Bangkok bank and moving funds for retirement visa in U.S.?

[chang beer]

Hi there. Are there any Americans here who move funds between Bangkok Bank and his American bank for the purpose of financial requirements for retirement visa?

I am with Bangkok Bank and am able to move funds via ACH because there is a branch here in New York city. Only able to do so since this is within U.S. Not WIRED if you know what I mean with charges!

The reason I ask is I had a hell of time....struggles to move funds via telephone call to the branch in Thailand!!!!! Not here in the States. They won't accepts calls here in U.S to move funds around. And was told that I can't sign up for online banking for the bank since I'm not there living in Thailand.

They will save me a lot of time if they allow me to do online banking.

Do you just leave that required funds in Thailand indefinitely for the purpose of retirement visa or do you move it back to American bank etc as soon as financial requirements are met? And are you able to do online banking with them for this reason?

thank you

BEER

[Jingthing]

I am not entirely clear on all that you are asking, but I can speak to one of the issues here.

The ACH link you are describing which is between most any U.S. bank and Bangkok Bank New York (where the money flows to your Bangkok Bank Thailand account, you never actually personally deal with Bangkok Bank New York at all and never actually have an account there) is strictly a ONE WAY street!

That means you can transfer the money from the U.S. to Thailand but NEVER back to the U.S. using that ACH link.

Just so you know.

Anyway, here is the basic method to set up the link.

From your ONLINE U.S. bank account, initiate an ACH link setup to Bangkok Bank New York using your THAILAND Bangkok Bank account number.

(Technical instructions like numbers to use, on Bangkok Bank Thailand website).

Then two TEST DEPOSITS are made from your U.S. bank to Bangkok Bank New York which flow to Thailand. You then need to CALL Bangkok Bank customer service in Thailand to find out the exact amount of the deposits in U.S. cents. You need to know this because the deposits will show up in Thailand in baht and you need to know the exact amount in U.S. cents.

You then use that cents info to validate the link on your U.S. bank website.

Then you are set to do transfers. The setup is one time thing. You need ONLINE access to both accounts (U.S. bank and your Thailand Bangkok Bank account).

Edited May 16, 2014 by Jingthing

[Maestro]

It is true that your Bangkok Bank branch, or any other bank in Thailand, will not set up online banking for your account without your presence at the branch office. This means that you have to travel to Thailand first before you can set it up and start making ACH transfers from your US bank account to your Thai bank account.

For your first retirement extension in Thailand, the 800k Baht must have been in your account for at least two months when you make the application. If you arrive with a single-entry non-O visa, with which you will get permission to stay for 90 days on your arrival, you have sufficient time to arrange online banking with Bangkok Bank an make the money transfer to Thailand.

[Jingthing]

Maestro is correct.

When you arrive in Thailand and get setup with Bangkok Bank online, you can then setup the ACH link on your U.S. bank account online. There is time if you get started with that after you arrive. If you don't already have multiple U.S. bank accounts, I suggest opening one or two more than one. Things can go wrong with your U.S. bank accounts once you are living in Thailand and once you are not living in the U.S. it can sometimes be impossible to open any new U.S. bank accounts. I'm talking backups ... some would call it paranoid ... but that's my suggestion.

You are also wise for focusing on Bangkok Bank in Thailand, the best choice for Americans because of this ACH option.

Where you're at now you could also do an initial SWIFT wire to Bangkok Bank Thailand directly by walking into your U.S. bank (or other method depending on the U.S. bank). You might want to do this for your initial funding in Thailand just so there is no pressure to get that online thing going right away once in Thailand. More expensive but it will be done.

Edited May 16, 2014 by Jingthing

[ubonjoe]

I am still not sure what you asking about doing.

If you already have a Bangkok Bank account you can transfer funds to it by ACH from in any bank in the US.using this routing number 026008691 to your account here.

You don't need online access to your account here to do it.

For more info she this page on Bangkok Bank website: http://www.bangkokbank.com/BangkokBank/PersonalBanking/DailyBanking/TransferingFunds/TransferringIntoThailand/ReceivingFundsfromUSA/Pages/ReceivingFundsfromUSA.aspx

[chiang mai]

You can only do push transfers, you can't do pull transfers, not with any bank. So if you are in the US and you're instructing a Thai bank to send you money from your Thai account, they almost certainly wont do it unless you've already put in place the online services to accomplish that, beforehand.

[ubonjoe]

You can only do push transfers, you can't do pull transfers, not with any bank. So if you are in the US and you're instructing a Thai bank to send you money from your Thai account, they almost certainly wont do it unless you've already put in place the online services to accomplish that, beforehand.

You should explain what you mean by push and pull. I am not sure the OP will understand what you have written.

Doing the transfer does does require online access to your US bank account if you have made arrangements to do it by phone fax and etc. It can certainly be done in person also.

[chang beer]

Hi Ubonjoe

I am still not sure what you asking about doing.

If you already have a Bangkok Bank account you can transfer funds to it by ACH from in any bank in the US.using this routing number 026008691 to your account here.

You don't need online access to your account here to do it.

For more info she this page on Bangkok Bank website: http://www.bangkokba...ndsfromUSA.asp

This is to return funds to home country.

As many of you know. One only has to keep funds in Thai bank for period of 2 to 3 months in order to qualify for financial requirements-retirement visa. Most people simply leave the funds there and use it up or return the funds to home-farang country.

So to transfer funds back to country of origin.

thank you

BEER

[chiang mai]

If you're with a global bank or bank that has branches in multiple countries and there is a common online system that serves them all, moving funds between accounts in different countries in straight forward, no matter which country you happen to be in at any given time. I'm thinking currently of HSBC Premier where all countries are served by the same system.

But in the case of Bangkok Bank for example, or indeed any other bank that is predominantly Thai but has representative branches in say London and New York, the online system serves the Thai element only although it can be accessed from outside Thailand. Moving funds from say New York to Thailand via Bangkok Bank is straight forward using the ACH system although such a transfer does not involve the Bangkok Bank online system at all, that is a "push" transfer.

But if you wanted to reverse that transfer and you happened to be in the US, there really isn't a mechanism for that because you are deemed to be trying to "pull" money from Thailand to the US - were you to be in Thailand you could easily go into a branch or perhaps use the online system to "push" funds to the US (am unsure of the limitations of Bangkok Bank online system).

An alternative to the above is to have rearranged telephone banking facilities whereby your various international accounts are already specified and limits and passwords etc established beforehand.

If it helps you any I have a similar problem with UOB and CIMB banks in Thailand where I have some fairly substantial time deposits. I tried to explore the options available to me if I was in the UK and wanted to transfer those funds from Thailand to the UK or indeed if I wanted to transact on my accounts in any way. I offered to go into UOB and/or CIMB London with my passport to prove my identity and to preauthorize remote transfers but both banks told me I would need to go into my branch in Thailand with my passbooks before any transfers/transaction would be allowed - this in the interests of security I'm told.

[ubonjoe]

You can only move the funds out of the country via swift directly to a US bank. It cannot be done through the New York branch.

Why are you wanting to move the funds out of Thailand?

If you have not moved the money in already and gotten the extension of stay I suggest you apply for an OA visa so your can leave your money in the states.

[chang beer]

Thanx UbonJoe. I was dead set on non immigrant O-A till I found out about criminal record, medical certificate notarized and future home address that I don't even have yet for the application. So I started thinking about just applying for retirement visa there.

BUT I might still do the O-A

I wanted to take the most painless route,if you know what I mean.

I don't know. I have a few more months to figure this out.

chok dii

BEER

[ubonjoe]

I am not sure having an address here is all that important. I am sure many get the OA without it.

The money in the bank is not the only option,.

You can also get an extension based upon income of 65K baht by getting an income affidavit at the embassy. Or you can combine income and money in the bank totaling 800K baht.

[chang beer]

Yeah Ubonjoe. 4 copies of my criminal record,4 copies of bank statement with a letter,4 copies of medical certificate all notarized,4 copies of application,4 copies of personal data and finally 4 copies of my passport, a trip to the local police station,Bank,Chuck Schwab,,my Doc and $200 in money order.

That just about covers it,I think.

I might just do this. I don't know. Can't wait till my pension kicks in.....

Thank you Sir.

chok dii

BEER

[ubonjoe]

Your income does not have to be from a pension. It can be any source of income. Investments, interest from savings, rental income and etc.

[CharlesHH]

Bangkok Bank and only Bangkok Bank has this service per Jingthing. Reading the Bank's well described Web page on this topic, it appears you can set up this RELAY service while your body is anywhere. You must first have a Bangkok Bank account that, I think, must be started in person in Thailand. Read that site carefully to see if you have to have any bank in USA because a quick read seemed to say that an SS Internet payment to you, for example, could go directly to the correct number account in NYC with no other American bank involved. This appears to be free and easy. So far, I use ATMs withdrawals, but should go to this method. However, FATCA or whatever that new law is called could find you more easily, I guess.

I am not entirely clear on all that you are asking, but I can speak to one of the issues here.

The ACH link you are describing which is between most any U.S. bank and Bangkok Bank New York (where the money flows to your Bangkok Bank Thailand account, you never actually personally deal with Bangkok Bank New York at all and never actually have an account there) is strictly a ONE WAY street!

That means you can transfer the money from the U.S. to Thailand but NEVER back to the U.S. using that ACH link.

Just so you know.

Anyway, here is the basic method to set up the link.

From your ONLINE U.S. bank account, initiate an ACH link setup to Bangkok Bank New York using your THAILAND Bangkok Bank account number.

(Technical instructions like numbers to use, on Bangkok Bank Thailand website).

Then two TEST DEPOSITS are made from your U.S. bank to Bangkok Bank New York which flow to Thailand. You then need to CALL Bangkok Bank customer service in Thailand to find out the exact amount of the deposits in U.S. cents. You need to know this because the deposits will show up in Thailand in baht and you need to know the exact amount in U.S. cents.

You then use that cents info to validate the link on your U.S. bank website.

Then you are set to do transfers. The setup is one time thing. You need ONLINE access to both accounts (U.S. bank and your Thailand Bangkok Bank account).

[Pib]

Sending money "to" Thailand is easy...Land of Smiles for Incoming Money. But I think the OP was also wondering can he easily move it back to his home country/U.S. bank after he has got his retirement extension of stay...move it back as easy as it was to send it over. The answer to that is No, generally it's not easy to move money out of Thailand unless its for a specific reason covered/allowed by Bank of Thailand regulations which Thai banks must comply with. And different rules apply for a Thai and a farang. Below is a partial quote from Bangkok Bank webpage regarding the outflow of funds via their ibanking...what is allowed and what is not. Note: this don't cover all the reasons outflow is allowed such as repatriating funds from sale of your condo assuming your have the original form showing the inflow of funds...and there is plenty of posts were the person just went to the Thai bank and initiated a funds outflow for X-amount....plenty of posts also reporting that the bank wouldn't allow an outflow unless it was salary repatiation along with having a work permit. Yes, Thailand can be the Land of Frowns when trying to outflow significant amounts of money. Summary: Inflow easy; outflow not so easy.

Funds can be transferred for any number of reasons, depending whether you are a Thai national or foreigner working in Thailand:

For Thai nationals

• Educational expenses
• Family support
• Living expenses
• Payment for goods
• Payment for services
• Travel expenses
• Personal expenses
• Gift
• Donation

For foreigners

• Salary repatriation

[Suradit69]

You can't obtain a "retirement visa" in Thailand, if you mean a Non-Imm O-A visa. It would only be available to you if you apply in the US and that would not require money in a Thai bank. Presumably you are talking about the extension of stay that you would apply for at an immigrations office in Thailand.

If you move the money from the US to your Bangkok Bank account via the NY branch in order to obtain an extension of stay, the point of having the money in your account here, aside from qualifying for the extension, is to use it for living expenses. So once it's here, why move it back to the US? You're going to spend it on living expenses here anyway, no?

If you don't want the whole Baht 800,000 to remain in your Thai account, then you'd be better off using the monthly pension amount (with embassy affidavit) or a combination of the monthly pension & money in the bank method when applying for the extension of stay. But realistically, if you're staying in Thailand long-term you're going to need the money for living expenses whether you bring it over in a lump sum or in installments. You won't be doing yourself any favors by shifting money back and forth repeatedly.

Edited May 17, 2014 by Suradit69

[Jingthing]

Yeah Ubonjoe. 4 copies of my criminal record,4 copies of bank statement with a letter,4 copies of medical certificate all notarized,4 copies of application,4 copies of personal data and finally 4 copies of my passport, a trip to the local police station,Bank,Chuck Schwab,,my Doc and $200 in money order.

That just about covers it,I think.

I might just do this. I don't know. Can't wait till my pension kicks in.....

Thank you Sir.

chok dii

BEER

Yeah, that's quite a bother.

If I were you, I'd go for the retirement extension in Thailand, assuming you are using the 800K Thai bank method and can manage it.

Some (wealthier?) people use the same 800K for many years and never touch it, just keeping the account for visa qualifying purposes.

I think most people using the bank method SPEND DOWN from the account every year and then TOP IT UP in time for the next years extension application.

The seasoning for the first one is two months, all later ones it is three months.

[IAMSOBAD]

Ubonjoe thanks for the info

[chang beer]

OK. I already have ACH set up so there's no hassle in transferring 800,000 bht anytime, but I like to proceed with the transfer as soon as I arrive and not while I'm still here in the states.

Only concern I had was to carry ATM card around with that much money in it.

I'll simply open a savings account and transfer funds between accounts. Unless the bank has a system of replenishing account when one is depleted? Like at my stock brokerage firms with a checking account and a brokerage account. I don't think so.

So. Get there on a single or multiple entry tourist visa and start the process immediately after I arrive.

One more question about O-A visa if I choose this route that is. I'd like to return to U.S for a week or two in March. This shouldn't be a problem right?

thanx guys. Ubon and Jingthing

[Langsuan Man]

First of all where in the US are you located ?

Only LA and Chicago required notarization of the medical form, proof of income and local police check. New York and Washington (Embassy) do not

But you can always use the Embassy in Washington by mail no matter where you are located in the US, and with Express Mail overnight really makes no difference how far from DC you are

There is no requirement for a Thai address to apply for an O-A, which automatically will be a multi entry which answers your concern about going back to the US in March. What address did you use to open your Bangkok Bank account ? Use that one to fill out the form, no one is going to check and you can even use a hotel address if you want to

By doing an O-A, you don't have to worry about 800,000 THB sitting in a bank account in Thailand for at least two years. If you satisfy the 65,000 THB per month income requirement then you can always get a letter from the US Embassy in Bangkok or Consulate in CM to extend your permission to stay and never have to have that much money sitting in a Thai bank after your O-A expires in one year or the admitted until stamp in two years time by leaving and returning to Thailand a day before your O-A is set to expire

[chang beer]

Copy that Langsuan Man. Yeah. Los Angeles here. and used my address in Patty for my bank account. I guess I could use any of numerous apartments I lived.

I got that about returning home next year on O-A after reading a reply from one of the members Ubonjoe here from another post.

thanx

BEER

[jimmym40]

Just for your info Chang, why don't you just keep funds required for retirement visa in Thailand? You get 3-4 times the interest rate in Thai bank than in the states at the moment.

[Langsuan Man]

Just for your info Chang, why don't you just keep funds required for retirement visa in Thailand? You get 3-4 times the interest rate in Thai bank than in the states at the moment.

And you will have to report the 800,000 THB via FBAR every year since it is over $10,000 in a Foreign Bank. The Thai Bank will withhold 10% of that interest and the US will tax you on the difference. But since you will not get a 1099 from a Thai Bank the IRS is going to have to trust you on your declaration

The number one rule in US Income taxes is never, never , do anything that might lead to an audit

[Jingthing]

That is true. An annual FBAR will be required for ALL Thai bank accounts, if even one of the Thai bank accounts has exceeded 10K USD for even one day.

Cheers.

[chang beer]

OH BOY!

BEER

[Pib]

Just for your info Chang, why don't you just keep funds required for retirement visa in Thailand? You get 3-4 times the interest rate in Thai bank than in the states at the moment.

And you will have to report the 800,000 THB via FBAR every year since it is over $10,000 in a Foreign Bank. The Thai Bank will withhold 10% of that interest and the US will tax you on the difference. But since you will not get a 1099 from a Thai Bank the IRS is going to have to trust you on your declaration

The number one rule in US Income taxes is never, never , do anything that might lead to an audit

The withholding tax is 15% on fixed deposit accounts. Obtaining a refund is easy...usually just a one page refund request at the local tax office...refund will occur in 2 to 6 weeks.

If you don't apply for the refund your are subject to U.S. federal tax on the entire amount including the 15% withholding tax "unless you attempted/filed for the refund with the Uncle Somchai tax man and he disapproved the refund (which he won't)." With this official disapproval paperwork in-hand Uncle Sam tax man only requires you pay tax on the 85% interest earned...no disapproval in-hand well that means a person didn't even apply for refund of the 15% withholding and therefore Uncle Sam will demand you pay tax on 100% of the interest earned.

Edited May 18, 2014 by Pib

[Pib]

Just for your info Chang, why don't you just keep funds required for retirement visa in Thailand? You get 3-4 times the interest rate in Thai bank than in the states at the moment.

And you will have to report the 800,000 THB via FBAR every year since it is over $10,000 in a Foreign Bank. The Thai Bank will withhold 10% of that interest and the US will tax you on the difference. But since you will not get a 1099 from a Thai Bank the IRS is going to have to trust you on your declaration

The number one rule in US Income taxes is never, never , do anything that might lead to an audit

The withholding tax is 15% on fixed deposit accounts. Obtaining a refund is easy...usually just a one page refund request at the local tax office...refund will occur in 2 to 6 weeks.

If you don't apply for the refund your are subject to U.S. federal tax on the entire amount including the 15% withholding tax "unless you attempted/filed for the refund with the Uncle Somchai tax man and he disapproved the refund (which he won't)." With this official disapproval paperwork in-hand Uncle Sam tax man only requires you pay tax on the 85% interest earned...no disapproval in-hand well that means a person didn't even apply for refund of the 15% withholding and therefore Uncle Sam will demand you pay tax on 100% of the interest earned.

Below from IRS Pub 514, Foreign Tax Credit for Individuals

Foreign tax refund. You cannot take a foreign tax credit for income taxes paid to a foreign country if it is reasonably certain the amount would be refunded, credited, rebated, abated, or forgiven if you made a claim.

[chang beer]

Hi. So basically all American expats retirees are reporting for FBAR every year? I think people who have lived in the kingdom of Thailand for a while ....10 years with the funds already in Thai banks are alright?

Just wondering.

thanks knowledgeable guys

Sierra Nevada BEER

[Jingthing]

Hi. So basically all American expats retirees are reporting for FBAR every year? I think people who have lived in the kingdom of Thailand for a while ....10 years with the funds already in Thai banks are alright?

Just wondering.

thanks knowledgeable guys

Sierra Nevada BEER

New report required annually no matter how long living in Thailand if the foreign bank accounts meet the reporting threshold. Cheers.