'Protest financiers' list brings angry denials, includes deceased executive

[tingtongteesood]

Even being dead isn't enough, to get one's name off the DSI's list, Oh My Budda !

Yay for Red Intimidation Investigation !

A person can provide funding before he dies, or can leave a bequest, or an estate can donate on behalf of the deceased.

The alleged list is in respect to donors. If you picked your nose yesterday, and you died tomorrow, would it mean that you did not pick your nose?

Right. Most of the money was given two years ago (not to Suthep but put into a general 'anti-Thaksin' pot), so Chaleo actually could have donated before he died. That said, is he even on the list or is The Nation simply taking Suthep's word for it? Because on the BKK Post leaked list, Chalerm - Chaleo's son - is named, not his father. I checked Manager as well and it says the 'owner of Red Bull' (i.e. Chalerm now), so the idea that Chaleo is named seems to come from Suthep alone unless anyone has seen it on a list they've seen?

Surely The Nation should write 'alleged' list anyway since nothing was actually released. Even the much maligned - amongst anti-govt folk on here at least - Khao Sod would provide us with an 'alleged' before repeating an unsubstantiated rumour. It would also provide us with the source of the rumour instead of simply present it as a fact.

Hence The Nation should have written something like: "PDRC leader Suthep Thaugsuban claimed the leaked list even included a dead man. Red Bull patriach Chaleo Yoovidhya, two years deceased, apparently appears on the CAPO list. Chalerm, in typically belligerent mood, shot back: 'I know the guy is dead'. Chalerm staggered, nearly falling, but managing to right himself enough to raise a single finger. 'I'm in charge of this list and I'll do whatever the hell I like with it. If anyone wants out, they know where I am. Maybe we can figure something out. Now, someone get me another dam_n drink... Gin Fizz for me. Always Gin Fizz.'

The CMPO bartender, respledent in a pink tux, brought the sad news that the gin was out. The best minds in Thai intelligence had failed to keep track of the gin situation. Chalerm, despondent, sent a staffer to 7/11 for a fresh bottle of Gilbeys. 'I know I'm funding fascism' said the big man. 'But if it's a choice between gin and democracy, what use is democracy? Besides, when you're trying to take down a notorious fiend like Suthep, you've got to keep the mind limber...' The CMPO head, fresh glass in hand, later threatened to seize the money Chaleo's family will burn for him on Ching Ming. 'Don't get the idea that the grave will protect you', he said."

You have proof of this

Most of the money was given two years ago (not to Suthep but put into a general 'anti-Thaksin' pot)

I bet you don't. I think this is more made up crap coming from the red sheeple propaganda mill. If you have proof then kindly provide it and I* will say sorry 3 times. If you don't then please stop spreading baloney...

[Emptyset]

Chalerm : " ...saying no one could stop him because the PM had given him the authority to make the decision. He also dismissed reports he would be sacked as CMPO director. "

Quote of the year : " No one could stop him ".

It sounds as if at least someone within the administration is getting wise to the fact that Chalerm is perhaps not such a brainy idea after all. He acts unilaterally, he shoots from the hip. He's immune from error because - well, he doesn't do errors, that's all. A deceased man on an enemies list ? Oh, he knew about that. Obviously, not being alive was not a compelling enough reason for Chalerm to excuse him from the list. You've got to do better than that. As Chalerm sees it, he's got a job to run sin out of Dodge. He's got better things to do than to get bogged down in details. But the details are really going to bite this administration, because there are clearly company executives on the list whose only " sin " was to have their products consumed by protesters. And if Chalerm thinks its a good idea to shame the very companies that are voluntarily investing in the fragile economy of this country, he had better think again. Whatever soul-searching occurs at the bottom of a whiskey bottle, now's the recommended time to do it.

So have you, perhaps. Can you point me in the direction of a leaked list which shows Chaleo's name? Because I've seen two and he's on neither of them. One indicates the head of Red Bull, the other names Chalerm, Chaleo's son. So where does the idea Chaleo is on the list come from? Suthep's the only one to have said it, as far as I can see. If I see a link to the contrary, I'll admit I was wrong. Can we be sure it wasn't Suthep just getting some pre-emptive ridicule in to downplay the list?

''because there are clearly company executives on the list whose only " sin " was to have their products consumed by protesters.''

How do you know this?

"Chalerm thinks its a good idea to shame the very companies that are voluntarily investing in the fragile economy of this country"

I'm not convinced funding this movement is doing much for the fragile economy. As for 'voluntarily investing', you make business sound like a charity. They're investing because there are profits to be made. They're not giving money away. They'll stop investing when they stop making money. Their own movement is more likely to damage their chances of that than Chalerm is, although the list may, of course, spark boycotts. That said I don't see how Chalerm's strategy will work other than as a threat, because like I said before, surely revealing the names will make these people think they have nothing to lose, so why not give more money to Suthep?

[jaidam]

For once, I find myself in full agreement with the axis of silliness Tarit,Chalerm, and Thaksin. Just because somebody is dead is no excuse to avoid justice. These deceased souls should be punished to the full extent that the law permits(once their corpse is found guilty in court of course). For the record does anybody know how the law pertains to the dead?

[Jonmarleesco]

Well, Chalerm was either compos mentis when Chaleo passed away, or in a state of insobriety. Either way, his response to the question of error only further reinforces the general wonderment that he is seen as fit for any job, given the often tenuous link between cerebrum and vocalisation.

[geriatrickid]

Pluck and courage ? Funniest thing I have heard all day.

And where exactly is your place in 'Thai social hierarchy' - what exactly makes you think that you are so far above to look down your nose at the rest of us ? 'Know your place' - where, where is my place. Tell me mas'ser. How very arrogant of you.

Isn't this exactly what the reds keep accusing the 'elites' of doing ? Be careful, the reds may add you to their list of people to kill if you keep talking like that.....

As I wrote, I was following the rules that the Suthep contingent follow, and they do indeed have a pecking order. There is a distinctive hierarchy and anyone who has attended social functions, and I mean the real ones such as the receptions for diplomats, or hiso weddings, or national dinners will see it on full display. If you want to play the game in Thailand, you better understand that Thai rules apply, and not the egalitarianism one finds in many western countries. That's all I was saying. In Thailand, people of lower social status do not talk back to those of higher social status. It's a cultural taboo. There are a lot of social customs that it seems many westerners are oblivious to.

Sure, there is plenty to criticize about the PM, and I have often asked why she did not address the nation on TV and tell the people the facts as she saw them. That's what western leaders would do. However, this is Thailand, and it's just not done. By Thai standards of staying quiet, by avoiding confrontation, of undertaking "conciliatory" gestures, the PM has been responding to the situation Thai style. Sure, I'd have been happier if they had just water hosed the protestors like they do in Europe or kettled them as they do in North America, but that's not how it's done in Thailand. They wait, and wait, and wait, and then explode with an over the top response. By western standards, the PM hasn't acted. By Thai standards, she has. It takes some strength to remain calm in the face of tough circumstances, and she's stayed the course her government has laid out. Abhisit gave in to a very western response on the day of the crackdown against the reds, with the army basically stepping in while he dithered. He was pushed aside for a few hours. The PM hasn't wilted and given in to those demanding the riot squads be used. For every effort by the PDRC to ratchet up the confrontation, the government has responded with restraint. It takes discipline not to fall into a trap of provoked violence. The result is that the Bangkok protests have withered. Many of the protestors have gone home.

It's not her looks as some misogynists claim. Rather, she is a likeable person who projects empathy. When you meet the lady, you get a genuine warm smile and when she asks about your parents, she means it. She has an ability to make people feel comfortable and can elicit affection. She has one on one people skills that if you could see, you would understand how she can still maintain loyalty in an inner circle more given to backstabbing than team work. These are qualities that her western critics of TVF will never see because they live in a different word.

[Jonmarleesco]

Chalerm : " ...saying no one could stop him because the PM had given him the authority to make the decision. He also dismissed reports he would be sacked as CMPO director. "

Quote of the year : " No one could stop him ".

It sounds as if at least someone within the administration is getting wise to the fact that Chalerm is perhaps not such a brainy idea after all. He acts unilaterally, he shoots from the hip. He's immune from error because - well, he doesn't do errors, that's all. A deceased man on an enemies list ? Oh, he knew about that. Obviously, not being alive was not a compelling enough reason for Chalerm to excuse him from the list. You've got to do better than that. As Chalerm sees it, he's got a job to run sin out of Dodge. He's got better things to do than to get bogged down in details. But the details are really going to bite this administration, because there are clearly company executives on the list whose only " sin " was to have their products consumed by protesters. And if Chalerm thinks its a good idea to shame the very companies that are voluntarily investing in the fragile economy of this country, he had better think again. Whatever soul-searching occurs at the bottom of a whiskey bottle, now's the recommended time to do it.

So have you, perhaps. Can you point me in the direction of a leaked list which shows Chaleo's name? Because I've seen two and he's on neither of them. One indicates the head of Red Bull, the other names Chalerm, Chaleo's son. So where does the idea Chaleo is on the list come from? Suthep's the only one to have said it, as far as I can see. If I see a link to the contrary, I'll admit I was wrong. Can we be sure it wasn't Suthep just getting some pre-emptive ridicule in to downplay the list?

''because there are clearly company executives on the list whose only " sin " was to have their products consumed by protesters.''

How do you know this?

"Chalerm thinks its a good idea to shame the very companies that are voluntarily investing in the fragile economy of this country"

I'm not convinced funding this movement is doing much for the fragile economy. As for 'voluntarily investing', you make business sound like a charity. They're investing because there are profits to be made. They're not giving money away. They'll stop investing when they stop making money. Their own movement is more likely to damage their chances of that than Chalerm is, although the list may, of course, spark boycotts. That said I don't see how Chalerm's strategy will work other than as a threat, because like I said before, surely revealing the names will make these people think they have nothing to lose, so why not give more money to Suthep?

From PTP's Chalerm, perhaps?

[tingtongteesood]

Pluck and courage ? Funniest thing I have heard all day.

And where exactly is your place in 'Thai social hierarchy' - what exactly makes you think that you are so far above to look down your nose at the rest of us ? 'Know your place' - where, where is my place. Tell me mas'ser. How very arrogant of you.

Isn't this exactly what the reds keep accusing the 'elites' of doing ? Be careful, the reds may add you to their list of people to kill if you keep talking like that.....

As I wrote, I was following the rules that the Suthep contingent follow, and they do indeed have a pecking order. There is a distinctive hierarchy and anyone who has attended social functions, and I mean the real ones such as the receptions for diplomats, or hiso weddings, or national dinners will see it on full display. If you want to play the game in Thailand, you better understand that Thai rules apply, and not the egalitarianism one finds in many western countries. That's all I was saying. In Thailand, people of lower social status do not talk back to those of higher social status. It's a cultural taboo. There are a lot of social customs that it seems many westerners are oblivious to.

Sure, there is plenty to criticize about the PM, and I have often asked why she did not address the nation on TV and tell the people the facts as she saw them. That's what western leaders would do. However, this is Thailand, and it's just not done. By Thai standards of staying quiet, by avoiding confrontation, of undertaking "conciliatory" gestures, the PM has been responding to the situation Thai style. Sure, I'd have been happier if they had just water hosed the protestors like they do in Europe or kettled them as they do in North America, but that's not how it's done in Thailand. They wait, and wait, and wait, and then explode with an over the top response. By western standards, the PM hasn't acted. By Thai standards, she has. It takes some strength to remain calm in the face of tough circumstances, and she's stayed the course her government has laid out. Abhisit gave in to a very western response on the day of the crackdown against the reds, with the army basically stepping in while he dithered. He was pushed aside for a few hours. The PM hasn't wilted and given in to those demanding the riot squads be used. For every effort by the PDRC to ratchet up the confrontation, the government has responded with restraint. It takes discipline not to fall into a trap of provoked violence. The result is that the Bangkok protests have withered. Many of the protestors have gone home.

It's not her looks as some misogynists claim. Rather, she is a likeable person who projects empathy. When you meet the lady, you get a genuine warm smile and when she asks about your parents, she means it. She has an ability to make people feel comfortable and can elicit affection. She has one on one people skills that if you could see, you would understand how she can still maintain loyalty in an inner circle more given to backstabbing than team work. These are qualities that her western critics of TVF will never see because they live in a different word.

Riiiiiight, whatever you say.

Having more money does not make anyone better than anyone else, Taksin and associated cronies are proof positive of that ! I say what I want to who I want and I don't care how much money you have, or who your daddy is, or who your best mate is. I am not 'oblivious' of anything but I don't care if it is the Thai way or not, it is not my way.

Plenty to criticize about the caretaker puppet, yes. Absolutely nothing good to say. The 'Thai way' is to try and avoid the problem and hope it goes away to try and save face. What a load of baloney ! Never solves any problems, just makes more as we see happening here. Useless, incompetent woman. The other reason she shows 'restraint' is because she knows she will be branded a 'murderer' by her opponents as her administration has tried to do to them. We all know the politically motivated move to strong arm Abisit and Suteb into agreeing to the amnesty will be thrown out of court, but we all know they may also bring the same case against Yinglack. The less people die the less chance she has of being found guilty. Not that she would anyway, but the accusation will stay with her always as it will stick with them, would be better if they both sue the 'Shin clan' for defamation of character after it is thrown out.

I never met Yinglack personally so I can't comment on that and glad I never have as I prefer not to meet horrid people like that. I don't find the caretaker puppet likeable or empathetic in the least, she is a pathetic example of nepotism of the worst kind. Useless, no clue how to act in that role, tries her best to avoid responsibility, a disgrace to politics worldwide. And to address your last point, who the hell wants to live in that world ? I sure as heck don't, I like my world just the way it is...

[hellyes2oo2]

Geriatrickid, you really do talk a load of Bollo*ks. Firstly let's talk about the hiso's. member for member Thaksins goverment were far richer than the Democrats goverment, but i must admit they weren't when first elected, but by the time that thaksin crapped himself and fled they were. As for Yingluck not using the army to inflict violence on the protesters, there is only one reason for that. It is because the army would refuse to do it. And just remind me will you, when the (peaceful) red shirts occupied Bangkok in 2010, did they not set up blockades using sharpened bamboo poles, and burning tyres, as well as of course many buildings getting burned down from accidental sparks caused by the burning tyres. I wish apologists like you would wake up to the fact that the Thaksin regime has ruined this country, and now even the poor are realising, that in the past although they got less for their rice, at least they were paid for it.

[gemini81]

Pluck and courage ? Funniest thing I have heard all day.

And where exactly is your place in 'Thai social hierarchy' - what exactly makes you think that you are so far above to look down your nose at the rest of us ? 'Know your place' - where, where is my place. Tell me mas'ser. How very arrogant of you.

Isn't this exactly what the reds keep accusing the 'elites' of doing ? Be careful, the reds may add you to their list of people to kill if you keep talking like that.....

As I wrote, I was following the rules that the Suthep contingent follow, and they do indeed have a pecking order. There is a distinctive hierarchy and anyone who has attended social functions, and I mean the real ones such as the receptions for diplomats, or hiso weddings, or national dinners will see it on full display. If you want to play the game in Thailand, you better understand that Thai rules apply, and not the egalitarianism one finds in many western countries. That's all I was saying. In Thailand, people of lower social status do not talk back to those of higher social status. It's a cultural taboo. There are a lot of social customs that it seems many westerners are oblivious to.

Sure, there is plenty to criticize about the PM, and I have often asked why she did not address the nation on TV and tell the people the facts as she saw them. That's what western leaders would do. However, this is Thailand, and it's just not done. By Thai standards of staying quiet, by avoiding confrontation, of undertaking "conciliatory" gestures, the PM has been responding to the situation Thai style. Sure, I'd have been happier if they had just water hosed the protestors like they do in Europe or kettled them as they do in North America, but that's not how it's done in Thailand. They wait, and wait, and wait, and then explode with an over the top response. By western standards, the PM hasn't acted. By Thai standards, she has. It takes some strength to remain calm in the face of tough circumstances, and she's stayed the course her government has laid out. Abhisit gave in to a very western response on the day of the crackdown against the reds, with the army basically stepping in while he dithered. He was pushed aside for a few hours. The PM hasn't wilted and given in to those demanding the riot squads be used. For every effort by the PDRC to ratchet up the confrontation, the government has responded with restraint. It takes discipline not to fall into a trap of provoked violence. The result is that the Bangkok protests have withered. Many of the protestors have gone home.

It's not her looks as some misogynists claim. Rather, she is a likeable person who projects empathy. When you meet the lady, you get a genuine warm smile and when she asks about your parents, she means it. She has an ability to make people feel comfortable and can elicit affection. She has one on one people skills that if you could see, you would understand how she can still maintain loyalty in an inner circle more given to backstabbing than team work. These are qualities that her western critics of TVF will never see because they live in a different word.

She hasn't done a darn thing, you know it. What are you waffling on into oblivion for? She has done nothing, only pose for pics, screw up speeches, run away. By no standards has she done jack s*it and she is getting the heat for it- just look around.

[paddyjenkins]

The funding is the most interesting question...follow the money and the game being played will suddenly be clearer

[Davidhere]

I don't pay too much heed to the angry comments of those who are far below me in the Thai social hierarchy.

As such, be quiet and know your place.

Farang amart.

Amazing what one can encounter here.

[bigbamboo]

And with every show of government incompetence any potential bank loan rate rises......

[khunken]

As I wrote, I was following the rules that the Suthep contingent follow, and they do indeed have a pecking order. There is a distinctive hierarchy and anyone who has attended social functions, and I mean the real ones such as the receptions for diplomats, or hiso weddings, or national dinners will see it on full display. If you want to play the game in Thailand, you better understand that Thai rules apply, and not the egalitarianism one finds in many western countries. That's all I was saying. In Thailand, people of lower social status do not talk back to those of higher social status. It's a cultural taboo. There are a lot of social customs that it seems many westerners are oblivious to.

Sure, there is plenty to criticize about the PM, and I have often asked why she did not address the nation on TV and tell the people the facts as she saw them. That's what western leaders would do. However, this is Thailand, and it's just not done. By Thai standards of staying quiet, by avoiding confrontation, of undertaking "conciliatory" gestures, the PM has been responding to the situation Thai style. Sure, I'd have been happier if they had just water hosed the protestors like they do in Europe or kettled them as they do in North America, but that's not how it's done in Thailand. They wait, and wait, and wait, and then explode with an over the top response. By western standards, the PM hasn't acted. By Thai standards, she has. It takes some strength to remain calm in the face of tough circumstances, and she's stayed the course her government has laid out. Abhisit gave in to a very western response on the day of the crackdown against the reds, with the army basically stepping in while he dithered. He was pushed aside for a few hours. The PM hasn't wilted and given in to those demanding the riot squads be used. For every effort by the PDRC to ratchet up the confrontation, the government has responded with restraint. It takes discipline not to fall into a trap of provoked violence. The result is that the Bangkok protests have withered. Many of the protestors have gone home.

It's not her looks as some misogynists claim. Rather, she is a likeable person who projects empathy. When you meet the lady, you get a genuine warm smile and when she asks about your parents, she means it. She has an ability to make people feel comfortable and can elicit affection. She has one on one people skills that if you could see, you would understand how she can still maintain loyalty in an inner circle more given to backstabbing than team work. These are qualities that her western critics of TVF will never see because they live in a different word.

It takes discipline not to fall into a trap of provoked violence. Unlike the groups continually attacking the protestors. PTP know damn well that unleashing the undisciplined police or red shirts would have prompted the army to step in. They were probably told so.

These are qualities that her western critics of TVF will never see because they live in a different word. Yes, they don't have access to the almighty Yingluck as you seem to do. Are you a PTP insider? That would explain some of your bias towards them.

I've never met YL but it's obvious that her insincerity is clear given her clear mandate from her brother to act in his interests, not Thailand's.

[fleeing]

This whole play with exposing 'financiers' is nothing but a red herring.

The Constitutional Court has already confirmed that the protests are not unconstitutional, so any move by Chalerm/Tarit against financial supporters of the protests is in itself unconstitutional.

Interestingly the Constitutional Court ruled that the demonstrators may have broken criminal laws, but obviously criminal prosecutions would have to be brought against individuals and not the protesters en masse. Likewise if any prosecutions were to be brought against financial supporters of the PDRC, it would have to be proved both that the criminal acts were carried out or directly instigated by leaders of the PDRC, and that the financial supporters were aware of their support being directly used to break criminal laws. In short conspiracy.

That is possibly why there have been no prosecutions against financial backers of the 2010 protests, and also why this move by CMPO is nothing but propaganda and bullying that will bounce right back at them.

[DirtFarmer]

The list has not been published yet. The fascists are getting very worried and trying to muddy the water by making up sham lists.

You guys really love that f word, don't you?

Funny that fascism is now a slur for anyone standing against corruption.

Even though Thaksin has used the nazi tactic of taking a disenfranchised section of society and promising them a better life should they blindly support him.

And we know how well that went, don't we?

In Italy, the supporters of Mussolini eventually turned on him because of the ruin his policies brought to their country.

I look forward to the day that the Red shirts turn on Thaskin because of the lies he sold them as promises of a better life, while he enriches himself and his family illegally.

I think that's a general political tactic, not necessarily a 'nazi tactic'. lol. Instead of blaming Thaksin and his supporters, maybe the elite should look at what they've done to enable Thaksin to gain the support of the disenfranchised and think about what they might do to win their support. Intead they propose to disenfranchise and alienate them further. If it wasn't Thaksin, it would've been someone else who exploited them for political gain. Maybe someone better. Maybe someone worse (yes, there are actually people worse than TS). But I'm hoping this experience will teach people something. Who is the real enemy? Actually, both Thaksin and the elite behind Suthep. Neither group wants to see real social change. Just Thaksin was smart enough to throw people a bone before the other side were. The other side, remember, generally think the best way to treat the (relatively) poor is to either ignore or ridicule them. I've seen few signs they've moved on from this, although I note even Akanat admitted some of the anti-rural stuff on the PDRC stage had gone "too far" (now they want to win the farmers support, of course).

However, this Nazi stuff has gone way overboard. I agree that Suthep's 'Council' plan resembles Mussolini's Grand Fascist Council and you can draw some parallels, but in the end, your average PDRC supporter no more resembles a fascist than your average red shirt does. Of course there are nationalist and ultra-royalist trends within the movement that should be noted but these forces are more dilute and muted than they were in PAD. It should be kept an eye on, but fascism seems more like an epithet to shut down discussion in the way it's generally used in these discussions, rather than a serious attempt to describe a political phenomenon.

________

Well put...it seems the rhetoric here as well as the level of confrontation on the street continues to escalate... passion is everywhere and a great deal of frustration felt on both sides...all sides really... even those who don't take sides but rather want to deal with all this from a middle ground... with a reverence for the rule of law, checks and balances.. and a hope for the future... it is no secret that these big Corporate donors one way or another perhaps contributed to Suthep and his gang.. and when one does a bit of research it comes as no surprise as to who or why... but the bigger picture is to what end? CP Group has been named as well as others... it is no secret that Abhiset's father is an independent Director of the CP Brand... you can Google the names and see who is who and who is where ... but for the moment lets take a look at the whole picture... one group says something is illegal and another group says it is not. One Court says something' not right and another one Dismisses it as okay... I truly believe that these Thai versions of checks and balances need reform before any other reform is or can be contemplated. ...the entire judiciary... at every level is biased one way or the other... and that bias comes from what..? Power brokering... be it back room deals... money in the pocket..or whatever the case may be ... I truly don't believe that any level of corporate or governmental or state,,, public or private corps... is not affected by the endemic common denominator...something that has been ingrained from a very early age...something that is accepted and a way of life.. and until the time when personal integrity and the rule and enforcement of the law becomes the norm and systemic rooting out of corrupted individuals and entities, public and private comes to pass ...we are just spitting in the wind...Thaksin has his ghosts...Suthep has his ghosts Abhiset his and so on... not a single one of them deserves the respect of the majority of the Thai people These protests and machinations and legal and political footballs have done nothing to improve the quality of Thai life for the majority of the people..only cause more problems.. clinging to one side or another this late in the game is specious.. and obstreperous..... they need to decide if they want Democracy or not... and not hide behind a self serving particular version of Democracy ... not be afraid to say they don't want Democracy if that is the case but what is abundantly clear... is that without education ..anybody who has passion and a loud voice and a few bucks behind him can get on the back of a covered wagon and sell elixir as a cure all...

[Emptyset]

You have proof of this

Most of the money was given two years ago (not to Suthep but put into a general 'anti-Thaksin' pot)

I bet you don't. I think this is more made up crap coming from the red sheeple propaganda mill. If you have proof then kindly provide it and I* will say sorry 3 times. If you don't then please stop spreading baloney...

Nope. I don't have proof anymore than Shaun Crispin has proof for the rumours he bases his articles on. He has to decide what's credible, and some of it obviously is. But he can't prove it. I heard about this ages ago but wasn't sure if it was true at first, but now I am because it fits with everything else I've seen. The guy who told me is very pragmatic, not a red but not a PDRC supporter either. A lot of what he's told me previously has later been corroborated. I'd agree, a lot of what partisan people tell you (on both sides) is garbage and is either what they want to believe or what they want others to believe.

I also don't see how this particularly benefits the red shirts. I mean surely it's common knowledge that many of the elite dislike Thaksin and want him out? So that they'd provide funding for such a thing is hardly a huge leap. lol.

Anyway, obviously you don't have to believe me. I mentioned it because I think it's true - and also interesting. I don't particularly care if people think I'm right. However, what I said about the funding sources back in December seems pretty flat with what I've seen of the leaked list:

Yep. Not to mention the assortment of retired generals, admirals and assorted pooyai usually associated with the anti-Thaksin crowd. When you think about it, people talk about Thaksin's money, but the anti-govt movement has far more resources available to them, in theory at least. I mean, Thaksin is just one guy, whereas anti-govt protests are backed by CP, TCC, Bangkok Bank, Kbank families and Red Bull amongst others.

In fact, they're all on it except CP (in yesterday's BKK Post article anyway, but has been mentioned elsewhere) so far as I can see.

I also mentioned back in Nov 2012 that: ''I heard a few months ago from a friend that some anti-govt people - but not necessarily the same key figures that advised and gave behind the scenes support to PAD in 2008 - were planning a movement based on the Arab Spring.'' I first heard about it in July 2012 I think. I just didn't believe it would be succesful. When I saw Pitak Siam, it went as I expected it to. A washout. Took the amnesty to achieve this measure of success, even though a lot of people wanted the govt out really from before they even took office, and the funding was there, the amnesty was the real catalyst for popular support (plus the ongoing corruption and cronyism of the previous two years, of course).

Edited February 13, 2014 by Emptyset

[backtonormal]

The biggest financial supporters will not be published for shure...

..but most here will be able to guess who the unpublished ones are. Its obvious that red bull have been sponsoring anti Thaksin movements why did Thaksin go after his son so hard that he had to flee to Singapore. Leo beer sales have plummeted in Udon province because the little'love me do' appeared on a JCB. The rice exporters are the main losers in the rice pledging....why...they alledgedly sponsored the last coup. Its great that some of the 'infamous amart' are being outed and people who strongly believe in their cause should stop buying their products. As I have said before about the amart, some are faceless business men whose product sales will plummet if they were exposed. There is still a large 'extended' group who will not be named

[rubl]

The biggest financial supporters will not be published for shure...

..but most here will be able to guess who the unpublished ones are. Its obvious that red bull have been sponsoring anti Thaksin movements why did Thaksin go after his son so hard that he had to flee to Singapore. Leo beer sales have plummeted in Udon province because the little'love me do' appeared on a JCB. The rice exporters are the main losers in the rice pledging....why...they alledgedly sponsored the last coup. Its great that some of the 'infamous amart' are being outed and people who strongly believe in their cause should stop buying their products. As I have said before about the amart, some are faceless business men whose product sales will plummet if they were exposed. There is still a large 'extended' group who will not be named

Speculation is running amok in some it would seem.

Of course all this is under the government statement of criminalising a valid anti-government protest movement which got really started with said government tried to push through a blanket amnesty bill which not only suddenly covered Thaksin's last two years in/out of office, but even the first two years of Ms. Yingluck's government. As if they needed that

[hellodolly]

at this point wouldn't it be better to swap thaksin for chalerm and send his ass into exile instead? strip him of his citizenship too, he is a disgrace.

While chalerm is a dangerous loon, most of his lunacy comes to nothing. Thaksin on the other hand leaves a trail of misery and tears in his wake (amidst both his supporters and those who get in his way), he is by far the more destructive of the two.

Agreed that Thaksin is the more destructive of the two.

How ever Chalerm is destructive in his inability to do the job's that need doing. Look at the wonderful job he did handling the south. Now he has been given a job that is meaningless as the last thing the PTP want to do is make martyrs out of the protestors. Who is inept enough to try and fail miserably. Well hello Mr Chalerm we have been looking for a man with your qualifications.

Chalerm : " ...saying no one could stop him because the PM had given him the authority to make the decision. He also dismissed reports he would be sacked as CMPO director. "

Quote of the year : " No one could stop him ".

It sounds as if at least someone within the administration is getting wise to the fact that Chalerm is perhaps not such a brainy idea after all. He acts unilaterally, he shoots from the hip. He's immune from error because - well, he doesn't do errors, that's all. A deceased man on an enemies list ? Oh, he knew about that. Obviously, not being alive was not a compelling enough reason for Chalerm to excuse him from the list. You've got to do better than that. As Chalerm sees it, he's got a job to run sin out of Dodge. He's got better things to do than to get bogged down in details. But the details are really going to bite this administration, because there are clearly company executives on the list whose only " sin " was to have their products consumed by protesters. And if Chalerm thinks its a good idea to shame the very companies that are voluntarily investing in the fragile economy of this country, he had better think again. Whatever soul-searching occurs at the bottom of a whiskey bottle, now's the recommended time to do it.

Who else to create a scene backed by conspirators who have been planing this very situation for years. The man lives in a world of make believe perfect for the job. When he has enough ear medicine he gets these weird ideas. When he doesn't have enough ear medicine he creates models to convert into conspiracies after the proper amount of ear medicine.

Actually there are enough conspiracy thinkers around all to willing to believe in conspiracy that he feels encouraged to have a shot of ear medicine.

Edited February 13, 2014 by hellodolly

[geriatrickid]

Riiiiiight, whatever you say.

Having more money does not make anyone better than anyone else, Taksin and associated cronies are proof positive of that ! I say what I want to who I want and I don't care how much money you have, or who your daddy is, or who your best mate is. I am not 'oblivious' of anything but I don't care if it is the Thai way or not, it is not my way.

Plenty to criticize about the caretaker puppet, yes. Absolutely nothing good to say. The 'Thai way' is to try and avoid the problem and hope it goes away to try and save face. What a load of baloney ! Never solves any problems, just makes more as we see happening here. Useless, incompetent woman. The other reason she shows 'restraint' is because she knows she will be branded a 'murderer' by her opponents as her administration has tried to do to them. We all know the politically motivated move to strong arm Abisit and Suteb into agreeing to the amnesty will be thrown out of court, but we all know they may also bring the same case against Yinglack. The less people die the less chance she has of being found guilty. Not that she would anyway, but the accusation will stay with her always as it will stick with them, would be better if they both sue the 'Shin clan' for defamation of character after it is thrown out.

I never met Yinglack personally so I can't comment on that and glad I never have as I prefer not to meet horrid people like that. I don't find the caretaker puppet likeable or empathetic in the least, she is a pathetic example of nepotism of the worst kind. Useless, no clue how to act in that role, tries her best to avoid responsibility, a disgrace to politics worldwide. And to address your last point, who the hell wants to live in that world ? I sure as heck don't, I like my world just the way it is...

I never claimed that having more money made anyone better than anyone else, but that is partly how the Thai social hierarchy works. Job title and relationship by bloodline to one of the key families also counts. You say you don't care if it is the Thai way or not, it is not your way. Well, it's not my way either, but that does not change the manner in which things are done in Thailand. You are judging the events from your western perspective and are applying using Western customs and values to interpret the events. It's a flawed interpretation. The reality is that unless you are a multinational CEO, or diplomat or senior military officer, you are lower on the social hierarchy than the pimply faced teenager in an expensive car, who's father just so happens to be related to one of the lesser (description not allowed under Thai visa rules) . That's how the hierarchy works.

I suppose had a more robust response been used, you would be calling the PM a blood thirsty savage. If you have not met the PM or seen her interact with people, how can you and others make such petty judgements as to the PM's personality or behaviour? What you base your decision on is what you see from the anti government media which is decidedly negative. Anyone who meets the PM comes away with a very different impression than what BlueSky or Nation Media provides. The continued personal attacks on the PM are petty. She's a decent, compassionate and caring person, and not the evil villain that the character assassins of Nation Media and TVF are making her out to be.

You like your world just the way it is. That's good. You live in your bubble. Unfortunately, outside of the bubble there are these creatures called Thais, living in Thailand, who behave differently than you and who have a different approach to conflict. Sooner or later, your world and the bigger world of Thailand are going to collide. Sort of like what is happening now, when westerners realize that in Thailand, the Thais play by their rules, not by what is done in farangland.

[tingtongteesood]

Yeah yeah, whatever you say geriatric. I don't care what you think either. I don't live in a bubble, I know what's going on, I just choose to live life by my rules. Anyway this thread isn't about me or you arrogant geriatric man, let's get back on topic ay ?

[Basil B]

If they are not contributing to us,they must be contributing to the other side, the logic of a delinquent drunk.

[newcomer71]

The list has not been published yet. The fascists are getting very worried and trying to muddy the water by making up sham lists.

u

If you can't find any bad or crucial evidence against them, just repeat 'fascist' again and again.

The bad part is Tarit naming deceased individuals...discrediting the thugs you cheer for.

No shame in funding a demonstration against an oligarchy anyhow. Something to be proud of, isn't it?

Tarit did not make any name, you blame Dr Bruce to prove what he says, maybe you will be kind to do the same?

Tarit said that SOME NAME (without specify which) was on the published list... So how can you say there is a deceased individual in the list of the DSI?

[phutoie2]

Yeah yeah, whatever you say geriatric. I don't care what you think either. I don't live in a bubble, I know what's going on, I just choose to live life by my rules. Anyway this thread isn't about me or you arrogant geriatric man, let's get back on topic ay ?

Humm stuffed again Tingtong by folk who live here and know the gen . Please learn to spell YS and her elder brother's name correctly too. Marks you as a bit of a numb nuts.

Sent from my i-mobile IQ 2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[kikoman]

Hey if the lisit is in fact wrong these people can prove they made no contributions to PDRC, Thailand has very specific and strict libel and deframation laws. but they have to assure some one affiliated with their company did not make a comtribution in the companys name RE: wife, empolyees, partners, colition member etc., let the court decide!

Cheers

[hellodolly]

Riiiiiight, whatever you say.

Having more money does not make anyone better than anyone else, Taksin and associated cronies are proof positive of that ! I say what I want to who I want and I don't care how much money you have, or who your daddy is, or who your best mate is. I am not 'oblivious' of anything but I don't care if it is the Thai way or not, it is not my way.

Plenty to criticize about the caretaker puppet, yes. Absolutely nothing good to say. The 'Thai way' is to try and avoid the problem and hope it goes away to try and save face. What a load of baloney ! Never solves any problems, just makes more as we see happening here. Useless, incompetent woman. The other reason she shows 'restraint' is because she knows she will be branded a 'murderer' by her opponents as her administration has tried to do to them. We all know the politically motivated move to strong arm Abisit and Suteb into agreeing to the amnesty will be thrown out of court, but we all know they may also bring the same case against Yinglack. The less people die the less chance she has of being found guilty. Not that she would anyway, but the accusation will stay with her always as it will stick with them, would be better if they both sue the 'Shin clan' for defamation of character after it is thrown out.

I never met Yinglack personally so I can't comment on that and glad I never have as I prefer not to meet horrid people like that. I don't find the caretaker puppet likeable or empathetic in the least, she is a pathetic example of nepotism of the worst kind. Useless, no clue how to act in that role, tries her best to avoid responsibility, a disgrace to politics worldwide. And to address your last point, who the hell wants to live in that world ? I sure as heck don't, I like my world just the way it is...

I never claimed that having more money made anyone better than anyone else, but that is partly how the Thai social hierarchy works. Job title and relationship by bloodline to one of the key families also counts. You say you don't care if it is the Thai way or not, it is not your way. Well, it's not my way either, but that does not change the manner in which things are done in Thailand. You are judging the events from your western perspective and are applying using Western customs and values to interpret the events. It's a flawed interpretation. The reality is that unless you are a multinational CEO, or diplomat or senior military officer, you are lower on the social hierarchy than the pimply faced teenager in an expensive car, who's father just so happens to be related to one of the lesser (description not allowed under Thai visa rules) . That's how the hierarchy works.

I suppose had a more robust response been used, you would be calling the PM a blood thirsty savage. If you have not met the PM or seen her interact with people, how can you and others make such petty judgements as to the PM's personality or behaviour? What you base your decision on is what you see from the anti government media which is decidedly negative. Anyone who meets the PM comes away with a very different impression than what BlueSky or Nation Media provides. The continued personal attacks on the PM are petty. She's a decent, compassionate and caring person, and not the evil villain that the character assassins of Nation Media and TVF are making her out to be.

You like your world just the way it is. That's good. You live in your bubble. Unfortunately, outside of the bubble there are these creatures called Thais, living in Thailand, who behave differently than you and who have a different approach to conflict. Sooner or later, your world and the bigger world of Thailand are going to collide. Sort of like what is happening now, when westerners realize that in Thailand, the Thais play by their rules, not by what is done in farangland.

You say

The continued personal attacks on the PM are petty. She's a decent, compassionate and caring person, and not the evil villain that the character assassins of Nation Media and TVF are making her out to be.

Well she may or may not be all o9f those things in her personal life. If she was those things in her political life she would resign.

Other than that there is a lot of truth in what you say about the Thai social hierarchy.For the most part that does not concern me or my Thai family they are happy with the life they have. The problem generally arises when the rabble rouser's come along and point out the difference and tell the rabble that they should share in the money that the top of the hierarchy has. For the most part if left alone the Thai's were happy with their life. It is only the westerners coming in and bringing their materialism based society with them that has caused problems.

[Davidhere]

Hey if the lisit is in fact wrong these people can prove they made no contributions to PDRC

When someone is accused, there is no need WHATSOEVER to prove a negative.

It's entirely incumbent upon the clown show of Chalerm and Tarit to prove their accusations (neither of whom have a good track record for doing so).

[Bluespunk]

Hey if the lisit is in fact wrong these people can prove they made no contributions to PDRC, Thailand has very specific and strict libel and deframation laws. but they have to assure some one affiliated with their company did not make a comtribution in the companys name RE: wife, empolyees, partners, colition member etc., let the court decide!

Cheers

Or better still, make sure the list is accurate before you publish it. Edited February 13, 2014 by Bluespunk

[Davidhere]

You have proof of this

Most of the money was given two years ago (not to Suthep but put into a general 'anti-Thaksin' pot)

I bet you don't. I think this is more made up crap coming from the red sheeple propaganda mill. If you have proof then kindly provide it and I* will say sorry 3 times. If you don't then please stop spreading baloney...

Nope.

Thanks for getting to the crux of your answer early.

[Suriya4]

Even being dead isn't enough, to get one's name off the DSI's list, Oh My Budda !

Yay for Red Intimidation Investigation !

Never heard of reincarnation?

How long have you been in Thailand?