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Thai court dismisses murder charges against former PM Abhisit


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What a loss for the red fans of the Shins here! They lost their 'but AV' and 'but ST' fabricated argument they misused and abused so often to divert attention from, or counterbalance comments about, criminal activities committed by their leaders, pals, and guards... What a sad day for them, what a happy one for most of us... And more coming whenn the Courts will start taking care of the violent red brigades!

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What a loss for the red fans of the Shins here! They lost their 'but AV' and 'but ST' fabricated argument they misused and abused so often to divert attention from, or counterbalance comments about, criminal activities committed by their leaders, pals, and guards... What a sad day for them, what a happy one for most of us... And more coming whenn the Courts will start taking care of the violent red brigades!

I would suggest that it is a loss for justice for all Thai civilians, but each to their own. I'm sure the military are happy once again.

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The Thai elite have been killing their own people for years and getting away with it, why on Earth did folks think it was going to be any different this time around?

There has to be some sort of accountability from politicians and military for the deaths, regardless of the circumstances at the time. In any civilised society this is a bare minimum. In ruling they have no jurisdiction they are preventing the truth from being known.

No doubt they will attempt to yet again foist this objectionable upper class twit who's father supported the odious dictator Suchinda upon the poor Thai populace. It runs in the Vejjajiva family.

Dark days ahead indeed as we have seen the rural Thais still haven't forgotten Democrat bitter medicine policies from the late 90's, and the cycle looks to continually repeat itself in the future, as they will never accept a government they haven't chosen, hence the attempts to cheat the system by the junta.

In 2010 Thaksin told his red shirts to fight the army and that he was very near to Thailand and would come back to help them if the army would open fire on them. Remember those famous words?

Red shirt leader Jatuporn, natthawut etc have also told their supporters numerous times to fight the army. Even told them to burn down the city.

You don't mention them in your propaganda piece. Why not?

You conveniently miss the point about accountability in your Thaksin-obsessed rant.

Doesn't matter what was said, people died, and there's been no accountability or transparency to date.

That lack of transparency is deliberate IMO to stop the facts from becoming public.

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The Thai elite have been killing their own people for years and getting away with it, why on Earth did folks think it was going to be any different this time around?

There has to be some sort of accountability from politicians and military for the deaths, regardless of the circumstances at the time. In any civilised society this is a bare minimum. In ruling they have no jurisdiction they are preventing the truth from being known.

No doubt they will attempt to yet again foist this objectionable upper class twit who's father supported the odious dictator Suchinda upon the poor Thai populace. It runs in the Vejjajiva family.

Dark days ahead indeed as we have seen the rural Thais still haven't forgotten Democrat bitter medicine policies from the late 90's, and the cycle looks to continually repeat itself in the future, as they will never accept a government they haven't chosen, hence the attempts to cheat the system by the junta.

I'd you don't like it you can always leave because it appears no one cares what you say

Careful, your bar-stool is wobbling a bit there.

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Well that result was a no brainer.

Now to dismiss the charges of murder against yingluck as well.

It is political driven persecution at it's worst on both sides of the equation.

<EDIT> Now that the amnesty bill is finished there was no need for the charge on Ahbisit anyway.

To think….Some would believe justice is served on a murder charge. Those "some" are the ones I pity.

Edited by djjamie
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"Abhisit's establishment-backed government in 2010 in street clashes between mostly unarmed "Red Shirt" demonstrators and security forces firing live rounds in Bangkok."

This AFP is getting tiresome.

They are right. Most red-shirts were unarmed. let's say 90% was unarmed out of 20,000 or so that were on the streets in 2010..... And it is normal for security forces to use their guns when threatened. That is one of the reasons the cop that stopped me this morning was carrying a gun. I guess.

Oh, don't be ridiculous - 2000 armed redshirts?! Even the army spokesman, Col. Sansern Kaewkamnerd, said that "500 “terrorists” had infiltrated the protest area and that the military were armed with M16s and prepared to defend themselves" ( http://csis.org/publication/thailand-steps-unknown ) to justify using force on the UDD demonstrators, and that was BS enough.

Edited by fab4
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Probably the correct decision given the circumstances at the time, however could the court not have mentioned it had no jurisdiction at a slightly earlier time in proceedings?

Abhisit and Suthep were charged as individuals, not as PM and deputy PM. The obvious reason for this is that finding a PM guilty of murder while doing his official duties could lead to unpleasant consequences for a former PM who ordered the Police to shoot-to-kill during the war on drugs.

Thaksin knew this and probably didn't expect any different verdict. The charges were brought against them just for show.

Not much is said these days about accountability etc over the 2,000 plus deaths during Mr. T's ' war on drugs ' which were conveniently reported as dealers killing other dealers to avoid being reported on.

Even the Human Rights Commissioner at the time justified it in the name of the ' war '.

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"Abhisit's establishment-backed government in 2010 in street clashes between mostly unarmed "Red Shirt" demonstrators and security forces firing live rounds in Bangkok."

This AFP is getting tiresome.

They are right. Most red-shirts were unarmed. let's say 90% was unarmed out of 20,000 or so that were on the streets in 2010..... And it is normal for security forces to use their guns when threatened. That is one of the reasons the cop that stopped me this morning was carrying a gun. I guess.

Oh, don't be ridiculous - 2000 armed redshirts?! Even the army spokesman, Col. Sansern Kaewkamnerd, said that "500 “terrorists” had infiltrated the protest area and that the military were armed with M16s and prepared to defend themselves" ( http://csis.org/publication/thailand-steps-unknown ) to justify using force on the UDD demonstrators, and that was BS enough.

at least 2000 were armed in different ways. Be it with knives, catapults, gasoline, sharp sticks, guns, bombs etc. Yeah 2000 might be on the low side.
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Criminal Court rejects murder lawsuit against Abhisit, Suthep
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- The Criminal Court on Thursday rejected the murder lawsuit against former prime minister Abhisit Vejjajiva and former deputy prime minister Suthep Thaugsuban.

The court reasoned that the lawsuit, which was initiated by the Department of Special Investigation, should have instead been initiated and investigated by the National Anti-Corruption Commission.

The DSI asked public prosecutors to file murder charges against Abhisit and Suthep, who is now a Buddhist monk, related to the fatal crackdowns on red-shirt protesters in 2010. The DSI charged that Abhisit and Suthep, who was the director of the Centre for Resolution of the Emergency Situation at the time, ordered troops to use live bullets against the protesters knowing well that they would be killed.

The lawsuit said the operations led to the killings of Phan Khamkong, a taxi driver, 14-year-old Kunakorn Srisuwan, and injury to Samorn Maithong, a van driver.

The Criminal Court said since the two gave the orders related to their administration and did not committed the acts personally, the case must be sent to the NACC for the conducting primary investigations. If the NACC finds grounds to suspect guilt of the two, the case must be sent to the Supreme Court for Holders of Political Office for trial, the Criminal Court said.

Abhisit and Suthep listened to the court's verdict but declined to give any comment to reporters.

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Criminal-Court-rejects-murder-lawsuit-against-Abhi-30241951.html

nationlogo.jpg
-- The Nation 2014-08-28

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"Abhisit's establishment-backed government in 2010 in street clashes between mostly unarmed "Red Shirt" demonstrators and security forces firing live rounds in Bangkok."

This AFP is getting tiresome.

They are right. Most red-shirts were unarmed. let's say 90% was unarmed out of 20,000 or so that were on the streets in 2010..... And it is normal for security forces to use their guns when threatened. That is one of the reasons the cop that stopped me this morning was carrying a gun. I guess.

So by your estimates, 10% of a mob is armed! Thats a frickin' lot!

So the army fired back when shoot at, is that not what they are trained to do?

This prosecution of Abhisat is the only way the corrupt left wing of Thai politics could get someone who has done nothing wrong.

It was a pathetic abuse of power by the Shinawatra clan and followers.

And Abhisat was not undemocratically elected PM, he was elected PM by a majority of MP's, because some switched parties because they were feed up of Thaksin and his followers ripping of Thailand.

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Court acquit Abhisit and Suthep of murder charges in red-shirt crackdown

Court-acquit-Abhisit-and-Suthep-of-murde

BANGKOK: -- The Criminal Court this morning dismissed the murder charges brought against former prime minister Abhisit Vejjajiva and his deputy, Suthep Thaugsuban, for ordering a military crackdown on red-shirt protesters during their protests from April to May 19, 2010.

The crackdown led to the killing of Mr Pan Kampong, a taxi driver from Yasothon, 14-year old Kunakorn Srisuwan and Mr Samorn Maithong, a passenger van driver.

The murder and attempted murder charges were brought against Mr Abhisit and Mr Suthep by the Department of Special Investigation led by Tarit Pengdit who was earlier dismissed by the National Council for Peace and Order. The case was proceeded to the Criminal Court by a special prosecution team with the approval of Mr Atthapol Yaisawang, then the attorney-general.

The court ruled that it had no jurisdiction to deliberate the case because the order to crack down on the protesters was made by Abhisit and Suthep in their capacity as prime minister and director of peace-keeping directorate respectively and not as private individuals even though some protesters were killed and injured and that snipers were deployed in the crackdown.

The court said that the offences regarded abuse of authority and the case should be tried by the Supreme Court’s criminal division for political office holders. Also, the court noted that the case was being investigated by the National Anti-Corruption Commission.

However, a sitting judge of the case, Mr Thongchai Senamontri, director-general of the Criminal Court, footnoted in the case file about his disagreement with the dismissal of the case by the majority judges. He maintained that the Criminal Court had the authority to deliberate the case because the case was based on evidences from autopsy examination of the dead victims.

Abhisit and Suthep did not make any comments after their acquittal. Their lawyer, Mr Bandhit Siriphan, however, said that he would use the court’s verdict as an evidence against Mr Tarit in a case brought against him by Mr Suthep and Mr Abhisit.

Many supporters of the two men, including members of Democrat party and People’s Democratic Reform committee showed up at the court to give them moral support.

(Photo : ThaiPBS file)

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/court-acquit-abhisit-suthep-murder-charges-red-shirt-crackdown/

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-- Thai PBS 2014-08-28

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"Abhisit's establishment-backed government in 2010 in street clashes between mostly unarmed "Red Shirt" demonstrators and security forces firing live rounds in Bangkok."

This AFP is getting tiresome.

They are right. Most red-shirts were unarmed. let's say 90% was unarmed out of 20,000 or so that were on the streets in 2010..... And it is normal for security forces to use their guns when threatened. That is one of the reasons the cop that stopped me this morning was carrying a gun. I guess.

So by your estimates, 10% of a mob is armed! Thats a frickin' lot!

So the army fired back when shoot at, is that not what they are trained to do?

This prosecution of Abhisat is the only way the corrupt left wing of Thai politics could get someone who has done nothing wrong.

It was a pathetic abuse of power by the Shinawatra clan and followers.

And Abhisat was not undemocratically elected PM, he was elected PM by a majority of MP's, because some switched parties because they were feed up of Thaksin and his followers ripping of Thailand.

And Abhisat was not undemocratically elected PM, he was elected PM by a majority of MP's

That is quite correct my friend.

Some would like to change the story to suit an agenda though.

As the 1 principle supporters like to state that the amnesty bill was voted for by the MP's at a vote of 307 - 0 meaning the majority wanted it. This same rule applies to the Right Honorable Ahbisit. If the amnesty was democratically driven then through logic (not PTP logic) Ahbisit was democratically elected as the PM.

Of course when dealing with "goldfish" that logic does not apply.

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The Thai elite have been killing their own people for years and getting away with it, why on Earth did folks think it was going to be any different this time around?

There has to be some sort of accountability from politicians and military for the deaths, regardless of the circumstances at the time. In any civilised society this is a bare minimum. In ruling they have no jurisdiction they are preventing the truth from being known.

No doubt they will attempt to yet again foist this objectionable upper class twit who's father supported the odious dictator Suchinda upon the poor Thai populace. It runs in the Vejjajiva family.

Dark days ahead indeed as we have seen the rural Thais still haven't forgotten Democrat bitter medicine policies from the late 90's, and the cycle looks to continually repeat itself in the future, as they will never accept a government they haven't chosen, hence the attempts to cheat the system by the junta.

In 2010 Thaksin told his red shirts to fight the army and that he was very near to Thailand and would come back to help them if the army would open fire on them. Remember those famous words?

Red shirt leader Jatuporn, natthawut etc have also told their supporters numerous times to fight the army. Even told them to burn down the city.

You don't mention them in your propaganda piece. Why not?

You conveniently miss the point about accountability in your Thaksin-obsessed rant.

Doesn't matter what was said, people died, and there's been no accountability or transparency to date.

That lack of transparency is deliberate IMO to stop the facts from becoming public.

I didn't miss any point. You are the one only mentioning the army and you don't seem to care what Thaksin and his red shirts did.

You said: There has to be some sort of accountability from politicians and military for the deaths, regardless of the circumstances at the time.

Why didn't you mentioned Thaksin, other protest leaders and the Red shirts? I will show you what I mean:

There has to be some sort of accountability from politicians, Thaksin/protest leaders, Red shirts, Police and military for the deaths, regardless of the circumstances at the time.

That's all.wai2.gif

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I'm confused. The headlines say they were acquitted.

"Adj. 1. acquitted - declared not guilty of a specific offense or crime acquitted - declared not guilty of a specific offense or crime; legally blameless; "he stands acquitted on all charges"
not guilty
clean-handed, guiltless, innocent - free from evil or guilt; "an innocent child"; "the principle that one is innocent until proved guilty"
I didn't get that. I understood that the court found it didn't have jurisdiction. There are statements that other courts would.
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I'm confused. The headlines say they were acquitted.

"Adj. 1. acquitted - declared not guilty of a specific offense or crime acquitted - declared not guilty of a specific offense or crime; legally blameless; "he stands acquitted on all charges"
not guilty
clean-handed, guiltless, innocent - free from evil or guilt; "an innocent child"; "the principle that one is innocent until proved guilty"
I didn't get that. I understood that the court found it didn't have jurisdiction. There are statements that other courts would.

I thought you had no comment... tongue.png

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Criminal Court dismisses murder charges against Abhisit and Suthep

BANGKOK, 28 August 2014 (NNT) – The Criminal Court has dismissed charges of murder and abuse of power against former prime minister Abhisit Vejjajiva and his ex-deputy in connection with the military crackdown on protesters in 2010.


Mr. Abhisit and his deputy Suthep Thuangsuban were present the hearing when the court handed down the verdict.

The court ruled that it did not have jurisdiction to hear the case because Mr. Abhisit and Mr. Suthep were holders of the public office at the time and were acting under an emergency decree. It added the only court with the authority to consider the allegations was the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Holders of Political Positions.

The hearing followed Criminal Court rulings on several cases where protesters were killed and wounded by gunshots fired by soldiers acting on the orders of the Centre of the Resolution of the Emergency Situation (CRES), which was set up by the then-Democrat-led government under Mr. Abhisit.

nntlogo.jpg
-- NNT 2014-08-28 footer_n.gif

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It said the only court with the authority to consider the allegations was the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Holders of Political Positions.

Presumably the only organisation with the power to bring a case against them to the designated "proper" court would be the NACC.

Nope.

DSI's Tarit could have brought the case... but instead chose the different (and ridiculous) to charge them as civilians/private citizens, thus resulting in the dismissal of the case.

This decision by the criminal court is the only logical and legal one to make as it was doomed from the beginning due to Tarit's nonsensical path.

Edited by nosstit
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So the army fired back when shoot at, is that not what they are trained to do?

This prosecution of Abhisat is the only way the corrupt left wing of Thai politics could get someone who has done nothing wrong.

It was a pathetic abuse of power by the Shinawatra clan and followers.

And Abhisat was not undemocratically elected PM, he was elected PM by a majority of MP's, because some switched parties because they were feed up of Thaksin and his followers ripping of Thailand.

So the army fired back when shoot at, is that not what they are trained to do?

Just one obvious case to point out : Wat Patum Wanaram. Were the army being fired at there? The criminal court ruled that they were not

The court inquest read out today stated that there was no evidence that the so-called Blackshirts were present inside or around the temple. The entire area has been secured by the military, the court insists, and it is impossible that so many journalists - some of them foreigners - failed to spot the mysterious gunmen.

The soldiers′ testimony that they were simply returning fire to the Blackshirts in the temple even contradicted accounts of other soldiers in the area who testified they that did not see any armed element, the court says.

Additionally, the judge pointed to the video clip that captured moments of soldiers on Skytrain track shooting at the temple. The soldiers did not try to take cover or react to the supposed attacks from the armed element at all, the judge said, so the gunfire was most likely one-directional.

http://www.khaosod.co.th/en/view_newsonline.php?newsid=TVRNM05UYzRORFF6TWc9PQ==&

From the reports here;

The crackdown led to the killing of Mr Pan Kampong, a taxi driver from Yasothon, 14-year old Kunakorn Srisuwan and Mr Samorn Maithong, a passenger van driver.

This doesn't seem to include those at Wat Patum Wanaram. I believe those were a separate court action but I don't know what's happened to them.

Even if you include those there's no chance of a proper trial anyway as Tarit, presumably under orders from the government decided not to involve the military in any court action. Since they, according to the courts fired the shots that would mean any court action would be biased before they started.

I do think this delay could have been avoided if the court had bothered to check if the case was under their jurisdiction before doing anything else. It's not as if the decision was that difficult from what I can see. Abhisit and Suthep's lawyers pointed it out and even I could see the problems.

As it is there seems little chance of any court case to bring the facts out but as someone else said this won't stop many redshirts believe the lies.

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What a loss for the red fans of the Shins here! They lost their 'but AV' and 'but ST' fabricated argument they misused and abused so often to divert attention from, or counterbalance comments about, criminal activities committed by their leaders, pals, and guards... What a sad day for them, what a happy one for most of us... And more coming whenn the Courts will start taking care of the violent red brigades!

The Thaksinista whinging is reaching fever pitch.... :cheesy:

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I'm confused. The headlines say they were acquitted.

"Adj. 1. acquitted - declared not guilty of a specific offense or crime acquitted - declared not guilty of a specific offense or crime; legally blameless; "he stands acquitted on all charges"
not guilty
clean-handed, guiltless, innocent - free from evil or guilt; "an innocent child"; "the principle that one is innocent until proved guil
I didn't get that. I understood that the court found it didn't have jurisdiction. There are statements that other courts would.

It does seem strange but perhaps it's down to the fact they accepted the case so a conclusion has to be reached and since they don't have the jurisdiction they have to acquit them. It might also be a problem with translation.

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The logical outcome of the Thaksin/Tharit farce prosecution.

Everyone not utterly amoral, including Abisit and Suthep,

are without a doubt sad at the deaths of anyone involved, of any shirt color.

But the prosecution was clearly a bargaining chip for Thaksin to pressure

his way back into the country scot free using his puppet government

and DSI lapdog to do it.

One more sad episode ended from this lurid tale of

power-mad, political-revenge driven misanthropy.

maybe now the junta could direct a court to dismiss the charges against Thaksin

all in the name of reconciliation and bringing happiness to the Thai people

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Accepting a case for trial on premeditated murder charges is a step beyond just "accusing" someone, rubl. It means that the court has decided at the preliminary hearing that there is a case to answer. Whether they answer that charge in a Criminal Court as civilians (which the court has now done a U Turn on) or at the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Holders of Political Positions is a moot point, as long as they answer the charges. The evidence doesn't go away (or shouldn't) but now it appears that the NACC has to prepare a case - whether they do of course is dependant upon the will to do so.

<snip>

The court didn't decide that there was a case to answer. They decide to hear arguments for and against as to whether there was a case to answer.

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A criminal court in the capital ruled that it did not have jurisdiction to hear the case because Abhisit and his then-deputy Suthep Thaugsuban were holders of public office at the time and acting under an emergency decree.

It said the only court with the authority to consider the allegations was the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Holders of Political Positions.

Leave it to the Pheu Thai Government to file the case at the wrong venue. Regardless of Abhisit/Suthep guilty or not, Pheu Thai again proves their total ineptitude in anything they try to accomplish and that with numerous lawyers and legal experts in their own camp. Priceless...

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Court dismisses case against ex-PM Abhisit, ex-Deputy PM Suthep
By Digital Content

14092154614782.jpg

BANGKOK, Aug 28 -- Thailand's Criminal Court on Thursday dismissed a murder lawsuit against former prime minister Abhisit Vejjajiva and his former deputy prime minister Suthep Thaugsuban.

The decision concerned the accusation of the Department of Special Investigation (DSI) that Mr Abhisit and Mr Suthep had ordered the murder of red shirt demonstrators in April and May 2010.

The defendants argued hat the DSI had no authority to investigate the case and that the National Anti-Corruption Commission already accepted to investigate it.

The Criminal Court ruled that roles of both both Mr Abhisit and Mr Suthep's in the crackdown order against the then anti-government demonstrators had been within their authority and responsibility and that the red shirt protest had turned more violent at that time.

It also ruled that doubts regarding their order concerned their official roles, not a question of murder, so such a case should instead go to the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Holders of Political Positions.

Therefore, the Criminal Court dismissed it. (MCOT online news)

tnalogo.jpg
-- TNA 2014-08-28

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