Suspects in Koh Tao backpacker murders retract confessions, says official

[Dumbfounded]

I have long suspected that some people are very afraid to admit that the system is corrupt and that there's all sorts of conspiracies going on.. I think they are so afraid to admit it because they have been taught since being small kids that the government and police etc are there to protect them and that they are perfect guardians that will always help the ones that are innocent. FEAR

The same conclusions could be reached regarding the conspiracy theorists here.

Personally I fear all governments a bit. Hence why I would never volunteer DNA.

Even if everyone were pointing their fingers at you for being a suspect? Even if you would want to clear your name off the suspect list?

The consensus is that the RTP are corrupt to the last man. If I accept that as even 20% true then why would I? Currently the man most of the conspiracy theorists here are pointing at has an alibi. He is not a suspect for the RTP. So no, I would not.

With so much BS being thrown about regarding what is fact and what is rumor it really is hard to have more than just an opinion.

I admit I believe that there is a conspiracy based on evidence and statements made by the police constantly changing. Also I can not get my head around the thought that these 2 Burmese could have so much anger and hatred in them to kill with such savagery.

I do think that once the PM said a thai couldn't do this, it was sealed that some other nationality would have to be found responsible.

Police demanded DNA testing of all the Burmese on the island yet the thai kid under suspicion only supplied a grainy photo (which many think is doctored anyway - where is video evidence to back up the photo?) to give him an alibi - which the police accepted as being enough to clear him.

And that's the problem for me in believing he is 100% clear -

a possibly doctored photo accepted without any further need to investigate him. Somehow I don't think the police would have accepted just a photo from the Burmese as proof for an alibi

One other thing I read on here in another KT topic was that a uni girl from his school said on her FB page that she saw him at school 2 days after the murder and she noticed he had scratches on his neck and arms - I don't know if this was verified or investigated at all.

JD I can see where you are coming from and everyone's entitled to their opinion and we all make up our own minds on what information we receive. We also choose what portion or percentage of the information we believe to be credible, possible, or just straight out BS.

Based on info I have read/seen and sorted into the 3 categories I believe the real murderer/s are still at large.

But, it's just my opinion

[jdinasia]

DNA testing can be done in hours. Commercial labs turn it around in less than 3 days with no rush put on it.

100's of tests would obviously take longer.

From the "we will complete the investigation in3 days " statement it was right at 3 days.

The burden of proof is on you JD, I did a search and everything I found so far says, 5 -10 days. That is for the test not because of backlog. Hopefully there is a knowledgeable poster her who can clear this up.

Getting it done in hours JD? Links please.

Commercial genetic testing (paternity) tests 3 people and has a 3 day turn around.

Links later. I am at work.

[steffi]

One thing that's always bothered me is that if Mon and co are so powerful why would they let some Quick-E-Mart attendant get between them and Sean? Also, don't you think if they wanted to they could confiscate anybody's phone that took pictures of them. What if the photos were staged and the whole story was to give Sean a quick legitimate reason to leave the Island without falling under anyones suspicion.

[heyexile]

One thing that's always bothered me is that if Mon and co are so powerful why would they let some Quick-E-Mart attendant get between them and Sean? Also, don't you think if they wanted to they could confiscate anybody's phone that took pictures of them. What if the photos were staged and the whole story was to give Sean a quick legitimate reason to leave the Island without falling under anyones suspicion.

Yes. However maybe Sean was/had already put it out there on facebook by the time they caught up to him.

Maybe nervous of CCTV.

Why would they want to enable Sean to leave quickly? So the press could not get to him? Impossible to know right now but that was a strange pic of him shaking hands with uniformed officer at pol sta on day of departure.

[DennisF]

DNA testing can be done in hours. Commercial labs turn it around in less than 3 days with no rush put on it.

100's of tests would obviously take longer.

From the "we will complete the investigation in3 days " statement it was right at 3 days.

The burden of proof is on you JD, I did a search and everything I found so far says, 5 -10 days. That is for the test not because of backlog. Hopefully there is a knowledgeable poster her who can clear this up.

Getting it done in hours JD? Links please.

Latest technology does show pretty fast results.

However, Thailand does not have that technology so the fact that it CAN be done does not mean it was and if it was, certainly not in Thailand.

[heyexile]

I don't understand why the mafia son, if he said he wasn't even on the island during the murders, would not submit to a DNA test. Instead of producing time stamped photos that everyone is saying are doctored photos, just give a sample. Because if you weren't on the island during the murders, then for sure your DNA is nowhere near the crime scene.

I would never volunteer a DNA sample without a court order and a guarantee that it would be destroyed with the results after I was excluded. Would you??

I would absolutely, particularly if I was innocent. If I was guilty, I'd do as Nomsod is doing.

Exactly.. .BUT there's something strange going on here as well... I can't figure it out .. please help me..

Let's pretend that the headmans son IS GUILTY

Let's also pretend that the cops are in the headmans pocket.

Let's also pretend that the cops can falsify DNA tests.

All of the above is what people here suggests is the truth , correct?

Still pretending that the above is true .. why would the cops not simply falsify a dna test from the headmans son and say it was no match?

There can be 1,000 'why's and why not's' ....you can 'pretend' such and such, but those of us who are very familiar with how things happen in Thailand AND have been following this case from the first minutes it broke in to the news .....do more than 'pretend'. It's likely the headman's son is guilty. The cops are bending over backwards to shield the headman's people. The cops are playing loose with (and likely falsifying) the DNA trail.

Because this is Thailand, Thai officialdom will very likely prevail. Even if there are 10 million commentators on social media who think Thai cops are framing the Burmese, ....it's more important (to Thai officialdom) to plow ahead and convict the scapegoats. It's become bigger than trying to save face - it's now a matter of trying to save careers. In a non-3rd-world country, if top brass were found to be purposefully skewing evidence, the perpetrators would not only have their careers threatened, they would also likely suffer legal prosecution. In Thailand, that's not possible. The very worst that can happen to investigators (from top brass on down) who skew evidence - is possibly getting sent to the Ministry of Inactive Posts. But still, that's career- and income-threatening, so it's anathema to them.

What top brass could be moved to inactive posts? The Supreme Commander Police (PM) and his Police Commissioner General have signed off on this perfect investigation. The court can be instructed on verdict and under Martial Law, even the New Interim Constitution, Judiciary can be overruled, even suspended.

Tick tok, tick tok.

http://nationmultimedia.com/opinin/Koh-Tao-case-a-time-bomb-for-Thailands-reputation-30245085.html

[jdinasia]

I don't understand why the mafia son, if he said he wasn't even on the island during the murders, would not submit to a DNA test. Instead of producing time stamped photos that everyone is saying are doctored photos, just give a sample. Because if you weren't on the island during the murders, then for sure your DNA is nowhere near the crime scene.

I would never volunteer a DNA sample without a court order and a guarantee that it would be destroyed with the results after I was excluded. Would you??

I would absolutely, particularly if I was innocent. If I was guilty, I'd do as Nomsod is doing.

Exactly.. .BUT there's something strange going on here as well... I can't figure it out .. please help me..

Let's pretend that the headmans son IS GUILTY

Let's also pretend that the cops are in the headmans pocket.

Let's also pretend that the cops can falsify DNA tests.

All of the above is what people here suggests is the truth , correct?

Still pretending that the above is true .. why would the cops not simply falsify a dna test from the headmans son and say it was no match?

There can be 1,000 'why's and why not's' ....you can 'pretend' such and such, but those of us who are very familiar with how things happen in Thailand AND have been following this case from the first minutes it broke in to the news .....do more than 'pretend'. It's likely the headman's son is guilty. The cops are bending over backwards to shield the headman's people. The cops are playing loose with (and likely falsifying) the DNA trail.

Because this is Thailand, Thai officialdom will very likely prevail. Even if there are 10 million commentators on social media who think Thai cops are framing the Burmese, ....it's more important (to Thai officialdom) to plow ahead and convict the scapegoats. It's become bigger than trying to save face - it's now a matter of trying to save careers. In a non-3rd-world country, if top brass were found to be purposefully skewing evidence, the perpetrators would not only have their careers threatened, they would also likely suffer legal prosecution. In Thailand, that's not possible. The very worst that can happen to investigators (from top brass on down) who skew evidence - is possibly getting sent to the Ministry of Inactive Posts. But still, that's career- and income-threatening, so it's anathema to them.

What top brass could be moved to inactive posts? The Supreme Commander Police (PM) and his Police Commissioner General have signed off on this perfect investigation. The court can be instructed on verdict and under Martial Law, even the New Interim Constitution, Judiciary can be overruled, even suspended.

Tick tok, tick tok.

http://nationmultimedia.com/opinin/Koh-Tao-case-a-time-bomb-for-Thailands-reputation-30245085.html

No. For martial law it goes to a courts martial.

Judiciary cannot be overruled until the appellate process. Etc

[JacknDanny]

DNA testing can be done in hours. Commercial labs turn it around in less than 3 days with no rush put on it.

100's of tests would obviously take longer.

From the "we will complete the investigation in3 days " statement it was right at 3 days.

The burden of proof is on you JD, I did a search and everything I found so far says, 5 -10 days. That is for the test not because of backlog. Hopefully there is a knowledgeable poster her who can clear this up.

Getting it done in hours JD? Links please.

Commercial genetic testing (paternity) tests 3 people and has a 3 day turn around.

Links later. I am at work.

jd, not having a go at you here, but you seem to be quite vociferous in challenging peoples 'theories' on here and seem to have a negative view on people posting what you consider to be worthless rumours and inaccuracies.

You come on now and say that DNA testing can be done within hours??? Really?

A poster challenges you to provide a link...... your response is that you are working!!!!. Yet a few minutes later you are back on here posting!!!

Please show the links!!

According to the original report (if my memory serves me right).... the DNA sample was taken from the bar owner, and the next day was found to be in the clear!!!!

So from the island to Samui to Bangkok, tested and result.... all within 24 hours?? Really?

[englishoak]

Sounds a little too desperate to me.

[jdinasia]

"a few minutes later"???

I welcome the link for the bar owner.

Edited October 13, 2014 by jdinasia

[ParadiseLost]

There is so much discussion of things that cannot be proven, and I think this is by design. So much disinformation leaked to the press and even by posters (not only Thaivisa) subtly trying to confuse the issue. If people only consider what was reported in newspapers/television news then one particularly interesting question emerges:

A (Nation) report dated 24th September, described the questioning of the brothers, and the search for a relative in Bangkok. I put it to you the Bangkok search came about when a partial match was found, using the THIRD sample from the female victim's TORSO. Nothing to do with the two (staged) traces found internally.

This discovery was most likely a big shock to all involved and no mention of a third trace was made - until during an interview on CHANNEL 3 where it 'slipped' out that a 3rd trace is present. The interview was in Thai so I don't link it here - discussion regarding this has been absent but I think it is the biggest breakthrough and should be pursued - vehemently.

The police case will show a DNA match, but only two out of three. Where is the third!

[MikePhuket1970]

Sounds a little too desperate to me.

yeah,sounds like a RTP press speaker

[DennisF]

From a former USDNA forensic amalyst:

DNA time scale.

Cleaning

Documentation

Technical steps

Body fluid screening 6 hours 30 minutes

DNA Extractions Total time so far: 22 hours

DNA Quantitation Total time so far 26 hours 15minutes

PCR Total time spent so far : 32 hours 30 minutes

DNA Typing Total time spent so far: 50 hours 45 minutes

Technical/administrative reviews Total time spent on case 54 hours 15 minutes.

Link here: http://www.patc.com/weeklyarticles/dna-timeline.shtml

[DennisF]

There is so much discussion of things that cannot be proven, and I think this is by design. So much disinformation leaked to the press and even by posters (not only Thaivisa) subtly trying to confuse the issue. If people only consider what was reported in newspapers/television news then one particularly interesting question emerges:

A (Nation) report dated 24th September, described the questioning of the brothers, and the search for a relative in Bangkok. I put it to you the Bangkok search came about when a partial match was found, using the THIRD sample from the female victim's TORSO. Nothing to do with the two (staged) traces found internally.

This discovery was most likely a big shock to all involved and no mention of a third trace was made - until during an interview on CHANNEL 3 where it 'slipped' out that a 3rd trace is present. The interview was in Thai so I don't link it here - discussion regarding this has been absent but I think it is the biggest breakthrough and should be pursued - vehemently.

The police case will show a DNA match, but only two out of three. Where is the third!

If that is accurate, I agree entirely, pursued with vigour.

[JacknDanny]

"a few minutes later"???

I welcome the link for the bar owner.

Thanks. No link then?

Just proved the point that you are full of hot air!!

[heyexile]

Andy Hall and mission now refused access to accused suspects.

Fair and transparant.

http://twitter.com/Atomicalandy

Edited October 13, 2014 by heyexile

[risky11]

I will be in Thailand Nov 14-23. Visiting friends in Chiang Rai, Bangkok and Pattaya. Then heading over to the Philippines for 9 days. I like to live dangerously 3 weeks a year!

[ParadiseLost]

I repeat what I wrote earlier - if it were possible to turn back time - other than to prevent this horrific crime - here is the point to start again - the last bit of real investigative work anyone has seen:

Nation: 24 September - Police free bar owners and look for ex village headman's son.

Pol Lt-General Panya Mamen: "the headman's son is believed to be hiding in Bangkok. Panya refused to reveal the suspects' names, saying police were questioning one man and expected to arrest another in Bangkok today. Strong words...

More info regarding Channel Three interview, and the vid: LINK

Edited October 13, 2014 by ParadiseLost

[metisdead]

A post containing content from Bangkok Post has been removed as well as the replies.

[transam]

One must remember that under interrogation they would of been told that if you admit it you probably will not die and have your sentence halved. If you don't you have a problem. The lawyers probably told them the way it really is, if there is no proof, or you did not do the killing then we will sort it...

My thought...

[smokie36]

So when is the bail hearing?

[DennisF]

So when is the bail hearing?

I dont think they have enough cash to pay to get to a bail hearing let alone the bail money, mores the pity.

Those 2 out of the prison and speaking might be an eye opener for many.

[Dogmatix]

So when is the bail hearing?

I dont think they have enough cash to pay to get to a bail hearing let alone the bail money, mores the pity.

Those 2 out of the prison and speaking might be an eye opener for many.

The Burmese embassy should step in and put up the bail and take them into the embassy's custody.

[testosterone]

I repeat what I wrote earlier - if it were possible to turn back time - other than to prevent this horrific crime - here is the point to start again - the last bit of real investigative work anyone has seen:

Nation: 24 September - Police free bar owners and look for ex village headman's son.

Pol Lt-General Panya Mamen: "the headman's son is believed to be hiding in Bangkok. Panya refused to reveal the suspects' names, saying police were questioning one man and expected to arrest another in Bangkok today. Strong words...

More info regarding Channel Three interview, and the vid: LINK

exactly, and the same time (+/- 1 day) panya also said, he was going to test all koh tao.

probably in order to find the 3rd man then.

and then... shortly after, days, he was oops replaced..

and then... shortly after, days, two burmese were arrested.

speaks volumes, doesnt it ?

[jdinasia]

"a few minutes later"???

I welcome the link for the bar owner.

Thanks. No link then?

Just proved the point that you are full of hot air!!

No. Just at work. Your link?

[ParadiseLost]

Furthermore, young Sean may still prove to be seriously implicated if the truth comes out - it would surely be better for him to be the one to break the case...

Unless he is also a patsy? Not saying he is an innocent upstanding decent human being, but he may be under threat.

It should be clarified when Sean's wounds were first noticed, was it after the murders (15-21 Sep), or after he was pursued into 7-11 on the 22nd? The wounds could have been inflicted as part of an intended frame-up. The reason he ran.

An AC bar worker claiming he was covered in blood on the night (of the murders) is mmm - an AC bar employee...

[JoeLing]

From a former USDNA forensic amalyst:

DNA time scale.

Cleaning

Documentation

Technical steps

Body fluid screening 6 hours 30 minutes

DNA Extractions Total time so far: 22 hours

DNA Quantitation Total time so far 26 hours 15minutes

PCR Total time spent so far : 32 hours 30 minutes

DNA Typing Total time spent so far: 50 hours 45 minutes

Technical/administrative reviews Total time spent on case 54 hours 15 minutes.

Link here: http://www.patc.com/weeklyarticles/dna-timeline.shtml

.

What point is it in pointing out US data?

Obviously you're one of those people this and past government's keep telling"

"You do not understand Thailand and need clarification"

We're in Thailand, all testing will be done "later" and is available by "tomorrow".

Unfailable! Anything else is just in your imagination.

[DennisF]

Just because I had a few minutes and wondered I took the first photo, cropped it, made both the same size and reduced the opacity of the 'good' photo.

CCTV shot is pretty bad but the profiles do seem to line up when I placed one on top of the other.

[jdinasia]

There is so much discussion of things that cannot be proven, and I think this is by design. So much disinformation leaked to the press and even by posters (not only Thaivisa) subtly trying to confuse the issue. If people only consider what was reported in newspapers/television news then one particularly interesting question emerges:

A (Nation) report dated 24th September, described the questioning of the brothers, and the search for a relative in Bangkok. I put it to you the Bangkok search came about when a partial match was found, using the THIRD sample from the female victim's TORSO. Nothing to do with the two (staged) traces found internally.

This discovery was most likely a big shock to all involved and no mention of a third trace was made - until during an interview on CHANNEL 3 where it 'slipped' out that a 3rd trace is present. The interview was in Thai so I don't link it here - discussion regarding this has been absent but I think it is the biggest breakthrough and should be pursued - vehemently.

The police case will show a DNA match, but only two out of three. Where is the third!

So we are to believe that a third (different source sample) was found but not believe the reported 2 exact matches are accurate?

[BuddhistVirus]

"a few minutes later"???

I welcome the link for the bar owner.

Thanks. No link then?

Just proved the point that you are full of hot air!!

No. Just at work. Your link?

You left the link at home?