Why do so many TV users dislike Thailand so much and yet stay?

[maxme]

Mmkay, so according to you these women have chosen to follow the doctrine set by their culture or family, voluntarily... And you know this how?

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What difference does voluntarily make? I do 10 things a day that I don't want to do.

The problem with narrow minded folks is they think there is only one way of doing things and that their way is the correct way.

It may be the correct way. Maybe you have freedom of choice and only do what you want to do. OK. The majority of the world is not free. I make no moral judgments about others. Just because the majority of the world has arranged marriages does not mean it is right. I don't think anyone said that.

I hope you are joking when you compare your trivial daily dilemmas to arranged marriages.

Young uneducated women don't know their choices as they haven't been shown them yet. Too often lured with the hopes of the promise land which turns out to be nth but a sex deal. Now if they know their choices and still do it, then by all means.

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Who cares? My statement was, the majority of women in the world get married by arrangement.

To get back on topic. Do you still live here?

Arranged marriages as you mentioned to consolidate land holdings or business dealings are common here. It must freak you out especially thinking marriage is a sex deal.

My advice would be to forget it. It's not your country. You are never going to be Thai.

Alright, got three important questions to ask you...

1) Sorry but who in their right minds want to be Thai when even the locals don't want to be?

2) Do you speak for all Thais when in regards to your previous statements?

3) Are you on that meth shit again?

You're allowed your opinion like everybody else on this forum but for the love of god don't whine about how you are misunderstood. If you don't want critique then don't post things that will attract criticism.

Your moral compass is so screwed up that I doubt you will ever come back to reality.

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Edited May 11, 2014 by maxme

[maxme]

I hope you are joking when you compare your trivial daily dilemmas to arranged marriages.

Young uneducated women don't know their choices as they haven't been shown them yet. Too often lured with the hopes of the promise land which turns out to be nth but a sex deal. Now if they know their choices and still do it, then by all means.

I know many educated women in arranged marriages, doctors, nurses, teachers, etc.

80% of the world population do arranged marriage, full spectrum of social status, wealth and education.

You really do have a limited view on life in the rest of the world.

Perhaps that wasn't the thing I was questioning but with your limited view I understand you see it that way.

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[thailiketoo]

Who cares? My statement was, the majority of women in the world get married by arrangement.

To get back on topic. Do you still live here?

Arranged marriages as you mentioned to consolidate land holdings or business dealings are common here. It must freak you out especially thinking marriage is a sex deal.

My advice would be to forget it. It's not your country. You are never going to be Thai.

Alright, got three important questions to ask you...

1) Sorry but who in their right minds want to be Thai when even the locals don't want to be?

2) Do you speak for all Thais when in regards to your previous statements?

3) Are you on that meth shit again?

You're allowed your opinion like everybody else on this forum but for the love of god don't whine about how you are misunderstood. If you don't want critique then don't post things that will attract criticism.

Your moral compass is so screwed up that I doubt you will ever come back to reality.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

You wrote, "3) Are you on that meth shit again?"

Grow up and post like an adult.

6) Do not post comments that could be reasonably construed as defamation or libel.

7) Respect fellow members by posting in a civil manner: do not launch personal attacks, or be hateful or insulting towards other members, ie No flaming.

9) Do not post inflammatory messages on the forum, or attempt to disrupt discussions to upset its participants,

[beb]

1) Sorry but who in their right minds want to be Thai when even the locals don't want to be?

God, this thread has gone bonkers in so many ways but I can't let this statement go without comment. There is a common misimpression by western expats that locals of whatever country they happen to be in don't want to be a part of their community in some way. Nothing could be further from the truth. Sure, there are people that prefer western culture and people but that is true of westerners as well.

Most people are more comfortable with people of the same background etc and frankly it's naive to think a 25 year old Thai girl would prefer to hang out with a 55 year old westerner than with her Thai friends and probably a 25 year old Thai guy. That's just common sense.

Now you can make an argument that the same 25 year old makes a choice on her own to be with the 55 year old but that's because he typically brings with him some other elements to the equation. Money, access to immigration to his home country, a better life for her children and family etc. Those are all valid things to consider for somebody who wants to have a better life.

And it's not uncommon that the young girl in whatever country is going back to the well for what really makes her happy without the knowledge of her husband/boyfriend. That's not so difficult to understand either.

But to think that this means Thai people don't want to be Thai is a bit feeble.

[maxme]

Who cares? My statement was, the majority of women in the world get married by arrangement.

To get back on topic. Do you still live here?

Arranged marriages as you mentioned to consolidate land holdings or business dealings are common here. It must freak you out especially thinking marriage is a sex deal.

My advice would be to forget it. It's not your country. You are never going to be Thai.

Alright, got three important questions to ask you...

1) Sorry but who in their right minds want to be Thai when even the locals don't want to be?

2) Do you speak for all Thais when in regards to your previous statements?

3) Are you on that meth shit again?

You're allowed your opinion like everybody else on this forum but for the love of god don't whine about how you are misunderstood. If you don't want critique then don't post things that will attract criticism.

Your moral compass is so screwed up that I doubt you will ever come back to reality.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

You wrote, "3) Are you on that meth shit again?"

Grow up and post like an adult.

6) Do not post comments that could be reasonably construed as defamation or libel.

7) Respect fellow members by posting in a civil manner: do not launch personal attacks, or be hateful or insulting towards other members, ie No flaming.

9) Do not post inflammatory messages on the forum, or attempt to disrupt discussions to upset its participants,

...

Strange, I thought those rules include misogony. I think what broke the camel's back was your lady comment before I posted the somewhat childish response. Beating the ppl at the own game so to speak. Although I hold a higher view of women than you and your buddy do.

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[thailiketoo]

Who cares? My statement was, the majority of women in the world get married by arrangement.

To get back on topic. Do you still live here?

Arranged marriages as you mentioned to consolidate land holdings or business dealings are common here. It must freak you out especially thinking marriage is a sex deal.

My advice would be to forget it. It's not your country. You are never going to be Thai.

Alright, got three important questions to ask you...

1) Sorry but who in their right minds want to be Thai when even the locals don't want to be?

2) Do you speak for all Thais when in regards to your previous statements?

3) Are you on that meth shit again?

You're allowed your opinion like everybody else on this forum but for the love of god don't whine about how you are misunderstood. If you don't want critique then don't post things that will attract criticism.

Your moral compass is so screwed up that I doubt you will ever come back to reality.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

You wrote, "3) Are you on that meth shit again?"

Grow up and post like an adult.

6) Do not post comments that could be reasonably construed as defamation or libel.

7) Respect fellow members by posting in a civil manner: do not launch personal attacks, or be hateful or insulting towards other members, ie No flaming.

9) Do not post inflammatory messages on the forum, or attempt to disrupt discussions to upset its participants,

Strange, I thought those rules include misogony. I think what broke the camel's back was your lady comment before I posted the somewhat childish response. Beating the ppl at the own game so to speak. Although I hold a higher view of women than you and your buddy do.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Quote one reference I made that could be construed as misogyny.

First the flame, "You wrote, "3) Are you on that meth shit again?"

Second, "Strange, I thought those rules include misogony. I think what broke the camel's back was your lady comment before I posted the somewhat childish response."

I have no lady here and I posted nothing about misogyny.

Feel free to disprove me and quote anything I said that was misogynistic.

More rules violations.

2) Do not use ThaiVisa.com to post any material which is knowingly or can be reasonably construed as false,

Edited May 12, 2014 by thailiketoo

[maxme]

Who cares? My statement was, the majority of women in the world get married by arrangement.

To get back on topic. Do you still live here?

Arranged marriages as you mentioned to consolidate land holdings or business dealings are common here. It must freak you out especially thinking marriage is a sex deal.

My advice would be to forget it. It's not your country. You are never going to be Thai.

Alright, got three important questions to ask you...

1) Sorry but who in their right minds want to be Thai when even the locals don't want to be?

2) Do you speak for all Thais when in regards to your previous statements?

3) Are you on that meth shit again?

You're allowed your opinion like everybody else on this forum but for the love of god don't whine about how you are misunderstood. If you don't want critique then don't post things that will attract criticism.

Your moral compass is so screwed up that I doubt you will ever come back to reality.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

You wrote, "3) Are you on that meth shit again?"

Grow up and post like an adult.

6) Do not post comments that could be reasonably construed as defamation or libel.

7) Respect fellow members by posting in a civil manner: do not launch personal attacks, or be hateful or insulting towards other members, ie No flaming.

9) Do not post inflammatory messages on the forum, or attempt to disrupt discussions to upset its participants,

Strange, I thought those rules include misogony. I think what broke the camel's back was your lady comment before I posted the somewhat childish response. Beating the ppl at the own game so to speak. Although I hold a higher view of women than you and your buddy do.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Quote one reference I made that could be construed as misogyny.

First the flame, "You wrote, "3) Are you on that meth shit again?"

Second, "Strange, I thought those rules include misogony. I think what broke the camel's back was your lady comment before I posted the somewhat childish response."

I have no lady here and I posted nothing about misogyny.

Feel free to disprove me and quote anything I said that was misogynistic.

More rules violations.

2) Do not use ThaiVisa.com to post any material which is knowingly or can be reasonably construed as false,

Yet there are a few posters that would disagree with you. I didn't say you don't have right to post your view, I just said don't expect people to agree with it.

And yet instead of putting it in definitive, you start your own little pity party.

So if you want to prove me wrong, context please, why should I forget about it since I'll never be Thai?

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[thailiketoo]

Who cares? My statement was, the majority of women in the world get married by arrangement.

To get back on topic. Do you still live here?

Arranged marriages as you mentioned to consolidate land holdings or business dealings are common here. It must freak you out especially thinking marriage is a sex deal.

My advice would be to forget it. It's not your country. You are never going to be Thai.

Alright, got three important questions to ask you...

1) Sorry but who in their right minds want to be Thai when even the locals don't want to be?

2) Do you speak for all Thais when in regards to your previous statements?

3) Are you on that meth shit again?

You're allowed your opinion like everybody else on this forum but for the love of god don't whine about how you are misunderstood. If you don't want critique then don't post things that will attract criticism.

Your moral compass is so screwed up that I doubt you will ever come back to reality.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

You wrote, "3) Are you on that meth shit again?"

Grow up and post like an adult.

6) Do not post comments that could be reasonably construed as defamation or libel.

7) Respect fellow members by posting in a civil manner: do not launch personal attacks, or be hateful or insulting towards other members, ie No flaming.

9) Do not post inflammatory messages on the forum, or attempt to disrupt discussions to upset its participants,

Strange, I thought those rules include misogony. I think what broke the camel's back was your lady comment before I posted the somewhat childish response. Beating the ppl at the own game so to speak. Although I hold a higher view of women than you and your buddy do.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Quote one reference I made that could be construed as misogyny.

First the flame, "You wrote, "3) Are you on that meth shit again?"

Second, "Strange, I thought those rules include misogony. I think what broke the camel's back was your lady comment before I posted the somewhat childish response."

I have no lady here and I posted nothing about misogyny.

Feel free to disprove me and quote anything I said that was misogynistic.

More rules violations.

2) Do not use ThaiVisa.com to post any material which is knowingly or can be reasonably construed as false,

Yet there are a few posters that would disagree with you. I didn't say you don't have right to post your view, I just said don't expect people to agree with it.

And yet instead of putting it in definitive, you start your own little pity party.

So if you want to prove me wrong, context please, why should I forget about it since I'll never be Thai?

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Trying to correct his quote function.

[maxme]

OK I do play the blame game sometimes. As of yet I haven't decided what to blame... My Iphone or the app.

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[GuestHouse]

Here's a curiosity.

I've noticed over the years how so very often TVF (and other Thailand based forum) users who take great offence at any negative news about Thailand being discussed, so very often suddenly and without any forewarning disappear.

I wonder if it has anything to do with a similar observation I have made of expats I have personally known in Thailand, who ranted and raved against anyone who made any negative comment about life in Thailand, only to be suddenly hit themselves with a negative reality they can't dodge - pack their bags and go home.

I strongly suspect the common cause is an insecurity some feel in the decisions they themselves have made.

I've never known anyone who is truly happy with the decisions they have made for themselves be at all concerned with other people's opinion on that decision.

[maxme]

Here's a curiosity.

I've noticed over the years how so very often TVF (and other Thailand based forum) users who take great offence at any negative news about Thailand being discussed, so very often suddenly and without any forewarning disappear.

I wonder if it has anything to do with a similar observation I have made of expats I have personally known in Thailand, who ranted and raved against anyone who made any negative comment about life in Thailand, only to be suddenly hit themselves with a negative reality they can't dodge - pack their bags and go home.

I strongly suspect the common cause is an insecurity some feel in the decisions they themselves have made.

I've never known anyone who is truly happy with the decisions they have made for themselves be at all concerned with other people's opinion on that decision.

Doesn't that go for views in general? Whether it's home or here? One's position in the social ladder might and often has an impact in one's views but we are not all built the same, we do not have the same background despite being equals thus it affects our opinions about people and society in general.

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[Berkshire]

Here's a curiosity.

I've noticed over the years how so very often TVF (and other Thailand based forum) users who take great offence at any negative news about Thailand being discussed, so very often suddenly and without any forewarning disappear.

I wonder if it has anything to do with a similar observation I have made of expats I have personally known in Thailand, who ranted and raved against anyone who made any negative comment about life in Thailand, only to be suddenly hit themselves with a negative reality they can't dodge - pack their bags and go home.

I strongly suspect the common cause is an insecurity some feel in the decisions they themselves have made.

I've never known anyone who is truly happy with the decisions they have made for themselves be at all concerned with other people's opinion on that decision.

Hmmmm....you can pretty much say the same about disgruntled farangs who have nothing but hate for Thailand, and one day they just disappear. Of course, some of the more demented ones will come on TV and rationalize to everyone why they're leaving. Sorting of a parting shot.

[GuestHouse]

Hmmmm....you can pretty much say the same about disgruntled farangs who have nothing but hate for Thailand, and one day they just disappear. Of course, some of the more demented ones will come on TV and rationalize to everyone why they're leaving. Sorting of a parting shot.

Thing is, whenever I ask for the names of these 'haters', the names are never forthcoming - its always a vague point at something someone who is never identified said.

[thailiketoo]

Hmmmm....you can pretty much say the same about disgruntled farangs who have nothing but hate for Thailand, and one day they just disappear. Of course, some of the more demented ones will come on TV and rationalize to everyone why they're leaving. Sorting of a parting shot.

Thing is, whenever I ask for the names of these 'haters', the names are never forthcoming - its always a vague point at something someone who is never identified said.

Do you have a link to any of those times you asked for the names of haters or is it a vague point, never really identified or impossible to find and link?

[GuestHouse]

Do you have a link to any of those times you asked for the names of haters or is it a vague point, never really identified or impossible to find and link?

I can do better than a link.

Who are the haters?

[thailiketoo]

Do you have a link to any of those times you asked for the names of haters or is it a vague point, never really identified or impossible to find and link?

I can do better than a link.

Who are the haters?

As I suspected. You never asked before. Well I don't want to go back and find all the posts but as I get flamed by the haters (I don't mind the hate and venom but the flaming when they proved wrong instead of reasoned debate) makes me put them on my ignore list. PM me if you want my list of people I have on ignore.

The last few I remember was a fellow who thought Thai women could not speak English and another who said that Walter Mitty types were found only in Thailand.

Another hater posted, "It is noticeable that the more seriously any Thai takes themselves, normally the more odious and corrupt the person. The upper echelons of Thai society are something to behold."

Another who said about Thailand, "I can't assimilate into Thai culture because I don't drink. Thialand is full of alcoholics both Thai and falang. That's why I don't fit in when I'm there.."

And, "the Thai smile is a fake, the land is polluted, the opportunities are not really there, or require lots of flamed hoops and under handed tea money. fed up with the lies, the hypocrisy , the border stamp runs, the driving, the abysmal regard for safety, the face saving above all else mentality. Thais are about as bigotted and racist a culture as it gets. poppng pimples - gawd that one is as nasty as it gets, too. Vanity and grossness rolled into one. Gawd just.... disgusting. Thais throw trash everywhere and pick their noses and have a serious hygiene deficiency. she is a moron, apparently, or insipid, or both. Seems to be a national condition. Note how the walls in their homes are black filthy or covered with pink mold."

And on and on......

I put all the ones who have flamed me more than the average, on ignore.

Edit to add. Sorry I just realized you can't PM me. Oh well.

Maybe I'm wrong but I think listing Thai haters without the specific quotes would not be allowable here. Let me know if I'm wrong.

Edited May 12, 2014 by thailiketoo

[benalibina]

In a perfect world.....only thai people would live and reside in thailand. Birmese only in Birma, Americans only in USA, French only in France...etc etc...

So the world is not perfect we can conclude.

A better world starts with oneself.

All this hate and apologizing on this forum ...is very informative for a neutral. It can make people more aware of their own stance on certain matters.

1 thing though i totally not understand.....are by some apologists and haters the personal and namecalling posts to people who do not agree with their view.

Critisims, well founded, are made, i hope, to make it a better place to live in. To make people aware of the possible pitfalls by living in thailand.

Edited May 12, 2014 by benalibina

[thailiketoo]

In a perfect world.....only thai people would live and reside in thailand. Birmese only in Birma, Americans only in USA, French only in France...etc etc...

So the world is not perfect we can conclude.

A better world starts with oneself.

All this hate and apologizing on this forum ...is very informative for a neutral. It can make people more aware of their own stance on certain matters.

1 thing though i totally not understand.....are by some apologists and haters the personal and namecalling posts to people who do not agree with their view.

Critisims, well founded, are made, i hope, to make it a better place to live in. To make people aware of the possible pitfalls by living in thailand.

You wrote, "In a perfect world.....only thai people would live and reside in thailand. Birmese only in Birma, Americans only in USA, French only in France...etc etc..."

In a perfect world by whom? Germany in the 1930's?

I would think a perfect world would be 100% opposite that where people of all nationalities were welcome in my country.

Your perfect world brings to mind the ethnocentric behavior that started WWII and the greater Asia co prosperity sphere and the rules against mixed race marriages in the USA.

Did you really mean to say that a perfect world would there would be no diversity?

[beb]

Here's a curiosity.

I've noticed over the years how so very often TVF (and other Thailand based forum) users who take great offence at any negative news about Thailand being discussed, so very often suddenly and without any forewarning disappear.

I wonder if it has anything to do with a similar observation I have made of expats I have personally known in Thailand, who ranted and raved against anyone who made any negative comment about life in Thailand, only to be suddenly hit themselves with a negative reality they can't dodge - pack their bags and go home.

I strongly suspect the common cause is an insecurity some feel in the decisions they themselves have made.

I've never known anyone who is truly happy with the decisions they have made for themselves be at all concerned with other people's opinion on that decision.

I'm the OP so it seems like this is directed at people like me. Let me explain a little my perspective.

First of all, I don't take great offense at people that complain about Thailand. I sometimes agree or find the complaints amusing. My friends and I laugh about TV comments all the time. And I have my own issues with Thailand but of course they aren't that great or I wouldn't still be here. I've lived in enough countries to know that there are always cultural differences that I'll have to learn to live with.

As far as people like me, and I think most of my friends in Thailand fall into that category, who "disappear", we don't leave Thailand, we just stop commenting on TV. Most of us find the negativity so overwhelming that it's really not something we want to wallow in.

For instance, when I read a tragic story, the last thing on my mind is to get into a debate on the comments about anything, but here it is commonplace. For instance, a recent story about a child who was trapped in his house after his father died. This is a news story I followed a link to on TV. In the first page of comments, a debate exploded over perceived racism and another suggested that the mother was responsible etc. etc. This all in a tragic story that in a normal environment would have been about the sadness of what happened to an innocent child http://goo.gl/inLdIx

My greatest sin here is being genuinely curious.

[thailiketoo]

Do you have a link to any of those times you asked for the names of haters or is it a vague point, never really identified or impossible to find and link?

I can do better than a link.

Who are the haters?

Add this one, "My advice is Dont

1. dont involve yourself with Thai men in situations where you are likely to disagree with them or be better than them at some task (even sport)

2. dont react to the constant smiles that you will observe. they are rarely genuine or reflect what you would think.

3. don't forget that you have entered into a fully undeveloped country even though the malls look nice and there are some good hotels (think North Korea or Afghanistan with perhaps better looking people)

4. dont forget that you have your own culture which is very likely superior in many ways. its fine to be mindful of thai culture but dont think you have to betray your own all the time

Do

1. treat thai people with complete detachment - and never expect more from them

2. remember at all times that thai culture dictates that in interacting with you they are highly encouraged to tell you exactly what they think you want to hear to make you feel good or let down your guard (things are rarely what they seem)

3. try your best to limit your interaction with thais to controlled situation (buying food, going to work if an expat, etc. Try not to have too many thai people in your life as it increases your risk)

End quote.

If they gave awards for hating posts the above would be close to the top. The above is a prescription for damaging any hope of relationships with Thais.

I have tried to answer your questions about haters fairly and without malice and I just scratched the surface of a normal few days postings. The dislike is really intense. I have never seen it on another forum. And I'm really at a loss to explain why they stay. I sure would have left a long time ago. Can you imagine the bars of hate in the self imposed jail the above poster puts himself behind every day?

Edited May 13, 2014 by thailiketoo

[HardenedSoul]

55% of the women in the world have arranged marriages with a 6% divorce rate. Based on percent I guess arranged marriages would be normal. I think what you are writing about is your culture which I don't think we are in right now are we? First comes marriage then comes love I believe is the norm world wide for the majority.

Guess you don' believe in freedom of the individual or in this case... women.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Where do you get from my post that I favor or don't favor anything? Max you are making things up. If you want to ask my opinion I'll give it to you though.

I have had two arranged marriages. The first was arranged by a father with a shotgun and the second was arranged by a father with a shotgun, I don't like arranged marriages. I don't care anything about sexist stuff. People is people. I don't like arranged marriages for men or women.

Now on the other hand if you were asking if most of the world has arranged marriages, well yes they do. My like or dislike of the concept has never been asked for.

TLT is correct, posters continually hold up western ideals and morality as the norm, or the majority.

In reality the western world is the minority way, about 17% of the world population.

Most of the world are from the Asian and Indian continents.

It's a classic self-serving argument, isn't it?

It's nothing to do with ideals. It's just another way the more odious and depraved among us use to justify the fact that they can get away with what they do out here.

Look at any images or media in popular youth culture in Asia then come back to tell us how many of them suggest that their ideal scenario is one in which young women open their legs for lecherous old fossils with their parents' blessing.

You guys are so full of it, all I can do is laugh at you.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Guess you don' believe in freedom of the individual or in this case... women.

Where do you get from my post that I favor or don't favor anything? Max you are making things up. If you want to ask my opinion I'll give it to you though.

I have had two arranged marriages. The first was arranged by a father with a shotgun and the second was arranged by a father with a shotgun, I don't like arranged marriages. I don't care anything about sexist stuff. People is people. I don't like arranged marriages for men or women.

Now on the other hand if you were asking if most of the world has arranged marriages, well yes they do. My like or dislike of the concept has never been asked for.

TLT is correct, posters continually hold up western ideals and morality as the norm, or the majority.

In reality the western world is the minority way, about 17% of the world population.

Most of the world are from the Asian and Indian continents.

It's a classic self-serving argument, isn't it?

It's nothing to do with ideals. It's just another way the more odious and depraved among us use to justify the fact that they can get away with what they do out here.

Look at any images or media in popular youth culture in Asia then come back to tell us how many of them suggest that their ideal scenario is one in which young women open their legs for lecherous old fossils with their parents' blessing.

You guys are so full of it, all I can do is laugh at you.

Hate to point this out to you HS, but none of the posts you quoted were to do with old men and young women.

We were discussing arranged marriage, as far as I can see old+young is your obsession, get over it.

[GuestHouse]

Add this one, "My advice is Dont

1. dont involve yourself with Thai men in situations where you are likely to disagree with them or be better than them at some task (even sport)

While extreme advice, there is no indication of hatred in this point - extreme caution and a clear personal fear of Thai men yes - There are no terms that could be remotely described as hatred or as inciting hatred used in this example you have given us.

2. dont react to the constant smiles that you will observe. they are rarely genuine or reflect what you would think.

Again, where is the hatred? - Whoever said this is suffering fear or confusion, perhaps both.

Certainly there are significant cultural differences between the use of smiles in western and Thai culture. The person who wrote this seems to be in fear of those differences or confused by those differences - There are no terms that could be remotely described as hatred or as inciting used in this example you have given us.

3. don't forget that you have entered into a fully undeveloped country even though the malls look nice and there are some good hotels (think North Korea or Afghanistan with perhaps better looking people)

Whoever wrote this is clearly wrong, Thailand is a developing nation, ie not fully developed but yes as s/he states the people are good looking. Comparison with North Korea and Afghanistan is of course grossly gratuitous but in the absence of explicitly derogatory terms the comments cannot be claimed to exhibit hate. They actually read like the words of someone who has never been to Thailand - There are no terms that could be remotely described as hatred or as inciting hatred used in this example you have given us.

4. dont forget that you have your own culture which is very likely superior in many ways. its fine to be mindful of thai culture but dont think you have to betray your own all the time

All cultures are superior to other cultures in some respect (No single culture has captured all goodness, who ever made this comment has not claimed a total superiority of any culture nor a total inferiority of Thai culture to other cultures).

Advising someone not to forget their own culture and not to betray their own culture is, I believe (in fact to remove any doubt, I will says) is good advice. - There are no terms that could be remotely described as hatred or as inciting hatred used in this example you have given us.

Do

1. treat thai people with complete detachment - and never expect more from them

I know people who hold this point of view about everyone they meet. Whoever said this clearly has low expectations of any meaningful interaction with Thai people, perhaps s/he doesn't actually want any interactions with Thai people (the fear and confusion s/he exhibits above might suggest a reason for that), but its hardly hatred.

I'd go as far as to say its not that much removed from something I read earlier My advice would be to forget it. It's not your country. You are never going to be Thai. - your own words I believe (Low expectations, it seems, are not the reserve of "haters"). - There are no terms that could be remotely described as hatred or as inciting hatred used in this example you have given us.

2. remember at all times that thai culture dictates that in interacting with you they are highly encouraged to tell you exactly what they think you want to hear to make you feel good or let down your guard (things are rarely what they seem)

The presentation of good news, rather than bad news and the underplaying of bad news to save the feelings of others is a recognised Thai cultural trait.

If whoever wrote this only has transactional dealings with Thai people then, yes, cultural misunderstandings are used by Thai people in transactional dealings with foreigners to get them to drop their guard.

Read the scam reports from tourists ripped off in Thailand, how often terms such as 'But s/he was such a nice and friendly person, treated us so well/smiled so beautifully/was so kind and helpful.... until we realised what they had done behind our back.

I once warned my UK bank manager who asked advice about a holiday to Thailand, that she should leave her credit cards in the hotel safe and if any sales person ever offers to take her back to the hotel to fetch her credit cards be aware she is almost certainly being scammed.

When I met her next she told me she was scammed to buying an expensive ruby ring that she did not really want by a guy who did indeed take her back to her hotel to fetch her credit cards.

I asked her, did you remember what I advised? She said she did, she felt awful getting her cards out and paying but "she didn't want to let the guy down - he'd been so nice and helpful".

A trick not lost on the TAT who train their official tour guides in how to get foreign tourists to spend money on targeted goods - Jewellery being one.

- There are no terms that could be remotely described as hatred or as inciting hatred used in this example you have given us.

3. try your best to limit your interaction with thais to controlled situation (buying food, going to work if an expat, etc. Try not to have too many thai people in your life as it increases your risk)

Again, speaks volumes about the persons own fears and misunderstandings but there is no hatred in what has been said. - There are no terms that could be remotely described as hatred or as inciting hatred used in this example you have given us.

End quote.

If they gave awards for hating posts the above would be close to the top. The above is a prescription for damaging any hope of relationships with Thais.

I have tried to answer your questions about haters fairly and without malice and I just scratched the surface of a normal few days postings. The dislike is really intense. I have never seen it on another forum. And I'm really at a loss to explain why they stay. I sure would have left a long time ago. Can you imagine the bars of hate in the self imposed jail the above poster puts himself behind every day?

Now if you had evidence of people saying stuff like:

Thai People are (offensively derogatory term) that would constitute hate speech.

But to express one's own fears of cultural difference, or one's own misunderstanding, no matter how extreme is nothing more than fear and misunderstanding.

Which then begs the question why label that which is so clearly not hatred as hatred?

You've almost joined the ranks of that hated 'Political Correctness'.... a bit more effort and you'll be there.

[GuestHouse]

Can you imagine the bars of hate in the self imposed jail the above poster puts himself behind every day?

I get an idea when I read people ranting about other people expressing other people expressing opinions about life in Thailand that they don't like to hear.

I'm left thinking, why not simply get out of bed and enjoy your own day - exactly how you find it, good, bad or indifferent - un-solid by the opinions of others.

This should be all the easier when those opinions are so far removed from your own experience.

Live your own life - not theirs.

[thailiketoo]

Now if you had evidence of people saying stuff like:

Thai People are (offensively derogatory term) that would constitute hate speech.

But to express one's own fears of cultural difference, or one's own misunderstanding, no matter how extreme is nothing more than fear and misunderstanding.

Which then begs the question why label that which is so clearly not hatred as hatred?

You've almost joined the ranks of that hated 'Political Correctness'.... a bit more effort and you'll be there.

I think we have a difference of opinion on what constitutes hate speech. Might I suggest a compromise definition? How about, " slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand?" I'm not a Thai apologist. I will be happy to change my posts to reflect that I don't like people who post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand. Does that work for you?

So how would you evaluate the following, " Thais are about as bigotted and racist a culture as it gets. poppng pimples - gawd that one is as nasty as it gets, too. Vanity and grossness rolled into one. Gawd just.... disgusting. Thais throw trash everywhere and pick their noses and have a serious hygiene deficiency. she is a moron, apparently, or insipid, or both. Seems to be a national condition. Note how the walls in their homes are black filthy or covered with pink mold."

End of quote

??

Edited May 13, 2014 by thailiketoo

[GuestHouse]

Now if you had evidence of people saying stuff like:

Thai People are (offensively derogatory term) that would constitute hate speech.

But to express one's own fears of cultural difference, or one's own misunderstanding, no matter how extreme is nothing more than fear and misunderstanding.

Which then begs the question why label that which is so clearly not hatred as hatred?

You've almost joined the ranks of that hated 'Political Correctness'.... a bit more effort and you'll be there.

I think we have a difference of opinion on what constitutes hate speech. Might I suggest a compromise definition? How about, " slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand?" I'm not a Thai apologist. I will be happy to change my posts to reflect that I don't like people who post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand. Does that work for you?

How about we agree on what is written in the ThaiVisa Forum Rules - The report button is there for your use if you feel they are being broken.

You might not get to feed your passion for telling others the limits of their freedom to think differently from you, but you'll spend less time posting on the topic (How many posts in this thread alone?) and you'll therefore have more time to enjoy your time out, about in Thailand and away from the computer screen.

[thailiketoo]

Can you imagine the bars of hate in the self imposed jail the above poster puts himself behind every day?

I get an idea when I read people ranting about other people expressing other people expressing opinions about life in Thailand that they don't like to hear.

I'm left thinking, why not simply get out of bed and enjoy your own day - exactly how you find it, good, bad or indifferent - un-solid by the opinions of others.

This should be all the easier when those opinions are so far removed from your own experience.

Live your own life - not theirs.

Then why did you comment? Why not live your own life not mine? No offense. But seems a bit like the pot calling the kettle black.

[GuestHouse]

Then why did you comment? Why not live your own life not mine? No offense. But seems a bit like the pot calling the kettle black.

Because there is a distinct difference between our two positions:

If I see hate speech I report it using the report function provided, and in my report I state why I have made my report. - End of story.

You, and you are not alone in this, shout down people expressing views you simply don't like and in doing so you restrict other members expressing their frustrations about life in Thailand within one of the only forums open for them to do so.

No fair minded person can possibly claim that life in Thailand is a bed of roses, there are real problems with life in Thailand that expats face on a daily basis, some trivial, some very serious.

The more an expat commits to life in Thailand the more these problems can become something they need to discuss.

A parent of a young child who can only afford local Thai schooling, is of course going to be concerned about educational standards in schools.

A parent who's child is injured at at Thai schools is of course going to concerned about safety at that school - if faced with denial and dodging responsibility from the staff, of course that parent is going to be concerned about accountability.

The list goes on, doing business in Thailand, building a home in Thailand, relationships in Thailand, getting involved with the law in Thailand.

Real concerns of real people.

If you feel a comment is breaking the rules - report it.

But please don't profess to be the arbiter of what other expats can and cannot say about life in Thailand. By doing so you are doing a expats who trying their best to make a good life in Thailand a disservice - denying them the opportunity to express frustrations about a place they have committed to, may be raising a family (perhaps raising other people's children) - people make the best of life in a place they very likely love.

Because with commitment comes a sense of ownership, belonging and responsibility - the faults start to matter.

These are the people you are denying a voice.

Pay them less attention and live you own life. You'll be doing them and yourself a favour.

Edited May 13, 2014 by GuestHouse

[EBlair48]

Now if you had evidence of people saying stuff like:

Thai People are (offensively derogatory term) that would constitute hate speech.

But to express one's own fears of cultural difference, or one's own misunderstanding, no matter how extreme is nothing more than fear and misunderstanding.

Which then begs the question why label that which is so clearly not hatred as hatred?

You've almost joined the ranks of that hated 'Political Correctness'.... a bit more effort and you'll be there.

I think we have a difference of opinion on what constitutes hate speech. Might I suggest a compromise definition? How about, " slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand?" I'm not a Thai apologist. I will be happy to change my posts to reflect that I don't like people who post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand. Does that work for you?

So how would you evaluate the following, " Thais are about as bigotted and racist a culture as it gets. poppng pimples - gawd that one is as nasty as it gets, too. Vanity and grossness rolled into one. Gawd just.... disgusting. Thais throw trash everywhere and pick their noses and have a serious hygiene deficiency. she is a moron, apparently, or insipid, or both. Seems to be a national condition. Note how the walls in their homes are black filthy or covered with pink mold."

End of quote

??

Hate speech is certainly subjective, and varies. I consider " Time to kill all the ..... " to be the definition of hate speech.

However I think if someone wants to say that, they should, all views should be allowed, or else political correctness seeps in and before you know it, we cannot discuss whether or not different races have reall differences aside form skin colour, breast size ear wax consistency, etc etc etc

My comments re Thais are valid personal observations of everyday occurences, which I find offensive, grotesque, etc etc and delight in sharing with others, many of whom showed their appreciation and amusement in the subject.

You think obsessive popping of pimples and food and beverage workers picking boogers is cute , by all means defend it.

Where I'm from, bartenders who visibly booger over lime wedges get fired for health reasons.

Just a different culture, certainly worthy of discussion.

And why I personally continue to reside here is not up for discussion and just another ploy to cover up for no argument.

Frankly I find those who disallow comments to be lacking any real defense. If a view is unpopular , let the reader dismiss it, it's just fascism to not allow a view- any view. for example, I strongly disagree with Germany's effort to suppress halocaust deniers - let the public reject views it finds offensive.

Censorship is the rotten fruit of the political correctness tree.

[thailiketoo]

Now if you had evidence of people saying stuff like:

Thai People are (offensively derogatory term) that would constitute hate speech.

But to express one's own fears of cultural difference, or one's own misunderstanding, no matter how extreme is nothing more than fear and misunderstanding.

Which then begs the question why label that which is so clearly not hatred as hatred?

You've almost joined the ranks of that hated 'Political Correctness'.... a bit more effort and you'll be there.

I think we have a difference of opinion on what constitutes hate speech. Might I suggest a compromise definition? How about, " slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand?" I'm not a Thai apologist. I will be happy to change my posts to reflect that I don't like people who post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand. Does that work for you?

So how would you evaluate the following, " Thais are about as bigotted and racist a culture as it gets. poppng pimples - gawd that one is as nasty as it gets, too. Vanity and grossness rolled into one. Gawd just.... disgusting. Thais throw trash everywhere and pick their noses and have a serious hygiene deficiency. she is a moron, apparently, or insipid, or both. Seems to be a national condition. Note how the walls in their homes are black filthy or covered with pink mold."

End of quote

??

Hate speech is certainly subjective, and varies. I consider " Time to kill all the ..... " to be the definition of hate speech.

However I think if someone wants to say that, they should, all views should be allowed, or else political correctness seeps in and before you know it, we cannot discuss whether or not different races have reall differences aside form skin colour, breast size ear wax consistency, etc etc etc

My comments re Thais are valid personal observations of everyday occurences, which I find offensive, grotesque, etc etc and delight in sharing with others, many of whom showed their appreciation and amusement in the subject.

You think obsessive popping of pimples and food and beverage workers picking boogers is cute , by all means defend it.

Where I'm from, bartenders who visibly booger over lime wedges get fired for health reasons.

Just a different culture, certainly worthy of discussion.

And why I personally continue to reside here is not up for discussion and just another ploy to cover up for no argument.

Frankly I find those who disallow comments to be lacking any real defense. If a view is unpopular , let the reader dismiss it, it's just fascism to not allow a view- any view. for example, I strongly disagree with Germany's effort to suppress halocaust deniers - let the public reject views it finds offensive.

Censorship is the rotten fruit of the political correctness tree.

Do you feel I have shouted you down or denied you a voice?