Lose Passport At Your Peril

[durhamboy]

http://bali-news-views.blogspot.co.uk/2014/07/cornwall-man-stranded-in-bali-after.html

Apparently the Indonesian man in this article has ILR and lived in the UK with his British wife and son for 14 years. He lost his passport when on a trip to Indonesia and now cannot get back into the UK.

This is obviously a sad tale of woe for the family.

The Home Office are "conducting the necessary checks" to establish his claim to ILR. However, he has been stuck in Indonesia for 5 months!

On the presumption that the man knew the details of his own Indonesian passport, does this mean that the Home Office does not have a database that they can easily interrogate to establish such claims?

Frankly, if true then that wouldn't surprise me and would be yet another example of the shameful shambles of an immigration system we have in this country.

[NanLaew]

The importance of keeping secure copies of your most important documents is the only thing that I take away from poor Agung's sorry situation. Dealing with British bureaucracy is hard enough when you are born a Brit and actually there!

Good luck!

[Jay Sata]

After 14 years it would have made sense to have taken UK citizenship.

[durhamboy]

After 14 years it would have made sense to have taken UK citizenship.

Yes but unfortunately I don't think Indonesia recognises dual citizenship.

[Jay Sata]

No need to tell them!

[OJAS]

And were he in a position to take British citizenship right now, he'd probably have to wait another 14 years for his first passport given the current HMPO shambles!

[Thongkorn]

all he has to do is quote his National Insurance Number. If he has ILR he will be ok, there is some thing wrong here that is not being told.

[Jay Sata]

He should also have his old passport/s which will have the stamps in it.

No passport on this planet lasts 14 years!

[7by7]

all he has to do is quote his National Insurance Number. If he has ILR he will be ok, there is some thing wrong here that is not being told.

I agree that there is probably more here than the article linked to in the OP, and others, would have us believe.

This, from an article in West Briton, is interesting

Mrs Bain said: "Agung has been refused a replacement passport as there was no proof of him holding indefinite leave to remain.

Why would the Indonesian authorities refuse to issue him a replacement passport? Whatever LTR he may have for the UK is not their concern and so not something they would consider before doing so.

BTW, having an NI number is no indication of one's immigration status in the UK. Anyone who is legally working in the UK requires one, regardless of their immigration status, and once issued it is kept for life.

For example, my wife once worked with a Burmese girl who was in the UK as a student; as she was working she needed a NI number. She finished her studies and returned home but still has her NI number even though she no longer has a valid visa or LTR for the UK.

[Basil B]

all he has to do is quote his National Insurance Number. If he has ILR he will be ok, there is some thing wrong here that is not being told.

I agree that there is probably more here than the article linked to in the OP, and others, would have us believe.

This, from an article in West Briton, is interesting

Mrs Bain said: "Agung has been refused a replacement passport as there was no proof of him holding indefinite leave to remain.

Why would the Indonesian authorities refuse to issue him a replacement passport? Whatever LTR he may have for the UK is not their concern and so not something they would consider before doing so.

BTW, having an NI number is no indication of one's immigration status in the UK. Anyone who is legally working in the UK requires one, regardless of their immigration status, and once issued it is kept for life.

For example, my wife once worked with a Burmese girl who was in the UK as a student; as she was working she needed a NI number. She finished her studies and returned home but still has her NI number even though she no longer has a valid visa or LTR for the UK.

The only advantage to a NI number is for the UKVI to cross reference it to trace this guys records.

I am sure there is no way the UKVI would have destroyed all documentation on this guy, (if they had any in the first place).

Before I am shouted down, this is only a possible scenario.

The guy never had a legitimate ILR, possibly a good fake, now UK boarder staff are looking more closer, he decided to ditch it playing on he had been here so long and so many people believed he had ILR he could blag it on the principle that UKVI are incompetent and do lose things and if he shouted loud enough they would give him ILR

As I said only hypothetically possible...

Edited July 14, 2014 by Basil B

[durhamboy]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-28293497

Breaking news as I write - he is now being allowed back into the UK as it seems that, after 5 months and a recent media blitz, the Home Office has found his records after all. Therefore he was telling the truth all along.

One of the more disturbing aspects of this case in this computer age is the apparent lack of easily accessable records held by the Home Office. Personally I would have thought that they would have a database which could be interrogated. The matter should have been sorted out in a few days not 5 months.

Therefore does this mean that the Home Office really has no idea who is in the UK and what their visa status is? Could people just overstay in the UK indefinitely without ever getting a knock on the door?

[evadgib]

He & family could have saved a lot of hassle if they'd stored copies of everything in a cloud based file from the onset.

[Jay Sata]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-28293497

Breaking news as I write - he is now being allowed back into the UK as it seems that, after 5 months and a recent media blitz, the Home Office has found his records after all. Therefore he was telling the truth all along.

One of the more disturbing aspects of this case in this computer age is the apparent lack of easily accessable records held by the Home Office. Personally I would have thought that they would have a database which could be interrogated. The matter should have been sorted out in a few days not 5 months.

Therefore does this mean that the Home Office really has no idea who is in the UK and what their visa status is? Could people just overstay in the UK indefinitely without ever getting a knock on the door?

The problem is a lot of old paper files are not kept these days.

At least it was a good result but the passport holder should really have kept photocopies and a back up of the documents. It is always worth having photocopies of your passport.

[durhamboy]

Yes Jay I agree that people should keep copies of passports etc. However, most people don't. After I read the article I realised I hadn't got a copy of my wife's settlement visa page in her passport. I am now rectifying that but these things are so easily overlooked.

I suppose a lot of old files may have been thrown out by the Home Office and this particular case is about 12 years old. If so, shouldn't the Home Office have extracted the essential data from those files into a computer database.

No one has yet answered the question I posed which is basically - is the Home Office ignorant of the majority of immigrant's visa status? Of course, we don't know how the Home Office works. This case just gives us a tiny glimpse of their ineptitude. I suspect that it is just the tip of the iceberg.

[personchester]

After 14 years it would have made sense to have taken UK citizenship.

Yes but unfortunately I don't think Indonesia recognises dual citizenship.

Many countries do this, I know two chaps one from Germany and one from Belgium, after living many years in the UK they applied and got British Citizenship.

The British Home office informed the German and the Belgian Embassy in London about this, and within a week the two chaps lost their original citizenship and passport was instantly cancelled.

[Seekingasylum]

I rather think this is a salutary lesson for all who may have thought that the British Home Office was a competent organisation, staffed by intelligent people and resourced to a degree commensurate with its economic standing in the world.

It is probably on a par with Cambodia, India and the Sudan but one may be somewhat uncharitable to those countries in making such a comparison.

Stupid is as stupid does. And these days one truly struggles to find worse. My dealings with them have certainly made me rethink how the Thai operate.

How long does it take to get a passport now? Six months seems to be the period although that assumes they haven't lost the application form, eaten a page with their sandwiches or just forgot to go to the right desk that day.

[personchester]

I rather think this is a salutary lesson for all who may have thought that the British Home Office was a competent organisation, staffed by intelligent people and resourced to a degree commensurate with its economic standing in the world.

It is probably on a par with Cambodia, India and the Sudan but one may be somewhat uncharitable to those countries in making such a comparison.

Stupid is as stupid does. And these days one truly struggles to find worse. My dealings with them have certainly made me rethink how the Thai operate.

How long does it take to get a passport now? Six months seems to be the period although that assumes they haven't lost the application form, eaten a page with their sandwiches or just forgot to go to the right desk that day.

The current UK Passport application procedure is very messy indeed for Brits both in UK and abroad,

Due to those messy applications the procedure will eventually be changed because the Labour party, together with many Westminster MP's of other parties are opposing it.

[Basil B]

The current UK Passport application procedure is very messy indeed for Brits both in UK and abroad,

Due to those messy applications the procedure will eventually be changed because the Labour party, together with many Westminster MP's of other parties are opposing it.

Seeing that this was probably an issue when the ILR was issued 14 years ago, maybe "Politically Correct Mancunian" may wish to reflect who was the party of government at the time?