Tourist visa holders denied entry to Thailand and left stranded in Malaysia

[draftvader]

The fact that those denied entry were told they could fly into Thailand instead suggests there's a monetary angle here. I guess the initiative is to fill Thai and Bangkok Airways flights.

Makes you start wondering about the link between certain people and certain airlines, doesn't it. Conspiracy theory? Perhaps.

I'll believe that if Don Muaeng enforces a strict interpretation whilst Suvarnabhumi does not. That will be the indicator.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

i stop being suprised here years ago.... ..buy a legal visa from a THAI consul (WHO HAVE THE POWER TO REFUSE) and then be refused entry at teh border...idiotic to say the least

It's again worth remembering that possession of a visa doesn't guarantee the holder admission to a country, it's the Immigration Officer at the Border that has the final say, this applies to most countries in the World, including the likes of the UK, the Schengen Area and the United States of America.

A cold fact that apparently needs to be repeated ad infinitum since some people seem incapable of understanding it.

Exactly now put yourself in the shoes of someone who requires (or wants) a TV to visit. Let's see go pay money at consulate in my country, book flights, hotels and hope and pray that some guy is not having an off day.....

The point being, they didn't pay for a tourist VISA in their home country.

Tourists go home, work for a while, then come on holiday.

People working illegally in Thailand, rarely return to their home countries, they visit a neighbouring country and buy a VISA from a corrupt consulate.

What is happening makes a lot of sense.

You want to work or live in Thailand, get the correct VISA, not a tourist VISA.

[noonms]

I agree with this, and actually it's not like this hasn't been done before, accept for already having a visa. Get rid of these beach bum back packers taking jobs from the locals.

I can I still Remember that you got a free visa!

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[Ned]

The TM7 form for extending Non O visas is titled:

Application For Extension Of Temporary Stay In The Kingdom.

The axe could fall anywhere.

[tonywillo]

It is only the habitual and long term users of tourist visas who are having problems

There has been so much coverage of the new stance the people concerned should not be surprised

Thailand gas a new government that is trying to achieve many many needed changes that acts with strength and determination, this has been needed for a long time

WARNING TO THOSE ON OVERSTAY, you need to leave immediately, and clean up your act, before the new regulations come in or you will risk being banned, it is not difficult to get retirement or marriage visas which probably cover 95% of those on overstay

I am personally in favor or the law being properly enforced

The Thai's I know are clapping their hands over this it should sort out the fugitives and the scum that are lingering in the country on weak immigration laws one said. Another from Thai / Australian said she wanted the government to set up a few special detention centres just like Australia. Overstay a day and be detained a day etc etc.

[Cypress Hill]

If your a tourist (financially stable and not working in the country) why should it matter how many tourist visas you have? If you have the funds to support yourself and wish to visit a country without being over 50, married to a local, or teaching English then why should it matter?

All these Thai Visa clowns are so quick to judge everyone else when they married a bar girl or borrowed money to put in an account for a retirement visa (ooops - how does it feel to be judged based on a small minority of people?)

First the Cambodians were kicked out - and people blamed the Cambodians for overreacting to rumours

Then the Myanmar refugees were kicked out - and people turned a blind eye to that

Now legit Visa holders are being denied - and they are being blamed for being "multiple tourist visa holders"

Its coming for you next. Let's see how your lovely loyal Thai wife deals with the mutual Thai bank account/ business/ property when your marriage visa renewal is denied. One thing is for sure, the next group in line to be targeted will be too busy pointing fingers at your faults to see it coming for them.

Post of the thread.

All he fools pointing fingers with a smug, more-legal-than-thou attitude should be very worried indeed. 800,000 baht isn't a lot of money these days. There are rumblings that it's going to be increased substantially. There are also rumours suggesting that the Thai Embassy in London is only issuing retirement visas to over 65s.

We, as an EX-PAT community have brought some of this on ourselves by not policing our own. If you know someone who is violating the VISA requirements - TURN THEM IN!!!!!!!!!!!

It's those folks who abuse the system and ruin it for the rest of the legitimate ex-pats!

God people like you make my blood boil.

What an idiotic pitchfork-wielding, yokel post. We're not supposed to police ourselves.

Of course it's not cricket for anyone to live here for years on end doing visa exempt entries - no one's denying that - but those people were not doing anything ILLEGAL.

It was a loophole that successive governments allowed to persist. Now they're clamping down - fair enough. How could the expat community police themselves when what is now frowned on was completely ignored for years by the country's own law enforcement?

Since your "knowledge" of the abuses is so accurate, why don't YOU turn someone in and we'll sit here eagerly awaiting to read the next thread you start in which you describe how some perfectly legit expat walked up to you and banged your lights out for poking your big nose into his business

[laislica]

it will surely lose it's appeal to many?

let me correct that for you you, It will lose its appeal to many people working illegally and cheating the system. Genuine Tourists will have no problems whatsoever. Get the proper visa and problem solved.

I do agree, every visitor should have a proper visa.

Because it is easier for me, I choose a retirement extension rather than a married extension.

Less hassle to obtain, if you fill the requirements, done on the spot, more cash tied up in the bank for 90 days but no big deal, at least for me.

It's the Nanny State part that may cause the loss of appeal to some.

A few years ago in Spain, you could smoke in bars (I don't smoke), ride a M/C without a helmet but the Nanny State took care of that!

Same in Thailand, no smoking in public buildings and crash helmet mandatory.

Slowly, slowly the changes creep in and what was lovely and free and "Up to you", becomes regulated and controlled.

[BillR]

So why did I pay 75 quid for a triple entry tourist visa in London?

I can not even use it!

Yes you can, if you are a legitimate tourist.

Can you clarify tourist?

So, can I stay here for 6 months using my back to back triple entry tourist visa that I paid for and was issued for the purpose of tourism?

If that is not the case, then why could I buy the visa in the first place?

Sure why not? Im not a IO but it would be pretty clear that if you leave Thailand for a reasonable ammount of time and come back again, you are not engaged in working illegally or living here perpetually on a tourist visa. It's pretty clear if you get into a death bus to the border and renew back to back you are not a tourist and have no money to even spend a few days by air in another country = You're not a tourist. Common sense prevails.

Edited July 14, 2014 by BillR

[phirho]

The 5 year visa is only issued if you buy the 2million baht (+VAT+20,00 per year) elite card. The 500k elite card you are given a 1 year visa, renewable 5 times. Will still work for me.

This is the info i recieved from Thailand Elite as i have already applied and been approved and will go to Bangkok after this month at work to pay and recieve the visa in my passport if there is no other solution.

This is not correct, 500k option gives 5 year visa as well.

Edited July 14, 2014 by phirho

[stgrhe]

Refusing entry to all people with tourist visas, how can you obtain a visa and then be denied entry to the country unless you fly into it?

Classic Thailand

A visa doesn't guarantee entry into Thailand and has never done so. A visa is merely a right to travel to the check-point and there apply for an entry. So in reality nothing has changed expecpt for a tought interpretation by Immigration Burea.

[noonms]

It is only the habitual and long term users of tourist visas who are having problems

There has been so much coverage of the new stance the people concerned should not be surprised

Thailand gas a new government that is trying to achieve many many needed changes that acts with strength and determination, this has been needed for a long time

WARNING TO THOSE ON OVERSTAY, you need to leave immediately, and clean up your act, before the new regulations come in or you will risk being banned, it is not difficult to get retirement or marriage visas which probably cover 95% of those on overstay

I am personally in favor or the law being properly enforced

The Thai's I know are clapping their hands over this it should sort out the fugitives and the scum that are lingering in the country on weak immigration laws one said. Another from Thai / Australian said she wanted the government to set up a few special detention centres just like Australia. Overstay a day and be detained a day etc etc.

cozy country

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[smedly]

The officers are doing their job by following the rules. In any new set of procedures there will be those that do not comprehend exactly to the letter what is required and the innocent individuals will get their balls chopped off. There has to be a statement from the Embassies and Consulates what the exact rules are. It is beyond belief that in an age looking for transparency the final say is an officer who can determine yes or no to entry. When you allow individuals to act on a whim of their choosing then you give an opportunity for corruption to creep in. Be consistent and let everyone know what is the law in Thailand. I took a days leave to go to Immigaration and then was refused an extension of stay based on teaching though i had a valid work permit and was on a Non O (multiple). You have been teaching for 7 years but you are not in our system. Obviously not for i am on a Non O and do not have to report to immigration i leave the Kingdom every 90 days. No you must got and get the houseowner where you stay to sign this form they must pay x baht i want also to see that you have paid your tax. I said i had to pay the tax and show it to the Labour office before i got my current work permit which expires 31st March 2015. No i want you to show me the receipt. Well went the following friday after taking another days leave and another officer no i don't need this. I looked at the previous officer and she showed no sign of recognition and ended up making the tea for her boss.<deleted>. So i went away with the understanding- why empower staff that do not comprehend the rules.

There is a popular TV program called "nothing to Declare" and is based at one of the major Australian airports, they pull people arriving on visa from various countries and interview them to make sure they are in full compliance with the rules, some say they are on holiday - some visiting girl/boyfriends - some visiting relatives etc. they then investigate to prove that the reason they obtained the visa was genuine, they contact the people they are claiming to meet, they check to see if they have enough money with them to sustain their visit, they check for criminal records etc etc, if they find any discrepancy in the story they cancel the persons visa and deport them from the airport, they also ban them from entering Australia for a period of 3 years

getting a visa in an embassy or consulate is absolutely no guarantee you will be allowed into a country at the point of entry by immigration - that is fact everywhere in the world including Thailand

[bkkjames]

The officers are doing their job by following the rules. In any new set of procedures there will be those that do not comprehend exactly to the letter what is required and the innocent individuals will get their balls chopped off. There has to be a statement from the Embassies and Consulates what the exact rules are. It is beyond belief that in an age looking for transparency the final say is an officer who can determine yes or no to entry. When you allow individuals to act on a whim of their choosing then you give an opportunity for corruption to creep in. Be consistent and let everyone know what is the law in Thailand. I took a days leave to go to Immigaration and then was refused an extension of stay based on teaching though i had a valid work permit and was on a Non O (multiple). You have been teaching for 7 years but you are not in our system. Obviously not for i am on a Non O and do not have to report to immigration i leave the Kingdom every 90 days. No you must got and get the houseowner where you stay to sign this form they must pay x baht i want also to see that you have paid your tax. I said i had to pay the tax and show it to the Labour office before i got my current work permit which expires 31st March 2015. No i want you to show me the receipt. Well went the following friday after taking another days leave and another officer no i don't need this. I looked at the previous officer and she showed no sign of recognition and ended up making the tea for her boss.. So i went away with the understanding- why empower staff that do not comprehend the rules.

There is a popular TV program called "nothing to Declare" and is based at one of the major Australian airports, they pull people arriving on visa from various countries and interview them to make sure they are in full compliance with the rules, some say they are on holiday - some visiting girl/boyfriends - some visiting relatives etc. they then investigate to prove that the reason they obtained the visa was genuine, they contact the people they are claiming to meet, they check to see if they have enough money with them to sustain their visit, they check for criminal records etc etc, if they find any discrepancy in the story they cancel the persons visa and deport them from the airport, they also ban them from entering Australia for a period of 3 years

getting a visa in an embassy or consulate is absolutely no guarantee you will be allowed into a country at the point of entry by immigration - that is fact everywhere in the world including Thailand

Then why not just get rid of the cash cow..

I know the answer btw

Sent from my LG-P970 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[noonms]

the chaos is complete

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[macka17]

From an outsiders point of view. They are just aligning with the rest of the western world.

Rules are made. and from now. Rules are enforced.

Nothing wrong with that.

You go to\through any country in the world. AS A TOURIST with flight itineraries.Hotel bookings and visa's.

You have no problem. Anywhere.

Neither do the legals over there too from what I've read.

Only the ones trying to get under the net. Hopefully they are\will be stopped now.

they just make things harder for normal people everywhere..

We go O\S from Aust for around 3 months every yr.

Normally to different areas of the planet that WE fancy Thailand 6 weeks last yr, Plus US Canada (kids)

Never have a problem even in Egypt.

US\Canada Mexico.Sth America. N\Z this yr. We don't envisage problems.

All they're doing is getting rid of the shonk's and bludgers.

Live there Properly. and work./ Retire with your income.or back where you came from Jack.

You live in a country you should either work and pay your way or have savings\Income to cover such.

A lot of westerners don't. Finally it's getting sorted.

[MJCM]

the chaos is complete

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

Is that the only thing you can contribute ? I think that's Nr 3 or Nr 4 already with that some comment.

You are a man of few words

[BillR]

how many people do you know that are living in Thailand on back to back tourist visa's that are NOT working illegally? Rhetorical question of course.

[MJCM]

how many people do you know that are living in Thailand on back to back tourist visa's that are NOT working illegally? Rhetorical question of course.

I know at least 3, not working, and just holidaying, travelling, relaxing and spending good money (between 10-20k a week)

Edit 1: And if their money is finished they just go back home work for a period of time and come back., however I must say they only stay around max (6 -9 months) in Thailand.

Edited July 14, 2014 by MJCM

[Cypress Hill]

This was inevitable. The immigration rules are an absolute shambles. Some rules apply in one place but not in another. It's the ultimate crapshoot

I've got a couple of friends who are on double/triple entry tourist visas in brand new passports who are thinking of less than legal means of re-entering because they're not prepared to take the risk that the border they use won't be staffed by morons.

They reckon there are quite a few services whereby, in return for ฿5,000, their passport can be stamped out, walked through the border by a "friendly" immigration officer, walked back in again and stamped with the appropriate date within 24 hours.

I heard that services had gone the way of the dodo and have, of course, advised these guys not to send their passports anywhere

[BillR]

how many people do you know that are living in Thailand on back to back tourist visa's that are NOT working illegally? Rhetorical question of course.

I know at least 3, not working, and just holidaying, travelling, relaxing and spending good money (between 10-20k a week)

on back to back border run tourist visa's ?? If they are travelling surely they can leave by air and come back like any other "tourist" ")

Saw your edit, you're friends have no problem then

Edited July 14, 2014 by BillR

[MJCM]

how many people do you know that are living in Thailand on back to back tourist visa's that are NOT working illegally? Rhetorical question of course.

I know at least 3, not working, and just holidaying, travelling, relaxing and spending good money (between 10-20k a week)

on back to back border run tourist visa's ?? If they are travelling surely they can leave by air and come back like any other "tourist" ")

Sorry, (I edited my post) they are not really on back to back tourist visa's. And on your question why they not fly, is sometimes they do and sometimes they don't. Why Fly if you are on Koh Chang and Cambodia is close or when you are in Chang Mai and Myanmar is close ?

[JDGRUEN]

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'Saw this coming. More ahead no doubt. Preachy non-O holders, pack up your smugness in your old kit bag, 'cause you're next on the agenda. And it's not even 12 AUG yet. I actually doubt this is going to help Elite sales much. Turn-aways like this create confusion and uncertainty, which is the opposite of what someone buying an expensive visa (or any expensive investment, or expensive anything) for the long-term tend to look for and expect. The very few who allow themselves to be herded toward the Elite program will be outweighed baht-wise by the many wondering what the heck is going on, and just deciding they can live without the hassle & go elsewhere. Whoever's behind all this either has no concern for the long-term damage he's doing, or no understanding of it. It's like a store-owner telling customers they have to leave if they haven't bought anything within the first 15 minutes. He might have his reasons (e.g., fear of shoplifters), but he'll end up driving away all his business, even those who might otherwise be first-timers, who'll walk the other way just based on the bad hearsay without knowing or caring about the details.

And next after Non 'O' holders (who will be mostly forced to do Extensions of Stay for Retirement - if the qualify) - sometime down the road those on Extensions of Stay for Retirement (EoSR) with get the shaft in the arse. First just do away with the Embassy certificate in lieu of 800,000 in the bank (for those who are allowed to use the cert.)..... Then later push everyone on Extension of Stay for Retirement into the first level of the Elite Visa - 500,000 baht for five years by basically doing away with the EoSR all together. After all - all the EoSR folks have 800,000 in the bank don't they - the government wants that money - not just left lying around in a bank... Thailand has bills to pay ... Rice Scheme and all ...

In the end no one is going to be immune to this huge enforcement change which will lead to a whole mind set change by the Thai leadership.

But eventually the Thai Leadership will run into big problems when the Low Season in all the resort areas is the permanent season.

And you know all of this is true and correct exactly how?

Or are you looking for your 5 seconds of fame?

Do actually KNOW this or are you just making it up?

If it is true of course, you will have all the links and information and will be willing to post it so go ahead and prove it.

If not please stop posting rubbish and rumours.

He is either the smartest person in the room or the dumbest. No facts, just angry HE got caught up it this never ending morass of laws, loopholes and visa myths.

Folks ... what I wrote was cynicism and sarcasm ... and a bit of lampooning ... did I have to type it in a bold type disclaimer with graphics for you to not take it seriously?

... Here, I won't use big words like cynicism, sarcasm or lampooning ... its a JOKE...

Also I did it to poke a stick in the eye of the stuff shirt EoSR folks and the Non Imm Folks who are saying such awful things about those lowly people who can only get tourist visas for long stay for the terrible reason of being under age 50 - painting all of them with a broad brush - such terrible people - those tourists...

Oh - I have a non imm multi o visa ... I just don't like stereotyping tourists - long stay ones or not.

Edited July 14, 2014 by JDGRUEN

[MrWorldwide]

All he fools pointing fingers with a smug, more-legal-than-thou attitude should be very worried indeed. 800,000 baht isn't a lot of money these days. There are rumblings that it's going to be increased substantially. There are also rumours suggesting that the Thai Embassy in London is only issuing retirement visas to over 65s.

Please link me to said rumblings and rumours,

[bkkjames]

Meanwhile over at Myanmar Tourism Board - an urgent meeting is underway to allow easy multiple entries for all visitors for a one time fee..... perhaps not, but wouldn't surprise me...

[uptheos]

I think I may just skip Thailand all together this time. I have been watching airfares and now it is just as cheap to fly into Cambodia. It use to be significantly more. Is Cambodia the next Thailand?

Etihad doing some very competitive fares LHR - Pnom Penh

[overherebc]

This was inevitable. The immigration rules are an absolute shambles. Some rules apply in one place but not in another. It's the ultimate crapshoot

I've got a couple of friends who are on double/triple entry tourist visas in brand new passports who are thinking of less than legal means of re-entering because they're not prepared to take the risk that the border they use won't be staffed by morons.

They reckon there are quite a few services whereby, in return for ฿5,000, their passport can be stamped out, walked through the border by a "friendly" immigration officer, walked back in again and stamped with the appropriate date within 24 hours.

I heard that services had gone the way of the dodo and have, of course, advised these guys not to send their passports anywhere

You gave them good advice. The food and comforts in IDC are wonderful and you get a free blacklisting.

[Time Traveller]

I agree with this, and actually it's not like this hasn't been done before, accept for already having a visa. Get rid of these beach bum back packers taking jobs from the locals.

Well those beach bum backpackers do cook the best fried noodles, make the most honest tuk tuk drivers and are the hardest working construction workers, so it's easy to see how they stole jobs from Thais -. god bless those beach bums, i'll miss them. But on the bright side, after they go there will be 20 million new job openings for the hard done by jobless Thais, which will drive the unemployment rate down to minus 10%, adding so much to the nation's GDP that Thailand will be on track to overtake China in economic power.

Just gotta get rid of the evil foreign menace first.

[smedly]

All he fools pointing fingers with a smug, more-legal-than-thou attitude should be very worried indeed. 800,000 baht isn't a lot of money these days. There are rumblings that it's going to be increased substantially. There are also rumours suggesting that the Thai Embassy in London is only issuing retirement visas to over 65s.

Please link me to said rumblings and rumours,

The London embassy has already changed the rules very recently

If you are under 65 you will not be granted a Multiple Entry type O visa unless you are married to a Thai or have Thai children

If you are over 50 you need to apply for a Type OA Retirement visa providing you can comply with the requirements - Police report - Medical Report and have the required finances

There is absolutely no substance to the rumour that financial requirements are going to change as you stated - gossip and hearsay

What bothers me about this thread is the fact that so many people believe that getting a Visa will guarantee entry into Thailand at a border crossing - This is not the case - never has been - and never will be, and this doesn't only apply to Thailand

So stop asking these stupid repeated questions like you have some primordial permission from office staff at a consulate or embassy because you obtained a tourist visa - it is you that is defining yourself as a tourist on your application - immigration at a border crossing may not agree

[ScotBkk]

If your a tourist (financially stable and not working in the country) why should it matter how many tourist visas you have? If you have the funds to support yourself and wish to visit a country without being over 50, married to a local, or teaching English then why should it matter?

All these Thai Visa clowns are so quick to judge everyone else when they married a bar girl or borrowed money to put in an account for a retirement visa (ooops - how does it feel to be judged based on a small minority of people?)

First the Cambodians were kicked out - and people blamed the Cambodians for overreacting to rumours

Then the Myanmar refugees were kicked out - and people turned a blind eye to that

Now legit Visa holders are being denied - and they are being blamed for being "multiple tourist visa holders"

Its coming for you next. Let's see how your lovely loyal Thai wife deals with the mutual Thai bank account/ business/ property when your marriage visa renewal is denied. One thing is for sure, the next group in line to be targeted will be too busy pointing fingers at your faults to see it coming for them.

Brilliant post my friend however, although' NOBODY will listen to your valid points. Considering, these buffoons are so small minded and don't give a toss about anyone else other than themselves. Never in my entire life, have I ever came across so many parasites who congregate to ridicule anyone who dare speak out. There is never any compassion or empathy shown as a sympathetic gesture for our fellow compatriots. All this doom n' gloom crap is beginning to get on my nerves. On Judgement day, we won't need a visa to get in - just some previous kindness and thoughtfulness will be suffice.

[toooa]

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It is only the habitual and long term users of tourist visas who are having problems

There has been so much coverage of the new stance the people concerned should not be surprised

Thailand gas a new government that is trying to achieve many many needed changes that acts with strength and determination, this has been needed for a long time

WARNING TO THOSE ON OVERSTAY, you need to leave immediately, and clean up your act, before the new regulations come in or you will risk being banned, it is not difficult to get retirement or marriage visas which probably cover 95% of those on overstay

I am personally in favor or the law being properly enforced

You're in favor are you? So these increases in strength and determination personally benefit you in some way? Do you have money in the game? Does enforcement or not somehow affect your day to day activities? Or is it that you consider yourself a no-nonsense, straight down the line, common sense chap who knows what needs to be done, and gets on with things, builds a bridge and faithfully serves whoever carries the biggest stick? Maybe it makes you feel a kind of smug superiority to know that you're above the rabble. Whatever....congratulations for being what ever it is you fancy yourself to be.