UK General Visitor Visa question - When to book flight tickets?

[ianwuk]

Hello All.

I am currently in the process of collecting all documentation for a UK general visitor visa but I am worried about purchasing flight tickets now (so I can include the itinerary as supporting evidence) before the visa has even been granted in case it is not granted and I waste all that money on flights.

I am sure I read somehere (maybe the UK GOV website?) that they say it is not advisable to book flight tickets until the visa has been issued but I cannot find anything official confirming this - can anyone point me to something official please for an answer to this?

Many thanks.

ianwuk

[7by7]

From the Guide to supporting documents

Accommodation and travel details
You may wish to submit the following documents to help show us your accommodation and travel arrangements in the UK and on which date you intend to leave the UK. We advise that you do not make any payments for accommodation, travel and so on until you have received your visa.
(My emphasis)

[brewsterbudgen]

Just print out and include the itinerary or planned flight times, airline etc, but don't book it until you get the visa.

There's a new thread running saying that it might take up to 30 days to get the visa unless you pay for the "Premium Service".

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/754912-thailand-apply-for-your-uk-visa-early/

Edited August 26, 2014 by brewsterbudgen

[7by7]

Note that the priority service is not available to all.

For general or family visitors it is only available if the applicant has travelled in the previous 5 years to the UK, the USA, Canada, Australia, New Zealand or to a country in the Schengen Area, (and their accompanying spouse/children under 18).

Note, too, that it costs an extra £100 per applicant!

[ianwuk]

Thanks everyone.

Let me explain my situation some more. I am basically getting married next month and I want to take my wife to the UK for Christmas.

I will be marrying my girlfriend next month by civil registration at the local amphur. I was under the impression, after we were married, because the marriage is legally recognised in the UK and Thailand my wife could enter the UK for Christmas on a general visitor visa. However a friend has done some research and said that once she becomes my wife a different visa is needed (not sure why?). They also said that I need to register my marriage with the UK embassy as well, is this true?

A little confused by it all right now.

Thanks.

ianwuk

[theoldgit]

The procedure at the Amphur is a legal marriage.

You cannot register your marriage at the embassy any longer, there was never a requirement to do so.

She can apply for a family or general visitor visa.

Same conditions and same burden of proof.

Family visas used to attract the right of appeal but that was withdrawn sone time ago.

There is no advantage to one over the other.

[ianwuk]

So, if for example, as per my original plan, my wife gets a general visitor visa and, during her time in the UK, will be staying at two different places she would need a letter of invitation from both places, is that correct? She will only be staying at the first place for a few days before spending the remainder of the time at my parents place with me. I gather that they need a letter of invitation from both places otherwise they may start asking questions?

Tomorrow we will both go to the embassy (only to be turned away and told to go to VFS in Sukhumvit most likely) but we have to try because there is so much conflicting information on the internet about this to be honest and I just want some real answers. It seems a lot of it may be outdated also.

My original plan was this:

Get married next month at local amphur
Apply for general visitor visa for my wife (reason to leave being we both have employment in Thailand and have to return)

Get visa approved

Book flights

Go to the UK

What may be a spanner in the works though is that in December, at a church where my parents live, we will just be having a blessing ceremony to commemorate the wedding because I know the wedding is recognised in the UK and it is illegal to remarry. How would this affect things in terms of applying for a visa, visa type and such?

Thanks so much for all the replies.

ianwuk

[brewsterbudgen]

So, if for example, as per my original plan, my wife gets a general visitor visa and, during her time in the UK, will be staying at two different places she would need a letter of invitation from both places, is that correct? She will only be staying at the first place for a few days before spending the remainder of the time at my parents place with me. I gather that they need a letter of invitation from both places otherwise they may start asking questions?

Tomorrow we will both go to the embassy (only to be turned away and told to go to VFS in Sukhumvit most likely) but we have to try because there is so much conflicting information on the internet about this to be honest and I just want some real answers. It seems a lot of it may be outdated also.

My original plan was this:

Get married next month at local amphur

Apply for general visitor visa for my wife (reason to leave being we both have employment in Thailand and have to return)

Get visa approved

Book flights

Go to the UK

What may be a spanner in the works though is that in December, at a church where my parents live, we will just be having a blessing ceremony to commemorate the wedding because I know the wedding is recognised in the UK and it is illegal to remarry. How would this affect things in terms of applying for a visa, visa type and such?

Thanks so much for all the replies.

ianwuk

Going to the Embassy is likely to be pointless. I doubt they'll even let you in (do you have an appointment?).

Your plan is fine. You're just taking your legal wife on holiday. If you choose to have your marriage blessed in the UK it won't make any difference.

Just include a letter from your parents and say you're staying there. You really don't need to mention the "first place" - if it's a hotel just say so.

The reason to return and finance is all they're really interested in.

[Upnotover]

So, if for example, as per my original plan, my wife gets a general visitor visa and, during her time in the UK, will be staying at two different places she would need a letter of invitation from both places, is that correct? She will only be staying at the first place for a few days before spending the remainder of the time at my parents place with me. I gather that they need a letter of invitation from both places otherwise they may start asking questions?

Tomorrow we will both go to the embassy (only to be turned away and told to go to VFS in Sukhumvit most likely) but we have to try because there is so much conflicting information on the internet about this to be honest and I just want some real answers. It seems a lot of it may be outdated also.

My original plan was this:

Get married next month at local amphur

Apply for general visitor visa for my wife (reason to leave being we both have employment in Thailand and have to return)

Get visa approved

Book flights

Go to the UK

What may be a spanner in the works though is that in December, at a church where my parents live, we will just be having a blessing ceremony to commemorate the wedding because I know the wedding is recognised in the UK and it is illegal to remarry. How would this affect things in terms of applying for a visa, visa type and such?

Thanks so much for all the replies.

ianwuk

Going to the Embassy is likely to be pointless. I doubt they'll even let you in (do you have an appointment?).

Your plan is fine. You're just taking your legal wife on holiday. If you choose to have your marriage blessed in the UK it won't make any difference.

Just include a letter from your parents and say you're staying there. You really don't need to mention the "first place" - if it's a hotel just say so.

The reason to return and finance is all they're really interested in.

But if you do go to the embassy you could get your Affirmation of Freedom To Marry (unless you already did that). At least would make the trip of some value as i am also sure you wont get better visa advice there than you do on here.

[ianwuk]

I already have the affirmation of freedom to marry notarised from the embassy. I then got it translated in to Thai and legalised by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and it is these documents that I will take to the Amphur next month, along with my passport, to get married. When I am married am I correct that my wife's visa status in the UK will not be affected meaning that she can still apply for a general visitor visa or to visit family (both short stay tourist kind of visas)?

I was told that, because she is my spouse I would need a different visa to bring her in the UK because she is now officially my wife. Also I was told that the marriage had to be registered at the embassy but I have read that this is no longer offered. I know this has already been answered but there is just so much conflicting information I am just trying to make sense of it all.

I don't actually have an appointment at the embassy. I was kind of hoping to just turn up with my fiancee (I understand she may not be allowed in) and talk to a real person and get some real information. The issue I have is that as soon as we land in the UK my fiancee will stay with her family under the date of the blessing and I will stay with mine until the date of the blessing ceremony.

After the ceremony my wife will then spend the rest of our time in the UK with my family. So my questionns are this:

1 - Because she will be staying with her family for a period of time and then mine she needs a letter of invitation from both places, this is my understanding - am I correct? Could I just say she is staying with my family for the entire trip which is pretty much true?

2 - The reason to return is employment for me and my wife. I have already obtained six months financial data from my Kasikorn accounts but how long back does the six months have to be (i.e. when they review the financials obviously my accounts will have had money deducted and deposited in it and so the six months data will be out of date?).

3 - My supporting documentation to include is thus:

Me:

• Letter of employment for me stating position salary and date to return
• Thai bank statements for the accounts I will be using to finance my wife’s visit to the UK - see question above
• Thai work permit for proof I am legally working in Thailand - is this really needed?
• Letter of invitation from my parents - this is where we will both spend most of our time
• Letter of invitation from my wife’s cousin - this is the first place my wife will be until the ceremony
• Copy of my British passport
• Copy of my Thai marriage certificate as proof of my marriage
• Proof that the blessing ceremony will be taking place in the UK

My wife:

• Letter of employment for her stating position, salary and date to return
• Letter of invitation from my parents - this is where we will both spend most of our time
• Letter of invitation from my cousin - this is the first place my wife will be until the ceremony
• Copy of Thai passport
• Copy of Thai marriage certificate as proof of my marriage

Thanks so much for all the replies!

ianwuk

[brewsterbudgen]

Others will comment, but I wouldn't bother going to the Embassy.

Marriage doesn't affect the application if you're applying for a general visitor visa.

Your application looks fine to me. The letter from your parents will be enough, but you can include the cousin's letter too. 6 months financials is fine.

[ianwuk]

Thanks very much Brewster. Seems I am on the right track after all but I will go to the embassy tomorrow just to confirm what I suspect - that we will get no help at all.

Thanks.

ianwuk

[brewsterbudgen]

Your list doesn't mention your Sponsor's letter, although I know you know about it! Don't forget it, as it's a key document.

[ianwuk]

Your list doesn't mention your Sponsor's letter, although I know you know about it! Don't forget it, as it's a key document.

Hello Brewster.

All the supporting documentation listed is referenced in my sponsorship letter and the sponsorship letter for my wife which we will obviously include.

Thanks.

ianwuk

[The Fat Controller]

Documents solely in Thai like you marriage certificate and registration need to be translated, take your wife along to make sure that they spell your name the same every time, we had a small issue with that and as they "cut and paste" from a template check everything carefully.

My wife applied for the Family Visitor Visa as that seems the most appropriate for those who are officially married, although you could apply for the General category.

She took the original documents, translations and colour copies of them all to VFS Trendy, and they returned all the originals that day.

It took 15 workings days to get the visa this April.

The full information is here

https://www.gov.uk/family-visit-visa/documents-you-must-provide

[theoldgit]

You seem to have things covered, the reasons to return are the most important, your partners employment, your employment in Thailand should cover this.

Just to clarify, there's actually no point in pitching up at the British Embassy, if you did manage to get yourselves inside by saying you're going to the Consular Department, you wouldn't get to see anyone from the UKVI, they're in a separate office and don't see the likes of you and I.

It also really doesn't matter whether your wife applies for a General or Family visa.

[ianwuk]

You seem to have things covered, the reasons to return are the most important, your partners employment, your employment in Thailand should cover this.

Just to clarify, there's actually no point in pitching up at the British Embassy, if you did manage to get yourselves inside by saying you're going to the Consular Department, you wouldn't get to see anyone from the UKVI, they're in a separate office and don't see the likes of you and I.

It also really doesn't matter whether your wife applies for a General or Family visa.

Thanks for replying TOG!

We did go to the embassy and they confirmed that, as said on here, the embassy service to to register a marriage in the UK is no longer offered. Furthermore we then went to VFS who, as also said on here, confirmed that a General Visitor Visa will be fine and so it turns out that I was right in my pursuits but at least I was officially agreed with.

Thanks again. I just need to get the remaining documents sorted out. However I have one more question. My fiancee was blacklisted when she visited the USA for overstaying (since then she has been living in Thailand for the past six years) and the priority visa service at VFS states that only those who have been to the US and UK before can apply (my fiancee has been to the US and the UK) but I am just concerned that the blacklisting from the US may be a red flag? (there is nothing in her passport from the US saying she is blacklisted).

Thanks.

ianwuk

[brewsterbudgen]

You seem to have things covered, the reasons to return are the most important, your partners employment, your employment in Thailand should cover this.

Just to clarify, there's actually no point in pitching up at the British Embassy, if you did manage to get yourselves inside by saying you're going to the Consular Department, you wouldn't get to see anyone from the UKVI, they're in a separate office and don't see the likes of you and I.

It also really doesn't matter whether your wife applies for a General or Family visa.

Thanks for replying TOG!

We did go to the embassy and they confirmed that, as said on here, the embassy service to to register a marriage in the UK is no longer offered. Furthermore we then went to VFS who, as also said on here, confirmed that a General Visitor Visa will be fine and so it turns out that I was right in my pursuits but at least I was officially agreed with.

Thanks again. I just need to get the remaining documents sorted out. However I have one more question. My fiancee was blacklisted when she visited the USA for overstaying (since then she has been living in Thailand for the past six years) and the priority visa service at VFS states that only those who have been to the US and UK before can apply (my fiancee has been to the US and the UK) but I am just concerned that the blacklisting from the US may be a red flag? (there is nothing in her passport from the US saying she is blacklisted).

Thanks.

ianwuk

I'll leave this to the experts, but I would think being blacklisted for overstaying in the US will affect the decision. Honesty is usually the best policy in visa applications but I'm not sure about that in this case!

[theoldgit]

Your wife should advise the UKVI of the circumstances surrounding the "blacklisting" in her application, if she doesn't and the UKVI check and find out, your wife could possibly face a ban from the UK of up to 10 years.

[brewsterbudgen]

Your wife should advise the UKVI of the circumstances surrounding the "blacklisting" in her application, if she doesn't and the UKVI check and find out, your wife could possibly face a ban from the UK of up to 10 years.

Is there a question in the UK application that specifically asks about visas/travel to other countries? In other words, is it possible to not mention the visit or the overstay or blacklisting, without lying? Is there a statute of limitations?

[Upnotover]

Your wife should advise the UKVI of the circumstances surrounding the "blacklisting" in her application, if she doesn't and the UKVI check and find out, your wife could possibly face a ban from the UK of up to 10 years.

Is there a question in the UK application that specifically asks about visas/travel to other countries? In other words, is it possible to not mention the visit or the overstay or blacklisting, without lying? Is there a statute of limitations?

You are required to list all travel to any country within the last 10 years. And further have to answer question 32;

32 HAVE YOU BEEN DEPORTED, REMOVED OR OTHERWISE

REQUIRED TO LEAVE ANY COUNTRY INCLUDING THE UK

IN THE LAST 10 YEARS?

Which whilst being blacklisted on departure is not specifically a YES to this question it is pretty close.

[brewsterbudgen]

Your wife should advise the UKVI of the circumstances surrounding the "blacklisting" in her application, if she doesn't and the UKVI check and find out, your wife could possibly face a ban from the UK of up to 10 years.

Is there a question in the UK application that specifically asks about visas/travel to other countries? In other words, is it possible to not mention the visit or the overstay or blacklisting, without lying? Is there a statute of limitations?

You are required to list all travel to any country within the last 10 years. And further have to answer question 32;

32 HAVE YOU BEEN DEPORTED, REMOVED OR OTHERWISE

REQUIRED TO LEAVE ANY COUNTRY INCLUDING THE UK

IN THE LAST 10 YEARS?

Which whilst being blacklisted on departure is not specifically a YES to this question it is pretty close.

So there isn't a question about overstaying in another country?

[Upnotover]

Your wife should advise the UKVI of the circumstances surrounding the "blacklisting" in her application, if she doesn't and the UKVI check and find out, your wife could possibly face a ban from the UK of up to 10 years.

Is there a question in the UK application that specifically asks about visas/travel to other countries? In other words, is it possible to not mention the visit or the overstay or blacklisting, without lying? Is there a statute of limitations?

You are required to list all travel to any country within the last 10 years. And further have to answer question 32;

32 HAVE YOU BEEN DEPORTED, REMOVED OR OTHERWISE

REQUIRED TO LEAVE ANY COUNTRY INCLUDING THE UK

IN THE LAST 10 YEARS?

Which whilst being blacklisted on departure is not specifically a YES to this question it is pretty close.

So there isn't a question about overstaying in another country?

Not specifically;

30 HAVE YOU BEEN REFUSED ENTRY TO THE UK IN THE

LAST 10 YEARS

(FOR EXAMPLE AT A UK AIRPORT OR SEAPORT)?

31 HAVE YOU BEEN REFUSED A VISA FOR ANY COUNTRY

INCLUDING THE UK IN THE LAST 10 YEARS?

32 HAVE YOU BEEN DEPORTED, REMOVED OR OTHERWISE

REQUIRED TO LEAVE ANY COUNTRY INCLUDING THE UK

IN THE LAST 10 YEARS?

33 HAVE YOU EVER VOLUNTARILY ELECTED TO DEPART

THE UK?

34 ARE YOU, OR HAVE YOU BEEN SUBJECT TO, AN

EXCLUSION ORDER FROM THE UK?

35 HAVE YOU EVER TRAVELLED OUTSIDE YOUR COUNTRY

OF RESIDENCE, EXCLUDING THE UK, IN THE LAST 10

YEARS?

[theoldgit]

I suppose it really depends on the circumstances surrounding the "blacklisting".

Certainly you are supposed to indicate if you have been refused admission to the UK, or any other country, or been removed as an Immigration offender.

If you are about to be removed from the UK you can leave voluntary to save being deported, but you still have to confirm the fact in future applications.

[ianwuk]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. It is much appreciated. I will let you know the outcome as I am still collecting the supporting documentation.

ianwuk

[7by7]

Whilst there is no specific question asking if the applicant has been blacklisted by any country, the declaration signed by the applicant contains

.....The information I have given is complete and true to the best of my knowledge......

....I am also aware that my application will be automatically refused and I may be banned from going to the
UK for 10 years if I use a false document, lie or withhold relevant information.....

(My emphasis)

I would suggest that being blacklisted by the USA is relevant information and, if one of the specific questions does not cover the circumstances, it, and the reasons for it, should be declared in the additional information box.

The reason for this being that I don't know the answers to the following two questions:

1. Is her blacklkisting entered onto some international database?
2. If it is, would the ECOs automatically, or even randomly, check this data base for UK visa applicants?

My gut feeling is that if she does declare it, then, depending on the circumstances and how long ago, it may be considered a reason for refusal but equally might not.

But if she doesn't declare it and the ECO discovers it, then she will definitely be refused and could face a ban from visiting the UK for 10 years. Furthermore, if the deception is considered serious enough she could face a ban from entering the UK in any capacity, including settlement as your wife, for life!

Your, and her, choice if you want to take the risk.

[brewsterbudgen]

Does the letter from the person who will be providing your accommodation in the UK need to be an original signed letter, or can it be an email or scanned copy of the letter?

[theoldgit]

Does the letter from the person who will be providing your accommodation in the UK need to be an original signed letter, or can it be an email or scanned copy of the letter?

I've only ever provided an unsigned word document that was sent as an emailed attachment, it does always include an invitation for the ECO to call to confirm, they never have and my partner has never been unsuccessful in her applications.

Accommodation is probably the least important part of the application for a visit visa, in my opinion.

[brewsterbudgen]

Does the letter from the person who will be providing your accommodation in the UK need to be an original signed letter, or can it be an email or scanned copy of the letter?

I've only ever provided an unsigned word document that was sent as an emailed attachment, it does always include an invitation for the ECO to call to confirm, they never have and my partner has never been unsuccessful in her applications.

Accommodation is probably the least important part of the application for a visit visa, in my opinion.

Thanks. One more question.

On the 'How to Apply' page on the UKVisa website, it says:

"Bring your appointment letter and application pack, your passport and a second valid form of identification."

I guess this would normally be a utility bill. My girlfriend has a Laos passport but as she lives in a shared room in Pattaya, which is rented on a all-in cash basis from the Thai landlord, she doesn't have any utility bills or other documents to prove her identity. Is there anything else she can use (she does have a K-Bank account)? Is a second valid form of ID essential?

To confuse matters on the FAQ page, it doesn't mention the 2nd form of ID. It just says:

What documents do I submit for a visa application?

Your appointment confirmation

A valid passport or travel document

1 recent passport-sized (45mm x 35mm) color photograph of your face, which meets the requirements in UK visas and immigration’s photograph guidance.

A printout of your online application form, signed and dated

If you are applying for a settlement visa or tier visa, a completed self-assessment form, signed and dated.

Any supporting documents relevant to your application.

It's a little confusing and I need to be prepared...

[brewsterbudgen]

In addition to the above query, as a sponsor for my GF's Visitor visa, do I need to prove I own my condo in Bangkok or is my word good enough, and if I do need to provide proof, do I need to get the title deed translated into English?