Building a Low Cost But Capable Desktop - opinions sought!

[JimShortz]

I am building this for a friend who's Windows XP machine has finally expired. He wants it low cost, but it should ideally have a good long lifetime too. His demands aren't high (no gaming), and the price for "the box" must be under 10k Baht.

Advice seem to be the suppliers of the cheapest components here in Chiang Mai, so I will be buying from them. All prices listed here are from their website. Search for Advice Computers Thailand to see their website.

My plan so far is:

G3220 Intel Haswell two core CPU - 1920

MSI 481M - E33 Motherboard - 1890

Kingston DDR3 ram, 4Gb - 1260

1TB WD blue HDD - 1980

Colors View C-2069 case and PSU - 820

DVD RW Samsung - 510

Total is therefore 8,380 Baht for what I think should be a fairly well balanced system that will work great for him to use for internet and downloading.

My main query is about the motherboard. Does anyone have a comment on the MSI board, or alternatives such as the Asrock H81M-HDS (2,160) or the Gigabyte GA-B85M-HD3 (2,340). The motherboard must have a HDMI out for streaming video to the TV, since I don't plan to buy a video card. It also must have more than 2 SATA connectors, as I want room to add more hard drives later.

Thank you in advance to anyone who offers opinions.

[alfalfa19]

I would be interested in maximum ram the mobo will take. 8 gig is not much, if you wish to expand later. However, I did just build a workstation with dual core amd, and 8 gb ram, it's fine for normal purposes, I just use it for surfing, and a bit of photoshop.

[JimShortz]

I believe that all of the motherboards I mentioned max at 16gb ram. For now I will only be putting 4 in anyway. The person I am building it for will never use photoshop or other power hungry applications anyway. He only multitasks by accident! :-)

Another board I am considering is the Asrock B85M-HDS for 2,160. This also seems to fit the bill quite well.

[NeverSure]

I believe that all of the motherboards I mentioned max at 16gb ram. For now I will only be putting 4 in anyway. The person I am building it for will never use photoshop or other power hungry applications anyway. He only multitasks by accident! :-)

Another board I am considering is the Asrock B85M-HDS for 2,160. This also seems to fit the bill quite well.

Don't skimp on the motherboard. That's where the future lies, and could trigger a replacement.

I can't find that MSI board, but the Asrock has just two ram slots, dual channel. That means that you need two matching sticks of ram, and if you ever want to upgrade, you can't just add. You have to replace. I can only see one PCI slot although the specs say it has two. I don't think I'm blind, lol. LINK

It has only 4 sata connectors. My mobo has 6 and I wish I had more. Have to add a card.

All of the ram for the video and audio is going to have to come from the mobo since there aren't slots to add cards with memory. It really wouldn't cost much more to put 8 gig of ram in it, and have plenty while avoiding tossing out the 4 gig later. It will run fine on 4 for what you describe, but over time he will add programs, and current program updates will use more ram. (you need a 64 bit operating system to see more than 4 gig, you know.)

I simply don't like that mobo. Isn't very expandable or upgradeable.

[GuyL]

I believe that all of the motherboards I mentioned max at 16gb ram. For now I will only be putting 4 in anyway. The person I am building it for will never use photoshop or other power hungry applications anyway. He only multitasks by accident! :-)

Another board I am considering is the Asrock B85M-HDS for 2,160. This also seems to fit the bill quite well.

Don't skimp on the motherboard. That's where the future lies, and could trigger a replacement.

I can't find that MSI board, but the Asrock has just two ram slots, dual channel. That means that you need two matching sticks of ram, and if you ever want to upgrade, you can't just add. You have to replace. I can only see one PCI slot although the specs say it has two. I don't think I'm blind, lol. LINK

It has only 4 sata connectors. My mobo has 6 and I wish I had more. Have to add a card.

All of the ram for the video and audio is going to have to come from the mobo since there aren't slots to add cards with memory. It really wouldn't cost much more to put 8 gig of ram in it, and have plenty while avoiding tossing out the 4 gig later. It will run fine on 4 for what you describe, but over time he will add programs, and current program updates will use more ram. (you need a 64 bit operating system to see more than 4 gig, you know.)

I simply don't like that mobo. Isn't very expandable or upgradeable.

I suppose that the other motherboard (MSI) is actually this one: http://thesystem.co.th/products/previews.php?code=A0065322

I would rather choose (between those) the ASROCK motherboard then: http://thesystem.co.th/products/previews.php?code=A0064713

Agreed, both are not very expandable, but should be sufficient IMHO for the usage described by the OP and would last a few years (very likely more than their 3-year warranty) before a serious upgrade (besides RAM) is really needed, and then, one will be able to get a new configuration at a cheap price for not much more than the addition of eventual upgrading components and performing better.

[GuyL]

OP, your Western Digital hard disk drive is probably (at the above mentionned price) not a blue but a green one: http://thesystem.co.th/products/previews.php?code=A0061996

I have had bad experiences with WD green HDDs in the past (black are OK though) and would rather recommend, for about the same price, this Seagate 1TB HDD: http://thesystem.co.th/products/previews.php?code=A0058234

I don't like much Seagate HDDs either, but according to my (and my friends') experience, they are a bit more reliable. When available, I would rather buy an Hitachi HDD, but haven't found one in your price range for a 1 TB capacity within Advice Distribution's website.

[JimShortz]

Don't skimp on the motherboard. That's where the future lies, and could trigger a replacement.

I can't find that MSI board, but the Asrock has just two ram slots, dual channel. That means that you need two matching sticks of ram, and if you ever want to upgrade, you can't just add. You have to replace. I can only see one PCI slot although the specs say it has two. I don't think I'm blind, lol. LINK

It has only 4 sata connectors. My mobo has 6 and I wish I had more. Have to add a card.

All of the ram for the video and audio is going to have to come from the mobo since there aren't slots to add cards with memory. It really wouldn't cost much more to put 8 gig of ram in it, and have plenty while avoiding tossing out the 4 gig later. It will run fine on 4 for what you describe, but over time he will add programs, and current program updates will use more ram. (you need a 64 bit operating system to see more than 4 gig, you know.)

I simply don't like that mobo. Isn't very expandable or upgradeable.

Hi NeverSure, thanks for your time replying. I agree with you in not loving the board, but to be honest I don't love many in this price range! If this was for me I would want the 6 SATA slots too, but for where this is going 4 seems like plenty (2 free for expansion later) to me - that would have us up to e HDDs and a DVD.... One PCIe for possible video expansion + one regular PCI also probably more than meets his needs to be honest!

What I may take on board though is banging 8 Gb ram in now. To keep the cost within his budget I may swap the G3220 chip out for a 500 Baht cheaper Haswell Celeron G1820 for 1,400 Baht. Normally I wouldn't consider Celeron, but from what I read this is not a bad chip at all and fits in the socket 1150 board, so leaving room for a future chip upgrade to an i5 or better. Pretty future proofed, as much as a PC ever can be...

[JimShortz]

OP, your Western Digital hard disk drive is probably (at the above mentionned price) not a blue but a green one: http://thesystem.co.th/products/previews.php?code=A0061996

I have had bad experiences with WD green HDDs in the past (black are OK though) and would rather recommend, for about the same price, this Seagate 1TB HDD: http://thesystem.co.th/products/previews.php?code=A0058234

I don't like much Seagate HDDs either, but according to my (and my friends') experience, they are a bit more reliable. When available, I would rather buy an Hitachi HDD, but haven't found one in your price range for a 1 TB capacity within Advice Distribution's website.

Hi GuyL, thanks also for your time. The HDD I mentioned is indeed Blue, see http://www.advice.co.th/products/preview.php?code=A0061974 but actually I think you are right with the Seagate, for a whole 40 Baht extra, I will go for that.

That leaves the motherboard. I agree in preferring the Asrock over the MSI. It's either that or the Gigabyte that I mentioned in the first post, the GA-B85M-HD3, see here: http://www.advice.co.th/products/preview.php?code=A0059138

They are both based on the same chipset and are almost the same price. I have bought both Asrock and Gigabyte before and have been happy with both. For the money I am probably erring towards the Gigabyte board. It's more expandable (although beyond our needs really) and I kind of trust Gigabyte quality more. What do you think?

[JimShortz]

Great input fellas, thank you. This is really helping me out. Hopefully will be of use to other Cheap Charlie builders too.

I have been out checking in the stores and for under 10K what you buy seems to all have 2GB ram, a 500GB HDD and low spec everything, so this certainly looks worth the effort building. I was under the impression that except for gaming rigs it is no longer worth building your own, but unless someone finds me a great deal that I have missed, I see nothing off-the-shelf worth buying at this price...

Of course, I won't actually build it, the Advice store can do that. I'll just install the software. It will be running Windows 7 64 bit by the way (and yes, a fully updateable version, so no worries there). I would consider Windows 8, but the leap from XP to 7 is going to be tough for the err... ageing gent (read, old bugger!) that I am building it for.

I am probably now at:
Intel Celeron G1820 Haswell two core CPU - 1,400 (see comparison with G3220 here: http://tinyurl.com/ozh35k5)
Gigabyte GA-B85M-HD3 - 2,340
Kingston DDR3 ram, 2 x 4Gb - 2,520
1 TB. SATA-III Seagate (64MB, STrek) HDD - 2,030
mATX Tsunami Genius case and PSU - 890
DVD RW Samsung - 510

Total is therefore 9,690 Baht - just under budget... (I could still get just 4GB Ram to keep the price lower, but will pay the price in a few years time I know)

I like the idea of the super cheap (and seemingly fairly capable for general use) CPU, but in a socket 1150 motherboard that accepts pretty powerful chips. I can imagine chucking the chip in a few years time and putting in something more powerful (if needed) and not feeling that much had been wasted.

[GuyL]

Great input fellas, thank you. This is really helping me out. Hopefully will be of use to other Cheap Charlie builders too.

I have been out checking in the stores and for under 10K what you buy seems to all have 2GB ram, a 500GB HDD and low spec everything, so this certainly looks worth the effort building. I was under the impression that except for gaming rigs it is no longer worth building your own, but unless someone finds me a great deal that I have missed, I see nothing off-the-shelf worth buying at this price...

Of course, I won't actually build it, the Advice store can do that. I'll just install the software. It will be running Windows 7 64 bit by the way (and yes, a fully updateable version, so no worries there). I would consider Windows 8, but the leap from XP to 7 is going to be tough for the err... ageing gent (read, old bugger!) that I am building it for.

I am probably now at:

Intel Celeron G1820 Haswell two core CPU - 1,400 (see comparison with G3220 here: http://tinyurl.com/ozh35k5)

Gigabyte GA-B85M-HD3 - 2,340

Kingston DDR3 ram, 2 x 4Gb - 2,520

1 TB. SATA-III Seagate (64MB, STrek) HDD - 2,030

mATX Tsunami Genius case and PSU - 890

DVD RW Samsung - 510

Total is therefore 9,690 Baht - just under budget... (I could still get just 4GB Ram to keep the price lower, but will pay the price in a few years time I know)

I like the idea of the super cheap (and seemingly fairly capable for general use) CPU, but in a socket 1150 motherboard that accepts pretty powerful chips. I can imagine chucking the chip in a few years time and putting in something more powerful (if needed) and not feeling that much had been wasted.

That's already a decent configuration, but I would rather keep the G3220 instead of switching to a G1820 for the CPU if I were you, even if that means that you will have only 4 GB of RAM right now. By the way, if you want to have 8 GB now, it's better (IMHO) to use a single 8 GB module (such as this one, for instance: http://www.advice.co.th/products/preview.php?code=A0054870) instead of two 4 GB modules, because you will still have a free slot for adding another 8 GB module later (max RAM being 16 GB with your motherboard) and won't have to ditch any lower capacity RAM module.

As for the motherboard itself, both Asrock and Gigabyte are decent enough for this price range IMHO.

[JimShortz]

Thanks GuyL, the 8GB chip makes sense I guess, although I'm not sure this machine will still be around to see 16GB, and by going single chip you lose the dual channel advantage - small though it is... :-)

I was always very opposed to Celeron, but this Haswell one seems pretty good - shockingly close to the G3220 in the tests I have seen. In real world use I am guessing that I couldn't see any difference, probably... Why would you avoid it? Is it same as me, Celeron aversion based on past experiences, or related to this actual chip?

My thinking is the cheaper the chip the easier it is to throw and upgrade in two or three years, if needed.

I don't know... Lol. Anyway, thanks again for your ideas, and helping me reach a better conclusion.

[GuyL]

Thanks GuyL, the 8GB chip makes sense I guess, although I'm not sure this machine will still be around to see 16GB, and by going single chip you lose the dual channel advantage - small though it is... :-)

I was always very opposed to Celeron, but this Haswell one seems pretty good - shockingly close to the G3220 in the tests I have seen. In real world use I am guessing that I couldn't see any difference, probably... Why would you avoid it? Is it same as me, Celeron aversion based on past experiences, or related to this actual chip?

My thinking is the cheaper the chip the easier it is to throw and upgrade in two or three years, if needed.

I don't know... Lol. Anyway, thanks again for your ideas, and helping me reach a better conclusion.

Budgetwise, I just would rather buy the best CPU that I can afford in this case, and save a little bit on the RAM modules (buying only one 4GB for instance if 8 GB is too much expensive), as it is easier and cheaper to add more RAM later (and maybe, replace your HDD with an SSD when the price will be reasonable enough, your current HDD could then still be used as data storage). You will get better performance (IMHO) in the meanwhile than what you can obtain with 2 RAM modules in dual channel with a slower CPU.

Again, it's just my humble opinion, and both solutions are decent enough for the usage described, I guess.

Edited April 14, 2014 by GuyL

[Oreganobag]

Invest in a branded 80 Plus Bronze or higher (Silver, Gold, Platinum) PSU. The power throughput here is so <deleted> that its burned through 2 or 3 of them in the past 5 years. Been building custom PCs just as long and have come to realize that if I'm not splurging on the PSU, I'm going to have to replace it within the year. Make sure it has a decent warranty, too. SeaSonic, Coolermaster and Corsair are excellent brands with strong warranties.

If your PSU is bad, it means trouble for everything, motherboard gets shot, CPU/CPU don't get enough constant current, burnouts, fires, etc. Random reboots and shut downs are also symptoms of a bad PSU.

Also, I prefer ASUS motherboards. Typically better support, BIOS, and every Gigabyte MOBO I've tried craps out on me or has some little niggle that makes it worse than ASUS. MSI and Asrock (Asus owns ASrock I believe) are also very good

[akampa]

I have not read but probably not forgotten is a good power supply unit min 400 watt Corsair comes to mind about 2000 baht and I sure there are cheaper ones out there but you do get what you pay for .

[akampa]

just beat me to it

[akampa]

i agree had 3 asus boards never any problems just wanted to up grade and use AMD cpu`s

[PaulHamon]

Lenovo IdeaCentre Q180 Mini PC

easy to take with you...

[Cam Khao]

Take a look at that AMD A10 APU.

Decent power, and good on board graphics for the price.

Just buy a motherboard, throw in some RAM and a hard drive, and you are done.

I built a very capable desktop using an A10 a few months back.

I was so impressed I just purchased an AMD A10 powered laptop as well.

[GuyL]

Lenovo IdeaCentre Q180 Mini PC

easy to take with you...

At 349 euro, it's too expensive.

Max budget being 10K baht, you have to compromise somehow.

That's why a 2000 baht power supply unit is also probably too much expensive here and less crucial considering the warranty duration on other components, especially if the OP's friend already owns an uninterruptible power supply (but we don't know that yet).

Edited April 14, 2014 by GuyL

[realenglish1]

Just go to Pantip Plaza and talk to a couple of companies that build them there I have built my own now for more than

10 years every few years when its needed to upgrade and I have always been very happy.

'

The one I am typing on how was built 2 years ago and 0 problems

[Kiwi1]

Hello all:

Fascinated by this thread.

Am a grizzled 78 year old, am very pleased with my Lenovo Thinkcentre desktop which has flat profile ie lies on its side which convenient for my desk set up.

Bought it second hand in New Zealand for around $50.00 US and it serves me very well.

I too have no need for games or photoshop.

Have some technical nous but the digital world a mystery to me.

My present machine Lenovo 80089 BM

Bios Lenovo

Now runs Windows 7 (would have preferred to stay with XP but there you are)

RAM 2GB

CPU 2 @1.8 (3.6Gb)

Disc 111.786 GB

P/S 225 W

This suits me fine but cannot fit a HDML graphics board and would like this to give display on flat screen TV.

Am very interested in baseline budget around 10,000+ baht and happy to pay more for a bigger power supply.

Can get help reinstalling software, or could I get away reusing the existing hard drive?

Live in Chiangmai and would be delighted if some kind person could coach me on what to order and where to go to get machine assembled.

Would like flat pack box if possible.

Thanks for your time.

Baz

[GuyL]

Hello all:

Fascinated by this thread.

Am a grizzled 78 year old, am very pleased with my Lenovo Thinkcentre desktop which has flat profile ie lies on its side which convenient for my desk set up.

Bought it second hand in New Zealand for around $50.00 US and it serves me very well.

I too have no need for games or photoshop.

Have some technical nous but the digital world a mystery to me.

My present machine Lenovo 80089 BM

Bios Lenovo

Now runs Windows 7 (would have preferred to stay with XP but there you are)

RAM 2GB

CPU 2 @1.8 (3.6Gb)

Disc 111.786 GB

P/S 225 W

This suits me fine but cannot fit a HDML graphics board and would like this to give display on flat screen TV.

Am very interested in baseline budget around 10,000+ baht and happy to pay more for a bigger power supply.

Can get help reinstalling software, or could I get away reusing the existing hard drive?

Live in Chiangmai and would be delighted if some kind person could coach me on what to order and where to go to get machine assembled.

Would like flat pack box if possible.

Thanks for your time.

Baz

I am pretty sure that you will soon be contacted by someone knowledgeable who lives in your area (it's not my case, I live in the Udon Thani province).

As for your 120 GB hard disk drive, while it is not impossible to use it within a new desktop computer as its system drive, I would not recommend it. 120 GB is not much nowadays and this HDD is probably an IDE one. I would recommend a much larger SATA (or SSD, but it's much more expensive then for a decent capacity) HDD for your new computer and a fresh install from scratch for your operating system and programs.

[mathewjg]

I am amazed that anyone bothers to build pc's these days - I used to enjoy upgrading etc but now the price of new desktops and very good quality used pc's is so low that I cant see how it costs in - don't forget you will also need an operating system unless you are using your original windows XP disk which if its an OEM version may not be usable. I still do still mess around with computers and I have to say that the best thing you can do to upgrade any computer is change the boot drive to a SSD. My old laptop (about 4 years old) boots up in about 10 seconds and everything works much quicker. Its a very noticeable difference - unlike memory and cpu upgrades. 64gig SSD's are now very affordable at about £40/2000 baht. I paid about £150/7500 baht for a good quality Samsung 250gb SSD. Not only are they faster they are also almost impervious to shock and use less power.

If I was building from scratch I would use any current motherboard/CPU combination, 4gb memory (maybe less), 64gb boot drive and whatever size drive that you want as a main storage.

[Muhendis]

I am amazed that anyone bothers to build pc's these days - I used to enjoy upgrading etc but now the price of new desktops and very good quality used pc's is so low that I cant see how it costs in - don't forget you will also need an operating system unless you are using your original windows XP disk which if its an OEM version may not be usable. I still do still mess around with computers and I have to say that the best thing you can do to upgrade any computer is change the boot drive to a SSD. My old laptop (about 4 years old) boots up in about 10 seconds and everything works much quicker. Its a very noticeable difference - unlike memory and cpu upgrades. 64gig SSD's are now very affordable at about £40/2000 baht. I paid about £150/7500 baht for a good quality Samsung 250gb SSD. Not only are they faster they are also almost impervious to shock and use less power.

If I was building from scratch I would use any current motherboard/CPU combination, 4gb memory (maybe less), 64gb boot drive and whatever size drive that you want as a main storage.

mathewjg you make so many compellingly good points. I would also add that the OP needs to ask the question......What if it don't behave after all that time has been spent doing what you thought was a good idea at the time?

Has the OP considered that one day he may want to play games? How about a bit of simulation (as in engineering). He will definitely need a good video board for that.

I like the sound of a bootup in about 10 seconds. SSD for me is a throwback to the old Atari days. I have often wondered if IBM might one day catch up. Do you know where I can get one? I'm near Buri Ram.

[kaveh]

1. I always recommend under ~5000 THB, it is ABSOLUTELY enough (NOT GAMING)

2. why don't you go for a 500GB HDD? nowadays we have almost everything online

3. any mainboard with Intel chipset if you going to use Windows platform

4. always get the latest CPU from the last generation (not the current generation) and match it with the most basic MBs of current generation. I call it a simple budget solution which is ready to upgrade if needed)

cpu=Pentium 4F 3.6GHZ

[JSixpack]

I agree w/ some points above and will add one. I built a system kinda like this not too long ago for a friend. She's happy.

Keep the 3220

Try to get a Bronze certified PSU. I like the CORSAIR CX500M 80+ Bronze (CP-9020059-NA) - 2306487017 500 WATT 80 PLUS Bronze (2,390) sold by JIB. http://www.jib.co.th/web/index.php/product/listCategory/2/1348/0/index.html. Modular, well-reviewed (high quality caps) As mentioned, Seasonic is a great brand. I strongly believe a quality PSU is well worth the money.

Change the mainboard to GIGABYTE GA-H81-D3 (2,290)

Keep the 4 GB of RAM. Buy one stick.

Change the HD to 500 GB if necessary to afford the extra above.

Try for a 60 GB SSD for the OS and programs--if at all possible.

[GuyL]

Guys, keep in mind that OP's max budget is 10K THB only.

Some suggestions, while interesting, are probably not reasonable enough budgetwise. Take into account all the components needed (including case, DVD writer, etc.).

By the way, many users don't want to store much of their data online. You won't save much by replacing your 1 TB HDD with a 500 GB. Agreed, a 2000+ baht PSU is more reliable than what comes with the chosen case, but it's (IMHO) a very expensive component for a cheap desktop computer (especially considering the warranty on other components).

And for the usage described, an SSD is probably a bit over the top at the moment (but as explained earlier, it could be bought in a couple of years in order to upgrade this configuration when greater capacity SSDs will be much more affordable).

Edited April 14, 2014 by GuyL

[mathewjg]

I am amazed that anyone bothers to build pc's these days - I used to enjoy upgrading etc but now the price of new desktops and very good quality used pc's is so low that I cant see how it costs in - don't forget you will also need an operating system unless you are using your original windows XP disk which if its an OEM version may not be usable. I still do still mess around with computers and I have to say that the best thing you can do to upgrade any computer is change the boot drive to a SSD. My old laptop (about 4 years old) boots up in about 10 seconds and everything works much quicker. Its a very noticeable difference - unlike memory and cpu upgrades. 64gig SSD's are now very affordable at about £40/2000 baht. I paid about £150/7500 baht for a good quality Samsung 250gb SSD. Not only are they faster they are also almost impervious to shock and use less power.

If I was building from scratch I would use any current motherboard/CPU combination, 4gb memory (maybe less), 64gb boot drive and whatever size drive that you want as a main storage.

mathewjg you make so many compellingly good points. I would also add that the OP needs to ask the question......What if it don't behave after all that time has been spent doing what you thought was a good idea at the time?

Has the OP considered that one day he may want to play games? How about a bit of simulation (as in engineering). He will definitely need a good video board for that.

I like the sound of a bootup in about 10 seconds. SSD for me is a throwback to the old Atari days. I have often wondered if IBM might one day catch up. Do you know where I can get one? I'm near Buri Ram.

[mathewjg]

I am not very familiar with computer related shops outside of Pattaya where there are a few to choose from including tuecom.

www.dabs.com are my favourite online retailer but I am not sure if they will post to Thailand but worth a try. They are owned by BT and have excellent customer service. I have used them for at least 10 years and the prices are very good - I am based in the UK and have been coming out to Thailand to avoid the winter. Quite surprising that IT prices seem to be quite a bit higher in Thailand than UK. Another option might be to order direct from China where a lot of this stuff originates.

[NeverSure]

I believe that all of the motherboards I mentioned max at 16gb ram. For now I will only be putting 4 in anyway. The person I am building it for will never use photoshop or other power hungry applications anyway. He only multitasks by accident! :-)

Another board I am considering is the Asrock B85M-HDS for 2,160. This also seems to fit the bill quite well.

Don't skimp on the motherboard. That's where the future lies, and could trigger a replacement.

I can't find that MSI board, but the Asrock has just two ram slots, dual channel. That means that you need two matching sticks of ram, and if you ever want to upgrade, you can't just add. You have to replace. I can only see one PCI slot although the specs say it has two. I don't think I'm blind, lol. LINK

It has only 4 sata connectors. My mobo has 6 and I wish I had more. Have to add a card.

All of the ram for the video and audio is going to have to come from the mobo since there aren't slots to add cards with memory. It really wouldn't cost much more to put 8 gig of ram in it, and have plenty while avoiding tossing out the 4 gig later. It will run fine on 4 for what you describe, but over time he will add programs, and current program updates will use more ram. (you need a 64 bit operating system to see more than 4 gig, you know.)

I simply don't like that mobo. Isn't very expandable or upgradeable.

I suppose that the other motherboard (MSI) is actually this one: http://thesystem.co.th/products/previews.php?code=A0065322

I would rather choose (between those) the ASROCK motherboard then: http://thesystem.co.th/products/previews.php?code=A0064713

Agreed, both are not very expandable, but should be sufficient IMHO for the usage described by the OP and would last a few years (very likely more than their 3-year warranty) before a serious upgrade (besides RAM) is really needed, and then, one will be able to get a new configuration at a cheap price for not much more than the addition of eventual upgrading components and performing better.

I recently upgraded a mobo like that for a friend. A potential problem to remember is that the newer mobos after 3 years may not accept your components. That happened in this instance.

None of the new mobos I could find would accept the cpu or ram. Three years is a long time in computer years. I had to buy a new cpu and ram in addition to buying a decent mobo.

Again, don't skimp on the mobo. Get one with at least 6 sata ports and 4 ram slots. At minimum it should have 2 or 3 pci slots. The mobo doesn't have to be top of the line or real expensive, but using that ASRock is planning for obsolescence IMHO.