Working Online

[AYJAYDEE]

It's obvious that the OP just started this thread to argue. And coming with the same boring statements as every thread about online work and digital nomads..........

I started the thread with exactly the intent I stated in the OP. In other words, I sought recommendation over what people were really doing on the ground with respect to this question. I did get ticked off when certain individuals tried to sabotage the thread right from the word go, tried to coerce moderators to get it shut down. But I don't find it hard to handle petty cyber bullies. I can do it with one hand tied behind my back. Two people on this thread have had no business on it except in trying to close down a discussion from the first posts they made. It's a tactic I've seen on many forums, and judging from some other responders, it's perfectly visible to most people.

you were not interested in finding out what others were doing so much as promoting your personal views on the shortcomings of the thai government with respect to online work. something that has been covered here in many other threads. and you got called on it.

Oh I was and am VERY interested in what others in a similar situation to myself have been doing, and that was my reason for starting the thread. Those were the very people I thanked for their contribution, most especially those who gave anecdotes of what they were told at immigration.

lol! you started arguing with all of them!

[Delphis]

No it's not work. And like most of your other statements here, you don't know what you talk about

Can you explain to me why it's not work though?

Better, can you explain to me what the practical difference is, to anyone in Thailand, or to the Thai economy, whether someone's money available to spend in Thailand is earned from a 10% gain in their foreign investment fund, or by a a foreign company selling coconuts to Australia. I doubt you can.

Inversely it is also difficult to explain where the word 'work' starts and where it ends. If washing one's car or doing some volontary domestic work is considered as work there will be always some confusion about knowing when exactly it is illegal and when it is not. I have read in one of the forum of TV that a foreigner owner of a bar was caught working illegally in his own bar because he was sitting and talking to customers, he was considered to be illegally working as entertaining people

Right, and I mean that's crazy, is it not? Or is it just me?

[Fab5BKK]

Well, here we have someone lol

BTW, I understood you "will likely not be back" because blablabla.

And it seems that you're keen to claim that you know everything about every single topic. Therefore, where's the point to stay here? Just asking

Please be a man who sticks to his words

Okay I'm done. I sincerely thank those who gave considered replies on the thread.

To the admin I say, I will likely not be back. I find the general attitude here by many posters trollish and hectoring, akin to schoolyard bullies. It does NOT seem like a friendly environment for people seeking advice on moving to Thailand, which is why I posted here. By all means please monitor the thread and see for yourself. Do with this information as you wish. Adios!

[Makham]

I'll just make it short:

Thailand has enough problems with visa abuse and illegal workers right now. There is no need for a visa that can be even more easily abused.

The law is deliberately set up to have no loopholes whatsoever, so anyone who even looks remotely like working can be kicked in the derriere.

[Delphis]

Well, here we have someone lol

BTW, I understood you "will likely not be back" because blablabla.

And it seems that you're keen to claim that you know everything about every single topic. Therefore, where's the point to stay here? Just asking

Please be a man who sticks to his words

Okay I'm done. I sincerely thank those who gave considered replies on the thread.

To the admin I say, I will likely not be back. I find the general attitude here by many posters trollish and hectoring, akin to schoolyard bullies. It does NOT seem like a friendly environment for people seeking advice on moving to Thailand, which is why I posted here. By all means please monitor the thread and see for yourself. Do with this information as you wish. Adios!

Well, I must admit I'm *surprised*. I would naively have thought that a community such as this would be more supportive of opening up possibilities for people thinking of living in Thailand, rather than shutting them down, or arguing to shut them down. This is obviously an issue that affects many people. It wouldn't come up as a topic as often as you guys are saying it does, if that were not the case.

It's also obviously an issue that can't be expected to go away, as the influence of the internet and internet-style business in future years, is going to become more pervasive not less. It's also important because if Thailand were (misguidedly I would say) to literally crack down on anyone working online in Thailand withour a work permit directly tied to said activity, that could lead to thousands of deportations.

It's not just Thailand. It's the whole world that needs to dawn to the realization that ways of doing business have simply changed.

[AYJAYDEE]

Well, here we have someone lol

BTW, I understood you "will likely not be back" because blablabla.

And it seems that you're keen to claim that you know everything about every single topic. Therefore, where's the point to stay here? Just asking

Please be a man who sticks to his words

Okay I'm done. I sincerely thank those who gave considered replies on the thread.

To the admin I say, I will likely not be back. I find the general attitude here by many posters trollish and hectoring, akin to schoolyard bullies. It does NOT seem like a friendly environment for people seeking advice on moving to Thailand, which is why I posted here. By all means please monitor the thread and see for yourself. Do with this information as you wish. Adios!

Well, I must admit I'm *surprised*. I would naively have thought that a community such as this would be more supportive of opening up possibilities for people thinking of living in Thailand, rather than shutting them down, or arguing to shut them down. This is obviously an issue that affects many people. It wouldn't come up as a topic as often as you guys are saying it does, if that were not the case.

It's also obviously an issue that can't be expected to go away, as the influence of the internet and internet-style business in future years, is going to become more pervasive not less. It's also important because if Thailand were (misguidedly I would say) to literally crack down on anyone working online in Thailand withour a work permit directly tied to said activity, that could lead to thousands of deportations.

It's not just Thailand. It's the whole world that needs to dawn to the realization that ways of doing business have simply changed.

so make your points on one the many threads already in existence as was suggested earlier. and you are in no position to open up possibilities any more than all the others that have made the same points in all those other threads.

[dreaming]

Delphis.

The short answer to your question is. Yes you do need a WP to work in thailand (even online). But the likelyhood of getting caught is probably zero.

A bit like speeding. We all know it is illegal but we all do it at some stage

[larsjohnsson]

It's obvious that the OP just started this thread to argue. And coming with the same boring statements as every thread about online work and digital nomads..........

I started the thread with exactly the intent I stated in the OP. In other words, I sought recommendation over what people were really doing on the ground with respect to this question. I did get ticked off when certain individuals tried to sabotage the thread right from the word go, tried to coerce moderators to get it shut down. But I don't find it hard to handle petty cyber bullies. I can do it with one hand tied behind my back. Two people on this thread have had no business on it except in trying to close down a discussion from the first posts they made. It's a tactic I've seen on many forums, and judging from some other responders, it's perfectly visible to most people.

you were not interested in finding out what others were doing so much as promoting your personal views on the shortcomings of the thai government with respect to online work. something that has been covered here in many other threads. and you got called on it.

Oh I was and am VERY interested in what others in a similar situation to myself have been doing, and that was my reason for starting the thread. Those were the very people I thanked for their contribution, most especially those who gave anecdotes of what they were told at immigration.

Those people that actually have some real online work here. They keep quiet and work. They don't start a thread and argue and announce what they do

[Delphis]

Those people that actually have some real online work here. They keep quiet and work. They don't start a thread and argue and announce what they do

They were kind enough to reply with useful insight and information, which I for one was very grateful for. I can't speak for anyone else.

[AYJAYDEE]

Those people that actually have some real online work here. They keep quiet and work. They don't start a thread and argue and announce what they do

They were kind enough to reply with useful insight and information, which I for one was very grateful for. I can't speak for anyone else.

you immediately argued with them when they tried to give you the information and thoughts you asked for!

Edited August 19, 2014 by AYJAYDEE

[IMA_FARANG]

i have known freelance journalists with and authour's with work permits, i must remember to ask them how those were arranged.

-----------------------------

For "journalists" i believe there is a process to get certified in Thailand as an "accredited journalist".

The "Catch 22" is that to do that you require foriegn accreditation first to get accredited as a "certified journalist" in Thailand.

I believe (but not positive) your foriegn accreditation allows you to become a member of the Foreign Journalists Club of Thailand which then certifies you as a accredited Thai journalist and alloows you to get a work permit as a journalist/writer/foriegn correspondent in Thailand.

But I am not certain exactly how it is done ..... i believe someone must first reccomend you (Thai).

Basically a "good old boy" clus. if you have to ask to join, you obviously don't belong.

[Banzai99]

But when someone kicks off with rudeness..

I simply stated that this topic had been discussed a thousand times already.

Simon, when a Forum is limited to Thai related questions, are you surprised ?

Yes he could use the search engine and pull up a thread 5 years old, if he replied to it, it would be closed as an old thread, so he opened a new one.

[anon676545345]

Okay I'm done. I sincerely thank those who gave considered replies on the thread.

To the admin I say, I will likely not be back. I find the general attitude here by many posters trollish and hectoring, akin to schoolyard bullies. It does NOT seem like a friendly environment for people seeking advice on moving to Thailand, which is why I posted here. By all means please monitor the thread and see for yourself. Do with this information as you wish. Adios!

This subjects been raised a few times and it gets the TV resident trolls excited as for some bizarre reason they really resent the fact people can earn a living on line. Basically they're just posting their opinion and using their vast (non-existent) knowledge of Thai law to attempt to substantiate that opinion, yet they consistently fail to provide any information from Thai governance pertaining to the subject. They're well practiced arguing this subject as they spend all day everyday loitering on this forum cluttering up various threads with inane rubbish, so if there was an relevant information out there that backed up their "opinion" they would have found it.

When I obtained my last visa I was asked a few questions due to the amount of tourist visa's in my passport they were concerned that I might be working in Thailand, I told them I work on line and draw an income from my home country, they wanted to see statements to support this once they'd viewed the statements and seen the money was getting paid into my UK bank they gave me a visa.

If the Thai authorities shared the view of ThaiVisa's arse clown brigade then I'm sure there would be raids on co-working spaces, several websites run by expats would be closed down and there would be at least some anecdotal evidence of people being arrested and fined.

[Banzai99]

Okay I'm done. I sincerely thank those who gave considered replies on the thread.

To the admin I say, I will likely not be back. I find the general attitude here by many posters trollish and hectoring, akin to schoolyard bullies. It does NOT seem like a friendly environment for people seeking advice on moving to Thailand, which is why I posted here. By all means please monitor the thread and see for yourself. Do with this information as you wish. Adios!

This subjects been raised a few times and it gets the TV resident trolls excited as for some bizarre reason they really resent the fact people can earn a living on line. Basically they're just posting their opinion and using their vast (non-existent) knowledge of Thai law to attempt to substantiate that opinion, yet they consistently fail to provide any information from Thai governance pertaining to the subject. They're well practiced arguing this subject as they spend all day everyday loitering on this forum cluttering up various threads with inane rubbish, so if there was an relevant information out there that backed up their "opinion" they would have found it.

When I obtained my last visa I was asked a few questions due to the amount of tourist visa's in my passport they were concerned that I might be working in Thailand, I told them I work on line and draw an income from my home country, they wanted to see statements to support this once they'd viewed the statements and seen the money was getting paid into my UK bank they gave me a visa.

If the Thai authorities shared the view of ThaiVisa's arse clown brigade then I'm sure there would be raids on co-working spaces, several websites run by expats would be closed down and there would be at least some anecdotal evidence of people being arrested and fined.

This.

[GarryP]

Okay I'm done. I sincerely thank those who gave considered replies on the thread.

To the admin I say, I will likely not be back. I find the general attitude here by many posters trollish and hectoring, akin to schoolyard bullies. It does NOT seem like a friendly environment for people seeking advice on moving to Thailand, which is why I posted here. By all means please monitor the thread and see for yourself. Do with this information as you wish. Adios!

This subjects been raised a few times and it gets the TV resident trolls excited as for some bizarre reason they really resent the fact people can earn a living on line. Basically they're just posting their opinion and using their vast (non-existent) knowledge of Thai law to attempt to substantiate that opinion, yet they consistently fail to provide any information from Thai governance pertaining to the subject. They're well practiced arguing this subject as they spend all day everyday loitering on this forum cluttering up various threads with inane rubbish, so if there was an relevant information out there that backed up their "opinion" they would have found it.

When I obtained my last visa I was asked a few questions due to the amount of tourist visa's in my passport they were concerned that I might be working in Thailand, I told them I work on line and draw an income from my home country, they wanted to see statements to support this once they'd viewed the statements and seen the money was getting paid into my UK bank they gave me a visa.

If the Thai authorities shared the view of ThaiVisa's arse clown brigade then I'm sure there would be raids on co-working spaces, several websites run by expats would be closed down and there would be at least some anecdotal evidence of people being arrested and fined.

Do you have any idea whether it is possible to open a UK based bank account from Thailand? Working online interests me, although I currently work in an office, and I had not thought of this aspect, i.e. having money paid to you offshore to show that you are being paid overseas.

The idea of retirement horrifies me, and working online appears to be an interesting option. Although god only knows what I would do online to make any money. Suggestions anyone, apart from online surveys.

Edited August 19, 2014 by GarryP

[anon676545345]

Okay I'm done. I sincerely thank those who gave considered replies on the thread.

To the admin I say, I will likely not be back. I find the general attitude here by many posters trollish and hectoring, akin to schoolyard bullies. It does NOT seem like a friendly environment for people seeking advice on moving to Thailand, which is why I posted here. By all means please monitor the thread and see for yourself. Do with this information as you wish. Adios!

This subjects been raised a few times and it gets the TV resident trolls excited as for some bizarre reason they really resent the fact people can earn a living on line. Basically they're just posting their opinion and using their vast (non-existent) knowledge of Thai law to attempt to substantiate that opinion, yet they consistently fail to provide any information from Thai governance pertaining to the subject. They're well practiced arguing this subject as they spend all day everyday loitering on this forum cluttering up various threads with inane rubbish, so if there was an relevant information out there that backed up their "opinion" they would have found it.

When I obtained my last visa I was asked a few questions due to the amount of tourist visa's in my passport they were concerned that I might be working in Thailand, I told them I work on line and draw an income from my home country, they wanted to see statements to support this once they'd viewed the statements and seen the money was getting paid into my UK bank they gave me a visa.

If the Thai authorities shared the view of ThaiVisa's arse clown brigade then I'm sure there would be raids on co-working spaces, several websites run by expats would be closed down and there would be at least some anecdotal evidence of people being arrested and fined.

Do you have any idea whether it is possible to open a UK based bank account from Thailand? Working online interests me, although I currently work in an office, and I had not thought of this aspect, i.e. having money paid to you offshore to show that you are being paid overseas.

The idea of retirement horrifies me, and working online appears to be an interesting option. Although god only knows what I would do online to make any money. Suggestions anyone, apart from online surveys.

I'm not sure about opening a UK account from abroad, but citybank offer an international account that can be opened on line, the staff at the embassy wanted to see that I was drawing an income from outside of Thailand.

There is a host of information on line reference earning money online there maybe something that fits your skill set, it's got to be a better utilistion of time than the guys who spend most of their day on TV arguing.

[LivinLOS]

So, as we know from recent events about visas, you may be able to get away with breaking the law this week, but next week could be a completely different matter.

And then you come back to the issue of rigorous application of the law, when so many laws are badly written catch alls.. Designed for interpretations should they want.

I have no real axe to grind with there being a set of clear laws, I can have a personal opinion on some laws being daft (cant buy alcohol 2 - 5) or wise but its the framework. The problem is when the framework is being suddenly rigorously applied, to a ill defined standard,

[potters]

Okay I'm done. I sincerely thank those who gave considered replies on the thread.

To the admin I say, I will likely not be back. I find the general attitude here by many posters trollish and hectoring, akin to schoolyard bullies. It does NOT seem like a friendly environment for people seeking advice on moving to Thailand, which is why I posted here. By all means please monitor the thread and see for yourself. Do with this information as you wish. Adios!

This subjects been raised a few times and it gets the TV resident trolls excited as for some bizarre reason they really resent the fact people can earn a living on line. Basically they're just posting their opinion and using their vast (non-existent) knowledge of Thai law to attempt to substantiate that opinion, yet they consistently fail to provide any information from Thai governance pertaining to the subject. They're well practiced arguing this subject as they spend all day everyday loitering on this forum cluttering up various threads with inane rubbish, so if there was an relevant information out there that backed up their "opinion" they would have found it.

When I obtained my last visa I was asked a few questions due to the amount of tourist visa's in my passport they were concerned that I might be working in Thailand, I told them I work on line and draw an income from my home country, they wanted to see statements to support this once they'd viewed the statements and seen the money was getting paid into my UK bank they gave me a visa.

If the Thai authorities shared the view of ThaiVisa's arse clown brigade then I'm sure there would be raids on co-working spaces, several websites run by expats would be closed down and there would be at least some anecdotal evidence of people being arrested and fined.

Best Post on this subject. Laughed my cock off and soooooo true

[potters]

If you are going to work online

DO IT

Keep your mouth shut and certainly don't post on here about it.

Does that make someone on here with between 1-3k plus posts to their name a Volunteer as they are keeping the site going.

If so need a permit for that.

Question for the moderators.

Are you not classed as working?

Anyway have to go back to Betfair footy tonight

[JLCrab]

The reason that the Thai authorities don't raid shared-office space, knock down condo doors, and deny more entries to the online folks on repeated tourist visas may be pretty simple: The component that such persons represent to the overall Thai economy is so small that they really don't give a sh*t. Most probably only do enough to get by anyway.

Thai officialdom wants IT and online service companies to invest in Thailand and hire Thai university graduates and, I presume, as long as they do not provide incentives to the lone wolves who do neither, the potential investors really don't care.

As for the repeated tourist visas, regardless of WP status, you sign a declaration on your application that your trip is for pleasure purposes only which, if otherwise, is making a false statement to a Thai official which may be an offense under the Thai Penal code.

Edited August 19, 2014 by JLCrab

[nicolas18]

Okay I'm done. I sincerely thank those who gave considered replies on the thread.

To the admin I say, I will likely not be back. I find the general attitude here by many posters trollish and hectoring, akin to schoolyard bullies. It does NOT seem like a friendly environment for people seeking advice on moving to Thailand, which is why I posted here. By all means please monitor the thread and see for yourself. Do with this information as you wish. Adios!

This subjects been raised a few times and it gets the TV resident trolls excited as for some bizarre reason they really resent the fact people can earn a living on line. Basically they're just posting their opinion and using their vast (non-existent) knowledge of Thai law to attempt to substantiate that opinion, yet they consistently fail to provide any information from Thai governance pertaining to the subject. They're well practiced arguing this subject as they spend all day everyday loitering on this forum cluttering up various threads with inane rubbish, so if there was an relevant information out there that backed up their "opinion" they would have found it.

When I obtained my last visa I was asked a few questions due to the amount of tourist visa's in my passport they were concerned that I might be working in Thailand, I told them I work on line and draw an income from my home country, they wanted to see statements to support this once they'd viewed the statements and seen the money was getting paid into my UK bank they gave me a visa.

If the Thai authorities shared the view of ThaiVisa's arse clown brigade then I'm sure there would be raids on co-working spaces, several websites run by expats would be closed down and there would be at least some anecdotal evidence of people being arrested and fined.

Perfectly sums up the situation. Great post!

[mataleo]

Legal or not i would say if u keep it low u ger away with it...

In reality its almost impossible to get caught and proved..

[simon43]

Yes he could use the search engine and pull up a thread 5 years old,

Actually, if he used the search engine, he would pull up several recent and ongoing threads on this subject.

[JLCrab]

Legal or not i would say if u keep it low u ger away with it...

In reality its almost impossible to get caught and proved..

Your permission of stay could be invalidated for any number of reasons without Immigration or Labor officials having to PROVE anything.

[mataleo]

Legal or not i would say if u keep it low u ger away with it...

In reality its almost impossible to get caught and proved..

Your permission of stay could be invalidated for any number of reasons without Immigration or Labor officials having to PROVE anything.

They cant kick u out for no reason at all.

Well they can made up reason..

And i think they cant just do it like u said.

Even if they got u working without wp in worst scenario u got court case...

[JLCrab]

Legal or not i would say if u keep it low u ger away with it...

In reality its almost impossible to get caught and proved..

Your permission of stay could be invalidated for any number of reasons without Immigration or Labor officials having to PROVE anything.

They cant kick u out for no reason at all.

Well they can made up reason..

And i think they cant just do it like u said.

Even if they got u working without wp in worst scenario u got court case...

They would have a reason and would not have to take you to court to 'prove' anything. You would have violated the terms of your permission to stay if on a tourist visa or visa exempt entry.

Edited August 19, 2014 by JLCrab

[mataleo]

Legal or not i would say if u keep it low u ger away with it...

In reality its almost impossible to get caught and proved..

Your permission of stay could be invalidated for any number of reasons without Immigration or Labor officials having to PROVE anything.

They cant kick u out for no reason at all.

Well they can made up reason..

And i think they cant just do it like u said.

Even if they got u working without wp in worst scenario u got court case...

They would have a reason and would not have to take you to court to 'prove' anything. You would have violated the terms of your permission to stay if on a tourist visa or visa exempt entry.

I think u wrong.

It dosent work that way.

Most cases no wp. Is fine sometimes big fine or bribe. And if u dont accept that u get locked up.

To avoid locking up u pay security money and u free to go until cort case and then u get ur security money. Then its up to court ...

At least that cases i saw...

[Jaakko]

Im also confused about it, because this kind of activity qualified as illegal can be carried any where and anytime ! No need for a proper office, no need for staff, can be done even with a cell phone. On the other hand if Thailand can authorise such buisiness it could be profitable for the country. An updating of some specific kind of work should be done.

Exactly. I'm glad someone here agrees with me!

be sure to let us know how you two do convincing them! lol

So you think it's impossible to conviice Thailand to chance their outdated laws? Are you trying to say that thais arent capable of rational thinking? Rational think would conclude that granting workpermits to online workers would generate more profit by taxes. Win win to everyone.

It seems like you are the biggest "thaibasher" here when underestimating thais so badly. Laws were made before online work even existed. Sooner or later they will chance it in Thailand. More often we raise this subject the quicker the chance will come. Internet is here to stay.

[JLCrab]

Laws were made before online work even existed.

The Thai Alien Working Act which governs work permits was enacted in 2008

Edited August 19, 2014 by JLCrab

[DrTuner]

Most cases no wp. Is fine sometimes big fine or bribe. And if u dont accept that u get locked up.

To avoid locking up u pay security money and u free to go until cort case and then u get ur security money. Then its up to court ...

Punishment is pretty clear:

http://www.thailawforum.com/database1/Alien-Working-Act.html

An alien working without a work permit is subject to imprisonment for a period of up to five years and/or a fine from 2,000 baht to 100,000 baht. If an alien accused of working without a work permit agrees to leave Thailand within 30 days, he may settle the matter with only a fine. An alien with a work permit failing to comply with certain provisions of the Alien Working Act is subject to a fine of up to 10,000 baht. An employer hiring an alien without a work permit is subject to a fine from 10,000 baht to 100,000 baht per alien, and an employer hiring an alien outside the scope of his work permit is subject to a fine of up to 10,000 baht per alien.