Get Out Of $dollars$ Now!

[BigSnake]

[dave_boo]

Bisto, there's a couple of things about your post that piqued my interest. A claim was made that at max, the 261M oz of gold stored up by the US government. However, 80M is mined globaly each year. It seems odd that there would only be 3 years supply locked up in the US.....am I missing something?

Also, I'm confused...there's a quote of that all the currency in the world is worth $100T. And of that, the US has $13.5T printed up. Now assuming that all the gold in the world is bought up, according to the scenario postulated, and the value of the dollar takes a nose dive to 1/2, wouldn't that mean that all currencies would go to 1/2 their stated value? And even if those countries did have 100% of their currencies' stated value in gold, wouldn't their currencies still drop due to pressures put on their local gold markets due to foreign demand of gold?

Lastly, why the focus on gold? With there being so much that a single country (or a consortium of contries) of suficient economic clout could do to the supply/demand, it seems that a more 'liquid' form of currency is better. Also, not everyone values money just in relation to gold. The oil producing countries see it more as oil, the agricultural countries see it more as crops, etc. Granted, those are all volatile standards, but they are standards in those countries and it's much harder for foreign countries to influence their local values. Whereas if everyone switched to using only gold as a standard, it would be much to easy for smaller countries to get even more trampled.

**disclaimer**

I am in no way a financial advisor, nor know too much about this subject. I merely posted my admittedly limited understanding of the current thread and am asking for clarification.

[siamamerican]

FED cuts by 0.75 !

It's total panic time.

So you still don't want to get out of USD ?

That the Fed will cut to 3% FFR is a given and already priced into the market. What isn't known is if they will go lower than that and what other central banks need do to keep their own economies humming.

The Fed cut rates from over 6% in 2000 to 1% in 2003. The dollar increased in value during this period compared to most currencies. The Fed raised the rate form 1% in 2003 to over 5% in 2007. the US dollar lost value during this period.

Numbers aren't the end all and I'm sure there are examples of the US dollar dropping in value when the fed drops rates, but just some info to consider.

[howtoescape]

I'm new to this investing game. Time will tell if I made the right decision. I've read that you are better letting your money ride through market downturns. Now I'm in the possition to pick my re-entry, but, to be honest, don't have a clue when to get back in. Well, I won half the battle and taxes weren't that bad. I held all the stocks with gain over 1 year and will only pay 10% tax in 2009.

Im in the same position sold everything October 07, but dont seem to have the balls to get back in at the moment, content with my 6.5% with the coventry building society.

[siamamerican]

I'm new to this investing game. Time will tell if I made the right decision. I've read that you are better letting your money ride through market downturns. Now I'm in the possition to pick my re-entry, but, to be honest, don't have a clue when to get back in. Well, I won half the battle and taxes weren't that bad. I held all the stocks with gain over 1 year and will only pay 10% tax in 2009.

Im in the same position sold everything October 07, but dont seem to have the balls to get back in at the moment, content with my 6.5% with the coventry building society.

Got 50% back in 2 Mondays ago. My stocks have underperformed the markets the last 2 weeks, but I'm in for the long haul. Adding to my possitions tonight and plan to reinvest the remainder of the money I took out over the next couple of months. I panicked a little when I got out, but it ended well. Being in the mortgage industry and watching our repurchsed loans from investores grow, scared me a little. Hopefully we are near a bottom, but I don't think anyone really knows.

[shochu]

funny,

whenever vegasvic disappears - you appear with a vengeance - coincidence, alter ego, son to a jingo preaching father, colleague...

you also seem to have a bit more of a zip to you - perhaps letting your hair down for the low ones???

[shochu]

and on topic,

forecast to go at least 10% lower if not more if things go smoothly!

[VegasVic]

funny,

whenever vegasvic disappears - you appear with a vengeance - coincidence, alter ego, son to a jingo preaching father, colleague...

you also seem to have a bit more of a zip to you - perhaps letting your hair down for the low ones???

Poor sochu a little defensive and paranoid are we? Thats OK you have good company on this forum to comiserate with, like lao po

[LaoPo]

funny,

whenever vegasvic disappears - you appear with a vengeance - coincidence, alter ego, son to a jingo preaching father, colleague...

you also seem to have a bit more of a zip to you - perhaps letting your hair down for the low ones???

Poor sochu a little defensive and paranoid are we? Thats OK you have good company on this forum to comiserate with, like lao po

Now, get back to your desert hole VegasVic, and crawl under that rock again, you hear ?

LaoPo

[Bisto]

Bisto, there's a couple of things about your post that piqued my interest. A claim was made that at max, the 261M oz of gold stored up by the US government. However, 80M is mined globaly each year. It seems odd that there would only be 3 years supply locked up in the US.....am I missing something?

Also, I'm confused...there's a quote of that all the currency in the world is worth $100T. And of that, the US has $13.5T printed up. Now assuming that all the gold in the world is bought up, according to the scenario postulated, and the value of the dollar takes a nose dive to 1/2, wouldn't that mean that all currencies would go to 1/2 their stated value? And even if those countries did have 100% of their currencies' stated value in gold, wouldn't their currencies still drop due to pressures put on their local gold markets due to foreign demand of gold?

Lastly, why the focus on gold? With there being so much that a single country (or a consortium of contries) of suficient economic clout could do to the supply/demand, it seems that a more 'liquid' form of currency is better. Also, not everyone values money just in relation to gold. The oil producing countries see it more as oil, the agricultural countries see it more as crops, etc. Granted, those are all volatile standards, but they are standards in those countries and it's much harder for foreign countries to influence their local values. Whereas if everyone switched to using only gold as a standard, it would be much to easy for smaller countries to get even more trampled.

**disclaimer**

I am in no way a financial advisor, nor know too much about this subject. I merely posted my admittedly limited understanding of the current thread and am asking for clarification.

Hi dave_boo

Sorry for late reply been busy.

Answers at end of questions.

> There's a couple of things about your post that piqued my interest. A claim was made that at max, the 261M oz of gold stored up by the US government. However, 80M is mined globally each year. It seems odd that there would only be 3 years supply locked up in the US.....am I missing something?

The U.S. mint used to have 3 times as much, back in WWII. The mint never accumulated since then, but only sold.

Since that time, gold mining has dramatically increased on an annual basis, yet gold mining still adds less than 2% to world supply per year.

>

> Also, I'm confused...there's a quote of that all the currency in the world is worth $100T. And of that, the US has $13.5T printed up. Now assuming that all the gold in the world is bought up

(Can never happen, but yes, go on)

> , according to the scenario postulated, and the value of the dollar takes a nose dive to 1/2, wouldn't that mean that all currencies would go to 1/2 their stated value?

Probably. I see all currencies as bad, not just the dollar.

> And even if those countries did have 100% of their currencies' stated value in gold

none do.

> , wouldn't their currencies still drop due to pressures put on their local gold markets due to foreign demand of gold?

yes.

>

> Lastly, why the focus on gold? With there being so much that a single country (or a consortium of countries) of sufficient economic clout could do to the supply/demand, it seems that a more 'liquid' form of currency is better.

like what? Silver?

> Also, not everyone values money just in relation to gold. The oil producing countries see it more as oil, the agricultural countries see it more as crops, etc. Granted, those are all volatile standards, but they are standards in those countries and it's much harder for foreign countries to influence their local values.

Please name for me one single entity that stores oil as money? none do.

> Whereas if everyone switched to using only gold as a standard, it would be much to easy for smaller countries to get even more trampled.

no. More countries mine gold than mint dollars.

>

Bisto

[cclub75]

A small news, but a symbolic one I think.

March 26 (Bloomberg) -- Treasuries are losing their ``charm'' and U.S. corporate debt and asset-backed securities may become attractive once confidence in credit markets improves, an official at South Korea's National Pension Service said.

The $220 billion fund, which holds about $14 billion of U.S. government debt, is seeking higher yielding debt after two-year Treasury yields slumped to 1.24 percent, the lowest since 2003 from a five-year high of 5.28 percent in June 2006. The pension service is buying commodity-related assets and starting a $22 billion fund with the government to develop overseas resources such as oil fields.

The party is over. Foreigners start to understand that financing the US is not a very good deal... Anymore.

What could happen if funds around the world start en masse to leave the US government debt market ?

Increase in a hurry interest rates to bring them back ? Obviously the FED is doing the contrary...

Will they be willing to switch to US corporate debt market ? Yeah, sure.

And what about the possible effects on the USD ? Scary too.

Edited March 26, 2008 by cclub75

[LivinLOS]

Bisto, there's a couple of things about your post that piqued my interest. A claim was made that at max, the 261M oz of gold stored up by the US government. However, 80M is mined globaly each year. It seems odd that there would only be 3 years supply locked up in the US.....am I missing something?

Also, I'm confused...there's a quote of that all the currency in the world is worth $100T. And of that, the US has $13.5T printed up. Now assuming that all the gold in the world is bought up, according to the scenario postulated, and the value of the dollar takes a nose dive to 1/2, wouldn't that mean that all currencies would go to 1/2 their stated value? And even if those countries did have 100% of their currencies' stated value in gold, wouldn't their currencies still drop due to pressures put on their local gold markets due to foreign demand of gold?

Lastly, why the focus on gold? With there being so much that a single country (or a consortium of contries) of suficient economic clout could do to the supply/demand, it seems that a more 'liquid' form of currency is better. Also, not everyone values money just in relation to gold. The oil producing countries see it more as oil, the agricultural countries see it more as crops, etc. Granted, those are all volatile standards, but they are standards in those countries and it's much harder for foreign countries to influence their local values. Whereas if everyone switched to using only gold as a standard, it would be much to easy for smaller countries to get even more trampled.

**disclaimer**

I am in no way a financial advisor, nor know too much about this subject. I merely posted my admittedly limited understanding of the current thread and am asking for clarification.

Hi dave_boo

Sorry for late reply been busy.

Answers at end of questions.

> There's a couple of things about your post that piqued my interest. A claim was made that at max, the 261M oz of gold stored up by the US government. However, 80M is mined globally each year. It seems odd that there would only be 3 years supply locked up in the US.....am I missing something?

The U.S. mint used to have 3 times as much, back in WWII. The mint never accumulated since then, but only sold.

Since that time, gold mining has dramatically increased on an annual basis, yet gold mining still adds less than 2% to world supply per year.

>

> Also, I'm confused...there's a quote of that all the currency in the world is worth $100T. And of that, the US has $13.5T printed up. Now assuming that all the gold in the world is bought up

(Can never happen, but yes, go on)

> , according to the scenario postulated, and the value of the dollar takes a nose dive to 1/2, wouldn't that mean that all currencies would go to 1/2 their stated value?

Probably. I see all currencies as bad, not just the dollar.

> And even if those countries did have 100% of their currencies' stated value in gold

none do.

> , wouldn't their currencies still drop due to pressures put on their local gold markets due to foreign demand of gold?

yes.

>

> Lastly, why the focus on gold? With there being so much that a single country (or a consortium of countries) of sufficient economic clout could do to the supply/demand, it seems that a more 'liquid' form of currency is better.

like what? Silver?

> Also, not everyone values money just in relation to gold. The oil producing countries see it more as oil, the agricultural countries see it more as crops, etc. Granted, those are all volatile standards, but they are standards in those countries and it's much harder for foreign countries to influence their local values.

Please name for me one single entity that stores oil as money? none do.

> Whereas if everyone switched to using only gold as a standard, it would be much to easy for smaller countries to get even more trampled.

no. More countries mine gold than mint dollars.

>

Bisto

Good succinct answers Bisto.

As to point 1) The large part of GATA's argument is that there has been no independent audit of US gold storage either, and they wont even give straight answers about if its been loaned out etc.. Its highly possible theres a lot less at fort knox than the accounts say.

[naklang]

Even if the world decided to cut off servicing US debt and oil flow, the military will still be able to go break some kneecaps to convince them to "get their mind right". The empire in it's last throes is certain to deal out some mighty damage to those that cross it. We suck at civil/insurgent conflicts, but we can level cities and standing armies quite efficiently. If you can't produce, service, or swindle your way to prosperity any longer, start taking it by force. The plans are being laid to do just that and its going to be uggggggglyy.

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-mili...,1,243958.story

[dave_boo]

Wow, another America basher.....this place is getting like Slashdot.

[naklang]

Not bashing, just illustrating that when all else fails, better start kicking ass and taking names. All that expensive killin' hardware needs to start paying oil dividends. Us 'merkins be gettin' mighty sore giving up our Budweiser money to fill up the Dodge Powerwagon. Gotta love the combat "camo" shoes on the trailer 'ho. LOL!

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http:/...=image&cd=3

Edited March 27, 2008 by naklang

[LaoPo]

Wow, another America basher.....this place is getting like Slashdot.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...t&p=1895397

Read the last part in this message where it says:

"You know what strikes me most....... ?"

You might want to read #184 as well:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...t&p=1894973

LaoPo

[dave_boo]

Wow, another America basher.....this place is getting like Slashdot.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...t&p=1895397

Read the last part in this message where it says:

"You know what strikes me most....... ?"

You might want to read #184 as well:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...t&p=1894973

LaoPo

To quote bad numbers is not bashing. To speculate on those numbers to the point of absurdity is. Some can't tell the difference.

[Martin]

"Numbers aren't the end all"

So true.

In fact, they only reflect what has happened up till now, and futures will play out in very different circumstances.

It does appear that (to mix metaphors) we are at a 'tipping point' in the 'march of mankind'.

The detail of what may be the fallout from the various tippings is not clearly visible.

The best insurance would seem to be to ensure food and shelter for ourselves and treat any income as a bonus.

Having the house paid for, the rice fields in good shape, and our savings in the form of bags of fertilizer and little gold bars is something that I find comforting.

Somehow those things seem better to be in than any fiat currency.

[siamamerican]

"Numbers aren't the end all"

So true.

In fact, they only reflect what has happened up till now, and futures will play out in very different circumstances.

It does appear that (to mix metaphors) we are at a 'tipping point' in the 'march of mankind'.

The detail of what may be the fallout from the various tippings is not clearly visible.

The best insurance would seem to be to ensure food and shelter for ourselves and treat any income as a bonus.

Having the house paid for, the rice fields in good shape, and our savings in the form of bags of fertilizer and little gold bars is something that I find comforting.

Somehow those things seem better to be in than any fiat currency.

Numbers nor monay is the end all. You seem to be content to live a simple, but comfortable life. More power to you.

As for me, I would rather invest in the the companies that make the fretilizer and farm machinery. Much more stressful, but more lucrative in most cases. The belief that the world is in good shape makes it a little easier.