My Future In-laws...what Do I Do?

[Ijustwannateach]

Here's a semi-related question, which I think fits in the in-law zone in its way.

How honest should one be with a partner about one's financial status, and how soon?

Many of us are dating partners who are significantly worse-off financially. If they smell money, so to speak, I wonder if it might not influence their behavior- or even worse, the in-laws' behavior. I know foreigners here who date Thais who are perfectly decent, but whose families make trouble- always pressure on them to get money from the "farang," and so forth.

Would it not be better to keep things fuzzy enough that they would have excuses to tell their family: I can't tell you how much he makes because I don't know?

I hope this doesn't go sideways. I'm not saying that we shouldn't share with our boyfriends and their families, but that keeping our finances fuzzy might eliminate some of the moral hazard.

And kudos in advance to the inevitable group who will post things like "that's why you shouldn't date people out of your economic range," but you're obviously not the ones who would know the answer to my question.

I'm asking because I'm pretty sure that discussions about money inevitably follow meetings with in-laws, such as the one I had recently.

"Steven"

[PeaceBlondie]

Taking the kind of advice I got here and at other forums, I've never told my long term partner about my assets. He knew I had a pension, and only after 2.8 years did he know how many baht that translated to.

Today, I lent him my wallet to go buy 4,000 baht of medicine. He brought it back with the receipt; no problem.

His family's never asked for a baht, and they are at various sublevels within "working class." Today, he volunteered to use his life's savings to help me buy a used car. He doesn't need to help me out financially, but it's the thought that counted.

My in-law advice is to make it clear, up front when the relationship starts, that you don't have the funds to be a charity fund. But, if you're able to, make it clear that you're completely self-supporting and will help out your own partner financially, as needed.

[Boo]

I agree with PB, I made it clear to hubby early on that I didn't feel responsible for his family, I was & still am happy for him to use some of his salary to help out his mum on a regular basis but some months, when we have an increase in outgoings, that he can't send any. He & they are fine with that.

My husband obviously knows how much I earn & so does his mum but it was explained very carefully that the cost of living here in the UK means that although it sounds a lot & is in thai terms, it isn't in the UK & that there is very little left over.

That said, when we first met I wasn't working & was living off savings, so "my" money wasn't an issue as I had one amount & it was only ever going to go down so there wasn't anythign to spare out of my budget.

[Guest endure]

My bf will not allow me to help his family and has had stand up knock down fights with his brother over it. I have paid his mother's hospital bill when she had a bad bout of fever and I contributed towards his younger brother's funeral (motocy accident )

[dukkha]

IJWT, could fuzzy be translated as vague...we are at the point that in my advancing years it is likely that I will predecease Sam and I dont want to leave a mess for him to deal with..I have made a thai will which he will be the sole recipient of any monies here in thailand, as for my monies in Australia he is aware of amounts and that he will also be the beneficiary of same...this arrangement will be handled by close friends in Australia who have clear instructions as to how the disbursement is to occur..with my history of being totally careless with money Sam is best qualified to deal with this sort of thing...I could not have made a committment to him without being totally honest about our financial situation, it does not leave me in any way vulnerable but rather in peace as to what goes to whom and how much...I dont expect that all farang/thai relationships follow my example but have decided what is best, the codicile being that if we are not together all this will change...great to hear PB that you may be changing from your two wheels to a more safe mode of transport with four wheels, best of luck and trust your recovery is well on the way.... Dukkha

I agree with PB, I made it clear to hubby early on that I didn't feel responsible for his family, I was & still am happy for him to use some of his salary to help out his mum on a regular basis but some months, when we have an increase in outgoings, that he can't send any. He & they are fine with that.

My husband obviously knows how much I earn & so does his mum but it was explained very carefully that the cost of living here in the UK means that although it sounds a lot & is in thai terms, it isn't in the UK & that there is very little left over.

That said, when we first met I wasn't working & was living off savings, so "my" money wasn't an issue as I had one amount & it was only ever going to go down so there wasn't anythign to spare out of my budget.

[popshirt]

IJWT, could fuzzy be translated as vague...we are at the point that in my advancing years it is likely that I will predecease Sam and I dont want to leave a mess for him to deal with..I have made a thai will which he will be the sole recipient of any monies here in thailand, as for my monies in Australia he is aware of amounts and that he will also be the beneficiary of same...this arrangement will be handled by close friends in Australia who have clear instructions as to how the disbursement is to occur..with my history of being totally careless with money Sam is best qualified to deal with this sort of thing...I could not have made a committment to him without being totally honest about our financial situation, it does not leave me in any way vulnerable but rather in peace as to what goes to whom and how much...I dont expect that all farang/thai relationships follow my example but have decided what is best, the codicile being that if we are not together all this will change...great to hear PB that you may be changing from your two wheels to a more safe mode of transport with four wheels, best of luck and trust your recovery is well on the way.... Dukkha

I agree with PB, I made it clear to hubby early on that I didn't feel responsible for his family, I was & still am happy for him to use some of his salary to help out his mum on a regular basis but some months, when we have an increase in outgoings, that he can't send any. He & they are fine with that.

My husband obviously knows how much I earn & so does his mum but it was explained very carefully that the cost of living here in the UK means that although it sounds a lot & is in thai terms, it isn't in the UK & that there is very little left over.

That said, when we first met I wasn't working & was living off savings, so "my" money wasn't an issue as I had one amount & it was only ever going to go down so there wasn't anythign to spare out of my budget.

My husband and I have striven to build as equal a partnership as is possible given our difference in age and financial resources. In order to do this I have rather fully disclosed my financial situation. But as the old lady in the red cloth coat said, sometimes you have to "just say no". This is a good thing because it establishes boundaries and also makes plain what can be expected in the future. I remember when my husband lusted after a rather expensive new camera "which would benefit the entire family, especially his sister who raises orchids and requires fotos to advertise them" I said no. That was a while ago and I explained that the camera was neither an emergency item nor was it a necessity. On the other hand, when his Mom had to stay in the hospital for a few days, I offered to pay the bill and did. Behaviors are sometimes more useful than laying down rules. But we are all learning as we go along. I just never forget who I am and get "lost" in the relationship. For one thing, I refuse to "buy-a-Thai" and my husband admires me for this. It also gives him freedom to make his own decisions.

[Ijustwannateach]

Thanks for the great stories, anecdotes, and advice, guys.

So far my current partner has been great about money, and I don't expect any big surprises soon [but who does?]. However, I know the values in this society are different, and I know that since his job is less well-paid than mine, I am in a certain role with respect to him. I have no problem with helping him and his family in medical emergencies- I'll take out some family insurance on them if this goes on long enough. It's the other stuff (like the camera popshirt mentions above) where I don't want to fall down the slippery slope. I guess in all couples there's an ongoing evolution of the economic relationship to the family as well as the emotional one.

[ProThaiExpat]

Right on IJWT with your last two posts. "Poor family from Issan" is the category of Thai B/f that my Thai would fit in and this category is definitely a caveat to what I say on the subject.

It has taken me three years to reach a comfort level on money issues with my Thai, as I have difficulty saying no to requrests for money from those I love.

My Thai feels that all "donations", responses to requests for money, and money left over from money advanced for shopping, are gratefully received and squirreled away to where, I don't know.

Continuing money needs of Mom is certainly one of his needs for money.

Other than being a spendthrift and not worrying about tomorrow, my Thai may be typical Thai in his explanation of why Thais are not demonstrably grateful for gifts. It is in the Buddhist tradition to accept the gift with a wai and express no further emotion.

Note monks and their stoic receipt of "donations". My understanding of the Buddhist philosphy is that the gift giver gains merit for the gift and is the one truly benefited more than the recipient. "It is better to give than receive" is a western culture saying that resembles this attitude.

IJWT's suggestion about being "fuzzy" would not work with my Thai as he has a sharp nose for money and is relentless in smelling out sources of it. My capital is in the U.S. and it was made clear that it was destined for my daughter upon my death, in the meantime, only available for any illness where emergency money was needed.

For the first three years of our relationship, we were in a more or less "walking ATM" mode that drove me crazy and created a great deal of conflict between us. Mostly because I couldn't say no.

My solution was to share equally with my Thai, all money left over each month, from my pension. Thus, all bills are paid before the monthly "savings" is shared. Loans against the monthly savings are made, up to the amount of the anticipated savings and that is always a contentious issue as it seems many Thais spend all of their monthly income immediately on receipt. Thus I don't loan his weekly "allowance" or money he has demonstrated he needs for daily expenses.

The benefit to me of this arrangement is that I now can say "no" easily when his share of "savings" is gone. He will be borrowing an entire years "savings" to re-build the families old home, however I only approved that loan after reducing therefrom the amount he will need for his daily activities he payed for himself. I know what would happen if I didn't hold back his daily needs, I would be pestered to death for money for "sport", Thai restaurant food, etc.

He does work for money when we are overseas, but only on a casual basis and he has no difficulty quickly spending all of it, except when he sends money to Mom every month.

As I have posted before, I doubt any falang/thai gay couple will ever be free of money issues, as I am sure most couples of any persuasion are as well.

Money is a problem with most relationships, it seems, so I don't feel I am any different. Finding a method I could live with and enable me to say "no" was the road to a place where my Thai and I have put "money issues" largely behind us.

[PeaceBlondie]

I was in one of those unmentionable sexual relationships in the West, for twenty years with the same partner, who never worked outside the home, came from a fine home with hard-working parents, and....well, maybe I shouldn't say this, but my partner was....a....Western....spoiled....WOMAN! Yes, we were straight, but some of my best friends, still, are straight.

Nobody in our nearly uppity neighborhood in Texas thought it was immoral for her to stay home (and not work there, either) while I struggled to be a professional, or even have a second job such as dishwasher or waiter.

The male nurse yesterday asked if I had a Thai wife. I said I had a Thai husband. He didn't blink an eye.

[HB2010]

thanks for all your comments! all of you have been so helpful in how i should deal with my future in-laws. my b/f told his parents about the dinner boat cruise, here's what he wrote back to me:

"and I told them about our

boat dinner at the end of year. They are glad very much. They are glad and

hornoured that you 'd like us go. Thank you so much Jerry. Yesterday, I felt

to cry when I met them. I don't know why...hmmm....I told them I will pick up them at home

and take a taxi to go to the pier of that boat. I think it would be fun and

happy so much at that night. I hope you would be happy with us too. My

parents and I are just normal so we maybe not know about traditional on the

dinner table. And it's the first time for us will visit there. Would you

mind that? Jerry, they are grateful that you would like to meet them. but

they told me that they cannot communicate with you...hehehe...I told them

not to worry because I will be good translator and cutiest one for you and

them.....hehehe. Do you agree with me that I'm the cutiest translator"

i'm sure we'll have fun that evening. i'm also sure i'll be doing other things for them as time goes on, and hopefully in the right way. i think someone said here, "its better to give than receive". how true that is!

once again, thanks for your advice!

[niteowl]

I realize I'm a bit late weighing in, but here's an anecdote from personal experience.

About 3 months ago, my gf and I went to meet her family in Isaan for the first time, so she could introduce me. They're poor, by Thai standards, but fairly well-to-do, by Isaan standards. (They own a large plot of land, and even have five (5!) buffalo.)

While we were there, I noticed the kids didn't have any toys. Their parents didn't notice. After all, none of the kids in the villiage had toys. The parents themselves, didn't have toys when they were growing up. So, I went to the local bazaar, and bought some toys. Later, my gf and her sister, and I, bought a few more (I hadn't known how many boys, girls, etc.), plus some school supplies. Ordinary things they lacked: notebooks, crayons, colored pencils, nothing elaborate. All told, a little over 2,000 Baht.

To give without being asked to give - that's the secret.

Hope this helps.

[phayao]

Of course, I got the dreaded "up-to-you" response, which is never strictly speaking accurate, as there are definitely some gifts that would be gaffes or mistakes......

.......... you need to consider the economic level of the family and scale your gift accordingly. If I were dating someone whose family owned a mall, I'd feel a little strange showing up with a tin of peaches. On the richer side, perhaps chocolates or other imported foods or alcohol?

"Steven"

I have tried almost everything during my 16 years relationship with my TBF (now my spouse).

Flowers, silver, clothes, shoes, books are a NO.

On the other hand, money and food were always appreciated.

What I do now is take them by groups to a Big C, Tesco-Lotus, Carrefour, Auchamp or other superstore for lunch (they feel uncomfortable in a fancy restaurant) and after an abundant meal we go shopping. I let them choose whatever they would like to have that they could not afford to buy: they will surprise you !

It could be a helmet for your nephew, a fancy dress for your little nice, some VCDs for the family karaoke, new towels for the mother-in-law, a microwave for your sister-in-law, an MP3 for the young brother-in-law, a mobile phone for the nice going to college, a dental check-up for your father-in-law, a gas cooker for the old aunt, a new fan for the granny... I think that satisfies everyone and leaves you lighter to travel.