Does Britain have a jihadi problem?

[NeverSure]

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*Deleted post edited out*

He will sooner or later make a U-turn back and heading to pseudologia fantastica...

I would love to join a debate on this subject, but I don't want personal shots taken at me just because I have an opinion. I'm not going to risk saying what I think of the quality of this conversation other than to repeat I don't want to be part of it.

Edited October 2, 2014 by Scott
Direct post edited out

[wellred]

There is without a doubt a jihadi problem here in the UK. But I think the bigger problem is that all these people who are being brainwashed have not been challenged. Challenged by their families, by their communities, by the education system and by the government.

This government and past governments have sat by and let this situation manifest and I fear it is now irreversible. If someone were to speak out against faith schools with a view to closing them down to get them to integrate they would probably be called a racist and attacking Islam ect. Well all I ca say is at some point every day folks will say they have had enough and it's not the jihadis who will be the target. It will be everyone else who should have stopped them but didn't.

[Albertosez]

And so we continue.

From a UK prospective - I see plenty of evidence of " Radical Islamists " preaching their hatred - but I see very little of the Muslims who genuinely want integration - denouncing them.

The pro radical message is deafening, the pro integration message is little more than a strategic whisper as and when it is necessary to satisfy the more senior apologists. When one message is far louder than the other I can only see more Muslim becoming radicalised and that is not good news for the UK and its' non- Muslim Residents.

[Mosha]

There is without a doubt a jihadi problem here in the UK. But I think the bigger problem is that all these people who are being brainwashed have not been challenged. Challenged by their families, by their communities, by the education system and by the government.

This government and past governments have sat by and let this situation manifest and I fear it is now irreversible. If someone were to speak out against faith schools with a view to closing them down to get them to integrate they would probably be called a racist and attacking Islam ect. Well all I ca say is at some point every day folks will say they have had enough and it's not the jihadis who will be the target. It will be everyone else who should have stopped them but didn't.

People in official positions who do complain. Are sent on Multi-cultural awareness courses.

[transam]

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[jacky54]

Fallon says they 'could' be brought before the court, I thought they 'could' be taking away passports, or 'not' letting them back in. The usual limp wristed response, they will not be going before any courts and will all be signing on in short order and getting free helath check ups, madness. Here the latest one, notice how her female relatives look so well integrated, so well they are teriified of showing their faces. I expect she 'could' be brought before the court as well, pathetic.

Hunt for British jihadi girl age 15: Family's anguish as teenager runs away 'to join fighters in Syria'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2774562/Police-fear-radicalised-British-schoolgirl-15-flew-Turkey-going-missing-family-home-planning-fight-jihadis-Syria.html

Edited October 1, 2014 by jacky54

[wellred]

Can't they just stop all Muslims entering the UK, do a polygraph and ballistics test and if found guilty arrest them.

[jacky54]

Against their 'human rights' mate, can't have that now can we!

[7by7]

Pathetic answer; as pathetic as the earlier accusations that I am constantly reporting posts!

The one example you managed to come up with, an example which proved nothing, wasn't deleted!

Two whoppers. I have no idea how many posts that you report. How would I?

Numerous links to your posts have been deleted. That is a fact.

If you don't know how many posts I have reported, how can you possibly call me a liar when I say that I have not reported any!

If you want to know who, if anyone, has reported a post which has been deleted, I suggest you ask the mod who deleted it.

All I can say is that it was not me.

But like everything which proves your prejudices to be based on ignorance; you'll just say that is a lie.

[7by7]

A Muslim commits a horrendous crime and, in your minds it's because they are a Muslim.

If they are standing in the street just having beheaded an innocent man, still holding the bloody knife and screaming that the Koran made them do it, then YES!

But Slavador did not do that after he had killed Mrs Silva.

Yet that didn't stop you and your mates claiming he's a jihadist!

Except that no posts apologising for radical Islam have ever appeared in this, or any other, topic.

Or if they have then they have, rightly in my opinion, been quickly removed by the mods before I have seen them.

Didn't you just post one being critical of people assuming that Muslim committing a terrible crime, i.e beheading did it because he was a Muslim. That sounds like denial to me on your part, is that not an excuse?

I posted here that in the Nolan case the murder had no link to terrorism.

I later changed that when evidence of his other activities came to light; here.

Funny that you are so sure I have posted things which I have not, yet can't remember what I have actually posted!

[Ulysses G.]

Pathetic answer; as pathetic as the earlier accusations that I am constantly reporting posts!

The one example you managed to come up with, an example which proved nothing, wasn't deleted!

Two whoppers. I have no idea how many posts that you report. How would I?

Numerous links to your posts have been deleted. That is a fact.

If you don't know how many posts I have reported, how can you possibly call me a liar when I say that I have not reported any!

If you want to know who, if anyone, has reported a post which has been deleted, I suggest you ask the mod who deleted it.

All I can say is that it was not me.

But like everything which proves your prejudices to be based on ignorance; you'll just say that is a lie.

It is a lie that I accused you of reporting posts as you claim above. I never said such a thing. There is no way for me to know that.

Edited October 1, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[7by7]

Can't they just stop all Muslims entering the UK, do a polygraph and ballistics test and if found guilty arrest them.

So you would arrest someone simply for being a Muslim?

What next?

Send them all to concentration camps while coming up with a final solution to the Muslim problem?

[7by7]

Pathetic answer; as pathetic as the earlier accusations that I am constantly reporting posts!

The one example you managed to come up with, an example which proved nothing, wasn't deleted!

Two whoppers. I have no idea how many posts that you report. How would I?

Numerous links to your posts have been deleted. That is a fact.

If you don't know how many posts I have reported, how can you possibly call me a liar when I say that I have not reported any!

If you want to know who, if anyone, has reported a post which has been deleted, I suggest you ask the mod who deleted it.

All I can say is that it was not me.

But like everything which proves your prejudices to be based on ignorance; you'll just say that is a lie.

It is a lie that I accused you of reporting posts as you claim above. I never said such a thing.

So what does "Two whoppers. I have no idea how many posts that you report. How would I?" mean?

[Ulysses G.]

It means that you were dishonest two times.

1) I never said that you were reporting posts at all - never mind "constantly". How would I know that?

2) Several links to your posts making justifications for terrorist groups - all of them - were deleted as off topic.

Edited October 1, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[7by7]

So you are calling me a liar.

BTW, I never said that you had said I was constantly reporting posts; but one of your mates has said it.

What I said was that your reply to a question was as pathetic as such accusations.

As I have said, if posts containing links to any posts of mine have been deleted, it was not as a result of any action on my part.

But those posts could not have contained any justification by me of terrorist activities or groups; because I have never made any post justifying terrorist activities or groups; and never would.

If you are correct that you or anyone else has posted links to such posts but they have been deleted, then PM the links to me and we can continue the discussion of this point.

Edit: "or groups" added following the previous posters edit of his post while I was typing.

Edited October 1, 2014 by 7by7

[Ulysses G.]

Both of your accusations were completely incorrect and both were directed at me. Do you think anyone buys your constant, dishonest spin? You continually deny the obvious on an open forum. Why would you be any more genuine in a PM?

Edited October 1, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[hawker9000]

Can't they just stop all Muslims entering the UK, do a polygraph and ballistics test and if found guilty arrest them.

So you would arrest someone simply for being a Muslim?

What next?

Send them all to concentration camps while coming up with a final solution to the Muslim problem?

That's not what he said. Typical "you". He said he'd run a polygraph and ballistics tests, and any arresting would be based on those findings. I actually do believe Muslims should get some extra scrutiny, but polygraphs & GSR tests probably aren't practical (unfortunately). Then again, I think some scientists are actually saying they're close to being able attach gizmos to one's head and read their thoughts. Hmmmm.

Sorry. I know it's "profiling", but the silent majority stands by silently while the extremists act in their name - there's a price to be paid. I've done absolutely nothing but I'm subjected to airport body checks & my emails get collected & read & use of my own money both at home & overseas is subject to various forms of monitoring, reporting & scrutiny, etc. etc. etc. If I can be scrutinized for having a pulse because of them, they can be scrutinized for having a religious/cult-based affiliation. Money flows from all mosques and muslim-run schools should get extra special scrutiny.

Gun control advocates would take away everybody's guns (as they actually DID in the UK) because of the violent actions of and abuse by a very few. Wondering why the practice of Islam should be considered any different...particularly since the violence & abuse is practiced by many more obviously than just a "very few". What was the last ISIS ground force estimate? 20K? 30K? More now? Add to that Hamas. Hezbollah. Etc. 'Sure sounds like more than a "few".

Edited October 2, 2014 by hawker9000

[H1w4yR1da]

Send them all to concentration camps while coming up with a final solution to the Muslim problem?

Well! It's a start that you agree there's a Muslim problem.

[wellred]

Guys lets all be realistic here. All the poroblem zones in this world are Muslim dominated countries or are down to Muslims. Iraq, Afghanistan, Israel, Nigeria, Somalia. Even Southern Thailand!!!!!

So don't tell me that it's profiling them. Why can't they just get along with everyone else instead of getting all nuts and blowing stuff up?

[JockPieandBeans]

Guys lets all be realistic here. All the poroblem zones in this world are Muslim dominated countries or are down to Muslims. Iraq, Afghanistan, Israel, Nigeria, Somalia. Even Southern Thailand!!!!!

So don't tell me that it's profiling them. Why can't they just get along with everyone else instead of getting all nuts and blowing stuff up?

I blame the schools

[7by7]

Both of your accusations were completely incorrect and both were directed at me. Do you think anyone buys your constant, dishonest spin? You continually deny the obvious on an open forum. Why would you be any more genuine in a PM?

In other words, such posts by me do not exist and you know it.

And yet again you call me a liar!

[7by7]

Can't they just stop all Muslims entering the UK, do a polygraph and ballistics test and if found guilty arrest them.

So you would arrest someone simply for being a Muslim?

What next?

Send them all to concentration camps while coming up with a final solution to the Muslim problem?

That's not what he said. Typical "you"..........

Do you know what a question mark (?) means? (there's another one)

It seems not!

Edited to fix quotes.

Edited October 2, 2014 by 7by7

[giddyup]

Guys lets all be realistic here. All the poroblem zones in this world are Muslim dominated countries or are down to Muslims. Iraq, Afghanistan, Israel, Nigeria, Somalia. Even Southern Thailand!!!!!

So don't tell me that it's profiling them. Why can't they just get along with everyone else instead of getting all nuts and blowing stuff up?

What do you expect when you have a bunch of testosterone-charged men with no sexual release other than each other? I'd be angry too!

[jacky54]

Both of your accusations were completely incorrect and both were directed at me. Do you think anyone buys your constant, dishonest spin? You continually deny the obvious on an open forum. Why would you be any more genuine in a PM?

In other words, such posts by me do not exist and you know it.

And yet again you call me a liar!

I thought I was reading an old post here, can't you get over what people think and post about what you write? Do drop the persecuted victim role, 'people accuse me of being an apologist', 'people accuse me of lying', really you are starting to sound like one of our Muslim friends with all this persecution stuff. threads about jihad in the UK, not you.

Edited October 2, 2014 by jacky54

[7by7]

Guys lets all be realistic here. All the poroblem zones in this world are Muslim dominated countries or are down to Muslims. Iraq, Afghanistan, Israel, Nigeria, Somalia. Even Southern Thailand!!!!!

So don't tell me that it's profiling them. Why can't they just get along with everyone else instead of getting all nuts and blowing stuff up?

Ukraine

North Korea

Democratic Republic of Congo

Three 'problem zones' off the top of my head which are neither Muslim dominated countries nor down to Muslims.

No one is denying, despite what some here wish to 'prove' but can't, that there are major problems in the Middle East and with Muslim extremists and jihadists in both Muslim and non Muslim countries.

But demonising all followers of Islam because some are fighting other Muslims or are terrorists, extremists or jihadists is nonsensical and, if carried to the sort of extremes advocated by some here will only add to the problem.

As this is supposed to be a UK related topic:

Not in our Name: British Muslims Condemn the Barbarity of ISIS

UK imams put fatwa on jihadists

For a world view over the longer term: Muslims Condemn Terrorist Attacks

In response to those who consistently ask why ordinary Muslims aren't out in the streets protesting against IS etc.: The myth of collective Muslim responsibility

Asking Muslims to apologise for al-Qaeda and IS is like asking a Brit to apologise for the English Defence League

There was no shortage of "here we go again" moments in US President Barack Obama's speech at the UN last week. One of them was his statement that "it is time for the world – especially Muslim communities – to explicitly, forcefully, and consistently reject the ideology" of al-Qaeda and the Islamic State.

Such demands are as old, misguided and exasperating as militant jihadism itself. Those who make them are either bewilderingly oblivious to the plethora of vocal Muslim rejection of jihadism and terrorism, or they conveniently ignore this to suit their own agendas

Muslims across the political and ideological spectrums have been condemning al-Qaeda and the Islamic State for as long as these groups have existed. Such expressions have only increased with the recent rise of the latter. Where have Obama and others been during all these years that Muslims have been making their voices heard loud and clear?

[boomerangutang]

Do you actually know any Muslims? Have you ever worked with them? Had them work for you? Worked for them? Been down the pub with them?

I know a few Muslims. No complaints. One is a friend I visit in Burma. Some are farmers around here, others run restaurants and food booths. As far as I can see, they're all fine, friendly and honest. If any of their kids grew up to be jihadists, I would have a problem with that and I'd expect their parents to try and deal with it as dynamically as possible. Come to think of it, I haven't seen some of their boys (late teens, early 20's) in awhile. I hope they're not taking trips to combat zones in the M.East. Even so, whenever they see me (and I look farang, with pointy nose and dirty blond hair), they're gentlemanly. I reckon even Jack The Ripper was gentlemanly during his daily interactions with people. People in general have such a capacity for switching their mental state. One moment appearing decent, a second later, raving and blood-thirsty. These big brains with hormones coursing through our bodies are major factors. That mixed with hate/vengence-filled environment that so many Middle Eastern Muslims are saddled with.

In Britain and Europe, one of the first things they should do is outlaw Madrassas (religious schools for Muslims). Along with that, they should not allow any Sharia Law. Anyone who complains, fine, just yank their passport and give them $120 and a one-way plane ticket to the Dune State of their choice.

[7by7]

Both of your accusations were completely incorrect and both were directed at me. Do you think anyone buys your constant, dishonest spin? You continually deny the obvious on an open forum. Why would you be any more genuine in a PM?

In other words, such posts by me do not exist and you know it.

And yet again you call me a liar!

I thought I was reading an old post here, can't you get over what people think and post about what you write? Do drop the persecuted victim role, 'people accuse me of being an apologist', 'people accuse me of lying', really you are starting to sound like one of our Muslim friends with all this persecution stuff. threads about jihad in the UK, not you.

Then why do you and your mates keep up the personal attacks against me at every opportunity?

I present arguments and evidence to support my point of view.

Do you counter those arguments? No.

Do you present evidence to disprove that of mine? No.

Instead you dismiss my evidence as lies and use my arguments as an excuse to call me an apologist for or even a supporter of terrorism, extremism, jihadism etc..

So, instead of your usual response, post a reasoned argument against my post above.

I'm signing off now until tomorrow, so you've plenty of time to prepare one.

[Ulysses G.]

In Britain and Europe, one of the first things they should do is outlaw Madrassas (religious schools for Muslims). Along with that, they should not allow any Sharia Law. Anyone who complains, fine, just yank their passport and give them $120 and a one-way plane ticket to the Dune State of their choice.

[MJP]

In Britain and Europe, one of the first things they should do is outlaw Madrassas (religious schools for Muslims). Along with that, they should not allow any Sharia Law. Anyone who complains, fine, just yank their passport and give them $120 and a one-way plane ticket to the Dune State of their choice.

If Boomerang hadn't put that in brackets I was about to believe curries hotter than a mixed balti should be banned.

[Ulysses G.]

I present arguments and evidence to support my point of view.

Pointing out that they are full of nonstop, deceitful spin is not a "personal attack."

Edited October 2, 2014 by Ulysses G.