. He's saying your timeline on recent events in thailand is not accurate. I agree with him. Democrats resigned first, then after that the government was dissolved (I forget how long - a few days or a few weeks). Same with the reform council - setup by the government after the house dissolution - they weren't even thinking about it before the house dissolved. Yes, the Democrats did not attend the reform council.

[pipkins]

Looks like with Suthep down to his last 200 today, and the whole of the world condemning PDRC and Suthep in particular that some of his fans are resorting to ganging up and spewing bile.

Any Country in the world and this vermin would have been rounded up months ago.

By all means, let PDRC members give Suthep their blank ballot papers to do with as he wishes. He could still never get close to PT.

BUT, don't rob other people of that right.

Yes I know the Army say it is ok to behave like this, and the Courts do.. But the real world, and the majority of Thais, do now want this new fascist on the Asisn Block, dictating their lives for the next 2 generations.

Remember, he has his insipid son with him now, so that is probably another 40 years Thailand will be bowing to a Thaugsaboon. if he gets his way.

[philw]

The idea of "Reform before Election" came after the parliament was dissolved. The DEM demanded the Parliament be dissolved and when it happened, they boycotted it. Before this, the Government initiated a Reform Forum but that was boycotted by the DEM as well.

It is an excuse to hide their fear of the people mandate. They rejected all reform initiatives and demanded that only their 'people council' with members nominated exclusively by the DEM's PDRC/PCAD 'executives'.

The worst thing is that the people's council will surely not include members of Puea Thai, which means that the supporters of the party who received the most votes in the last election will be completely stripped of their voice in Thailand's future.

That is clearly the intention and it will be achieved by whatever means.

Puea Thai will gone in a few weeks either by force majure by Suthep or judicial conniving and subjective judgements.

Either way, a democratically elected PM will have been removed and there are going to be a very large number of rightfully aggrieved Thai people.

Suthep, his backers and the "Powers that Be" are making a very grave mistake to the long term detriment of Thailand.

The genie is well out of the bottle and all the nonsense spoken here about Thaksin ( and his "clan') is nothing but a red herring.....

As ever, foreigners will probably be safe and able to spout off as usual, but the 15 to 20 million disenfranchised or just simply ignored voters are going to have a serious voice and some are bound to take action.

Folks on here supporting Suthep do not love Thailand and cannot see beyond the broken record, "hate Thaksin" mantra that has made this forum painful over the last few years.

[rreddin]

PCAD need to be honest and suggest abolishing elections and democratic politics permanently. They want a paternal system in a one-party state. Perhaps something like China, Laos or Vietnam. If that is what the people here are happy with, for the sake of stability, then let them have it. The world's first constitutional communist monarchy state!

I suspect, however, it is not what the majority want. The genie is already out of the bottle.

It will not be a communist state. It will be yet another period in Thailand's history when it is a fascist state. However, should that happen, the kingdom would break up into a number of largely autonomous regions leaving the Dear Leader to lord it over some of the Southern Provinces and a large part, but not all, of Bangkok.

[ggold]

More crap! how do you expect a government that has proven track record of corruption and incompetence form a forum for the changes to the constitution that are needed, and expect that to be unbiased?

The forum was so successful it isn't even sitting now to discuss the changes, Which show just how sincere PTP were with that forum!

Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament.

If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!

1. Where is the proven track record of corruption and incompetence.

2. I did not argue whether the government initiative on a reform council headed by Banharn Silipa Archa is successful or not. I was pointing out the fact that it was there before there is a DEM's PDRC/PCAD

3. I don't know what you are talking about on:

"Also the Dems resigned from government before any dissolution, it was after they resigned the government dissolved parliament. and the reform forum was last month not before PTP dissolved parliament."

"If you can't get your facts right, then don't post this BS and expect anyone to believe it!"

Are you intimidating me. I will not be intimidated to stop sharing. You don't have to agreed with me and you are entitleld to your opinions but you don't have to use BS.

the fact that as you say "I don't know what you are talking about on:" shows you how ignorant your comments are! My fact are correct, if you don't know then what are you doing posting on subjects you know nothing of?

WOW, cannot clarify! Let me tell you this - Half truth, distortion are worse than lies.

So why do you tell half truths distort and lie? Why do I need to clarify what is readily available to read in the media?

[HerbalEd]

True democracy at work ..... NOT!