UK Things you cannot (legitimately) do if you live in Thailand

[JB300]

Thanks Partington (and I do know the Conan Doyle story, just hadn't twigged the plans were called that)

I did indeed misunderstand ur post & as I've always (since the age of 19) had to complete a self-assessment return That link, looks very informative (should my investments ever get back to paying decent dividends!)

Edited May 28, 2014 by JB300

[speedtripler]

The problem with getting NHS treatment is you lose your GP ,or you used to, if you do not use them for 5 years. I believe they try and contact you a few times before they send your records back to their Central office. It happened to me and I didn't know until I tried to visit the doctor after being back in the UK for a few months. So if you do go home to get treated for something a bit nasty , you need your GP to get referred to the Hospital obviously.

my last trip home i was refused an appointment to my dentist ,he hadnt seen me for ages so he "removed " me from his books

luckily dentistry not too expensive so i did it in thailand but i was a bit shocked they would refuse a paying customer who was

on the books for 10+ years but rarely needed dentistry so didnt go much

[Surasak]

It is possible to renew a UK driving licence while living in Thailand, I did it almost a year ago now, in fact 27/6/2013. The only problem I had was the dispute regarding a new photo. But because my passport is still valid until 2016 this was overcome easily enough. All the authorities know I live in Thailand so I was not trying to hide anything by using a UK address. Having sent off the relevant paperwork the new licence was duly returned to me three weeks later. So sorry to say I do dispute this particular item in your thread.

[sometimewoodworker]

Can't change your bank account or open a new one without a UK address

There is at least 1 branch of 1 UK bank that will let you open an account without a UK address

[watcharacters]

.

Avoid paying UK taxes unless you pay the corresponding taxes in Thailand.

A friend told me he pays taxes here as he doesn't pay them in the UK. He said unless a UK citizen pays the UK taxes, he has an obligation to pay taxes in Thailand. He's the only UK citizen I know who pays any taxes at all.

[Card]

Two more things you can miss as a non-UK resident:

Be paid net on bank interest.

Declare offshore bank interest and investments and not pay tax on them in the UK.

Edited May 29, 2014 by Card

[Card]

.

Avoid paying UK taxes unless you pay the corresponding taxes in Thailand.

A friend told me he pays taxes here as he doesn't pay them in the UK. He said unless a UK citizen pays the UK taxes, he has an obligation to pay taxes in Thailand. He's the only UK citizen I know who pays any taxes at all.

I assume you refer to bringing in cash to Thailand from the UK, which could be counted as income. However, if you have an offshore bank account, say in Isle of Man, then you need to open 2 accounts. 1 is for the initial capital, and 2 is for all the interest that that capital gains - if you instruct your bank to put the annual interest immediatley into account 2 when it is due, then you can make transfers from your account 1 into Thailand without paying tax on it in Thailand because you are then transferring capital, not income.

[Jesse123]

Beware - if you hold UK shares, UK bank accounts, UK property but claim to be non UK domiciled your estate will be subject to the IHT regime on your death. Not a problem for you but your heirs will need UK probate to access the assets even if the value is low and below the nil rate band.

[BudRight]

Thanks Bob.

[Brian Corrigan]

Pay UK tax on your private pension.

[JB300]

Interesting one as I think they've very recently changed the rules so you can get treatment on the NHS if you've paid at least 7 years NI

With regards to the NHS and availability of it for expats please see the following from a British MP which was in reply to a rant of mine on this very subject.

"From: [email protected]

To: NickNick

Subject: Expat eligibility to the NHS

Date: Mon, 19 May 2014 16:24:09 +0000

<<<>>>

This change will make NHS rules consistent with the principles of ex-pat eligibility for UK pensions and other state benefits

I can't see it happening (or can I ), but that paragraph could imply a different level of eligibility to NHS based on where you're an expat ala the different pension rules between Thailand & Philippines.

[Mudcrab]

it is both illegal and morally offensive to wear socks with sandals. Sure we see the rebels living on the wild-side blatantly flouting these fundamentals - their time will come.

[Neeranam]

Vote in the Scottish referendum.

[AhFarangJa]

Sell shares that you legitimately purchased unless you still hold a U.K. address.

Agreed, but you can transfer them to another person.

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Would they not in turn be liable to capital gains as it would be a gift?

I know we are moving a little off topic but I am intrigued by the replies. I have been non resident for tax for 22 years. I bought all my shares through my company schemes (a large British Defence Company ) these shares are managed by a group called Capita, ( sorry if I just broke a rule there) these are the people who keep on informing me I need a U.K. bank account even though I did not have one when I purchased the shares!! If anyone knows anything I do not please pm me. Many thanks.

It is absolutely not true that you cannot legally sell shares that you acquired before you left the UK, and it is absolutely not true that you cannot legally buy and sell shares while you are non resident, using a UK broker. The UK HMRC site in fact has many informative pages dealing with tax resulting from sales of shares and bonds while non-resident, and would not give this information if it was not in fact legal to do so!

e.g. http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/international/tax-incomegains.htm

There may be a problem in finding a broker that will continue to provide an account if you inform them you are no longer resident in the UK, but ones that do allow expat accounts certainly exist, as I have an account with one: Charles Stanley.

Moreover if you are absent for five continuous tax years you are not liable for capital gains tax, nor are you liable for any tax on dividends or bond interest payments other than that (if any) already withheld before payment (providing you do not claim your personal allowance in your annual tax return).

The tax benefits for share and bond investors are huge for UK expats, so you should be aware of and take advantage of them, if possible - and not believe completely incorrect information like the quoted post above.

Excellent summary except for the part about tax withheld on dividends, you cannot offset your personal allowance against this even if you have no other income in the UK (i.e. you cannot get the Tax back no matter what) but you can still use the full personal allowance against other income streams (which are considered as coming 1st when calculating Tax) if you do.

I very recently learnt (from another thread on this site) that the tax withheld is the only tax you pay on dividends, even if you're paid enough dividends to take you into the higher rate tax bracket.

AhFarangJa, I don't believe partington meant any criticism to you or your post, if you look at the links I posted you can see lots of Brokers will refuse to let you trade if you don't have a UK bank account but as he & I are trying to highlight, it's perfectly legal to do & there are brokers out there who will happily take you on as a customer if yours isn't.

partington, is that where you're from in the UK as it's not far from where I'm from (Martinscroft, Warrington).

Cheers

JB

JB & Partington,

No offence was taken, in fact quite the opposite. I wish to thank you both for all your constructive information and links, and I will be busy this weekend poring over them with viqour!! I closed my one bank account in U.K. at the advice of lawyers when asking about making a will, long story. My main account is in Jersey, so as you say, that may be the reason ( but was not explained!!)

Again, many thanks to you for your insight, I hope I can repay the the compliment some day soon.

[thejcb]

Enjoy that wonderfull English weather ...

Exactly, I love the weather in England, just love it. Nice to put a coat on and walk in the drizzle. Not sweating ALL the time, can ride my bicycle comfortably. No need for fans and air conditioners. Getting into bed at night, just feels wonderful. I love the English weather. I am glad other people feel the same. Ad David stated its WONDERFUL (Only one "L" though)

[CaitlinHappyMeal]

Hi, If you go back to the uk from time to time and still have a uk bank account you can set up a direct debit for the lottery whilst you're there. The rule is you can be out of the country if your winning numbers coming up but you must have been on british soil when you set the direct debit up……..

[sandyf]

Lack of clarification by the OP has led to many irrelevant and contradictory posts. It all hinges on the term resident. It is not until you give up residency for tax purposes that you are no longer a UK resident. I took this up with the tax office and the answer was that I am a UK resident with shared domicile. There is no criteria for how much time you spend where. The Inland Revenue, the Pension Service and my bank have both UK address and Thai address for me.

I receive my pension direct to Thailand without any tax being deducted, all tax is collected from another pension paid in the UK. I was told if they could not collect tax from the UK pension I would have to pay a lump sum via self assessment.

A previous poster is quite correct in that if you do not pay tax in the UK you are obliged to declare any income to the Thai revenue department.

Edited May 29, 2014 by sandyf

[wileycoyote]

Register land in the UK Registry ,has to be registered through a UK resident or proxy

[sandyf]

Hi, If you go back to the uk from time to time and still have a uk bank account you can set up a direct debit for the lottery whilst you're there. The rule is you can be out of the country if your winning numbers coming up but you must have been on british soil when you set the direct debit up……..

I used to do that, then about a year ago I got 3 emails in the space of a month warning that only people living in the UK could participate. The warning contained a reference to a passport check. I think they may have monitored online access to the account.

I decided to give it up, rather not win than win and have it taken away.

[NoshowJones]

Lol... I'm not denying that people might tell the odd porky [emoji6] but trying to get a list of things that "Legitimately" (my definition is not tell porkies/omit the truth) cannot be done.

There is nothing wrong with stealing or lieing to people who steal or lie to you.

[NoshowJones]

Can't change your bank account or open a new one without a UK address

There is at least 1 branch of 1 UK bank that will let you open an account without a UK address

Which bank is that?

[NoshowJones]

Hi, If you go back to the uk from time to time and still have a uk bank account you can set up a direct debit for the lottery whilst you're there. The rule is you can be out of the country if your winning numbers coming up but you must have been on british soil when you set the direct debit up……..

There's more to it than that, if you do not have an official UK address, I understand they will not pay any winnings over 5000GBP.

[mariner16]

Can't change your bank account or open a new one without a UK address

I still have my account with NatWest and all letters pertaining to it are sent to my Bangkok address, only issue was they would not post new credit or debit cards overseas so have to use an intermediary in UK

[In Search of Space]

Enjoy that wonderfull English weather ...

Beautiful right now, just the right amount of drizzle with 13 degrees

[mariner16]

Lack of clarification by the OP has led to many irrelevant and contradictory posts. It all hinges on the term resident. It is not until you give up residency for tax purposes that you are no longer a UK resident. I took this up with the tax office and the answer was that I am a UK resident with shared domicile. There is no criteria for how much time you spend where. The Inland Revenue, the Pension Service and my bank have both UK address and Thai address for me.

I receive my pension direct to Thailand without any tax being deducted, all tax is collected from another pension paid in the UK. I was told if they could not collect tax from the UK pension I would have to pay a lump sum via self assessment.

A previous poster is quite correct in that if you do not pay tax in the UK you are obliged to declare any income to the Thai revenue department.

DT18703 - DT: Thailand: double taxation agreement, Article 4:

Fiscal domicile

(1) For the purposes of this Convention, the term `resident of a Contracting State` means, subject to the provisions of

paragraphs (2) and (3) of this Article, any person who, under the law of that State, is liable to taxation therein by reason of

his domicile, residence, place of management, place of incorporation, or any other criterion of a similar nature.

(2) Where by reason of the provisions of paragraph (1) of this Article an individual is a resident of both Contracting States,

then his status shall be determined in accordance with the following rules:

(a) he shall be deemed to be a resident of the Contracting State in which he has a permanent home available

to him. If he has a permanent home available to him in both Contracting States, he shall be deemed to be a

resident of the Contracting State with which his personal and economic relations are closer (centre of vital

interests);

( if the Contracting State in which he has his centre of vital interests cannot be determined, or if he has not

a permanent home available to him in either Contracting State, he shall be deemed to be a resident of the

Contracting State in which he has an habitual abode;

© if he has an habitual abode in both Contracting States or in neither of them he shall be deemed to be a

resident of the Contracting State of which he is a national;

(d) if he is a national of both Contracting States or of neither of them, the competent authorities of the

Contracting States shall endeavour to settle the question by mutual agreement.

(3) Where by reason of the provisions of paragraph (1) of this Article a person other than an individual is a resident of both

Contracting States, then the competent authorities of the Contracting States shall endeavour to settle the question by

mutual agreement.

[evadgib]

Hi, If you go back to the uk from time to time and still have a uk bank account you can set up a direct debit for the lottery whilst you're there. The rule is you can be out of the country if your winning numbers coming up but you must have been on british soil when you set the direct debit up……..

Camelot clearly state that they won't pay out in these circumstances...

[Jaggg88]

Interesting one as I think they've very recently changed the rules so you can get treatment on the NHS if you've paid at least 7 years NI

Thanks ..... I didn't know that. I've been paying for BUPA in UK (and in Thailand) as I thought I could not get NHS ..... will have a look into this to see if I can save some money. I only spend a couple of weeks a year in UK anyway but I've been paying NI for over 20 years before I left UK.

I'm not sure they have set this new rule up yet.

However, if you return to the UK and present yourself for treatment they are obliged to treat you if you declare you now intend to live in the UK (you are still a UK citizen). After treatment you can live where ever you choose.

[Lancashirelad]

A now late friend of mine had lived in Thailand over 20 years. During that time he never returned to the uk. He became seriously ill with bowel cancer, returned to the uk & was treated, including a major operation, without question. However, he had never "officially" left the uk.

Capita are indeed registrars, not brokers.

Capital gains tax on the sale of shares: You'd have to be be doing quite well from your sale and making a profit of over £11,000 (2014 -15 tax year). Only any amount over that is taxable.

[Lancashirelad]

A now late friend lived in Thailand for over 20 years. During that time he never returned to the uk. Became seriously ill with bowel cancer and returned to the uk. He was treated, including a major op, without question, however, he had never "officially" left the uk.

Capita are indeed registrars, not brokers.

Capital Gains Tax on the sale of shares: you'd have to be doing quite well from the sale. CGT is only payable on any profit over £11,000 (2014-15 tax year). i.e. profit £12,000. pay tax on £1,000.

[rwdrwdrwd]

Hi, If you go back to the uk from time to time and still have a uk bank account you can set up a direct debit for the lottery whilst you're there. The rule is you can be out of the country if your winning numbers coming up but you must have been on british soil when you set the direct debit up……..

I used to do that, then about a year ago I got 3 emails in the space of a month warning that only people living in the UK could participate. The warning contained a reference to a passport check. I think they may have monitored online access to the account.

I decided to give it up, rather not win than win and have it taken away.

What passport? Use a VPN.