The Class System in Thailand?

[scorecard]

To the OP, why are you asking?

[laolover88]

Confusing two things here

Class...,,deriving from Family, History, Education, Property, Inter familial connections...not that different from anywhere

It is not called 'New Money'/Nouveau Riche for nothing!

Class: ...Style, fashion, chic..not necessarily what money can buy..look at old buffers in ragged tweed jackets....any new Benz is a show of money and naff!

My grandpa, with a few Rai, drives a 20 year old Benz with grass growing on the roof..that is class!

[NeverSure]

I thought the OP was about a class system, not whether someone "has class."

[GuestHouse]

I take it that the OP is British.

[David48]

I take it that the OP is British.

GH ... even better ... I'm an Aussie.

We know we are a better class ... because the best English Judges chose us in the first place ...

Jokes aside ... I did live in the UK for several years.

.

[buhi]

Guesthouse, I think David is Australian, I am British.

Just had a shower and gave this a great deal of thought.

Thai class, you need a nice white uniform with lots of coloured squares above the left pocket.

However you may need ear medicine as well!

[JockPieandBeans]

The " Class System " whether it be Thailand or any other land.

Is simply one method of dividing and controlling the masses.

[buhi]

The " Class System " whether it be Thailand or any other land.

Is simply one method of dividing and controlling the masses.

Jock if you eat that you must be Scottish!

Pie and beans, good grief!

[wamberal]

A rather strange poll. "Class" and "social standing" are different terms for the same phenomenon, at least in lay terms.

There are some old well established families, my understanding is that they are at the top of the pile, most, if not all, of them have Royal connexions through marriage or relationships over the years.

Thai ethnicity is overwhelmingly important, but then so is money and power. My understanding is that the social strata are now a lot more fluid now, with money allowing some upwards mobility.

But it will be a long time, if ever, that a person of Chinese ethnicity from a poor background can break into the upper echelons, no matter how rich he or she gets, or how much education they undertake.

[JockPieandBeans]

The " Class System " whether it be Thailand or any other land.

Is simply one method of dividing and controlling the masses.

Jock if you eat that you must be Scottish!

Pie and beans, good grief!

Buhi

I am indeed. as for eating it. I have not eaten one in over 10 years.

I just happened to have a craving for one, as I was joining TV, and used it as my name.

[wabothai]

I have 2 cars, an old beaten up pickup truck and a new very nice one.

On the road: in the new one i am treated with a certain amount of respect.in the old one i am just a poor thai. And that happens all the time.

Wait till i come along with my tank.

[ronthai]

OTHER :

Because maybe they have money or not, but act is if they have with gold and such that goes back to the pawnshop ever month.

[laolover88]

I thought the OP was about a class system, not whether someone "has class."

We are waiting for you to define a class 'system'.

Most systems share common characteristics, whether they are social, simple or complex

All exist within an environment

Structure?

Behavior?

Interconnectivity?

I don't think on this forum we should begin to investigate or even ask how many people are 'connected' to the Chakri dynasty

but in Thailand I guess it 'helps'

"Having" 'class' morphs into participating in the above...or would you define it differently?

[ravip]

In a class system, a person born a peasant will always be a peasant. In the context of royalty, one must be born into it. That's as far as a system goes in Thailand. Otherwise, I'm not sure I'd call it a class system so much as class awareness which can involve social standing (which in turn might rely on position, connections, money), money, education, etc.

In Thailand, a person can be born into a peasant family, but by good fortune has brains and gets a good education, a good job, and money in the bank, and is no longer a peasant but has social standing.

Is there any country where a person born a peasant could rise up to be a King or a Queen?

Or where a super rich person wouldn't have 'some privileges' over a peasant?

[arthurwait]

In a class system, a person born a peasant will always be a peasant. In the context of royalty, one must be born into it. That's as far as a system goes in Thailand. Otherwise, I'm not sure I'd call it a class system so much as class awareness which can involve social standing (which in turn might rely on position, connections, money), money, education, etc.

In Thailand, a person can be born into a peasant family, but by good fortune has brains and gets a good education, a good job, and money in the bank, and is no longer a peasant but has social standing.

Is there any country where a person born a peasant could rise up to be a King or a Queen?

Or where a super rich person wouldn't have 'some privileges' over a peasant?

The future queen of England ?

[arthurwait]

I have 2 cars, an old beaten up pickup truck and a new very nice one.

On the road: in the new one i am treated with a certain amount of respect.in the old one i am just a poor thai. And that happens all the time.

Wait till i come along with my tank.

When I use one of the Hi-aces my wifes family business has had for about 15 - 20 years just about everyone shows respect and moves out the way.

Or they may think some drunk Thai is driving it.

[ravip]

In a class system, a person born a peasant will always be a peasant. In the context of royalty, one must be born into it. That's as far as a system goes in Thailand. Otherwise, I'm not sure I'd call it a class system so much as class awareness which can involve social standing (which in turn might rely on position, connections, money), money, education, etc.

In Thailand, a person can be born into a peasant family, but by good fortune has brains and gets a good education, a good job, and money in the bank, and is no longer a peasant but has social standing.

Is there any country where a person born a peasant could rise up to be a King or a Queen?

Or where a super rich person wouldn't have 'some privileges' over a peasant?

The future queen of England ?

Really?

Was there ever a record made in history where a peasant became a King or a Queen?

Which year, where, who?

[Shiver]

I have a pair of classes. They say "Ray Ban" on them (not sure if that's a village or not), but they were given as a gift from a friend that procured them from somewhere exotic and far south of Issan where I live. I think he said it was Pattaya, if anyone has ever heard of that. I do notice that everyone has darker skin when I wear them though.

Does that mean I have Class?

[buhi]

The " Class System " whether it be Thailand or any other land.

Is simply one method of dividing and controlling the masses.

Jock if you eat that you must be Scottish!

Pie and beans, good grief!

Buhi

I am indeed. as for eating it. I have not eaten one in over 10 years.

I just happened to have a craving for one, as I was joining TV, and used it as my name.

Mutton pie and beans, now you have my taste spuds flowing, yes Jock I am half Scottish!

[buhi]

In a class system, a person born a peasant will always be a peasant. In the context of royalty, one must be born into it. That's as far as a system goes in Thailand. Otherwise, I'm not sure I'd call it a class system so much as class awareness which can involve social standing (which in turn might rely on position, connections, money), money, education, etc.

In Thailand, a person can be born into a peasant family, but by good fortune has brains and gets a good education, a good job, and money in the bank, and is no longer a peasant but has social standing.

Is there any country where a person born a peasant could rise up to be a King or a Queen?

Or where a super rich person wouldn't have 'some privileges' over a peasant?

Napoleon!

[arthurwait]

Is there any country where a person born a peasant could rise up to be a King or a Queen?

Or where a super rich person wouldn't have 'some privileges' over a peasant?

The future queen of England ?

Really?

Was there ever a record made in history where a peasant became a King or a Queen?

Which year, where, who?

Early life[edit]

Catherine Elizabeth Middleton was born at Royal Berkshire Hospital in Reading on 9 January 1982, and christened at St Andrew's Bradfield, Berkshire, on 20 June 1982.[9][10]:32 She is the eldest of three children born to Carole (née Goldsmith), a former flight attendant, and Michael Middleton, who also worked as a flight attendant prior to becoming a flight dispatcher for British Airways. Her parents were married on 21 June 1980, at the parish church of Dorney, Buckinghamshire.[11] In 1987, they founded Party Pieces, a mail order company that sells party supplies and decorations. Party Pieces is a private company with an estimated worth of £30 million.[12][13][14] The Middletons have another daughter, Philippa "Pippa",[15][16] and a son, James William Middleton.[16]

Middleton's paternal ancestors were from Leeds, West Yorkshire. Her paternal great-grandmother, Olive, was a member of the Lupton family, who, for a number of generations, were woollen cloth merchants and manufacturers, active in civic affairs.[16][17] Her maternal ancestors, the Harrisons, were working-class labourers and miners from Sunderland and County Durham.[18]

Michael and Carole Middleton worked for British Airways, in Amman, Jordan, from May 1984 to September 1986. In Jordan, Middleton went to an English language nursery school[19] before returning to their home in Berkshire.[20] Following her return from Amman, Middleton was enrolled at St Andrew's School near the village of Pangbourne in Berkshire, then briefly at Downe House.[21] She attended Marlborough College, a co-educational independent boarding school in Wiltshire,[22] and graduated in 2005, from the University of St Andrews in Fife, Scotland, with an undergraduate MA (2:1 Hons) in the History of Art.[23] In November 2006, Middleton accepted a position as an accessory buyer with the clothing chain Jigsaw.[2

[buhi]

Fun topic, are we discussing Thai, Nee Ayutiah?

Or as someone mentioned an upstart with Chinese ancestry?

Class in Thailand is relative, relative to much higher relatives, even if...... whooooo stop!

I still go for the white uniform, very pretty!

[Tywais]

Perhaps the term Hierarchical Society is better suited than class. Certainly not black/white in reality as we westerners perceive classes such as high/middle/low class though those terms are bandied about often in the media and are too fundamental for accuracy. Guess one could check every poll option and may cover most of the variables.

Thailand’s Hierarchal Society

Traditional Thai society is organized along lines of hierarchy and patronage by people who know their place and power is divided among cliques and fiefdoms.” Social interactions are often hierarchal and defined by patron-client relationships or bunkun, a dept of gratitude, often a between young people and elders. Hierarchy is based on age, occupation, wealth and residence, Peasant farmers have traditionally been at the bottom of the heap, with merchant and artisans above the, and government officials above them. The Buddhist clergy is viewed as a group apart. Although society is led by a relatively small group of powerful politicians, businessmen and military personnel, social class and ranked status are largely absent. There is a great amount of social mobility in Thai society.

The stratification of upper, middle, and lower classes is mostly based on the past social hierarchy (sakdi na) and the family's financial powers. This social stratification is no longer enforced by contemporary law, but its presence is recognized by most Thais. There is also a distinction between urban and rural Thais. Constituting a majority of the Thai population, people in the rural villages of Thailand have led more-simple lives rooted in rich traditions, with less interference from international cultures or capitalism. Urban Thailand, on the other hand, has gained its cultural richness from the diverse social classes, ethnicities, and international cultures. The rural/urban division is still highly salient to most Thais, even though the differences have become gradually smaller due to the media, improved communication and transportation, and the migration of rural Thais to find work in big cities. Among other changes, gender and sexuality in rural villagers today have been greatly adulterated by the urban cultural images through the ubiquitous popular media. [source: Encyclopedia of Sexuality: Thailand (Muang Thai) by Kittiwut Jod Taywaditep, M.D., M.A., Eli Coleman, Ph.D. and Pacharin Dumronggittigule, M.Sc., late 1990s; www2.hu-berlin.de/sexology/IES/thailand

Social position and the age are decisive in determining the way Thais behave towards one another. Generally the oldest or socially highest ranking person receives the most respect. Many details in way people behave depends on the social status and /or the age of the people interacting. This is reflected in the family, among friends and at work. It also explains the power of authority and how favoritism, cronyism, corruption and undemocratic structures work in Thai society. Great emphasis is placed on maintaining harmonious relations and people go through great lengths not to ruin relation which one day could become important.

Read more here - http://factsanddetails.com/southeast-asia/Thailand/sub5_8c/entry-3228.html

[JockPieandBeans]

The " Class System " whether it be Thailand or any other land.

Is simply one method of dividing and controlling the masses.

Jock if you eat that you must be Scottish!

Pie and beans, good grief!

Buhi

I am indeed. as for eating it. I have not eaten one in over 10 years.

I just happened to have a craving for one, as I was joining TV, and used it as my name.

Mutton pie and beans, now you have my taste spuds flowing, yes Jock I am half Scottish!

Possum, says he is going back to Scotland in 2 weeks.

His mission, if he chooses to accept, is to bring a suitcase of Jock Pies and Irn Bru back with him.

[chrisinth]

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In a class system, a person born a peasant will always be a peasant. ...

What about a Thai Family ... three sisters, born not that far apart in terms of years.

Sister 1 stays on the Farm and harvests the rice ... just as the generations before her did.

Sister 2 seeks her fame and fortune in Pattaya, makes a shit load of money ... does her 'class' change from that of the sister who stayed on the Farm?

Sister 3 is sent to University, obtains her degree, moves from the Farm to Bangkok, earns a good wage and her presence doesn't reflect the tanned skin of working the fields, nor the qualities of the 'working girl'.

She then goes onto to marry a Dentist, lives in a very nice house, drives a Benz ... has she 'shifted' Class?
.

It all depends, in your example, who is judging the class order.

For instance, if it is family hierarchy then regardless of what jobs or way of life the sisters have, the eldest will always remain at the top. If it is social circles, then that would become different.

The social circle of sister 1 (in your example) would be unlikely to meet the social circle of sister 3 and vice virsa so one couldn't judge these two on an overall basis.

However, if my reading is correct, sister 2, in the line of her work could meet both parts of the social circles of sister 1 and sister 3, but discretion would be called for and her social status would remain anonymous, her class remaining hidden.

In short, class would be determined by social groups, unless a mixture Money, Connections & Personal Wealth exposes the single person to a wider audience.

Class, IMHO, has everything to do with social standing.

[buhi]

Perhaps the term Hierarchical Society is better suited than class. Certainly not black/white in reality as we westerners perceive classes such as high/middle/low class though those terms are bandied about often in the media and are too fundamental for accuracy. Guess one could check every poll option and may cover most of the variables.

Thailands Hierarchal Society

Traditional Thai society is organized along lines of hierarchy and patronage by people who know their place and power is divided among cliques and fiefdoms. Social interactions are often hierarchal and defined by patron-client relationships or bunkun, a dept of gratitude, often a between young people and elders. Hierarchy is based on age, occupation, wealth and residence, Peasant farmers have traditionally been at the bottom of the heap, with merchant and artisans above the, and government officials above them. The Buddhist clergy is viewed as a group apart. Although society is led by a relatively small group of powerful politicians, businessmen and military personnel, social class and ranked status are largely absent. There is a great amount of social mobility in Thai society.

The stratification of upper, middle, and lower classes is mostly based on the past social hierarchy (sakdi na) and the family's financial powers. This social stratification is no longer enforced by contemporary law, but its presence is recognized by most Thais. There is also a distinction between urban and rural Thais. Constituting a majority of the Thai population, people in the rural villages of Thailand have led more-simple lives rooted in rich traditions, with less interference from international cultures or capitalism. Urban Thailand, on the other hand, has gained its cultural richness from the diverse social classes, ethnicities, and international cultures. The rural/urban division is still highly salient to most Thais, even though the differences have become gradually smaller due to the media, improved communication and transportation, and the migration of rural Thais to find work in big cities. Among other changes, gender and sexuality in rural villagers today have been greatly adulterated by the urban cultural images through the ubiquitous popular media. [source: Encyclopedia of Sexuality: Thailand (Muang Thai) by Kittiwut Jod Taywaditep, M.D., M.A., Eli Coleman, Ph.D. and Pacharin Dumronggittigule, M.Sc., late 1990s; www2.hu-berlin.de/sexology/IES/thailand

Social position and the age are decisive in determining the way Thais behave towards one another. Generally the oldest or socially highest ranking person receives the most respect. Many details in way people behave depends on the social status and /or the age of the people interacting. This is reflected in the family, among friends and at work. It also explains the power of authority and how favoritism, cronyism, corruption and undemocratic structures work in Thai society. Great emphasis is placed on maintaining harmonious relations and people go through great lengths not to ruin relation which one day could become important.

Read more here - http://factsanddetails.com/southeast-asia/Thailand/sub5_8c/entry-3228.html

Good post and accurate, I rank very highly in my Thai family, because of my senior status and wealth.

Outside of family, well that does not matter as I do not patronise anyone and no one patronises me.

Harmony is extremely important and it takes a lot of changing oneself to blend in, that is if you are British and used to being respected on merit.

[Thai at Heart]

My 5 years living here says the "class system" is solely based on how much money you have, but it's important where that money came from and the job you hold or business you own. High level government jobs, especially police, military and high level politicians are some of the highest in the system and then successful business people.

It's a sick, disgusting system and is hugely responsible for a dysfunctional government built on corruption.

Some is birth, some is money, and some is base power.

To see people waiing people that they know to blatantly corrupt or carrying out immoral business is frankly disgusting.

[buhi]

My 5 years living here says the "class system" is solely based on how much money you have, but it's important where that money came from and the job you hold or business you own. High level government jobs, especially police, military and high level politicians are some of the highest in the system and then successful business people.

It's a sick, disgusting system and is hugely responsible for a dysfunctional government built on corruption.

Some is birth, some is money, and some is base power.

To see people waiing people that they know to blatantly corrupt or carrying out immoral business is frankly disgusting.

I do not think you are Thai at heart.

I cannot and will not post where you are wrong, but it goes to the top!

[ATF]

There are only two classes. The Aristocracy and Commoners. Everything else is an invention of the Middle Classes. The Middle Class still have to work albeit in a professional capacity. Someone whom is independently wealthy is still a Commoner.

The real Working Class has far more in common with the Aristocracy than the Middle Class because neither gives a %&% and both spend lavishly on alcohol and other recreational drugs while the Middle Classes are too busy keeping up appearances.

[buhi]

There are only two classes. The Aristocracy and Commoners. Everything else is an invention of the Middle Classes. The Middle Class still have to work albeit in a professional capacity. Someone whom is independently wealthy is still a Commoner.

The real Working Class has far more in common with the Aristocracy than the Middle Class because neither gives a %&% and both spend lavishly on alcohol and other recreational drugs while the Middle Classes are too busy keeping up appearances.

Do not agree.

This appeared at first to be an innocuous topic, but in truth goes straight to the heart of Thai society and realms where comment is forbidden!

Edited July 19, 2014 by buhi