Ecuador V. Thailand

[ray23]

This was just for fun and taking stock of what I really do have. I have researched Ecuador. There are some postives to it that Thailand does not have, if I had researched it in the first place I may have settled there instead of here. But I'm here now and would have to sell everything to have that little adventure so it's not likely.

I apoligize in advance for how it presented but Im not real good with computer, now theres some news hUH Forget that I did manage to cut and paste didn't know yuo could do it on the forum

What made this interesting everyone has positive things to say about the country they settle in this guy after eight years listed out what he tought was worng. So I thought now this is the way to do a comparison, deal with the bad stuff first and then look at the postives. See which out weighs which.

I did my comparison, would love to see you guys thoughts I know I missed things.

Lengthy but that happens sometimes

Joel <[email protected]> escribi๓:

I must admit that after living in Ecuador for close to 8 years, I have found a few things that I do not like, but still consider Loja, Ecuador one of the best places to reside in this planet. In fact at the time I do not have a second choice in mind. I am sure that after reading them, you will agree with me that they are NO big deal.

Here is my list of what I do not like about Ecuador:

ท Yes they do urinate on the streets, side walks, etc. I have to admit that on some occasion I have had no other choice either. There are very few public restrooms available. I do wonder how women manage to hold on to it, since one rarely sees a woman urinating in public. Solution: More public restrooms. Keep in mind that it sure is a lot more ecological... BTW: Ecuadorians in general are very well groomed and clean, especially in the cities. Most schools require uniforms.

ท People are not as environmentally conscious as they seem. The fact is that cities spend quite a bit of funds constantly cleaning the junk people leave on the streets. This is why you do not see garbage allover. Solution: More education.

ท There are one too many careless forest fires. Solution: More education combined with fire prevention methods. Perhaps one of you retirees care to jump in and help... join a foundation like ours www.condorhuana.org and be part of the solution.

ท Most farmers' level of education is very low. For example there is one in our neighborhood that does not know how to use plural words, making it quite difficult to deal with him. A few days ago he kept on an on about "A" rock, when in fact there were many rocks.

Many farmers are FULL of fears. For example getting them to give up one meter of land for a new road or paying a $1-2 per month for water service can be quite a challenge... Poor uneducated people are often full of fears, which cause them to be rude and unfriendly. This same people often do not make good workers, it does take extra effort to explain them in detail what you want. After you become accustomed to explaining in much more details what you want, they often do comply.

ท Lack of job opportunities; though there are plenty of business opportunities.

ท All government institution lack more basic infrastructure, especially in the proper use of communication and computer technology.

ท I totally dislike that Ecuador allows the US Government to have military installation in its territory. I am very pleased that the free trade agreement did not take place; which shows that Ecuadorian are becoming smarter.

ท No “how-to” information from government. We have run into problems with several government offices, due to lack of knowing the local way of doing business. For example we started a company and a foundation, but NO one told us that we had to file 2 tax forms each month; we found out 4 years later... We were giving incorrect information about how to obtain a drivers license, this resulted in 5 years without one, when in fact it was a very simple and quick process.

ท There is a huge lack of street signs and lights. Do not like it? Go tell the mayor yourself, perhaps they will take notice.

ท Many roads are in poor conditions.

ท Drunken people often walk the streets, making it more difficult to drive. Hey sponsor a AA chapter.

ท Most eating establishments have a TV on all the time. I simply do not go to those places.

ท There are very few authentic foreign restaurants. No Japanese, Indian, etc…

ท Most buildings are not finished, on the other hand, there is constant improvement, including new modern movie theater and mini-mall.

ท Ecuador sells salt with Fluoride, which is well know to cause a long list of ailments. We simply buy sea salt for 6 cent a pound.

ท There is still a lack of more modern communication technology. Yes we have Internet and cell phones, but there is still lack of higher speeds and more coverage, including a lack of telephone land lines, fortunately digital cellular technology is filling in the gap.

ท I have often confused good manners with Hippocratic behavior. Some people have taken us for a financial ride. There is a lack of honesty. This is a problem everywhere. I guess it has been my fault for being so naive and gullible.

Overall the good tilts the balance quite well over the bad things listed above. Of all the above bad things, the one that bothers me the most is dealing with ignorant people, they drain energy and slow down progress, fortunately this is not often, and most likely not your case, since this is only for those of us doing business/construction/etc.

For a positive list of reasons of why to live in Ecuador, please see our websites: www.LosVisionarios.org and www.RealEstateLoja.com You will find in them positive articles and long FAQs about Ecuador.

May the above warnings make your stay in Ecuador more pleasant.

Best regards,

Joel

Well I have been looking on the net at Ecuador as a posible location other then Thailand, biggest reason dual citizenship. You can do the same things that every other citizen can do. Not true of Thailand. the best you can get here is a annual visa and even that requires 90 day reporting to immigration. There is no gaurantee that you will get a renewal each yaer, But, if you meet the financial requirements haven't upset the wrong person and stayed out of trouble they will take your money and give you another year. This doesn't entiltle you to own property. own a business or work in any fashion in the Kingdom this means volunteer work as well. This really is a great place to live but there is always that little grey cloud hanging around

I thought I would do a comparison of the bad things just to see how things compare.

Occasioanlly you do see people urnitating but not very often, usually on the highways where there is little choice. Businesses here don't seem to be upset when you ask to use thier restroom and any service station is open for that usage even if your not a customer. But it does happen.

Ecology a far as individual efffort seems very low in the scheme of things but overall a clean country.

It's really rare to see a dirty Thai, two baths a day or more is the norm, it's hot here.

Forrest fires seem to be over in Myamar more the here but the south does get the smoke from them.

Education in the rural area 6th grade, but many children are sent into the bigger cities to get an education. But a education here does not neccesarily mean better work. Farmers understand farming and A foriegners concept doesn't as a norm fit.

Are the rural people a bit fearful yes that have good reason to be, they are easy targets for scams.

Water service if there is one thing a Thai can understand it's the need for water and in most places there are good systems in place.

If you can't speak Thai ( a very difficult language to learn) and you want something done good luck. As a general rule they don't have a clue as to why you want something done a certain way. If you can get across the end use they will make something that works may not be anywhere near what you envisioned but it will work.

This seems to come up a lot in consruction of homes you can build a nice hosue here for 40K, but it won't be the same a a Western home that costs 100K to build in the states. You can get that but your going to pay pretty much the same for it here as you would in the states.

Job oppurtuties exactly the same here.

Overall Thailand does have a good infratructure and government normally will respond in the areas there responsible for, some times thats going to cost a bit of tea money, but you can get things done if your patient enough.

The last thing in the world generally speaking a Thai that is, is rude. Of course he may be smiling at you while reaching in his pocket for a knife. Smiles can mean a lot of things here.

This is a friendly to the American Military location, it had a huge miltary presence during Vietnam. A lot of those GI's have returned with thier Thai wifes and retired here. No active basis that I know of. Does America have a influence here I'm sure it does to some extent but I don't really see that as a negative. Doesn't seem to effect my day to day life here.

Yep Thais do drink a lot yes, as do most of the turist that come here, but it's usually tourist who find trouble.

There are very active forums here where yiu can find out just about anything about meeting the needs of the governent in doing busines with them Takes a bit of research though. But if you ask one government employee something he may very well tell you the opposite of his fellow employee sitting next to him. Both with the greatest intentions

Yep there are dishonest people here and you have to be careful, but I worry more about the expats then the Thai's.

You can find just about any food you want in Thailand but you might have to drive a day to get them.

Most roads are good here but not all. Street sign depends on where you are major city, pretty much any major road but they may not be english ไรไนนนื ไร่รใ Thats what Thai writing looks like.

Street lights again depends on where you are, but even most villages have lights.

Resturants are going to have something on if not TV then loud music.

Lots of half finished buildings here left over from the financial crash.

People are not ignorant here and would venture to say they are not in Ecuador either just have a different way of doing things.

Most of the electroinc goodies can be found here if you in a large enough city.

so overall I don't see a lot of difference in living that foriegn country and living in this one.

Except you can own property or a business, even have job. You don't seem to go under the scrutiny of the governement every year to see if yuo can stay after building a life here.

Actually sounds like if an expat wanted to build something there say a different kind of restuarant he could. Opportunity there may be what it was here twenty years ago. Thailand is growing fast. Gone are the day of cheap prime properties. I've seen if it's true that you could have an ocean view house there for 40K. Won't even get close here these days maybe five years ago but not now.

You know we are a diiferent but I really had to ahve an American style life I woud have stayed there keep punching the clock so I could give the finance companies my checks and hope I have enough left over for a little fun. These days my retirement is 30% of what I earned in Los Angeles working six days a week and one day to get everything done in so I go back to work on Monday. You remember, I owe I owe so off to work I go. I actually have more now than I have ever had in my life that is really mine. I can actually save 50% of my retirement if I are to and I don't do wihtout anything that I want, notice I didn't say need. I said want. Now if I knwe for a fact that I could do the same there I might just trade for that beach view or a different climate in the mountains. Knowing with confidence I could stay and enjoy what I had built.

When you make such a drastic change in life there is going to be an adjustment and nothing comes free, nor is anywhere perfect. Can't wait to see the positive sides because the negatives pretty much sound like the life I lead anyway LAUGHTER.

Bet ten years ago you didn't even have the time to think about things like this I didn't.

Ray

[The Dan Sai Kid]

Education in the rural area 6th grade, but many children are sent into the bigger cities to get an education. But a education here does not neccesarily mean better work. Farmers understand farming and A foriegners concept doesn't as a norm fit.

I thought all Thais had to be in full-time education til they were 18.

[ray23]

I don't think so but I wouldn't bank on it, most of the girls you meet from the villages in the Issan area have only went to the 6th grade simply because that was all that was offered in thier area.

But I could be very WRONG wouldn't be the first time

[tutsiwarrior]

I don't think so but I wouldn't bank on it, most of the girls you meet from the villages in the Issan area have only went to the 6th grade simply because that was all that was offered in thier area.

But I could be very WRONG wouldn't be the first time

you ought to take the premise to a wild extreme...think about Bolivia...before Evo Morales...

the place is positively mideaval...crazy vendettas as in Una Cronica de una muerte pre sentida... conservative Roman Catholicism...indigenous people with pagan rituals...if you take a drink of chicha out in the countryside you have to slop a slug onto the ground for 'Pacha Mama'...mother earth, before you imbibe...howling winds in the heights of the Andes, and stories of ghosts...'al volver a la chosa nos encontrabamos una bulta...'

doan' matter too much...chicha is cheap...perhaps the expense would be otherwise with Lao Kao or Sang Som in deepest, darkest Suphanburi...

[ray23]

I really believe if you go to any place in this world other then your home country you are really going to start notice differences. Today for me Thailand is home the States woukld seem very strange to me now.

[swissie]

Well ray 23. Interesting topic, makes for good reading. But since it's no "top secret" why most Falangs live in Thailand, you missed to adress one topic:

What about the Ladies in Ecuador?

Now don't be shy, speak out!

Cheers.

[Kerryd]

I thought all Thais had to be in full-time education til they were 18.

Actually, my understanding is that Thailand provides free education up to grade 8 only.

If a family wants their child to continue after that, the family has to pay. Woman that runs a shop downstairs from me mentioned it cost her 50,000 baht to put her oldest daughter through her final year in school (that was just for the one year). (Not that it helped. Her now graduated daughter hangs around, sleeping all day and will look after the shop at night, once in awhile).

This lack of education is often cited as one of the reasons there are so many prostitues in Thailand. With a grade 8 education, getting a regular job isn't going to be easy. In rural villages, your choices are even fewer (rice farmer or Karaoke girl).

[ray23]

Wellt eh answer that I have been givenas to ladiew it is really the Columbian ladies who ar the stunners there and supposedly enough to go around. I think Thailand would have that one hands down.

Two thing beyond ladies would attract to me the region one was Mexican food, seems that is not to be apparently the diet is rather bland.

The other is the liberal immigartion rules as compared to Thailand.

Wouldn't it be nice to have a real retirement visa, instead an annual renewal. But then there is the Residency Permit, if you care to cough up the money and go through the process, may do it yet. I've been here long enough to qaulify, but a far as I know that still doesn't allow you to own real property. It does qaulify you eventually for citizenship that would do it, but as far as I know that is a very long process. I have no idea if it is dual citizenship, I would never give up my American Citizenship.

The education your guess is as good as mine maybe it is the eigth grade. But as far a I can tell once a child hits high school the family does have to pay for it. There are lot of guys out there that would know more then I. We don't have children.