Thai rice not being dumped: trade chief

[webfact]

Thai rice not being dumped: trade chief
Petchanet Pratruangkrai
The Nation


Farmers on trucks and tractors return home after receiving a promise from embattled PM Yingluck Shinawatra that they would receive overdue payments next week for rice sold under the government scheme

Denies Indonesian claim of cheap sales or breaching world trade rules

BANGKOK: -- The Foreign Trade Department yesterday dismissed reports that Thailand dumped cheap rice on the world market - a move that could be a breach of World Trade Organisation rules.

The United States and some Asian nations have sounded warnings at the WTO because of Thailand's alleged lack of transparency on rice sales and stocks.

Thailand has a glut of 18 to 20 million tonnes in state stockpiles bought via the pledging scheme.

An Indonesian trade official pointed to "indications" that Thai suppliers were dumping rice in that country.

Foreign Trade chief Surasak Riangkrul denied yesterday that the government had sold rice cheaply in the global market.

Thailand had sold rice to Indonesia under a government-to-government deal, but the price was not below the market price, despite what had been alleged, he said. Moreover, the deal was not a recent one and the government had not sold rice to Indonesia in the past year, he added.

"Thailand has sold rice at the market price and has never offered Indonesia or other countries rice at very low prices," Surasak said. He added that the department would investigate the reports, and it may need to ask the Indonesian Embassy in writing about the case.

When asked about a move by the US, Cambodia and Vietnam against Thailand at the WTO, Surasak said officials would have to wait to see whether those countries filed a case. No country

had done that at the world trade body so far, he stressed.

However, the USA Rice Federation did write to the US Trade Representative in October 2012 to express fears that Thailand would eventually dump rice on the global market.

It expressed concern about the Thai rice-pledging scheme and the effect it may have on increased production and eventually on exports, if all the stored rice were to be released onto the market.

The federation urged the WTO to investigate Thailand's compliance with anti-dumping rules.

Surasak said Thailand stood ready to prepare information and documentation to explain its position to the WTO if a price-dumping case were to ensue.

Meanwhile, Bachrul Chairi, director-general of foreign trade at Indonesia's Trade Ministry, said there were signs that Thai suppliers were dumping rice in Indonesia as the Kingdom offloads its record stockpile on an already oversupplied global market, the Jakarta Globe reported.

"There is an indication that Thai rice suppliers dumped their rice exports in Indonesia," he told reporters, without providing details of volumes or companies.

"They sell their rice to Indonesia at lower prices," he said.

Asian rice exporters and producers will come under pressure with millions of tonnes of cheap Thai rice set to flow into the market when the controversial subsidy scheme ends later this month and farmers elsewhere offload their March harvest.

According to the Thai Rice Exporters Association, the price of Thai rice in the world market was still higher than that quoted by other rice-producing nations

The Phnom Penh Post reported that rice buyers were holding out as they anticipated a fire sale of cheap rice flooding the market. So Cambodia and other countries are taking the hit.


-- The Nation 2014-02-22

[Bluespunk]

uh oh………….other countries bringing in the WTO. That ain't good.

[Thai at Heart]

Why is there zero information about prices?

[waza]

No problems Yingluck will just state that the WTO isn't their father.

[notmyself]

uh oh.other countries bringing in the WTO. That ain't good.

Was always going to happen if details of supposed G2G deals were exposed. I don't think the WTO has the power to fine a country who does dump though? A similar thing happened in the early 90's with Japan dumping computer memory chips but it was a company which just happened to catch fire one day. After a prolonged destruction of EU memory chip manufacturers by Japan selling at a huge loss it resulted in ALL manufacturing plants going bust, there was a fire and the price went up from 8 quid per MB to 15 overnight. With luck, there was another Japanese plant there to take over the demand.

Not sure that can be done with rice.

[PaullyW]

Here we go. Another TV prediction coming to fruition. Predicting things in Thailand is not so difficult. If you can understand a child, you can predict what will happen here.

[Bluespunk]

Why is there zero information about prices?

Good question. That's the one the WTO may be asking.

[PaullyW]

US is involved as well as other SEA countries. Not good. Deal with China vanished. It's not looking good at all. And, as much as I dislike many things about Thailand (while loving many as well), I think Thailand had earned its spot as top world exporter over many years of hard work and decent policy. One of the very few things that the country seemed to be exceptional at. Ruined (for now) by truly idiotic policy.

Edited February 22, 2014 by PaullyW

[chainarong]

To disseminate this rice scam would take eons, you really can't trust the word of any Thai official from the PTP administration, it is riddled with spivs, that are all in denial , the steps Indonesia is taking with the WHO , could find Thailand in the wilderness with trading partners, they will find out very quickly that other countries wont tolerate their bullS!!t, not like the good people of Thailand.

[Tatsujin]

The only was we are going to know the extent of this scam is when those that started it and continue it are no longer in power and someone else can step in and really take a look "over the books". It's going to be FAR worse than anyone has predicted so far.

[dcutman]

Why is there zero information about prices?

Here is some numbers from previous auctions. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/704323-afet-bids-for-thai-govt-rice-come-in-low-amid-high-supply/?hl=+rice%20+auction

The sale yesterday of white rice and jasmine rice was the second in the futures market this year, after 58,900 tonnes auctioned last month.

Somchart Soithong, director-general of the ministry's Internal Trade Department, said the auction was expected to generate Bt1 billion. White rice was bid at Bt1.70-Bt3.49 per kilogram lower than the market price for delivery. Jasmine rice was Bt1.72-Bt4.73 a kilo lower than the market price.

Khao Hom Patum rice is currently quoted at Bt14 per kilo and jasmine rice at Bt27-Bt28, while white rice fetches Bt11-Bt12 per kilo. This means the government would receive only Bt8.50 per kilo if the market price is Bt12 on the delivery date.

Traders also know that the government sold rice at very low price in the previous sale of 850,000 tonnes at only Bt9.5-Bt11 a kilo, so the marker price for white and jasmine rice is seen as dropping gradually.

[looping]

Interesting to see how this is unravelling: Govt can't claim political motivation for once.

Now that they're breaking international laws which affect other countries, they may finally have to produce some figures for the whole scheme, and account for the rice, if not the money.

Maybe they can learn from this:

They shouldn't 'dump' where they please, the International Community may dump back, then they will know what it's like to be dumped on.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Edited February 22, 2014 by looping

[TVGerry]

Our tax dollars at work. Buy high, sell extremely low. Everything the Shinwatra government touches turns to crap.

[rogerdee123]

Our tax dollars at work. Buy high, sell extremely low. Everything the Shinwatra government touches turns to crap.

Your right .... except it's probably more correct to say .... "Buy High, don't sell, let rot" ... the rice stockpiles are turing to crap .. this is the Shinawatra touch

Edited February 22, 2014 by rogerdee123

[CWMcMurray]

Why is there zero information about prices?

Here is some numbers from previous auctions. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/704323-afet-bids-for-thai-govt-rice-come-in-low-amid-high-supply/?hl=+rice%20+auction

The sale yesterday of white rice and jasmine rice was the second in the futures market this year, after 58,900 tonnes auctioned last month.

Somchart Soithong, director-general of the ministry's Internal Trade Department, said the auction was expected to generate Bt1 billion. White rice was bid at Bt1.70-Bt3.49 per kilogram lower than the market price for delivery. Jasmine rice was Bt1.72-Bt4.73 a kilo lower than the market price.

Khao Hom Patum rice is currently quoted at Bt14 per kilo and jasmine rice at Bt27-Bt28, while white rice fetches Bt11-Bt12 per kilo. This means the government would receive only Bt8.50 per kilo if the market price is Bt12 on the delivery date.

Traders also know that the government sold rice at very low price in the previous sale of 850,000 tonnes at only Bt9.5-Bt11 a kilo, so the marker price for white and jasmine rice is seen as dropping gradually.

Interesting... Although it seems that even at this selling price, if gov sold 18 mil tons in stock pile they would be able to pay off the debt to farmers of 130 billion THB

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[AleG]

The only was we are going to know the extent of this scam is when those that started it and continue it are no longer in power and someone else can step in and really take a look "over the books". It's going to be FAR worse than anyone has predicted so far.

That is assuming nothing happens to the books as the crooks leave.

[Roadman]

The rice piles need an immediate audit for volumes and quality. And as part for the audit for the courts on how much rope puppets get to dance on. Grade it accordingly and sell on international market prices. Accept the losses of what's missing and lesser and lower grades of for example mill to rice flour etc. and again accept the loss. Some may need dumped and again accept the loss. Thai rice still is an international recognised quality and has a place in the market. Cash flow can come from sales. And as part of the political reforms make the books of such schemes open to public view. Pay the farmers immediately what they are owed and replace this current Thaksin stupidly with the older lesser but direct to the poorer farmers systems that other previous Thai governance had in place but only as short term substitute for education initiatives for changing the poorer rice farmers into skilled trades and production workers.

[khwaibah]

"Thai rice not being dumped: trade chief" Just being left to rot.

[expat888]

Translation of OP: Yes we dumping our rice to pay the farmers because our scheme to control rice (like we try to control everything) failed!! (as everything fails that they attempt to control)

[dcutman]

Why is there zero information about prices?

Here is some numbers from previous auctions. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/704323-afet-bids-for-thai-govt-rice-come-in-low-amid-high-supply/?hl=+rice%20+auction

The sale yesterday of white rice and jasmine rice was the second in the futures market this year, after 58,900 tonnes auctioned last month.

Somchart Soithong, director-general of the ministry's Internal Trade Department, said the auction was expected to generate Bt1 billion. White rice was bid at Bt1.70-Bt3.49 per kilogram lower than the market price for delivery. Jasmine rice was Bt1.72-Bt4.73 a kilo lower than the market price.

Khao Hom Patum rice is currently quoted at Bt14 per kilo and jasmine rice at Bt27-Bt28, while white rice fetches Bt11-Bt12 per kilo. This means the government would receive only Bt8.50 per kilo if the market price is Bt12 on the delivery date.

Traders also know that the government sold rice at very low price in the previous sale of 850,000 tonnes at only Bt9.5-Bt11 a kilo, so the marker price for white and jasmine rice is seen as dropping gradually.

Interesting... Although it seems that even at this selling price, if gov sold 18 mil tons in stock pile they would be able to pay off the debt to farmers of 130 billion THB

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes they could pay off the farmers if they sold all this stock. Of course it would take around 3 years to do it (at a normal exporting volume) and farmers would have to cut their production drastically for the same period of time.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Why is there zero information about prices?

Good question. That's the one the WTO may be asking.

...because its a secret, my little secret and I'm not telling anyone.

[hellodolly]

BANGKOK: -- The Foreign Trade Department yesterday dismissed reports that Thailand dumped cheap rice on the world market - a move that could be a breach of World Trade Organisation rules.

When has she ever admitted she is or has done some thing wrong.

I am not saying she is dishonest more than likely just can't understand.

[Ricardo]

"Thailand had sold rice to Indonesia under a government-to-government deal, but the price was not below the market price, despite what had been alleged, he said. Moreover, the deal was not a recent one and the government had not sold rice to Indonesia in the past year, he added."

And there went another former export-market.

Edited February 22, 2014 by Ricardo

[mic6ard]

Who to believe, minister from the gov't that repeatedly lied about numerous things. Or a foreign trade official.

[telecom]

The only was we are going to know the extent of this scam is when those that started it and continue it are no longer in power and someone else can step in and really take a look "over the books". It's going to be FAR worse than anyone has predicted so far.

I agree totally.

However, at the moment the NACC is on the ball and once Those charged have accepted the charges, the investigation can begin.

This will take a long time to compile the entire shabang of corruption down to the last baht, but I am sure they will be laser guided as certain civil service officials are forced to comply with the investigation. I am sure that a hell of a lot of these officials will stand up as whistle blowers almost immediately to save their own skins.

Why else do you think Yingluck and Co are lashing out at the NACC for speeding things up?

The NACC will start the investigation in full with a specialist hit squad dedicated to this scam, and I have a feeling that within a week or so, they will have found enough to apply for arrest warrants from the criminal court.

I am so pumped.

[Bocking]

Of course, the fact that the WTO may be looking closely at Thailand, and that Indonesia are pissed-off, will somehow be the fault of those pesky PDRC people. I wonder, as new payment promises to Farmers pass without action, will we find that farmer's leader 'Chada' has retired in order to spend more money time with his family and that the government has exchanged several tonnes of rice for magic beans?

[bigbamboo]

uh oh………….other countries bringing in the WTO. That ain't good.

I think we might have seen the last of Yingluck's goodwill 'trade' missions for a while.

[Ricardo]

Burma & Cambodia must be wetting themselves with laughter, first the Thai government paid over-the-odds for their own 'informal' rice-exports, and now the Thais are being accused by other countries of dumping the stuff onto world markets !

Now that's what I call 'eternal friendship', taking the rap, on behalf of the generals & Hun Sen !

Remind me, who thought this whole scam scheme up, again ?

[soalbundy]

Its not being dumped,its being burnt

[Scamper]

One of the saddest images is the one that accompanies this article - of that huge, proud caravan of famers' trucks leaving Bangkok, in the expectation they would be paid next week. It is hard to imagine a mere promise alone could have sparked such an exodus, as they had experienced so many broken promises in the past. There had to be something else - there had to be - you will be paid but you have to return to your homes. Anything else would be unfeasible. That having been said, the same caravan will be sure to be turning back in the opposite direction once the farmers are not paid next week - as the administration has no means of doing so.

" When asked about a move by the US, Cambodia and Vietnam against Thailand at the WTO, Surasak said officials would have to wait to see whether those countries filed a case. No country had done that at the world trade body so far, he stressed. "

And this is the other side of the scandal - action by other countries - and strong indications that rice is being dumped by slashed prices in Indonesia. All of this is going to catch up with this administration. The administration is being fought from without and within.

Edited February 22, 2014 by Scamper