Hardware House (HWH)

[gdhm]

Hoping somebody can advise me.

I took a Silverstone Strider Gold (80plus Gold) Model SST-ST75F-GPSU on a 3 year warranty back to the Hardware House shop in Khon Kaen, (Tukom 3rd Floor (Kosa Centre Mall ) today as it had blown only 2 years 3 months into its warranty.

The shop had closed down as were the other HWH areas at the same Mall (also gone at Central Plaza Khon Kaen)

My wife phoned the HWH Service Centre Bangkok and the girl seemed to be deliberately not understanding where the branch address was that bought the PSU from and then cut my wife off 3 times and then somehow changed the number to an out of order sound.

We phoned HWH HO and were passed around to 3 differetn area before my wife was told HWH have closed down and she was given a number to phone but it is not answering.

Their service ticket number office is not responding either. However the website seems fully up and running (http://www.hwhinter.com/index.php). They do mention on the site they needed to close some shops.

Does anybody know anything about them and if they have ceased trading or are just tryign to avoid their warranty responsibilities

AND if closed down does anybody know who I can contact in Thailand (ideally Khon Kaen) that services Silverstone's warranty repairs or even can repair it properly

I paid ฿ึ7,000 for this high quality PSU (had great reviews) and it lasted a little over 2years before going BANG. Luckily for me upon installing an old almost unused PSU I know it is the only thing that is affected. I'm very sisappointed that such a we ll respected Brand should fail so quickly especially as our electrcial supply is good AND I have a APC Back-UPS RS 1100 Un-Interruptible Power Supply protecting the PC, Monitor and modem which is a High Spec unit.

Many thanks all

Edited May 16, 2014 by gdhm

[IMHO]

Have you tried the TH distributor for Silverstone? Assumedly, they would be the ones to honor the warranty, not the retailer (HWH): http://www.silverstonetek.com/wheretobuy.php?wname=thai&area=en

[gdhm]

Have you tried the TH distributor for Silverstone? Assumedly, they would be the ones to honor the warranty, not the retailer (HWH): http://www.silverstonetek.com/wheretobuy.php?wname=thai&area=en

Thanks for trying to help IMHO. Regretfully that link was the second I tried, but unfortunately it only quotes non Thailand addresses and phone numbers. I have not been able to find who is the Thailand distributor for Silverstone so I can ask how I get my PSU repaired.

The site does give several retailers in Thailand but I know they will only be interested in good bought directly from them. Normally I like to buy from J.I.B who I find reliable, helpful and with some of the cheapest prices. Unfortunately although mentioned by Silverstone I have never seen them sell Silverstone PSUs, otherwise I would have purchased it from them (even if needing ordering)

It amazes how difficult trying to find a simple contact in Thailand is (not only in this instance).

I could email but we all know how often emails are answered here

.

Kind Regards

[RichCor]

As IMHO says, why not contact Silverstone directly, especially so if HWH is being evasive -- if they HWH gave you an RMA# you'd probably never see the item ever again.

Silverstone Technology

Warranty Conditions | Contact Us | Where to Buy THAILAND

A third alternative: I see that InvadeIT and J.I.B. is on their list... Try contacting one of them and ask for a company contact for warranty repair. Hopefully you still have the original purchase receipt or this could be a frustrating trip.

[IMHO]

Have you tried the TH distributor for Silverstone? Assumedly, they would be the ones to honor the warranty, not the retailer (HWH): http://www.silverstonetek.com/wheretobuy.php?wname=thai&area=en

Thanks for trying to help IMHO. Regretfully that link was the second I tried, but unfortunately it only quotes non Thailand addresses and phone numbers. I have not been able to find who is the Thailand distributor for Silverstone so I can ask how I get my PSU repaired.

The site does give several retailers in Thailand but I know they will only be interested in good bought directly from them. Normally I like to buy from J.I.B who I find reliable, helpful and with some of the cheapest prices. Unfortunately although mentioned by Silverstone I have never seen them sell Silverstone PSUs, otherwise I would have purchased it from them (even if needing ordering)

It amazes how difficult trying to find a simple contact in Thailand is (not only in this instance).

I could email but we all know how often emails are answered here

.

Kind Regards

Neloution are the Silverstone distibutor for TH... says so right on the link I gave you

Contact them here: http://www.neolutiongroup.com/th/contact-us/

[JSixpack]

FWIW, lady who had worked at HH Tukcom Pattaya, and moved to another shop across the aisle when her branch closed, said the whole company was shutting down.

[gdhm]

Thanks All for the interest and advice its very much appreciated.

JSixpack: Thanks for the confirmation . This what I was hearing here in Khon Kaen but I was not sure if they were ceasing completely or just dealing in online trading in future . I will not waste any more time on them.

IMHO: I appreciate you following up on my second post. I did access the Neloution site before posting but was not sure. I searched their database and they only seemed to sell one Silverstone PSU model so I thought that they cannot be a full distributor or they would offer many more Models I probably confused myself. Anyway I will ask my wife to ring them for me and If they have an English speaker I will take over the call.

Richcore: you must be a mind reader as I had decided to go to JIB (If I did not get better info from this site) and see if they have a contact. I do note they do not (in store or online) advertise they sell ANY Silverstone PSUs currently nor for a long time. Nevertheless I always have found them helpful and I believe they will be happy to give me contact details if they still have them.. If not I can try invade if IMHO's info of Neloution being the Silverstone distributor for Thailand.

I am really surprised how unreliable PSUs are. I don't know if it is the hot climate here in Thailand that is to blame.

The better, more costly Brands may supply better protection and cleaner and more accurate voltages but they seem just likely to pop as your ฿350+ run of the mill PSUs. Currently I am using a Raidmax RX-730SS which cost ฿2020 in Jan 2012 (3 yr warranty from Banana IT (and I later readon the net is not regarded as one of the more reliable brands (few seem to really like/agree on any Brand). The Raidmax popped after only 8 weeks and needed a warranty repair. It has lasted 2 days so far but I am not confident (but I still have 7 months warranty left)

I accept members here may be wondering how come 2 more expensive PSUs have popped with my PC and all I can say is that my power supply is pretty good and my Quite High spec PC is ALWAYS protected by my APC un-interruptable Power supply - so it REALLY IS down to the PSUs themselves.

Does anybody know whether a local repair is a realistic option? I suspect whoever accepts (if anybody) the repair under warranty I am going to be told I must send it to Bangkok which will not be cheap.

If a local PSU repair is usually easy and reliable (change a few capacitors etc) then maybe that is a good option or is it much more complicated than that.

Does anybody have an opinion on a reliable Brand? I am thinking of maybe Corsair. I use around 730 Watts models currently. I suspect I could use smaller but have read that in hot climates PSUs do not give full watts when hot and on for hours so I have played safe.

Popping is NOT the worst problem I am fully capable of changing a PSU but I worry the rest of the PC may be taken out when a PSU pops or is that rare due to PSU internal safeguard/protection circuitry?

Kind Regards

Dave

[guzzi850m2]

If two good quality PSU's have busted in your PC are you sure they are not too small for your use and run heavy loaded?

Perhaps a +1000W PSU will be better and yes hot climate are not improving performance at all and they run hotter as well so therefore having a PSU with lots of extra power makes sense.

Do you have a good case with ample airflow and are intakes/exhausts clean and is the case correct placed, not on the floor or too close to a wall? Case Fans running and set up correctly?

Edited May 18, 2014 by guzzi850m2

[RichCor]

According to Silverstone literature, your PSU is "Active PFC" which requires Pure Sinewave current.

I'm wondering if your APC Back-UPS RS 1100 lack of Line Conditioning, AVR (automatic voltage regulation), or its Stepped/modified Sine Wave output was directly responsible for the capacitor blowing in your PSU.

Just a thought.

[IMHO]

1000 watts PSU for a computer? Did I just time warp back to the year 2000?

It must be absolutely astonishing if it requires >10x the power of what a top-end notebook needs, I can also say I'm glad I don't pay your electricity bill .... @ 1 unit/hr such a machine costs around 3000 Baht/mth just in electricity.. in less than 3 years the energy usage overhead alone could pay for a top-end MBP retina

[guzzi850m2]

1000 watts PSU for a computer? Did I just time warp back to the year 2000?

It must be absolutely astonishing if it requires >10x the power of what a top-end notebook needs, I can also say I'm glad I don't pay your electricity bill .... @ 1 unit/hr such a machine costs around 3000 Baht/mth just in electricity.. in less than 3 years the energy usage overhead alone could pay for a top-end MBP retina

Well we don't know what he have inside the PC do we? Some runs 2 graphics cards and 2 or 3 hard drives.

http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-1813487/fractal-design-newton-1000w-run-6950-7950.html

A PSU will only draw the power it needs and a top game rig will pull a lot during heavy gaming that is graphics demanding and video editing too can be very power consuming.

We are talking peak power, when running not gaming/not video editing it will be much lower and thus much lower power consumsion.

Some PSU's are rated for 30 deg/C and some 50 deg/C.

Just for your info: I pay around 5000 baht per month in electricity bill for a fair sized house, A/C's running a lot here in the hot season.

[IMHO]

1000 watts PSU for a computer? Did I just time warp back to the year 2000?

It must be absolutely astonishing if it requires >10x the power of what a top-end notebook needs, I can also say I'm glad I don't pay your electricity bill .... @ 1 unit/hr such a machine costs around 3000 Baht/mth just in electricity.. in less than 3 years the energy usage overhead alone could pay for a top-end MBP retina

Well we don't know what he have inside the PC do we? Some runs 2 graphics cards and 2 or 3 hard drives.

http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-1813487/fractal-design-newton-1000w-run-6950-7950.html

A PSU will only draw the power it needs and a top game rig will pull a lot during heavy gaming that is graphics demanding and video editing too can be very power consuming.

We are talking peak power, when running not gaming/not video editing it will be much lower and thus much lower power consumsion.

Some PSU's are rated for 30 deg/C and some 50 deg/C.

Just for your info: I pay around 5000 baht per month in electricity bill for a fair sized house, A/C's running a lot here in the hot season.

Oh, Tom's Hardware still exists? - I remember that site from the days of overlocking Celerons

I haven't used a desktop since Nvidia released their first laptop video card (geforce2go), and I haven't played games on a PC since PS3 (now with PS4 brother)

[JSixpack]

Does anybody have an opinion on a reliable Brand? I am thinking of maybe Corsair.

Busitek is known for selling quality products, and here's their list:

http://www.busitek.com/page/pricelist.html#psu

Seasonic gets the most love of any brand.

As for Corsair, get the CXM series; JIB has a 500W

http://www.jib.co.th/web/index.php/product/readProduct/11460/6/index.html

Check at one of the online PSU capacity calculators and find out how much wattage you need really. I wouldn't buy above that unless you have a big expansion plan. Lots of hobbyists have far more than they need.

Before buying, check the reviews. Of course the newegg.com user reviews, but better an in-depth review that opens up the PSU and delves inside. For example,

http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/psu/55065-corsair-cx-series-modular-cx600m-atx-power-supply/

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Corsair/CX600M/4.html

Note how these reviews find that the capacitors in the CXM series are better than the Chinese Samxon used otherwise:

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story4&reid=214

Final thoughts: Raidmax is coming up in the world, but ain't there yet. Friend of mine had a Raidmax quickly fail on him, too. However, one model, forget which, has one of the top review ratings on newegg. Go figure. I wouldn't buy one myself.

So the Raidmax failure might have been expected, but not the Silverstone. Still, even the best brand has its lemons. I do see cheap models and no-names failing at a much higher rate than the big names. My old PC Power & Cooling PSU, not that great, chugged along happily for years as my neighbor replaced 3 or 4 B400 units he congratulated himself on finding at the local Tukcom.

You're right to be concerned that a power supply failure can take other components with it. It indeed can. Hence an investment in a high-quality PSU is absolutely worth it. I like saving a buck as well as the next guy, but I don't skimp on the PSU!

[gdhm]

next post applies

Edited May 19, 2014 by gdhm

[gdhm]

Hi all,

Once again thanks the input. I will try to give specific info and may those discussing wattage, running temperatures, UPS Sine wave and other

My system

I will try and make what I believe (from my level of understanding)

1. guzzi8850m2 feel sure with my set up (not using doubler graphic cards) that my PSU at 730/750 have a large surplus capacity. Hence why I am not concerned my UPS is rated 660W

2 The PC with Silverstone has run nearly every day for 8 hours plus (switched off at night) for 27 months without any issues until now. It popped when I shut down my PC and 1 minute later rebooted (had been running 8 hours ).

3. I do use Air cons at time but often not Ambient Room Temperature in the hottest days hit 33C like today (with aircon)

4. My PSU Specs: Nominal labelled power: 750 W continuous, 850 W peak at 40º C

in a full testing several years ago these were found so I do not believe overheating or power are an issue. In fact according to the tester the PSU would auto switch off as intended if risking overload. I appreciate the voltages are 115V whereas mine are 230V but the figures give the gist of the PSUs capabilities.

5. Forgive me Richcor, you obviously understand specs better than I do. Are you suggesting Silverstone PSUs (or my highly rated model are not supposed to work with possible the World leader in UPS. This seems incredible to me if so and how many users in the World would know that or buy a PSU that is UPS unfriendly

6. JSixpack thanks for your comments these confirm my beliefs mostly. I was aware of Seasonic being highly rated in US but have seen any sold in Thailand (I am not a lover of on-line shopping here, as too easy to avoid customers living in Khon Kaen and most work out of BKK and sending for repairs has costs and risk of damage and many firms are poor with emails.

7.IMHO. Yes I have noted video editing/heavy graphical games can use a lot of CPU power and massively heat up the CPU within minutes (my system only uses the Intel supplied CPU fan. Call me old fashioned but do not like idea of liquid cooling circulating around so much circuitry).

I think I have given info and details asked but please forgive if I have missed something.

Regards

Dave

[inthepink]

As IMHO says, why not contact Silverstone directly, especially so if HWH is being evasive -- if they HWH gave you an RMA# you'd probably never see the item ever again.

Silverstone Technology

Warranty Conditions | Contact Us | Where to Buy THAILAND

A third alternative: I see that InvadeIT and J.I.B. is on their list... Try contacting one of them and ask for a company contact for warranty repair. Hopefully you still have the original purchase receipt or this could be a frustrating trip.

I don't think a receipt will be needed. Whenever I have to return stuff these days they just input the serial number in their system and can check the purchase date themselves.

[RichCor]

As IMHO says, why not contact Silverstone directly, especially so if HWH is being evasive -- if they HWH gave you an RMA# you'd probably never see the item ever again.

Silverstone Technology

Warranty Conditions | Contact Us | Where to Buy THAILAND

A third alternative: I see that InvadeIT and J.I.B. is on their list... Try contacting one of them and ask for a company contact for warranty repair. Hopefully you still have the original purchase receipt or this could be a frustrating trip.

I don't think a receipt will be needed. Whenever I have to return stuff these days they just input the serial number in their system and can check the purchase date themselves.

I have no direct experience with Silverstone Technology product nor how they handle returned parts for repair -- I only included the Warranty Conditions link because item #5 stated the requirement for a sales receipt or invoice with clear indication of purchase date to determine warranty eligibility. If a warranty card was filled in and sent back it may also, as you indicate, be enough to fulfill the eligibility requirement.

[RichCor]

[...]

5. Forgive me Richcor, you obviously understand specs better than I do. Are you suggesting Silverstone PSUs (or my highly rated model are not supposed to work with possible the World leader in UPS. This seems incredible to me if so and how many users in the World would know that or buy a PSU that is UPS unfriendly

[...]

Regards

Dave

Not all UPS systems are alike, nor are all APC systems alike. If you look at the higher-end APC offerings you may notice that they offer more then just bigger batteries and multiple outlets. Whether the system is based on "on-line", "line-interactive" or "standby" can have a dramatic effect on how the PSU handles the transition of originating power source.

Also, here's some technical direction from APC regarding active PFC PSU.

APC APPLICATION NOTE # 147: UPS selection for servers with active PFC power supplies

[AnotherOneAmerican]

I always bought no-name PSUs for about 1,000bht.

Always worked perfectly, had to replace the fans a few times.

Branded PSUs seem to be a waste of money.

Why do you need more than 600W? the rest of your PC kit is pretty low end, low power.

Edited May 19, 2014 by AnotherOneAmerican

[inthepink]

As IMHO says, why not contact Silverstone directly, especially so if HWH is being evasive -- if they HWH gave you an RMA# you'd probably never see the item ever again.

Silverstone Technology

Warranty Conditions | Contact Us | Where to Buy THAILAND

A third alternative: I see that InvadeIT and J.I.B. is on their list... Try contacting one of them and ask for a company contact for warranty repair. Hopefully you still have the original purchase receipt or this could be a frustrating trip.

I don't think a receipt will be needed. Whenever I have to return stuff these days they just input the serial number in their system and can check the purchase date themselves.

I have no direct experience with Silverstone Technology product nor how they handle returned parts for repair -- I only included the Warranty Conditions link because item #5 stated the requirement for a sales receipt or invoice with clear indication of purchase date to determine warranty eligibility. If a warranty card was filled in and sent back it may also, as you indicate, be enough to fulfill the eligibility requirement.

Never filled a warranty card out in my life but with monitors and other IT equipment I've returned I haven't had a problem yet. I only mentioned it to point out that all may not be lost if the OP did not keep his receipt.

[RichCor]

I don't think a receipt will be needed. Whenever I have to return stuff these days they just input the serial number in their system and can check the purchase date themselves.

I have no direct experience with Silverstone Technology product nor how they handle returned parts for repair -- I only included the Warranty Conditions link because item #5 stated the requirement for a sales receipt or invoice with clear indication of purchase date to determine warranty eligibility. If a warranty card was filled in and sent back it may also, as you indicate, be enough to fulfill the eligibility requirement.

Never filled a warranty card out in my life but with monitors and other IT equipment I've returned I haven't had a problem yet. I only mentioned it to point out that all may not be lost if the OP did not keep his receipt.

If the OP were returning the part to HardWareHouse where he actually purchased it (as he initially wanted) that might have been true. But as HWH seems to have dropped him from their preferred customer list he is having to go outside of the direct return chain. I doubt very much that Silverstone, or even Neloution, their Thailand authorized distributor, will have any records beyond when that Serial Numbered device was shipped out of their warehouse.

Then again, I might be wrong and often am. Let's hope the OP is met with a "mai pen rai" and a wide smile when he finally finds someone to accept the PSU under warranty.

[gdhm]

I don't think a receipt will be needed. Whenever I have to return stuff these days they just input the serial number in their system and can check the purchase date themselves.

I have no direct experience with Silverstone Technology product nor how they handle returned parts for repair -- I only included the Warranty Conditions link because item #5 stated the requirement for a sales receipt or invoice with clear indication of purchase date to determine warranty eligibility. If a warranty card was filled in and sent back it may also, as you indicate, be enough to fulfill the eligibility requirement.

Never filled a warranty card out in my life but with monitors and other IT equipment I've returned I haven't had a problem yet. I only mentioned it to point out that all may not be lost if the OP did not keep his receipt.

If the OP were returning the part to HardWareHouse where he actually purchased it (as he initially wanted) that might have been true. But as HWH seems to have dropped him from their preferred customer list he is having to go outside of the direct return chain. I doubt very much that Silverstone, or even Neloution, their Thailand authorized distributor, will have any records beyond when that Serial Numbered device was shipped out of their warehouse.

Then again, I might be wrong and often am. Let's hope the OP is met with a "mai pen rai" and a wide smile when he finally finds someone to accept the PSU under warranty.

Actually Hardware House have not dropped me. They seem to have closed down all/most of their retail shops and say they are ceasing trading.

[gdhm]

[...]

5. Forgive me Richcor, you obviously understand specs better than I do. Are you suggesting Silverstone PSUs (or my highly rated model are not supposed to work with possible the World leader in UPS. This seems incredible to me if so and how many users in the World would know that or buy a PSU that is UPS unfriendly

[...]

Regards

Dave

Not all UPS systems are alike, nor are all APC systems alike. If you look at the higher-end APC offerings you may notice that they offer more then just bigger batteries and multiple outlets. Whether the system is based on "on-line", "line-interactive" or "standby" can have a dramatic effect on how the PSU handles the transition of originating power source.

Also, here's some technical direction from APC regarding active PFC PSU.

APC APPLICATION NOTE # 147: UPS selection for servers with active PFC power supplies

Hi RichCor,

Thanks again for your help and the APC notes which I will save for future use.

Please forgive my lack of knowledge which is clearly FAR BELOW yours on this subject

The info is way beyond my full understanding however the document seems to be saying

1) If Passive PSU (older type) then there is no issue.

2) If Active (most newer PSUs are) then under certain circumstances an Active PSU may send a surge to the UPS and in my case a cheaper APC UPS) which may trigger a protective UPS Shut down if overload too high.

In 27 months that has never happened and if it did surely that is not the end of the World except anything unsaved I was working on work (rare I am retired) would be lost. I note one scenario is that it is more liely if runnign on battery. Certainly here in Khon Kaen powercuts probably average 1 a month (more in Monsoon Season, less in hot season) but the UPS has always kicked in and if Power was not returned within 2-3 minutes I always do a controlled shutsown of PC

From what I can understand APC are NOT suggesting my UPS could damage my Silverstone or that my PSU could damage the APC UPS.

Is this your interpretation RichCor. If not I's greatly appreciate any concerns I should consider?

Is this your interpretation RichCor. If not I's greatly appreciate any concerns I should consider.

For info

When my PSU popped it did seem to affect my UPS which seemed to trip to Battery supply initially or behave as if it had auto shutdown temporarily. I am also suspicious whatever blew in the PSU may have damaged the power lead between PSU and UPS (has an earthed ground my house has all its wiring grounded. I replaced the lead as suspicious it was no longer 100% sound after the PSU popped.

The PSU popped after i had been using my PC for 8+ hours non stop and had installed software and decided to completely shut down PC and start up again (as against reboot without shutting down). I switched on on the PC walked and it started to boot up and I walked over to my Son & his PC (same room) approx 15-20 seconds after starting up my PC there was a loud pop/bang (and a smell of burning circuitry. I recognized the symptoms as a Blow PSU (from previous experience over the years). It seems normal powering up the PC (& PSU) found a fault and triggered the pop (as no indication of any problems previously and no smell of burning either).

If I buy a new PSU I could drop down its Wattage but I note PSUs do not just deliver the total wattage but have 1) maximums for the various connections AND 2) drop voltage when running hotter. I have looked at the sites that try to give guidance of wattage needs but was unable to be sure how much was definitely a safe wattage with a little to spare.

I certainly do not see me increasing consumption unless I was to add a 3rd internal hard-drive (which I may) or maybe memory (which I doubt)

Kind Regards

Dave

[RichCor]

[...] But as HWH seems to have dropped him from their preferred customer list he is having to go outside of the direct return chain. [...]

Actually Hardware House have not dropped me. They seem to have closed down all/most of their retail shops and say they are ceasing trading.

"...seems to have dropped him from their preferred customer list"

is a euphemism, a nice way of saying they will no longer commit any resources to make sure you remain a satisfied continuing customer and pass along that confidence to induce other people in your sphere of influence to also do business with them.

I'm apologize if I have offended you or implied that you were not worthy of being on a preferred list of a company seemingly going out of business. My imprecise wordplay with the English language was intended to be a funny contradiction to the actual situation.

[gdhm]

I always bought no-name PSUs for about 1,000bht.

Always worked perfectly, had to replace the fans a few times.

Branded PSUs seem to be a waste of money.

Why do you need more than 600W? the rest of your PC kit is pretty low end, low power.

OUCH!!!! that hit a raw nerve.

I honestly do not know what I need so I played safe with 730W rather than pay a lot and risk PSU shutitng down and overheating due to working falt out. Correct decision I honestly do not know AnotherOneAmerican

I must be Farang Ki Nok coz I did not consider my CPU, RAM, Motherboard, PSU & Graphics card "pretty low end" and certainly not 2½ years ago when selected the various components after much research (usually build my own PC but let JIB put it all together this time as the offered to do so). You say you always bought ฿1,000 PSU and you suggest my system is "pretty low end I do not understand the logic. May have worked perfectly but noisy failing fans are a nuisance and there is always a chance they will (unknown to the user) stick and fry the PSU.

Anyway I like my home PC, and not a Games machine or a server and its pretty fast. If yours and most others here have much better PCs then I am genuinely happy for you all.

I admit am not well off and my family comes first. My criteria when I upgraded from the one my 10 year old son now uses (low end and 7 years old) was one that it would be fast and capable enough that I would be happy with it for at least 5 years without feeling the frustration of wanting to get a faster one every time I used it. It meets that requirement very well in my opinion. Of course its not state of the art, (but how many people need that) but with all systems there is a point where you pay a fortune for each few percent points improvement.

For me the CPU speed and Ram were important and an adequate Graphics card that performed reasonably fast with large graphical games. It meets all my needs with flying colours (except the PSU )

Regards

Dave

Edited May 20, 2014 by gdhm

[gdhm]

[...] But as HWH seems to have dropped him from their preferred customer list he is having to go outside of the direct return chain. [...]

Actually Hardware House have not dropped me. They seem to have closed down all/most of their retail shops and say they are ceasing trading.

"...seems to have dropped him from their preferred customer list"

is a euphemism, a nice way of saying they will no longer commit any resources to make sure you remain a satisfied continuing customer and pass along that confidence to induce other people in your sphere of influence to also do business with them.

I'm apologize if I have offended you or implied that you were not worthy of being on a preferred list of a company seemingly going out of business. My imprecise wordplay with the English language was intended to be a funny contradiction to the actual situation.

Hi RichCor

, No you certainly did NOT offend me in any way and there is no need to apologize for anything. You have been very kind and informative and I greatly appreciate your kind and knowledgeable input

It is I who should apologize if I left you wondering if I was offended.

I knew your use of "preferred List" was not serious. My intention was merely to confirm I believe they have/are closing down and not interested in anybody any more. My wife probably spoke to a few people who are working out their last days and who can blame them for lacking interest).

Kind Regards

Dave

Edited May 20, 2014 by gdhm

[gdhm]

Never filled a warranty card out in my life but with monitors and other IT equipment I've returned I haven't had a problem yet. I only mentioned it to point out that all may not be lost if the OP did not keep his receipt.

Thankfully I always keep my important receipts (especially for items under warranty or insurable under house contents).

I also scan them as well, because many places tend to either not change their ribbons and print is barely readable or more often use low grade thermal paper that goes completely blank after only 2-3 months (never worked out if just cheap skates or deliberate (hard prove a purchase with a blank receipt. Easy when able to show a perfectly scanned copy .

Regards

Dave

[RichCor]

[...]

From what I can understand APC are NOT suggesting my UPS could damage my Silverstone or that my PSU could damage the APC UPS.

Is this your interpretation RichCor. If not I's greatly appreciate any concerns I should consider?

Is this your interpretation RichCor. If not I's greatly appreciate any concerns I should consider.

[...]

Kind Regards

Dave

My original intention of bringing attention to your APC UPS was to suggest that it might have passed along or influenced an out-of-tolerance power line condition that negatively effected the computer's PSU. Active PFC PSUs are more power efficient and draw more current at power-on.

But as you've recently stated that your son was also using a computer at the time (probably even on a shared circuit) this probably wasn't a UPS induced event.

More likely worn parts, dust, ants or a dreaded JingJok. Our microwave oven was recently possessed by Zeus/Jupiter until I partially dismantled it and removed the dead JingJok shorting the high-voltage circuit.

While it's recommended that you use a better rated UPS with an Active PFC PSU, very few people have reported issues pairing them over the years, and even fewer have ever reported PSU failures. Probably have the same MTBF rate as those either without UPS systems or using conditioned lines. I just mentioned it as something to look at.

Years ago I maintained radio equipment, and was always surprised that a low-voltage car battery could cause a two-way radio to burn out its transmitter amplifier or pop a capacitor. Odd things can happen during out-of-tolerance conditions.

[gdhm]

Hi RichCor,

Once again thanks ever so much for the info.

My son's much lower powered old PC has its own APC Back-UPS CS 500. When my RaidMax popped 29/02/2012 (on that PC mine at the time) I decided to buy a Corsair Corsair CS600 (600W) a Bronze rated PSU I think, with the intention of getting the Raidmax repaired under warranty and use the corsair on my new PC that I was about to build. In the end I decided to leave the Corsair in my son's PC as I was unsure if 600W Bronze rating would be adequate when running hot. Now I am using the Raidmax .

The APC Back-UPS CS 500 on my Son's PC does have different and higher minimum voltages before going on battery than my APC Back-UPS RS 1100. Recently I switched its settings to middle sensitivity to reduce the number of time it clicked to Battery when on very hot nights the main voltage temporarily drops quite a lot between 6:30pm to 7:30pm (everybody must switch their air-cons on when they get home. Even with the middle sensitively setting allowing a slightly lower minimum voltage it still (but less times) momentarily switches to battery at a higher minimum voltage than my APC Back-UPS RS 1100 which is on the most sensitive setting, so I felt it was safe to use it middle setting. Certainly my son's UPS still clicks more often when voltage drop on very hot nights between 6:30pm to 7:30pm whereas mine does not often. Both are doing their jobs thankfully.

My son's UPS is quite old and when the battery next needs changing I may well decide to pass my 2 year old UPS to his PC and then I will invest in a better APC Smart UPS if not an arm and a leg.

RichCor, I did make one statement in my last but one post to you which I realized was in error whilst I was thinking about PSUs in bed last night (sad devil aren't I? ). The lead I felt had been damaged was NOT the lead between my PCs PSU and UPS it was the mains lead to the UPS. Maybe the PSU overloaded the APC and the cable was not good enough to handle the surge. All I know is that cable had not been moved in weeks so I have zero reason to think the source of my issues was that cable AND my monitor and modem were unaffected when the PSU popped (both plugged into separate UPS protected sockets.

Luckily I have over 7 months to get my Silverstone sorted out under warranty (provided the Raidmax behaves itself that is). I am seriously thinking of getting a Corsair UPS as the one in my sons PC is working faultlessly) but am unsure if the 500W Bronze currently model sold by J.I.B has enough wattage &spare capacity when PSU will be less efficient when running hot for hours. When I get one I will replace the Raidmax and keep that as a reserve should either my son's or mine PSUs fail. I never have any issues with other components in either PC - only with PSUs occasionally (except for "many years old" Hard Drives from time to time and even they have never completely failed just started getting more errors which can be expected in old HDs).

Regards

Dave