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What has Thailand become?


khunpa

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You're projecting your own feelings of being inadequate. You've likely pointing fingers your entire life. Sooner or later fault finding. Wish you well. The world doesn't revolve around you.

Thanks Mr./Mrs. Psychologist... You just saved my life and made me see things so much clearer.

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There's greed and corruption all over the world, even in the so called biggest democratic countries. Only difference is Thailand seems to air they're dirty laundry in public!

True ooooh so very true.

Who would have the b...... to admit it?

My nose is in the air as I am on cloud 9

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Pattaya used to be what you say now it is crawling with poor white tourists that buy food and drink at 7/11. I think the Thais feel sorry for the poor drunk white folk who swim in such bad water and can only afford to eat and drink at convenience stores.

Pretty silly for such poor foreigners to think that convenience stores are a cheap way to eat. For myself, I find them completely unaffordable.

I just don't see a future for my kids if they had gone through the Thai system even if they had had international school.

Too much nepotism and corruption. Sad really

The true international schools (maybe a dozen?) have nothing at all to do with any "Thai system" other than a few window-dressing MoE requirements.

And there is no reason for your kids to have much contact at all with Thai society at the level you're complaining about unless you choose to structure your/their lives that way.

But since such a lifestyle is far more expensive here than it would be back home, I certainly agree that parents of young children should head back home to raise them there.

7/11 Ma ma noodles, hot dogs and cheap wine - no diarrhea.

Kids get em the best education possible. I have a Thai friend in Australia and her school employes a translator for her daughter who is the only Thai speaking child in the whole school!

Edited by thailiketoo
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Why I do not worry too much about what Thailand has or has not become:

Don't own property. Don't own a house. Not married. No children for whom I am legally responsible. Don't own a business. Not employed. Don't go to a shared work space and say I'm not working. Don't live in a tourist area. Don't much hang out with persons who speak or speak only English. Don't own a car. Don't frequent bars at 2 AM. ...

..and you call that a life?

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Sounds like a great life for someone well off, except for the lack of kids.

Not this is an attorney, so most likely has orgs fronting for his ownership of many income-producing properties.

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You have to bribe someone to get a teachers degree? cheesy.gif

You have to bribe someone to get drafted into the army? cheesy.gif

You have to bribe someone to get a job working for Ford with all the benefits? cheesy.gif

30 baht health care isn't great but it does cover all Thai people.

Go to Tesco talk to the lady baking the rolls and the lady chopping the pork and ask them what their degree is in?

It seems you know nothing about LOS......................rolleyes.gif You carry on.............coffee1.gif

Thailand has 197 colleges. . Of these, 76 are public (excluding universities for the religious training of monks). These 76 institutes can be categorized as 16 well established public universities, 2 open universities, 41 rajabhat universities, 9 universities of technology, 8 antonomous universities, 58 university extension campuses, 32 private universities, and 31 private colleges that offer bachelor programs.

A number of higher education institutes have recently increased opportunity for various types of students to study at the higher level. In 2007, the Education Council estimated that the number of new students enrolled in bachelors programs between 2007 and 2016 will be approximately 500,000 each year,

Problem is Thailand only needs 145,348 bachelor graduates each year.

Oooops.

http://blog.nationmultimedia.com/print.php?id=2435

Well, with the actual knowledge level provided for these so called "Bachelor Degrees" students, I guess its okay to send out 500.000 students every year.

Then around 350.000 can go work at 7-eleven (which fits their actual skill level) and the remaining 150,000, who are really needed and truly skilled can then do more complex work.

I had an employee once with a Bachelor Degree in Business. She look at me like I had fallen down from the moon, when I asked her to do a "Cost Budget" for me. Totally blank stare and open mouth, having no clue what I was taking about. Later had to fire her, because no matter what I asked her to do, she simply did not have the brain power required to do it. She told me that her grades from university, were better than her husbands. I never met her husband, but I always imagined him being this vegetable in a wheel chair.

I am still to this day wondering about how she and the husband ever passed their exams... How they even managed to sign up for school is also a mystery.

Yet you hired her !!!

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It is just you. Remember Black May? Thailand was just as screwy and corrupt 20 years ago - there was coup after coup and Thai citizens were attacked by the government. However, I loved the place then and I love it now, even if there are plenty of bad apples. There always has been.

Agreed, I have been coming to Thailand for 27 years and live here now more than 10 years.

Yes, countries/peoples attitudes changes somewhat,

but the major change is the technology, news infra-structure.

All is almost immediately out there.

People hear and see more (daily) things happening and see how the (civilized) western world lives (and upper class Thais).

People get more envy and want the same lifestyle.

Honest jobs will not give that for most, so some use other methods, which we hear daily in the news.

I also think that in the more farang area's in Thailand, many Thais are envy and angry.

Daily they see farangs spend money in bars and such 3000-5000-10.000 baht in one day/evening, which is their monthly salary.

Thailand is not the same of course from 20 years ago, but not as the OP says, all is more in the open.

20 years ago there was no ThaiVisa to report daily news/events or internet (worth while)

I think you have a point about the envy and hatred of foreigners, but.....

They don't seem to be upset at the Thais driving Ferraris, killing cops with them and getting off scot free etc.

Nor do they seem to be upset at so many rich families with 10 cars who pay a team of servants 5k a month to clean and cook 12 hours a day......etc....etc

and the kicker.....most (except the elite anti govt protesters) don't seem to care about a fascist tyrant bilking the country for all its worth.....

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My apologies if it offended you.

Your statement about special, foreignfunded, interestgroups who want to see Thailand fail is ridiculous. I can even think, because many people who critisize aspects of thai society are in your eyes ... thaibashers, that it was a different way of saying it. If you however are serious about your statement, please give us some proof or examples. Be interested to read it.

Again...my apologies.

Astroturfing is the practice of masking the sponsors of a message (e.g. political, advertising, religious or public relations) to make it appear as though it originates from grassroots participant(s). It is intended to give the statements more credibility by withholding information about the source's financial connection. The term astroturfing is a derivation of AstroTurf, a brand of synthetic carpeting designed to look like natural grass, a play on the word "grassroots".

Data mining expert Bing Liu (University of Illinois) estimated that one-third of all consumer reviews on the Internet are fake

According to an article in the Journal of Business Ethics, astroturfing threatens the legitimacy of genuine grassroots movements. The authors argued that astroturfing that is "purposefully designed to fulfill corporate agendas, manipulate public opinion and harm scientific research represents a serious lapse in ethical conduct.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing

Laos ?

Burma, Malaysia, Singapore I would think would benefit more from Thai negative publicity in the tourism and industrial sector and any Thai anti government groups.

Consider the topic of the thread. Who benefits from saying "Personal greed and corruption has reached a level were people do no longer even bother to vote and even religion has lost the respect and power it once had here."

The key is probably in the last phrase, "even religion has lost the respect and power it once had here."

same as in the wesetern countries,ins'it?
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Why I do not worry too much about what Thailand has or has not become:

Don't own property. Don't own a house. Not married. No children for whom I am legally responsible. Don't own a business. Not employed. Don't go to a shared work space and say I'm not working. Don't live in a tourist area. Don't much hang out with persons who speak or speak only English. Don't own a car. Don't frequent bars at 2 AM. ...

So what is it that makes Thailand so attractive to you?

laobali,

JLCrab's post pretty much describes me as well and is has not had any noticeable impact on my enjoyment of or attraction to Thailand. The people are still nice, the food is still good, the scenery is still beautiful, and the culture is still interesting. The description applies to me in all the countries I travel to and it has not impacted my enjoyment of any of them.

David

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I was just curious what he (and for that matter, you) do to occupy your time in Thailand rather than somewhere else.

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Astroturfing is the practice of masking the sponsors of a message (e.g. political, advertising, religious or public relations) to make it appear as though it originates from grassroots participant(s). It is intended to give the statements more credibility by withholding information about the source's financial connection. The term astroturfing is a derivation of AstroTurf, a brand of synthetic carpeting designed to look like natural grass, a play on the word "grassroots".

Data mining expert Bing Liu (University of Illinois) estimated that one-third of all consumer reviews on the Internet are fake

According to an article in the Journal of Business Ethics, astroturfing threatens the legitimacy of genuine grassroots movements. The authors argued that astroturfing that is "purposefully designed to fulfill corporate agendas, manipulate public opinion and harm scientific research represents a serious lapse in ethical conduct.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing

Laos ?

Burma, Malaysia, Singapore I would think would benefit more from Thai negative publicity in the tourism and industrial sector and any Thai anti government groups.

Consider the topic of the thread. Who benefits from saying "Personal greed and corruption has reached a level were people do no longer even bother to vote and even religion has lost the respect and power it once had here."

The key is probably in the last phrase, "even religion has lost the respect and power it once had here."

same as in the wesetern countries,ins'it?

Criminality is getting worse. Service is going down. Prices up.....

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Well, with the actual knowledge level provided for these so called "Bachelor Degrees" students, I guess its okay to send out 500.000 students every year.

Then around 350.000 can go work at 7-eleven (which fits their actual skill level) and the remaining 150,000, who are really needed and truly skilled can then do more complex work.

I had an employee once with a Bachelor Degree in Business. She look at me like I had fallen down from the moon, when I asked her to do a "Cost Budget" for me. Totally blank stare and open mouth, having no clue what I was taking about. Later had to fire her, because no matter what I asked her to do, she simply did not have the brain power required to do it. She told me that her grades from university, were better than her husbands. I never met her husband, but I always imagined him being this vegetable in a wheel chair.

I am still to this day wondering about how she and the husband ever passed their exams... How they even managed to sign up for school is also a mystery.

Yet you hired her !!!

Actually my Daily Manager hired and recommended her (they were friends), but I of course approved of it... So "Yes" I was responsible.

I imagined that with a Degree in Business, at least she would be able to do some kind of stuff actually related to running a business. She was actually a sweet and honest girl, but unfortunately had unbelievable bad skills (none) for a person with a Bachelor Degree.

I also once when making a company in Vietnam, managed to say yes to hiring a girl with a Masters Degree in English. She wrote English okay, but I understood absolutely nothing when she spoke. I actually did not know she had a Masters Degree before after one year of her working in the company. I would never had guessed and was very surprised when I found out. But good for her.

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Why I do not worry too much about what Thailand has or has not become:

Don't own property. Don't own a house. Not married. No children for whom I am legally responsible. Don't own a business. Not employed. Don't go to a shared work space and say I'm not working. Don't live in a tourist area. Don't much hang out with persons who speak or speak only English. Don't own a car. Don't frequent bars at 2 AM. ...

So what is it that makes Thailand so attractive to you?

laobali,

JLCrab's post pretty much describes me as well and is has not had any noticeable impact on my enjoyment of or attraction to Thailand. The people are still nice, the food is still good, the scenery is still beautiful, and the culture is still interesting. The description applies to me in all the countries I travel to and it has not impacted my enjoyment of any of them.

David

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I was just curious what he (and for that matter, you) do to occupy your time in Thailand rather than somewhere else.

Can't speak for him but I have plenty to keep me busy. I take classes (Thai language and culture classes), travel the country taking pictures, ride my scooter out away from the city to get back to more rural parts of the county. I love riding the trains here even if they are a bit old and slow ... so am I. LOL I get out and meet Thais, especially the ones in my neighborhood. They are great folks. And since I am single with no kids, I have more time to do that. None of the things that JLCrab and I have in common keep us from doing what we would do if we had all those things. We just get to do more of them. And none of the stuff I do in Thailand takes into consideration all the travel I do outside Thailand.

David

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<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Why I do not worry too much about what Thailand has or has not become:

Don't own property. Don't own a house. Not married. No children for whom I am legally responsible. Don't own a business. Not employed. Don't go to a shared work space and say I'm not working. Don't live in a tourist area. Don't much hang out with persons who speak or speak only English. Don't own a car. Don't frequent bars at 2 AM. ...

Or to quote from a Country Western song , sorry I can't remember which. "Freedom's just another word for nothing left to loose" it really seems as though you fall into that category.

Kris Kristofferson 'Me and Bobby McGee -- but, from Irving Berlin:

Got no mansion, got no yacht
Still I'm happy with what I've got
I got the sun in the morning and the moon at night

And a twenty year old woman, for afternoon delight.

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Why I do not worry too much about what Thailand has or has not become:

Don't own property. Don't own a house. Not married. No children for whom I am legally responsible. Don't own a business. Not employed. Don't go to a shared work space and say I'm not working. Don't live in a tourist area. Don't much hang out with persons who speak or speak only English. Don't own a car. Don't frequent bars at 2 AM. ...

booo we have a ghost here in thaivisa! w00t.gif

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Just keep the public stuffs (gov, police, imigration, .. use then only when you need, do not allow the "useless" to became part of you) out of your personal life and you will not get confused by corruption and suffering. You can trust have lots of people doing this right now!

The base of this world is corruption and suffering. Just learn how to avoid it at the best you can and you will feel much better, than you can live your life even in a war zone.

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Just keep the public stuffs (gov, police, imigration, .. use then only when you need, do not allow the "useless" to became part of you) out of your personal life and you will not get confused by corruption and suffering. You can trust have lots of people doing this right now!

The base of this world is corruption and suffering. Just learn how to avoid it at the best you can and you will feel much better, than you can live your life even in a war zone.

I have tried, unconsciously, to not get the useless, as you state, to become part of me. When i "needed" them.....they all were useless. So its all about knowledge and when 1 gets it into his/her own frame of mind....a conscious life will follow suit. Or ...just getting older and wiser ?

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I hope I don't need to tell you that 95% of the tourist traffic comes here for one reason. The other problems are secondary and not many foreigners give a hoot about solving them.

Cheap tat at MBK and Chatuchak, right ? ;)

Massive overestimation of the number of mongers looking for nightlife - how many tourists in CM or Hua Hin look like punters to you ? How many of the Chinese tour groups and Russian families staggering up and down Walking St would you say are looking for group discounts at a Go-Go ?

I've never shied away from my weekend warrior status in Thailand, or my late night activities, but only a seriously deluded monger could see Thailand's massive tourism industry in that light.

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Thailand is no doubt better in many ways than it used to be, and in some ways worse. I think this is part of the development process of a country. It is still regarded, technically I believe, as a Third World country, but I would dispute this. It is a 'Second World' country. I don't think it ever had Third World status actually, in the way that some African and other nations do, but it has yet to pass fully into the economic and governmental realms of those that we generally class as 'First World',. Sadly, as it does, it will become a victim of some of the bad things that most of Europe and the U.S.A suffer from.... a different kind of corruptness, less consideration for each other, material greed. Most of the so-called developed countries have suffered from a decline in morality, religion has lost sway and the rich get richer while the poor get poorer. I am heartened though, by the work ethic I have seen among many Thais. Most work hard because they have to, but I have found them, generally, to be a cheerful and friendly race. I have met wealthy and poor and been treated well by all. Of course, I have met spiv taxi drivers in Bangkok, just as I have in London. I have met pushy traders - I ignore them. As a race, the Thais are as good as any on earth and better than many. It will be a few years yet before corruption is reduced and before democracy, as it should be, is fully understood and properly wielded. Until then, as a farang, I will continue to try to treat them as I would my own countrymen; with patience, kindness, fairness and, as far as I can, understanding. I ask everyone to do the same, then Thailand can be a great country for both the Thais and farang..

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I miss the good old days on TV, when all we argued about was who had actually barfined a Katoey and who just liked to watch.

yep I loved those good old days early 80's when you could have a great time up north patts[sabi land] as it was known or down south soi diamond,carosel bar,suzy wong bar and mix with the katoey's in the red cat.never being pestered or having to watch over your shoulder them days were great,walking home alone in the early hrs[6am] along the beach rd.yes I did that but not many times alone.sitting outside jimmy macs[r.i.p.] waitng for him to open for breakfast.

but in the 10yrs to 1990 the only money I saw ploughed back into any project in patts.was when they done the beach rd.walking pavement.i have been back once 2010 never again.

MEMORIES NEVER TO BE FORGOT

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Thailand is no doubt better in many ways than it used to be, and in some ways worse. I think this is part of the development process of a country. It is still regarded, technically I believe, as a Third World country, but I would dispute this. It is a 'Second World' country. I don't think it ever had Third World status actually, in the way that some African and other nations do, but it has yet to pass fully into the economic and governmental realms of those that we generally class as 'First World',. Sadly, as it does, it will become a victim of some of the bad things that most of Europe and the U.S.A suffer from.... a different kind of corruptness, less consideration for each other, material greed. Most of the so-called developed countries have suffered from a decline in morality, religion has lost sway and the rich get richer while the poor get poorer. I am heartened though, by the work ethic I have seen among many Thais. Most work hard because they have to, but I have found them, generally, to be a cheerful and friendly race. I have met wealthy and poor and been treated well by all. Of course, I have met spiv taxi drivers in Bangkok, just as I have in London. I have met pushy traders - I ignore them. As a race, the Thais are as good as any on earth and better than many. It will be a few years yet before corruption is reduced and before democracy, as it should be, is fully understood and properly wielded. Until then, as a farang, I will continue to try to treat them as I would my own countrymen; with patience, kindness, fairness and, as far as I can, understanding. I ask everyone to do the same, then Thailand can be a great country for both the Thais and farang..

never mind what Thailand has become its more of what is going to happen to this country.in over 30yrs apart from some I say[ some ] decent roads that have been made I cant think of anything positive that goverments have done.i love where I live,my wife and my dog,but having hopefully another 20yrs.left on this planet I don't foresee any changes for the better.

n.f.says Thailand can be a great country for thais and farangs,as the saying goes,"NOT ON YOUR NELLY"

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I hope I don't need to tell you that 95% of the tourist traffic comes here for one reason. The other problems are secondary and not many foreigners give a hoot about solving them.

Cheap tat at MBK and Chatuchak, right ? wink.png

Massive overestimation of the number of mongers looking for nightlife - how many tourists in CM or Hua Hin look like punters to you ? How many of the Chinese tour groups and Russian families staggering up and down Walking St would you say are looking for group discounts at a Go-Go ?

I've never shied away from my weekend warrior status in Thailand, or my late night activities, but only a seriously deluded monger could see Thailand's massive tourism industry in that light.

I think Donnie is probably thinking in terms of the people he knows. smile.png

As far as Thailand changing is concerned I would sum it up by saying that a country that was once a reflection of it's kings is now a reflection of the Shins. sad.png

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See what has happened in Thailand is that once a pure and loving country has been over run by foreigners, who constantly degrade and be little Thailand's people of original origin.

Thus leading to emotional turmoil in the LOS. The young men now realize that they are no match for a foreigner check book thus creating hostile angry new generations of people. This later spills into the politics, all the way to the soup stands.

I'm so sorry for my mothers home land. sad.png

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

I suggest you take the time to study Thai history and not the sanitized revisionist version taught in Thailand.

Thailand was not a pure and loving country. No country has been or is, although some are as good as it can get. A quick look at Thailand will show that there has been slavery, and indentured servitude, extreme poverty and starvation and the scourge of disease. Thailand today is a far better place than it was 100 years ago, and 50 years ago.

The foreigners who you claim have "over run" Thailand are the people that helped stop the disease and gave solutions to address the waves of famine that characterized the Thailand of the past. Today, it is the foreigners you condemn who are working towards effective treatments for the illnesses that are causing havoc on the Thai workforce, diseases such as HIV, malaria, tuberculosis and cancer. It is their fat cheque books that finance a significant amount of humanitarian aid while wealthy Thais give relatively little to the country's social service organizations and universities. In any western country, universities and hospitals are built with the generous contributions of the general public and the wealthy. And in Thailand with its multi millionaires and billionaires, what have they done? One cannot blame such selfishness on foreigners.

Remember, according to Thailand it was never colonized. The collaboration with the Japanese, which laid the foundation for much of today's current political crisis and economic inequity has left a legacy that keeps on giving in so many unpleasant ways. Thailand never confronted its past and thus it is condemned to keep repeating its political mistakes until it does so. Look closely at the history of the Japanese presence in Thailand and the period that followed.

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See what has happened in Thailand is that once a pure and loving country has been over run by foreigners, who constantly degrade and be little Thailand's people of original origin.

Thus leading to emotional turmoil in the LOS. The young men now realize that they are no match for a foreigner check book thus creating hostile angry new generations of people. This later spills into the politics, all the way to the soup stands.

I'm so sorry for my mothers home land. sad.png

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

I suggest you take the time to study Thai history and not the sanitized revisionist version taught in Thailand.

Thailand was not a pure and loving country. No country has been or is, although some are as good as it can get. A quick look at Thailand will show that there has been slavery, and indentured servitude, extreme poverty and starvation and the scourge of disease. Thailand today is a far better place than it was 100 years ago, and 50 years ago.

The foreigners who you claim have "over run" Thailand are the people that helped stop the disease and gave solutions to address the waves of famine that characterized the Thailand of the past. Today, it is the foreigners you condemn who are working towards effective treatments for the illnesses that are causing havoc on the Thai workforce, diseases such as HIV, malaria, tuberculosis and cancer. It is their fat cheque books that finance a significant amount of humanitarian aid while wealthy Thais give relatively little to the country's social service organizations and universities. In any western country, universities and hospitals are built with the generous contributions of the general public and the wealthy. And in Thailand with its multi millionaires and billionaires, what have they done? One cannot blame such selfishness on foreigners.

Remember, according to Thailand it was never colonized. The collaboration with the Japanese, which laid the foundation for much of today's current political crisis and economic inequity has left a legacy that keeps on giving in so many unpleasant ways. Thailand never confronted its past and thus it is condemned to keep repeating its political mistakes until it does so. Look closely at the history of the Japanese presence in Thailand and the period that followed.

Good comment....i think he will ask his mothers opinion now about your statements.

Most likely she will reply....arai waa...farang maj roe ru ang......

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'thailiketoo' ... we've had a bit of a run in before; you've challenged someone else (re formalin on food) and retracted ...

So just how is a comparative done?

Do you have *empirical data that supports any of the nonsense you espouse?

*[ research methodologies containing qualitative and quantitative data? ]

In one forum you defend Thailand and here you condemn me for making a comparative to other countries and someone else provided a link to the UK ... is is just that you are a Yank and can't stand seeing anyone point out one of the multitude of many wrongs with the US of A?

Daniel Boon wrote, "well I can't comment about Thailand, but the rot in the USA and Australia has well and truly set in."

That is a comparative or comment about Australia and/or America not Thailand. This is a Thai forum if you want to compare two things one of them should be about Thailand.

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