Beer In Asia Is Fine I Dont Know What U Are Talking About

[ayakiawe]

'No trouble brewing,' beer industry insists

By Zhang Feng (China Daily)

China's beer industry, the most prolific in the world, yesterday struck back at reports that 95 per cent of domestically bottled beer contains formaldehyde.

The chemical, famously used to preserve Damian Hirst's controversial dead cows and known to cause cancer, does play a part in the brewing process, but does not pose a threat to public safety, Xiao Derun, director of the beer branch of the China Alcoholic Drinks Industry Association, told China Daily yesterday.

for the rest go to

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2...tent_460109.htm

[Hans Brix]

Some interesting bits on formaldehyde:

Chang like all Thai domestically brewed beers contains Formaline, a mixture of Formaldehyde and Glycerine which actually makes buzzed rather than pissed. You can remove it by tipping the chang upside down into a glass of water, holding the neck below the rim. Then watch as the Formaline sinks out into the water, it looks awful and in fact is. What you are left with a cleaner tasting Chang, the one that won awards abroad because Formaline is not put into the stuff they export to Australia etc, it's illegal. Those professing undying love for this beer, needed to know that. I like it, but in moderation, it makes a mighty hangover.

Konrad Stalin

http://www.bottledbeer.co.uk/index.html?beerid=924

Scroll down this next link to see a few tid bits

http://www.funkyguide.com/beer.htm

The sharp pains in the head you get from a "Changover" suggest that it is not dehydration that is the root cause but perhaps a special added ingredient. If you drink a warm Chang then it will taste vastly different from a well-chilled Chang. It has been suggested that the reason for this is formaldehyde. God only knows why they add it but every brewery in Thailand seems to find it necessary to add it in varying quantities to every beer they make. I really don’t know if it is done for cost factors or if they just think that is how beer is made but it has to be said that despite the added ingredient the beer is fantastically successful.

http://beerasia.blogspot.com/

[meadish_sweetball]

Still no more hard proof of Thai beers actually containing formaldehyde at any detectable or dangerous level - just hearsay, it seems to me.

As for Chinese beer, note the very end of the article>

Xiao also pointed out that a market survey has shown the formaldehyde content of imported beer to be similar to that of the domestically produced beverage.

Not that I know if he was just trying to justify the use - nor do we know what market survey he is talking about, and indeed how a 'market survey' could tell us any scientific facts... but note that the actual fermentation process of beer naturally produces a bit of formaldehyde...

[Kan Win]

Still no more hard proof of Thai beers actually containing formaldehyde

So why am I always Pickled and Preserved then ?

Edited June 13, 2006 by Kan Win

[tutsiwarrior]

I was in PRC about 15 years ago and the beer was excellent...each province considers their brew to be better than the next...

I was in Chanchun in Jilin province and during a delay/repite before boarding the train to Heilongiang province was given the 'pepsi test' by local engineers. Well...one was dry and the other a bit sweet ('well...which is it? they demanded)...I like my beer a bit dry, I said...Harbin won...and there was grumbling and threatening behavior all around...

(this was after lunch when I queried the preparation of the duck dish that was excellent...there were almost fisticufs...some saying to be deep fried first and others saying that full roasting could only produce the proper result...)

a most remakable business trip (2 times...once in dead of winter and the other in the glorious chinese springtime)

when I returned to Brighton I only wanted noodles, rice and stir fried ingredients...my then wife at the time made slitty eyed mockery and danced around and said 'an I bet youl'd like to shag one ob dem slitty eyed ladies as well...'

she was right...

Edited June 13, 2006 by tutsiwarrior

[Richardj]

Some interesting bits on formaldehyde:

Chang like all Thai domestically brewed beers contains Formaline, a mixture of Formaldehyde and Glycerine which actually makes buzzed rather than pissed. You can remove it by tipping the chang upside down into a glass of water, holding the neck below the rim. Then watch as the Formaline sinks out into the water, it looks awful and in fact is. What you are left with a cleaner tasting Chang, the one that won awards abroad because Formaline is not put into the stuff they export to Australia etc, it's illegal. Those professing undying love for this beer, needed to know that. I like it, but in moderation, it makes a mighty hangover.

Konrad Stalin

http://www.bottledbeer.co.uk/index.html?beerid=924

Scroll down this next link to see a few tid bits

http://www.funkyguide.com/beer.htm

The sharp pains in the head you get from a "Changover" suggest that it is not dehydration that is the root cause but perhaps a special added ingredient. If you drink a warm Chang then it will taste vastly different from a well-chilled Chang. It has been suggested that the reason for this is formaldehyde. God only knows why they add it but every brewery in Thailand seems to find it necessary to add it in varying quantities to every beer they make. I really don’t know if it is done for cost factors or if they just think that is how beer is made but it has to be said that despite the added ingredient the beer is fantastically successful.

http://beerasia.blogspot.com/

I often have the opportunity to chat with the head of production of Chang (I work for ThaiBev), and the issue of the foreign perception of Thai beer often comes up after I read a beer blog somewhere.

He says categorically that formalin or formaldehyde is not used in Chang beers, but yet the myth persists. I have seen a comparative list of the congeners (chemicals that cause hangovers and commonly found in all beers) in best-selling beers available in Thailand, and Chang comes in with among the lowest amount of congeners per volume. In fact, many beers that foreigners regard as "super premium" by looking at the brand name sometimes have higher concentrations.

I believe one of the reasons some people complain about getting hangovers from Chang (I only drink two bottles Friday nights and wake up Saturday afternoon sans hangover) is that they don't understand that drinking four or five bottles of beer that is 6.4% alcohol will give you a hangover much worse than the equivalent of 3-4% alcohol due to the increased dehydration.

I also feel that there is a perception that if beer is cheap, it has something wrong with it. Take away the label and very few people can tell the difference between cheap and expensive lager beers. You may say this is not true, but then in blind taste tests conducted by the Australian Institute of Beer Awards, Chang and Archa have been able to beat the best lagers in the world to grasp gold medals in 1998 and 2007 respectively? The company also did its own blind taste tests in the UK and Chang did very well compared to other lagers there.

Comments come after looking at the label I suppose. Certainly, of the 14 brew masters (brewers trained in Denmark, Germany or the UK as part of a standard course) in Thailand, 13 of them are with Chang.

I know that someone is bound to ask the Chang people to publish a list of the beers that contain higher concentrations of congeners, or even formaldehyde, but that is not an ethical alternative for any company, so the myth is bound to continue until someone with an independent lab does his own analysis.

[ricklev]

"Chang and Archa have been able to beat the best lagers in the world to grasp gold medals in 1998 and 2007 respectively?"

Well, sort of....... http://www.beerawards.com/pdfs/2007_beer_catalogue.pdf

Edited July 31, 2007 by ricklev

[threelegcowboy]

This beer that I had in China was the best I ever had. No Joke. Served cold. I just had to take a picture because I knew I would never recognize it otherwise.

LLL

[Lite Beer]

This beer that I had in China was the best I ever had. No Joke. Served cold. I just had to take a picture because I knew I would never recognize it otherwise.

LLL

Probably even better standing up

[ricklev]

I see that Cheers beer won a silver medal in the Australian Institute of Beer Awards "competition"! Must be one of the best beers in the world.

Edited July 31, 2007 by ricklev

[jackspratt]

This beer that I had in China was the best I ever had. No Joke. Served cold.

I also have fond memories of beer drinking in China 5 or so years ago. While living in Beijing I could buy a crate (24 bottles x 660ml) of the local Beijing brew (Yan Jing) for about 36 yuan (at the time, US$4, Oz$8, TBH240). Worked out at about 33 cents (Oz) (TBH10) per bottle, which meant I could not afford NOT to drink it.

It came in both brown and green bottles, and the standing joke amongst the local expats was that you got a different brew in every bottle. It certainly felt that way - you could drink the same number of bottles on different days, and get totally different effects, both at the time, and the following morning.

[kmart]

This beer that I had in China was the best I ever had. No Joke. Served cold.

I also have fond memories of beer drinking in China 5 or so years ago. While living in Beijing I could buy a crate (24 bottles x 660ml) of the local Beijing brew (Yan Jing) for about 36 yuan (at the time, US$4, Oz$8, TBH240). Worked out at about 33 cents (Oz) (TBH10) per bottle, which meant I could not afford NOT to drink it.

It came in both brown and green bottles, and the standing joke amongst the local expats was that you got a different brew in every bottle. It certainly felt that way - you could drink the same number of bottles on different days, and get totally different effects, both at the time, and the following morning.

Was true about Singha Beer for a while too. Varying quality and alcohol content, but apparently they re-jigged the production process to make it more consistent. The Formalin "myth" refuses to go away, however...

[AlbertTatlockDeceased]

"I believe one of the reasons some people complain about getting hangovers from Chang (I only drink two bottles Friday nights and wake up Saturday afternoon sans hangover) is that they don't understand that drinking four or five bottles of beer that is 6.4% alcohol will give you a hangover much worse than the equivalent of 3-4% alcohol due to the increased dehydration."

Personally speaking, I think you just haven't practiced enough, 2 bottles on a Friday is simply not enough to let your immune system bui

d up enough Chang antibodies to counteract the reaction. - May I suggest at least 4 bottles a night, chilled to freezing almost, for a per

od of say 5 to 10 years should have you rising right as rain the following morni

g - hangover free!

and, the wonderful feeling around 4 in the afternoon as you anticipate another b

oster of anti virus in the fridge.

 I find 5 bottles of Chang a day is probabbly the best, no problems with hangovers whatsoever, after many years of practice, they don't exist anymore, completely immune!

Unfortunately, even though I have attempted over the past few years, to boost my immunity to a couple of other Thai beverages, namely Lao Kao and Lao Dong, the human body as far as I can see is unable to produce significant ammounts of antibodies to neutralize these toxins, and the virus usually persits for most part of the next day and well into the afternoon, and the only way to relieve the symptoms is to take a four bottle Chang booster, which usually does the trick as it immediately counteracts their negative effects.

I would be interested if anyone has experienced this immunity with large volume consumption of Thai wines?, until I was recently corrected by a Thai friend, I had been using them incorrectly, silly me, I had been using them to strip varnish from my table. However, from the bouquet of one bottle of Lam Yai wine, I think my Thai friend is incorrect, not me! did a ###### good job on the polyurethane!

[a2396]

I still like Beer Lao. I think it has the best qualities I prefer & no bitter, sticky aftertaste.

[swain]

Some interesting bits on formaldehyde:

Chang like all Thai domestically brewed beers contains Formaline, a mixture of Formaldehyde and Glycerine which actually makes buzzed rather than pissed. You can remove it by tipping the chang upside down into a glass of water, holding the neck below the rim. Then watch as the Formaline sinks out into the water, it looks awful and in fact is. What you are left with a cleaner tasting Chang, the one that won awards abroad because Formaline is not put into the stuff they export to Australia etc, it's illegal. Those professing undying love for this beer, needed to know that. I like it, but in moderation, it makes a mighty hangover.

Konrad Stalin

http://www.bottledbeer.co.uk/index.html?beerid=924

Scroll down this next link to see a few tid bits

http://www.funkyguide.com/beer.htm

The sharp pains in the head you get from a "Changover" suggest that it is not dehydration that is the root cause but perhaps a special added ingredient. If you drink a warm Chang then it will taste vastly different from a well-chilled Chang. It has been suggested that the reason for this is formaldehyde. God only knows why they add it but every brewery in Thailand seems to find it necessary to add it in varying quantities to every beer they make. I really don’t know if it is done for cost factors or if they just think that is how beer is made but it has to be said that despite the added ingredient the beer is fantastically successful.

http://beerasia.blogspot.com/

I often have the opportunity to chat with the head of production of Chang (I work for ThaiBev), and the issue of the foreign perception of Thai beer often comes up after I read a beer blog somewhere.

He says categorically that formalin or formaldehyde is not used in Chang beers, but yet the myth persists. I have seen a comparative list of the congeners (chemicals that cause hangovers and commonly found in all beers) in best-selling beers available in Thailand, and Chang comes in with among the lowest amount of congeners per volume. In fact, many beers that foreigners regard as "super premium" by looking at the brand name sometimes have higher concentrations.

I believe one of the reasons some people complain about getting hangovers from Chang (I only drink two bottles Friday nights and wake up Saturday afternoon sans hangover) is that they don't understand that drinking four or five bottles of beer that is 6.4% alcohol will give you a hangover much worse than the equivalent of 3-4% alcohol due to the increased dehydration.

I also feel that there is a perception that if beer is cheap, it has something wrong with it. Take away the label and very few people can tell the difference between cheap and expensive lager beers. You may say this is not true, but then in blind taste tests conducted by the Australian Institute of Beer Awards, Chang and Archa have been able to beat the best lagers in the world to grasp gold medals in 1998 and 2007 respectively? The company also did its own blind taste tests in the UK and Chang did very well compared to other lagers there.

Comments come after looking at the label I suppose. Certainly, of the 14 brew masters (brewers trained in Denmark, Germany or the UK as part of a standard course) in Thailand, 13 of them are with Chang.

I know that someone is bound to ask the Chang people to publish a list of the beers that contain higher concentrations of congeners, or even formaldehyde, but that is not an ethical alternative for any company, so the myth is bound to continue until someone with an independent lab does his own analysis.

I agree absolutely... I love the taste of Chang beer, and can afford to drink more expensive beers. I never liked the coors, or buds of the western world. I love San Miguel beer, Myanmar beer, and Chang beer. These have always been my favorites with singha coming in fourth. Chang has a strong taste that I like and I think a re marketing of Chang beer is needed but I hope doesn't happen as I love how inexpensive it is. People don't know what they have until its gone. When I could find Chang in the states I would always buy alot of it at absurd prices. Now that I live in Chiang Mai, Chang beer is what I drink. But mostly not in public. I have gone out with my friends and they buy me a beer and ask me what I want and I ask for a Chang and they say dont worry about the price get what you want... embarrassing... so at home and when I dont have to put on airs Chang but when going out I switch to Asahi.

Edited August 1, 2007 by swain

[Austhaied]

I still like Beer Lao. I think it has the best qualities I prefer & no bitter, sticky aftertaste.

Agreed..Less of a hangover as well.

[traveling]

This beer that I had in China was the best I ever had. No Joke. Served cold.

Now, it has been changed.

[JimsKnight]

Yup, Chang is foul stuff, so is Singha too.

The Heineken is like rat pss; very watered down (even direct from the bottle.)

I go with Leo beer these days, good taste and just the right strength.

If not Leo then Sang Som Rum with coke

[stumonster]

Sang Som Rum

ah - the good old Sang Som num naa

in China I recommend small bottles of Snow Beer - its a mid strength 3.2% - very smooth drop . http://www.snowbeer.com.cn/

[madjbs]

Where can I buy British bottled ale in Bangkok? They have coopers brewed beer in Villa but it couldnt stand up to a British real ale and I never understood why they would brew a beer that is ment to be cloudy

Edited October 16, 2007 by madjbs

[saraburioz]

I'm looking for VB, the best beer in the world

[pampal]

Weizen beer at Tawandaeng is excellent

[Fred Sanford]

Yup, Chang is foul stuff, so is Singha too.

The Heineken is like rat pss; very watered down (even direct from the bottle.)

I go with Leo beer these days, good taste and just the right strength.

If not Leo then Sang Som Rum with coke

I must agree that beer available in Thailand is horrible but Leo is the best of the worst

[Thai Chi]

I'm looking for VB, the best beer in the world

I assume you are joking

[Pepe']

Yup, Chang is foul stuff, so is Singha too.

The Heineken is like rat pss; very watered down (even direct from the bottle.)

I go with Leo beer these days, good taste and just the right strength.

If not Leo then Sang Som Rum with coke

---------------

I always thought that Sang Som was total rot gut.

But there are also two different kinds, correct.

One is a white label and the other is slightly different and "higher quality.?"

I tasted it once, one drink. Didn't taste bad. My friend who has lived in LOS for many years said not to drink any more though...

[tuky]

Chang on ice is the beer of choice...

[duncaw]

Ever tried the "upside down Chang in the glass of water trick"?

Take your open bottle of Chang. Put your thumb over the neck. Turn it upside down and put into a glass of water.

Wait for a couple of minutes and watch the hideous brown gunk diffuse into the water.

The difficult bit is to then put your thumb back over the neck of the bottle of Chang and remove it from the glass of water.

Afterwards your bottle of Chang has a beautiful crisp taste and leaves you with no hangover - alcohol doesn't diffuse into the water before anyone claims this is the reason.

If you have the stomach for it, try drinking the water / brown gunk mix - I swear you will never drink Chang again!

This also works with Singha (and quite possibly all other locally brewed beers including Heineken / San Miguel)

(the above is best tried outdoors for the first time as you may otherwise annoy your local bar owner)

When you think about the crates of beer sitting around for weeks/months in ambient temperature in up-country stores the reason for putting large amounts of preservative into the beer seems obvious.

[PhilHarries]

I also have fond memories of beer drinking in China 5 or so years ago. While living in Beijing I could buy a crate (24 bottles x 660ml) of the local Beijing brew (Yan Jing) for about 36 yuan (at the time, US$4, Oz$8, TBH240). Worked out at about 33 cents (Oz) (TBH10) per bottle, which meant I could not afford NOT to drink it.

It came in both brown and green bottles, and the standing joke amongst the local expats was that you got a different brew in every bottle. It certainly felt that way - you could drink the same number of bottles on different days, and get totally different effects, both at the time, and the following morning.

Same here in central VN though a bit more expensive, my beer of choice is Bia Saigon which costs 8000VND per 460ml bottle (25 cents US) at the hotel bar, cheaper over the road. However the price doubles if you go to the tourist places like Hoi An.

btw, I've never been to China but have been told by some that have lived and worked there that the bottle colour indicates whether it's new or recycled glass (nobody can remember which is which).

[jayjayjayjay]

Still no more hard proof of Thai beers actually containing formaldehyde at any detectable or dangerous level - just hearsay, it seems to me.

As for Chinese beer, note the very end of the article>

Xiao also pointed out that a market survey has shown the formaldehyde content of imported beer to be similar to that of the domestically produced beverage.

Not that I know if he was just trying to justify the use - nor do we know what market survey he is talking about, and indeed how a 'market survey' could tell us any scientific facts... but note that the actual fermentation process of beer naturally produces a bit of formaldehyde...

While working it the chemical additives industry (USA) in 1998, regulation were dropped preventing formaldehyde being used in foods. I was working in animal foods but as far as I recall this applied to human ingredients as well. The bottom line is after years of testing the FDA could NOT prove that formaldehyde had any negative affects on the general population(cancer included). I do take sides on the arguement, but I dont want to be eating or drinking it either..... This was just fact!

[rixalex]

Have had a love-hate relationship with Leo beer for the last five or six years. Love the way it tastes and appreciate its value for money, but hate the occasional curve ball it throws me in terms of hangovers. Last week i swore i'd never drink another bottle after i had the mother of headaches for an entire day after an evening drinking two solitary bottles. Throughout our relationship, Leo has done this to me on occasion, but of late seems more frequent and i'm just getting tired of having an old mate stab me in the back (or head to me more appropriate!)

I can forget Chang or Singha - hate the taste of both and absolutely guaranteed a hangover.

Not that keen on the taste of Heineken either to be honest, but looks like i'll be giving it a shot as don't know there's much in the way of alternative (sobriety not being an option!).