Dearth of black managers and decent referees

[oldgit]

At the unveiling of the statue of Arthur Wharton, considered to be the first professional black player in the English football league, Brendan Batson, the FA's advisor on equality, reiterated his stance on the lack of black managers in the Football League ( two at the last count) and none whatsoever in the Premier League. Earlier in the week, Keith Hackett, a former elite referee wrote a scathing account of the standard of refereeing in the Premier League saying that the only decent referee operating now was Mark Clattenburg! Furthermore, he compounded that by saying that the Premier League should employ arbiters from abroad.

I think it's safe to say that no club owner would employ a manager just because of the colour of his skin, but it is also worth noting that, in the NFL. the authorities have instigated a ruling, known as the Rooney rule, whereby. if a coach/managerial vacancy exists at a club, at least one of the applicants must be from the ethnic minorities.

As far as referees and assistant referees are concerned, some people would say that Keith Hackett has a point but the connection I'm making here is, if the jobs aren't there in the managerial sector, why aren't there more black or Asian referees coming through the system? The last black official I can remember is Uriah Rennie, who officiated in the Premier League some seven years ago. Come to that,why aren't there any top class ex footballers refereeing at the highest level? I remember James Richardson asking his two studio 'experts', Don Hutchinson and Deon Dublin, if they had ever thought of becoming a referee. You could have heard a pin drop.

[arthurwait]

If there is a black manager that is good enough they will get the job.

[NE1]

Same with Uriah Renny , he was dropped off the Premier League list because he was not good enough .

I don't think there is racial discrimination in the choosing of managers or officials.

If they are good enough they will get a chance.

Paul Ince had plenty of chances but as a manager he was crap.

[jellydog]

There is clearly a bias towards hiring managers from the ol' boy network in the EPL. Seeing as how there aren't many (if any) blacks in the ol' boy network they don't get hired. With as many outstanding black players who have come through the EPL, to think that close to none of them have been named managers is all you need to know.

This was the same scenario in major sports in the USA for decades. Only when pressure was put on the various clubs did black managers begin to be hired. Surprise ! As it turned out, black managers were not genetically inferior and have been very successful in the NFL, MLB and NBA.

Its obviously a touchy subject but one that should be addressed by the powers that be. OTOH, given the nature of the powers that be in football I wouldn't hold my breath. They are the epitome of the ol' boy network.

[jellydog]

If there is a black manager that is good enough they will get the job.

Complete and utter bullshit.

You ought to be put in a time machine and sent back to Alabama 50-60 years ago.

[NE1]

There have been plenty of extremely good white players in the English leagues who never made it into management . I can't hear them crying,

Do you think that a football club will pay a black footballer hundreds of thousands of pounds a year because he is black or because he is good.

It's because he is good , and if he were a good manager then clubs would employ him .

Don't forget not all managers can be successful .

Edited October 17, 2014 by NE1

[jellydog]

There have been plenty of extremely good white players in the English leagues who never made it into management . I can't hear them crying,

Do you think that a football club will pay a black footballer hundreds of thousands of pounds a year because he is black or because he is good.

It's because he is good , and if he were a good manager then clubs would employ him .

Don't forget not all managers can be successful .

Keep trying.

[NE1]

Thank you .

[StevieH]

If there is a black manager that is good enough they will get the job.

Bobbins. They don't even get the chance to find out if they're good enough because they don't even get interviews. It's obviously a problem in football.

[Chicog]

If there is a black manager that is good enough they will get the job.

Complete and utter bullshit.

You ought to be put in a time machine and sent back to Alabama 50-60 years ago.

And you ought to up your medication.

Football is a results oriented game and if a black manager gets results he will succeed.

If he's rubbish, like any other manager, he won't.

Putting a manager in a job just because he's black will not get you results.

[jellydog]

If there is a black manager that is good enough they will get the job.

Bobbins. They don't even get the chance to find out if they're good enough because they don't even get interviews. It's obviously a problem in football.

When the likes of Hodgson and Fat Sam are scrounging around for a job as a pundit and black candidates are given a chance to fail...then that will be a small sign of progress.

Seems 'Arry is on the chopping block and who is considered as a replacement ? Dim <deleted> Sherwood. A perfect opportunity to hire a black manager, see him fail at QPR, and then explain "well, we gave them a chance".

[jellydog]

If there is a black manager that is good enough they will get the job.

Complete and utter bullshit.

You ought to be put in a time machine and sent back to Alabama 50-60 years ago.

And you ought to up your medication.

Football is a results oriented game and if a black manager gets results he will succeed.

If he's rubbish, like any other manager, he won't.

Putting a manager in a job just because he's black will not get you results.

For a bright guy Chiccy you can be dumb as a bag of hammers.

[StevieH]

If there is a black manager that is good enough they will get the job.

Complete and utter bullshit.

You ought to be put in a time machine and sent back to Alabama 50-60 years ago.

And you ought to up your medication.

Football is a results oriented game and if a black manager gets results he will succeed.

If he's rubbish, like any other manager, he won't.

Putting a manager in a job just because he's black will not get you results.

Again though, they're not getting the opportunities to find out whether or not they can get results.

Given the number of amazing black players who have played in England in the last decade or two I refuse to believe that there hasn't been a number of very capable managers among them.

[NE1]

Stevie H , being a good manager has nothing to do with being a good player.

Look at all the great white players who have tried and failed .

Ferguson , Mourinho , Wenger . Never excelled at football , but top of the managerial trees.

[Chicog]

Stevie H , being a good manager has nothing to do with being a good player.

Look at all the great white players who have tried and failed .

Ferguson , Mourinho , Wenger . Never excelled at football , but top of the managerial trees.

Lawrie McMenemy, Bertie Mee, the list goes on.

[Chicog]

If there is a black manager that is good enough they will get the job.

Complete and utter bullshit.

You ought to be put in a time machine and sent back to Alabama 50-60 years ago.

And you ought to up your medication.

Football is a results oriented game and if a black manager gets results he will succeed.

If he's rubbish, like any other manager, he won't.

Putting a manager in a job just because he's black will not get you results.

For a bright guy Chiccy you can be dumb as a bag of hammers.

Better than being a bleeding heart liberal that wants to give people jobs just because of the colour of their skin.

What next, not enough gay managers for you?

Do you have some figures for black players that take their coaching badges?

Edited October 17, 2014 by Chicog

[jellydog]

Ha ha ! Not long ago I was being called a sexual dinosaur and now I'm a bleeding heart liberal !

My point is that clearly blacks are not being given an opportunity (either to fail or succeed). Its as clear as the bloodshot noses on the faces of those denying the opportunity.

Get back in your cave and chew some gristle Chiccy.

[rijit]

Unfortunately the jack the lad images of Wright and fferdinand dodging drugs tests and frankly persisent steriotyping of black kids coming a x as rather dumb arsed stereo type street kids has done intelligent thoughtful black footballers no good .Seems a waste, all that experience and talent and know how not being used, something to kick start would imo seem prudent to introduce . just saying if he's good enuf he'll get the job is proving not to be working, and even if the 'Rooney rule' was introduced, if he aint good enuf bit, surely, would still apply,, so cant see any harm in introducing it, However, i'm sure, the rather reactionary world of football will hold a different view and it will probably take a court case to sort it out..

[Chicog]

Ha ha ! Not long ago I was being called a sexual dinosaur and now I'm a bleeding heart liberal !

My point is that clearly blacks are not being given an opportunity (either to fail or succeed). Its as clear as the bloodshot noses on the faces of those denying the opportunity.

Get back in your cave and chew some gristle Chiccy.

Answer the question.

How many actually bother to take coaching badges? You don't need "opportunity" to do those.

Edited October 17, 2014 by Chicog

[oldgit]

There are no black managers in La Liga and only one in the top two tiers of the Bundesliga. It seems that this situation isn't only confined to the English football leagues.

[jellydog]

Ha ha ! Not long ago I was being called a sexual dinosaur and now I'm a bleeding heart liberal !

My point is that clearly blacks are not being given an opportunity (either to fail or succeed). Its as clear as the bloodshot noses on the faces of those denying the opportunity.

Get back in your cave and chew some gristle Chiccy.

Answer the question.

How many actually bother to take coaching badges? You don't need "opportunity" to do those.

I don't have any idea and blacks probably figure it wouldn't make a hill of beans difference.

[jellydog]

There are no black managers in La Liga and only one in the top two tiers of the Bundesliga. It seems that this situation isn't only confined to the English football leagues.

Indeed.

[Chicog]

Ha ha ! Not long ago I was being called a sexual dinosaur and now I'm a bleeding heart liberal !

My point is that clearly blacks are not being given an opportunity (either to fail or succeed). Its as clear as the bloodshot noses on the faces of those denying the opportunity.

Get back in your cave and chew some gristle Chiccy.

Answer the question.

How many actually bother to take coaching badges? You don't need "opportunity" to do those.

I don't have any idea and blacks probably figure it wouldn't make a hill of beans difference.

And thus your already flawed argument is revealed to be nothing more than than half-baked opinion.

[BangrakBob]

If there is a black manager that is good enough they will get the job.

Complete and utter bullshit.

You ought to be put in a time machine and sent back to Alabama 50-60 years ago.

And you ought to up your medication.

Football is a results oriented game and if a black manager gets results he will succeed.

If he's rubbish, like any other manager, he won't.

Putting a manager in a job just because he's black will not get you results.

If it's a result orientated game then why are there are a lot of managers who go from job to job on the back of being shit-e average in their last job. i.e. Warnock, Holloway, Keane etc You can bet if they were black managers you'd never see them again after one appointment because if they do get a chance that's all they'll get, one chance.

For the past 30 years, the UK leagues have been graced by thousands of talented black footballers, so where are they?? You look across any bench tomorrow and see how many even supporting roles are held by black coaches. yet the likes of Team Neville step straight of the pitch in to England coaching jobs.

Go through the European leagues specifically in countries with multiple generators of black citizens that make up a major part of the population and count the number of black managers compared to white.

There is a factual imbalance, it can be proven with real numbers and there must be a reason for that imbalance.

[jellydog]

Ha ha ! Not long ago I was being called a sexual dinosaur and now I'm a bleeding heart liberal !

My point is that clearly blacks are not being given an opportunity (either to fail or succeed). Its as clear as the bloodshot noses on the faces of those denying the opportunity.

Get back in your cave and chew some gristle Chiccy.

Answer the question.

How many actually bother to take coaching badges? You don't need "opportunity" to do those.

I don't have any idea and blacks probably figure it wouldn't make a hill of beans difference.

And thus your already flawed argument is revealed to be nothing more than than half-baked opinion.

Golly, I guess that ends the debate about racism/discrimination in football. Thanks Chiccy !

[jellydog]

Can we allow Phish Flaps back on the forum for just this thread so he and Chicog can agree on something ?

[mrbojangles]

It's hard enough for an English person to get a job managing a team in the prem, never mind his skin colour. What is it 60%? 65% of prem managers are johnny foreigners but I don't hear Brendon Batson mentioning anything about that in his equal opportunities. He's just trying justify his role when he has absolutely no evidence of racial discrimination.

[Chicog]

Golly, I guess that ends the debate about racism/discrimination in football. Thanks Chiccy !

I would have thought even with your mosquito-like intellect you would know that no coaching badges = no job these days.

Certainly there are lots of black players around now, but perhaps they are happy to take their millions and go and do something less stressful with them.

You are not offering any evidence to support your argument other than the fact that you don't see black managers.

By your standards, the whole of the league is biased against having transexual Chinese people as managers, because you don't see any of them.

[jellydog]

Golly, I guess that ends the debate about racism/discrimination in football. Thanks Chiccy !

I would have thought even with your mosquito-like intellect you would know that no coaching badges = no job these days.

Certainly there are lots of black players around now, but perhaps they are happy to take their millions and go and do something less stressful with them.

You are not offering any evidence to support your argument other than the fact that you don't see black managers.

By your standards, the whole of the league is biased against having transexual Chinese people as managers, because you don't see any of them.

Me and my mosquito-like intellect find you more amusing than annoying. Carry on and get a bigger spade.

[Chicog]

Golly, I guess that ends the debate about racism/discrimination in football. Thanks Chiccy !

I would have thought even with your mosquito-like intellect you would know that no coaching badges = no job these days.

Certainly there are lots of black players around now, but perhaps they are happy to take their millions and go and do something less stressful with them.

You are not offering any evidence to support your argument other than the fact that you don't see black managers.

By your standards, the whole of the league is biased against having transexual Chinese people as managers, because you don't see any of them.

Me and my mosquito-like intellect find you more amusing than annoying. Carry on and get a bigger spade.

Yes, the person who has no argument usually gives up eventually.