Hooked On Thailand

[smile]

Any help will be gratefully accepted.

In the last year we have spent six weeks in Asia, three in Hong Kong and Three in Thailand (half work, half vactation). I have thouroughly enjoyed both countries. But I never left Hong Kong wishing I could stay.

I have a partner and two kids and so education / healthcare insurance would infuence my decision.

What income would be required to live comfortably in Thailand including good education, healthcare and a life?

I work in IT, currently a network manager, and my partner in marketing but we would both like to change this.

We could raise 250,000 sterling ( 17,500,000 Bht) to enter Thailand. What could we expect?

Kind regards and many thanks.

[Dutchy]

What could we expect?

Your savings will disappear slowly, you won't be able to make a good living from your background, there are lots of locals doing the same job for minimal wages. Education for your children is unaffordable, the good thing though is that you won't have to worry whether they'd fail. They definitely won't fail here. If you can't open a business or have a serious job here, better stay in the UK. This may sound sarcastic but I think it's honest advice, only if you can make in excess of 100.000 baht per month you can save for the future. Your children will cost approx. 800.000 a year for relatively decent education.

No money, no honey, no future in Thailand...

Dutchy

[caughtintheact]

You did not mention how old you are.

If you have a partner, but not a legal wife, then one or both of you may not qualify to come here. A foreigner with a partner is considered single, so each would have to qualify on his or her own merits.

Your options may be limited to

a. Retirement: Then you cannot work legally

b. Hired by a company in Thailand: Then you will have some income so you don't have to use all your savings

c. As an investor: You will have some time to determine what you want to invest in.

d. There are some other options which I can't discuss at this time because I do not know your status.

e. In any event you would have to qualify for a Non-Immigrant visa to come here on a more or less permanent visa. Do you qualify? Check out the Royal Thai Consulate (Los Angeles) website Royal Thai Consulate Los Angeles to see if you and your partner qualify or check with the nearest Thai Embassy or consulate in your home country.

Agree with Dutchy. You would be taking a risk that will affect your whole family.

On the other hand, you might find some kind of work here to avoid having to deplete your savings. Why not make a budget to see how long the money will last if you do not find work. Using Dutchy's numbers for a good education (B800k/year per child), you will be spending at least B2.3-3 million per year, so your accumulated cash would be down to zero in about 5-7 years. What do you do then?

[smile]

Thank you for your advice. All points have been noted. I am 39 my Girlfriend of 20 years is 37 and my girls are 3 and 9.

You are telling me that an education will cost about B1.5M. I was not looking just to move and draw on the money we took but to invest in a home (including business set up) for about B4.5M and use the other B13M to buy one or two business'. I have picked up from the net (With due sceptisism) that you can expect a 30% return on investment. I estimate that to be in the region of 50K Stering (B3.5M) a year. Taking off education that should leave B2M to live on what would be the real figure?

I appreciate what I have read may well be twoddle and that is exactly why I joined the forum.

I am prepared to invest and work. What investment would be required for an investment visa. Is the stuff on "Sunbeltasia" way out???

Thanks again,

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Thank you for your advice. All points have been noted. I am 39 my Girlfriend of 20 years is 37 and my girls are 3 and 9.

You are telling me that an education will cost about B1.5M. I was not looking just to move and draw on the money we took but to invest in a home (including business set up) for about B4.5M and use the other B13M to buy one or two business'. I have picked up from the net (With due sceptisism) that you can expect a 30% return on investment. I estimate that to be in the region of 50K Stering (B3.5M) a year. Taking off education that should leave B2M to live on what would be the real figure?

I appreciate what I have read may well be twoddle and that is exactly why I joined the forum.

I am prepared to invest and work. What investment would be required for an investment visa. Is the stuff on "Sunbeltasia" way out???

Thanks again,

Talk to Sunbelt...very straightforward and knowledgable advice, and I certainly consider him reliable. The main problem for you is that Thailand does not recognize de facto relationships.

[lopburi3]

Believe dutchy was talking about total education bill (2 children) being 800k per year for a good international school.

You are not married. More expense meeting visa requirements.

A 30% return on investment? Not likely in many legal offerings. Bank savings account earns 0.75% and the banks have money. The reason isn't that people don't want to earn more!

[lambada]

Just thought I would add something. I live in Hong Kong. There are hundreds of people here who would love to live in Thailand but don't! Maybe you should look more closely at Hong Kong, Singapore, Macau, etc etc. Its only $2000-3000 HK to get to the land of smiles and your living in a place that is designed for making money.as opposed to a place that is designed for spending dosh. You could invest your money and / or work (not that that is as easy as it used to be), educate your kids, be in the West and East - not to be underestimated! and go to Thailand, Vietnam, Loas, Cambodia etc as often as you want. ###### you haven't even seen Vietnam yet:) I'm a newbie but your almost virginal:) Take your time. You're not even married to a Thai - you'll get crucified!

[OldAsiaHand]

What what it's worth, I agree wholeheartedly with Lambada. I've lived in Asia for nearly twenty-five years and one thing has remained absolutely constant. Hong Kong and Singapore are significant commercial centers where westerners can and do build real businesses and actual lives. The best of the westerners who want to live in Asia for whatever reaxson, those with education and ability and a work ethic, live there. Bangkok gets the left overs.

[Zendesigner]

If you think of working

DONT come here , I'm an ###### also and been looking for 9 months now. They just don't want to see your face.

If you want to start a company , maybe possible, you probably have money enough, but forget It then also, maybe production of something. Don't even think the restaurant - guesthouse - Bar thing, everybody thinks that....

Open a Production plant, Get BOI approval, and then you probably have a change.

And get a three year headache from the administration Laws here.

But Can you do that ????

B

[smile]

Are IT jobs really that difficult to land in Thailand? As it happens I was looking to get out of IT anyway and I could cope with a three year headache. Infinately better than than the mediocrity we have to endure here.

Honestly. What anual income would be required, in your opinion, to educate and support two kids and a partner with a comfortable lifestyle?

Thanks

[Zendesigner]

Hi smile,

Are IT jobs really that difficult to land in Thailand? As it happens I was looking to get out of IT anyway and I could cope with a three year headache.

There are some jobs out there , the papers are full of them, but mostly there is this little line that says " Thai National Only". On the ones that don't have it you can estimate that for at least 60 percent the same rule will apply.

The people that work in IT here as farang are :

1. Send by the mother company in europe

2. Set up their own It biz to work as contracters (some extra possibilities)

3. Very highly specialized

4. Working at a very crummy wage doing a lot of things that are not IT.

I saw an Add yesterday asking for an ######. it said

"Some networking experiance needed, electricians will have extra consideration"

There is a lot of demand for SAP financials consultants, Sales people like business unit managers ect. But most adverts then also state bilingual thai english.

Don't believe all the story's from how cheap thailand is.

Thailand is cheap if you can live as a thai.

The teachers on their 20.000 bath maximum wage here al sleep in little 4mX4m one room appartments, drive a motorbike, and eat thai food on the street everyday.

If you want to Keep your lifestyle as in europe meaning:

Reasonable appartment or house, Car, eating western food at least three times a week at home of course.

You better start looking in expense between 40.000 bath and 60.000 bath/ monthly , depending on the area that you live in.

The only thing that is really cheap here is THE FOOD, electricity, water, gas.

Cars and houses go very close to european prices. the more close to bangkok the more expensive the houses are. Average house in pattaya (3 bedrooms style) will set you back between 25.000 and 35.000 monthly, bangkok 3 bedroom condo's are about the same. Of course if you live up country in Isaan you can find the same house for 5000 a month.

I'm living as a couple , no children and spending around 45.000 monthly on a nice house, car and living cost.

Despite what everyone says , the only succesfull farangs i meet here are usually owners of factory's , service buisinesses, long standing hotels and restaurants.

The poor guy's are the basic english teachers, new owners of beer bars, the 130th guesthouse owner in Jontiem ect.

If you can come with enough money you can easely survive even with a good small business, But your childrens education while compromise that by the cost of it.

And as DR patpong said , defacto relations are not recognized so all of you will have problems getting visa's every three months or yearly again. Which means or Marry, then you can do it one 1 company 1 workpermit + visa on your name, wife children on there also.

Or 1 company 2 workpermits (capatalization 4 mill, lot of thai staff) children on your visa's. (ask Sunbelt about Companies)

I don't know what happens to the children if they become of legal age regarding visa's , maybe could ask the DR again?

What anual income would be required, in your opinion, to educate and support two kids and a partner with a comfortable lifestyle

Above figures are estimates without education, insurance, hospital bils ect.

Your children will NEED an international school (if you care about their future at least).

In a normal Thai school they will learn diddely squat. Only Thai reading and writing, basic mathematics. Rote learning , No individual development at all.

Even in international schools they probably will have it easy with their european background.

Everybody say's that international schools are expensive. They also look like their expensive , But since i have no kids i can't help you with that.

If you want you can e-mail me and i can give you some more figures in private.

Hope it helps

B

[OldAsiaHand]

Your children will NEED an international school (if you care about their future at least).

In a normal Thai school they will learn diddely squat. Only Thai reading and writing, basic mathematics. Rote learning , No individual development at all.

Everybody say's that international schools are expensive. They also look like their expensive  , But since i have no kids i can't help you with that.

Thai schools are generally conceded by everyone to be a disgrace as educational institutions, and naturally, teach solely in the Thai language, so they would really be a disaster for European children. Worse, if you are still intent on your kids making their way in an educational system in another language regardless of its qualitity, you should know that even Thais only get into the limited number of Thai schools that you might find even reasonably acceptable through a combination of social status and outright bribery. The previous poster was exactly right. International schools are a necessity for every foreigner.

As for costs, count on an absolute minimum of USD12,000 per child per year, plus a major registration fee up front when they first join the school (another USD10,000 -15,000 per child). For the most respected international schools --- Bangkok Pattaya (British system) and International School of Bangkok (American system) --- tutition runs the equivalent of about USD15,000 plus another USD3,000 or so in other fees per child per year.

The costs are so high because very few foreign parents actually pay them out of their own pockets (although Thai parents, desperate to get their kids into the very small quotas available for Thais in each of the international schools often offer to pay even more, either on or below the table). A considerable majority of foreign students who attend international schools in Thailand are being paid for by corporations or embassies as a part of a parent's expat pay package, so the sensitivity most foreigners have to educational costs in not very high.