Abhisit, Suthep sued over crackdown temple deaths

[webfact]

Abhisit, Suthep Sued Over Crackdown Temple Deaths
By Khaosod English

A member of the security force walk past dead bodies of 6 civilians killed in Wat Pathumwanararm Temple, 20 May 2010

BANGKOK: -- Families of two civilians who were shot dead by the military during 2010 unrest have filed murder lawsuits against the former government leaders.

Mr. Abhisit Vejjajiva and Mr. Suthep Thaugsuban, the Prime Minister and Deputy Prime Minister at the time, respectively, are named in the lawsuit, which aims to prosecute the two Democrats on charge of co-instructing other individuals to commit premeditated murders.

The lawsuit specifically focused on the deaths of the two of six civilians who were shot as they took shelter inside Wat Pathumwanararm Temple in downtown Bangkok on 19 May 2010 - the day the military, acting under Mr. Abhisit's order, launched a final assault against the Redshirts' protesters who have been encamped in Bangkok's financial district for months.

According to court inquest last year, the soldiers who were stationed on the BTS track opposite the temple fired their weapons into the sanctuary and subsequently killed the six civilians, despite the government's designating the temple as a "safe zone". Several volunteer medics are among the dead.

Today, families of two of the slain civilians, Mr. Suwan Sriraksa and Mr. Attachai Chumchan, have appointed a lawyer to sue Mr. Abhisit and Mr. Suthep on their behalf.

It is now up to the court whether to accept the lawsuit, said the lawyer, Mr. Chokechai Angkaew, during a press conference at the Ratchapisek Criminal Court in Bangkok.

Families of 4 other victims who had been slain in Wat Pathumwanararm Temple are also considering their own lawsuits, but they are not ready to file the cases at the time, Mr. Chokechai told reporters.

He added, "The victims' families have plenty of time to consider their lawsuit, because murder charges carry a limitation of 20 years".

Mr. Abhisit and Mr. Suthep are also facing separate murder charges filed by the public prosecutors for their roles in 2010 crackdown, which claimed the lives of more than 90 people, most of them civilians.

The former Prime Minister has acknowledged the charge and expressed his willingness to contest it in trials, while Mr. Suthep has repeatedly postponed the meeting with public prosecutors to acknowledge his charges, citing his need to lead anti-government protesters in their quest to oust Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra.

Source: http://en.khaosod.co.th/detail.php?newsid=1394787445&section=11&typecate=06


-- Khaosod English 2014-03-14

[Mango Bob]

It should also include the Chief of the Army. His man did the shooting.

Edited March 14, 2014 by metisdead
Oversize font reset to normal.

[GentlemanJim]

They obviously did not co-ordinate this one with Yinglucks "can everybody please stop filing law suits against each other - especially me" press conference and PR team. Thailand hub of comedy.

[JesseFrank]

It should also include the Chief of the Army. His man did the shooting.

It should also include Tarrit, since he was one of the decision makers of CRES at that time.

[greg71]

Will this lead to the muslims down south to charge the then defense minister and pm with murder ? Fair is fair .

[GentlemanJim]

Can these courts order the death penalty? If found guilty it would be the appropriate penalty.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

And on what planet would that be appropriate or even where they would be found guilty.

Government says "Temple is a safe sanctuary", Soldier decides to shoot two people, lawyer persuades victims families to charge PM and Dep PM with pre-meditated murder - That will work then...not! Regardless of outcome, the families pay large amount of money to said lawyer, case kicked out of court as garbage after much time wasting, and fees being paid to the courts (and more to the lawyer). Result Lawyer wins and he doesn't give a flying fruit cake that everyone else loses.

End of factual statements, carry on and make it up as you wish as per normal.

[Tatsujin]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

[NCFC]

Can these courts order the death penalty? If found guilty it would be the appropriate penalty.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

And on what planet would that be appropriate or even where they would be found guilty.

Government says "Temple is a safe sanctuary", Soldier decides to shoot two people, lawyer persuades victims families to charge PM and Dep PM with pre-meditated murder - That will work then...not! Regardless of outcome, the families pay large amount of money to said lawyer, case kicked out of court as garbage after much time wasting, and fees being paid to the courts (and more to the lawyer). Result Lawyer wins and he doesn't give a flying fruit cake that everyone else loses.

End of factual statements, carry on and make it up as you wish as per normal.

The OP says the case is being brought by the families so I am interested to know if we have any legal experts on TV who would know if this action runs in parallel with the other murder charges, replaces them or is a prompt for the govt to get a move with the existing charges.

During the US OJ Simpson case there was a public prosecutors case and a case brought by the victims families. Which they won a substantial payout.

Do the legal experts on TV know whether the families actions are civil or criminal?

My opinion is that the country needs a big wake up call that politicians can't get away literally with murder. Politicians need to be held accountable. The death penalty would send a big message to the corrupt as it does in China.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[billd766]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Wasn't that amnesty given by the PTP government?

[Tatsujin]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Wasn't that amnesty given by the PTP government?

"On May 1, the director-general of the Justice Ministry's Department of Special Investigation (DSI), Tarit Pengdith, announced that military personnel would not be held responsible for casualties during the government's crackdown on street protests in 2010, despite overwhelming evidence that soldiers shot civilians."

You can work out who was in power at the time and then ask yourself why they were given special treatment. You can also work out who was appointed by who and when it all happened.

[NCFC]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[GentlemanJim]

Can these courts order the death penalty? If found guilty it would be the appropriate penalty.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

And on what planet would that be appropriate or even where they would be found guilty.

Government says "Temple is a safe sanctuary", Soldier decides to shoot two people, lawyer persuades victims families to charge PM and Dep PM with pre-meditated murder - That will work then...not! Regardless of outcome, the families pay large amount of money to said lawyer, case kicked out of court as garbage after much time wasting, and fees being paid to the courts (and more to the lawyer). Result Lawyer wins and he doesn't give a flying fruit cake that everyone else loses.

End of factual statements, carry on and make it up as you wish as per normal.

The OP says the case is being brought by the families so I am interested to know if we have any legal experts on TV who would know if this action runs in parallel with the other murder charges, replaces them or is a prompt for the govt to get a move with the existing charges.

During the US OJ Simpson case there was a public prosecutors case and a case brought by the victims families. Which they won a substantial payout.

Do the legal experts on TV know whether the families actions are civil or criminal?

My opinion is that the country needs a big wake up call that politicians can't get away literally with murder. Politicians need to be held accountable. The death penalty would send a big message to the corrupt as it does in China.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Well it seems you need to decide what you are talking about because you seem to be getting very mixed up. You are saying Abhisit and Suthep may be getting away with 'Murder', yet you and all the sane people in this country know that is not the case. You then say the death penalty will send a message to the corrupt? Is murder corrupt, was the killing of the two civilians corrupt? What is the corrupt bit in the case you are referreing to? Why would the death penalty be appropriate? I can think of some pretty deserving cases for the death penalty if you just want to set an example and Thaksin is far closer to the top of the list than Abhisit ever will be.

[NCFC]

Can these courts order the death penalty? If found guilty it would be the appropriate penalty.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

And on what planet would that be appropriate or even where they would be found guilty.

Government says "Temple is a safe sanctuary", Soldier decides to shoot two people, lawyer persuades victims families to charge PM and Dep PM with pre-meditated murder - That will work then...not! Regardless of outcome, the families pay large amount of money to said lawyer, case kicked out of court as garbage after much time wasting, and fees being paid to the courts (and more to the lawyer). Result Lawyer wins and he doesn't give a flying fruit cake that everyone else loses.

End of factual statements, carry on and make it up as you wish as per normal.

The OP says the case is being brought by the families so I am interested to know if we have any legal experts on TV who would know if this action runs in parallel with the other murder charges, replaces them or is a prompt for the govt to get a move with the existing charges.

During the US OJ Simpson case there was a public prosecutors case and a case brought by the victims families. Which they won a substantial payout.

Do the legal experts on TV know whether the families actions are civil or criminal?

My opinion is that the country needs a big wake up call that politicians can't get away literally with murder. Politicians need to be held accountable. The death penalty would send a big message to the corrupt as it does in China.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Well it seems you need to decide what you are talking about because you seem to be getting very mixed up. You are saying Abhisit and Suthep may be getting away with 'Murder', yet you and all the sane people in this country know that is not the case. You then say the death penalty will send a message to the corrupt? Is murder corrupt, was the killing of the two civilians corrupt? What is the corrupt bit in the case you are referreing to? Why would the death penalty be appropriate? I can think of some pretty deserving cases for the death penalty if you just want to set an example and Thaksin is far closer to the top of the list than Abhisit ever will be.

No where have I said that Abhisit and Suthep may be getting away with 'Murder'

Politicians being responsible for the murder of civilians must be the biggest abuse of power possible, that sounds like corruption to me.

The death penalty is possible in Thailand in cases of murder.

Thaksin may be another candidate. Let the families of those killed in the drug wars bring a case

I don't make a distinction between any political individual of any side. I want to see the guilty punished as an example to others.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Tatsujin]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Great. I look forward to seeing Yingluck, Chalerm and Tarit sharing that jail cell in that case.

[LomSak27]

These were reds and not Yellows

as such they have not been delcared non violent by the courts, like the yellows, therefore shooting them is allowed

that is all

[kimamey]

Can these courts order the death penalty? If found guilty it would be the appropriate penalty.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes they can and Abhisit has said he will accept the courts decision.

Of course there are problems with this.

Firstly if they had actually ordered premeditated murders the trial would last as long as it takes to read the orders to commit premeditated murders. Murder is an illegal act so they would be guilty. The trouble is that anyone who actually reads the ROE will see that it doesn't say that. I wonder why a supposedly educated lawyer would present a case like this. I'm guessing that the charges are nothing like has been reported and the words have been carefully chosen to sound sensational rather than accurate.

Of course no mention of the army who fired the shots in contravention of their orders.

I wonder if the lawyer is on a good fee.

If a death senence were to be passed it unlikely to be carried out but if it were Thailand (about 96% Buddhist) could demonstrate it's unique brand of hypocrisy.

[tezzainoz]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

So you would make Thailand the laugh of every country in the world, setting a presedence like this. Yingluck would face the same fate

Every Government in the world that sent soldiers to war and shot some one not firing at them would be open for the same charges

Unless you have a signed order to kill people at the temple

This is a layers scam to part fools and their money

[ramrod711]

Can these courts order the death penalty? If found guilty it would be the appropriate penalty.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Will you feel the same way if Yingluck is found guilty of murder? Somehow I doubt it.

[Gunna]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

So you would make Thailand the laugh of every country in the world, setting a presedence like this. Yingluck would face the same fate

Every Government in the world that sent soldiers to war and shot some one not firing at them would be open for the same charges

Unless you have a signed order to kill people at the temple

This is a layers scam to part fools and their money

Possibly Taksin's money paying for the lawyers to put extra pressure on Abhisit & Suthep

[Thai at Heart]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes, and those orders come with 100 caveats, which probably were broken in this sitiation, but another court has already ruled that not to be the case. So no one ordered anyone to murder anyone. Case obviously closed. But TIT..........The army are the ones who should be on the hook

[MrSlatersParrot]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

So you would make Thailand the laugh of every country in the world, setting a presedence like this. Yingluck would face the same fate

Every Government in the world that sent soldiers to war and shot some one not firing at them would be open for the same charges

Unless you have a signed order to kill people at the temple

This is a layers scam to part fools and their money

Shooting to death a nurse treating an injured man 5 times inside a temple designated as a safe haven is murder.

Those soldiers should be indicted for murder and those who gave them their orders.

This wasn't a war yet.

[Tatsujin]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

So you would make Thailand the laugh of every country in the world, setting a presedence like this. Yingluck would face the same fate

Every Government in the world that sent soldiers to war and shot some one not firing at them would be open for the same charges

Unless you have a signed order to kill people at the temple

This is a layers scam to part fools and their money

Possibly Taksin's money paying for the lawyers to put extra pressure on Abhisit & Suthep

Now you're starting to see the bigger picture. Pawns to be moved around.

[kimamey]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Absolutely right but you need to read the rest of the instructions to know that it referred to protesters doing certain things. Killing people in safe zones who weren't engaged in specific acts such as threatening the lives of the soldiers and others weren't approved. Therefore the soldiers weren't operating under the instructions of Suthep, who signed the ROE or Abhisit who didn't as far as I know.

It may have escaped your notice in your haste to mention Nuremberg and crimes against humanity that unlike those cases Abhisit and Suthep appear not to have given those orders so the comparison doesn't work.

You're right there does seem to be proof but only that they didn't order the killings.

I believe this report is from a pro Thaksin paper from what I'm told so it's likely that this is just to plant the idea of premeditated murder using the fact that people everywhere tend to make assumptions based on skimming reports and tailoring the few facts they have to their view without actually looking any further. You seem to have done this.

[Tatsujin]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

So you would make Thailand the laugh of every country in the world, setting a presedence like this. Yingluck would face the same fate

Every Government in the world that sent soldiers to war and shot some one not firing at them would be open for the same charges

Unless you have a signed order to kill people at the temple

This is a layers scam to part fools and their money

Shooting to death a nurse treating an injured man 5 times inside a temple designated as a safe haven is murder.

Those soldiers should be indicted for murder and those who gave them their orders.

This wasn't a war yet.

If it was indeed the soldiers that did it, I would agree. I'm not convinced though that they were indeed the ones that shot and killed "all" of those that died during the protests.

[Basil B]

This is ludicrous and political motivated.

Such claims should be made against the state. The Prime Minster and minsters of government to a degree should be immune from prosecution unless there was a misuse of power or dereliction of duty.

Therefore every road traffic victim or their families could sue the minister responsible for transport? the rice farmers could sue the PTP and Yingluck for for their loss.

The list goes on...

Just plain stupid.

Edited March 14, 2014 by Basil B

[kimamey]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

So you would make Thailand the laugh of every country in the world, setting a presedence like this. Yingluck would face the same fate

Every Government in the world that sent soldiers to war and shot some one not firing at them would be open for the same charges

Unless you have a signed order to kill people at the temple

This is a layers scam to part fools and their money

Shooting to death a nurse treating an injured man 5 times inside a temple designated as a safe haven is murder.

Those soldiers should be indicted for murder and those who gave them their orders.

This wasn't a war yet.

And who do you think gave the orders. Also will there be any proof of the orders from the army commanders.

I agree but the last government didn't want to do that in case the army got upset.

[dickyknee]

If they are being sued, this would imply a civil case and they would be suing for compensation. I didnt think incarceration or death penalty is in the table in this case.

I don't know thai law, but in the west , civil cases rest in the balance if probability rather than like criminal cases which require beyond all reasonable doubt.

Please educate me.

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[NCFC]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

So you would make Thailand the laugh of every country in the world, setting a presedence like this. Yingluck would face the same fate

Every Government in the world that sent soldiers to war and shot some one not firing at them would be open for the same charges

Unless you have a signed order to kill people at the temple

This is a layers scam to part fools and their money

Shooting to death a nurse treating an injured man 5 times inside a temple designated as a safe haven is murder.

Those soldiers should be indicted for murder and those who gave them their orders.

This wasn't a war yet.

If it was indeed the soldiers that did it, I would agree. I'm not convinced though that they were indeed the ones that shot and killed "all" of those that died during the protests.

The case is being brought by relatives of those slain in the temple so naturally that is the subject of this topic.

Tezza suggests no army could go to war in such circumstances but even wars are subjected to ground rules. Break those rules and you can face international courts.

But we are not even talkin of a war situation against external enemies but of soldiers firing at their own countrymen and women taking refuge in a place of religious worship. How low can you go to shoot and kill a nurse when she is trying to save lives?

The responsibility lies with those who gave the orders whether it was to open fire or allow live ammunition to be used.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[kimamey]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Yes there is proof.

Suthep signed the papers that allowed the army to use live ammunition against protesters.

Since the Nuremberg trials established that those giving the orders, and not necessarily with their finger on the trigger, are guilty of crimes against humanity. Since Nuremberg the international courts have brought several cases against those who ordered crimes against humanity.

It is up to the courts to judge but my option is there is prima facia evidence that there is a direct link between giving an order to allow the use of live ammunition and civilians gunned down in the sanctuary of a temple.

The soldiers who opened fire need to be prosecuted as so the officers in charge, all the way up to Abhisit and Suthep with the greatest penalties reserved for those at the top.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

So you would make Thailand the laugh of every country in the world, setting a presedence like this. Yingluck would face the same fate

Every Government in the world that sent soldiers to war and shot some one not firing at them would be open for the same charges

Unless you have a signed order to kill people at the temple

This is a layers scam to part fools and their money

Shooting to death a nurse treating an injured man 5 times inside a temple designated as a safe haven is murder.

Those soldiers should be indicted for murder and those who gave them their orders.

This wasn't a war yet.

If it was indeed the soldiers that did it, I would agree. I'm not convinced though that they were indeed the ones that shot and killed "all" of those that died during the protests.

The case is being brought by relatives of those slain in the temple so naturally that is the subject of this topic.

Tezza suggests no army could go to war in such circumstances but even wars are subjected to ground rules. Break those rules and you can face international courts.

But we are not even talkin of a war situation against external enemies but of soldiers firing at their own countrymen and women taking refuge in a place of religious worship. How low can you go to shoot and kill a nurse when she is trying to save lives?

The responsibility lies with those who gave the orders whether it was to open fire or allow live ammunition to be used.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

You still seem to be avoiding the question of who gave the orders to shoot people in the temple who were posing no threat. The allowing of live ammunition isn't enough as there are rules that applied to this. Those seem to have been broken.

Live ammunition is allowed all the time in most countries including Thailand and it can be used against nationals of those countries including Thais in Thailand. If a Thai tried to kill Yingluck or the king do you think the gaurds would ask for their ID or passport first?

Thai police are armed even whilst doing their shopping in Tesco so unless those are water pistols the government have given them rules covering the discharge of those weapons. That doesn't mean if a policeman shoots an armed robber Yingluck is guilty of murder.

[rreddin]

The ONLY way this becomes more than a complete waste of time, is if someone, somewhere has a written order telling the soldiers to shoot people and can produce it in Court.

Other than that, if the Govt (as has been shown previously) ordered safe zones, no shooting etc then it's the soldiers that should be on trial.

Oh wait, can't do that, they already had a blanket amnesty for that.

Case closed.

Wasn't that amnesty given by the PTP government?

So far as I recall, it was included in the Amensty Bill that Suthep got scrapped. Now he is hoist on his own petard. Oh the irony of it!