Warehouse filled with rotten rice in Nakhon Si Thammarat

[Chao Lao Beach]

Why would they care if it is rotton, don't the tax payers own it ?

[Old Man River]

I'm sure you are right in that this mess would have lost plenty on paper, without anyone stealing or acting negligently.

I don't accuse Yingluck of stealing rice. Even she isn't that dumb; well her advisers anyway. I'm sure the financial trails associated with any wrongdoing will meander into a veritable Gordian Knot. We will have to see where they lead, should they be uncovered and pursued.

There appear to be issues in the control inventory and money, both actual and accounting. It will take some time to unravel.

If this was the difference between the pledge price paid and the prices it is then sold for, that's a government decision. Any loss becomes the cost of the subsidy which has a social aspect to it. The government and people who elected them, may consider this cost worth the social benefits and that is their right to decide.

However, the accounting and reporting and overall management has been piss poor made worse with blatant lying to claim otherwise. Yingluck and PTP's repeated insistence of no problems and silly claims about secret non existent purchase orders have fueled speculation as to other potential issues.

Some people have made money out of this scheme through defrauding the Thai taxpayer. Maybe millers,transport companies, rice export businesses or the warehouse owners who provided a some what inferior service at no doubt premium costs. A lot of people seem to have put their trust in PTP or another Thaksin proxy party being in power for many years and allowing this to go unchecked.

At best, Yingluck is guilty of massive negligence and incompetence in doing the job she swore and oath to do. Consciously not bothering to do the job you swore an oath to do, and taking the salary to do it. Is that not fraud? Whether she benefited out of any other criminal acts in this scheme is irrelevant. She also made matters fare worse by continued lying in the hope it will all go away. Something she is still seemingly trying to do. I doubt she received one baht personally. But I would not be surprised to learn some of the unaccounted money made its way into PTP coffers for redistribution. Will be very hard to trace and prove as most white collar crime is.

So finally, someone understands that the 700bn is probably the loss between the purchase and sale price.

So now we are talking about possible accounting fraud in the system. That there might be dodgy grade marks and theft in the system. The accusation is 3,000,000 tonnes missing. This might be true, it might not be. Not easy to misplace 3,000,000 mt. Its a lot of rice. How could it be done? False invoicing to the farmers, but 3,000,000 milled rice makes up about 5,500,000 to the farmers. That is virtually one whole crop in a given region. An enormous amount.

Could it be done? Yes. But it would need an enormous amount of compliant farmers to put their names to it, millers to process it, warehouses to produce the paperwork and the list goes on.

Did Yingluck know about this? Who knows? Could and should Yingluck have known about it? Yup. Will they be able to prove it, if she did? I doubt it.

What proof is there yet? Less than a huyndred thousand tonnes missing so far. Not looking good, unless the crime is in one single place.

So now, what is she guilty of if anything? Willfully doing nothing to stop it, if she knew about it. That is bad. As political crimes go, its bad. Is it an organised red shirt scam? So far at 100,000 mT of missing rice. Hardly. People on here are aruging that PTP must have got their mits onto the missing 700bn. Its beyond me how it can be so hard to discover accounting problems for this much rice. It is an enormous figure of the real one. There will have to be provinces where they expect to have 2,000,000 MT of rice buy only 1,000,000 in the warehouse. A million tonnes of rice takes up an astronomical amount of space. Massive.

They need to unearth an enormous amount of missing and misgraded rice, and then trace the invoices and bank payments to farmers for nonexistant rice. As for as I know, that should all be in the Bank of Agriculture records right? It shouldn't be too hard to find. If there is going to be a crime, it will involve one or two companies closely connected to PTP, and it will have had to have been on an enormous scale.

You are focusing on quantitative proof. In my humble opinion they will find that, but you might also want to go back to media reports, pre- coup, where non-quantitative charges were being discussed.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

A qualitative charge that the rice deteriorated ? Hmmmm. Hello? Its 40c and 90% humidity. I don't think that stands up in a court of law.

Hello? I was responding to your comment and agreeing with you.

You may recall that there was discussion in the media, pre-coup, that she may be charged with continuing the program after allegedly receiving credible information that the program was damaging the country. Of course now, they have more access to the numbers than pre-coup, but in my humble opinion her continuing the program may well be one of the charges against her.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[djjamie]

Small or large. There was theft and the PTP said there was none. yingluck doesn't need to get a baht,. She is guilty. She said no irregularities. Full Stop.

yinglucks deputy was Chalerm. Chalerms son's best mate did the investigation so must have overlooked this warehouse.

This is why reform is needed. Thanks for highlighting it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away and nicks some rice, and the local warehouseman is complicit and he doesn't report it. Now, we are entering the realms of fantasy. I think better, she should have just kept touring the country 365 days a year randomly visiting warehouses. At least it would have kept her busier.

I think more appropriate that Chalerms son be hauled in with his inspection report first to work out why he missed it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away

Of course not. I don't live in PTP land,

Of course when yingluck said there were no irregularities and no rice missing and no substitution of good rice for inferrer rice and actually didn't attend any meetings one may get the sneaking feeling she will be found guilty for negligence.

Looking forward to Chalerms son's mate sharing a jail cell with her though!!

Some always forget she did say there were no irregularities. There were ergo she is guilty.

Peace and reconciliation be with you my friend.

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed.

[Prbkk]

Whatever the politics of it, it's sad to see one of Thailand's iconic products have its reputation destroyed in this way. French wine, Swiss chocolate, Thai rice. Once I would always choose Thai rice as the best available, now I wouldn't eat it unless certain of its origin. It will be a long climb back to re-establish its reputation.. Who, given a choice, would eat rice with the possibility of contamination, aflatoxin, weevils, etc? Only those without choice..

I would like to know how they get rid of dodgy rice, apart from burying it or burning it.

Thai people are very fussy about the food they buy, watch them shopping in the markets. When you buy rice at the markets like Wororot Market in Chiang Mai, the rice is on display in large tubs and is scooped into a plastic bag and weighed, right in front of you. If the rice was no good people would not buy it, or indeed try to sell it.

And I can't see BigC selling packaged rice that was full of weevils or poisoned.

Thailand has a very high rate of primary liver cancer. While part of that is due to very high rates of Hepatitis B infection, the other major factor is concurrent exposure to aflatoxin ( a mould found on rice stored incorrectly...cooked or uncooked). This is not a new problem and most western countries importing Thai rice check shipments ( and reject some). In Thailand the combination of Hep B and aflatoxin exposure kills thousands. In the west it is rare other than for alcohol related disease.

Yes, Thais are fussy about rice but many are not savvy about safe use of cooked rice . It is a major public health issue. Things are better for this generation because of the Hep B immunisation at birth program.

The rice in this story should be burnt and not palmed off as token charity to a third world country.

[Cuchulainn]

^^^^.........The rice in this story should be burnt......

NO. It should be dumped on Yingluck's doorstep, maggots, rats and all.

[WitawatWatawit]

Hello? I was responding to your comment and agreeing with you.

You may recall that there was discussion in the media, pre-coup, that she may be charged with continuing the program after allegedly receiving credible information that the program was damaging the country. Of course now, they have more access to the numbers than pre-coup, but in my humble opinion her continuing the program may well be one of the charges against her.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Indeed. A charge of damaging the country. They might as well as charge her with making a system that was "bad" or "nasty".

I find it quite hilarious that some on here are so desperate to get her, that they think she should be held directly accountable for someone nicking some rice from a warehouse hundreds of miles away. Its idiotic.

It's idiotic for you to think that this is just about "someone nicking some rice from a warehouse hundreds of miles away." At the moment it's just the bean counters in the news and we'll see what they come up with over the next 3 weeks. But it's after that when the auditors and accountants start to connect the dots that we could see the real issue come to light - and it's not physical theft, but the amount of grain pledged that did not actually come from farmers, but neighbouring countries (or dragged surreptitiously out of old stocks). That is when things COULD get real interesting for YL. She might not be responsible for the creative accounting in this turgid scheme, but she sure as hell is responsible for not trying to stop it.

[rametindallas]

Small or large. There was theft and the PTP said there was none. yingluck doesn't need to get a baht,. She is guilty. She said no irregularities. Full Stop.

yinglucks deputy was Chalerm. Chalerms son's best mate did the investigation so must have overlooked this warehouse.

This is why reform is needed. Thanks for highlighting it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away and nicks some rice, and the local warehouseman is complicit and he doesn't report it. Now, we are entering the realms of fantasy. I think better, she should have just kept touring the country 365 days a year randomly visiting warehouses. At least it would have kept her busier.

I think more appropriate that Chalerms son be hauled in with his inspection report first to work out why he missed it.

Seriously, how many times, in the face of logical posts, are you going to defend Thaksin's interest. Just stop! You won't answer any direct questions and you continue to troll on Thaksin's behalf. What's your motivation? Surely you can't believe what you write. Talk about 'entering the realm of fantasy', that's you, in a nutshell. As a human being, don't you have any dignity left? This scheme has cost the not-so-rich people of Thailand money that now, can't be spent on education or flood prevention or infrastructure improvements. This scheme has costs Thai farmers their lead as rice exporters and ruined the reputation of Thai rice. Now you have the nerve to make excuses for Yingluck not doing her job to monitor a multi-billion Baht program that she, personally, chairs? Just stop it before you lose your soul. Your name is a deception as you have no Heart; at least not for Thai people.

[Thai at Heart]

Small or large. There was theft and the PTP said there was none. yingluck doesn't need to get a baht,. She is guilty. She said no irregularities. Full Stop.

yinglucks deputy was Chalerm. Chalerms son's best mate did the investigation so must have overlooked this warehouse.

This is why reform is needed. Thanks for highlighting it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away and nicks some rice, and the local warehouseman is complicit and he doesn't report it. Now, we are entering the realms of fantasy. I think better, she should have just kept touring the country 365 days a year randomly visiting warehouses. At least it would have kept her busier.

I think more appropriate that Chalerms son be hauled in with his inspection report first to work out why he missed it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away

Of course not. I don't live in PTP land,

Of course when yingluck said there were no irregularities and no rice missing and no substitution of good rice for inferrer rice and actually didn't attend any meetings one may get the sneaking feeling she will be found guilty for negligence.

Looking forward to Chalerms son's mate sharing a jail cell with her though!!

Some always forget she did say there were no irregularities. There were ergo she is guilty.

Peace and reconciliation be with you my friend.

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions, assuming she was ever told about these issues. Some somchai wants to arrange changing grades or stealing some stuff and you think the guys in situ shouldn't be held accountable first? They need to convict people all the way up the chain first.

[djjamie]

Small or large. There was theft and the PTP said there was none. yingluck doesn't need to get a baht,. She is guilty. She said no irregularities. Full Stop.

yinglucks deputy was Chalerm. Chalerms son's best mate did the investigation so must have overlooked this warehouse.

This is why reform is needed. Thanks for highlighting it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away and nicks some rice, and the local warehouseman is complicit and he doesn't report it. Now, we are entering the realms of fantasy. I think better, she should have just kept touring the country 365 days a year randomly visiting warehouses. At least it would have kept her busier.

I think more appropriate that Chalerms son be hauled in with his inspection report first to work out why he missed it.

Seriously, how many times, in the face of logical posts, are you going to defend Thaksin's interest. Just stop! You won't answer any direct questions and you continue to troll on Thaksin's behalf. What's your motivation? Surely you can't believe what you write. Talk about 'entering the realm of fantasy', that's you, in a nutshell. As a human being, don't you have any dignity left? This scheme has cost the not-so-rich people of Thailand money that now, can't be spent on education or flood prevention or infrastructure improvements. This scheme has costs Thai farmers their lead as rice exporters and ruined the reputation of Thai rice. Now you have the nerve to make excuses for Yingluck not doing her job to monitor a multi-billion Baht program that she, personally, chairs? Just stop it before you lose your soul. Your name is a deception as you have no Heart; at least not for Thai people.

The sad thing is it is the Thai people that are negatively impacted because of this scheme yet it is still defended.

The suicides are even deflected as an inconvenient truth that ensures excuses are made for the tragic deaths to defend the PTP.

When it gets to the point that people are thrown aside and disregarded to defend a regime then in highlights their hypocrisy and lack of understanding when they say the Junta are bad.

I feel all warm and fuzzy when after the 24th of May ALL terrorist attacks stopped.

That tells me I support the right side.

[JesseFrank]

Small or large. There was theft and the PTP said there was none. yingluck doesn't need to get a baht,. She is guilty. She said no irregularities. Full Stop.

yinglucks deputy was Chalerm. Chalerms son's best mate did the investigation so must have overlooked this warehouse.

This is why reform is needed. Thanks for highlighting it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away and nicks some rice, and the local warehouseman is complicit and he doesn't report it. Now, we are entering the realms of fantasy. I think better, she should have just kept touring the country 365 days a year randomly visiting warehouses. At least it would have kept her busier.

I think more appropriate that Chalerms son be hauled in with his inspection report first to work out why he missed it.

I must have missed the news article where there was announced that the warehouse was broken into .

Why do you think the warehouseman wouldn't report a break in ?

And yes, a prime minister is accountable for all the thefts the administration is involved in, that's why she's prime minister.

[kimamey]

Small or large. There was theft and the PTP said there was none. yingluck doesn't need to get a baht,. She is guilty. She said no irregularities. Full Stop.

yinglucks deputy was Chalerm. Chalerms son's best mate did the investigation so must have overlooked this warehouse.

This is why reform is needed. Thanks for highlighting it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away and nicks some rice, and the local warehouseman is complicit and he doesn't report it. Now, we are entering the realms of fantasy. I think better, she should have just kept touring the country 365 days a year randomly visiting warehouses. At least it would have kept her busier.

I think more appropriate that Chalerms son be hauled in with his inspection report first to work out why he missed it.

I think she was touring other countries most of the time.

[djjamie]

Small or large. There was theft and the PTP said there was none. yingluck doesn't need to get a baht,. She is guilty. She said no irregularities. Full Stop.

yinglucks deputy was Chalerm. Chalerms son's best mate did the investigation so must have overlooked this warehouse.

This is why reform is needed. Thanks for highlighting it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away and nicks some rice, and the local warehouseman is complicit and he doesn't report it. Now, we are entering the realms of fantasy. I think better, she should have just kept touring the country 365 days a year randomly visiting warehouses. At least it would have kept her busier.

I think more appropriate that Chalerms son be hauled in with his inspection report first to work out why he missed it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away

Of course not. I don't live in PTP land,

Of course when yingluck said there were no irregularities and no rice missing and no substitution of good rice for inferrer rice and actually didn't attend any meetings one may get the sneaking feeling she will be found guilty for negligence.

Looking forward to Chalerms son's mate sharing a jail cell with her though!!

Some always forget she did say there were no irregularities. There were ergo she is guilty.

Peace and reconciliation be with you my friend.

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions, assuming she was ever told about these issues. Some somchai wants to arrange changing grades or stealing some stuff and you think the guys in situ shouldn't be held accountable first? They need to convict people all the way up the chain first.

Whhaaa?

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions?

Yet Ahbisit is stringently and absolutely accused by the PTP / UDD of murder.

Back to the point though and the inconvenient truth which you refuse to acknowledge.

yingluck said there was no corruption. She was wrong.

yingluck said there was no irregularities. She was wrong.

yingluck said no rice was substituted. She was wrong.

Not only are you defending a regime over a poor population that you openly supported previously when it suited the regimes agenda not only are also defending a regime that has lied you are also part of the ilk that said THERE was no corruption. (you were wrong), THERE was not irregularities (you were wrong) and THERE was no substituted rice ( you were wrong)

So now you were wrong son on all of the above you transfer the argument to the next stage, which is blaming others..That is PTP logic my friend, plain and simple.

yingluck lied. Get over it.

<EDIT> Sorry…I always wanted to say this..You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for murder?

Edited July 9, 2014 by djjamie

[Thai at Heart]

It's idiotic for you to think that this is just about "someone nicking some rice from a warehouse hundreds of miles away." At the moment it's just the bean counters in the news and we'll see what they come up with over the next 3 weeks. But it's after that when the auditors and accountants start to connect the dots that we could see the real issue come to light - and it's not physical theft, but the amount of grain pledged that did not actually come from farmers, but neighbouring countries (or dragged surreptitiously out of old stocks). That is when things COULD get real interesting for YL. She might not be responsible for the creative accounting in this turgid scheme, but she sure as hell is responsible for not trying to stop it.

So why is everyone jumping up and down on here screaming "scam" when they find afew thousand tonnes of missing rice. You are making exactly the point that I am. Finding a few thousand missing sacks is not the issue. Screaming that "we all know" she all got paid is not the point.

They are trying to account for 19,000,000 tonnes of the stuff. Yes, she might be responsible for not stopping it.

[Robby nz]

Hello? I was responding to your comment and agreeing with you.

You may recall that there was discussion in the media, pre-coup, that she may be charged with continuing the program after allegedly receiving credible information that the program was damaging the country. Of course now, they have more access to the numbers than pre-coup, but in my humble opinion her continuing the program may well be one of the charges against her.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Indeed. A charge of damaging the country. They might as well as charge her with making a system that was "bad" or "nasty".

I find it quite hilarious that some on here are so desperate to get her, that they think she should be held directly accountable for someone nicking some rice from a warehouse hundreds of miles away. Its idiotic.

The desperation is all yours in the way you are trying to defend her and the whole scheme.

She put herself in as chair of the policy committee that was in charge of the scheme, there can be no argument about that.

Such a position brings with it a certain responsibility, like to ensure that the scheme is run to the optimum benefit for those who it was intended to help and of course to minimize the loss to the country.

She denied several times that there were irregularities in the scheme and said no rice was missing, that is a matter of record and is also either a statement born of ignorance or an outright lie for in her position of chair of the policy committee she should have known the facts.

The NACC have determined in their investigation that she did not fulfill the responsibility she took on and therefor was negligent in her duty.

That negligence has, and will continue to cost the country dearly, that some who have put down roots here are unhappy with that is understandable.

Nothing whatsoever about her stealing rice, that has only come out in your posts for I have not seen in any other posts an accusation of her stealing rice.

You have had to admit that large quantities of rice are missing with clear evidence of an attempted cover-up, but tried to minimize it, a drop in the ocean.

You have had to admit there is a fair quantity of bad rice in the few warehouses that have so far been inspected, photos in this case have not lied.

Yet you still try to defend the indefensible....Its not working.

Again note !

The figure of almost 3 million tons missing came from an audit of the whole scheme from inception to the date of the report,

A completely different thing to what will be found to be missing from the present spot inspection.

[Thai at Heart]

Whhaaa?

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions?

Yet Ahbisit is stringently and absolutely accused by the PTP / UDD of murder.

Back to the point though and the inconvenient truth which you refuse to acknowledge.

yingluck said there was no corruption. She was wrong.

yingluck said there was no irregularities. She was wrong.

yingluck said no rice was substituted. She was wrong.

Not only are you defending a regime over a poor population that you openly supported previously when it suited the regimes agenda not only are also defending a regime that has lied you are also part of the ilk that said THERE was no corruption. (you were wrong), THERE was not irregularities (you were wrong) and THERE was no substituted rice ( you were wrong)

So now you were wrong son on all of the above you transfer the argument to the next stage, which is blaming others..That is PTP logic my friend, plain and simple.

yingluck lied. Get over it.

<EDIT> Sorry…I always wanted to say this..You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for murder?

Where have they proved any of the above things so far. Yes, some rice seems to have been nicked. The subsistiuted is still pending, and I await the judgement. There is no concrete proof of corruption yet.

I await far more evidence than they have come up with yet. I await them reconciling the 3,000,000 tonnes of apparenlty missing product.

[djjamie]

Whhaaa?

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions?

Yet Ahbisit is stringently and absolutely accused by the PTP / UDD of murder.

Back to the point though and the inconvenient truth which you refuse to acknowledge.

yingluck said there was no corruption. She was wrong.

yingluck said there was no irregularities. She was wrong.

yingluck said no rice was substituted. She was wrong.

Not only are you defending a regime over a poor population that you openly supported previously when it suited the regimes agenda not only are also defending a regime that has lied you are also part of the ilk that said THERE was no corruption. (you were wrong), THERE was not irregularities (you were wrong) and THERE was no substituted rice ( you were wrong)

So now you were wrong son on all of the above you transfer the argument to the next stage, which is blaming others..That is PTP logic my friend, plain and simple.

yingluck lied. Get over it.

<EDIT> Sorry…I always wanted to say this..You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for murder?

Where have they proved any of the above things so far. Yes, some rice seems to have been nicked. The subsistiuted is still pending, and I await the judgement. There is no concrete proof of corruption yet.

I await far more evidence than they have come up with yet. I await them reconciling the 3,000,000 tonnes of apparenlty missing product.

Mateeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!

Do you understand that yingluck is not up on corruption charges?

She is up on negligence charges...

I give up!!!!

[Thai at Heart]

Hello? I was responding to your comment and agreeing with you.

You may recall that there was discussion in the media, pre-coup, that she may be charged with continuing the program after allegedly receiving credible information that the program was damaging the country. Of course now, they have more access to the numbers than pre-coup, but in my humble opinion her continuing the program may well be one of the charges against her.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Indeed. A charge of damaging the country. They might as well as charge her with making a system that was "bad" or "nasty".

I find it quite hilarious that some on here are so desperate to get her, that they think she should be held directly accountable for someone nicking some rice from a warehouse hundreds of miles away. Its idiotic.

The desperation is all yours in the way you are trying to defend her and the whole scheme.

She put herself in as chair of the policy committee that was in charge of the scheme, there can be no argument about that.

Such a position brings with it a certain responsibility, like to ensure that the scheme is run to the optimum benefit for those who it was intended to help and of course to minimize the loss to the country.

She denied several times that there were irregularities in the scheme and said no rice was missing, that is a matter of record and is also either a statement born of ignorance or an outright lie for in her position of chair of the policy committee she should have known the facts.

The NACC have determined in their investigation that she did not fulfill the responsibility she took on and therefor was negligent in her duty.

That negligence has, and will continue to cost the country dearly, that some who have put down roots here are unhappy with that is understandable.

Nothing whatsoever about her stealing rice, that has only come out in your posts for I have not seen in any other posts an accusation of her stealing rice.

You have had to admit that large quantities of rice are missing with clear evidence of an attempted cover-up, but tried to minimize it, a drop in the ocean.

You have had to admit there is a fair quantity of bad rice in the few warehouses that have so far been inspected, photos in this case have not lied.

Yet you still try to defend the indefensible....Its not working.

Again note !

The figure of almost 3 million tons missing came from an audit of the whole scheme from inception to the date of the report,

A completely different thing to what will be found to be missing from the present spot inspection.

So they believe that there is a total of 3mn tonnes over the entire duration of the whole scheme? How much rice per year? 25,000,000 tonnes of padi? So they believe that they may have lost 4%?

And this is an issue? &lt;deleted&gt;? So they aren't actually expecting to find very much missing at all?

You do realise they took down a government over this? Removed a democratically elected government because of supposed corruption in this system, and you think 4% loss is excessive? Go check the history of the olive crop subsidies in the EU.

[Thai at Heart]

Whhaaa?

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions?

Yet Ahbisit is stringently and absolutely accused by the PTP / UDD of murder.

Back to the point though and the inconvenient truth which you refuse to acknowledge.

yingluck said there was no corruption. She was wrong.

yingluck said there was no irregularities. She was wrong.

yingluck said no rice was substituted. She was wrong.

Not only are you defending a regime over a poor population that you openly supported previously when it suited the regimes agenda not only are also defending a regime that has lied you are also part of the ilk that said THERE was no corruption. (you were wrong), THERE was not irregularities (you were wrong) and THERE was no substituted rice ( you were wrong)

So now you were wrong son on all of the above you transfer the argument to the next stage, which is blaming others..That is PTP logic my friend, plain and simple.

yingluck lied. Get over it.

<EDIT> Sorry…I always wanted to say this..You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for murder?

Where have they proved any of the above things so far. Yes, some rice seems to have been nicked. The subsistiuted is still pending, and I await the judgement. There is no concrete proof of corruption yet.

I await far more evidence than they have come up with yet. I await them reconciling the 3,000,000 tonnes of apparenlty missing product.

Mateeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!

Do you understand that yingluck is not up on corruption charges?

She is up on negligence charges...

I give up!!!!

So there is no scam then? Or if there was, which they haven't proven yet, she was definitely negligent of uncovering a scam that they haven't uncovered yet?

[Robby nz]

Whhaaa?

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions?

Yet Ahbisit is stringently and absolutely accused by the PTP / UDD of murder.

Back to the point though and the inconvenient truth which you refuse to acknowledge.

yingluck said there was no corruption. She was wrong.

yingluck said there was no irregularities. She was wrong.

yingluck said no rice was substituted. She was wrong.

Not only are you defending a regime over a poor population that you openly supported previously when it suited the regimes agenda not only are also defending a regime that has lied you are also part of the ilk that said THERE was no corruption. (you were wrong), THERE was not irregularities (you were wrong) and THERE was no substituted rice ( you were wrong)

So now you were wrong son on all of the above you transfer the argument to the next stage, which is blaming others..That is PTP logic my friend, plain and simple.

yingluck lied. Get over it.

<EDIT> Sorry…I always wanted to say this..You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for murder?

Where have they proved any of the above things so far. Yes, some rice seems to have been nicked. The subsistiuted is still pending, and I await the judgement. There is no concrete proof of corruption yet.

I await far more evidence than they have come up with yet. I await them reconciling the 3,000,000 tonnes of apparenlty missing product.

Mateeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!

Do you understand that yingluck is not up on corruption charges?

She is up on negligence charges...

I give up!!!!

So there is no scam then? Or if there was, which they haven't proven yet, she was definitely negligent of uncovering a scam that they haven't uncovered yet?

You should go have a sleep, you have completely lost the plot this time.

[northernjohn]

No there is no problem with the rice all the stock is good (according to Yingluck and her gang and of course the red cheerleaders here on Thaivisa)

More and more it becomes clear how expensive this scam was to buy votes and stay in power.

Yingluck is looking for more witness in her trial for corruption regarding the rice scam.

I wonder if she would except the head inspector on the job in the warehouse as a witness for her.

[englishoak]

Small or large. There was theft and the PTP said there was none. yingluck doesn't need to get a baht,. She is guilty. She said no irregularities. Full Stop.

yinglucks deputy was Chalerm. Chalerms son's best mate did the investigation so must have overlooked this warehouse.

This is why reform is needed. Thanks for highlighting it.

You think reasonably a prime minister should be held accountable because someone breaks into a warehouse hundreds of miles away and nicks some rice, and the local warehouseman is complicit and he doesn't report it. Now, we are entering the realms of fantasy. I think better, she should have just kept touring the country 365 days a year randomly visiting warehouses. At least it would have kept her busier.

I think more appropriate that Chalerms son be hauled in with his inspection report first to work out why he missed it.

Seriously, how many times, in the face of logical posts, are you going to defend Thaksin's interest. Just stop! You won't answer any direct questions and you continue to troll on Thaksin's behalf. What's your motivation? Surely you can't believe what you write. Talk about 'entering the realm of fantasy', that's you, in a nutshell. As a human being, don't you have any dignity left? This scheme has cost the not-so-rich people of Thailand money that now, can't be spent on education or flood prevention or infrastructure improvements. This scheme has costs Thai farmers their lead as rice exporters and ruined the reputation of Thai rice. Now you have the nerve to make excuses for Yingluck not doing her job to monitor a multi-billion Baht program that she, personally, chairs? Just stop it before you lose your soul. Your name is a deception as you have no Heart; at least not for Thai people.

Sorry but hes been making perfect sense the whole time, just because you have a hysterical obsession to lay blame at any cost no matter how thin details and evidence does not mean hes making excuses for anyone.

Hes actually laid a lot out of the logistics and size and amount, your just begging for your boogy man to be the reason with nothing to substantiate anything ..

If you cant debate and argue with similar logic then dont bother posting the usual ... "you must be red bs blah blah" Because you sound like a hysterical woman off a Thai soap opera.

It will shake itself out or not depending, It also wont mean that there wasnt any involvement by PTP of course just its not been proven. My bet is there will be no big scandal as its likely to involve far too many close to home rather than just a couple of your PTP villains or Yingluck.

Try to remember how the Thai system works and how connected these people are whatever your colour bent you can be sure they dont give a rats who they work with as long as theres money to be made.

Edited July 9, 2014 by englishoak

[rubl]

Knowing what happened with the rice actually delivered by farmers is only part of the RPPS story.

The BAAC paid out for the government to anyone who showed the proper government papers, be they farmers, warehouse owners, transporters, whoever. I would assume that the BAAC needing to get the government to reimburse them, has kept proper administration on all.

While some follow the rice trail others should do an audit on the BAAC paperwork and provide details on how those nearly 1 trillion Baht have been spent. Another team to digest the data on what and how much rice from government stock has actually been sold and how much income has been generated from that.

I'm afraid that the rice mountain itself is just the tip of a larger scandal.

[siampolee]

Cuchulainn post # 126

NO. It should be dumped on Yingluck's doorstep, maggots, rats and all.

I presume you are making a reference to the P.T.P. with the above comment. Said P.T.P. have dumped Yingluck at her brothers orders

.Ah the delfghts of throw away brotherly love.

[craigt3365]

Several bickering posts have been removed from view. Please keep it civil.

[djjamie]

Hello? I was responding to your comment and agreeing with you.

You may recall that there was discussion in the media, pre-coup, that she may be charged with continuing the program after allegedly receiving credible information that the program was damaging the country. Of course now, they have more access to the numbers than pre-coup, but in my humble opinion her continuing the program may well be one of the charges against her.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Indeed. A charge of damaging the country. They might as well as charge her with making a system that was "bad" or "nasty".

I find it quite hilarious that some on here are so desperate to get her, that they think she should be held directly accountable for someone nicking some rice from a warehouse hundreds of miles away. Its idiotic.

The desperation is all yours in the way you are trying to defend her and the whole scheme.

She put herself in as chair of the policy committee that was in charge of the scheme, there can be no argument about that.

Such a position brings with it a certain responsibility, like to ensure that the scheme is run to the optimum benefit for those who it was intended to help and of course to minimize the loss to the country.

She denied several times that there were irregularities in the scheme and said no rice was missing, that is a matter of record and is also either a statement born of ignorance or an outright lie for in her position of chair of the policy committee she should have known the facts.

The NACC have determined in their investigation that she did not fulfill the responsibility she took on and therefor was negligent in her duty.

That negligence has, and will continue to cost the country dearly, that some who have put down roots here are unhappy with that is understandable.

Nothing whatsoever about her stealing rice, that has only come out in your posts for I have not seen in any other posts an accusation of her stealing rice.

You have had to admit that large quantities of rice are missing with clear evidence of an attempted cover-up, but tried to minimize it, a drop in the ocean.

You have had to admit there is a fair quantity of bad rice in the few warehouses that have so far been inspected, photos in this case have not lied.

Yet you still try to defend the indefensible....Its not working.

Again note !

The figure of almost 3 million tons missing came from an audit of the whole scheme from inception to the date of the report,

A completely different thing to what will be found to be missing from the present spot inspection.

So they believe that there is a total of 3mn tonnes over the entire duration of the whole scheme? How much rice per year? 25,000,000 tonnes of padi? So they believe that they may have lost 4%?

And this is an issue? <deleted>? So they aren't actually expecting to find very much missing at all?

You do realise they took down a government over this? Removed a democratically elected government because of supposed corruption in this system, and you think 4% loss is excessive? Go check the history of the olive crop subsidies in the EU.

They didn't take down the government because of this. They took it down because of the daily terrorist attacks that were done with impunity by the people that brought the government to power.

I don't care if it was 1% or even 0.00000001% Why? Because the PTP said 0.000000000% was missing or stolen and there was 0.000000000% irregularities.

Had the PTP said there was 4% stolen and we will investigate this and if yingluck followed that up with "Go check the history of the olive crop subsidies in the EU" I would completely understand that. I would respect yingluck. BUT no. She said 0.000000% irregularities.

Can you not face that inconvenient truth that the PTP lied?

Edited July 10, 2014 by djjamie

[Old Man River]

Whhaaa?

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions?

Yet Ahbisit is stringently and absolutely accused by the PTP / UDD of murder.

Back to the point though and the inconvenient truth which you refuse to acknowledge.

yingluck said there was no corruption. She was wrong.

yingluck said there was no irregularities. She was wrong.

yingluck said no rice was substituted. She was wrong.

Not only are you defending a regime over a poor population that you openly supported previously when it suited the regimes agenda not only are also defending a regime that has lied you are also part of the ilk that said THERE was no corruption. (you were wrong), THERE was not irregularities (you were wrong) and THERE was no substituted rice ( you were wrong)

So now you were wrong son on all of the above you transfer the argument to the next stage, which is blaming others..That is PTP logic my friend, plain and simple.

yingluck lied. Get over it.

Sorry…I always wanted to say this..You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for murder?

Where have they proved any of the above things so far. Yes, some rice seems to have been nicked. The subsistiuted is still pending, and I await the judgement. There is no concrete proof of corruption yet.

I await far more evidence than they have come up with yet. I await them reconciling the 3,000,000 tonnes of apparenlty missing product.

Mateeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!

Do you understand that yingluck is not up on corruption charges?

She is up on negligence charges...

I give up!!!!

Don't give up.

Maybe this will help (note: the source is TV, from an article that appeared in The Nation):

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/674737-open-letter-pridiyathorn-writes-to-pm-yingluck-opposing-rice-pledging/

Also, others may recall Thailand's Auditor General's (Jiruvan at the time) report on the losses being incurred as of a few years ago.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Thai at Heart]

Whhaaa?

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions?

Yet Ahbisit is stringently and absolutely accused by the PTP / UDD of murder.

Back to the point though and the inconvenient truth which you refuse to acknowledge.

yingluck said there was no corruption. She was wrong.

yingluck said there was no irregularities. She was wrong.

yingluck said no rice was substituted. She was wrong.

Not only are you defending a regime over a poor population that you openly supported previously when it suited the regimes agenda not only are also defending a regime that has lied you are also part of the ilk that said THERE was no corruption. (you were wrong), THERE was not irregularities (you were wrong) and THERE was no substituted rice ( you were wrong)

So now you were wrong son on all of the above you transfer the argument to the next stage, which is blaming others..That is PTP logic my friend, plain and simple.

yingluck lied. Get over it.

SorryI always wanted to say this..You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for murder?

Where have they proved any of the above things so far. Yes, some rice seems to have been nicked. The subsistiuted is still pending, and I await the judgement. There is no concrete proof of corruption yet.

I await far more evidence than they have come up with yet. I await them reconciling the 3,000,000 tonnes of apparenlty missing product.

Mateeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!

Do you understand that yingluck is not up on corruption charges?

She is up on negligence charges...

I give up!!!!

Don't give up.

Maybe this will help (note: the source is TV, from an article that appeared in The Nation):

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/674737-open-letter-pridiyathorn-writes-to-pm-yingluck-opposing-rice-pledging/

Also, others may recall Thailand's Auditor General's (Jiruvan at the time) report on the losses being incurred as of a few years ago.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

This is a loss incurred by the policy. And????

Shall I send you a link to the CAP and how that works. Or maybe the USA corn or cotton systems . Or Japanese rice?

[Old Man River]

Whhaaa?

You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for these types of actions?

Yet Ahbisit is stringently and absolutely accused by the PTP / UDD of murder.

Back to the point though and the inconvenient truth which you refuse to acknowledge.

yingluck said there was no corruption. She was wrong.

yingluck said there was no irregularities. She was wrong.

yingluck said no rice was substituted. She was wrong.

Not only are you defending a regime over a poor population that you openly supported previously when it suited the regimes agenda not only are also defending a regime that has lied you are also part of the ilk that said THERE was no corruption. (you were wrong), THERE was not irregularities (you were wrong) and THERE was no substituted rice ( you were wrong)

So now you were wrong son on all of the above you transfer the argument to the next stage, which is blaming others..That is PTP logic my friend, plain and simple.

yingluck lied. Get over it.

SorryI always wanted to say this..You are living in lala land if any politician in this position would be held personally responsible for murder?

Where have they proved any of the above things so far. Yes, some rice seems to have been nicked. The subsistiuted is still pending, and I await the judgement. There is no concrete proof of corruption yet.

I await far more evidence than they have come up with yet. I await them reconciling the 3,000,000 tonnes of apparenlty missing product.

Mateeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!

Do you understand that yingluck is not up on corruption charges?

She is up on negligence charges...

I give up!!!!

Don't give up.

Maybe this will help (note: the source is TV, from an article that appeared in The Nation):

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/674737-open-letter-pridiyathorn-writes-to-pm-yingluck-opposing-rice-pledging/

Also, others may recall Thailand's Auditor General's (Jiruvan at the time) report on the losses being incurred as of a few years ago.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

This is a loss incurred by the policy. And????

Shall I send you a link to the CAP and how that works. Or maybe the USA corn or cotton systems . Or Japanese rice?

If you are talking about the derivatives markets, I can teach you, but this has not been reported as a derivatives transaction. In addition, a Floor would make more sense than a Cap.

Instead, it has been reported as paying far above market, and then starting with an approx. 30% market share, speculating with hundreds of millions of USD's of the Country's money that by slowing down exports they could drive up market prices. It didn't work. However, since you offered, please show me how the US and Japan have likewise used similar commodities market related speculative programs as the mainstay of their agriculture related subsidies.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[AleG]

You are focusing on quantitative proof. In my humble opinion they will find that, but you might also want to go back to media reports, pre- coup, where non-quantitative charges were being discussed.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

A qualitative charge that the rice deteriorated ? Hmmmm. Hello? Its 40c and 90% humidity. I don't think that stands up in a court of law.

Really, don't think so?

So if I charge you for X amount of money to keep your commodity in good conditions you'd be just fine with me pocketing the money and letting it rot instead?

How charitable of you.