Yingluck allowed to submit further evidence to fight charges: Rice pledging

[Nick1954]

Yingluck's lawyer, Norawit Lalaeng, said today that Yingluck had not informed him of any change with her plan to return to Thailand on Sunday.

[rickirs]

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As I understand it the extra witnesses she wanted to produce to the NACC were not witnesses in the true sense but character references who can hardly speak to whether she did wrong or not but only to ' she's too nice,  responsible, wonderful etc. ' to have done so.

 

If questioned correctly these character witnesses could actually damage her as how do they answer " why do you say she's innocent ? "

Apart from the glowing tributes they may also point out she's not responsible because she didn't know what was going as she rarely attended any committee meetings,  never asked for or received reports and didn't ask questions which proves her total ' hands off ' lack of responsibility and leadership.

 

The law requires for an official to dishonestly exercise or omit to exercise any of his functions to be held criminally liable. Thus, by legal symmetry one who honestly exercises or omit to exercise any of his functions cannot be held criminally liable. So the charge against Yingluck is in part a matter of subjectiveness as to her character, honesty and trustworthiness. The court must find malfeasence in her actions or lack of actions that she had intentionally planned for the failure of the rice pledging program for political and/or financial gain in order for her actions or lack of actions to be ruled criminal.  

[IAMSOBAD]

If WE get stopped walking down the road for any non reason...we are treated guilty and cannot call any witnesses or for help. But she gets whatever she wants. Sounds like the deck is stacked.
My character is above reproach, may I call anyone? NO! Edited August 6, 2014 by IAMSOBAD

[Tatsujin]

 

 

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It is fair that she can submit further evidences as long as they are true. However, there is a hard evidence that many rice farmers were screwed by the Yingluck administration. I am curious to see how she defends the charges.      

This case has nothing to do with the farmers being paid.   

 
You sound like a guy who's just fallen off his bar stool in a drunken stupor and that's the first thing that came out of your mouth . . .
 
This case(s) is about malfeasance, corruption, negligence . . . farmers killing themselves because they didn't get paid would certainly have a LOT to do with how well the Thaksin rice scam was conceived and administered.
 
But up to you . . . keep those blinders on and keep living in your own little blinkered fantasy world if it helps you get through the day . . .
 

 
Mango Bob may have blinders on but you live in a fish bowl being led by your own tail.
 
The financial burden and related suicides of the rice farmers are not part of the negligence charges against Yingluck and rightly so. And should such a case be brought against Yingluck, charges should also be brought against Suthep, the PDRC, the Democrats, the EC, and the Junta for justice to be served.
 
Farmers were not paid timely in the latter half of 2013 and in 2014 during Yinglucks interim government as of September 2013 simply because the government had no authority UNDER THE CONSTITUTION to borrow funds to pay-off the farmers quicker than what sales revenues were able to provide. The EC ruled on that matter and remained resolute not to allow borrowing despite the farmers financial suffering.
 
When Yingluck approached private banks for funding, Suthep and the PDRC invaded those branches with protesters and intimidated/threatened the banks into refusing to be involved. When the military overthrew the government, one of its first acts was to SUSPEND the Constitution, thus removing the legal barrier from the government to borrow funds to pay-off the farmers. Yingluck regime's compliance with the law is not an act of malfeasance nor negligence.

You're the one in the fish bowl or perhaps you are simply getting old and the memory is failing.

The farmers were not being paid as promised well before ANY protests took place.

Go look it up if you've forgotten (or refuse to acknowledge) the REAL facts about this scam from day 1.

The Govt was responsible for ensuring budgets were in place BEFORE the scheme started, continually trying to borrow more and more because rice sales couldn't cover the actual costs involved is part of the reason why they are ALL negligent.

 

Those trillion baht loans for "infrastructure" and other things they were trying to railroad through were intended to be used to hide the huge losses and mismanagement of this scam.

 

But you believe whatever you want. I prefer to go with the truth, not some made up fantasy.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Tatsujin

[Tatsujin]

double post 

 

Edited August 6, 2014 by Tatsujin

[Old Man River]

OK I really don't get it

Your the leader of the county Say like the United States. Then there is Obama. Who is the president ( so sorry) Now if you compare him to Yinluck . (they want to charge her with dereliction of duty) then why is Obama still president. It would seem to me there is massive dereliction of duty on his part so why is he still president.

Because this is democracy. Good bad or indifferent once you elect an official you stuck with them for the term of the office. Here in Thailand if you don't like then charge then with dereliction which come to my point.

Who in their right mind that has a fabric of good in their body will want to be Prime minster of Thailand and have the threat of nebulous legal action hanging over their heads.

There lies the rub

No one with any talent will want to Its that simple so the Thais are designing a system that will only attract less that stellar people.

I wouldn't want to be O'bama either, but in the US you can impeach a president. With YL, she dissolved her own parliament. The systems aren't the same.


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None of what was going on would ever have been exposed if the military hadn't stepped in

There was a pending 2 billion off budget loan which if approved would have been used in part to cover up their financial misdeeds and assisted in their re-election

For obvious reasons and in no particular order - PTP refused to

- Tell the truth at any time during their attempt to run Thailand
- Step down in the face of total incompetence and lies
- be open and transparent

They also openly supported and funded a nationwide terrorist organisation, terrorised intimidated and murdered anyone that stood against them and also removed ministers and heads of departments that did same

It goes on and on - but you get the general idea

Smedly, I have more than the general idea, and it does go on and on. You and I agree completely.


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[khunken]

 

 

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It is fair that she can submit further evidences as long as they are true. However, there is a hard evidence that many rice farmers were screwed by the Yingluck administration. I am curious to see how she defends the charges.      

This case has nothing to do with the farmers being paid.   

 

You sound like a guy who's just fallen off his bar stool in a drunken stupor and that's the first thing that came out of your mouth . . .

 

This case(s) is about malfeasance, corruption, negligence . . . farmers killing themselves because they didn't get paid would certainly have a LOT to do with how well the Thaksin rice scam was conceived and administered.

 

But up to you . . . keep those blinders on and keep living in your own little blinkered fantasy world if it helps you get through the day . . .

 

 

 

Mango Bob may have blinders on but you live in a fish bowl being led by your own tail.

 

The financial burden and related suicides of the rice farmers are not part of the negligence charges against Yingluck and rightly so. And should such a case be brought against Yingluck, charges should also be brought against Suthep, the PDRC, the Democrats, the EC, and the Junta for justice to be served.

 

Farmers were not paid timely in the latter half of 2013 and in 2014 during Yingluck’s interim government as of September 2013 simply because the government had no authority UNDER THE CONSTITUTION to borrow funds to pay-off the farmers quicker than what sales revenues were able to provide. The EC ruled on that matter and remained resolute not to allow borrowing despite the farmer’s financial suffering.

 

When Yingluck approached private banks for funding, Suthep and the PDRC invaded those branches with protesters and intimidated/threatened the banks into refusing to be involved. When the military overthrew the government, one of its first acts was to SUSPEND the Constitution, thus removing the legal barrier from the government to borrow funds to pay-off the farmers. Yingluck regime's compliance with the law is not an act of malfeasance nor negligence.

 

 

This has a strong resemblance to the same crap posted in a thread about the rice subsidy losses yesterday. And it will get the same answer from me.

 

The payments to the rice farmers stopped when YL and her mob resigned and they (repeat they) made no provision for ensuring that the funds were available.

 

Either YL was ignorant of an interim government's inability to obtain loans (for obvious electioneering reasons) or she thought that she could ignore the law as she had done before. Mismanagement and/or negligence.

 

Yes, the PDRC and the EC very strongly pointed out that it was illegal for the resigned mob to obtain loans, despite efforts to brow-beat some banks into making non-collateralised loans.

 

Suthep may have been guilty of all sorts of things but he was well within his rights and the law to oppose Yingluck's attempted illegality. The EC did nothing wrong, except if you think that PTP couldn't be prevented from breaking the law (which was always a 'feature' of their misrule).

 

The NCPO, as soon as they could legally, paid the farmers - thereby righting a wrong solely caused by PTP.

 

The one correct item in your pack of untruths is that the suicides are not a part of the negligence charges.

 

[Baerboxer]

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It is fair that she can submit further evidences as long as they are true. However, there is a hard evidence that many rice farmers were screwed by the Yingluck administration. I am curious to see how she defends the charges.      

This case has nothing to do with the farmers being paid.   

 

You sound like a guy who's just fallen off his bar stool in a drunken stupor and that's the first thing that came out of your mouth . . .

 

This case(s) is about malfeasance, corruption, negligence . . . farmers killing themselves because they didn't get paid would certainly have a LOT to do with how well the Thaksin rice scam was conceived and administered.

 

But up to you . . . keep those blinders on and keep living in your own little blinkered fantasy world if it helps you get through the day . . .

 

You live in a Yellow world.   Wake up and see there more colors than just yellow.  Good think people like you don't judge others in a court of law.

 

She has failed to respond to questions on the illegal acts of her government; lied and been caught lying. 

 

She repeatedly said she was in charge, numero uno and made all the decisions - or was that just another lie? So hard to tell what's truth and what's lies with this lot.

 

She, as any other, deserves a fair and transparent trial - but not one with pastry boxes or where the only decision allowed is one that favors the Shins.

 

I'm sure Tatsujin would be a fair minded juror and judge based on the evidence. Not like some,Bob, who might be politically motivated in their judgement.

 

Do you really believe as PM/DM, Chair of the Rice committee, she acted responsibly and exercised all her duties with diligence and due care? Or did she simply not give a toss, sod off on as many trips as possible and turn a blind eyes as instructed by the great caddy from afar? 

 

That's what the courts will have to decide.

[Tatsujin]

Apparently she's confirmed she's returning to face the music . . . so she's gone up a small notch in my estimation when compared to her brother . . . if it happens . . .

[Tanlic]

This reminds me of Max Bygraves "I wanna tell you a story".

 

 

[FangFerang]

The main people charged in the largest of losses were....military.  They found warehouse managers fraudulently filed chits for non-existent rice and wrote chits for the same rice more than once.  Then we have the famous 'hollow stacks" found in one warehouse.

 

The dereliction of duty for maintaining rice stocks is clear.  It reaches back to before the 1950's, and involves 'switching' cheaply purchased foreign rice with Thai rice, then selling the Thai rice after smuggling it outside the country.  Accusing the PM of dereliction retroactively damns every PM since way before Thaksin.

 

Amazing Thailand and TVF -- people are still trying to scream colors when farangs aren't even entitled to claim transparent as a color.

 

[kimamey]

 

 

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It is fair that she can submit further evidences as long as they are true. However, there is a hard evidence that many rice farmers were screwed by the Yingluck administration. I am curious to see how she defends the charges.      

This case has nothing to do with the farmers being paid.   

 

You sound like a guy who's just fallen off his bar stool in a drunken stupor and that's the first thing that came out of your mouth . . .

 

This case(s) is about malfeasance, corruption, negligence . . . farmers killing themselves because they didn't get paid would certainly have a LOT to do with how well the Thaksin rice scam was conceived and administered.

 

But up to you . . . keep those blinders on and keep living in your own little blinkered fantasy world if it helps you get through the day . . .

 

 

 

Mango Bob may have blinders on but you live in a fish bowl being led by your own tail.

 

The financial burden and related suicides of the rice farmers are not part of the negligence charges against Yingluck and rightly so. And should such a case be brought against Yingluck, charges should also be brought against Suthep, the PDRC, the Democrats, the EC, and the Junta for justice to be served.

 

Farmers were not paid timely in the latter half of 2013 and in 2014 during Yingluck’s interim government as of September 2013 simply because the government had no authority UNDER THE CONSTITUTION to borrow funds to pay-off the farmers quicker than what sales revenues were able to provide. The EC ruled on that matter and remained resolute not to allow borrowing despite the farmer’s financial suffering.

 

When Yingluck approached private banks for funding, Suthep and the PDRC invaded those branches with protesters and intimidated/threatened the banks into refusing to be involved. When the military overthrew the government, one of its first acts was to SUSPEND the Constitution, thus removing the legal barrier from the government to borrow funds to pay-off the farmers. Yingluck regime's compliance with the law is not an act of malfeasance nor negligence.

 

 

I've mentioned this mistake of yours before but I'll do it again. The ability of the NCPO to borrow money had nothing to do with the suspending of the Constitution. The PTP were prevented because they were operating under election rules. I'm sure you're aware that the NCPO weren't a political party campaigning in an election so the rules wouldn't apply to them anyway.

 

The original problem was they didn't foresee the need for funds before dissolving the house.  I would have thought that they should have at least been aware of the possibility at the time. Perhaps they believed their own overinflated predictions of sales levels.

 

After that you're correct that Suthep and the PDRC were instrumental in preventing them borrowing from the banks.

[jayjayjayjay]

Funny to read what Khun Panadda Diskul meekly said now and weeks before. No mention of massive frauds and corruption or even rice loss but just a polite mention that samples will be sent to the lab for quality check and result known mid-sept. Looks like the air has been leaked out of a much inflated oppositions claim.

There's no accountability to what 99% of TV poster say here. All rave on with zero facts suppourting there arguments so as much as I support your arguement I urge your to leave them swilling in their own vomit! 5555 let's wait to see, the rice scheme might even make money after most is found in good condition and with India's increased domestic consumption and Vietnams bad year, the reason for a rice trading scheme can be shown to the naysayers. Only problem is not a single one would admit to it as they are so fixed on their political beliefs facts have no place in this arguement ;)

[NeilSA1]

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It is fair that she can submit further evidences as long as they are true. However, there is a hard evidence that many rice farmers were screwed by the Yingluck administration. I am curious to see how she defends the charges.      

This case has nothing to do with the farmers being paid.   

 

You sound like a guy who's just fallen off his bar stool in a drunken stupor and that's the first thing that came out of your mouth . . .

 

This case(s) is about malfeasance, corruption, negligence . . . farmers killing themselves because they didn't get paid would certainly have a LOT to do with how well the Thaksin rice scam was conceived and administered.

 

But up to you . . . keep those blinders on and keep living in your own little blinkered fantasy world if it helps you get through the day . . .

 

You live in a Yellow world.   Wake up and see there more colors than just yellow.  Good think people like you don't judge others in a court of law.

Yes, nothing like a good think....