Bernard Flint Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 The govt is a lame duck. Senate has more legitimacy presently as an elected body. Senate is also part of the 'House' in the absence of MPs they have a role to play. I'm not saying they aren't partisan but they are seeking a solution. Their solution is apparently undemocratic because it seeks an 'appointed' PM/cabinet which intends to be neutral and capable of organising fair reform. It's not the end of the world to take democracy offline for 6 months to resolve things. Peua Thaksin are only interested in shoring up power, as such they insist on an unconditional election to regain power and dominate the reform agenda, and we all know where they will lead us. If the Senate are able to propose a balanced 'short term GNU solution that can include Peua Thai and Dems equally, it's far more likely to see us through than this simplistic, head-in-the-sand, idea of 'election will solve the problem'. It won't, elections are presently part of the problem. elections are presently part of the problem only because the losers refuse to accept the results. They want power but refuse to talk to the people and earn their confidence and their votes the democratic way. Instead, they want to impose themselves in a position of power, which is going to be most surefire path toward violence. Dont be so sensible mate, this is unusual for the hi-so farangs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kratiam Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? Yes you are missing something, 2 words. FREE and FAIR. No need to shout. I would have thought "free & fair" was a given and that the majority would understand that? Emphasis is not shouting...........and a bit trivial to make a post out of it (as is this, I suppose!) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Flint Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? Yes you are missing something, 2 words. FREE and FAIR. No need to shout. I would have thought "free & fair" was a given and that the majority would understand that? Emphasis is not shouting...........and a bit trivial to make a post out of it (as is this, I suppose!) The yellows are looking silly now, they are even trying to stop some going home, to continue with their business, even some from Pattaya are being forced to stay 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Flint Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? Yes you are missing something, 2 words. FREE and FAIR. No need to shout. I would have thought "free & fair" was a given and that the majority would understand that? Emphasis is not shouting...........and a bit trivial to make a post out of it (as is this, I suppose!) The yellows are looking silly now, they are even trying to stop some going home, to continue with their business, even some from Pattaya are being forced to stay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Flint Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 (edited) Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? Yes you are missing something, 2 words. FREE and FAIR. No need to shout. I would have thought "free & fair" was a given and that the majority would understand that? Emphasis is not shouting...........and a bit trivial to make a post out of it (as is this, I suppose!) The yellows are looking silly now, they are even trying to stop some going home, to continue with their business, even some from Pattaya are being forced to stay, even though they are being paid 400 baht a day, from Suthep big c bag. Has anyone known an opposition so poor, as not showing donations, unless one wants to look in a bag ahahahahahah, its laughable Edited May 17, 2014 by Bernard Flint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just1Voice Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Common sense from the Senate. And the idiotic caretaker PM true to his idiotic predecessor convicted crim's puppet is to busy in Issan. To busy for the sake of the country. Idiots and clowns to the left and the right. The sooner all these pathetic politicians are stood down and an interim administration is set up for a short term solution for reform before an election the better. Failing that it will be the Army imposing martial law. GEOGRAPHY 101 - Chiang Rai and Chiang Mai are NOT in Issan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post sweatalot Posted May 17, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? yes. you are missing the point without reform to kick out criminals, cheaters, puppets and cronies and with rats reds threatening and intimidating making it impossible for other parties to canvass and without undoing brainwashing fair, open democratic elections are impossible 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smedly Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? were you ? sleeping in Feb - there was an election and it failed another one will also fail, the simple truth is that there is a huge portion of the Thai people want reforms first - very possibly more than 50% but even if it was 40% an election is still not going to work - all of the voting public need to be on-board The main point here is that those that want reforms are not saying no to an election - they are saying they want it delayed so reforms can take place first - so contrary to what the red spammers here are saying - everyone wants an election - nobody is advocating not to have an election which is a very important point - What the reds stand to lose is power and money - these red leaders are getting paid huge amounts - PTP stand to lose huge amounts and possibly jail if an investigation is launched into government finance to find the missing stolen upwards of 800billion baht - PTP and the reds have a lot to lose which is why they are refusing to compromise Reforms Referendum Election It's as simple as that what are these reforms that I keep hearing about? Can you list them? nobody knows what the reforms would be exactly but they will be primarily designed to do a few important things - - Shore up anti corruption laws and plug the gaps that Thaksin/PTP/reds tried to expose/exploit or in the case of the rice scheme - did exploit to the tune of billions and billions of baht - Force transparency for all government finance and projects - they can not longer keep things hidden from the public and withhold the details - Implement measures to stop vote buying and intimidation during elections - Controls over election populist policies - perhaps a branch of the EC - Rules governing candidates similar to Senators excluding those previously convicted of criminal offences - parlimentry abuse and corruption - Banning those convicted for life and not just 5 years from taking office - reform of the police the list goes on but you get the idea IMO the one thing That PTP and Thaksin have shown in the last 10 years is that there is a need for reform - the abuse of power and corruption has been unpresidented - some argue that corruption the last two years has decreased in Thailand - it is still to be investigated uncovered and exposed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Flint Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? were you ? sleeping in Feb - there was an election and it failed another one will also fail, the simple truth is that there is a huge portion of the Thai people want reforms first - very possibly more than 50% but even if it was 40% an election is still not going to work - all of the voting public need to be on-board The main point here is that those that want reforms are not saying no to an election - they are saying they want it delayed so reforms can take place first - so contrary to what the red spammers here are saying - everyone wants an election - nobody is advocating not to have an election which is a very important point - What the reds stand to lose is power and money - these red leaders are getting paid huge amounts - PTP stand to lose huge amounts and possibly jail if an investigation is launched into government finance to find the missing stolen upwards of 800billion baht - PTP and the reds have a lot to lose which is why they are refusing to compromise Reforms Referendum Election It's as simple as that what are these reforms that I keep hearing about? Can you list them? nobody knows what the reforms would be exactly but they will be primarily designed to do a few important things - - Shore up anti corruption laws and plug the gaps that Thaksin/PTP/reds tried to expose/exploit or in the case of the rice scheme - did exploit to the tune of billions and billions of baht - Force transparency for all government finance and projects - they can not longer keep things hidden from the public and withhold the details - Implement measures to stop vote buying and intimidation during elections - Controls over election populist policies - perhaps a branch of the EC - Rules governing candidates similar to Senators excluding those previously convicted of criminal offences - parlimentry abuse and corruption - Banning those convicted for life and not just 5 years from taking office - reform of the police the list goes on but you get the idea IMO the one thing That PTP and Thaksin have shown in the last 10 years is that there is a need for reform - the abuse of power and corruption has been unpresidented - some argue that corruption the last two years has decreased in Thailand - it is still to be investigated uncovered and exposed That means no yellows in power then, Suthep is a thug and a criminal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smedly Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 The yellows are looking silly now, they are even trying to stop some going home, to continue with their business, even some from Pattaya are being forced to stay what on earth are you taking about ???????? what a stupid post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Flint Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 The yellows are looking silly now, they are even trying to stop some going home, to continue with their business, even some from Pattaya are being forced to stay what on earth are you taking about ???????? what a stupid post thank u for the informative post google the crazy man, read for yourself. Thailand need reforms, but Suthep is a very rich,corrupt guy, like many Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smedly Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 nobody knows what the reforms would be exactly but they will be primarily designed to do a few important things - - Shore up anti corruption laws and plug the gaps that Thaksin/PTP/reds tried to expose/exploit or in the case of the rice scheme - did exploit to the tune of billions and billions of baht - Force transparency for all government finance and projects - they can not longer keep things hidden from the public and withhold the details - Implement measures to stop vote buying and intimidation during elections - Controls over election populist policies - perhaps a branch of the EC - Rules governing candidates similar to Senators excluding those previously convicted of criminal offences - parlimentry abuse and corruption - Banning those convicted for life and not just 5 years from taking office - reform of the police the list goes on but you get the idea IMO the one thing That PTP and Thaksin have shown in the last 10 years is that there is a need for reform - the abuse of power and corruption has been unpresidented - some argue that corruption the last two years has decreased in Thailand - it is still to be investigated uncovered and exposed That means no yellows in power then, Suthep is a thug and a criminal your intellectual prowess is astounding 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Flint Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 nobody knows what the reforms would be exactly but they will be primarily designed to do a few important things - - Shore up anti corruption laws and plug the gaps that Thaksin/PTP/reds tried to expose/exploit or in the case of the rice scheme - did exploit to the tune of billions and billions of baht - Force transparency for all government finance and projects - they can not longer keep things hidden from the public and withhold the details - Implement measures to stop vote buying and intimidation during elections - Controls over election populist policies - perhaps a branch of the EC - Rules governing candidates similar to Senators excluding those previously convicted of criminal offences - parlimentry abuse and corruption - Banning those convicted for life and not just 5 years from taking office - reform of the police the list goes on but you get the idea IMO the one thing That PTP and Thaksin have shown in the last 10 years is that there is a need for reform - the abuse of power and corruption has been unpresidented - some argue that corruption the last two years has decreased in Thailand - it is still to be investigated uncovered and exposed That means no yellows in power then, Suthep is a thug and a criminal your intellectual prowess is astounding your insulting, arroagant behavious is far worse. This is a forum and we all have opinions without resorting to insults,are you drunk???????? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeO Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 why don't the appointed senators 'step down for the sake of the country' and allow the people to choose their senators. why is it just the caretaker cabinet-which already resigned, that should resign again.. ...because the whole reason for the protests is that this caretaker government has been robbing the country blind for the past three years...! As opposed to some senators? Why should anypne take the statements of some senators who owe their positons to an appointment by a military dictatorship, the very same dictatorship that laid the foundations for this constitutional crisis when the wrote a new constitution without allowing for critical comment? ...and the government of the past three years has been a solution to the problem has it? Of course not, it has been the root of the problem. And how does your precious PTP government and its paid pack of wolves deal with critical comment....?! Take off your red-tinted glasses for a moment and recognise that what the Senate is trying to do is bring this political impasse to an end so that Thailand can start to move out of the rut that it is now in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Cnxforever Posted May 17, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? were you ? sleeping in Feb - there was an election and it failed another one will also fail, the simple truth is that there is a huge portion of the Thai people want reforms first - very possibly more than 50% but even if it was 40% an election is still not going to work - all of the voting public need to be on-board The main point here is that those that want reforms are not saying no to an election - they are saying they want it delayed so reforms can take place first - so contrary to what the red spammers here are saying - everyone wants an election - nobody is advocating not to have an election which is a very important point - What the reds stand to lose is power and money - these red leaders are getting paid huge amounts - PTP stand to lose huge amounts and possibly jail if an investigation is launched into government finance to find the missing stolen upwards of 800billion baht - PTP and the reds have a lot to lose which is why they are refusing to compromise Reforms Referendum Election It's as simple as that what are these reforms that I keep hearing about? Can you list them? nobody knows what the reforms would be exactly but they will be primarily designed to do a few important things - - Shore up anti corruption laws and plug the gaps that Thaksin/PTP/reds tried to expose/exploit or in the case of the rice scheme - did exploit to the tune of billions and billions of baht - Force transparency for all government finance and projects - they can not longer keep things hidden from the public and withhold the details - Implement measures to stop vote buying and intimidation during elections - Controls over election populist policies - perhaps a branch of the EC - Rules governing candidates similar to Senators excluding those previously convicted of criminal offences - parlimentry abuse and corruption - Banning those convicted for life and not just 5 years from taking office - reform of the police the list goes on but you get the idea IMO the one thing That PTP and Thaksin have shown in the last 10 years is that there is a need for reform - the abuse of power and corruption has been unpresidented - some argue that corruption the last two years has decreased in Thailand - it is still to be investigated uncovered and exposed You are a bit shortsighted - the people who are really robbing this country have done so much much longer! Maybe you should read a it more than The Nation and find out who was really robbing the country long before Thaksin and then together with him! Start with the PAD leader who has stolen billions from the Thai people but has never spent a day in prison! Only when Thaksin cut him off he turned against him! The gangster Suthep who is shouting on stage that others are corrupt is not only sent their by even more corrupt people who can't get their hand I to the cookie jar anymore - he himself brought down the last elected Democrat led government with his corrupt dealings! Fact is that TRT was the most popular and successful government that Thailand ever had - period! The numbers prove it whatever others try to make up! The last post coup unelected democrat led stint was a disaster! And that's why the Thai people elected PT again for no other reason - and it is their democratic right to do so! Since the coup the country has never been able to move forward! Suthep is a criminal sent their by other criminals who want their hands back in the cookie jar - everything else is a smoke screen! There was not a word about reforms when the democrats where in power not so long ago - they where really so stupid and thought they would win the elections - they thought we just buy the votes of those who vote PT - didn't work out either even after admitting that they spent more money trying to buy votes than PT! The Thai electorate has evolved - they have seen the progress under TRT and that's why they vote for them - corrupt or not - there has never been a Thai government not corrupt to the core! And with Thaksin winning elections again and again the people who felt they where so "important" are loosing their grip on the country throwing it into chaos if has to be - can't loose face after all! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post fab4 Posted May 17, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2014 nobody knows what the reforms would be exactly but they will be primarily designed to do a few important things - - Shore up anti corruption laws and plug the gaps that Thaksin/PTP/reds tried to expose/exploit or in the case of the rice scheme - did exploit to the tune of billions and billions of baht - Force transparency for all government finance and projects - they can not longer keep things hidden from the public and withhold the details - Implement measures to stop vote buying and intimidation during elections - Controls over election populist policies - perhaps a branch of the EC - Rules governing candidates similar to Senators excluding those previously convicted of criminal offences - parlimentry abuse and corruption - Banning those convicted for life and not just 5 years from taking office - reform of the police the list goes on but you get the idea IMO the one thing That PTP and Thaksin have shown in the last 10 years is that there is a need for reform - the abuse of power and corruption has been unpresidented - some argue that corruption the last two years has decreased in Thailand - it is still to be investigated uncovered and exposed So somebody (perhaps abhisits "idea" of the Reform Now group - Who?) defines all these reforms and put's them to the public to vote on in a referendum, they are acted upon and then we have an election, is that the idea? Right let's look at the practicalities. Someone has to have the authority to hold the referendum in the first place, who's that? The arguing over and agreement on the wording of the reforms is going to take one hell of a lot of time. Who's going to be running the country in the meantime (spare me the glib soundbite replies, think about it). The resulting paperwork for the public to decide on, will be reams of legalese far more complicated than the constitution, in itself 300 plus articles, that the public were asked to vote on in 2007. Granted the choice then was made easy for them - Yes was the only answer required. These reforms, once agreed by the public will need to be made law. Who's going to do that - there isn't a parliament as an election can't be held until after "reforms". So less than half a senate (currently about 70 senators are holding "informal" meetings) will have to illegally appoint an interim government citing articles 180 and 7 of the constitution before this process even gets started. What do you think is going to happen after that announcement? Or they could have accepted what Yingluck offered way back in December Thai Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra unveiled a plan on Wednesday to create an independent reform council to try to appease opponents who, angered by her billionaire family's political dominance, are calling for her resignation. The proposal, which comes after weeks of anti-government protests that have rallied more than 200,000 people at their peak, could be put into play soon and would be free of government interference, Yingluck said in a televised address. Yingluck's plan calls for a council of 499 eminent Thais, chosen by a wider group of 2,000, to examine reform of Thailand's political system. It looks similar to the unelected "people's council" protest leader Suthep Thaugsuban has proposed to replace the government, with one crucial difference. Under Yingluck's proposal, the reform council would operate alongside an elected government, not an appointed one. "This council is not the government agency ... it would let it run on its own and would not be overshadowed or influenced by the government," Yingluck said. "I insist that the new elected government will take this and implement what the council decides on how to reform the nation." http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/12/25/uk-thailand-protest-idUKBRE9BO02720131225 Seems quite reasonable. Of course that was before the ammart had to have their Shinawatra scalp......................... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robblok Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Why does the PDRC?Suthep STEP BACK. Why the Govt need to step back? As far as I am aware they have been trying to follow procedure and have an election? Why are the senators calling for them to step down, rather than calling Suthep to step back? Because they are the cause of the problems, had they not try to get Taksin home the good people of Thailand would not have risen against this government. They were told not too, but did so it is all on them and their bandit leader. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianf Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? Y es. You are missing a lot. The last election was neither free nor democratic. Elections per se are not indicative of democracy. In Thailand especially so where money comes first and if the cash doesn't work there's always threats. I have oft mentioned folk that I know of in 'red' villages forced by peer pressure to vote for the reds. Other families faking illness so they don't have to go and vote for whom they don't want. This is certainly true in red villages and indeed is the whole purpose of red villages. Every Abhisit poster in the last election had his face torn out in an attempt to demonise him. I didn't notice the red posters defaced in the same way. Abhisit has been demonised, quite unfairly, through red propaganda. The Shins are not totally free to campaign in the deep south and the Democrats are excluded from campaigning in large swathes of the country. Hardly democratic behaviour by the Thaksin purveyors of democracy! If you search the net and read what ex-allies have said about Thaksin's undemocratic behaviour and put all this information together, you'll find what you are missing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Civil War Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Strange to see the wording completely different to the Khaosod report. Seems to me that it is still on, the senate is just giving the government one last chance to step aside, before they actually do go ahead with replacing them. They are basically saying, 'jump or we will push you'. The red shirts are also basically threatening to 'burn Bangkok' again if there is violence this weekend and the army come out... the UDD have not changed one bit and those two who are on bail for terrorism are doing exactly the same as they are on bail for. I doubt they would have the guts to enter BKK with the army and anti-gov protesters waiting for them. The government are finished, they just want to leave on the back of mass deaths so they look like the 'victims' to the international community.... guess what..... the international community don't really give a crap.... they will simply tut tut and will have forgotten about it the next day. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yimlitnoy Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? Yes you are missing something, 2 words. FREE and FAIR. You are missing a lot. When the people who want election will understand that no one is against fair and honest election with the right to campaign everywhere in the country, including Isan and the North without intimidation and risk on life. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post sawadee1947 Posted May 17, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2014 why don't the appointed senators 'step down for the sake of the country' and allow the people to choose their senators. why is it just the caretaker cabinet-which already resigned, that should resign again.. I agree with you. It cannot be that one man is threatening and pushing the whole country. Not even to make proposals of reforms. And also: who will be nominated for interim PM? NO NAMES. All hidden. No truths, all lies. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Raymonddiaz Posted May 17, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2014 How unelected senators can ask people chosen by the Thais to step down....What kind of world are we??? are we in 2014 or not???? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post smedly Posted May 17, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2014 were you ? sleeping in Feb - there was an election and it failed another one will also fail, the simple truth is that there is a huge portion of the Thai people want reforms first - very possibly more than 50% but even if it was 40% an election is still not going to work - all of the voting public need to be on-board The main point here is that those that want reforms are not saying no to an election - they are saying they want it delayed so reforms can take place first - so contrary to what the red spammers here are saying - everyone wants an election - nobody is advocating not to have an election which is a very important point - What the reds stand to lose is power and money - these red leaders are getting paid huge amounts - PTP stand to lose huge amounts and possibly jail if an investigation is launched into government finance to find the missing stolen upwards of 800billion baht - PTP and the reds have a lot to lose which is why they are refusing to compromise Reforms Referendum Election It's as simple as that what are these reforms that I keep hearing about? Can you list them? nobody knows what the reforms would be exactly but they will be primarily designed to do a few important things - - Shore up anti corruption laws and plug the gaps that Thaksin/PTP/reds tried to expose/exploit or in the case of the rice scheme - did exploit to the tune of billions and billions of baht - Force transparency for all government finance and projects - they can not longer keep things hidden from the public and withhold the details - Implement measures to stop vote buying and intimidation during elections - Controls over election populist policies - perhaps a branch of the EC - Rules governing candidates similar to Senators excluding those previously convicted of criminal offences - parlimentry abuse and corruption - Banning those convicted for life and not just 5 years from taking office - reform of the police the list goes on but you get the idea IMO the one thing That PTP and Thaksin have shown in the last 10 years is that there is a need for reform - the abuse of power and corruption has been unpresidented - some argue that corruption the last two years has decreased in Thailand - it is still to be investigated uncovered and exposed You are a bit shortsighted - the people who are really robbing this country have done so much much longer! Maybe you should read a it more than The Nation and find out who was really robbing the country long before Thaksin and then together with him! Start with the PAD leader who has stolen billions from the Thai people but has never spent a day in prison! Only when Thaksin cut him off he turned against him! The gangster Suthep who is shouting on stage that others are corrupt is not only sent their by even more corrupt people who can't get their hand I to the cookie jar anymore - he himself brought down the last elected Democrat led government with his corrupt dealings! Fact is that TRT was the most popular and successful government that Thailand ever had - period! The numbers prove it whatever others try to make up! The last post coup unelected democrat led stint was a disaster! And that's why the Thai people elected PT again for no other reason - and it is their democratic right to do so! Since the coup the country has never been able to move forward! Suthep is a criminal sent their by other criminals who want their hands back in the cookie jar - everything else is a smoke screen! There was not a word about reforms when the democrats where in power not so long ago - they where really so stupid and thought they would win the elections - they thought we just buy the votes of those who vote PT - didn't work out either even after admitting that they spent more money trying to buy votes than PT! The Thai electorate has evolved - they have seen the progress under TRT and that's why they vote for them - corrupt or not - there has never been a Thai government not corrupt to the core! And with Thaksin winning elections again and again the people who felt they where so "important" are loosing their grip on the country throwing it into chaos if has to be - can't loose face after all! I am not going to disagree with a lot of what you have said in fact you have just made the case even stronger that reforms are needed But also not that in every western country you have rich people - in most cases they are business owners large and small that provide employment for the masses - these are people who have educated themselves or are just naturally gifted and have taken risks that paid off, they are the backbone of every modern economy in the world - they are the people that create jobs and contribute to the economies of countries - but on the other hand we have a criminal element that live their lives through crime including corruption fed by greed - their mandate is to lie steal corrupt perpetrate crime break laws and deceive - the worst of which are those in government who are cheating the common people out of (in Thailand) billion and billions - it has to stop or at least extreme measure implemented to curb their activities and bring them to account, there are many guilty in Thailand but more recently Thaksin PTP and the Redshirt leaders have the most attention - defend them if you want but I would rather see them investigated and brought to justice - I would also like to see measures put in place to make it extremely difficult to continue this cycle of power abuse corruption and greed - considering this it is no wonder that a growing number of people including myself agree that having an election without implementing these changes is not the solution that the Thai people need - PTP Thaksin the well paid redshirts leaders have a vested interest to let the system remain as is and further make sure that any investigation into government finance over the last 3 years doesn't happen as it would expose for all to see exactly what they have been up too and I suspect on a scale that will shock not only the Thai people but the world 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piichai Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Red Shield: I am 100% for true democracy and believe the freedom of all men is guaranteed on an even higher plane than any document or system created by man for such purpose. I suppose that explains their disdain for the constitution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Prbkk Posted May 17, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2014 What the appointed Senators really mean is resign for the sake of the old guard because the old guard wants their power back. With their overblown sense of entitlement, they believe it's going to come easy. Not this time. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piichai Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 what are these reforms that I keep hearing about? Can you list them? nobody knows what the reforms would be exactly but they will be primarily designed to do a few important things - - Shore up anti corruption laws and plug the gaps that Thaksin/PTP/reds tried to expose/exploit or in the case of the rice scheme - did exploit to the tune of billions and billions of baht - Force transparency for all government finance and projects - they can not longer keep things hidden from the public and withhold the details - Implement measures to stop vote buying and intimidation during elections - Controls over election populist policies - perhaps a branch of the EC - Rules governing candidates similar to Senators excluding those previously convicted of criminal offences - parlimentry abuse and corruption - Banning those convicted for life and not just 5 years from taking office - reform of the police the list goes on but you get the idea IMO the one thing That PTP and Thaksin have shown in the last 10 years is that there is a need for reform - the abuse of power and corruption has been unpresidented - some argue that corruption the last two years has decreased in Thailand - it is still to be investigated uncovered and exposed That means no yellows in power then, Suthep is a thug and a criminal Reforms will affect *all* sides! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xminator Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 It is against the Constitution to step down as caretaker government. They already step down for fresh elections. Just as it is against the constitution for the Senate to appoint a PM. Laws should work both ways, not just when there was a convenient cooking show on TV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueNoseCodger Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 (edited) Yes, please Senate step down for the good of the country. You unelected idiots are making a mockery of Thailand. You've undermined our courts with a partisan oversight system. You've stuffed the Independent agencies with partisan appointees. You've tried to seize power from the elected house and from the interim government. You impeached the previous Senate Leader while the others were out for election. You hold a 'senate' meeting, when the senate is out of session with only your unelected apparatchiks. And yeh, we get it, reforms is just a code word for yet more election rigging. None of you dare say what you mean by reform, you claim to be all independent and neutral, so how do you know the 'reform' each of you plan is the same? and yet none of you can state it? It's election rigged and you cannot state it because it is corruption in its purest form. Your Democrat party is elitist and unelectable You blocked voting in the South, if the South is yours by right, why did you not trust them to boycott the election? Why did it have to be blocked?! You are determined to block any election, because you know you will lose You were set to lose badly in Bangkok and the South So yes unelected Senate posse, breaking all the laws of the Senate, step down and let us replace you with a fully elected house that represents the people, not your bunch of lying corrupt dinosaurs. /rant Edited May 17, 2014 by BlueNoseCodger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeO Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 What the appointed Senators really mean is resign for the sake of the old guard because the old guard wants their power back. With their overblown sense of entitlement, they believe it's going to come easy. Not this time. Congratulations on having succeeded in stringing together three sentences without one single reference to "thugs". Bravo...!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 Surely the best way to get a prime minister & cabinet with full authority would be to have an election or am I missing something? Surely "full authority" must include the mandate of the people? You are totally right but the farangs who post on this thread are obsessively anti-democratic. They are similar to the people who in February and March 1933 argued that now the time called for emergency measures and the suspension of democratic rights and rules of governance - we all know the result of that was Hitler usurping power and heaping misery on Germany and the world for the subsequent 12 years. The TV farangs have learnt no lessons from history. They are hopelessly shaped by a "neo-colonialist" outlook where they basically see Thais as second-class citizens and themselves as vastly superior. That is why expat farangs hate Thai democracy - nothing is more repellant to them than to see Thais run their own country. They would much rather see the country run by a small elite and the vast majority of Thais told to stay "in their place". In the mindset of the TV farang who continually posts here in defense of Suthep and his gang of fascist thugs the destruction of Thai democracy would benefit his selfish expat existence more than if Thailand as a whole becomes more equal and fair. Them generalizations. Most Expats living in Thailand do not post on TVF. Most TVF members do not post on political issues. Of those who do, wouldn't really say there's a vast majority of anti-government supporters. In fact, even those that do not approve of the government are often critical when it comes to Suthep (for example). There is nothing wrong with pointing out problems pertaining to Thailand's democracy, or pointing out flaws in Thailand's political system. That does not imply hatred of democracy. Nor does having the country run by a group of small elite represent any obvious advantage to expat foreigners. Expats, as a rule, are nobodies when it comes to the higher echelons of Thai social order. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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